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Why does Simon hate pensioners?

Written By: - Date published: 5:31 pm, May 21st, 2018 - 130 comments
Categories: Simon Bridges, welfare - Tags: ,

In a welcome move by Labour to relieve energy poverty on those with fixed, low incomes, all beneficiaries (including pensioners) are to get up to $700 extra automatically over winter.

This will reduce the rate of deaths among the old & ill as they live in very cold houses trying to eek out their benefit.  It’ll reduce health costs as the more able get less ill in warmer homes.

The universality is important – if added benefits need to be applied for, the better off get them, the poorest are too busy struggling to find out about them, let alone have time to apply.

But it’ll be welcomed by all pensioners (and other beneficiaries), as Simon Bridges admits his parents will be happy to receive it.  Electricity gets expensive through winter and everyone appreciates a little help.

So why does Simon hate pensioners and seems to be trying to drive them away?  Simon, they’re the most reliable voting bloc, don’t piss them off…

(oh wait, I don’t mind if you do…  carry on Simon…)

(at least he loves criminals though, he wants lots more of them and is willing to pay for their new heated accommodation at Waikeria)

130 comments on “Why does Simon hate pensioners?”

  1. Gabby 1

    Slick’s mum n dad can opt not to take it of course.

    • paul andersen 1.1

      yes, jacinda made the point that you didnt HAVE to take the dosh. maybe something to follow up about and ask simon whether his parents took the dosh….

    • SARAH 1.2

      They could also opt not to take the pensions as well. I don’t see many wealthy people taking this philanthropic action.

  2. Kat 2

    National are fast becoming irrelevant and the support base is starting to crumble, that is why all the players in the opposition appear somewhat edgy. The next few polls will be very telling for Mr Bridges and co.

    As for pensioners why would the “I’m alright Jack” party give a toss……..

    • Gosman 2.1

      What evidence do you have that the National Party support base is crumbling?

      • WILD KATIPO 2.1.1

        They lost the election.

        That’ll do for starters.

        • james 2.1.1.1

          That has nothing to support a crumbling support base.

          The last poll had them only 0.4% behind the election night vote.

          So Kat …. anything to back up your comment ….. or just making stuff up?

          • WILD KATIPO 2.1.1.1.1

            Well besides the fact that it was only intended as a humorous dig, the truth is they DID lose,… and , … it appears the rate they are going with Mr Bridges they are finding themselves in exactly the sort of position Labour did…

            And all the Nats can do is aim shots only to see them bounce right off. This govt is popular and shows no sign of that popularity waning , even among its critics from the left. Also, the longer its in the harder it will get for National. It seems to be a phenomenon in NZ politics nowadays.

            So based on that I predict National will and IS losing its support base. Even it it starts by a ‘mere’ 0.4% ,- after all… ACT is the party of 0.5%.

            And there’s a jolly good chance it ( ACT ) will drop even lower as times goes by… which means… National really hasn’t got any friends left…

            Has it now….

    • cleangreen 2.2

      One name, (simple) Simon Bridges’

  3. AsleepWhileWalking 3

    $700 is quite a lot of money to allocate.

    I thought National would have supported a less bureaucratic option. Trying to target any other way would have been very pricey power.

    And they targeted free Freeview installs in a similar manner.

    • Gosman 3.1

      National have been very big on targeted welfare so why would they support untargeted welfare increases?

      • WILD KATIPO 3.1.1

        National have been very big on targeting beneficiaries to kick them off a benefit for the most trivial of excuses , – and setting up obstacles to prevent anyone in genuine need receiving a benefit , – while being EXTREMELY TARGETED in making damn sure the wealthy got their tax cuts.

        FIFY.

      • Daveosaurus 3.1.2

        National have been very big on targeted welfare

        You mean, like targeting $11½ million at a rich foreigner in a botched sheep deal?

        I’d rather see New Zealanders benefit, and reject the Logan’s Run fantasies of the Nats under Simon No-Bridges.

        • KJT 3.1.2.1

          Not to mention the targeted welfare to another rich American, who was given citizenship, and the opportunity to make a large sum, courtesy of NZ tax payers

  4. alwyn 4

    “are to get up to $700 extra automatically over winter.”

    But not this year. They will get something but it doesn’t even start until the worst of winter is over and it will certainly not be anything like $700.
    I wonder how many pensioners are not going to make it through the worst of Winter? As you are proposing they will, at the coldest time of the year be the
    “old & ill as they live in very cold houses trying to eek out their benefit”

    I suppose it will save the CoL some money though that they can spend on Tsar Winston’s favourite hobby of slow racehorses.

    You clearly listened to, and believed, the lies they were throwing around before the election when you wrote this. You really should have waited until they found themselves in the Beehive and they had to rapidly backtrack on those “promises” and then write about what they are really getting up to.

    • In Vino 4.1

      Get real, alwyn.
      You have no idea of when the worst of winter will be.. We are now late in May, and after a record hot summer and Autumn (ongoing) the temperature inside my Waikato zone house is currently 18º and I have used the heater very sparingly so far. Have not needed it, and don’t need it tonight. As a pensioner, I have no fear of getting through winter, which is likely to be less cold than usual, and the greatest cold usually comes later in winter, when the payments will be coming through.
      Silly comment from a silly man. Not a sign of a frost so far. I remember frosts in March…

      • cleangreen 4.1.1

        In Vito,

        Alwytn is a sicko it seems with all that muddled claptrap.

        Maybe he is feeling the cold damp crawling down his back as the crumbling National Party leader is looking more and more nlike a bloody joke.

        I wouldn’t feel comfortable if i was a National Party supporter now with his failing muddled grasp on the pulse of the people.

      • tony 4.1.2

        The greatest cold comes from the COLD HEARTED ..

      • alwyn 4.1.3

        That’s nice dear. It is also wrong.
        Of course you don’t seem to give a damn for people in colder parts of the country do you?
        You’ll get the payment for July, August and September.
        The coldest month further south, in Dunedin and Invercargill is in JUNE and May is colder than September.
        Even in Wellington the coldest month is also June. In Christchurch the coldest month is July but June is colder than August or September.
        Still, what do you care for other people? You are an example of the “I’m all right Jack” syndrome who doesn’t care about anyone else.

