What a combination bank notes, screens, stainless steel, glass, plastic and cooler temperatures. It is not hard to see how community transmission is spread without coughing, sneezing or talking occurring.
Mask wearing, distancing, hand washing, testing, contact tracing and isolation, were this not to occur the number of infections would be far greater. The second wave in the Northern Hemisphere is looking far worse than the first wave.
Victoria and NSW have given up on eliminating and the quote is that they are going to try to control but understand that it will keep 'bobbing along'. The point is made that there are many borders, it is a big land mass, more than NZ. And, hopefully, they have not run down their medical systems as we have.
They are making plenty of money from us, which leads to our skewed economy, hopefully they are putting their bank and supermarket profits into useful infrastructure and services over there.
Just to remind ourselves of the various control methods for Covid 19 from our NZESR:
Aug 3, 2020 — Despite its mutations, the virus shows little variability, and this is good news for … virus causing the COVID–19 pandemic, SARS-CoV-2, presents at least six strains. … The original one is the L strain, that appeared in Wuhan in December 2019. … 14, 2020 — In a new paper, experts comment on the future of …
In an audit of New Zealand's genome sequencing programme, EPA chief science advisor Michael Bunce recommended the Government prioritise genomic surveillance of the virus to monitor potentially dangerous mutations.
"Aotearoa New Zealand needs to embrace genomic tools and analyses for long-term monitoring of viral evolution. This is not simply an academic exercise, rather there is a pressing need to monitor the viral lineages that are circulating (akin to seasonal influenza tracking)," he wrote.
But the slow rate of mutation – just 24 a year on average – should remain a solace both to researchers working on vaccines and the rest of us, who hope to one day take one.
I see that vaccines such as the BCG are being looked at. Modifying the BCG has as much chance as something undiscovered. A proven vaccine is the best possible outcome to manage Covid – 19.
Sounds good. Hope it works. Talk I previously heard is that we may end up with a yearly vaccine tailored to the most outrageous of the nasty dots wanting to get at us. Similar to the present flu vaccine but additional to.
Scanning the Herald this morning, just noted they are charging for an article that was published in The Independent (UK) yesterday….on a Murdoch leaving his father’s (Rupert) company.
But in his briskly analytical way, over lunch and a subsequent phone call, he tried to explain why he "pulled the rip cord," as he put it, after deepening estrangement with his father and brother and growing discomfort over the toxicity of Fox News and other conservative News Corp properties.
"I reached the conclusion that you can venerate a contest of ideas, if you will, and we all do and that's important," he told me. "But it shouldn't be in a way that hides agendas. A contest of ideas shouldn't be used to legitimise disinformation. And I think it's often taken advantage of. And I think at great news organisations, the mission really should be to introduce fact to disperse doubt — not to sow doubt to obscure fact, if you will.
I was wondering how Rupert could look himself in the face. Let alone his recent missus. It must be clear to him now it's got down to a war on democratic processes. And the affront to his journalistic instincts of Trumpism.
Richard Harman on his Politik website is suggesting that Collins has had to rejig her campaign diary in this final week. She’s now not going to Tauranga (a visit that somehow Simon Bridges wasn’t even aware of) and instead will head to Hamilton where, according to Harman , the two National held seats are now at risk.
POLITIK understands that Collins and the party hierarchy believe they have identified the MP who leaked the email. The MP cannot be named for legal reasons, but they are in the top 20 of the caucus and to put it on the record, it is neither Lee nor Simon Bridges.
Collins has apparently confronted the MP, and three separate sources have told POLITIK that her approach was greeted with what one described as a tirade.
‘However, the aim to expand the use of biometrics for multiple uses by Crown agencies is clear in documents obtained under the Official Information Act from Internal Affairs, the police and others.’
"The business outcome… is to deliver a fit-for-purpose and supported Facial Recognition Solution that will increase productivity, reduce cost and extend the capability across and beyond" the Service Delivery and Operations branch, said a privacy assessment of the DXC system by Internal Affairs.
Police tender documents show they sought out a system that could be used in the future to import drivers' licence and passport photos, and masses more facial images than currently, though police deny they will use their Dataworks Plus-NEC system for that.
"the company has been criticised in the UK for being less than transparent about how these all-important algorithms 'learn' who to raise the alarm about."
When it comes to identifying a person for a specific reason proper facial recognition is required. It is the use of the information gathered which needs to be administered according to legislation which is clear and understood.
Would you have an issue with police using a body webcam on a normal shift?
Nothing is required! There is a big difference between some local camera on a local cop recording a personal local interaction and scanning everyone that passes a particular place or uses a particular service.
There is no reason for surveillance of the public going about their lawful business and any law and order stuff is just rubbish. How many people would be scanned to pick up the one person in years doing some thing they shouldn't that couldn't be identified in any other way.
Labour need to get on top of this pronto. The chilling sight of China selling the system they use on the Uighers to Iran should stop anyone in their tracks
Somehow we managed to identify people adequately before facial recognition. Once it's in it will be very hard to get it out. Plus extending to private firms -who thought that was a good idea.
I'm still a no -any safeguards would be gone by lunchtime with a right wing government.
The other problem is a camera with bad lighting using technology that routinely has difficulty correctly identifying people of colour in ideal conditions has a high likelihood of not just rounding up the usual suspects, but forcing the suspects to prove their innocence because "computer says you were there".
And a proprietary algorithm that the defence can't interrogate or examine? Not only would they have to prove the computer wrong to discount that piece of "evidence", disagreeing with it would make them look like liars and therefore lower the weight of the other evidence they present. You know, stuff like true alibis.
I am with you on this RBCV, however I feel we will be in the minority.
We have access to a bach near Taupo, on a street running to the lake with a river on one side.
A mix of locals and bach owners concerned with crime have put a digital CCTV camera up. Thru a FB page they have lobbied folk to gauge enthusiasm for $ to maintain the device.
Overwhelmingly in favour is how would describe the response. I have asked a couple of questions e.g., who 'owns' the data, how they intend to deal with privacy issues should they arise. Not got an answer yet….
I was a little surprised at the enthusiasm, but I live rurally and a dog is about the extent of our security. We don't lock doors and about half the windows.
"5.Street surveillance The concept of a “public place” is changing subtly but very significantly with the increasing use of surveillance systems. "
Also ….I have personal experience of Employer Surveillance…I pushed back HARD. Union, Community Law etc, There was theft. Turns out it the end (long trail ) it was a "manager". But WE all got surveillance. Camera in smoko room !! And its still there. Fark ..pissed off.
4.2.1 Absolutely !! And an FYI for anyone… When the whole 5 Eyes spy BS was started. Fark I debated and pushed back many times AGAINST John Key and the nats trying to have surveillance on ALL of us.
Now Labour is going there?
And re the Police, SIS etc? They already have more than enough Laws and Tech to do their jobs. Have done for Years.
Leaving aside the total bullshit around National’s lies about the Green’s Wealth Tax, it’s the target audience that’s probably the most interesting aspect.
The party has been forced, in the last week, to roll out some pretty crude scare tactics to try and regather one of its usually most constant voting cohorts, wealthy, mortgage free retired kiwis.
The wealthy mortgage free retired Kiwis are the new Act Party voters.
Seymour is going to be the big winner next Saturday when it comes to a comparison on how much a leader has grown their party. His end of life bill will probably pass, as it is not harmful to others apart from immediate family starting the grieving process earlier than they would have.
This one is going to accelerate changes already in train. The Americans are no longer going to provide the default security guarantee and global trade structure; we are going to rapidly see a number of powers attempt to occupy the vacuum created. It will be messy.
It was going to be about a decade off, now it's next year or so.
Is it going to be a replication of the triumphalist superpower in full spectrum domination , or perhaps something more mature and multi polar, where we accept flux and negotiation.Who knows, the art of true diplomacy may come to the fore
It's going to be a bumpy ride the next little while though
Greywarshark could also read 'Nature's Mutiny' by Blom. About the little ice age from about 1580 to 1670 and the profound effect it had on society.
In the early years they burned a few witches to appease an angry God when crops failed. When that didn't seem to work the people turned to other solutions. By the end of the century of low temperatures a embryonic capitalistic system was embedded in Europe.
A very readable and insightful book.
Climate change is going to have profound effects on life.
global temperatures dropped approximately 1°C around the year 1400. By the 1500s, the temperature drop had reached 2°C, resulting in extreme weather events. England’s historically temperate Thames River froze over five times between 1400 and 1550, and between 1551 and 1700 it was covered in thick ice 12 times.
Harvests failed during this period, and for a social world largely centered on grain production, this was a disaster. Peasants starved and could no longer pay their masters. Various “messiahs, seers, occultists, witches, magicians, and charlatans” proffered explanations of nature’s nervous breakdown, and a frenzy of finger-pointing led to rampant torture and burning of scapegoats.
Blom suggests that the crisis in agriculture led to a vast reorganization of land use and land ownership, which changed social structures and power relationships. Farms and estates that once operated in a self-enclosed system began to produce more efficiently and to look to long-distance trade. To facilitate the new system of production and far-flung markets, regulatory bodies were established, and roads were built. European powers looking outward identified whole continents full of natural resources that they enthusiastically plundered, ushering in the age of colonialism.
There are monastry wine makers records that show that the cold from about 1590 was preceded by a very warm period when it was possible for picknickers to walk across the Rhine at Frankfurt even by ladies in the volumnous dresses of the day and only get their feet a little wet, according to Hugh Johnson in The Story of Wine and this year The Little Ice Age by Prof Brian Fagan of University of California Santa Barbara. Both excellent reads esp Fagans on how climate has shaped our history.
Of immediate concern to those in western Europe is the state of health of the Gulf Stream. Once, about 13,000 years ago, a vast frozen lake in north America melted and, in a remarkably short period of time (in geological terms), dumped its freshwater contents into the Sea of Labrador. The Gulf Stream, which is only a small part of the planet-girdling "conveyor belt" of ocean currents, came to a halt. An icy chill hit Europe, and drought settled on the Middle East. This incident, known as the Younger Dryas, was a mere blip in the Earth's gradual recovery from the Ice Age, but it lasted for 1,000 years.
At present, the icecap on Greenland is leaking cold meltwater into the north Atlantic at the same rate as the Nile empties into the Mediterranean. This alone should concentrate the minds of the politicians, economists and farmers. Halting the Gulf Stream might be Earth's compensatory way of restoring an icecap to the North Pole, but in the process it will be farewell to everything and everybody north of Morocco.
It's sort of an attack on democracy really – people who are supposed to be able to form modern joined-up thoughts and put their reasoned thinking into choosing a capable leader with wide knowledge and the wisdom to apply it for the good of everyone. I don't feel encouraged about getting a good outcome from the brainwork of citizens revelling in this sort of graffiti. And witches are so passe' aren't they. Aren't they?
Well, we need a war govt to deal with climate change, so that is socialism. Though National is slipping away from recognition of climate change to engineer more immediate rewards for themselves.
Be interesting to see if Ardern heads to Auckland Central in this last week? Winning is still an uphill battle for Swarbrick but she’s clearly in another league from White and Mellow.
" Winning is still an uphill battle for Swarbrick but she’s clearly in another league from White and Mellow "
Yes from what i have seen of White and Mellow ( sounds like an accounting firm ) Swarbrick would be a marvellous asset for the good people of Auckland Central.
Yesterday I received an unsolicited and personalised email from Judith Collins. Its content, which is fear mongering at its worst, is attempting to link Labour policy to the Green's Wealth Tax proposal. Jacinda Ardern has stated quite categorically that this is not true and so scurrilous misinformation.
It is obviously aimed at gold card holders and a number of my acquaintances, who share my indignation, have also received it.
