What is happening in the National Party?

172 comments on “What is happening in the National Party? ”

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1. Ennui 1

   8 April 2015 at 8:12 am

   Handbags at 5 meters from yesterday’s people.
2. Sacha 2

   8 April 2015 at 8:17 am

   The Hollow Men is a useful read.
   • ropata 2.1

     8 April 2015 at 9:05 am

     So’s Dirty Politics. Hoots has gone off the reservation, perhaps the Collins/Slater/Hooton faction is cooking up some way to get rid of the Keymaster?
3. One Anonymous Bloke 3

   8 April 2015 at 8:36 am

   “…he has lied to me and about me.”

   It’s been a while since PR consultants were able to look down on bankers.
4. tc 4

   8 April 2015 at 8:53 am

   ACT vultures circling in order to pick the bones of a post shonky national.

   As they said in saving private ryan….’dont shoot boys let em burn’
5. Skinny 5

   8 April 2015 at 8:54 am

   Well Hooton has been quite vocal against corporate welfare by the Key led National Government. He has been left politically homeless since ACT as a coalition partner has had numerous failed moments where they have gone against the grain of their own membership.

   I actually see an opportunity for an opening for a true Right party. National are going to bleed votes, votes that have to go somewhere other than ACT. Interesting to see if Hooton can pull off a new political
   party.
   • ghostwhowalksnz 5.1

     8 April 2015 at 10:07 am

     The most successful political party that sprang from national was Winstons NZ First.

     ACT was mostly an offshoot from labour, Jim Anderton was the same in the other direction.
     • Skinny 5.1.1

       8 April 2015 at 10:47 am

       Yes Peters NZF will get their share of the National drift and with Jones as 2ic they will be quite a force to contend with.

       Interesting ACT see Labour as a future coalition partner, obviously dreaming of the good old days ( dark days for us) Douglas- Preeble days.
       • aaron 5.1.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 1:43 pm

         Ironical that it was the Nats that took Jones out of Labour – in the long run they may have done both Labour and NZF a favour and created a new thorn in their own side.
         (If Jones does join NZF that is)
         • Skinny 5.1.1.1.1

           8 April 2015 at 3:52 pm

           He will join NZF who else could succeed Peters? None of the current lot can.
           Not great news for the Greens if he does. Let’s see how their leadership pans out. There is a slim chance they will pony up to the Nat’s who will gladly accommodate them being National no mates.
           • Corokia 5.1.1.1.1.1

             8 April 2015 at 4:54 pm

             How many times do you need to be told- the Greens will never go with a National party which supports oil drilling, intensive dairy expansion, wants to gut the RMA, won’t even measure our GHGs, won’t feed the kids….do I need to go on, or have you made contact with planet Earth yet?
           • KJT 5.1.1.1.1.2

             8 April 2015 at 7:11 pm

             Still bullshitting about the Greens, Skinny?
             • Skinny …

               8 April 2015 at 8:26 pm

               Oh i wish some of you mad Greens (KJT) would stop being so precious, one can hardly blame some within the party for mooting the unholy alliance when you consider the shabby treatment Labour gave them under Clark.

               The evolution of the Greens has seen in recent times an influx of what I would classify as ‘Blue Greens.’ You know comfortable trendy urban dwellers.

               All political party’s have faction’s and the Greens are no different, let’s just hope they don’t overrun the true left backbone like Cath Del and co.
               • MrSmith …

                 8 April 2015 at 9:36 pm

                 That’s right Skinny keep parroting the “Greens shifting to the right” lines, in the next breath you will be saying how the Greens support is stagnant.

                 They held onto their voters over the last 2 terms, (unlike Labour) yet you’re saying those voters have changed, I doubt it! All thats changed is the latest message from National and Labour about how the Greens are turning right.

                 The big difference between Green voters and the Labour&National voters, is the Green voters are politicly engaged and so won’t fall easily for yours, our others spin.
   • heather 5.2

     8 April 2015 at 8:02 pm

     maybe this is where Judith will sweep in like a fearsome milkmaid!
   • Simon Gunson 5.3

     13 April 2015 at 4:58 pm

     I think you will find that the party which most scares National is not Labour, Greens, ACT or NZ First etc. That party is Colin Craig’s Conservatives.

     I’ve suggested to Andrew Little and Tim Barnett that granting an Epsom like deal to the Conservatives at the next elections not to stand a Labour candidate in an electorate of their choice in return for an agreement to give confidence and supply to a Labour government would do more to destroy National than any other single strategy. I think many in Labour choke on that idea but letting the Conservatives loose on National’s plot will spell the end of that corrupt bunch of Natzis.
6. esoteric pineapples 6

   8 April 2015 at 9:04 am

   “That’s because he has lied to me and about me.”

   John Key has lied to people and lied about people A LOT. New Zealand is a small country and there must by now be an awful lot of people in New Zealand who have experienced this personally or know of someone else – a family member, friend etc – who has experienced this amongst the establishment classes. There must be a lot of personal feelings of dislike towards John Key amongst this group in society by now.
   • Paul 6.1

     8 April 2015 at 9:11 am

     Maybe blip’s comprehensive list of Key’s lying could be sent to Mr Hooton.
7. weka 7

   8 April 2015 at 9:06 am

   Didn’t Hooton’s active antipathy towards Key/National kick on post Dirty Politics (the book)? Or maybe last winter when all that Collins stuff was going on?
   • rhinocrates 7.1

     8 April 2015 at 10:57 am

     That’s when the rat started looking for the life jackets if that’s what you mean.
     • weka 7.1.1

       8 April 2015 at 11:01 am

       Pretty much. Or there was some scrabbling to see which way the chips were going to fall and where was the best place to put oneself.
8. fisiani 8

   8 April 2015 at 9:12 am

   Must be a quiet morning to try to rattle this canard. Who actually cares what Hooton tweets? It’s just his opinion. He is entitled to have an opinion, I know that the Left are desperate to see a schism in National but all you see is divergent views that are tolerated. National is a ‘broad church’, Labour used to be one too. This is not a harbinger of infighting. This is normal political discourse. It used to happen in Labour and the Greens back in the 20th century.
   • mickysavage 8.1

     8 April 2015 at 9:22 am

     Slater has also been very critical of National recently. National never used to tolerate divergent views. Its discipline over the first two terms was outstanding. Something has changed. It seems that internal trust of Key is plummeting and I am interested in why this has occurred.
     • Northsider 8.1.1

       8 April 2015 at 9:29 am

       Slater and Hooton are not going against National: they are faction fighting within National.