        • In Vino 4.1.3.1

          Rubbish again, alwyn. May is nearly gone, and (loving old stats as you appear to) I will tell you right now that September is going to be cooler in Dunedin and Invercargill than May was this year. Plucking dumb statistics to try to appear informed.. Silly.
          Your “I’m alright Jack” reflects your own outlook. You are a tory.

          • alwyn 4.1.3.1.1

            “I will tell you right now that September is going to be cooler in Dunedin and Invercargill than May was this year”.
            Well that certainly shows quite amazing confidence doesn’t it. I am sure that the Met Service would like to take advantage of the Crystal Ball you must use for your predictions.

            “You are a tory”. Oh the pain you inflict. The wounds to my soul.
            You silly little fellow. You show the common sense of a 2 year old.

            • Wensleydale 4.1.3.1.1.1

              Do you actually read what you write? I mean, if it were any more pretentious it would probably be physically painful. Do you wear a kravat and a velvet smoking jacket, and strut about the grounds reciting Baudelaire? I’m genuinely curious. You remind me of one of those obnoxious goth kids who used to sit in Grafton cemetery drinking absinthe and discussing the interminable anguish of not being allowed to paint their bedrooms black.

              • alwyn

                You must have led an interesting life to be able to recite such experiences from your youth.
                Well perhaps not interesting. Strange is probably more appropriate.
                What on earth were you up to in this cemetery you speak of? Was it the abode of the pot smokers and drug takers?
                I am also genuinely curious.
                Were you allowed to paint your bedroom black? And did you keep a coffin and a skeleton in the corner?

                • In Vino

                  Well said, Wensleydale.
                  Getting back to the weather subject, alwyn, no I don’t have a crystal ball, but I have the ability to pick likelihoods: The Met Service will already have noted that May this year was NOT so cold as in previous ones, especially in the said towns (Dunedin and Invercargill). You may have missed this fact, but others will be pretty certain that this time, September will be the cooler month.
                  As both cooler and warmer zones move south, such change is inevitable – or do you want to pretend that the world is not warming?
                  Beyond that, your inane insults merely reflect your own appalling state of mind.

                  • alwyn

                    Perhaps you are right. On the other hand perhaps you aren’t.
                    You obviously must have some sort of sooth-saying apparatus if you can happily talk about average temperatures for the month of May when it is still only the 22nd of the month.
                    Still, you are obviously very good at such activities. Pray tell me what the winning Lotto numbers will be tomorrow.
                    Where did the Met Service make these comments about May? And their predictions for September in Dunedin and Invercargill would be nice at the same time. I’m sure you made a note of the source for your statement.

                    • In Vino

                      Alwyn – As you laboriously and turgidly point out, May is not over yet, so obviously I jumped to my own conclusions. Right now, Dunedin and Invercargill are indeed getting temperatures far colder than in the North Island. But it will not last long enough to change the average temperature for the month, and I will be right about September. If I prove to be wrong, I invite you to bring the point up at the time.
                      But the current point is that you were hypocritically expressing concern for people (old-age, poor pensioners) for whom your ilk usually show no concern at all. Because you don’t like the new Govt.
                      Cry me a river. And provide your own hankie.

                    • alwyn

                      @In Vino
                      Obviously your forecasting isn’t working out to well is it?
                      Lucky that Labour gave that nice allowance to pensioners to let them keep warm in this cold weather.
                      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/104164229/heavy-snow-in-deep-south-ice-closes-north-islands-desert-road
                      Oh wait. They didn’t did they?
                      Still pensioners don’t matter. They probably have the sense not to vote Labour anyway.

      • Siobhan 4.1.4

        “Get ready for one of the coldest winters in years, Metservice says.

        Meteorologist Georgina Griffiths told Newshub we’re entering a colder than normal winter with much of June looking to be the same. ”

        ww.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2018/05/coldest-winter-in-years-on-its-way-metservice.html

    • Muttonbird 4.2

      The delay has been caused by problems installing the program and I suggest this is because the public service responsible for doing so has been gutted by the John Key government over several years of penny-pinching and is at present unable to carry out the tasks required of it.

      • cleangreen 4.2.1

        Thanks Muttonbird or that information, that the ghost of John Key is still haunting us all.

        He was certainly a liability that has damned the natiional party for a very long time going forward.

      • alwyn 4.2.2

        What utter rubbish.
        Even if we give you the benefit of the doubt however what was the reason they cut the payment for this year from $700 to a mere $413 or so. They could have at least paid out the full amount they promised in their pre-election b*s.
        Was that impossible to implement?

        • Muttonbird 4.2.2.1

          It is so ironic that you, representing the last vestiges of the dying rabid right on this forum, would use a lack of social spend to attack this government.

          Lol.

    • Fireblade 4.3

      What moronic comment Alwyn.

      Alwyn, the National Party were in government for nine years and never implented anything like a winter energy payment. National obviously don’t care if pensioners get sick and die.

      Also Alwyn, it’s the Honorable Winston Peters. Don’t call him Tsar Winston. The only place I’ve seen this term before is on Kiwiblog. I know your throwing your toys out of your cot because the National Party was too incompetent to negotiate an agreement with NZ first, but you need to get over it.

      • alwyn 4.3.1

        You are wrong you know.
        What the National Party did implement was an increase in the aftertax Super of $680/year that would have started on April 1, 2018. Your mates in the current Government scrapped it. It was a tax cut.

        Another thing is that Winnie the First is actually officially titled The RIGHT Honourable Winston Peters. A mere Honourable wasn’t sufficient for Tsar Winston.

        “too incompetent to negotiate an agreement”. Labour was willing to offer Peters anything, and they did. I really don’t think that National was willing to offer him $3,000,000,000.00 for the preserve Winston Slush Fund that Shane Jones is dishing out. Neither was it willing to give him $1,000,000,000.00 or so for him to spend on his mates in MFAT.
        I’m sure National was willing to give him something. I really don’t think they were willing to give the man open slather with the Public Purse.

