Prendergast doesn’t get it

Written By: - Date published: 10:59 am, October 13th, 2010 - 40 comments
Categories: act, local body elections - Tags: ,

According to Kerry Prendergast, STV may cost her election as mayor of Wellington, and therefore it is undemocratic.  Good doublethink there Kerry.

STV’s other name is “Instant Run-off” – what it gives is the answer if there had been an election just between Celia Wade-Brown and Prendergast.  Yes that means that people’s third preferences count against Kerry’s first preferences, but that’s only because those third preferences still weren’t for Prendergast – they didn’t want her.

Indeed STV is much more democratic, as people are free to vote for whomever they like, rather than having to coalesce about one “anti” candidate, knowing that their third or fourth preferences will still keep out the person they really didn’t want.  The winner will be the one who more than 50% of people were prepared to back, not someone who 40% liked but 60% hated.

Prendergast has also been saying that she’s been hurt because she’s the only candidate on the right, and there were lots on the left (perhaps this shows where the preponderance of new talent and ideas are?).  Usually it’s considered a good thing to be the only one in a discernable role – there’s no vote splitting – but Kerry’s desperate for excuses…

[UPDATE: Prendergast really doesn’t get it – Celia is Mayor!]

—

In other news, ACT are still busy infighting.  “We don’t have caucus rankings” – just the order of the seats, and you’re last…

40 comments on “Prendergast doesn’t get it ”

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  1. come get some 1
    13 October 2010 at 11:26 am

    “At this stage, Celia [Wade-Brown] can’t beat me, but STV can. I don’t think members of the public have really understood the system. Some do, but the majority don’t understand.”

    Would love to see her statistics to back her comments up, highly doubtfull she actually has any, but hey

  2. Gotham 2
    13 October 2010 at 11:52 am

    Now, I’m obviously no fan of Prendergast – but even I have been astonished at the way she has handled this situation.

    She lost (even if she wins, she lost) because she ran a non-existent campaign. She believed, as did pretty much everyone including Celia’s own supporters, that she was going to win. The Dom Post made it clear that although Celia’s bid was respected and earnest, Kerry was going to get another term. Hell, even tv3 news on Sunday night announced Kerry having won the mayoralty again, without even waiting for the official results!!

    I think Celia herself must have been pretty surprised. I voted for her, and I encouraged everyone I knew to vote for her, and I was surprised too! And in the interrum, Celia has sounded and acted like a winner; while Kerry has made every excuse under the sun why she is in the position she’s in.

  3. Bored 3
    13 October 2010 at 12:05 pm

    Kerry is weaned on a pickle, she looked very bitter. Maybe its because another term for her is another term for Rex and his developer mates, another terms for the business people of the city to push their share of rates onto the citizens, and for the landlords to compliance with avoid building regs.

    There is a lot at stake and it was never made clear during the election by the Dom, who failed singularly to report anything adverse to the status quo, and blackened the opposition candidates and messages..(standard MSM bias).

    It would appear that, contrary to Kerry\’s assertions that those who did vote used their preferences wisely. In short it seems pretty much everybody who did not vote for Kerry voted against her (i.e gave their preference to Wade Brown). They in effect said who they did not want. Thats democracy in action, far more so than Kerry winning on a sub 50% FPP event.

    • prism 3.1
      13 October 2010 at 4:53 pm

      And for unrestrained rorting of poor suffering motorists forced to donate big dosh for parking! Hope some goodwill will filter down even if there is a greenie for a mayor. Perhaps slash by half the amount of the ticket if paid within two days.

  4. randal 4
    13 October 2010 at 12:19 pm

    yes indeedy.
    she has had so much pork fr so long she is beginning to say oink all the time.

  5. sophie 5
    13 October 2010 at 12:42 pm

    “At this stage, Celia [Wade-Brown] can’t beat me, but STV can. I don’t think members of the public have really understood the system. Some do, but the majority don’t understand.”

    The arrogance of the Woman is astounding. Actually Kerry , the majority of us did understand the system and that is why we voted as we did.

    • the pink postman 5.1
      15 October 2010 at 2:35 pm

      What does anyone expect from these Tories ?. I”ve never meet a good one yet . Some appear “jolly’ but under all the bluff its the same old bitter ,me,me me . Why any decent person would vote for them beats me.
      However what us Lefties have to keep tabs on is the action from the Dirty Tricks Brigade , Its going to happen ,lets be ready. they are not going to accept the defeat they have just had. Just watch out.!

  6. ghostwhowalksnz 6
    13 October 2010 at 1:09 pm

    Sounds like the usual right wing smear campaign is just starting. Probably advised by Farrar.
    You know the usual things , the election was rigged/stolen, then they move onto previous history – was her father/brother born in kenya?, is she a muslim? and so on . There will be a attack on democracy theme somewhere in the future.
    This things are so predictable, but the media will run them anyway

  7. Hilary 7
    13 October 2010 at 1:12 pm

    There was a poll in the last couple of years in which the citizens of Wellington got to vote on whether to keep or change the STV voting system. The result was a vote to keep STV.