The serious question is, how did the National Party obtain those email addresses. If they came from a Grey Power data base or even a Gold Card data base then this must be a breach of privacy which should be investigated. Do others share my concern.
Ask the sender of this email how they obtained you email address. You could also get assurance from your grey power chairperson that they've not given it to any marketing outfit.
But how they would get your email address from a gold card database. Is there such a thing?
Grey Power need looking into telling members to vote no on the cannabis reeferendum without consulting members when 70% of elderly people are for a yes vote.
“Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern says she will reconsider a decision to deny a grieving British family entry to New Zealand.
Ardern said this morning that she stood by a decision not to let yachts in the Pacific dock here during the Covid-19 pandemic.
She said she did not want a scenario in which people could not fly into New Zealand but could sail in.”
The blue water yachts sailing the world oceans have annually migrated and brought business to New Zealand when they sailed away from the tropical areas of the Pacific to avoid being there in the hurricane season. To sail from Tahiti to NZ, as this family will have to do , will take about 20 days so they will not arrive Covid stricken.
I bet the super yacht owners and all their friends will be “facilitated” to come to NZ in time for the Americas Cup Races – but will the lovers and friends ( those that do not have “partner” status) of New Zealanders currently held at bay overseas , be invited in first. What wins MONEY of Kiwi happiness ? Right now I am ashamed to be a New Zealander.
But surely the blue water yachts have had the sense to lay up at this time. Surely they can't have thought they could drift through the carnage unaffected, munching their lotuses?
RL, frankly the opinionated tosh coming from people who appear to have a poor grasp of pandemic epidemiology and what's at stake globally has been… an eye-opener. On 2 October, you wrote (in separate comments):
The daily number of new COVID infections continues to outstrip recovered cases, so the number of active COVID cases globally continues to rise. On 2 October, when you boldly and repeatedly opined "It's over", the number of active cases was apparently 7.72 million; currently there are 8.31 million infected patients.
Officially, COVID-19 has infected less than 0.5% of humans , so it seems unlikely that "it's over", even allowing for vitamin D supplementation and whatever other 'magic bullet' / 'snake oil' straws one might want to clutch at. Apologies for doing "this one to death" (an unfortunate choice of words), but your opinion on this particular aspect of the COVID-19 pandemic are misleading and dangerous to public health, IMHO.
Edit: Reading those two quotes again, you appear to be implying that those critiquing your opinions might want COVID-19-related illness and death to continue – pretty offensive.
Take your complaint to WHO. They've come out this week against continued lockdowns as the only tool against Covid.
We now have an array of smarter, less blunt, tools to help manage this disease. And in the week since I made those quotes above, it looks like a lot of qualified medical people are thinking along similar lines.
RL, my "complaint" is that you are promulgating the idea that the COVID-19 pandemic is over. Don't lean too hard on the WHO for support; how do you imagine that organisation, or indeed “a lot of qualified medical people” would respond to your assertion that "It's over"?
“We now have an array of smarter, less blunt, tools to help manage” diabetic conditions, but diabetes isn’t over.
You can delude yourself as much as you want, but please don’t mislead others.
It's over from a strategic perspective. Its no longer an unknown, uncontrolled threat. Which means we can start thinking about what comes next.
I’ve made this distinction clear enough already, but obviously it suits you to pretend otherwise.
Diabetes kills between 1 – 2m people each year, and we manage it without resort to extraordinary measures that have huge costs to the whole of society. Covid is going to eventually become something similar.
All comparisons are flawed. But it was DMK who made it in the first place.
But let's see, we could probably stop diabetes in its tracks if govts exerted a complete totalitarian control over diet and exercise. Comfortable with that?
Doing it for a month or so would have minimal effect on diabetes. It would also require carefully tailored programmes for each individual, lest heart attack rates and other comorbidities skyrocket.
L4 for a month or so saved thousands of NZers' lives, and means we can go to sports games without it being a "super-spreader" event.
In short, your comparison could well make the diabetes problem worse, while the "totalitarian" action actually imposed has led to greater freedoms than many other nations currently have.
You could have written 'It's not [anywhere near] over, yet', but that wouldn't have suited your argument/position, so you chose to deceive and wrote "It's over" – twice. And now your writing that:
"It's over from a strategic perspective. Its no longer an unknown, uncontrolled threat."
I personally believe it’s simply more “opinionated tosh” to assert that COVID-19 is "no longer an uncontrolled threat". Recorded daily global deaths have been between 4,000 and 6,000 since 28 April, and currently at 5,285 (7-day moving average) – ffs, think for a moment if the families and friends of the thousands of people who will die tomorrow due to COVID-19 infections view it as 'over' – that’s a morally repugnant view IMHO.
Your point of view remains a mystery to me, moreso because you previously stated that:
"We still have some way to go to properly understand the epidemiology of this virus."
I get that you want the COVID-19 pandemic to be over. I certainly wish it was over. But no amount of wanting and wishing by us will make a blind bit of difference. The COVID-19 pandemic is what it is, and it's NOT over, "from a strategic perspective" or otherwise. You're position on this issue is simply not credible or rational, and I can only conclude that irrationality is at the root of your apparent need to dig yourself ever deeper.
The remarkable thing about the global daily death rate is how stable it is now. This is not a pandemic spiralling out of control. It represents less than 4% of all deaths, despite the case rate continuing to climb.
Also check the data we do have for the excess death rate. This paints another picture again
a regular 10-20% increase in some nations weekly mortality is "almost back to normal"?
Only because the peaks before substantial numbers of people did what the governments were too cowardly or corrupt to require. So now we have places like the US, where huge numbers of people are in lockdown (voluntary or locally-mandated) for months while others hug each other at maskless political events, just to keep it ticking over.
I, for one, don't want to risk an "almost normal" 20% increase in mortality in NZ.
It's a "remarkable thing" that we can have such different opinions about what a stable global COVID-19 death rate of 5,000 (give or take) per day means for the pandemic. Your evolving position:
"…but it's over"
"…but from an epidemiology perspective… it's over"
"It's over from a strategic perspective."
is an intriguing one, but I'm not convinced your selected words accurately reflect the current stage of the pandemic.
Hopefully the COVID-19 case and fatality rates will begin to edge down within a few months, and your "it's over" will eventually match pandemic reality – maybe when (or if) a moderately effective vaccine is widely available. But if the COVID-19 trajectories of some other OECD countries are anything to go by, then letting our guard down is just asking for trouble.
fatality rates will begin to edge down within a few months
And a quick glimpse of the data clearly shows that despite a rising number of cases globally, the number of deaths is stable. This absolutely means the Case Fatality Rate must be declining and has been for months … good news.
But if the COVID-19 trajectories of some other OECD countries are anything to go by, then letting our guard down is just asking for trouble.
Nonetheless the shape of these curves is broadly similar, a bump and then a decline back to nearly normal or below. Even Sweden where they never put their guard up much in the first place.
Someone might just look at them all and conclude that from the perspective of why we did the lockdowns and travel bans back in March … it's effectively over. Globally it's not exponentially spiralling out of control, and we now have an array of tools to manage this disease in the usual way. Lockdowns should no longer be the primary tool that govts reach to.
Possibly more “controversial” for NZ than for the nine OECD countries with rates of COVID-19 deaths per million at least 100 times ours. Might relaxing NZ’s border controls now be likened to gradually decreasing the concentration of fluoride in drinking water?
It's hardly surprising that a global pandemic would increase inequality and so hardship, but is the optimal solution really to allow the virus to spread until herd immunity (still rather contentious for COVID – remember your perceptive comment regarding our incomplete understanding of COVID epidemiology) is established? This would appear to be advocating that the total number of COVID-19 cases globally should be allowed to increase to a point were there are roughly 100 times the number of people infected – this would presumably (somehow) occur in a controlled fashion. Still, I can't help wondering if there might be some other way to alleviate poverty – some other way. After all, there really is more than enough wealth to go around.
Don't know about Aussie, but found these links.
'Fatally flawed': AMA fires back at letter
"However, despite the good intentions of the medial experts’ letter, the Australian Medical Association (AMA) has fired back, saying the letter is “fatally flawed’ and lifting restrictions too soon would only allow the virus to spread uncontrollably.
“Well, what we really say is do it all,” she responded. “We say don’t just do one thing. Don’t just rely on your border closure or your mass quarantine, do absolutely everything you can because where we are seeing a failure or we are seeing a rise in cases people have focused just one thing and this is again where lockdowns can be problematic.
“When people come out of lockdowns they think, ‘OK, it is over, we don’t have to do all of the other things any more’ and in fact it is all the other things that really work.”
He then asked her whether Australia should open its borders to the rest of the world.
“What we are seeing that really works is strong quarantine and strong monitoring at borders,” she said. “So if you are looking at, really following everybody who comes in, really putting them in quarantine, really putting them in quarantine, really making sure that happens, then we are certainly seeing that is what prevents transmission.”
In order to get some clarification, Karl asked whether this means we should open the borders but still enforce a two-week quarantine once people arrive.
Seems to relaxing border controls for NZ now would be akin to not finishing a course of antibiotics.
Yes. I get that, we saved lives at the front end, but now we're faced with another kind of challenge at the back end. It seems to me NZ is betting the farm on an effective vaccine.
At present NZ is nowhere near 'herd immunity', at whatever level you choose to put that number, effectively COVID has never really happened in NZ, which is forcing us into a posture of extreme vulnerability all the while waiting on a vaccine to rescue us. Is this really a sustainable strategy?
As I've said repeatedly, back in March when faced with many unknowns lockdowns were absolutely the right thing to do. But in six months the ground has shifted.
"As I've said repeatedly, back in March when faced with many unknowns lockdowns were absolutely the right thing to do. But in six months the ground has shifted."
With over a million dead, and at least as many seriously debilitated, the ground has indeed shifted – we now know that COVID-19 is a dangerous virus. I'll behave accordingly until a reliable treatment and/or vaccine is available – it's an easy personal choice to make here.
As NZ progressed down the COVID alert levels for the first time, we went to a popular local resaurant to celebrate level 3 –> 2. It was a little too popular, and wasn't observing the mandated health safety rules. Haven't been back – fortunately there are plenty of safety-conscious eateries to choose from.
"At present NZ is nowhere near 'herd immunity'", and as you point out we don't even know if as few as 50% of the population (or even less) would need to be infected to achieve effective herd immunity (if herd immunity is even possible for this virus.) If ~50% turns out to be the level of exposure required for herd immunity, then we're already ~1% of the way down that road – yay.
I'm under no illusions that economic considerations will eventually dominate health concerns, but I'll get (well) behind any government, health service, organisation and individual applying the brakes and urging caution, and drag my heels every step of the way.
Stamp it out, keep it out – "We don't know how lucky we are…", and I'd rather that didn't become "We don't know how lucky we were…"
Nah, a completely idiotic and in the long term, impossible dream. It will fail.
There are only two ways out of this, a vaccine or herd immunity.
The article I linked to on herd immunity above is a reasonably well balanced read on this. It could be a number as high as 70% based on a simple analysis, or as low as 20% if you start introducing other considerations. Differing specialists are making various argument. But NZ has effectively taken this possibility off the table for the time being.
So a vaccine it is … what if we never get one? How many more lockdowns can we do?
And here is a WHO spokesperson speaking to the NZ situation; effectively saying the same thing as I am. Use all the tools at your disposal, but don’t rely on lockdowns as your primary tool:
"There are only two ways out of this, a vaccine or herd immunity." – RL @8:47 am
You’ve repeatedly stated "it's over", so why do we need a 'way out'? Is the COVID-19 pandemic over, and if not then why were you promulgating the idea that it was?
