Willis’s budget analysis is either deeply cynical or evidence she does not know what she is talking about

Written By: mickysavage - Date published: 8:33 am, December 5th, 2023 - 75 comments
Categories: budget 2023, grant robertson, labour, making shit up, national, nicola willis, same old national, spin, you couldn't make this shit up - Tags:

I almost feel sorry for Nicola Willis.

She is under some pressure trying to make National’s tax cut policy work. After all she did promise to resign if she did not deliver tax cuts.

Remember when she said:

I am going to ensure that National meets it commitment to deliver tax reduction. I do care that it adds up. If we didn’t deliver tax reduction, yes, I would resign, because we are making a commitment to the New Zealand people, and we intend to keep it.

There are weasel words included in this. She is not saying how much and to who. But no doubt she will be reminded of what she said. Repeatedly.

And there are some rather big holes in National’s calculations. The end of the foreign buyer tax will hurt. There are also major questions about other funding sources in particular the online gambling tax. Increasing rates of cancer so that you can afford to give landlords a tax cut is a sign of how desperate things are.

So Willis has used the tried and true method used by desperate politicians and that is to make baseless allegations against Labour to try and create confusion. Either that or she has no idea of what she is talking about. Either possibility is concerning.

Yesterday she started talking about fiscal cliffs and hinted darkly that there were hidden features in the Government’s finances. From Radio New Zealand:

“I am concerned by the scale of the financial challenges left to us by the outgoing government. I am still receiving advice on both the number of those challenges, their size, and the options available,” she said.

They came in two broad categories, Willis said: Risks referred to in the pre-election update but with their true scale and urgency not made clear for reasons including commercial sensitivity; and government programmes set to expire because they were only funded on a short-term basis.

“I think what they did is they found clever workarounds to make the books look better than they really are. For example, it is absolutely permissible for a government to only short-term fund a programme, that is allowed, but where you know that you will have to go back to fund it in future Budgets – then actually you should just be funding it for the long term.”

One example for that second category was Pharmac funding, she said.

“Did they really intend to withdraw funding for listed medicines, and if not why didn’t they account for that in their pre-election update?”

Other examples she offered were a cybersecurity programme for schools, and funding for the school lunches programme.

The practice was “extremely disingenuous,” she said. “It makes the books look better in future years even though it is highly unlikely ministers genuinely intended to stop funding those programmes.”

She obviously does not want to do the tough job of actually reading and comprehending Budget documents. Instead she is insisting for a Reader’s Digest version so that she can get her head around what is in the country’s finances.

Grant Robertson did not hold back in response. About the list he said:

“It already exists, it’s called the Budget. We put it out every year. And all of those things are in here,” he said, holding up a copy. “How can we be hiding something that’s literally in this document?”

Deciding how to handle time-limited funding was just part of the job, he said.

“I inherited a number of time-limited pieces of funding and what you do at each Budget is you go back and you look and say ‘Well are we going to extend that? Are we going to baseline it? Are we going to look at another way of doing it? This is literally the job that Nicola Willis has signed up for and she seems to think it’s some kind of scandal.”

He pointed to the school cybersecurity funding.

“Nicola Willis seemed to suggest that particular example she gave today was, quote: ‘Buried in the estimates’. It’s on page 89 of a 154-page document. It is not buried.

“If she couldn’t make it to page 89 of the Budget I’m really, really concerned at what kind of finance minister she’ll make.”

This is nothing new. In the last National Government Nick Smith specialised in bogus figures and analysis to claim that there was a crisis with ACC funding when it was clear there was not. Read any of the Standard posts on the topic to get a feel of what was happening.

This incident is evidence either that National will cynically make baseless claims to attack Labour or that Nicola Willis has no idea about what she is talking about and has not been doing her most basic job of reading and comprehending previous budget documents. Or possibly both.