       They are still inveterate Nats and anti-worker to the core.
       • Tracey 8.1.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 11:39 am

         YUP… even Fisi couldn’t ring himself to use the term “Honest John” in his defence above.
         • Rodel 8.1.1.1.1

           8 April 2015 at 4:30 pm

           Yeah but in spite of the twist and spin to make it sound sound positive, he’s right about one thing.
           Q….”Who actually cares what Hooton tweets?”
           A…deafening silence
     • ghostwhowalksnz 8.1.2

       8 April 2015 at 10:14 am

       Its called Maurice and Judith. These people have serious money and supporters in Auckland.
       They are definitely a faction now.

       In the selection for Northlands candidate, they prevented the strongest candidate , a National party board member from winning, as payback for previous blocking of their candidates in the general election.

       Key is safe , the ‘intervention’ is seen as largely a Joyce policy.
     • Tracey 8.1.3

       8 April 2015 at 11:38 am

       Slater has been most critical of Key and National since Collins starting sitting in the back row. Hoots does seem to have found some ethics since the last election, but that he waited until he personally was lied about speaks volumes. Just as he was upset by the proposed zoning changes in the area where he lives (and spent good money getting into zone for his daughters). He seems to be finding an antipathy for Key and National in direct relation to the level of his own personal affront.
     • mary_a 8.1.4

       8 April 2015 at 1:50 pm

       @ mickysavage (8.1) – cover ups, the “prominent NZer” issue, more revelations to come perhaps? Culminating in a growing increase in mistrust of Key maybe.
     • Anne 8.1.5

       8 April 2015 at 3:10 pm

       mickysavage @ 8.1
       Haven’t had time to check out all the comments but I’m picking the Sabin Affair and the subsequent thrashing in Northland was the last straw for some of them.

       Edit: mary_a beat me to it.
   • Paul 8.2

     8 April 2015 at 9:23 am

     Yet you feel obliged to comment on such a trivial matter.
     Wonder why your masters told you to speak about this.
     • Skinny 8.2.1

       8 April 2015 at 9:35 am

       I will ask Little or Mc Carten if he is with him tomorrow.

       I heard over the weekend there are a lot of National people in Auckland that are highly pissed off Key the money trader won’t rein in ‘mainly well heeled Chinese’ property investors. The blue ribbon set are starting to snare at being out muscled.
       • ghostwhowalksnz 8.2.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 11:41 am

         A bit like Auckland Medical school. Sons/daughters of medical school professors were missing out on places due to mostly chinese students having higher marks

         So they introduced a sort of character test which measured outside activities such as sport or community activities so the traditional applicants could get a leg in again.

         You see time and time again property advertisements for ordinary suburbs which just show a picture of a big back yard.
         land area for a future subdivision is king for local and overseas speculators.
       • Tracey 8.2.1.2

         8 April 2015 at 3:30 pm

         and yet they have rampant increased equity in their home/s because of it… seems odd they wouldbe this upset, or do you mean, moving in next door?
         • You_Fool 8.2.1.2.1

           8 April 2015 at 9:56 pm

           I think he means that they are outbidding the bluebloods for the properties that they want. I mean yes it is pushing their own house prices up, but they probably think they can do that themselves…
           • Tracey 8.2.1.2.1.1

             9 April 2015 at 8:58 am

             Ahhhh, thanks for that.
   • Skinny 8.3

     8 April 2015 at 9:25 am

     It’s over Fisiani face the music chappy, your brave cheerleadering is well noted here. Actually John Key should reward you with a medal of bravery ‘if’ ya both still about by the next election.

     Key looks hammered these days, great big bags under his eyes struggling to squint out at the world. Muldoon, Moore they all looked the same before getting rolled.
     • the pigman 8.3.1

       8 April 2015 at 6:48 pm

       To be fair Moore always looked like Uncle Fester. The “fish and chips brigade” photo of Basett/Douglas/Lange/Moore is proof enough of that.
       • Skinny 8.3.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 8:39 pm

         Many a Labour leader got rolled after a feed of fish & chips, the second to last guy Shearer even provided the fish, 2 snapper. All Cunliffe had too provide was 5 bucks worth of chips and the hapless Shearer was gutted like his fish.
   • miravox 8.4

     8 April 2015 at 9:36 am

     “He is entitled to have an opinion”

     Hooton’s paid to opine. Who’s paying for these ones?
     • Tracey 8.4.1

       8 April 2015 at 11:41 am

       Only $110 to be on with Mike Williams for half an hour.
       • miravox 8.4.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 5:08 pm

         $110 for the appearance doesn’t sound much, but how much does he get paid behind the scenes for the words he uses in that half hour?
         • Tracey 8.4.1.1.1

           8 April 2015 at 6:21 pm

           or in free advertising of himself
           • miravox 8.4.1.1.1.1

             8 April 2015 at 9:24 pm

             Yup. Especially if he’s lost the National Party gig.
   • felix 8.5

     8 April 2015 at 10:03 am

     Hi fizzy, aren’t you worried that Hoots might be a terrorist?
     • vto 8.5.1

       8 April 2015 at 10:13 am

       lol. The Nat type of person has no idea what constitutes a terrorist. Like pretty much everything else, cue is taken from Paul Henry and Mike Hosking and John Key for what they are supposed to think about the world …..