Herd immunity remains a dream until ~50% of NZers have been infected; maybe not even then. At the moment ~1,800 NZers have been infected, so one of your "ways out" consists of letting the number of people who have been infected with COVID-19 rise (gradually?) to ~2,500,000. No thanks – that's a BIG fail, IMHO.
I'm not holding out much hope for an effective vaccine either, but that's still a better bet than banking on at least 2,500,000 NZers being infected.
If you're planning on returning to NZ anytime soon then you'll have to do the 14-day managed isolation, just like everyone else.
This it what I ve written elsewhere. Note I am in the business myself.
"While I would be inclined to support the yachties, being one myself, and living in an area where many jobs depend on boating and visitors. However New Zealand has hundreds of thousands asking for exemptions. Including industries that make a lot more than services, to notoriously frugal, cruisers. Every group that is exempted increases the risk, even if by a small amount. At the moment we have totally free movement within NZ, no covid outside isolation, and most of our industries working, unlike the USA. A resurgence puts all that at risk, including the many people, most of NZ, whose jobs depend on keeping covid out. The Government has to draw a line in the sand with our border, somewhere. As the more people we have to quarantine the greater the chances of more outbreaks. It is a numbers game. The more we let in the more risk. I'm an essential worker that travels around NZ. Very pleased our Government has kept covid away from me so far. Unlike similar people in other countries. People I knew in the USA are dead! Those ignoring the rules are somewhat arrogant, to say the least. Just look at the US reaction to those disobeying border rules. Indefinite detention without trial."
By the way there are a huge number of commercial ships crews that have been stuck on board for 17 months or more now. With no shore leave. Including in New Zealand.
On many ships little or no contact with family.
Having accidents after months of 12 hour split shifts.
No one gives a stuff about them. accept to crucify them if something goes wrong.
And you expect me to be worried about a few yachties. Who can fly home and pay a New Zealand crew to sail their boat to Opua, if it is that desperate.
Already pressure from our "poverty stricken" farmers and growers to let their slave labour back in. Not to mention the education sector wanting to resume their student scam. If they all had their way, as National is dog whistling, we would be back to 10’s of thousand of arrivals per month, in private quarantine.
If anyone should be given priority to enter NZ, it should be shore leave and repatriation for the ships crews, that deliver our groceries and depart with our exports.
KJT @ 7.49 am Really good explanation of why we should be maintaining our tight line on the borders. Then the government can decide who to let in on what basis and how to handle them. Well said.
Several thousand New Zealand citizens and permanent residents are arriving by air each week.
Any New Zealand citizens and permanent residents on yachts in the South Pacific have been free to return at any time. But if they arrive with crew that aren't currently eligible to arrive here considering the pandemic situation, then those crew members won't find a welcome. And if the yacht they arrive on isn't NZ owned etc, then that's problematic too.
"several thousands per week"might be considered overstating it….
"There was a net gain of 5200 New Zealand citizens between April and August this year, which was partially offset by a net loss of 3500 non-New Zealand citizens, leaving a net gain of 1700 overall."
and arrivals were 5200 between april and august…hardly several thousands per week.
"Statistics NZ estimated that in the 12 months to August, there was net population gain of 71,500 people from migration, with 98% of that gain occurring over the seven months prior to border restrictions being introduced."
If they arrive by air and are NZ citizens of course they permitted entry. The difference is that those coming by boat that are not permitted entry are not NZ citizens. How difficult is that to understand?
In the normal course of events they would have been granted visitor visas. That's what they were relying on when they set out.
If you got on a plane to a country like Australia with automatic visa entry, and half way into your flight the authorities of that country cancelled all entry, arrested you when you landed, put you in prison, deported you and fined you a sum equal to the value of your home, I think you would see this as unreasonable.
That's a gross misrepresentation. They've been made aware they’re not welcome before boarding, not mid-flight.
Circumstances change during travel. It happens. When you became aware that you're not welcome at your next intended destination, you change plans and routes before you leave where you are currently.
Once you depart the Eastern Pacific, the only practical destination for most is going to be Aus/NZ.
When I was connected to the industry, there were plenty of boats doing all kinds of alternative routes that I was aware of. Sure, they weren't all cushy downwind slides, some of them were long and uncomfortable slogs upwind. But they were doable and were being done.
In the right boat with a strong crew yes. But most short handed cruisers would be exhausted in less than a week.
Sailing upwind is doable for short legs, but for 3 – 4 weeks or more, it's not an option for most. Throw in the constant ocean swell and performance is even worse. Most cruising boats are not set up to do it for long periods, and things start to break.
If they don't travel here, the visa remains valid until its expiry date, but they can't use the visa to travel to and enter NZ currently. If they travel here and are refused entry, then the visa is cancelled automatically under the Immigration Act.
Qualified medical people are missing their employer funded or tax write off overseas conferences and sabbaticals, overseas holidays, au pairs, school student exchanges and the opportunity to host overseas colleagues. This is a source of bias towards thinking along similar lines. An elderly obese diabetic person would think along different lines I suspect, and rightly so.
The family can fly out of Tahiti- and assumedly could leave their boat there as well or at worse hire a kiwi yacht broker to sail it here and sell it. It's worth $1m.
They may not arrive covid free in NZ if they sailed with one infected person and it was transmitted to others during the voyage.
As for cyclones -this is a fact free zone by the media. The cyclone season is Nov- April. The pacific nations closed borders at the end of March. Boats were assumedly some where safe for the last cyclone season and basically have been unable to move since.
FP has only very limited exposure to cyclones. There has been a lot of links on that.
Covid 19 has an incubation period of around 5 days but it can incubate up to 14 days. Symptoms develop at the end of the incubation period. Tbe contagious period begins 2-3 days before symptoms begin and lasts for up to 10 days, or longer if symptoms persist.
With a little bad luck, a sailor could contract covid the day they left, become infectious around day 10 and infect the rest of the crew, experience mild symptoms around day 13 and then recover. The other crew, who may experience no symptoms at all, will likely be contagious as they disembark on day 20.
The other point is that those timeframes are the most probable ones, there will be statistical outliers.
And even if we're talking a solo sailor taking three weeks for the voyage, what if they have it upon arrival or require urgent help from within our rescue area only a part way through their "isolation"? Everyone in the crew compartment would be a close contact, and the chopper is down a crew for the next fortnight. Mostly because the sailor wants to sell their boat for a better price than in the islands.
This scenario is the same basis on which family groups are already treated. Are you telling me that quarantine for 14 days is far too short? You should alert the appropriate medical authorities.
It is not the same because in managed quaratine the original case would be tested on day 3 and 12, and checked daily for symptoms.
In addition, medical authorities do acknowledge that there is a risk that undetected infections may pass through MIQ. This is why only NZ residents are permitted entry and random yachties aren't.
Sighs … yet no-one is proposing that these yachties just get off the boat untested. As a group they've worked to develop a quarantine protocol that makes sense for their situation. In effect they'd be doing two quarantines, one at sea and another when they get here. If that isn't enough for you I don't know what would be.
I struggle to imagine any other group arriving with a lower risk profile than these people, and they'd self isolate on arrival in the safest possible manner. At almost no cost to NZ.
This is why only NZ residents are permitted entry and random yachties aren’t.
This isn't the biggest political issue of the year, but it sure has uncovered just how smugly irrational and mean spirited kiwis have become over their covid situation.
They want to come to New Zealand because they think they can sell their yacht quicker and for more money here.
However, Genda said it is almost impossible to sell their yacht in French Polynesia.
Auckland yacht brokers 36 degrees had urged the family to make the "utmost effort" to bring September AM to New Zealand because there were prospective buyers here – but none that could fly to Tahiti to view their yacht.
Genda said the family would soon have to sail their yacht from Tahiti for over a week to the French Polynesian island of Marquesas to be safe during the summer cyclone season.
"We hope that we spend the cyclone season [in Marquesas] and hopefully next year New Zealand will open up and then we can eventually sail the boat there for a sale.
In order for this to be viable they need visas and funds to stay in FP for that period. Plus somewhere they'll be allowed to anchor long term. And nothing else to go wrong.
It was an option for those Greman chancers that apparently decided instead to do a bandit run and see how it turned out for them (badly, they shoulda stayed where they were).
It's an option for the family at issue right here right now.
So far there hasn't been any of them with a woe is me story for whom it hasn't been an option. I'm gonna need actual evidence to be persuaded it's not option. Vague unbacked assertions won't cut it.
If they are EU citizens (including the UK currently), they can stay and work in Tahiti without special visas. Not much use for the North American travellers obviously.
I don't really get it. Is there a reason they can't stay in that part of the Pacific until cyclone season is finished, and then sail back to Europe and sell the yacht there?
They started sailing in Jan, by the end of Feb it was clear we were heading into a pandemic. NZ borders have been closed since mid-march. I appreciate they are grieving, but what have they been doing all year? The complaint about the America's cup is a big rich, given they were pretty much intending to go on holiday for a year. They can put their daughter into school in the Pacific until they can move on.
The America's cup is part of that whole Auckland exceptionalism thing – they think there might be a few votes in it – but real sailors, not so much. No salt in this govt's blood.
The blue water yachts sailing the world oceans have annually migrated and brought business to New Zealand…
Sounds like the godwits. These birds have been traversing the globe from time immemorial. They have birdbrains and are most adept at doing what their instincts tell them.
Whereas humans have few instincts, but large brains and we do not seem to be adept at using them to capacity. Pity we are such a failing species that we are taking ourselves down, and the rest of the animal crew on the planet as well who had adapted and knew their limits.
No not like Godwits, every year a different fleet of yachts arrive in the Pacific and many drop down to NZ for cyclone season shelter and boat repairs near the end of the safe sailing season, which is now. Yachts generally sail westwards along what we call the barefoot route.It takes most yachties about 3 years to sail right around the world This family left England in January 2019 . No covid in sight then.
It was understandable for everything to be shut done in the panic when Covid hit NZ. By now things like “yachts” coming into New Zealand should be reconsidered.
Actually the only reason we cannot have more people coming into NZ is because of the limitation of quarantine facilities for air travellers. Anyone arriving on a yacht to any country of the world is not allowed to disembark until a health check of all people on board has been undertaken and they are signed off as OK by a health department doctor. In the current situation , if the people on board did not get a clearance because maybe the signing off doctor thought, despite the time it took to sail here, that the captain and crew may be infectious or may yet become infectious with Covid then everybody stays on board until that clearance is given.
So really NZ could be opened up for yachties to arrive because they will not be needing our quarantining facilities.If they need to quarantine they will stay on their boats.
New Zealand is turning away the good seasonal business that comes with the yachties for no really sensible reason.
With the current case there is a humanatarian aspect.
The only people allowed into NZ are NZ citizens/residents, people on humantiarian grounds, and people that Labour believe bring some kind of urgent economic benefit. The family on the yacht don't fit into any of those categories.
Except humanitarian, they are grief-stricken as their 13 year old son was killed by a yobbo in a small boat in Tahiti who crashed into their yacht and they wish to return home and bury him and give up the cruising dream. I can understand that completely. Bit unfair to say "Harden up ".
We have the author of his story about being held on Manus Island speaking in Nelson soon. If you have a yacht you are entitled to have superior arrangements obviously, to all the other suffering people in the world.
The only people allowed into NZ ….. …. limited to NZ citizens etc because of our limited border / quarantining facilities. The family on the yacht do not need to go into our border quarantine facilities – they can quarantine on board if thought necessary.
250 post-grad students who already had visas and didn't make it here before the borders closed in March.
New Zealand's door has been opened to overseas students again – but only for 250 postgraduate students who will have to pay for their own quarantine.
