Labour’s plan vs National’s plan

43 comments on “Labour’s plan vs National’s plan ”

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1. fisiani 1

   28 January 2015 at 1:49 pm

   i know there is a tendency here to distill concepts into a sound bite but how about some honesty.
   Here is the actual National policy which is far more exciting and a real boon to those in need of affordable housing.

   Over the next three years, the National-led Government will:

   Increase the overall number of social housing places – where tenants receive an income-related rent subsidy from the Government – by 3,000 to 65,000.
   In Auckland, as part of this increase, an initial 300 income-rent related subsidies will shortly be offered to community housing providers.
   Ensure Housing New Zealand has enough capital to build new social houses and develop its existing properties.
   Continue to work hard to reduce the number of people waiting for social housing and reduce pressure on emergency housing. A $500,000 cash injection will be available for emergency housing, alongside a wider review of funding. The Government will also create an Auckland emergency housing database.
   Increase the supply of affordable housing for people to buy, particularly in Auckland.
   Help transition social housing tenants to independence, as appropriate. We will aim to undertake 3,000 more tenancy reviews this year and next year, focusing on market renters or near-market renters, to help free up places for others with greater needs.
   Commission a strategic review of Housing New Zealand to help ensure Housing New Zealand properties are in the right places and of the right size and configuration to meet existing and future demand.
   Encourage and develop a more diverse ownership of social housing, involving approved community housing providers, but only if we can get better services for tenants and communities, and fair and reasonable value for taxpayers.
   Look to sell between 1,000 and 2,000 Housing New Zealand properties over the coming year for use as social housing run by approved community housing providers. Housing New Zealand will continue to be by far the largest owner of social housing, with the Government committed to maintaining at least 60,000 properties in Housing New Zealand’s portfolio by 2017.
   • Atiawa 1.1

     28 January 2015 at 1:57 pm

     And your point?
   • tracey 1.2

     28 January 2015 at 2:09 pm

     The herald online this morning put the (then) soon to be heard Key speech into ten points.

     Interestingly they use this stat, presumably because Key does?

     “There are almost 5000 people on a social housing waiting list (as at the end of December). That’s down from just over 11,000 in 2002, but the true level of unmet housing need is estimated to be in the region of 43,000-55,000.”

     The use of 2002 as a point of reference piques my interest… Isn’t the number on the waiting list from the end of 2008 to december most relevant?

     In 2008 the then Labour Minister stated there were

     “as at 29 February 2008 the number of applicants on the waiting list was 9,875. This figure includes 2,435 applicants already living in Housing New Zealand houses who are seeking a transfer.”

     In a 2013 Briefing for the Minister HNZ noted the following

     “As New Zealand’s largest landlord, Housing New Zealand owns or leases nearly 70,000 rental properties, housing over 200,000 people. This portfolio is worth $15.1 billion and is the Government’s second largest asset. There are also 2,100 families – about 6,000 people – on the waiting list with a serious need for a state house.”

     It appears that when National entered parliament in late 2008 there were about 7440 people in serious need of a state house. At the end of 2013 this had dropped to 6000.

     in April 2014

     “The figures show that in March 5,204 priority applicants were on the waiting list. In January this year the number was 4,197.”

     By December 2014 they were

     4964

     Hard to see how their policy

     “Continue to work hard to reduce the number of people waiting for social housing and reduce pressure on emergency housing. A $500,000 cash injection will be available for emergency housing, alongside a wider review of funding. The Government will also create an Auckland emergency housing database.”

     is working quickly enough…
     Why not use the real figures, they seem to still show a decline ?
   • framu 1.3

     28 January 2015 at 2:14 pm

     “Increase the overall number of social housing places ”
     -how?

     “Ensure Housing New Zealand has enough capital to build new social houses and develop its existing properties”
     -how?

     “Increase the supply of affordable housing for people to buy, particularly in Auckland.”
     -how?