75 comments on “Willis’s budget analysis is either deeply cynical or evidence she does not know what she is talking about ”

Comments are now closed

Adrian 1

5 December 2023 at 8:55 am

When a basic lunch for kiddies becomes a fiscal cliff then we are truly rooted.
feijoa 2

5 December 2023 at 9:12 am

She is laying the ground work for austerity.
- Rolling-on-Gravel 2.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 11:44 am
  
  Ding dong.
  
  This with the "the books are bad" rhetoric is the way they will get their electronic monitoring & selected doctors for medical certificate for the benefits through.
  
  Be aware and be ready to protest.
  - gsays 2.1.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 12:36 pm
    
    By electronic monitoring, does that include the 'debanking' of individuals?
    
    A'la China and Canada during the truckers protest. A tactic I recall being celebrated by some 'lefties' and 'progressives' round these parts.
    
    Our Commonwealth cousins have set an extremely worrying and damaging precedent.
    - Rolling-on-Gravel 2.1.1.1
      
      5 December 2023 at 12:47 pm
      
      I don't mean in the conspiracy sense. I don't at all agree with them.
      
      Actually:
      
      I meant in the electronic monitoring of beneficiaries' bank accounts.
      
      Here is the part where it is mentioned in the ACT's coalition agreement with National:
      
      "Social Services
      
      • Implement sanctions, including electronic money management, for beneficiaries who can work but refuse to take agreed steps to find a job.
      
      • Develop an approved pool of doctors who can issue medical certificates to go onto a health and disability related benefit."
      
      This is the link to the full coalition agreement between ACT and National:
      
      https://assets.nationbuilder.com/actnz/mailings/6945/attachments/original/National_ACT_Agreement.pdf?1700781466
      - Rolling-on-Gravel 2.1.1.1.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 1:01 pm
        
        I didn't realise when I said electronic monitoring I meant electronic money management.
        
        I am guessing that means either extending the purpose of the Green card we use to buy food with to making beneficiaries "spend correctly" or looking at how they spend their money from some kind of mechanism.
        
        And given a lot of people who are on Jobseekers are usually not "disabled enough" for Supported Living (I am on it) are usually not able-bodied enough to easily get a job, this is where they will want to control beneficiaries until they stumble and die or wreck their bodies further.
        
        Sanctions are generally a tool of austerity. This tells us that ACT wants to enact austerity and they will likely enact more of these sort of things.
        
        This is worrying, no matter what terminology I consciously or unconsciously use.
      - gsays 2.1.1.1.2
        
        5 December 2023 at 4:36 pm
        
        Nothing conspiracy about getting debanked.
        
        It happened to some folk who had the temerity to fiscally support the truckers.
        
        My point is this technology is widely available and if this regime is half as heartless as they appear (needing smokers tax dollars and gleefully announcing the removal of fair pay agreements) then we may find ourselves side by side resisting the state's further encroachment into our lives.
    - Ghostwhowalks 2.1.1.2
      
      5 December 2023 at 4:36 pm
      
      Canada declared a National emergency for its actions against the Truckers blockades. Rather coy calling them 'protests' isnt it when like the Wellington occupation it quickly degenerated into violence from the fringe groups it attracted
      - gsays 2.1.1.2.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 5:34 pm
        
        One man's protestor is another's hater and wrecker.
        
        I clearly referred to one who merely donated money to the protestors.
        
        Speaking to a senior detective recently, the demographic of the the parliament protest didn't change much until the final few days. as opposed to the "quickly degenerated into violence" revisionist narrative.
        