        • In Vino 4.3.1.1

          Diddums. Any serious argument?

          • Wayne 4.3.1.1.1

            Tax cuts is a serious argument (not that Standardnistas would ever recognise that).

            The home heating allowance was Labour’s device to offset the proposed National tax cut. They are about the same amount. Labour knew they had to have something for National Superannuiants or else they would have been worse off by voting Labour.

            In my view the tax cuts are better. They are more efficient to administer and all tax payers, including low and middle income New Zealanders without children, would have benefitted. The proposed National cuts were only to the lowest rate, and to the threshold for the lowest rate. not exactly a tax cut for the rich.

            Labour will probably do something similar for the 2020 election, since over time fiscal drag (inflation and wage increases) drives people into higher tax bands unless the tax thresholds are adjusted.

            • One Anonymous Bloke 4.3.1.1.1.1

              Tax cuts is a serious argument (not that Standardnistas would ever recognise that).

              Was that insulting lie really necessary, Wayne?

              How about if you want to be taken seriously, you present real world evidence (not right wing “think” tank sophistry) to support your assertion.

              • Wayne

                OAB,

                I am not about to provide you the whole plethora of evidence from economists over many decades on why tax cuts help economic growth and freedom. It would be a waste of time. It would never convince you anyway.

                I just assume that for the left (or at least the hard left) they are fundamentally opposed to tax cuts, whereas as for the right (and the moderate left) they are an inherent part of policy to ensure the size of government is not too large, say less than 30 to 35% of GDP. So as not to squeeze out private investment and to ensure people can use the bulk of their money for their choices, not those of the government. A large part of of our freedoms being contained in that concept.

                I note that the current govt in the budget has the size of govt at 28% of GDP, surprisingly low for a centre-left government. I would have thought they would have gone for 30% of GDP, which would be an additional $5 billion social spending per year.

                • Stuart Munro

                  You happen to be wrong about this, as you are about most things.

                  https://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/14/magazine/the-tax-cut-con.html

                  For all the bullshit about rockstars, your party stuck NZ with under 1% growth for a decade. They are not in danger of Nobel nomination.

                  • Baba Yaga

                    Yes, the GFC did have an impact on growth, as did Labour’s recession, underway before the GFC hit NZ. Thankfully nationals tax cuts kick-started the economy and we recovered faster than most OECD countries. Pity labour think they can spend our money better than we can. Command economies never work.

                    • KJT

                      Democratically regulated ones do.

                      But, i know that you will never understand the difference.

                    • Andrea

                      You know, Baba Yaga, for many of us it never felt that anything at all was ‘kick-started’. Despite nine long years of cringe-cluttered ‘government by people who clearly couldn’t run a lemonade stand on a hot day and make a profit.

                      And the pity about National is that it sells what wasn’t its to sell – then wastes the money on inducements and favour buying.

                      A parcel of rogues.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  I am not about to provide you the whole plethora of evidence from economists over many decades on why tax cuts help economic growth and freedom. It would be a waste of time. It would never convince you anyway.

                  Gratuitous insults won’t get you off the hook, Wayne.

                  As luck would have it though, you turned around and contradicted your own assertion in the very same comment, when you pointed out that economists, far from prescribing “tax cuts” for every situation, hold that there is a level of taxation (you mentioned 30%) which is good.

                  You’ve certainly convinced me of something 😆

                • Draco T Bastard

                  I am not about to provide you the whole plethora of evidence from economists over many decades on why tax cuts help economic growth and freedom.

                  The evidence, which most economists have been ignoring for decades, shows that tax cuts make us worse off.

                  So as not to squeeze out private investment and to ensure people can use the bulk of their money for their choices, not those of the government.

                  If private investment can’t compete with the efficiency of the government then they should simply collapse. Isn’t that the capitalist way?

                  We certainly shouldn’t have government subsidising their inefficiency by removing the most efficient system – government.

                  • …. ‘ If private investment can’t compete with the efficiency of the government then they should simply collapse. Isn’t that the capitalist way? We certainly shouldn’t have government subsidising their inefficiency by removing the most efficient system – government ‘ …

                    I just cant ‘ L00L’ long enough or loud enough !

                    Those two last paragraphs caught my eye and it was Bullseye !!!

                    Nice!

                • Sometimes I really cant understand you Wayne, … and your support for the neo liberal agenda… it seems you are in league with shitting all over the Right Honourable Sir Rob Muldoon , – who incidentally – would have won the election had it not been for the weasel Bob Jones and his NZ party ‘conveniently ‘ splitting the vote on purpose,…

                  And Bob Jones only ever did it because he was a frustrated property magnate who simply just wanted to get richer,- he had NO inclinations for the betterment of this country , is a confirmed globalist and BOASTED about handing Lange / Labour the election win.

                  How does that stack up with your ideology’s , Wayne?

                  Are you a party turncoat?… a herd follower,… or are you going to spout off some crap about ‘ moving with the times?’… are you weak?

                  Are you / were you a professional survivalist in politics or were you there to do the best for the people of your country – or feather your own nest while the going was good?

                  How do you sleep at nights knowing under National that so many family’s were doing it hard and sleeping rough in cars at night because,… even though they had jobs,- couldn’t afford the rent , had to go to food banks and their kids tried to study in dim van lights for exams the next day ???

                  Because I tell you sunshine – NONE of those things would have EVER been countenanced or tolerated under the late Sir Robert Muldoon’s New Zealand. Ever.

                  HE had an EMPATHY with the KIWI battler.

                  Something that you don’t seem to have.

                  Is it because the Right Honourable Sir Robert Muldoon was a firm believer in Keynesian economics and that you ,… are an adherent to post 1984 neo liberalism ???

                  I have a sneaking suspicion that this is precisely the case and amply explains your viewpoints.

                  • alwyn

                    “Because I tell you sunshine – NONE of those things would have EVER been countenanced or tolerated under the late Sir Robert Muldoon’s New Zealand. Ever.
                    HE had an EMPATHY with the KIWI battler.”