  8. Draco T Bastard 8
    13 October 2010 at 1:14 pm

    It should be mandated that local government and electorate elections be STV. It’s far more democratic and gets in people that the majority support.

    • Rex Widerstrom 8.1
      13 October 2010 at 2:57 pm

      Hear hear. There’s no reason we can’t have one PR system for electorate voting while retaining another (if that’s what we wish) for the overall system, yet it’s not something embraced by campaigners for MMP, sadly.

      Someone with a platform really needs to start a debate that goes beyond the bounds of FPP vs MMP and gets people talking about all the possible options they could opt to have. Or, you know, the MSM could actually take it upon itself to inform and educate…

      • Vicky32 8.1.1
        16 October 2010 at 1:56 am

        STV seems pretty well perfect as far as I can see! (Back in ’93 it’s what I wanted but the vote ended up FPP vs MMP, so that’s what I had to vote for..)

  9. HitchensFan 9
    13 October 2010 at 1:20 pm

    One word.

    Prenderghastly.

  10. Ari 10
    13 October 2010 at 1:26 pm

    Actually, STV isn’t entirely immune to the spoiler effect, because the elimination order is very significant, and it’s possible to accidentally or ignorantly make a non-transferrable vote if you’re in FPP mode. Kerry being the only right-wing candidate is beneficial for her in an STV election, because she doesn’t risk issues with vote-transfers from other right-wing candidates. STV still gives Kerry an unfair advantage, even if it isn’t anywhere near as big.

    Note that STV is only an IRV system for races like Mayor where a single person wins. It functions quite differently when you’re electing multiple winners at the same time, and is actually much, much better in those cases.

    I don’t think central government ought to mandate how local governments hold their elections, Draco, (it could come back to bite us if a particularly mendacious government mandated a regressive system- best to leave it up to each region or city to make up their own rules) but I think all local authorities should at least transition to STV, if not some sort of evaluative vote. STV has some big problems (complicated counting, failing the majoritarian criteria that voting a candidate higher can never hurt them, and so on) and it really only returns a mediocre improvement over FPP for them.

    • Draco T Bastard 10.1
      13 October 2010 at 2:00 pm

      Well, the mandate could be something like must be proportional and fair rather than mandating a specific type and then leave it to the locals to choose which type.

  11. toad 11
    13 October 2010 at 1:52 pm

    Rodney Hide used the same “stupid ignorant voters don’t understand STV” excuse that Prendergast is putting up here for foisting FPP on electors for the Auckland Council not just for this election but for the next one as well.

    It is a credit to Auckland voters that despite this, and despite Hide’s gerrymander in Auckland that seriously over-valued votes in right-leaning wards, they saw through this and thoroughly rejected his corporatist privatisation agenda.

    • Graeme Edgeler 11.1
      13 October 2010 at 3:04 pm

      Despite having the option of going STV for almost 10 years, not a single (old) Auckland Council went that way: all stayed with FPP.

      Moreover, FPP is the voting system that the Royal Commission recommended.

      Now I am a big support of STV, but FPP was not foisted on Aucklanders – it’s the system they’ve chosen for themselves since the choice was first available.

      • Jafa 11.1.1
        13 October 2010 at 3:46 pm

        Well I don’t recall the council ever putting the question to the ratepayers.

        Turkeys Cristmas…

      • toad 11.1.2
        13 October 2010 at 5:08 pm

        I may be wrong, but I seem to recall Waitakere City Council did go for STV for this election (had it survived to implement it). Given its a moot point, can’t be bothered going through the Council minutes to check.

        In 2002 (when I was living in Auckland City) some of us tried to get a petition together to force Auckland City Council to hold a poll on their electoral system, but didn’t quite get the numbers. The Councillors wouldn’t go there of their own initiative, presumably because they saw it as a potential threat to their incumbency.

    • BrianW 11.2
      14 October 2010 at 3:16 pm

      I support STV as an option to FPP. In fact any PR system is much more democratic.
      However, I’m afraid that Rodney is right, most voters simply don’t get it even though it is not that hard a concept to grasp for those with a reasonable level of intelligence.

  13. Pascal's bookie 13
    13 October 2010 at 2:32 pm

    I guess she’s officially irrelevant now so ne’ermind.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/4228513/New-mayor-for-capital

    Ooh! look!

    Beer o’clock again. So soon.