Education Minister Chris Hipkins says the students must have had a visa to study in New Zealand at masters or doctoral level but were unable to get into the country when the border closed in March.
It is nice of Judith to have a photo OP with the man they are replacing her with after the election. I wonder if they have been discussing her big golden parachute exit out of parliament?
It's an interesting question, the future of National.
Some might argue that they don't have one, at least not as they are.
The Luxon waiting in the wings doesn't seen to have any splendid new ideas, and there's no sign thus far of them going to the mattresses to sort out what they stand for that the public could conceivably swallow.
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To buttress his argument that "a 4% swing from Labour to National or ACT in the last two weeks" of the current election campaign is certainly achievable (and thus "there is a credible path to victory for National") ,David Farrar cites polling evidence from the final stages of the 2002 campaign, suggesting the "Govt (ie Labour) dropped 5% from 46% to 41% in last two weeks".
What DPF doesn't mention is that in the same Colmar Brunton, the National Party Opposition suffered an even steeper plunge from 27% down 6 points to 21% over those same final 2 weeks.
In other words, far from the gap closing .. Labour's lead over the Nats during those final few weeks in 2002 opened up a little by 1.4 points. There was no "5% swing" from Govt to Oppo.
Still I never like the thought of tightrope walking. I would like to have seen planned electorate party voting by the Greens and Labour, in a keen left electorate, to be sure of one in Green hands. Pragmatic and legal, politics is the art of the possible etc.
Yes, strategic planning is unknown on the left still. The electorate is viewed as a market, so party providers are meant to promote their brands separately. Gambling on faith. Whereas the right get that democracy is a game, so to win you must figure out how best to game the system – not that they're much good at this in Aotearoa currently!
Politics as a sport. If we openly treated it as such, showing how people have allegiances with the brand and the team, we would understand why there is often little intellectual power put into the process and understand the outcome better.
Swordfish….but that doesn't mean it won't happen this time….and if the Greens get 4.9% Standardistas could wake up to Crusher as PM and ACT with 5 cabinet posts.
Based on current polls, the route to that happening would need 1% or 2% of the electorate shifting from Green to Labour, and a massive exodus of Labour voters to Nat.
Former Green voters aren't gonna go anywhere but to Labour (unless the nutter faction in Greens is waaay bigger than I thought and they go to Billy Te Kookiha). So if they do bail, then the 47%ish Labour are showing in the polls goes up closer to 50% vs a combined NACT vote around 40%.
To lift NACT above Labour, nearly 1 in 10 voters currently planning to vote Labour would need to swap to Nat. Disregarding the fact that over a quarter of the electorate has already voted.
In his excellent book Strategy and Soul, US activist and educator Daniel Hunter says, “Politicians are like a balloon tied to a rock. If we swat at them, they may sway to the left or the right. But, tied down, they can only go so far. Instead of batting at them, we should move the rock: people’s activated social values. When we move the rock, it automatically pulls all the politicians towards us — without having to pressure each one separately.”
In other words, where the people lead the politicians will follow. We, the people, just need to be clear, strategic and insistent about where we want to paddle this waka to. I think our social movements would benefit from working at the intersections of what is popular and progressive.
There are many kaupapa where voters are more ready for change than our politicians: government-funded dental care, higher taxes for the wealthy and climate action. With a coordinated and broad-based approach, social movements could make significant gains on all three of these.
Every campaign we win pulls the rock to a more progressive position which makes more change possible in the future. We build hope and belief by winning. We grow our power by nurturing diverse social movements, building the capacity of people to create change and shifting hearts and minds through storytelling and organising.
So this is a community-building praxis, in which like-minded communities operate as social organisms. They appeared in our media during the latter half of the 1960s. I went on a HART demo in 1970 after several years of resolutely refusing to be a joiner, and remember how alien it felt – being part of a group of strangers.
In the pandemic era infection teaches us there's danger in such groups. Praxis of how to drive group process to make progress happen has to become more sophisticated in response. Non-local communities are now how humans exercise social agency.
To be fair Labour does it too. I was part of numerous phone campaigns in past years. Asking people to get out and vote was the opening gambit then you took it from there – depending on the recipient's response.
I gave up doing it because too many people were rude and just hung up. Looking back I don't blame them.
Michele A'Court describes the sheeple styling of wimping out, then gets proactive:
When people talk about how they're going to vote in the upcoming cannabis referendum, it is usual practice – even for those in favour of legalising the Devil's Lettuce – to clearly state they don't touch the stuff themselves, actually officer… In a nod to that tradition, I will say these things: cannabis is not my drug of choice but I was at university in the 1980s and I've worked in the entertainment industry for over 30 years.
I'm voting yes in the referendum in small part because I'd like to ditch my current drug of choice – alcohol – and replace it with a nice, soothing, legal cup of cannabis tea.
As a balm, cannabis strikes me as a distinctly feminine drug. Despite the popular image of cannabis users being a bunch of blokes getting blazed on the strongest strain of weed they can cultivate, there is a whole other world of Mary Jane proponents whose names are more likely to be Mary or Jane.
There is a network, for example, of Green Fairies in Aotearoa – mostly women who grow and supply the herb to assist with anxiety, provide pain relief, and offer a natural pick-me-up or calm-me-down.
Before it became illegal here in 1927, the story goes that Mother Suzanne Aubert (currently in line for sainthood) included the plant in her remedies and sold it to help fund her community work.
It is an entirely human thing to seek out substances that change our mood – every culture finds a leaf or berry, vegetable or fruit that they can tootle about with to come up with vodka, pinot, coffee or cocaine. [Which] shifts us from our factory settings to either a more or a less elevated state.
Those Green Fairies sound like great ladies. For all the female elderly arthritic ladies and gents mustn't forget them, and those who have anxiety and stress in their lives young or old bring it on. Being a reformed non drinker for health reasons a calming balm of the devil's lettuce sounds a pretty good thing to me. Kicking back at the end of the day – when I miss my drink the most – would be wonderful. I am good at growing vegies etc in the garden and have successfully grown the most amazing specimen of the devil's lettuce once upon a time, it was wondrous to behold, I am looking forward to cultivating a couple of the plants in the corner of my garden when this reform becomes law.
Bless these Green Fairies for they are the salt of the earth.
Why is there not an option for medicinal cannabis?
My weeping gut cannot take meds for arthritic pain in several places and when the pain gets so debilitating I would like the option of smoking away the pain.
When it comes to being stoned when driving I am wavering being a yes vote for legalising cannabis. Screening for being stoned is not up to the mark. The strength and 14 grams is an issue for me as well. Most other reasons to legalise can be worked around. The end of life choice is a yes.
I am a bit stumped for the first time in voting for 40 years on giving Labour my electorate vote. I might just do a party vote this time around.
Like you I have erosive gastritis and arthritis. The gut wont take anti-inflammatories so I just take fish oil and glucosomine and its amazing how pain tolerant one can become. I have had foot surgery and a knee replacement but I still do get out and walk and keep fit. I think there will be some leeway with driving. Its not like the elderly will be stoned witless every day. As for the euthanasia bill its a big no for me. Just can't get my head around it. Like taxes, laws are just waiting to be changed, altered, got around, loopholed you name it. So its a big nono for me. However this will be an interesting election I must say.
The strength they are suggesting is at the lower end of the scale.
14 gram max limit is so people don't have to visit the shop as often. Unlike say a box of beers, people won't consume 14g in a day/sitting. It would be near on impossible for one person to smoke that much weed in a day.
Medical cannabis under the current system is unaffordable for many, the majority of those who use it for such get it on the black market at present. Being able to grow ones own medicine changes everything when it comes to affordability. Personally am looking forward to the prospect of being able to grow a plant organically to use as ingredient in a salve for arthritis, should everything work out.
The best thing about voting yes is that we get to have a say on how the law is constructed via committees etc etc.
To date, probably the best piece I've seen this election, that examines both sides of the story was Paddy Gowers last week. Here's the link
Mum disclosed she voted yes for cannabis the other day, she's a conservative person in her late 70's, originally she was going to vote no. Same with the old man, almost fell over when he said he voted yes, he's always been fiercely anti weed.
Hope that is of help and all the best making your decision. How lucky are we that we get to have choices, yay for referendums 🙂
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Barely acknowledged, if at all by commentators … the last Reid Research Poll found a whopping 21% of 2017 –Nats– planning to swing to –Labour–.
Not surprising, of course, given the significant re-alignment suggested by all the post-COVID Lockdown polls … but it's worth pointing out just how massive this is … means around 242k Nats have moved to Labour (putting aside questions of turnout).
By comparison, at the last two Turnover Elections (ie where a change of Govt occurred), only around 94k Labour voters swung to the Nats in 2008, while about 105k Nats moved to Labour in 2017.
The closest we've come to something on this scale (assuming it eventuates) was in 2002 when 112k Nats swung to Labour (representing a little over 17% of 1999 Nat voters).
Give them something to vote for and they will come eh!. Go on cleaving through the Slough of Despond and we can see off some of the crippling rentiers and con corporates and private equity outfits with our own versions. Use the attackers own weapons, hoist them on their own petards.
People generally don't like the low blows that Collins eminates like a spoilt child who doesn't get her whey will mean she will be put out to pasture ,being a negative ninny like whinny means he is dog tucker.
Swordfish…do you have any data on how many 18-25's are enrolled this election compared with the last?
Also, I'm guessing the percentage of enrolled 18-25's that will turn up and vote is likely to be higher due to the cannabis issue. The Green's will benefit from this.
Mind you, 2020 stats are, of course, pre-election … 2017 were post-election (over 94,000 (of all ages) enrolled over the final 3 days before 2017 election day). So if similar last minute surge then final 2020 tally for 18-24 yo may well exceed 2017.
Let's imagine the Greens come out of this election strong enough that they can ram through a wealth tax. What does everybody think will then happen in 2023, and the fate of the wealth tax after the next change in government?
Firstly, I don’t think the Greens will be in a position to ram through anything. In any case, this will have to be dealt with during the post-election talks between parties.
Secondly, it is not in their nature [pardon the pun] to try a ram through anything.
Insisting on a conversation is not equal to ‘ramming through’, IMHO.
Ok then, let's assume the polite and respectful conversation they insist on having results in a wealth tax being implemented over the many statements so far from Labour that it ain't gonna happen.
What does everybody think will then happen in 2023, and the fate of the wealth tax after the next change in government?
What would need to happen for that is Labour looking tired, out of ideas, and authoritarian, and Greens to still be stuffed full of social activists and woo-meisters with very few actual grounded greens. Kinda like 2008, only worse.
But of the people in my circles that are currently going Labour or Greens, I'd tend more to be one of the later ones to switch. Most of the others will flip somewhat more easily.
Perhaps you will keep on watching what happens in the USA Andre and advise us on what to do so we turn the opposite way. Or perhaps you will go back and give them the benefit of your excellent analytical skills that you have honed here.
Ok then, let's assume the polite and respectful conversation they insist on having results in a wealth tax being implemented over the many statements so far from Labour that it ain't gonna happen.
Ah, so you want to do a thought experiment? Seems a bit abstract to me.
As said above, the Greens are unlikely to try and ram anything through, politely or otherwise. What Shaw is saying is that they will bring the wealth tax to the table during negotiations. I assume this includes the GMI and the ACC reforms and so on, they're not wanting a tax for tax' sake. And I take the positioning this week to be about not letting Labour treat them like some rag tags who will do as they are told. Which is a good thing, to stand up to that.