       This is the nature of conservatives. They have very limited uses and everything turns to shit when they try to do things they are not suited to.
   • Tracey 8.6

     8 April 2015 at 11:35 am

     ” It used to happen in Labour and the Greens back in the 20th century.”

     Yup and National always said it was cos of disagreements inside Labour…
     • fisiani 8.6.1

       8 April 2015 at 4:22 pm

       Would a white university educated straight male from say an Irish Catholic background with a moderate social democratic viewpoint be tolerated as a new candidate in a winnable seat for Labour in 1950, 1960 , 1970 , 1980 or 1990 Absolutely. In 2017 No chance.
       Therein lies the problem for Labour. A factional Party will only be supported by a faction. Centrist dissension is not tolerated in the Labour Party of the 21st Century and that’s why I’m convinced that the old see-saw pattern of 2-3 terms one side then the other of recent decades is forever finished. As long as Honest John is the leader of the National Party he will be PM till he chooses to retire. His successor I believe was sworn in last year but will not take over till the mid 2020’s.
       Let me be clear. On a 0 -100 scale mean distribution curve which I cannot replicate here, so use your imagination where 0 equals Far Left and 100 equals Far Right I believe that Labour 2015 straddles approx 20-55 whereas in the past it straddled 25-65. National straddles 40-75. Both straddle the middle ground which has the most voters. Whoever gets the most votes from the 40-60 group generally wins. Labour can now only appeal to 40-55 whereas National can appeal to 40-60. That’s the crucial difference
       Plane loads of immigrants are arriving each week. Are they full of Leftists? No.
       Ask yourself, would a Labour selection panel of today accept as a candidate a Goff, Shearer, Mallard, King, Lange, Jones, O’Connor, Palmer let alone a Prebble or a Douglas. Of course not. That’s why the see saw no longer swings.
       • tracey 8.6.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 4:27 pm

         To function correctly, each cell depends on thousands of proteins to do their jobs in the right places at the right times. Sometimes, gene mutations prevent one or more of these proteins from working properly. By changing a gene’s instructions for making a protein, a mutation can cause the protein to malfunction or to be missing entirely. When a mutation alters a protein that plays a critical role in the body, it can disrupt normal development or cause a medical condition. A condition caused by mutations in one or more genes is called a genetic disorder.

         In some cases, gene mutations are so severe that they prevent an embryo from surviving until birth. These changes occur in genes that are essential for development, and often disrupt the development of an embryo in its earliest stages. Because these mutations have very serious effects, they are incompatible with life.

         It is important to note that genes themselves do not cause disease—genetic disorders are caused by mutations that make a gene function improperly. For example, when people say that someone has “the cystic fibrosis gene,” they are usually referring to a mutated version of the CFTR gene, which causes the disease. All people, including those without cystic fibrosis, have a version of the CFTR gene.
         • infused 8.6.1.1.1

           8 April 2015 at 4:50 pm

           If you can’t beat em, copy/paste like a tard trying to claim some intellectual high ground while really just covering up you being inept.
           • Tracey 8.6.1.1.1.1

             8 April 2015 at 6:29 pm

             cant beat what? off?

             Re read my post that he replied to. his diatribe might be relevant but not where he put it. i was addressing infighting and how it is conveniently seen differently when nats do it to labour.
         • Wreckingball 8.6.1.1.2

           8 April 2015 at 5:27 pm

           Can’t win the argument Tracey so just spouting rubbish. We all see through it.
           • Tracey 8.6.1.1.2.1

             8 April 2015 at 6:26 pm

             he didnt answer what i posted so i answered something he didnt ask.

             re read my post that he replied to. his diatribe might be relevant but not where he put it. i was addressing infighting and how it is conveniently seen differently when nats do it to labour.
         • mickysavage 8.6.1.1.3

           8 April 2015 at 7:56 pm

           Hey Fisi

           Shearer was selected to a safe Labour seat in 2009.
       • infused 8.6.1.2

         8 April 2015 at 4:49 pm

         You talking about Chris Bishop? I have money on that too.
         • the pigman 8.6.1.2.1

           8 April 2015 at 6:51 pm

           I mooted against Mini-Gerry circa 2006. He was utterly charmless and unlikable. Just your typical privileged loudmouthed prick that fills law school lecture rooms.
       • Sacha 8.6.1.3

         8 April 2015 at 10:33 pm

         “National straddles 40-75”

         In your dreams. Which parties represent the 25% to the right of your fantasy numbers? Conservtives on less than 3%? Act on less than 1%?
       • mac1 8.6.1.4

         8 April 2015 at 10:47 pm

         Yep, I tick all eight of those boxes and much later than 1990, Fisiani. I am living proof of the wrongness of your assertions, but then I believe that would be true of most that you write, O Acolyte of the One, the Honest, the Unblemished, True John.

         Hint- ‘Mac1’ should give you an idea of my Irish heritage…………
         • Sacha 8.6.1.4.1

           8 April 2015 at 11:16 pm

           mc1, surely 🙂
           #tobesure
           • mac1 8.6.1.4.1.1

             9 April 2015 at 3:51 pm

             ‘Mac’ is a pun on the speed of my thought processes, Sacha! As well as what me friends call me, when they’re being nice………………
         • fisiani 8.6.1.4.2

           11 April 2015 at 9:12 pm

           So you agree that you could never gain selection for a safe Labour seat. I rest my case.
           • ropata 8.6.1.4.2.1

             11 April 2015 at 9:52 pm

             fizzy fails at maths and English yet again. I rest my case.
           • mac1 8.6.1.4.2.2

             11 April 2015 at 10:11 pm

             Fisiani, you did not say “safe Labour seat.” You said “winnable”- which it was.