     “Help transition social housing tenants to independence,”
     -how?

     actual cause and effect, evidence based explanations please – actually show how the policy will achieve its stated result.

     heres your big chance fisi – can you do what even JK cannot?
     • Sacha 1.3.1

       28 January 2015 at 2:21 pm

       “transition social housing tenants to independence” = kick them out
     • Tracey 1.3.2

       28 January 2015 at 3:51 pm

       in 6 years they have dropped the waiting list by about 2500. that is about 400 people a year. assuming they havent been re categorised.
       • Murray Rawshark 1.3.2.1

         29 January 2015 at 2:22 am

         I know people who left the list because they couldn’t see a house getting any closer. I’d guess that HNZ also finds spurious reasons to boot people off.
   • Draco T Bastard 1.4

     28 January 2015 at 2:19 pm

     i know there is a tendency here to distill concepts into a sound bite but how about some honesty.

     No, that would be National and their pet RWNJs. See National’s bullet point policy announcements compared with the detailed policies of Labour, Greens and other left parties.
2. The Harpoon 2

   28 January 2015 at 2:18 pm

   Sounds like an assett sale but then again John did say there would be NO MORE ASSETT SALES after Genesis (49%) went on the block so I guess it must be a …. ????

   Re: Little’s speech – more than happy with what I heard. Setting the tone which I think will start to resonate more and more with struggling Kiwis over the course of time. Most are now aware that Key is slippery bastard at the best of times and his snide remarks will only carry him so far from here on in. People eventually grow tired of infantile remarks and indeed even of so-called popular leaders.

   Congratulations to Little on a good speech. Labour now have a plan. The Nats on the other hand seem content to further the spoils of the already wealthy while leaving the rest of NZ behind. Bollocks to that!

   As I told English – the only thing the Nats have managed to create is a dog eat dog society. Eventually the little dogs are gonna get sick of being bullied and will start fighting back. Let this be that moment.

   2017
   • Tracey 2.1

     28 January 2015 at 4:02 pm

     do you mean like the middle class kiwis here?

     http://i.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/65493861/Fire-destroys-home-just-hours-after-alarm-check
3. greywarshark 3

   28 January 2015 at 2:38 pm

   This is a song for you NUACT. Slip sliding away.
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_H-LY4Jb2M

   God only knows
   God makes his plan
   The information’s unavailable
   To the mortal man
   We’re working our jobs
   Collect our pay
   Believe we’re gliding down the highway
   When in fact we’re slip slidin’ away

   Slip slidin’ away
   Slip slidin’ away
   You know the nearer your destination
   The more you’re slip slidin’ away
   edited
4. TheBlackKitten 4

   28 January 2015 at 3:22 pm

   Actually both plans are what is needed for NZ.
   State housing is an old tired concept of the 1930’s that has been taken advantage off for far too long and changes are long overdue.
   For too long state houses have been taken advantage of by those that could and should have moved out years ago to allow someone else a chance of the helping hand that was the intention of state housing. Instead, we have situations of families/people that have sat in them for 45+ years denying other working families a chance of the same state housing benefit that they have selfishly & shamelessly hogged up for far longer than necessary.
   It is their greed that has led to the policies that National are announcing today and these policies will please middle NZ (for reasons listed above) & will overshadow Mr Little’s speech which is a shame as I thought Mr Little made some good points that have been over looked for too long.
   National’s policy is actually quite cunning. Shift the responsibility to another organisation that is in the ‘helping the poor radar’ but has nothing to do with government. So therefore, when these organisations give those state house lifers a short shift kick up the butt (and rightfully so) then there will be no public backlash on the government.
   If Labour want to compete for Mr & Mrs Middleclasses vote then they better hurry up and accept that Mr & Mrs Middleclass support welfare as a helping hand up and not a life choice. Headings such as this article are certainly not an indicator of accepting that & neither is Mr Twyford’s comments in this mornings Herald relating to this subject!
   • One Anonymous Bloke 4.1

     28 January 2015 at 3:29 pm

     You don’t speak for Mr. or Mrs. anybody.