Personally I think Lab should just give them the welfare portfolio. Sepuloni obviously isn't managing it well, and Labour can let the Greens do the heavy lifting on it for a while. The Greens aren't going to get all their policy enacted off the vote this year, but it's completely reasonable to bring the whole policy to the table and say this is our starting point, these things are very important, and remember it's the members who decide if we form govt with you or let you come to us on each piece of legislation for the next three years while we are on the cross benches.
If that comes about and the other areas brought to the fore are actual green topics, then I'd consider that a win. But it would be a win somewhat tempered by the apparent shortage at the top of the Greens list of actual green talent and substance to take advantage of it.
you still seem to be under the mistaken impression that the Green Party is only meant to be about the environment, as if that is somehow separate from human social and economic wellbeing.
But green politics has always been about the intersections of environmental and social justice.
Getting NZers out of poverty is a climate priority. Does that really need explaining?
meanwhile the Greens, after change not power, are yet again pulling NZ in the right direction. They've been doing that on climate and other environmental issues for decades and I don't see that has changed much, it's just that the policies are integrated more I guess. But shifting the debate on welfare is huge.
Well spoken Weka-there is too much tribal Labour and Jacinda worship being used to justify voting for Labour, rather than debate about the policies.
In particular the Wealth Tax is a good idea but clearly would benefit by being modified/fine-tuned, perhaps so that it only targets the top 4% rather than 6% as now, so that it can gain more widespread support.
For me to support it, the Green Party needs to balance a strong green focus with those other aspects. Right now, that balance isn't there because the green side of things is very weak and way under-represented. I'm not interested in a radical social activism party that's trying to pretend to be something else by holding a Green tissue paper in front of themselves.
The Green Party can make their philosophy and politics about whatever they want it to be. But if they don't have an actual strong green focus, they shouldn't expect to attract votes from those whose actual interest is green issues just by calling themselves Green.
And no, moving people up out of poverty doesn't automatically improve the climate or environment. In fact, to first order, by itself it might even make climate and environment issues worse, because those people will likely consume more. Making environmental and climate improvements needs actual work and priority on those topics, not self-delusion that social activism somehow also magically creates climate and environmental improvement.
But if they're interested in why their vote share falls short of their hopes and dreams and previous highs, my view is there for the consideration. And I know there's other sometime Green voters with similar views. I couldn't say how common they are outside my circles tho, we could just be weirdos. Or not.
"But if they're interested in why their vote share falls short of their hopes and dreams and previous highs, my view is there for the consideration."
This seems reasonable and I would assume they are looking at why previous green voters are still voting Labour after 2017. But I think the reasons are complex. I doubt it's primarily the wealth tax, which would affect so few NZers. I think it's more likely to be a combination of the Ardern effect, along with a smaller party having been successful in pulling the larger party closer to its own platform and no longer standing out.
Lots of people won't see a huge amount of difference between Lab and Green and will vote on feels (they like JA). Those that look at policy more in depth will shy away from the welfare stuff, not because of the woke thing so much as most liberals in NZ are centre left and happy with neoliberalism.
There is probably a hang over from 2017 of perception of competence (Shaw's Green School gaff won't have helped), along with lots of new faces that people don't know.
Then there is covid, and I have no doubt that there is both the effect of thinking Labour handled it well, and people being afraid and wanting stability and centrism rather than radical change.
Weird thing for me this week is seeing a number of actual lefties saying to vote GP when they've been slagging them off all year. Don't quite know how that is supposed to work, they want people to suddenly think the GP are a good bet?
don't know what you are on about Andre. Leaving aside the referends, there are 8 major policies currently on the campaign part of the website, and 5 of them are environment focused,
transport
oceans
farming
clean energy
the Green Vision for Aotearoa:
Healthy Nature.
Clean Economy.
Fairer Communities
Here are the three top priorities this year, that will feature in any post-election negotiations,
Action on climate change
Halting the biodiversity crisis
Income inequality
"And no, moving people up out of poverty doesn't automatically improve the climate or environment."
No-one actually said it would though, you just made that up.
"In fact, to first order, by itself it might even make climate and environment issues worse, because those people will likely consume more."
Which is why the Green Party has an integrated set of policies based on systems thinking, not reductionist, linear, solve this problem then that one thinking.
"Making environmental and climate improvements needs actual work and priority on those topics, not self-delusion that social activism somehow also magically creates climate and environmental improvement"
Fuck sake, get a grip and go read some actual policy as well as what they've been doing for the past three years.
I have some problems with some of the GP positioning on things woke too. Their rigid stance on gender ID is very risky given what is happening in the UK were left wing women voters are basically now at war with the Labour Party. I just don't think that throwing the baby out with the bath water will help. On climate alone, there are compelling reasons to vote Green, not least is that Labour have no commitment to acting in time.
as for the party list, the point there is that everyone is on board with eco and social and economic. Everyone. So eg Ricardo Menendez will be supporting the enviro stuff while he works on his area of social justice, because he understands the connection between the two.
Vagueish short documents can always be interpreted and implemented in a wide variety of ways.
Manifesto policies that don't align with a pollies actual interests tend to get a token once-over to satisfy the notion that they're trying to implement the policy before finding their way to the too-hard basket.
But the stuff that gets that pollies juices going, that gets a lot of attention and effort whenever it can somehow get related to the manifesto.
Looking at the personnel at the top of the Greens list, I see very little actual green talent and substance, so I have little confidence serious green efforts will be made. But I see a lot of background and experience and enthusiasm for social activism I'm meh about, but I think it's very likely that's where the effort and enthusiasm will go.
As for the last three years, one of the very few individuals that had actual green talent and substance has retired and isn't standing this time around.
yet in the top five are the Minister for Climate, the Minister for Conservation and Associate Minister of Transport. Are they the ones not enthused about their portfolio?
But Weka, that would require Andre actually reading the Green's policies. He is obsessed with the Wealth Tax, in part because he will have to pay some extra tax because of it.
I'm not averse to a side of social justice with my greenery, but I'm not keen on a heaping helping of social activism and moral superiority with a tiny sprinkling of ineffectual green on top to hide it.
Clearly a Nat/Lab voter, ole Kate. Does a chair speak for the org or not? Depends which way the political wind is blowing. I suspect members have been blowing up a bit of a storm in the general direction of her…
Over the weekend, 453,426 votes were cast, according to the Electoral Commission. 253,616 were on Saturday and 199,810 on Sunday, taking the total number of early votes to 1,153,334.
it becomes glaringly obvious that it is now impossible for Labour to lose next Saturday… The election campaign will rumble on. But it is likely to prove to be even more of an anti-climax than it was already likely to have been. By the time the campaign enters its final week, the participants are exhausted; the arguments have been thrashed to death.
There is nothing new to say. If there happens to be fresh policy at hand, opponents will castigate its content and the timing of its release as an indication of desperation.
The pressure will be on Collins to lift National’s party vote to 35 per cent as an absolute minimum is, well, crushing
The disarray, disunity, indiscipline and disloyalty endemic in National’s caucus hardly inspires confidence that the party could lift its game to the standard at which Ardern operates.
To the contrary, National looks less like a government-in-waiting and more like a rabble without a cause.
" Barack Obama, Justin Trudeau and Emmanuel Macron each, like Ardern, spoke the language of “hope” and “change”. Yet, ultimately, all further entrenched a poisonous status quo "
Glen Johnson from Al Jazeera has summed up politics in New Zealand very succinctly.
On border protection from Judith today more yeah..nah.. confusion.
"She said lockdowns led by the border protection agency and minister in charge should be the last resort."
On introducing new, unknown road tolls, Judith negates the whole point of better roading,
" People don't mind, because they have the alternative.
"People can always go the slower way," she said. "
And for her claims, the only party with a tech plan, which then has a tech blunder, Judith ices the "pick me cake",
" About National's ad error, Collins said it was a digital error that was fixed quickly and was now fine. She put the blame on the "digital people"."
Ah, those digital people ay, they keep fecking up Natz great tech policy.
And when you are short on answers to the media's questions today, after ' re-introducing' the same tech policy and probably some more tolls for Auckland roads, Judith looks to her inner Trump mentor,
" I think we just out work, out compete and basically be far more fabulous than [anyone] on the other side."
What brilliant observations by Glen Johnson from Al Jazeera. Shows up our local media. Listened briefly to something on Newshub of some sort of discussion between their women reporters. They were like a group of 14 year old teenage girls as they giggled about someone's birthday cake.
Sean Plonker can't understand why the PM doesn't want a bar of Magicktalk. Why can't snoflake Plonker's listeners join the team of 5 million? whines Sean. Maybe they could try a different station.
Shhh, don't tell St. Jude the patron saint of lost causes that she has an actual lost cause on her hands. We don't want her to give up. I'm quite enjoying the show as it's currently playing out.
And on and on Red Logix goes – sail away I say. What about spending
six months on a leaky boat and we'll just trudge along without you.
And as for people arriving by air. We want to keep our airline going, on a lesser level no doubt in the future, fewer tourists etc. But to do that we have to use it and have return passengers. Comparing our airline entries and exits with people who own their own boats with lives separate from being permanent NZ citizens on land, is spurious.
Or do you think they will put their backs into becoming transport for our people and visitors – a sort of Dunkirk. That would earn them some brownie points here. But actually they need to shelter here don't they, so they have little structural value to us in a time of crisis.
Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: My top six things to note around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the week to July 27 were:1. The Minister for Ford Rangers strikes againTransport Minister Simeon Brown was again the busiest of the Cabinet ministers this week, announcing an ...
You got a fast carAnd I want a ticket to anywhereMaybe we make a dealMaybe together we can get somewhereAny place is betterYesterday’s newsletter, Trust In Me, on the report of abuse in state care, and by religious organisations, between 1950 and 2019, coupled with the hypocrisy of Christopher Luxon ...
New Zealand is again having to reconcile conflicting pressures from its military and its trade interests. Should we join Pillar Two of AUKUS and risk compromising our markets in China? For a century after New Zealand was founded in 1840, its external security arrangements and external economics arrangements were aligned. ...
The ‘50 Shades of Green’ farmers’ protest in 2019 was heavy on climate change denial, but five years on, scepticism and criticism about the idea that pine forests can save us is growing across the board. File photo: Lynn GrievesonTL;DR: Here’s the top six news items of note in climate ...
This morning the sky was bright.The birds, in their usual joyous bliss. Nature doesn’t seem to feel the heat of what might angst humans.Their calls are clear and beautiful.Just some random thoughts:MāoriPaul Goldsmith has announced his government will roll back the judiciary’s rulings on Māori Customary Marine Title, which recognises ...
In 2003, the Court of Appeal delivered its decision in Ngati Apa v Attorney-General, ruling that Māori customary title over the foreshore and seabed had not been universally extinguished, and that the Māori Land Court could determine claims and confirm title if the facts supported it. This kicked off the ...
Earlier this week at Parliament, Labour leader Chris Hipkins was applauded for saying that the response to the final report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care had to be “bigger than politics.” True, but the fine words, apologies and “we hear you” messages will soon ring ...
TL;DR: In news breaking this morning:The Ministry of Education is cutting $2 billion from its school building programme so the National-ACT-NZ First Coalition Government has enough money to deliver tax cuts; The Government has quietly lowered its child poverty reduction targets to make them easier to achieve;Te Whatu Ora-Health NZ’s ...
Kia ora. These are some stories that caught our eye this week – as always, feel free to share yours in the comments. Our header image this week (via Eke Panuku) shows the planned upgrade for the Karanga Plaza Tidal Swimming Steps. The week in Greater Auckland On ...
1. What's not to love about the way the Harris campaign is turning things around?a. Nothingb. Love all of itc. God what a reliefd. Not that it will be by any means easye. All of the above 2. Documents released by the Ministry of Health show Associate Health Minister Casey ...