             And the redefining of your original proposition, aka changing the position of the goal posts, is a well-known trick. Like brain fades, changes of roles, and careful use of weasel words- all practised by your mentor and hero, Honest John.
   • the pigman 8.7

     8 April 2015 at 7:00 pm

     Hahaha, unfortunately there’s scarcely a quiet day with Hoots and Blubberboy continuing their ludicrous Collins-boosting they’ve been playing at.

     Pssst, I think the press gallery may be onto them, not just standardistas…

     But YEAH like you say, nothing to see here, let’s leave them to their undermining of Joyce/Bennett/Key.
     • Tracey 8.7.1

       8 April 2015 at 7:09 pm

       hoots is a Collins fan? Is that cos she should really be in ACT but settled for moving Nats further right so she didnt have to be in ACT?
       • the pigman 8.7.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 7:26 pm

         I don’t think he has been in the past, certainly not in the transparent way that blubberboy is, but he must realise that undermining Key plays into her hands only.

         That is what I take Keith Ng’s references to “utu” in the twitter conversation to refer to. Hoots knows this but plays cute instead. :blush:

         She is too hopelessly compromised to survive outside the National fold so she needs proxies like these to enhance her mana in the party.
       • Anne 8.7.1.2

         8 April 2015 at 7:38 pm

         I don’t think Matthew Hooton is a Collins fan. I can’t be bothered to go back and check, but I think Hooton was fairly scathing of the Oravida scandal. Is he an associate and/or supporter of Michelle Boag? There is no love lost between Boag and Collins! If you’re on Boag’s side of the fence, then you ain’t a Collins supporter.

         I think its highly likely Hooton can see the writing on the wall and isn’t on anyone’s side.
         • mickysavage 8.7.1.2.1

           8 April 2015 at 7:57 pm

           I am pretty sure he is not. I am also pretty sure he is despairing …
         • felix 8.7.1.2.2

           8 April 2015 at 8:36 pm

           “I think its highly likely Hooton can see the writing on the wall and isn’t on anyone’s side.”

           Yep. Trouble is Hooten is shut out of the currently ruling faction with its PR managed from offshore and its Dirty Tricks done in-house, and the Collins/Slater crew are a bunch of savages who’d fuck him and eat him as soon as blink, and drag him down with them as they sink back into the fetid swamp that birthed them.
           • mickysavage 8.7.1.2.2.1

             8 April 2015 at 8:38 pm

             +1
           • Tracey 8.7.1.2.2.2

             9 April 2015 at 9:02 am

             The mental images you have been planting are funny if not a little disconcerting.
   • Wynston 8.8

     11 April 2015 at 7:48 pm

     “Who actually cares what Hooton tweets? It’s just his opinion. He is entitled to have an opinion”

     One can say exactly the same about your view/opinion, the main difference being that he is much closer to being right than you!
9. felix 9

   8 April 2015 at 9:12 am

   Just a few obs.

   1. Nothing that Matthew is complaining about is new to the National Party. None of it.

   2. But apparently it didn’t bother him until recently. lolz.

   3. ACT has imploded. The take-over was too overt and too patronising, even for Nat voters. The 1% need a disproportionate voice.

   4. National need a new far-right side-car.

   5. Neo-con Ultra. That’s Matthew’s own label for himself.
   • Paul 9.1

     8 April 2015 at 9:27 am

     Hooton is. a shill for the 0.1 %
     • Skinny 9.1.1

       8 April 2015 at 9:39 am

       I think Matthew’s pride is dented because Key doesn’t rate him, probably thinks he is slightly mad lol.
       • Rodel 9.1.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 7:26 pm

         In the Hollow Men, Matt’s “F**k we’re good” e- mail comment (about himself) wasn’t supported by the Aussie PRs and JK’s people. Must have hurt and obviously still does.
       • Old Mickey 9.1.1.2

         9 April 2015 at 1:25 pm

         Hoots really blotted his copy book with National when he was on the delegation to the middle east in 2011. You couldnt find one person on that visit who would say anything nice about hooton, especially Tim Groser. Word spread quickly to Joyce & Key…….bye bye Matt, no more favours for you !
   • Tracey 9.2

     8 April 2015 at 11:30 am

     It didn’t bother him untilit personally affected him. It’s still self interest

     chuckle @ neo con ultra
     • felix 9.2.1

       8 April 2015 at 3:33 pm

       His own words.

       Maybe he’s starting a far-right boy-band.
       • tracey 9.2.1.1

         8 April 2015 at 3:34 pm

         Well, he will definitely be the guy on the far right, in any photos.
       • Sacha 9.2.1.2

         8 April 2015 at 10:39 pm

         Ah, Vienna
10. Tracey 10

    8 April 2015 at 9:42 am

    he wasn’t upset at skycity getting to suck on the public teat untilt eh deal went sour, or was he an objector to the deal from the beginning?

    Sobriety can make people see things a bit clearer.

    Of particular note is that once he knew Key was lying about him (personally) he accepted Key is a liar. Others of us accept it cos of the recognisable pattern of misleading and lying, rather than when we get affected personally.

    Hoots looking to rebuild ACT?
    • Skinny 10.1

      8 April 2015 at 9:57 am

      Of course Hooton and true actoids were opposed to the SkyCity deal, same as the RioTinto deal. Corporate welfarism is more of a sin than dole bludgers.