                    Are you sure you aren’t a doppelganger for Tsar Winston?
                    He was, I thought, the only person who ever referred to someone as “sunshine” and he is certainly the last person who thought that Rob was someone to be admired and whose policies should be emulated.

                    • KJT

                      I wasn’t a Muldoon supporter.

                      However if oil prices had continued to Sky rocket, the same people who are bagging him now, would be making him a hero.
                      Think big went on to, on the whole, make big profits for private owners, after the Rogernomes gave them away.

                      Muldoon, at least, did his best for New Zealanders. Unlike way to many MP’s, after him, who concentrated on lining the pockets of their corporate sponsors, to ensure their own comfortable retirement. Whose “vision” only includes the next election.

                    • Oh yes, always been a fan of the great Right Honourable Winston Peters , – most definitely so.

                      And unashamedly so.

                      But then again, I was also a fan of the late great Jim Anderton as well.

                      Doppelganger ?… not so much , my wee laddie.

                      And you WILL notice they were complete opposites in the political spectrum… so how therefore, … does one reconcile oneself to that conundrum?

                      Quite easily , in actual fact …

                      The difference was between the brash Johhny come lately ‘ neo liberal’ ideology ,… and the more stable and sensible economic theory which this country adhered to when it was extremely wealthy – that of post WW2 Keynesian based economics.

                      So wealthy in fact , – that we were ranked the 6th wealthiest nation on the planet- after Denmark.

                      And there happened to be an interview ( on one of the last vestiges of our publicly owned broadcasting TV networks , no less… ) many years ago – beyond your years or memory , I should imagine ,… where Mr Peters stated something to the effect that ‘Muldoon made some mistakes’,… yet then proceeded to contrast the current scandalous and corrupted neo political political environment contrasted with the Muldoon era…

                      And he was scathing of the treasonous sell outs he was witnessing in parliaments contemporary gaggle of thieves…( meaning those of the Douglas / Richardson / Mont Pelerin society ilk ) and alluding to the decline of our democracy… that interview was conducted sometime in the early 1990’s… and Peters hasn’t changed one bit.

                      And thank goodness for that.

                      And that is why ,… when the marvelous Jacinda Adern takes child leave ( as she is more than entitled to ) you will then be addressing Winston Peters in his full title and not Tzar Peters, you shameless ignorant neo liberal degenerate .

                      And that title will be :

                      The Right Honourable Winston Peters , Prime Minister of New Zealand.

                      And DONT your ever forget it.

                    • Edit: should read ;

                      … ‘ yet then proceeded to contrast the current scandalous and corrupted neo LIBERAL political environment ‘ …

                      But I take it you are intelligent enough to get the gist, you don’t need an interpreter,… and I presume you even intelligent and / or old enough to know NZ’S recent political history to be able to compare apples with apples so to speak,… if not ,… then you really have no basis to conduct a counter argument….

                      And I suspect also,… that that is indeed the problem with so many of these exponents of neo liberalism,… they use the generations ignorance of the historical facts as a concealment and justification for their rorts and theft.

                    • alwyn

                      @KJT.
                      Muldoon was quite a good PM, at least in his first term and a half.
                      Unfortunately he wanted ALL the power and ended up not listening to anyone else. No one should be both PM and Minister of Finance.
                      He simply couldn’t accept that the old economy of New Zealand was dead. There was simply no demand for frozen sheep meat by the end of the 1970s. In order to keep sheep farming solvent he brought in the Supplementary Minimum Price scheme which kept buying, at ever higher prices, sheep meat that no-one wanted. In the end it was basically dumped. Didn’t they end up turning it into fertiliser?
                      He also became, in his third term, totally delusional about his importance in the world. He was going to totally re-organise the World financial system.
                      No PM should stay as long. Muldoon, Bolger and Clark all got to believe their own publicity. Key had the sense to quit before he got the same way. Only Holyoake seemed to be able to resist, at least to a degree. Perhaps keeping his home phone number in the directory, and answering it himself, as well as walking to and from Parliament from his house in Thorndon helped.

                    • Yet fast forward the clock , alwyn and we had Murray McCully involved in the Saudi sheep scam , eh mate.

                      So ,… that kind of disproves the narrative somewhat , doesn’t it.

                      Perhaps there always was a demand for sheep products but our fixation with a guaranteed market in ‘Great Britain’ clouded the thinking… 40 or so years on , and England has pulled out of the ‘European Union’ or whatever flavour of the month name they like to call it now…

                      So there go the French protections of their sheep farmers… they are irrelevant.

                      And as for Muldoon becoming delusional?

                      Well that’s subjective… we wouldn’t want to be accused of being ‘ageist’ now, would we…

                      And Key quit because of what Winston Peters termed ‘irresponisbity’ and ‘unaccountablility’s ‘ in his govt decisions… now,… I wonder what that could mean… a certain small village in Afghanistan , perhaps?

                    • alwyn

                      Wild K at 3.47pm
                      Sheep still in demand you think.
                      I will take the livestock numbers in the country as being rather more meaningful.
                      In 1982, at the peak of the SMP scheme there were apparently about 70.3 million sheep in New Zealand. This had dropped by the beginning of 2015 to 29.6 million.
                      You don’t really think that was coincidence or just a minor fluctuation do you?
                      https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/07/new-zealand-sheep-numbers-fall-to-their-lowest-for-75-years

                      You then waffle on about yours, and others like Bradbury’s conspiracy theories about why Key retired.
                      He retired about 18 months ago. Various wild-eyed radicals on the left of politics have been promising to reveal “why” ever since. None of you have ever produced anything have you?

                • KJT

                  Explain please Wayne, how high tax California has gone from the 8th to the sixth largest economy in the world.
                  Subsidising and preventing the decline of “low tax” States.”

                  Looking at evidence, is obviously not a National MP’s strong suite.

                  • alwyn

                    Do you think it is a coincidence that California is the home of those enormously successful companies the left loves to hate?
                    Companies like Facebook, Google and Apple for example.
                    You know. The ones who supposedly don’t pay enough in taxes.
                    Perhaps we should welcome them here and we could bloom as well?

                    • And have another few thousand working for the minimum wage for American company’s with the proceeds going from this country to the USA?