  14. outofbed 14
    13 October 2010 at 2:34 pm

    I am going for a few beers
    go Celia

    • RobertM 14.1
      13 October 2010 at 6:02 pm

      Maybe not. I fear we have been delivered into the hands of the puritans. I’m not a great fan of Kerry. But Green rule in Wellington. As someone with flawed eyesight, I dislike the cycling lanes on Christchurchs long flat aerterial roads. Those modern racing type cycles are fast and they can be tricky to see in time, much more so than cars or even motorbikes.
      What I try and get across for those who believe the market and creative destructive capitalism and sexual freedom hetro, bi or otherwise is essential- the NZ right is always likely to fail to deliver and is partly a lost cause because most of the electorate do not want moral fundamentalism or sexual repression. In NZ the right can only win by luck, accident or natural disaster. The linking of the right to fundamentalism, or Southland conservatism or Catholic conservatism really destroys the possibility of broad based support and makes defeat even more likely with a STV system.
      But when the Nats, Citizens can not grasp that you need newer brighter candidates than Kerry and Banks or even see their voters have to be educated in how STV works and you don’t put Celia number 2 after Kerry on the Ballot its hopeless. The failure to have a few other right centre candidates on the ballot shows the unforgivable and hopeless ignorance and arrogance of the WEllington right and the idiocy of their supporters in the Dominion who with their prole Taranaki provincial roots can generally be relied to derail and divert the right centre, just as Richard Long wrecked Brashes chances.
      I mean if they can lose with Kerry, their so hopeless, why would anybody bother.The real liberal National Party seemed to have its last stand with Shipley. English and Smith are really fundamentalsit conservatives with nothing in common with Talboys, Marshall , Shand, Hannan , Gordon et cl.
      The greens should dance around the maypole at the shrine of Rod Donald. But from a right centre point of view it reveals that he was very effective for them.

  15. gobsmacked 15
    13 October 2010 at 2:56 pm

    Wonderful news.

    But obviously it hasn’t really happened, because the MSM commentators all knew Prendergast would win easily, and there was probably an online poll or something which said so, so that just proves it, and … oh, damn democracy!

    Seriously, congratulations to all Celia’s team. And if your vote made a difference, congrats to you too.

    • rosy 15.1
      13 October 2010 at 3:27 pm

      Thank goodness for that!
      It seems more people really didn’t like prenderghastly than really didn’t like CW-B 🙂

  16. BLiP 16
    13 October 2010 at 4:03 pm

    Asked what she was going to do this afternoon, Wade-Brown said she was about to hop on her bicycle and ride into town for a press conference.

    BLiP is doing his balding, middle-aged male version “Stir-The-Pot” / “The Robot” combo happy dance !!!!

  17. swordfish 17
    13 October 2010 at 4:46 pm

    Prenders says “unfair and undemocratic” ?!!! This would be the same Prenders who was elected Mayor in 2007 on barely a third of the vote !!! (indeed, less than 15 % if you consider all eligible voters in Wellington). From memory, she won on even less support at the 2004 local body election.

    “Bored” is spot-on regarding Rex Nicholls, his developer mates and Prenders’ long-term policy of decisively moving the rates differential in favour of the business lobby, to the detriment of ordinary residents. A de-emphasis on spending to improve suburban infrastructure and a much greater emphasis on ‘the Golden Mile’ is part and parcel of this shift. We hear nothing of this in the DumbPost, of course.

    Meanwhile, the DumbPost presents an astonishingly partisan “overview” of the up-coming Mana by-election. National’s Parata gets half a page to herself, complete with large photo showing her cheerfully inter-acting with a Mana voter and a text by “journalist” Andrea Vance that comes damn close to hagiography (much emphasis on Parata’s supposed “glamour”, “good looks” and “amazing popularity” with electors. All the more remarkable then that Parata came a very poor second at the 2008 general election, receiving far fewer Candidate votes than National received Party votes !!!).
    Labour’s Fa’afoi and the Greens’ Logie, meanwhile, have to make-do with quarter a page each (with a studio mug-shot of Fa’afoi).

    • Colonial Viper 17.1
      13 October 2010 at 6:34 pm

      The DumbPost is welcome to destroy their own circulation base with their unending right wing stupidity. Then see how many of their favoured business clients want to advertise in it.

  18. tc 18
    13 October 2010 at 4:50 pm

    Great result being a Jaffa watching from afar it says one thing clearly to Kerry…” everyone wants you outta there…”
    Interesting to see some RWNJ I come across already substituting humble pie for a slice of ” JK’s no fool, he’ll back the new council and knows the score etc etc” ……gotta love that adoration.

  19. Adrian 19
    13 October 2010 at 5:40 pm

    What do these mayoral results say about the national polls. I’ll bet there’s some pants shitting happening at certain party headquarters.

  20. Carol 20
    13 October 2010 at 6:21 pm

    Into the first ad break on TV One News. So far we’ve had: Chilean miners, guns in police cars & 7s rugby at Delhi. No mention of Wellington’s new mayor or Auckland’s new deputy mayor so far or on promos for up coming items.

    PS: Celia Wade-Brown on now, first after the ad break.

    • rosy 20.1
      13 October 2010 at 6:37 pm

      Guns in police cars – two weapons in one. Great.

      anti-spam: enemy (definition of the public it seems)

      • Colonial Viper 20.1.1
        13 October 2010 at 6:47 pm

        When the police start behaving as if they are a military force, its natural for them to see the people as the enemy of the state.

  21. infused 21
    13 October 2010 at 10:31 pm

    People do understand it. People on the inside knew the outcome over a week ago.

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