      ACT is a flogged horse, well beaten, there infighting as well. The lapdog from Epsom is not well liked by the older boys.
    • Tautoko Mangō Mata 10.2

      8 April 2015 at 11:42 am

      I find it amusing that a PR spinner such as Matt Hooton can actually recognise a lie when he hears one! Even more amusing is his reaction to being the object of a lie, especially considering the misinformation that he has doled out over the years.
      • Tracey 10.2.1

        8 April 2015 at 12:45 pm

        He hates Hager for exposing his duplicity in Hollow Men
11. repateet 11

    8 April 2015 at 10:06 am

    What is happening in the National Party? I don’t know, but if the answer to the subsequent questions is the harridan Judith Collins, the story line could be sold to the makers of ‘The Return of the Return of the Living Dead.’

    The machinations of Collins and Slater both canvassing to get off the canvas will be especially thrilling.
12. left for deadshark 12

    8 April 2015 at 10:11 am

    Hooton has never been in the shonkey camp,but like most in PR,have their hand out when the monies flowing.
13. vto 13

    8 April 2015 at 10:19 am

    Don’t know why Hooton is rated by so many as someone worth listening to. From what I can glean he has led a sheltered existence since, or rather due to, becoming ‘politically aware’ in the early 80’s.
    • Anne 13.1

      8 April 2015 at 7:43 pm

      He’s the right’s answer to Josie Pagani.
14. AUDNZD 14

    8 April 2015 at 10:19 am

    Mr Hooton is right and Mr Key wrong.
15. rhinocrates 15

    8 April 2015 at 10:45 am

    If he thought that National ever adhered to the fantasy of ideological vision that he had when he became “politically aware” (now that’s a joke in itself), then he’s even more of a fool than I think he is.

    He followed some idiotic adolescent fantasy and is now in middle age disappointed that the world isn’t all free market unicorns and rainbows and thinks that his personal crisis is a Shakespearean drama.

    He can buy a divorce, some viagra and a sports car like every other disappointed yuppie.

    I can’t even be bothered with the schadenfreude.
    • Tracey 15.1

      8 April 2015 at 11:32 am

      Maybe he offered his services after the northland debacle and got a thanks but no thanks.
      • rhinocrates 15.1.1

        8 April 2015 at 11:36 am

        So he’s throwing his toys out of the cot now. “They’re telling lies about me waah!” – this from a pathological liar who’s been paid to wreck other people’s lives with his lies. Self awareness has never been his strong point.
16. Karen 16

    8 April 2015 at 11:20 am

    The Nat infighting is all to do with succession. Key looks mostly tired and irritable these days, and my guess is he wants out. He wants to get the TPPA signed first, because that will help him get some high status corporate job with a multi national company. The job he wants would pay heaps of money, give him lots of time off to play golf and allow him to hobnob with the rich and famous.

    Those on the hard right, like Matthew Hooton, want a National Party strongly aligned to ACT, and anything said is designed to achieve this aim. Hooton also loathes Eagleson so there is also some personal stuff going on. Slater wants Judith to be in charge and to get more power within the party. The criticism of Key is just part of the positioning process.
    • Tracey 16.1

      8 April 2015 at 11:31 am

      needs to secure his knighthood and that only gets secured if he retires and the Nats can reward him with a gong.
    • thechangeling 16.2

      8 April 2015 at 3:48 pm

      Very good analysis. I suspect this is on the money! (figuratively and literally).
    • Saarbo 16.3

      8 April 2015 at 9:33 pm

      Yep, good summary.
17. Michael 17

    8 April 2015 at 11:34 am

    I think Hooton’s been on the outer with the Nats since the Dirty Politics scandal broke and it’s probably costing him money, as his clients calculate he can’t lobby for their interests within the power circle any more. It couldn’t have happened to a nicer guy, IMHO.
    • ghostwhowalksnz 17.1

      8 April 2015 at 11:43 am

      That is the core idea. The people that pay Hooton are generally against government interference.
      • KJT 17.1.1

        8 April 2015 at 7:16 pm

        So they paid him to lobby for them. LOL.

        Or they used to when National/ACT took any notice of him.
        • Tracey 17.1.1.1

          9 April 2015 at 9:03 am

          Yeah I saw the irony of them paying Hooton to influence the government to stop influence of government.
18. fisiani 18

    8 April 2015 at 11:35 am

    Key will have as many terms as he wants. My pick is six. 2008, 2011, 2014, 2017, 2020, 2023 and there will be new leader for the seventh term in 2026
    • Skinny 18.1

      8 April 2015 at 11:43 am

      I dare him to do a Shearer and wave a couple of undersized snappers around the house. See what happens?
    • Lanthanide 18.2

      8 April 2015 at 11:44 am

      I’m quite sure it’s actually the public of NZ that get to decide how many terms he gets.

      Unless you’re saying Key is about to unmask himself as dictator?
      • Tracey 18.2.1

        8 April 2015 at 11:49 am

        I think he means that as long as Key wants tobe PM, he has the means and strategies to ensure the electorate re-elect him.
        • Lanthanide 18.2.1.1

          8 April 2015 at 1:13 pm

          So he’s committing electoral fraud, then. That’s the only way to be ‘certain’ of an election outcome, which fisi is.
          • Tracey 18.2.1.1.1

            8 April 2015 at 1:21 pm

            manipulating and duping can be done without fraud.

            Fisi is back to his parodying best with that post.
            • Lanthanide 18.2.1.1.1.1

              8 April 2015 at 1:27 pm

              “manipulating and duping can be done without fraud.”