                      Nah piss off mate , – the Batistas tried that on in Cuba and look what happened.

            • Kay 4.3.1.1.1.2

              Wayne, I’m sure you know that beneficiaries NEVER benefit from tax cuts, even though what we get is actually taxed. The system is so deliberately rigged and you know it. So how is no fuel allowance ON TOP OF no benefit increase going to help us?

              Now perhaps your lot would consider legislation to halve the price of power across the board- that way you wouldn’t have to give any of the plebs any more money. Or wouldn’t the shareholders like that?

            • Draco T Bastard 4.3.1.1.1.3

              Tax cuts is a serious argument

              No it’s not. Reality has shown quite conclusively that tax cuts don’t do what the RWNJs claim that they do. They just make society worse off as inequality and poverty increases.

              In my view the tax cuts are better. They are more efficient to administer and all tax payers, including low and middle income New Zealanders without children, would have benefitted.

              Nope. As reality has shown. With tax cuts the rich are better off while everyone else is worse off as public spending is decreased and inflation soars.

              The proposed National cuts were only to the lowest rate, and to the threshold for the lowest rate. not exactly a tax cut for the rich.

              Tax cuts are only for the rich as they’re in a position to skim off all the extra money by putting prices up to grab it.

        • Incognito 4.3.1.2

          Alwyn, please educate yourself or you’ll keep spouting ignorant nonsense.

          Peters also announced a whopping $714.2m allocation to the Official Development Assistance fund – or foreign aid – that will be heavily prioritised towards the Pacific.

          He said the funding was a “clear demonstration” to the international community that New Zealand was serious in addressing global and regional challenges and helping people in need”.

          “Increased investment will enable New Zealand to deliver on our Pacific Reset. It will bolster our efforts to tackle priority issues like climate change in the region,” said Peters.

          “We will assist our partners to make progress towards the UN Sustainable Development Goals; support youth across the region with access to health services, education and training; and promote the sustainable and inclusive growth of Pacific economies.”

          https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/103738729/budget-2018-1b-for-foreign-affairs-massive-boost-to-pacific-aid-and-a-new-embassy

          • alwyn 4.3.1.2.1

            “ignorant nonsense”?
            You really are confused aren’t you? The link you provide is precisely the one I got my numbers from. Even the heading on the story confirms what I said.
            As it says there is an additional billion dollars going to MFAT. OF course some will go on aid. So what? It is still our money going to Tsar Winston’s mates in MFAT and you can be quite sure they will strew it around.

            I merely spelt the amount out fully so it is quite clear how big the number is.
            I said “$1,000,000,000.00”. That is merely all the digits, including the cents in one billion dollars and it is all going through MFAT’s grasp.

            I am afraid your attempt to try and justify your opinion about me is some more of your usual ignorant nonsense.
            FAIL.

            • Incognito 4.3.1.2.1.1

              My dear Alwyn, it is you who is confused, obviously.

              You did not mention a link and you did not provide a link. Oops.

              You forgot to mention that $714.2m does not go to “his mates in MFAT” but to foreign aid. Oops, you did it again.

              You seem to love spelling out big numbers in all their digits, don’t you? You silly little fellow. You behave like a 2 year old.

              Let me lift the lid on my opinion of your commenting here. I think you’re disingenuous at best and deliberately confusing others with your wilful spouting of misinformation at worst. I fail to see what you get out of it but your hautain put-downs of other commenters who challenge you suggests to me that you’re not doing it just for laughs.

        • Draco T Bastard 4.3.1.3

          What the National Party did implement was an increase in the aftertax Super of $680/year that would have started on April 1, 2018. Your mates in the current Government scrapped it. It was a tax cut.

          $680 for whom?

          Because we can be sure as hell that it wouldn’t have been for pensioners.

          “too incompetent to negotiate an agreement”. Labour was willing to offer Peters anything, and they did. I really don’t think that National was willing to offer him $3,000,000,000.00 for the preserve Winston Slush Fund that Shane Jones is dishing out.

          As I understand it, National actually offered NZFirst more. Typical of National believing that everyone is for sale and then getting upset when they find out that that isn’t so.

      • Gosman 4.3.2

        National increased core benefit levels. Labour never did that from 1999 till 2008

        • WILD KATIPO 4.3.2.1

          Only because they faced riots if they didn’t, … there was a GFC , remember ?

          Remember this?… and the campaign of lies John Key used with crying crocodile tears about the poor in this country ?

          Aroha of McGehan Close flees NZ | Stuff.co.nz
          http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10468960/Aroha-of-McGehan-Close-flees-NZ

          Then after he got into power proceeded to shit all over the less well off in this country and created a society of homeless, poverty ridden family’s and individuals.

          So far the coalition has increased student allowances , is working towards an hourly rate of $20.00 per hour minimum , and has provided ( and will provide ) a power subsidy for all – of which you , no doubt will be enjoying the benefits thereof.

          So dont bloody complain you ingrate.

        • Barfly 4.3.2.2

          Not mine they didn’t – liar

        • Sarah 4.3.2.3

          I’ve yet to meet anyone who received that $25 a week. I believe a few got a proportion of it but very few, and I believe it was also only ‘targeted’ at people with children. That narrows the field.

          • Baba Yaga 4.3.2.3.1

            Targeted…as it damn well should be. Just like energy payments to rich pensioners is plain silly when Labour claim the health system is underfunded by 2bill and then provide only a quarter of that.

            • WILD KATIPO 4.3.2.3.1.1

              As I said to Wayne earlier,… it would be a simple thing to redirect those monies designated for their power bill to another social development effort of their choice.

              THAT , OF COURSE , … would be totally reliant on the well off’s sense of fair play , values and social conscience. …

              And as I said to Wayne,… there are many ways to do this , it just means thinking outside the square.

              But I have a sneaking feeling that the challenge of redirecting to a worthy social cause would be too great or the subsidy’s too small for many of the well off to bother thinking about it… and hence would just let it accrue…

              But you never know , those patriots with a social conscience who happened to be well off may very well surprise…. means testing is a costly , divisive and discriminatory device subject to too many human errors and biases , and , … as well… the wealthy do contribute and there is nothing wrong with them being fellow partakers of the benefits of energy / power/ heating subsidy’s…

              I have no problem with that at all.