        Ghostwhowalks 2.1.1.2.1.1
        
        6 December 2023 at 12:51 pm
        
        The first days had them setting up kangaroo courts and hoping try 'criminals' … so that was the nice part
        
        The trucker owners were the ones whos bank accounts were hit not the donators – of course it blocked the donations via go fund me and other methods. One of the biggest donors was a US tech enterpreneur
        
        https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/14/world/canada/canada-trucker-protests-donations.html
        
        But of course you are all in on the falsehoods which you continue to spread
        The destinations of funds were blocked not the donors
        “Protesters were initially able to use GoFundMe to garner financial support and raised around $7.8 million before GoFundMe put a stop to the fundraiser for violating its terms of service and opted to refund all donors.”
        https://www.npr.org/2022/02/10/1080022827/a-canadian-judge-has-frozen-access-to-donations-for-the-trucker-convoy-protest
        
        gsays …
        
        6 December 2023 at 8:01 pm
        
        So, about spreading falsehoods….
        
        "The destinations of funds were blocked not the donors"
        
        https://www.newsweek.com/banks-have-begun-freezing-accounts-linked-trucker-protest-1680649
        
        "Canadian banks have begun freezing the accounts of people linked to the trucker protests in Canada and the federal government is promising to take more accounts offline in coming days…"
        
        and
        
        "On February 17, Deputy Prime Minister Chrystia Freeland said in a press conference that financial institutions have started freezing accounts and canceling credit cards in accordance with the Emergencies Act, which Prime Minister Justin Trudeau invoked earlier this week."
        
        https://www.newsweek.com/banks-have-begun-freezing-accounts-linked-trucker-protest-1680649
        
        "The Trudeau government’s emergency measures have been widely panned by observers and opposition members, who say the occupations in downtown Ottawa and at land border crossings this month don’t meet the threshold for invoking the Emergencies Act."
        
        "“When you freeze someone’s bank account, you’re effectively removing them from society,” Lawrence said.
        
        “The de-banking provisions are so broad, that literally a clerk at a Kwik-E-Mart who sold a propane canister to a protester could have his accounts frozen.”"
        
        https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/even-small-donation-to-freedom-convoy-after-feb-15-enough-to-have-donors-bank-accounts-frozen-finance-committee-told
        
        Time for you to retract your falsehood smear.
        
        Ghostwhowalks …
        
        7 December 2023 at 9:05 am
        
        You said it was the donors ,['one who merely donated money'] That wasnt correct its was the accounts of the protest movement which your links confirm
        
        Your false hoods are apparent again
        
        'that literally a clerk at a Kwik-E-Mart who sold a propane canister to a protester could have his accounts frozen'
        ‘could’ is a fantasy word, just like your made up claim about a senior detective conversation.
        Your marbles were scrambled long ago so receptive this make believe world online
        Sure the Ottawa government played hardball, but then so did the truckers protest …boo hoo
        
        gsays …
        
        7 December 2023 at 12:47 pm
        
        Meanwhile back in reality…
        
        I asserted some donors had their accounts frozen, this is verified by the article in Newsweek.
        
        You pop up with yr grammer free revisionist history take with smears and falsehoods.
        
        When yr latest outburst is more ad hominem than argument it demonstrates you don't have a leg to stand on.
  - Foreign waka 2.1.2
    
    5 December 2023 at 6:13 pm
    
    This country is being divided, not by the current parties elected but by those who want to topple a democratic selected government. This is shameful really, the government was not even sworn in and the hounding and disrespect for the country, the constitution (if there is one) and the law of the land is breath taking. Totally uncalled for, not abiding by the standard of the house is just beyond belief. Hugely disappointed, not even sure what there is left to say.
    - observer 2.1.2.1
      
      5 December 2023 at 8:08 pm
      
      At the 2020 election a party received a majority of the votes, for the only time under MMP. They then formed a government.
      
      Because of the election result, all criticism of their policies immediately ceased.
      
      Right?
    - Populuxe1 2.1.2.2
      
      6 December 2023 at 9:39 am
      
      What nonsense. You're the one being anti-democratic for denying the right to protest.
Incognito 3

5 December 2023 at 9:32 am

Whining Willis is setting the scene for her attempted cover-up of her inevitable failure to make her numbers add up. National’s so-called tax package was already ripe for the recycle bin before the coalition agreements and it only got worse after that thanks to the likes of retrospective changes to tax deductibility for landlords by the tune of $900 million or so, for example.

https://newsroom.co.nz/2023/11/28/now-sworn-in-new-govt-turns-attention-to-tax-package/

The thing with ‘laser focus’ is that people tend to follow the dot on the screen of the laser pointer and miss everything else. If that fails, produce a few loud bangs and bounce a few dead cats on the table through the likes of Chris Bishop.