Trust in me in all you doHave the faith I have in youLove will see us through, if only you trust in meWhy don't you, you trust me?In a week that saw the release of the 3,000 page Abuse in Care report Christopher Luxon was being asked about Boot Camps. ...
TL;DR: The podcast above of the weekly ‘hoon’ webinar for paying subscribers last night features co-hosts and talking about the Royal Commission Inquiry into Abuse in Carereport released this week, and with:The Kākā’s climate correspondent on a UN push to not recognise carbon offset markets and ...
TL;DR: As of 6:00 am on Friday, July 26, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:Transport: Simeon Brown announced$802.9 million in funding for 18 new trains on the Wairarapa and Manawatū rail lines, which ...
The northern expressway extension from Warkworth to Whangarei is likely to require radical changes to legislation if it is going to be built within the foreseeable future. The Government’s powers to purchase land, the planning process and current restrictions on road tolling are all going to need to be changed ...
Text within this block will maintain its original spacing when publishedFirst they came for the doctors But I was confused by the numbers and costs So I didn't speak up Then they came for our police and nurses And I didn't think we could afford those costs anyway So I ...
Photo by Joshua J. Cotten on UnsplashWe’re back again after our mid-winter break. We’re still with the ‘new’ day of the week (Thursday rather than Friday) when we have our ‘hoon’ webinar with paying subscribers to The Kākā for an hour at 5 pm.Jump on this link on YouTube Livestream ...
Notes: This is a free article. Abuse in Care themes are mentioned. Video is at the bottom.BackgroundYesterday’s report into Abuse in Care revealed that at least 1 in 3 of all who went through state and faith based care were abused - often horrifically. At least, because not all survivors ...
Luxon speaks in Parliament yesterday about the Abuse in Care report. Photo: Hagen Hopkins/Getty ImagesTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy today are:PM Christopher Luxon said yesterday in tabling the Abuse in Carereport in Parliament he wanted to ‘do the ...
About a decade ago I worked with a bloke called Steve. He was the grizzled veteran coder, a few years older than me, who knew where the bodies were buried - code wise. Despite his best efforts to be approachable and friendly he could be kind of gruff, through to ...
Some of the recent announcements from the government have reminded us of posts we’ve written in the past. Here’s one from early 2020. There were plenty of reactions to the government’s infrastructure announcement a few weeks ago which saw them fund a bunch of big roading projects. One of ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 7:00 am on Thursday, July 25 are:News: Why Electric Kiwi is closing to new customers - and why it matters RNZ’s Susan EdmundsScoop: Government drops ...
Hi,I felt a small wet tongue snaking through one of the holes in my Crocs. It explored my big toe, darting down one side, then the other. “He’s looking for some toe cheese,” said the woman next to me, words that still haunt me to this day.Growing up in New ...
Yesterday I happily quoted the Prime Minister without fact-checking him and sure enough, it turns out his numbers were all to hell. It’s not four kg of Royal Commission report, it’s fourteen.My friend and one-time colleague-in-comms Hazel Phillips gently alerted me to my error almost as soon as I’d hit ...
TL;DR: As of 6:00 am on Thursday, July 25, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day were:The Abuse in Care Royal Commission of Inquirypublished its final report yesterday.PM Christopher Luxon and The Minister responsible for ...
The Official Information Act has always been a battle between requesters seeking information, and governments seeking to control it. Information is power, so Ministers and government agencies want to manage what is released and when, for their own convenience, and legality and democracy be damned. Their most recent tactic for ...
TL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy today are:Transport and Energy Minister Simeon Brown is accelerating plans to spend at least $10 billion through Public Private Partnerships (PPPs) to extend State Highway One as a four-lane ‘Expressway’ from Warkworth to Whangarei ...
I live my life (woo-ooh-ooh)With no control in my destinyYea-yeah, yea-yeah (woo-ooh-ooh)I can bleed when I want to bleedSo come on, come on (woo-ooh-ooh)You can bleed when you want to bleedYea-yeah, come on (woo-ooh-ooh)Everybody bleed when they want to bleedCome on and bleedGovernments face tough challenges. Selling unpopular decisions to ...
Please note:To skip directly to the- parliamentary footage in the video, scroll to 1:21 To skip to audio please click on the headphone iconon the left hand side of the screenThis video / audio section is under development. ...
Given the crackdown on wasteful government spending, it behooves me to point to a high profile example of spending by the Luxon government that looks like a big, fat waste of time and money. I’m talking about the deployment of NZDF personnel to support the US-led coalition in the Red ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 7:40 am on Wednesday, July 24 are:Deep Dive: Chipping away at the housing crisis, including my comments RNZ/Newsroom’s The DetailNews: Government softens on asset sales, ...
As I reported about the city centre, Auckland’s rail network is also going through a difficult and disruptive period which is rapidly approaching a culmination, this will result in a significant upgrade to the whole network. Hallelujah. Also like the city centre this is an upgrade predicated on the City ...
Today, a 4 kilogram report will be delivered to Parliament. We know this is what the report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in State and Faith-based Care weighs, because our Prime Minister told us so.Some reporter had blindsided him by asking a question about something done by ...
TL;DR: As of 7:00 am on Wednesday, July 24, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:Beehive:Transport Minister Simeon Brownannounced plans to use PPPs to fund, build and run a four-lane expressway between Auckland ...
NewstalkZB host Mike Hosking, who can usually be relied on to give Prime Minister Christopher Luxon an easy run, did not do so yesterday when he interviewed him about the HealthNZ deficit. Luxon is trying to use a deficit reported last year by HealthNZ as yet another example of the ...
Back in January a StatsNZ employee gave a speech at Rātana on behalf of tangata whenua in which he insulted and criticised the government. The speech clearly violated the principle of a neutral public service, and StatsNZ started an investigation. Part of that was getting an external consultant to examine ...
Renting for life: Shared ownership initiatives are unlikely to slow the slide in home ownership by much. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy today are:A Deloittereport for Westpac has projected Aotearoa’s home-ownership rate will ...
You're broken down and tiredOf living life on a merry go roundAnd you can't find the fighterBut I see it in you so we gonna walk it outAnd move mountainsWe gonna walk it outAnd move mountainsAnd I'll rise upI'll rise like the dayI'll rise upI'll rise unafraidI'll rise upAnd I'll ...
There’s been a change in Myers Park. Down the steps from St. Kevin’s Arcade, past the grassy slopes, the children’s playground, the benches and that goat statue, there has been a transformation. The underpass for Mayoral Drive has gone from a barren, grey, concrete tunnel, to a place that thrums ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections Global society may have finally slammed on the brakes for climate-warming pollution released by human fossil fuel combustion. According to the Carbon Monitor Project, the total global climate pollution released between February and May 2024 declined slightly from the amount released during the same ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 7:00 am on Tuesday, July 23 are:Deep Dive: Penlink: where tolling rhetoric meets reality BusinessDesk-$$$’sOliver LewisScoop:Te Pūkenga plans for regional polytechs leak out ...
TL;DR: As of 6:00 am on Tuesday, July 23, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:Health: Shane Reti announcedthe Board of Te Whatu Ora-Health New Zealand was being replaced with Commissioner Lester Levy ...
Health NZ warned the Government at the end of March that it was running over Budget. But the reasons it gave were very different to those offered by the Prime Minister yesterday. Prime Minister Christopher Luxon blamed the “botched merger” of the 20 District Health Boards (DHBs) to create Health ...
Long ReadKey Summary: Although National increased the health budget by $1.4 billion in May, they used an old funding model to project health system costs, and never bothered to update their pre-election numbers. They were told during the Health Select Committees earlier in the year their budget amount was deficient, ...
As a momentous, historic weekend in US politics unfolded, analysts and commentators grasped for precedents and comparisons to help explain the significance and power of the choice Joe Biden had made. The 46th president had swept the Democratic party’s primaries but just over 100 days from the election had chosen ...
TL;DR: I’m casting around for new ideas and ways of thinking about Aotearoa’s political economy to find a few solutions to our cascading and self-reinforcing housing, poverty and climate crises.Associate Professor runs an online masters degree in the economics of sustainability at Torrens University in Australia and is organising ...
The Finance and Expenditure Committee has reported back on National's Local Government (Water Services Preliminary Arrangements) Bill. The bill sets up water for privatisation, and was introduced under urgency, then rammed through select committee with no time even for local councils to make a proper submission. Naturally, national's select committee ...
Some years ago, I bought a book at Dunedin’s Regent Booksale for $1.50. As one does. Vandrad the Viking (1898), by J. Storer Clouston, is an obscure book these days – I cannot find a proper online review – but soon it was sitting on my shelf, gathering dust alongside ...
History is not on the side of the centre-left, when Democratic presidents fall behind in the polls and choose not to run for re-election. On both previous occasions in the past 75 years (Harry Truman in 1952, Lyndon Johnson in 1968) the Democrats proceeded to then lose the White House ...
This is a free articleCoverageThis morning, US President Joe Biden announced his withdrawal from the Presidential race. And that is genuinely newsworthy. Thanks for your service, President Biden, and all the best to you and yours.However, the media in New Zealand, particularly the 1News nightly bulletin, has been breathlessly covering ...
A homeless person’s camp beside a blocked-off slipped damage walkway in Freeman’s Bay: we are chasing our tail on our worsening and inter-related housing, poverty and climate crises. Photo: Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy ...
What has happened to it all?Crazy, some'd sayWhere is the life that I recognise?(Gone away)But I won't cry for yesterdayThere's an ordinary worldSomehow I have to findAnd as I try to make my wayTo the ordinary worldYesterday morning began as many others - what to write about today? I began ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 7:00 am on Monday, July 22 are:Today’s Must Read: Father and son live in a tent, and have done for four years, in a million ...
TL;DR: As of 7:00 am on Monday, July 22, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:US President Joe Biden announced via X this morning he would not stand for a second term.Multinational professional services firm ...
A listing of 32 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, July 14, 2024 thru Sat, July 20, 2024. Story of the week As reflected by preponderance of coverage, our Story of the Week is Project 2025. Until now traveling ...
This weekend, a friend pointed out someone who said they’d like to read my posts, but didn’t want to pay. And my first reaction was sympathy.I’ve already told folks that if they can’t comfortably subscribe, and would like to read, I’d be happy to offer free subscriptions. I don’t want ...
National: The Party of ‘Law and Order’ IntroductionThis weekend, the Government formally kicked off one of their flagship policy programs: a military style boot camp that New Zealand has experimented with over the past 50 years. Cartoon credit: Guy BodyIt’s very popular with the National Party’s Law and Orderimage, ...
Day one of the solo leg of my long journey home begins with my favourite sound: footfalls in an empty street. 5.00 am and it’s already light and already too warm, almost.If I can make the train that leaves Budapest later this hour I could be in Belgrade by nightfall; ...
Do you remember Y2K, the threat that hung over humanity in the closing days of the twentieth century? Horror scenarios of planes falling from the sky, electronic payments failing and ATMs refusing to dispense cash. As for your VCR following instructions and recording your favourite show - forget about it.All ...
Climate Change Minister Simon Watts being questioned by The Kākā’s Bernard Hickey.TL;DR: My top six things to note around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the week to July 20 were:1. A strategy that fails Zero Carbon Act & Paris targetsThe National-ACT-NZ First Coalition Government finally unveiled ...
Summary:As New Zealand loses at least 12 leaders in the public service space of health, climate, and pharmaceuticals, this month alone, directly in response to the Government’s policies and budget choices, what lies ahead may be darker than it appears. Tui examines some of those departures and draws a long ...
The Minister of Housing’s ambition is to reduce markedly the ratio of house prices to household incomes. If his strategy works it would transform the housing market, dramatically changing the prospects of housing as an investment.Leaving aside the Minister’s metaphor of ‘flooding the market’ I do not see how the ...