              ALL New Zealanders, rich or poor, … deserve to have warm, healthy , dry homes in the types of winters we experience.

              And that’s the final definition .

              • dv

                Solution is a Universal income to replace all allowance and benefits.
                A higher tax rate on incomes over say 150k and a tobin tax.

                Higher tax claws back the universal income and tobin tax catch trusts.
                And No need of big beuracracy to administer.

                • Yet another possibility . I’ve heard a few arguments for and against the idea, but the concept is certainly interesting!

                  The Universal Basic Income.

                  What a marvelous thing for the people of NZ that work in poorly paying jobs or cant find work .And not just those as well. Many others would benefit. These are the sorts of things that need to be brought to the table and SERIOUSLY considered as we move into the future.

            • KJT 4.3.2.3.1.2

              No problem with the wealthy also benefiting from tax payer funded services.

              So long as they, ‘pay their share of taxes”!

              It ensures, the wealthy support continuation of these services. Out of self interest sure. Targetting is always the start of a slope towards removal.

      • WILD KATIPO 4.3.3

        The Right Honourable Winston Peters, soon to be:

        The Right Honourable Winston Peters Prime Minister of New Zealand.

        And rightly so.

        You will address him by his correct and proper title and DON’T you ever forget it , alwyn.

        You complete and utter pleb.

        • alwyn 4.3.3.1

          “Prime Minister of New Zealand”.
          Really? Is he planning a coup? I wonder if Ms Ardern realises that she is not just allowing him the role of Acting Prime Minister as she has said. He is going to depose her.
          I will address him in the way he deserves. Probably not to his face as I am not a regular habitue of the Green Parrot Restaurant in the wee small hours, so I am unlikely to run into him.
          He shall remain Tsar Winston.

          Your last sentence takes me way, way back.
          “pleb”.
          I haven’t heard that since, probably, my University days. It was the sort of word the crazier lefties, followers of Mao, used to use as they paraded waving their copies of the Quotations of Chairman Mao in the air.
          I suppose you still have your sacred copy of The Little Red Book in a suitable place of honour?

          • WILD KATIPO 4.3.3.1.1

            Very amusing.

            And yes he will be Acting Prime Minister , – but Prime Minister , …nonetheless !!!

            And that just really rankles all you neo liberal types no end, doesn’t it just ???

            L0L0L !

            You are quite the drama queen , alwyn…. ‘ planning a coup ‘ ???

            L00L! again !

            And yes , … my little blue eyed Babooshka , you can put away your little idealistic university days of being so easily alarmed and come back down to planet earth ,… the cold war is over,…throw away that kerchief and decline a warming drink at the Green Parrot,..though it may warm your soul and knock in some senses to that overworked stuffed full of useless garbage university education if you chose to accept …

            But I must admit,… that you are definitely showing a distinctly ‘Americanized ‘ worldview in your political / economic biases… are you sure you are not trying to ‘Americanize ‘ us?

            Are you an American?

            Because even you must admit,… John Key is long gone, as is Obama,… Donald Trump is in office now, and Jacinda Adern is now our Prime Minister…

            And most assuredly ,… the Right Honourable Winston Peters will be the ‘Acting’ Prime Minister … and with FULL executive powers, … no less.

            ‘ Prepare yourself ‘.

            predator 2 king willy scene!!! – YouTube
            Video for prepare yourself king willie▶ 3:17

  5. NZJester 5

    Why does he hate them, well maybe because a lot of the older not quite as well off National supporters and those from their puppet support parties are wising up to how National and its Puppets have been screwing them over. Because they don’t want to support Labour, most are now swapping to NZ First.

  6. Ian 6

    More pensioners voted for National than labour. Why preach to the converted.Perhaps he doesn’t like their smell ?

  7. solkta 7

    as Simon Bridges admits his parents will be happy to receive it.

    I think he actually has a good point here. It was clearly the only one though. Like the general population there is a significant number of “pensioners” who are actually fucking wealthy. It is already enough of a rort that these people can claim a benefit without just throwing another $700 at them. I’m not sure in what way it could be targeted, but it really doesn’t sit well with me as is.

    • Muttonbird 7.1

      It doesn’t sit well but the two other ways of doing it are to means-test at the provider end the costs of which are prohibitive, or to make it application based which as Bunji has said would have all the rich prick pensioners signing up pronto, and the already pressured ones unsure about, or unable to recognise what they are entitled to.

      The remaining option is universal with opt out.

      • Mac1 7.1.1

        The remaining option was justified by a top manager of a Ducati factory in Italy who said that of course he didn’t mind paying higher taxes if he got something back.

        All humans of whatever wealth and income need warmth. The rich will know they are too getting something for their tax dollar and bask too in the warmth of knowing they contributed.

        The same with kids in France all eating together in the same dining room. The parents share the cost and the kids share and serve literally each other.

        In another country (I’ve been watching tonight a hugely powerful Michael Moore film on how countries of the world have all sorts of good ideas) no school can charge fees from their students. Therefore, almost all kids, rich and poor, attend the same public schools. As Moore said, in later adult life it’s much harder to shaft someone who you were friends with at school.

        Taxation, and shared public services like education and health that tax provides, can be a great leveller and moderator of elitism.

        Let’s all enjoy a little communal warmth together.

        • WILD KATIPO 7.1.1.1

          … ‘ Let’s all enjoy a little communal warmth together ‘ …

          Hear , hear !

          We really should have no qualms about who does and does not receive this , – there was a time in NZ that ALL received the same benefits of a state owned electricity company as we all contributed to it with taxes, – the rich and the poor alike. And it resulted in ALL being able to afford warm, dry homes .

          NO ONE should have to go through these winters perpetually ill , miserable , shivering in cold weather . That is ridiculous in a country like this.

          So I say , rich or poor alike , – let the people have warmth !!!

    • Draco T Bastard 7.2

      I’m not sure in what way it could be targeted

      That’s actually quite easy – increase taxes on the rich.