PS Watch Winston Peters go quiet when a mini-scandal such as leaked Cabinet papers hits & hurts the NACTs.
Ad 4

5 December 2023 at 9:36 am

She'll win the week looking shocked, but wait for mini budget.
- Incognito 4.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 9:41 am
  
  She should have an ice cream and watch a movie, as we can all afford that now, can’t we?
  - Ad 4.1.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 2:41 pm
    
    She's going to deliver a tax break of some kind by March 2024 or make National look total idiots.
    - Incognito 4.1.1.1
      
      5 December 2023 at 3:05 pm
      
      You can be more specific on what they promised and agreed on in the Coalition Agreements, which is “tax relief of up to up to $100 per fortnight for an average income household” “coming into force from 1 July 2024.” Note that this is outside the 100-day plan that was confirmed about a week ago and which doesn’t mention anything about these tax cuts at all.
      
      They are likely to deliver on their promises, by and large (but watch the rhetoric), but the other side of the ledger will look much worse than they said during the election campaign and they’re shiftily trying to shift the blame on the previous Government, as expected.
      - Foreign waka 4.1.1.1.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 6:22 pm
        
        Well, I disagree with that. Mr. Robertson certainly is not a great finance buff, so much is certain. And it is very likely – I stretch very – that figures have been creatively explained.
        
        The government forecast a budget deficit of NZ$11.4 billion ($6.7 billion) for the year ending June 30, 2024, much larger than a deficit of NZ$7.6 billion estimated in May. – 11 Sept 2023
        
        Does anybody really belief that you can print money like there is no tomorrow without consequence?
        
        Incognito 4.1.1.1.1.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 8:08 pm
        
        Your seemingly ‘firm’ opinion is on shaky ground if you’re not even sure of what was explained in Budget 2023 that was released on 18 May of this year with the assistance of a team in Treasury.
        
        You can read all about it here:
        
        https://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/budgets
        
        If you have trouble with it, as Nicola Willis does, then use ChatGPT to help you out, you might even finish reading it before Willis does.
        
        Did you get those impressive numbers from Chris Bishop by any chance and did you double-check them? Willis seems to be still stuck on the Executive Summary and Media Statements released in May. The poor woman needs help, obviously. Where are those financial wizzes Joyce and Goldsmith when you need them??
        
        There may indeed be a few who think that money can be printed justifiably under certain circumstances. However, this Government will let the razor gang lose and apply selective austerity to give taxpayers’ money to a small section of their voter base, and an even smaller section of the NZ population, and most likely borrow to make up for the shortfall aka the widening and deepening hole that they opened up, yet again. Some international agencies have already warned about the inflationary risks of this Government’s policies. So, perhaps Willis and Bishop need to explain it ‘creatively’ to them …
        
        theotherpat …
        
        6 December 2023 at 11:02 am
        
        John …
        
        12 December 2023 at 5:46 pm
        
        Seek help.
        
        [My 100-day plan is to not be bothered by you again. Bye – Incognito]
        
        Incognito …
        
        12 December 2023 at 7:01 pm
        
        Mod note
Nick 5

5 December 2023 at 9:51 am

Just the latest chapter in NZ's sad history since the collapse of organised class struggle. The capitalist class know NZ is ripe for the picking and there is realistically not going to be any effective resistance to selling off what's left and push wages back into the dirt both directly and by over supplying the labour market. They will cash in the future to bolster profit today, for a glimpse of the future take a look at any third world country in the grips of IMF etc debt.
- Populuxe1 5.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 11:30 am
  
  Pretty sure we crossed that particular Rubicon under David Lange
Patricia Bremner 6

5 December 2023 at 9:56 am

They always intended to take from the very marginal and give to landlords.