As previously noted, my historical fantasy piece, set in the fifth-century Mediterranean, was accepted for a Pirate Horror anthology, only for the anthology to later fall through. But in a good bit of news, it turned out that the story could indeed be re-marketed as sword and sorcery. As of ...
An employee of tobacco company Philip Morris International demonstrates a heated tobacco device. Photo: Getty ImagesTL;DR: The top six things I’ve noted around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy on Friday, July 19 are:At a time when the Coalition Government is cutting spending on health, infrastructure, education, housing ...
TL;DR: My pick of the top six links elsewhere around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day or so to 8:30 am on Friday, July 19 are:Scoop: NZ First Minister Casey Costello orders 50% cut to excise tax on heated tobacco products. The minister has ...
Kia ora, it’s time for another Friday roundup, in which we pull together some of the links and stories that caught our eye this week. Feel free to add more in the comments! Our header image this week shows a foggy day in Auckland town, captured by Patrick Reynolds. ...
TL;DR : Here’s the top six items climate news for Aotearoa this week, as selected by Bernard Hickey and The Kākā’s climate correspondent Cathrine Dyer. A discussion recorded yesterday is in the video above and the audio of that sent onto the podcast feed.The Government released its draft Emissions Reduction ...
Save some money, get rich and old, bring it back to Tobacco Road.Bring that dynamite and a crane, blow it up, start all over again.Roll up. Roll up. Or tailor made, if you prefer...Whether you’re selling ciggies, digging for gold, catching dolphins in your nets, or encouraging folks to flutter ...
Waiting In The Wings:For truly, if Trump is America’s un-assassinated Caesar, then J.D. Vance is America’s Octavian, the Republic’s youthful undertaker – and its first Emperor.DONALD TRUMP’S SELECTION of James D. Vance as his running-mate bodes ill for the American republic. A fervent supporter of Viktor Orban, the “illiberal” prime ...
TL;DR: As of 6:00 am on Friday, July 19, the top six announcements, speeches, reports and research around housing, climate and poverty in Aotearoa’s political economy in the last day are:The PSAannounced the Employment Relations Authority (ERA) had ruled in the PSA’s favour in its case against the Ministry ...
Te Rangi e tu nei (The sky above us) Te Papa e takoto nei (The land beneath us) Tatou katoa te hunga ora (To us all the living) Tena koutou katoa (Greetings) ...
A late change to charter school legislation will cheat educators out of fair pay and negotiating power proving charter schools are just a vehicle to make profit out of our education system. ...
In 2004 te iwi Māori rallied against the Crown’s attempt to confiscate our coastlines and moana with the Foreshore and Seabed Act. This led to the largest hīkoi of a generation and the birth of Te Pāti Māori. 20 years later, history is repeating itself. Today the government has announced ...
It has been five and a half years since the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care was established to investigate the abuse of children, young people, and vulnerable adults within state and faith-based institutions. Yesterday, the final report - Whanaketia through pain and trauma, from darkness to light ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to take action off the back of the International Court of Justice ruling on Israel’s illegal occupation of Palestine. ...
On Friday the International Court of Justice reaffirmed what Palestinian’s have been telling us for decades: that the occupation and colonisation of Palestinian lands by Israel is illegal and must end immediately. They also called for reparations for Palestinian’s who have lived under Israeli occupation since it began in 1967. ...
Labour calls on the Government to act after the International Court of Justice (ICJ) ruled that Israel’s occupation of Palestinian Territories is illegal. ...
The 53.7 percent rise in benefit sanctions over the last year is more proof of this Government’s disdain for our communities most in need of support. ...
Aotearoa could be a country where every child grows up feeling safe, loved and with a sense of belonging in their whānau and community. But for some of our children, this is far from reality. Instead, they are trapped in a maze of intergenerational harm that they can’t escape on ...
Te Pāti Māori are calling for David Seymour to resign as Associate Health Minister in response to his call for Pharmac to ignore the Treaty of Waitangi. “This announcement is just another example of the government’s anti-Tiriti, anti-Māori agenda.” Said Co-leader and spokesperson for health, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer. “Seymour thinks it ...
The soaring price of renting is driving the rise of inflation in this country - with latest figures from Stats NZ showing rents are up 4.8 per cent on average while annual inflation is at 3.3 per cent. ...
National’s Emissions Reduction Plan will take New Zealand further from the economy we need to ensure the next generation has a stable climate and secure livelihoods. ...
Following consultation with named parties and thorough consideration of privacy interests, the Green Party is in a position to release the Executive Summary of the final report from the independent investigation into Darleen Tana. ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon should be asking serious questions of his Minister for Resources Shane Jones now it’s been revealed he misled the public about a dinner with mining companies that he didn’t declare and said wasn’t pre-arranged. ...
Te Pāti Māori have submitted to the Justice Select Committee against the Sentencing (Reinstating Three Strikes) Amendment Bill. The bill will further entrench racism in our justice system and fails to focus on rehabilitation. “Reinstating Three Strikes will empower a systematically racist system and exacerbate the overrepresentation of Māori in ...
The Transport and Infrastructure Committee is set to make a determination on the Residential Tenancies Amendment (RTA) Bill in the coming weeks. “This legislation will give landlords the power to kick our whānau out onto the street for no reason” said Housing spokesperson, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “Their solution to the housing ...
“National’s campaign was about tackling crime and the best they can do is a two-year long Ministerial Advisory Group,” Labour justice spokesperson Duncan Webb said. ...
“There are more examples of charter schools failing their students than there are success stories. The coalition Government is driving to dismantle our public school system and instead promote a privatised, competitive structure that puts profits before kids,” Jan Tinetti said. ...
“This government is choosing to deliberately mislead and withhold information, keeping our people in the dark about this government’s agenda and the future of our mokopuna,” said co-leader and spokesperson for Health, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer. The call comes after the demand from the Chief Ombudsman that Associate Minister of Health, Casey ...
“Today’s climate announcement by Simon Watts makes clear the National Government is simply paying lip service to meeting its climate change targets,” Megan Woods said. ...
National is choosing to make life harder for workers by taking away the rights our communities have fought hard for. Here's how they’re taking workers backwards. ...
Australia, Canada and New Zealand today issued the following statement on the need for an urgent ceasefire in Gaza and the risk of expanded conflict between Hizballah and Israel. The situation in Gaza is catastrophic. The human suffering is unacceptable. It cannot continue. We remain unequivocal in our condemnation of ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today reminded all State and faith-based institutions of their legal obligation to preserve records relevant to the safety and wellbeing of those in its care. “The Abuse in Care Inquiry’s report has found cases where records of the most vulnerable people in State and faith‑based institutions were ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says the Government’s online safety website for children and young people has reached one million page views. “It is great to see so many young people and their families accessing the site Keep It Real Online to learn how to stay safe online, and manage ...
Tēnā tātou katoa, Ngā mihi te rangi, ngā mihi te whenua, ngā mihi ki a koutou, kia ora mai koutou. Thank you for the opportunity to be here and the invitation to speak at this 50th anniversary conference. I acknowledge all those who have gone before us and paved the ...
New Zealand’s payroll providers have successfully prepared to ensure 3.5 million individuals will, from Wednesday next week, be able to keep more of what they earn each pay, says Finance Minister Nicola Willis and Revenue Minister Simon Watts. “The Government's tax policy changes are legally effective from Wednesday. Delivering this tax ...
An experimental vineyard which will help futureproof the wine sector has been opened in Blenheim by Associate Regional Development Minister Mark Patterson. The covered vineyard, based at the New Zealand Wine Centre – Te Pokapū Wāina o Aotearoa, enables controlled environmental conditions. “The research that will be produced at the Experimental ...
The Coalition Government has confirmed the indicative regional breakdown of North Island Weather Event (NIWE) funding for state highway recovery projects funded through Budget 2024, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Regions in the North Island suffered extensive and devastating damage from Cyclone Gabrielle and the 2023 Auckland Anniversary Floods, and ...
Indonesia’s Foreign Minister, Retno Marsudi, will visit New Zealand next week, Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced. “Indonesia is important to New Zealand’s security and economic interests and is our closest South East Asian neighbour,” says Mr Peters, who is currently in Laos to engage with South East Asian partners. ...
He aha te kai a te rangatira? He kōrero, he kōrero, he kōrero. The government has reaffirmed its commitment to supporting the aspirations of Ngāti Maniapoto, Minister for Māori Development Tama Potaka says. “My thanks to Te Nehenehenui Trust – Ngāti Maniapoto for bringing their important kōrero to a ministerial ...
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has thanked outgoing Chair of the Civil Aviation Authority, Janice Fredric, for her service to the board.“I have received Ms Fredric’s resignation from the role of Chair of the Civil Aviation Authority,” Mr Brown says.“On behalf of the Government, I want to thank Ms Fredric for ...
The Government is proposing legislation to overturn a Court of Appeal decision and amend the Marine and Coastal Area Act in order to restore Parliament’s test for Customary Marine Title, Treaty Negotiations Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “Section 58 required an applicant group to prove they have exclusively used and occupied ...
Regulation Minister David Seymour says that opposition parties have united in bad faith, opposing what they claim are ‘dangerous changes’ to the Early Childhood Education sector, despite no changes even being proposed yet. “Issues with affordability and availability of early childhood education, and the complexity of its regulation, has led ...
After receiving more than 740 submissions in the first 20 days, Regulation Minister David Seymour is asking the Ministry for Regulation to extend engagement on the early childhood education regulation review by an extra two weeks. “The level of interest has been very high, and from the conversations I’ve been ...
The Coalition Government is investing $802.9 million into the Wairarapa and Manawatū rail lines as part of a funding agreement with the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA), KiwiRail, and the Greater Wellington and Horizons Regional Councils to deliver more reliable services for commuters in the lower North Island, Transport Minister Simeon ...
Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced his intention to appoint a Crown Manager to both Hawke’s Bay Regional and Wairoa District Councils to speed up the delivery of flood protection work in Wairoa."Recent severe weather events in Wairoa this year, combined with damage from Cyclone Gabrielle in 2023 have ...
Mr Speaker, this is a day that many New Zealanders who were abused in State care never thought would come. It’s the day that this Parliament accepts, with deep sorrow and regret, the Report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care. At the heart of this report are the ...
For the first time, the Government is formally acknowledging some children and young people at Lake Alice Psychiatric Hospital experienced torture. The final report of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in State and Faith-based Care “Whanaketia – through pain and trauma, from darkness to light,” was tabled in Parliament ...
The Government has acknowledged the nearly 2,400 courageous survivors who shared their experiences during the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Historical Abuse in State and Faith-Based Care. The final report from the largest and most complex public inquiry ever held in New Zealand, the Royal Commission Inquiry “Whanaketia – through ...
With a week to go before hard-working New Zealanders see personal income tax relief for the first time in fourteen years, 513,000 people have used the Budget tax calculator to see how much they will benefit, says Finance Minister Nicola Willis. “Tax relief is long overdue. From next Wednesday, personal income ...
Workplace Relations and Safety Minister Brooke van Velden says a bill that has passed its first reading will improve parental leave settings and give non-biological parents more flexibility as primary carer for their child. The Regulatory Systems Amendment Bill (No3), passed its first reading this morning. “It includes a change ...
Two Bills designed to improve regulation and make it easier to do business have passed their first reading in Parliament, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. The Regulatory Systems (Economic Development) Amendment Bill and Regulatory Systems (Immigration and Workforce) Amendment Bill make key changes to legislation administered by the Ministry ...