              But you simply won’t know *for sure* that you’re going to win the election if you only manipulate and dupe.
              • Tracey …

                8 April 2015 at 1:29 pm

                I dunno, 3 election victories suggest you can.
          • fisiani 18.2.1.1.2

            8 April 2015 at 4:49 pm

            Look to my mathematical model above which explains how the most popular politician in a generation ought to be able to last in power so long. It’s not a certainty of course but with the state of Labour I see them doomed to opposition for a decade at least.
            • ghostwhowalksnz 18.2.1.1.2.1

              8 April 2015 at 5:41 pm

              National is 3 MPs away from opposition.
              • fisiani …

                8 April 2015 at 6:25 pm

                Correct. So what? The general election campaign team at National have lots of potential coalition options. Labour only have one.
                • You_Fool …

                  8 April 2015 at 10:06 pm

                  I thought a Labour would have to lead a coalition that was the multi-headed taniwha not National? Do you wingnuts keep your stories straight?
            • McFlock 18.2.1.1.2.2

              8 April 2015 at 5:49 pm

              lol.
              Fisi’s faith continues to leech away: John Key was once NZ’s most popular PM ever, full stop. Then John Key was NZ’s “most popular Prime Minister ever perhaps”. Now he’s only the most popular politician in a generation.

              So sad to see someone’s complete faith wither in the face of reality, but we must remember that it is for their own good…
              • Macro …

                8 April 2015 at 6:55 pm

                Fisi has never heard of Norm Kirk. or Michael Savage.
                Fisi never walked into a home with photos of the Prime Minister on the wall in a place of honor.
                Maybe Fisi has a hall full of Key photo ops.
                • KJT …

                  8 April 2015 at 7:23 pm

                  Didn’t you know. Fizzy is actually a left winger in disguise.

                  Giving us a parody of right wing “thought”.
                  • GregJ …

                    9 April 2015 at 7:16 am

                    I am beginning to thing Fisi is some sort of experiment in “alternative” comedy put together by an anarcho-communist comedy collective.
                    • KJT …

                      9 April 2015 at 1:20 pm

                      🙂
                  • Tracey …

                    9 April 2015 at 9:04 am

                    😉

                    Best way to treat him
            • Rodel 18.2.1.1.2.3

              8 April 2015 at 7:31 pm

              Helen Clark was the most popular politician in our generation..but she moved on to higher things.
              Wonder who will want Mr Key?
            • keyman 18.2.1.1.2.4

              8 April 2015 at 10:27 pm

              i agree with Fis join key will be the leader indefinitely the country is heading major economic problems and John key will need to take executive rule to ensure order and those or us who count retain our position of privilege in this country.it is our birth right we are born to rule
              • ropata …

                9 April 2015 at 1:34 am

                team key voters “won” the election, it’s just like a rugby game innit?
                we have to stop arguing with facts and shit.
                we want greasy photo ops, soft interviews, and blokey radio shows
              • Tracey …

                9 April 2015 at 9:05 am

                chuckle
            • ropata 18.2.1.1.2.5

              8 April 2015 at 11:35 pm

              Fisi,
              Your “mathematical” model is incoherent rubbish based on guesses pulled from your arse. Look at the Northland byelection result for some actual relevant data. You can barely express your muddled thinking in clear English, and your lack of math skills is sadly apparent as well.

              Hint: the graph you are probably thinking of is a Normal distribution curve (a “mean curve” is the average of several other curves). My guess would be that, contra your assumption of a classic symmetric curve, political opinions in NZ still heavily skew LEFT. See the polls of policy taken before the 2014 election.

              FJK is National’s biggest asset but also their biggest liability. When his teflon shine finally wears out there will be nothing left to cover up and distract from National’s sordid record of lies and schemes.

              Maybe a convenient war will get the citizenry back on side aye Fisi?
    • ghostwhowalksnz 18.3

      8 April 2015 at 11:53 am

      Im afraid you could be right.
      Everyone else wants to leave politics to go make some money. Key is poster child for been there done that.

      I always remember that former ACT Mp and lawyer Franks saying , before parliament he was a highly paid lawyer but too his clients he was just like the lawn guy.
      Being an MP was different everyone listened to what he said or thought and he got real respect from most higher public officials.

      Key knows that if he leaves office he will be back to being a nobody. Sure he will get board appointments.
      So what, he was ex officio on a committee of the NY Federal Reserve. A big cheese in the big apple

      Chair of Contact Energy ….give me a break.

      There are no high international finance positions open to him. As the World bank is for US citizens and IMF is always a European.
      • Stickler 18.3.1

        8 April 2015 at 12:48 pm

        But Key IS a US citizen – he must have needed a green card for all those years spent there, surely?

        It would be interesting to know whether he carries two passports. I think we know which one he shows allegiance to.
        • Neil 18.3.1.1

          8 April 2015 at 12:56 pm

          If Key is a US citizen, he is breaking US law by becoming PM of NZ.
          • Naturesong 18.3.1.1.1

            8 April 2015 at 1:31 pm

            Is that legislated?

            We’ve had a few PM’s who were born overseas, particularly in the early days.
        • Lanthanide 18.3.1.2

          8 April 2015 at 1:17 pm

          You only need a green card if you want to work in the US. Key clearly doesn’t need to ‘work’ in the US. He’d easily get in under the investor category if he wanted to (I believe you just have to ‘create 10 jobs’), and even then the US effectively has ‘star’ citizenship rules where being prominent in your field will get you through the door.
          • ghostwhowalksnz 18.3.1.2.1

            8 April 2015 at 5:37 pm

            Working for Merrill Lynch would have got him a green card
        • felix 18.3.1.3

          8 April 2015 at 1:20 pm

          “It would be interesting to know whether he carries two passports. I think we know which one he shows allegiance to.”