     I note you blame people for their own misfortunes. That makes you trash. Who cares what trash thinks?
     • Tracey 4.1.1

       28 January 2015 at 3:37 pm

       interestingly some say gfc was worst economic crisis since the depression. it took a labour govt some 6 years after that event to begin a programme to house people and create jobs. if it is second worst crisis it makes sense genuine homeless would increase… poverty would increase. kitten is asserting the opposite so am interested in his/her sources.
       • One Anonymous Bloke 4.1.1.1

         28 January 2015 at 3:43 pm

         I know the source.
         • Tracey 4.1.1.1.1

           28 January 2015 at 3:47 pm

           nothing so credible, surely?
   • Tracey 4.2

     28 January 2015 at 3:34 pm

     could you provide some sources for your claims about everything in your third paragraph?
     • framu 4.2.1

       28 January 2015 at 3:37 pm

       i would like sources for all of it – i see a whole load of slagging people off via unfounded and unprovable generalisations
       • One Anonymous Bloke 4.2.1.1

         28 January 2015 at 3:39 pm

         Garbage in, garbage out.
       • Tracey 4.2.1.2

         28 January 2015 at 3:40 pm

         yes all those quadraplegics, cerebral palsy sufferers, mental health and spina bifida afflicted wanting warm dry affordable homes. wasters!
     • One Anonymous Bloke 4.2.2

       28 January 2015 at 3:39 pm

       He has a friend who bought a dog from a guy once, and the dog owner’s Dad knew some people who were getting ten thousand dollars a week on the dole and had four state houses each.
       • Tracey 4.2.2.1

         28 January 2015 at 3:42 pm

         hehehe….

         i am sure kitten also wants company law completely over hauled cos some directors take the piss and fly fast and loose.
       • Murray Rawshark 4.2.2.2

         29 January 2015 at 2:31 am

         You forgot that they were Mowries, OAB. That level of benefit isn’t available to oppressed pakeha like myself and Alan Titford.
   • Pete George 4.3

     28 January 2015 at 6:17 pm

     @TheBlackKitten “Actually both plans are what is needed for NZ.”

     I agree, there’s merits in both.

     It would be good if Little would cautiously endorse the need to revamp and improve State and social housing. Maybe even contribute some ideas for better housing.

     And it would be good if Key would take on Little’s goal of the lowest unemployment level.
     • mickysavage 4.3.1

       28 January 2015 at 6:28 pm

       It is in Labour’s DNA to improve state and social housing. They oppose Key’s announcements because, putting to one side the appalling lack of detail, they will not do one thing to improve the situation. Changing the ownership of some existing houses will not create one new home.
     • One Anonymous Bloke 4.3.2

       28 January 2015 at 6:35 pm

       Hey Wormtongue! Key took on responsibility for the unemployment rate and the policies to tackle it, when he became Prime Minister.

       Little and Labour already made the commitment. What a lovely shiny failed lie you parroted.

       Your excuses for the former, and smears of the latter, would be disgusting if they weren’t so unoriginal and transparently dishonest.
     • weka 4.3.3

       28 January 2015 at 6:40 pm

       “It would be good if Little would cautiously endorse the need to revamp and improve State and social housing. Maybe even contribute some ideas for better housing.”

       What, like Labour’s housing policy?

       http://campaign.labour.org.nz/ending_the_kiwi_housing_crisis
   • Murray Rawshark 4.4

     29 January 2015 at 2:28 am

     The greed of state house tenants? Not the greed of speculators, real estate agents, and landlords? What about Mr and Mrs Middleclass who think they deserve to make $100k or more a year by living in a house. As OAB says, you are trash.
5. tricledrown 5

   28 January 2015 at 4:40 pm

   Nationals Vision is to get the state out of welfare by stealth and hand it over to filthy rich landlords who will monopolize and price gouge!
   corpirate Welfare for the big Aussie banks and national’s wealthy landlord funders!
   • English Breakfast 5.1

     28 January 2015 at 5:29 pm

     I’m not sure Community Housing Providers can be described as “filthy rich landlords”. I’ve never understood the obsession with the state owning houses for low income provision, when state subsidies to non-Govt providers has the potential to spread the same money further.
     • DoublePlusGood 5.1.1

       28 January 2015 at 5:56 pm

       How on earth can subsidising a private company spread the money further than the government using its vast resources to provide public housing? When you consider that the government would be wasting money on a private company making a profit, your argument clearly makes no sense.
6. Chrys Berryman 6