Nicola is 'preparing the path'.

They sang "Overspend", so often, and she is not finding the "fat" in the documents, so now the tune is "Fiscal cliffs." to explain why cuts are necessary.

When hundreds are made unemployed, they claim on tax rather than pay it, that alters the books.

Life is becoming hard for Nicola, and Ministers will come with demands, wanting to curry favour with her Boss, who will continue with both banalities and dismissive statements, and his "Make NZ Great again". attitude, saying he is "governing for all" while overseeing destruction of agreements and systems.

Nitpickers unite.
- Rolling-on-Gravel 6.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 11:48 am
  
  Agreed, Patricia.
  
  This will be where ACT & NZF & NAT will be able to enact its true colours.
  
  They will use this to enact their true policies.
  
  Scrapping the smoke-free legislation is just the start.
  
  This will be how they'll get through their policies of electronic monitoring of beneficiaries and selected doctors for medical certificates and etc.
  
  This will pave the way for their version of austerity.
  
  It is a political choice.
  
  We should be prepared to protest.
  - Foreign waka 6.1.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 6:24 pm
    
    I think they should prescribe vapes – some have 5x the amount of nicotine of a single cigarette.
Adrian 7

5 December 2023 at 10:29 am

She doesn’t have a boss Patricia she thinks she is the boss because after all she holds the purse strings.
- Anne 7.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 10:50 am
  
  Both Luxon and Willis are perfect examples of Dunning Kruger in practice.
  
  You can fool some of the people some of the time etc… but there will come a time when most people will have seen through both of them. The question is: how long will it take – one term or two terms?
  - Chris 7.1.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 11:23 am
    
    I'm guessing less than one. Willis is one of the most vacuous MPs in her party. Luxon's up there too. So much so even the most unthinking of NZ's racist majority will begin to see through them. The most apt question I think is which will come first: Willis attempting to roll Luxon? -or Peters wrecking the coalition to deny Seymour's day in the sun in 18 months time?
    - Populuxe1 7.1.1.1
      
      5 December 2023 at 11:43 am
      
      I think you're misreading toeing the line as vacuity. While it might not be saying much, she's smarter, or at least more cunning, than the likes of Luxon and Bishop, and she'll be seething about not getting the deputy PM job.
      - Kat 7.1.1.1.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 12:17 pm
        
        "She" is definitely vacuous….cunning requires some ability to achieve things in a clever way………nothing that's clever so far…….and you can tell when she is covering things up by the tacky use of corporate executive jargon……..such as 'fiscal cliffs'…….
        
        Populuxe1 7.1.1.1.1.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 4:13 pm
        
        It's not like she's declared any other preferred pronouns, love.
      - Anne 7.1.1.1.2
        
        5 December 2023 at 12:23 pm
        
        Yes. she's smart in a cunning sort of way. So is Luxon.
        
        I don't count their kind of 'smartness' as indicating high intellectual ability or sound cognitive ability. Been associated with numerous Luxons and Willis's over the years to well know the difference.
        
        A good example of a former PM with all the abilities in abundance was Helen Clark and she is the one imo that history is going to highlight above all the others and not just in NZ.
        
        Rolling-on-Gravel 7.1.1.1.2.1
        
        5 December 2023 at 1:37 pm
        
        Best PM in my lifetime… so far.
        
        Chris 7.1.1.1.2.2
        
        5 December 2023 at 2:13 pm
        
        I get physically ill watching clips of Helen Clark speak. Her refusal to restore benefit rates after Ruth Richardson's mamouth cuts in 1991 despite promises to the contrary, followed by an insistence on continuing with the previous government's anti-beneficiary agenda, and then the Foreshore and Seabed Act are what did it for me.
        