          He left me in no doubt when back in the middle of the GFC, while NZ was hemorrhaging jobs, Key said he was spending money shopping in the U.S. because their economy really needed it right now.
          • Tracey 18.3.1.3.1

            8 April 2015 at 1:30 pm

            He must be off to Aussie any day now
        • mary_a 18.3.1.4

          8 April 2015 at 2:06 pm

          @ Stickler (18.3.1) – if the treasonous Key isn’t a US citizen now, he soon will be as his reward for pimping and prostituting NZ to all comers waving a dirty dollar or two under his nose!
          • Macro 18.3.1.4.1

            8 April 2015 at 7:01 pm

            And my god are they dirty! I’ve never seen such filthy money as that in the US. I think they never replace it – just keep it in circulation til it disappears, or wears out.
            • ropata 18.3.1.4.1.1

              8 April 2015 at 11:50 pm

              Key seems to be acting on behalf of his bankster buddies, I wonder if his real goal is to join the billionaire club?

              Wall Street has demonstrated its ability to send its minions on Trojan Horse missions into the US government, to sell mountains of debt, and to destroy nations like Greece. It’s a feature of sociopathic crony capitalism.
        • veutoviper 18.3.1.5

          8 April 2015 at 4:08 pm

          I doubt very much that Key is a US citizen. He was born in NZ and therefore holds NZ Citizenship (and IIRC must hold this to serve as a MP and PM).

          NZ allows dual citizenship as a general right; but in certain circumstances the US does not.

          In particular, if you gain US citizenship through naturalization (eg where you were a citizen of another country and are granted US citizenship) then you must give up your former citizenship. That would be the likely situation for Key if he sought US citizenship, from my reading of the US rules on citizenship. See the third part of this legal article:

          http://www.legallanguage.com/legal-articles/dual-citizenship-united-states/

          In view of Key’s high profile as PM of NZ, if he had been granted US citizenship and not renounced his NZ citizenship, I am pretty sure that this would have hit the headlines before now.

          I don’t have time to research this further right now, but I understand that the type of job positions Key worked in when he lived in the US (eg Merrill Lynch, US Federal Reserve) are not subject to the standard green card requirements for work and immigration purposes. Rather his moving within Merrill Lynch to work in NY would be classed as an international transfer within an international company. In such situations, different rules apply.

          Again IIRC, these periods of working in the US, plus his owning of property in the US (an apartment in NY(?) and condominium in Hawaii) and frequent visits/stays there would probably mean that he has some form of permanent residence in the US, and could qualify for US Citizenship at some point in the future if he so chose.
          • Macro 18.3.1.5.1

            8 April 2015 at 7:05 pm

            You cannot be a NZ citizen and a US citizen. To become a US citizen you have renounce your NZ citizenship.
            • Lanthanide 18.3.1.5.1.1

              8 April 2015 at 7:29 pm

              “To become a US citizen you have renounce your NZ citizenship.”

              This seems to be a popular myth: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_nationality_law#Dual_citizenship

              There has been no prohibition against dual citizenship, but some provisions of the INA and earlier U.S. nationality laws were designed to reduce situations in which dual citizenship exists. Although naturalizing citizens are required to undertake an oath renouncing previous allegiances, the oath has never been enforced to require the actual termination of original citizenship.
              • Macro …

                8 April 2015 at 7:48 pm

                Not a popular myth. I have just returned from visiting my cousin in the states who is now a US citizen having lived and worked there for 40 years. You need to tell her it is a myth.
              • veutoviper …

                8 April 2015 at 8:05 pm

                I was very careful to not make a definitive statement that “to become a US citizen you have to renounce your NZ citizenship”. Hence my providing a link that sets out the (reasonably recent) legal situation.

                Until 1967, there was an absolute prohibition; US law is now not so prohibitive. But the intent still seems to be that those people with other citizenship who seek and get approval to take up US citizenship are supposed to give up their original citizenship. As I said, if Key had sought and been granted US citizenship before now, I believe that this would have come out in the wash before now.
            • Paul Campbell 18.3.1.5.1.2

              8 April 2015 at 8:26 pm

              No true, my kids were born in the US they have dual citizenship because they have a kiwi dad. My wife was born in the US, she recently took NZ citizenship, she now has both – but if she joins the NZ armed forces or parliament the US will likely come and ask for their citizenship back
              • Craig H …

                8 April 2015 at 10:27 pm

                Being born in the US is automatic citizenship per the Constitution, so it has always been a way of having dual citizenship (in previous times, the only way).

                Dual citizens can be MPs, but if they become citizens of another country after becoming MPs, they lose their seat unless their citizenship was granted due to birthright or marriage (refer to sections 55 and 55AA of the Electoral Act). Look into the Harry Duynhoven affair for more info on ways MPs can trip up,..
                • Paul Campbell …

                  9 April 2015 at 8:58 am

                  no that’s a different issue I’m talking about what the US does, not what NZ does – it used to be that if you became a NZ citizen the US automatically took away your US citizenship, some time in the 70s someone took that to the supreme court and it ruled that the US had to have a good reason to take it away (some of my NZ friends got their US citizenship back) – now days to be stripped of your US citizenship you basically have to take the citizenship of an ‘enemy’ state, or become a government official of another country (join the army or parliament seems to be the test) – Meir Kahane is a great example of someone who crossed the line and lost his US citizenship (he was an Israeli MP, as well as just not a nice person)
      • Karen 18.3.2

        8 April 2015 at 1:12 pm

        Mike Moore once headed the World Bank, so it certainly is not just for US citizens. However, I think Key would prefer being head of a large multinational. Whatever he does it won’t be in NZ.
        • One Anonymous Bloke 18.3.2.1

          8 April 2015 at 2:20 pm

          *Mike Moore is the former DG of the WTO, and current ambassador to the USA, although Groser’s tipped to take his place before long. He’s never worked at the World Bank.
          • Karen 18.3.2.1.1

            8 April 2015 at 3:07 pm

            You are absolutely right about Moore OAB – I made a stupid mistake.