    • Baba Yaga 7.3

      Agreed. Like the hundreds of millions thrown at students, many of whom come from rich families, with zero gain in student numbers. Meanwhile, the government breaks promise after promise after promise…

  8. Zorb6 8

    Why does he hate them?Because as his role model mentioned in the teapot tapes-‘they’re dying’.
    No future in that.

  9. Kat 9

    Why does Radio New Zealand “national” persist with that tired old right wing spin merchant Matthew Hooton, someone in that organisation hates pensioners…..and others that tune in during the day.

    • tc 9.1

      No it’s just another messaging mechanism.

      All too easily got to with a few drop ins by shonky’s crew back a few terms also there’s hardly anywhere else to work if you actually want to attempt journalism.

    • Gosman 9.2

      Which person on the right would you prefer they engage with?

      • WILD KATIPO 9.2.1

        The Right Honourable Winston Peters , – soon to be the Right Honourable Winston Peters , Prime Minister of New Zealand.

        He’ll do nicely.

        After all , he was in the National party at one stage before they shat all over him , and he did have an affinity somewhat with the Right Honourable Sir Robert Muldoon.

        Or is Sir Robert and by association , – Winston Peters viewed as too far to the left of the political spectrum for the neo liberals these days ,… huh?

        My oh my , … how far to the right this country has flown in 3 short decades of neo liberal lies…

        • Gosman 9.2.1.1

          He (as you point out) is an actual Politician not a media commentator. It would be highly unusual to employ him in any capacity that Matthew Hooton is currently being used for.

          • WILD KATIPO 9.2.1.1.1

            Yeah well see that’s part of the problem, – we have all these goons coming on spraying their B.S all over the place, creating suspicions and rumors, putting their slant on things , putting words in peoples mouths, and generally just muddying the waters.

            What we need is more statements from the actual people involved directly- not a bunch of sycophantic talking heads and wishful thinkers with vested interests- and that’s precisely the problem with characters like Hooten.

            • Gosman 9.2.1.1.1.1

              You mean exercising their right to free speech

              • No , – I mean their unwarranted hogging of a disproportionate amount of air time with their unbalanced views which do not represent the bulk of peoples thinking and peddling their far right wing propaganda on our broadcasting channels.

                • Baba Yaga

                  …aka expressing their right to free speech.

                • Gosman

                  Unfortunately for you (but fortunately for much of the rest of us) you don’t have any power to decide whether or not these people you dislike are ‘hogging’ a disproportionate amount of airtime. Luckily for our democracy you also don’t have the power to restrict what views are being broadcast. If that ever changes it would be a sad day for NZ.

                  • KJT

                    Unfortunately. That privilege, is reserved for the rich, who own the media.

                  • Ah Gosman , Gosman , Gosman…

                    How silly art thou?

                    Please name the broadcasting outlets that are TRULY owned by the tax payers of New Zealand as true state owned broadcasting SOE’S.

                    Without the fawning Mike Hosking as an example , please.

                    And then correlate that with the various overseas companies that also donate to the National party… are you willing to follow the electronic ‘ paper’ trail ?

                    I doubt it.

                    Here’s an example:

                    When I worked for a particular security company that contracted to Mediaworks, ( owned then by IRON BRIDGE , an Australian firm ) not only was I witnessing the setting up of Kim Dotcom , and the MANA / INTERNET party launch , but also the Pike River disaster and the ‘unnamed ‘ National party MP undergoing Police inquiry’s in Northland, I also was observant of the financial bail outs of that company.

                    As a security officer,… you are trained to observe the various comings and goings… and accurately if needs be for witness testimony in a court of law.

                    And people talk,… willingly.

                    I saw what the tax payer dollar was being spent on. Heres a hint:

                    Nice floor to ceiling glass frontages , guys…

                    A foreign owned private company receiving a bail out from a Minister of the National party who once owned the same company and had good local knowledge of those individuals in that field ( one Stephen Joyce – the dildo guy ) and a company that was notorious for being a recognized mouthpiece for the National party.

                    Now even you and your sycophants should easily be able to connect the dots and see how big business and mass media work hand in hand. A kind of ‘symbiotic relationship’ as it were , ….of mutual financial interests…

                    If not , you are stupid , in denial and wasting everybody’s time.

                    And no one wants to listen to a liar.

                    Free speech?

                    Its an illusion when included in the same sentence as neo liberalism.

                    Particularly when its touted by those who have pecuniary interest’s in NOT telling the truth as John Key was doing , and the reversals of Mr Kim Dotcoms fortunes have shown recently in the courts, – and particularly after John Key left office suddenly… I’m sure ‘ Wayne ‘ knows a little about that and what REALLY happened regarding Operation Burnham…

                    My Lai Massacre – Wikipedia
                    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Lai_Massacre

                    • Oh ,… and one other thing,…

                      The amount of capital that is being sucked out of New Zealand by Australian owned banks operating here in New Zealand ?

                      That’s a big naughty too…

                      And do you really think you will effectively convince anybody with half a brain that’s thought about that , … that they wont be able to work out that we are being conned?

                      Of course they will want to have interests in keeping New Zealanders passive and docile… of course they will want to have a mouthpiece here in NZ.

                      Free speech from a privately owned and foreign news media that is literally laughing all the way to its own banks?

                      Piss off.

                      Just piss off and stop wasting serious peoples time , Gosman .

                      Your fooling no-one but yourself.

                    • I also sometimes suspect you are a construct yourself, Gosman…

                      Used by various on the left to play the ‘devils advocate’ and stimulate discussion… there is a gap / time lag often in your replies,… almost as if time is taken to work out an inflammatory reply to coax a reaction…

                      Are you even worth replying to?

                      I wonder…

  10. RuralGuy 10

    My folks sold the farm several years ago for just over 7mil. Aside from a house in Hamilton, a Bach, an Audi A7 and a couple of cruises they haven’t really spent too much. It appears that they’re also now going to be receiving this additional payout too. It’s a bit comical really.

    The old boy thinks it a huge joke. He said something about it’ll serve those pinko commies right if they want to pay for a couple dozen nice bottles of red….