        There's much to be said for the old adage 'you can judge a government by the way it treats its vulnerable', and Clark treated Aotearoa's most vulnerable like shit.
        
        Rolling-on-Gravel …
        
        5 December 2023 at 2:31 pm
        
        That's why I said "…so far."
        
        I wish there was somebody who could dump all that neoliberalism and Helen Clark was the best of the neoliberals.
        
        Even Helen Clark wasn't enough.
        
        Jacinda came close but for some reason she decided to keep the two-tier welfare system during COVID-19.
        
        I'm still waiting for that moment where somebody like Michael Joseph Savage or someone whose government is even better to come along in the 21st century.
        
        I've never ever actually experienced anything like that yet.
        
        Kat …
        
        5 December 2023 at 3:40 pm
        
        The first govt that puts people first, fair wages that workers can live on, makes home ownership take precedence over the speculation in housing, re establishes a 21st century ministry of works and other strategic govt depts that were thrown out in the flawed ideology that govt shouldn't be involved in the business of building and managing strategic infrastructure, then we may see a govt akin to the values of Michael Joseph Savage.
        
        Rolling-on-Gravel …
        
        5 December 2023 at 4:38 pm
        
        I would vote for that if it is truly viable and not shouted down like with so many people like Bernie Sanders and Jeremy Corbyn.
        
        It also has to take a perspective that includes disabled people, Maori people, gay people and poor people into account along with an ecological consciousness.
        
        That's the government that I want for the future.
        
        Anne …
        
        6 December 2023 at 9:56 am
        
        I felt less afraid during the Clark & Ardern years than under the Key years because at least I didn't feel as if they were watching over my shoulder to see what I'm doing, even if I had issues with them.
        
        Hell yes, but it goes back further than John Key. For instance the "commie" accusation was still a thing in the 80s and 90s, Anyone who was an active member of the Labour Party came under scrutiny, especially if you were a public servant.
        
        After the election of the Lange government I was bullied and harassed and it was eventually taken beyond the work place. It got hellishly nasty and in those days there was nowhere to go for help. The PSA was ineffective due to the bully-boy tactics of Muldoon and there was no employment tribunal.
        
        In fact the Muldoon days are an excellent example of what is in store for this country if this bunch of thugs are given carte blanche to do what they like.
        
        Belladonna …
        
        5 December 2023 at 4:38 pm
        
        Given the international trends towards more right-wing governments – it seems unlikely that you will see your nirvana any time in the near future.
        
        Descendant Of Smith …
        
        5 December 2023 at 4:48 pm
        
        Won't that depend on how quickly the predominantly European baby boomers die off.
        
        I still argue that much of the economic decline is due to them stopping spending as they retire. Big difference between two incomes, no mortgage and no kids to being on super.
        
        Some can continue working but not all by any stretch – and why should they anyway. Haven't the capitalists made enough money off their weary bodies?
        
        First baby boomers will be turning 78 this year – those that make it.
        
        bwaghorn …
        
        5 December 2023 at 6:59 pm
        
        I don't know the coalition of cancer is looking wobbly as fuck , Chippies had a road to Damascus moment after his loss , could get interesting.
        
        Anne …
        
        5 December 2023 at 7:34 pm
        
        @ RoG
        Helen Clark was no neoliberal fan. I knew her well once. She was old school Labour in the sense she despised the 'born to rule' mentality of National and the conservative nature of their policies.
        
        By the time she became PM in 1990 the neoliberal mechanisms were firmly in place, not just in NZ but amongst those countries we traded with and were allied with. To turn the country around was going to be a laborious task which could only be achieved slowly. Had she tried to rush the exercise she would have frightened the younger horses in particular who had known nothing else but market-place ideology.
        
        She worked at it assiduously and there is every chance that one more term between 2008 and 2012 would have seen a new acceptance of a partial return – at the least – of the previous social contract ushered in by Michael Savage. It would not have looked exactly the same, but much better than what we have ended up with.
        