            The World Bank is a much higher status job than DG of WTO. Would Key want it even if it was offered? Don’t think it would be his thing somehow. He’d want something based in USA that involved European travel, but not third world I don’t think. Still see him wanting a position with a big multinational as a figurehead – he wouldn’t want to do much actual work.
            • ghostwhowalksnz 18.3.2.1.1.1

              8 April 2015 at 5:39 pm

              World Bank has only been run by a US national. The current head is Korean born but stilla US national.
              IMF goes to a European as part of the tradeoff.
            • ropata 18.3.2.1.1.2

              9 April 2015 at 1:23 am

              I hope FJK will never be CEO of a decent NZ company like AirNZ or Fonterra.

              SkyCity casino or the ANZ would be more his style.
      • repateet 18.3.3

        8 April 2015 at 6:21 pm

        You’re right! Suddenly Franks and Hyde had credibility. Thing is getting the cred did not rid them of the cret(in).
      • CnrJoe 18.3.4

        8 April 2015 at 6:40 pm

        “You can now convert New Zealand dollars into renminbi, if you are of such a mind to do so. So, life after politics, I might go back to the foreign exchange markets and smack around the renminbi. Maybe not.” John Key
        http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11224933
    • Clemgeopin 18.4

      8 April 2015 at 12:43 pm

      “2008, 2011, 2014, 2017, 2020, 2023 and there will be new leader for the seventh term in 2026”

      Wake up, maan! Dawn is breaking.
      • the pigman 18.4.1

        8 April 2015 at 10:44 pm

        Can you hold him down for me? We’ve got to get some food into him.. he hasn’t eaten in days.

        *draws a syringe of gruel to squirt down fisiani’s throat*

        Be a good boy and eat up Fizzy, if you keep this down you get to take your blue pill.
      • keyman 18.4.2

        9 April 2015 at 6:03 am

        there is no leader out there that can replace John key ,the smart people know ,they vote national John key has delivered the key era has a long way to go. John key has never lied there is no proof .
        • One Anonymous Bloke 18.4.2.1

          9 April 2015 at 6:41 am

          He certainly seems popular with the semi-literate.
        • Paul Campbell 18.4.2.2

          9 April 2015 at 9:02 am

          of course he’s lied, he promised that he would resign if there was mass surveilance of New Zealanders – that was a lie
        • thatguynz 18.4.2.3

          9 April 2015 at 11:24 am

          Just wow, your grammar is far worse than P. Ure’s and you have but a fraction of his lucidity.

          Perhaps you could restate what you’re trying to say – maybe ask your teacher to give you a hand?
        • Jeeves 18.4.2.4

          9 April 2015 at 4:39 pm

          You would be one of the smart ones then.
          Good on ya matey. Keep up the good work- enjoy those benefits…. oh
          wait a minute……
    • Paul 18.5

      8 April 2015 at 1:50 pm

      Dull.
19. Robert Glennie 19

    8 April 2015 at 11:55 am

    Matthew Hooton is working for Matthew Hooton. Not for anyone else. He changes ship when it suits him.
    • newsense 19.1

      8 April 2015 at 6:29 pm

      spot on. I guess we may know more in the fullness of time. If it wasn’t in his interests he wouldn’t be doing this.
20. Tanz 20

    8 April 2015 at 12:00 pm

    Key has sold us out to overseas Chinese investors, a basic home in Auckland is now a luxury and Generation Rent will also be Generation resentful, and with good reason. An empty suit with a lot of luck. He is all about being seen with the elite, and dippy photo ops.
21. Tracey 21

    8 April 2015 at 12:46 pm

    “And then the 10 bridges bribe. You’ll find I was criticising this govt for interventionism since it was elected.”

    since 2008?
22. Wairua 22

    8 April 2015 at 1:02 pm

    Welcome to the Third World. Jamaica was once a fashionable destination.
23. One Anonymous Bloke 23

    8 April 2015 at 2:22 pm

    Fight you bastards, fight! 😈
24. Whateva next? 24

    8 April 2015 at 8:26 pm

    Rats and a sinking ship, thanks to Nicky Hagar
    • Lanthanide 24.1

      8 April 2015 at 10:57 pm

      Nicky sure didn’t help, but I would think Sabin and what eventually will happen should his reason for leaving parliament become public will be causing quite a bit of posturing behind the scenes, given the potential fallout from the revelations.
25. Saarbo 25

    8 April 2015 at 10:06 pm

    Im often surprised how for a “political” person, how un-political Hooten can be. David Farrar is always pro-Nats and plays his political cards in an obvious way but Hooten, you don’t know what you are going to get. I don’t like his politics but I like Hooten.
    • Sacha 25.1

      8 April 2015 at 10:45 pm

      He’s very personable in person. Not as immmediatey dodgy as Farrar or Slater.
26. les 26

    9 April 2015 at 8:59 am

    I can see Key wanting to emulate Tony Blair in his life after politics…his rolladex will have the necessary V.I.P contacts,and as a fanboy of U.S hegemony will waltz into a sinecure.
27. Wairua 27

    9 April 2015 at 9:18 am

    What is up with Sabin ?

    I’m getting tired of all this “Nudge, Nudge; Wink, Wink” enigmatic innuendo.

    Someone should front up and clear the air.

    Whatever he has allegedly done he has the right to due process and a fair hearing in a court of law, if not public opinion.

    Let the chips fall where they will ..

    [r0b: There are reasons why no one can discuss the issues openly, but the “fair hearing in a court of law” is certainly going ahead.]
    • Wairua 27.1

      9 April 2015 at 9:48 am

      Ah .. sub judice. Understood .. thanks
    • Wairua 27.2

      9 April 2015 at 9:48 am

      Ah .. sub judice. Understood .. thanks

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