   28 January 2015 at 5:56 pm

   I work for an NGO that will probably put their hand up for State houses sold dirt cheap…..this organisation is hell bent on “appearing corporate” and spends heaps of its Gov dosh on leasing Euro cars for the managers,and on creating lots of new non hands-on positions that have no effect on the lives of the very people the service was set up for in the first place ….hands on staff deal with all sorts of difficult issues and are paid a pittance…….the outsider audits that happen are basically a quick once over to make sure the paperwork is up to date……auditors have been told about problems h/o staff face every day ,but these are ignored………the sell off of State Houses to other NGOs like my one will mean a lot more corruption without any real public scrutiny….sounds like a National policy plank
7. Observer (Tokoroa) 7

   28 January 2015 at 7:00 pm

   Hello to The Black Kitten

   What a lovely creature you are – even your endless preening and licking comes through in what you write pussy Cat!

   There you are hoping to tip inferior creatures out of house and home, while you soak milk and cream and canned delicacies down your mean throat. Your shit like your vomit, is putrid. Always has been.

   Let me tell you Pussycat, the Middle Class pay taxes (unlike the upper classes) and they will be paying more tax than ever to pay the renting expenses of the inferior classes. Especially when Mr Key has given the existing valuable housing stock to his friends.

   You see, cats who think they are the bees knees, don’t understand that wages are exceedingly low for the inferior people and even if there is work for them, it does not go anywhere near enough to cover housing.

   Scratch away at that PussyCat.
8. fisiani 8

   28 January 2015 at 7:54 pm

   So the general impression is that Little blew his chance to shine and was trumped by John Key. Actually helping people get a home seems practical and sensible as opposed to the empty platitudes written for the union puppet Andy. Glad to hear however that he is going to retain the 90 day right to prove yourself law which is popular with small business.
   • Chch_Chiquita 8.1

     28 January 2015 at 8:10 pm

     Has the housing crisis been solved already? Wow, that was fast. Only a couple of hours. Man, that John Key must be candidate for the next Harry Potter book.
     When people WILL actually get a home and the waiting list will shrink dramatically, then, and only then you will be able to claim that Little have been trumped by Key. Until then, it’s nothing but another spin to cover the truth about the dire situation we are in and the dreadful one we are heading towards.
   • Murray Rawshark 8.2

     29 January 2015 at 2:37 am

     Actually helping speculators get an 8th, 9th and 10th home..FIFY
9. adam 9

   29 January 2015 at 1:38 am

   I have to say I’m impressed by National. Saying they are helping the poor, whilst lining the pockets of their mates. Impressive. Kiwi Crony Capitalism – never missing a chance to give a back hand to business. Always hiding behind a nice smile, and that just right level of pathos. Were would we be without our political masters? Free? Or is that to bloody frightening?
10. Jenny Kirk 10

    29 January 2015 at 7:42 am

    Well, well, well. Look at today’s Herald editorial ! It’s being positive about Little’s state of the nation speech, and says Key missed an opportunity. Is there a bit of a turnaround happening here ??

    Here’s the link :
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11393284
    • Ffloyd 10.1

      29 January 2015 at 10:00 am

      Had to laugh at P.Rick Gower last night. He did an analysis ? on A.L and key’s speeches. Apparently Little’s had no detail as to how he was going to implement his plans for NZ but key supposedly had it all laid out so we all knew exactly how his sell down of State houses was going to happen, who to, and the benefits to the people he was going to displace Yada,yada,yada. SO, HE SCORED A.L. a six, and key a seven, and triumphantly announced KEY WINS!!!
      Gower is a twit of the first order. Just give Johnny liar an extra point and tarra! he is a winner. Because Gower say’s so……. GGMS.
11. The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 11

    29 January 2015 at 8:01 am

    “More jobs and higher wages” is a plan?
    • adam 11.1

      29 January 2015 at 12:04 pm

      “Borrowing money and sell of the family farm.” is a plan?
      • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 11.1.1

        30 January 2015 at 10:56 am

        No. It is a sentence that makes no sense.
12. Robert Glennie 12

    30 January 2015 at 11:36 am

    One solution would be to allow only the nationals of countries where we can buy housing to be able to buy into the New Zealand market. Seems fair to me. If we can’t buy in their country, why should they be able to buy in ours?

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