        It didn't eventuate and we reverted back to full neoliberalism under John Key which we know from experience is the source of the inequalities that exist in today's society.
        
        Anne …
        
        5 December 2023 at 8:01 pm
        
        My apols. Clark became PM in Nov. 1999.
        
        Rolling-on-Gravel …
        
        5 December 2023 at 8:16 pm
        
        Thanks, I did feel some sense of sadness when I saw her defeated by Key and I wish she could have held on just for one more term. Same for Chris Hipkins & Jacinda Ardern.
        
        Even though they were all effectively working under neoliberalism, I'll have to say, I felt less afraid during the Clark & Ardern years than under the Key years because at least I didn't feel as if they were watching over my shoulder to see what I'm doing, even if I had issues with them.
        
        I wish I could see what it's like to live outside these constraints. It would be going towards either disaster or surprising because it might turn out to be a different sort of good. Different but good.
        
        As Oscar Wilde said:
        
        "A map of the world that does not include Utopia is not worth even glancing at, for it leaves out the one country at which Humanity is always landing. And when Humanity lands there, it looks out, and, seeing a better country, sets sail. Progress is the realisation of Utopias.”
        
        ― Oscar Wilde, The Soul of Man Under Socialism
        
        To revise Mr. Wilde a bit, I'd say it's good to dream then go back to reality and strive towards what you've dreamed of, even if you don't completely get what you want.
        
        So, yeah, I want to do better than before. We need to.
    - Foreign waka 7.1.1.2
      
      5 December 2023 at 6:30 pm
      
      "even the most unthinking of NZ's racist majority" – is this a racist statement or can you verify what this means please. Thank you.
SPC 8

5 December 2023 at 10:45 am

The budget news merely shows the governments net debt is up because of market changes in some asset values – but otherwise revenues are up on forecast and spending slightly down.

It's only beyond her control because of the coalition agreement is not good for the economy.
James Simpson 9

5 December 2023 at 10:51 am

Net Debt is $8b higher than forecast at the PREFU.

Unfortunately this is exactly what National needs to justify what they are about to unleash.
- Rolling-on-Gravel 9.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 11:54 am
  
  Exactly why I genuinely despise "debt" and "save money" talk from conservatives and right-wingers. They never say what it actually means, that they don't think the rest of us should try to build a new future nor that we should have a better sort of life. It just means they want to cut services for us the "hoi polloi" and let us go in favour of what they consider as the social "betters" that they so covetously want to be amongst while looking down on other people despite being among them.
  
  Tough luck. For such slavishness, this sort of thing won't be well rewarded.
- SPC 9.2
  
  5 December 2023 at 12:16 pm
  
  It just means a market change in asset values
  
  The NZSF (Cullen Fund) ACC etc will have a had a fall in total value – money moving to bonds from stocks with higher interest rates.
  - James Simpson 9.2.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 12:41 pm
    
    Try explaining that to 99% of the population
    - bwaghorn 9.2.1.1
      
      5 December 2023 at 7:03 pm
      
      Gee if only we had a finance minister that was honest and went on the news explaining things ,rather than a dishonest #$%^ that is going to use it as excuse to unleash the worst kinda shit that only right-wing governments can
- Nic the NZer 9.3
  
  5 December 2023 at 2:28 pm
  
  A whole $8billion? That seems quite a big number for the forecast to be out by? What is the typical margin of error on budget figures anyway? Is it give or take half or several billion to be a good guess?
- Ghostwhowalks 9.4
  
  5 December 2023 at 4:29 pm
  
  NETT debt is a fiction.
  
  The governments borrowing are GROSS debt. Thats the amount to be paid back and which interest is paid on.
  