    Based upon my family’s experience, I’d say this policy is hard to defend.

    • Incognito 10.1

      I’d imagine your folks are quite jolly then assuming they receive NZ Super, public healthcare, ACC, the SuperGold Card, to name a few universal perks in in this country. They’d be even jollier when they remember that other people receive the same benefits who are not necessarily as well-off. So, I think it is a very easy to defend such policies. Your folks my no need all these benefits but just like the other beneficiaries they’re entitled to them because they paid taxes but most importantly because they are members of this society. Who’s laughing now?

      • KJT 10.1.1

        Basically. They are rich because those “pinko commies” subsidised their farming.
        They should be grateful.

    • Carolyn_Nth 10.2

      You clearly haven’t read or digested the post and/or some of the above comments. Basically, a universal system is cheapest to administer and the one to ensure people who need it do get it. A means tested one results in some fairly well-off people knowing or rorting the system and getting it, while those who need it are too busy with struggling to survive to know about it.

      A means tested benefit results in nasty Nats, when in government, doing their best to ensure beneficiaries who are means tested, are treated badly, and made to beg for every cent they are given – and often missing out on their entitlements or having punitive sanctions applied to them.

      Your rellies would have to have claimed a super to get it – ie they don’t get it automatically. If they don’t need it, and still applied for it, they must be a bit greedy. But, that is also why people on high incomes should be more heavily taxed – then they would be paying for their own super.

      And, to get the winter payment, they would first need to be getting super. But they also can opt out of getting the winter payment, as it says here:

      http://www.superseniors.msd.govt.nz/news-events/news/2017/winter-energy-payment.html

      So, basically, to ensure all people who need it do get it, we need to put up with selfish greedy people, like your rellies. They don’t sound like they aren’t thinking very deeply about how to get the payments to the people who need it, and are just grabbing at every extra cent they can get and sniggering at people working to get payments to people who need it. Also, not a great look for them or rightees who repeat such stories as an attack on the left.

      • Drowsy M. Kram 10.2.1

        Good comments Carolyn.

        And thanks to RuralGuy for selflessly sharing information about his parents – some ‘valuable’ insights there.

    • Muttonbird 10.3

      Your family seem like a bunch of scumbags.

      Just saying.

      • Wayne 10.3.1

        Muttonbird,

        Was that insult really necessary.

        • WILD KATIPO 10.3.1.1

          Probably not but I don’t think his Dad being of good farmer stock will be too worried, and , if he so chooses to have a few good bottles of Red instead then all power to him. I really don’t mind those that can afford power bills getting the same subsidy, I really don’t.

          The way I see it , …they too , have contributed their taxes so why shouldn’t the well off be partakers of the same benefits. Means testing is an inefficient, costly discriminatory and divisive mechanism that runs contrary to the good will of an equal society regarding the fundamentals of basic human needs such as this issue.

          From the richest to the poorest, all should be equal partakers. It then becomes a matter of values and conscience whether someone chooses to decline , – OR , – could have that amount donated to other certified social development programs of their choice instead.

          There’s lots of ways to do this. Just got to think outside the square.

        • Stuart Munro 10.3.1.2

          It’s important to remind the worst of the right that there are better principles they should be living up to. Or we descend to their standards.

        • Draco T Bastard 10.3.1.3

          Yes, It is necessary to point out greedy scum.

    • peterlepaysan 10.4

      What is there to defend? Everybody wins! shock! horror! Communism is rampant.
      Unbelievable both the wealthy and the poor get to share common spoils.
      That is not allowed.
      Only the greedy and powerful should get the goodies,
      Actually there is a real need to be addressed in power prices and the most cost effective way is an across the board payment.

      Your comment reveals rather more about the mental health of you and your family.

      Time you grew up you pr shill..

    • MikeS 10.5

      The policy (flawed though it is IMO) is easy to defend.

      Your father’s attitude however, is indefensible.

  11. MikeS 11

    I dislike Bridges but in fairness the article says he would have cancelled them whereas in reality he wouldn’t have implemented them as they weren’t National party policy. There is a difference.

    I don’t agree with universality either. It should be means tested or something for those receiving superannuation, many of whom don’t need either super or the additional payment. I can only hope that the reason for universality is that the complexity / cost would have been too much to try and target the payment, because the alternative would be that they’re worried about votes which would indicate real lack of conviction.

    Let’s be realists here, I would guess that only a tiny handful (if that) will opt out, even if they are financially well off. Sad but not many people will say no to free money even if morally they should.

    I wish this government wasn’t so centrist, but guessed / knew they would be similar to the Clark government rather than transformational, I hope that massive surplus Robertson has produced is earmarked for something important and necessary because no government should be running such surpluses when there are people in need, especially a left (supposed) leaning one.

    • mac1 11.1

      Mike S, superannuation is actually universal. The winter warmth payment is going to superannuitants. Universality makes sense for both payments for similar reasons.

    • Draco T Bastard 11.2

      It should be means tested or something for those receiving superannuation, many of whom don’t need either super or the additional payment.

      Just need to be properly taxed. That is, after all, already means testing.

  12. David Mac 12

    I wonder if means testing it would be more expensive than making it universal. We would need inspectors checking on and policing peoples’ means. Then we’ve got govt officials looking for pots of gold amongst elderly battlers’ affairs.

    The oldies I know with a few $ have their wealth tucked away in a trust. They drive new cars and world cruise courtesy of the directors of the trust and day to day live on their pensions, on paper, struggling.

    • Draco T Bastard 12.1

      We would need inspectors checking on and policing peoples’ means.

      We could call them the IRD.

      The oldies I know with a few $ have their wealth tucked away in a trust. They drive new cars and world cruise courtesy of the directors of the trust and day to day live on their pensions, on paper, struggling.

      Which is just more proof that we need to get rid of trusts as they’re obviously a rort.

  13. cleangreen 13

    ‘Simple Simon’ is the true term for this man Simon Bridges..

  14. Perhaps it is a cunning plan to boost NZF’s numbers, so Winston will look kindly on him if coalition negotiations are needed in 2020.

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