  The various government bodies , ACC, EQC, NZSF that hold huge massive financial assets are a different category- they rise and fall with the markets and their assets are ring fenced from the Finance Ministers fingers
  
  NZSF $67 bill
  
  ACC $47 bill
  
  EQC around $250-300 mill ( severely depleted from earthquakes and floods in last decade. But they also have Reinsurance for maybe $10 bill which requires an annual premium and government guarantee also a premium paid
Chris 10

5 December 2023 at 12:12 pm

"So Willis has used the tried and true method used by desperate politicians and that is to make baseless allegations against Labour to try and create confusion. Either that or she has no idea of what she is talking about."

The two aren't mutally exclusive, as Willis has so aptly demonstrated.
UncookedSelachimorpha 11

5 December 2023 at 12:17 pm

With NAct I always think of Oscar Wilde "…someone who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing"

…but it seems they don't know the price either!
- Patricia Bremner 11.1
  
  6 December 2023 at 2:07 am
  
  Yes, value. If it does not have a price it does not have value. Must turn a buck in Willis World. Fiscal Cliff means a money pothole. One she isn't sure she can fill.
John 12

5 December 2023 at 1:19 pm

We all know the books are in bad shape?
- observer 12.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 1:33 pm
  
  AAA credit rating. That's a non-partisan assessment for you, from the international agencies.
  
  What's yours?
  - Chris 12.1.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 2:28 pm
    
    I just hope Robertson's getting cut-through with his responses to Willis' incompetence. Telling her to "read the budget" mightn't quite cut it. The stupid and racist among us are likely to not understand.
    - newsense 12.1.1.1
      
      6 December 2023 at 1:17 am
      
      Don’t worry the unbiased press are all over it. Letting them get away with lies.
      
      Luke Malpass officially a cock. What a dickhead. When Mike Hosking shared his man love for Key, at least his idol had earned it to some degree.
      
      ‘Left wails’ the headline when it’s clearly a Maori protest.
      
      Reports Luxon ‘I don’t even know.’ Brandishing his incompetence.
      
      https://www.thepost.co.nz/politics/350124535/left-wails-while-government-dismantles
      
      Quick back to solving today’s problems with the solutions of the 90s or the 1890s…
Reality 13

5 December 2023 at 1:57 pm

Nicola Willis (she with the rasping voice) is one of the most smug and nauseatingly self-satisfied politicians ever!
- Adrian 13.1
  
  5 December 2023 at 3:20 pm
  
  You’re right Reality, a few weeks ago a few ex-school mates of hers used almost the same words about her at school. Can’t remember where I saw it.
  - Descendant Of Smith 13.1.1
    
    5 December 2023 at 4:52 pm
    
    Friend of mine who was at university with her said she was the most horrible person on campus. Couldn't believe at the time she saw her first campaigning that she was going into politics.
Georgecom 14

5 December 2023 at 5:08 pm

Rock Solid on her costings before the election Whilst almost everyone else was calling the costings fanciful or BS. A classic case of make up some BS to get elected and then worry later how to pay for it. Nicola now finds herself having to pay for it and has to make up some more BS to cover her earlier BS.
JeffB 15

6 December 2023 at 5:35 am

I wish someone would conduct a poll. It is fun watching my hard right friends skirm as they are faced with the undeniable and indefensible incompetence and deceitfulness of this government. Some of my bellwether friends have already said they won’t vote National again,
- Chris 15.1
  
  6 December 2023 at 10:03 am
  
  Yes, this will be the undoing of them, when their own start to revolt. It's simply not credible that what this government feels determined to destroy won't be opposed by those from within. Luxon has misread everything. The nature and consequences of what he's doing will override any sense of loyalty to the party. This is one of several reasons why he's toast already.
Mike the Lefty 16

6 December 2023 at 12:20 pm

Didn't someone whisper to Luxon and Willis that running a country's economy is a bit different from playing a game of Monopoly?
John 17

11 December 2023 at 11:47 am

Being second to last to Equatorial Guinea says it all about Labour’s fiscal management.
John 18

12 December 2023 at 3:04 pm

More shocking revelations daily of Labour’s dereliction of duty,in their management of the economy.