New legislation paves the way for greater competition in sectors such as banking and electricity, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly says. “Competitive markets boost productivity, create employment opportunities and lift living standards. To support competition, we need good quality regulation but, unfortunately, a recent OECD report ranked New ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says lotteries for charitable purposes, such as those run by the Heart Foundation, Coastguard NZ, and local hospices, will soon be allowed to operate online permanently. “Under current laws, these fundraising lotteries are only allowed to operate online until October 2024, after which ...
The Coalition Government is accelerating work on the new four-lane expressway between Auckland and Whangārei as part of its Roads of National Significance programme, with an accelerated delivery model to deliver this project faster and more efficiently, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “For too long, the lack of resilient transport connections ...
Sir Don McKinnon will travel to Viet Nam this week as a Special Envoy of the Government, Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced. “It is important that the Government give due recognition to the significant contributions that General Secretary Nguyen Phu Trong made to New Zealand-Viet Nam relations,” Mr ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says newly appointed Commissioner, Grant Illingworth KC, will help deliver the report for the first phase of the Royal Commission of Inquiry into COVID-19 Lessons, due on 28 November 2024. “I am pleased to announce that Mr Illingworth will commence his appointment as ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters travels to Laos this week to participate in a series of Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN)-led Ministerial meetings in Vientiane. “ASEAN plays an important role in supporting a peaceful, stable and prosperous Indo-Pacific,” Mr Peters says. “This will be our third visit to ...
Construction of a new mental health facility at Te Nikau Grey Hospital in Greymouth is today one step closer, Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey says. “This $27 million facility shows this Government is delivering on its promise to boost mental health care and improve front line services,” Mr Doocey says. ...
New Zealand is committing nearly $50 million to a package supporting sustainable Pacific fisheries development over the next four years, Foreign Minister Winston Peters and Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones announced today. “This support consisting of a range of initiatives demonstrates New Zealand’s commitment to assisting our Pacific partners ...
Associate Education Minister David Seymour says proposed changes to the Education and Training Amendment Bill will ensure charter schools have more flexibility to negotiate employment agreements and are equipped with the right teaching resources. “Cabinet has agreed to progress an amendment which means unions will not be able to initiate ...
In response to serious concerns around oversight, overspend and a significant deterioration in financial outlook, the Board of Health New Zealand will be replaced with a Commissioner, Health Minister Dr Shane Reti announced today. “The previous government’s botched health reforms have created significant financial challenges at Health NZ that, without ...
Minister for Space and Science, Innovation and Technology Judith Collins will travel to Adelaide tomorrow for space and science engagements, including speaking at the Australian Space Forum. While there she will also have meetings and visits with a focus on space, biotechnology and innovation. “New Zealand has a thriving space ...
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President Adeang, fellow Ministers, honourable Diet Member Horii, Ambassadors, distinguished guests. Minasama, konnichiwa, and good afternoon, everyone. Distinguished guests, it’s a pleasure to be here with you today to talk about New Zealand’s foreign policy reset, the reasons for it, the values that underpin it, and how it ...
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The photograph is striking and beautiful, but also disturbing – a reminder that my love for John was often entangled in shame.The Sunday Essay is made possible thanks to the support of Creative New Zealand.In the spring of 1980, in Dunedin, shortly before his death, someone took a photograph ...
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Pacific Media Watch A Lebanese photojournalist who was severely wounded during an Israeli air strike in south Lebanon carried the Olympic torch in Paris this week in honour of her peers who have been wounded and killed in the field — especially in Gaza and Lebanon. Christina Assi of Agence ...
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Interesting (and concerning ) research showing COVID can last 28 days on some surfaces.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/428099/covid-19-virus-survives-on-some-surfaces-for-28-days
Such information is a reminder to us that we cannot be complacent..
As Sharon Murdoch said in her cartoon, we need to be a lert.
The world needs lerts.
https://mobile.twitter.com/domesticanimal/status/1314266673789059072/photo/1
What a combination bank notes, screens, stainless steel, glass, plastic and cooler temperatures. It is not hard to see how community transmission is spread without coughing, sneezing or talking occurring.
Mask wearing, distancing, hand washing, testing, contact tracing and isolation, were this not to occur the number of infections would be far greater. The second wave in the Northern Hemisphere is looking far worse than the first wave.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/428118/victoria-should-ease-lockdown-epidemiologist-says
Victoria and NSW have given up on eliminating and the quote is that they are going to try to control but understand that it will keep 'bobbing along'. The point is made that there are many borders, it is a big land mass, more than NZ. And, hopefully, they have not run down their medical systems as we have.
They are making plenty of money from us, which leads to our skewed economy, hopefully they are putting their bank and supermarket profits into useful infrastructure and services over there.
Just to remind ourselves of the various control methods for Covid 19 from our NZESR:
https://www.esr.cri.nz/our-expertise/covid-19-response/strategies-for-covid-19/
The strain of knowing that there are different strains. Oooh er!
The six strains of SARS-CoV-2 — ScienceDaily http://www.sciencedaily.com › releases › 2020/08
Aug 3, 2020 — Despite its mutations, the virus shows little variability, and this is good news for … virus causing the COVID–19 pandemic, SARS-CoV-2, presents at least six strains. … The original one is the L strain, that appeared in Wuhan in December 2019. … 14, 2020 — In a new paper, experts comment on the future of …
The coronavirus is mutating — does it matter? – Nature http://www.nature.com › news feature
Sep 8, 2020 — Different SARS-CoV-2 strains haven't yet had a major impact on the course of the …
Oct.5/20 https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300124671/covid19-the-nz-strains-and-our-second-wave-of-coronavirus
This is a long-form piece with lots of info and detail, thanks stuff and Marc Daalder of Newsroom. At the end there is an update on the vaccine situation which is rather cheering.
In an audit of New Zealand's genome sequencing programme, EPA chief science advisor Michael Bunce recommended the Government prioritise genomic surveillance of the virus to monitor potentially dangerous mutations.
"Aotearoa New Zealand needs to embrace genomic tools and analyses for long-term monitoring of viral evolution. This is not simply an academic exercise, rather there is a pressing need to monitor the viral lineages that are circulating (akin to seasonal influenza tracking)," he wrote.
But the slow rate of mutation – just 24 a year on average – should remain a solace both to researchers working on vaccines and the rest of us, who hope to one day take one.
I see that vaccines such as the BCG are being looked at. Modifying the BCG has as much chance as something undiscovered. A proven vaccine is the best possible outcome to manage Covid – 19.
Sounds good. Hope it works. Talk I previously heard is that we may end up with a yearly vaccine tailored to the most outrageous of the nasty dots wanting to get at us. Similar to the present flu vaccine but additional to.
Scanning the Herald this morning, just noted they are charging for an article that was published in The Independent (UK) yesterday….on a Murdoch leaving his father’s (Rupert) company.
James Murdoch. A wise man?
I was wondering how Rupert could look himself in the face. Let alone his recent missus. It must be clear to him now it's got down to a war on democratic processes. And the affront to his journalistic instincts of Trumpism.
Richard Harman on his Politik website is suggesting that Collins has had to rejig her campaign diary in this final week. She’s now not going to Tauranga (a visit that somehow Simon Bridges wasn’t even aware of) and instead will head to Hamilton where, according to Harman , the two National held seats are now at risk.
https://www.politik.co.nz/2020/10/12/national-gets-desperate/
Very interesting.
From the article you referenced
Ahaha.
By the way, would Bennett still be on the caucus email list? Adams etc?
Adams certainly would be. Love the thought of someone giving madame Collins a dressing-down.
But with Collins turning up in Hamilton wont that put those two seats in even more risk ?
There is no way Collins would be going to Tauranga and the siting MP not knowing. I there?
Depends who her campaign team trusts..
Facial Recognition. Coming soon…Everywhere?
‘However, the aim to expand the use of biometrics for multiple uses by Crown agencies is clear in documents obtained under the Official Information Act from Internal Affairs, the police and others.’
"The business outcome… is to deliver a fit-for-purpose and supported Facial Recognition Solution that will increase productivity, reduce cost and extend the capability across and beyond" the Service Delivery and Operations branch, said a privacy assessment of the DXC system by Internal Affairs.
Police tender documents show they sought out a system that could be used in the future to import drivers' licence and passport photos, and masses more facial images than currently, though police deny they will use their Dataworks Plus-NEC system for that.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/428103/government-facial-recognition-tech-deal-offers-wide-access
No fucking way is this acceptable
"the company has been criticised in the UK for being less than transparent about how these all-important algorithms 'learn' who to raise the alarm about."
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/423893/global-facial-recognition-company-working-closely-with-nz-govt
Labour? What is the story?
When it comes to identifying a person for a specific reason proper facial recognition is required. It is the use of the information gathered which needs to be administered according to legislation which is clear and understood.
Would you have an issue with police using a body webcam on a normal shift?
Nothing is required! There is a big difference between some local camera on a local cop recording a personal local interaction and scanning everyone that passes a particular place or uses a particular service.
There is no reason for surveillance of the public going about their lawful business and any law and order stuff is just rubbish. How many people would be scanned to pick up the one person in years doing some thing they shouldn't that couldn't be identified in any other way.
Labour need to get on top of this pronto. The chilling sight of China selling the system they use on the Uighers to Iran should stop anyone in their tracks
A system which does the job and does not violate a person's freedom or rights is required.
The police have made more than one IT blunder. Remember INCIS a computer system which flopped.
Somehow we managed to identify people adequately before facial recognition. Once it's in it will be very hard to get it out. Plus extending to private firms -who thought that was a good idea.
I'm still a no -any safeguards would be gone by lunchtime with a right wing government.
Your no is clear.
Lazy policing methods would occur and security firms do not have the ability to arrest a person.
I would not want to be caught up in being questioned or on a list just because my face was detected near a crime scene.
The other problem is a camera with bad lighting using technology that routinely has difficulty correctly identifying people of colour in ideal conditions has a high likelihood of not just rounding up the usual suspects, but forcing the suspects to prove their innocence because "computer says you were there".
And a proprietary algorithm that the defence can't interrogate or examine? Not only would they have to prove the computer wrong to discount that piece of "evidence", disagreeing with it would make them look like liars and therefore lower the weight of the other evidence they present. You know, stuff like true alibis.
I am with you on this RBCV, however I feel we will be in the minority.
We have access to a bach near Taupo, on a street running to the lake with a river on one side.
A mix of locals and bach owners concerned with crime have put a digital CCTV camera up. Thru a FB page they have lobbied folk to gauge enthusiasm for $ to maintain the device.
Overwhelmingly in favour is how would describe the response. I have asked a couple of questions e.g., who 'owns' the data, how they intend to deal with privacy issues should they arise. Not got an answer yet….
Anyone can put a CCTV camera up. What to do with the information is another matter.
Would the police even be interested in looking at the footage?
It should be on a secure server that no one can access unless a crime is committed that is covered by the camera(s).
If a crime occurs that is covered by the cameras then they would be. I'd be highly disgusted if they didn't.
4.2.1.2 Hi, I have had an interest in this since the John Key "era"…but sadly the normalisation of our surveillance has continued…
Anyway, maybe these might be of use?
https://privacy.org.nz/assets/Files/Brochures-and-pamphlets-and-pubs/Privacy-and-CCTV-A-guide-October-2009.pdf
https://www.cab.org.nz/article/KB00001289
Last resort ?
https://www.privacy.org.nz/your-rights/making-a-complaint/
Thanks, PLA. I will give them a peruse.
I was a little surprised at the enthusiasm, but I live rurally and a dog is about the extent of our security. We don't lock doors and about half the windows.
Nick Hager on…and he would Know ! This is a great sum…
https://www.privacy.org.nz/assets/Files/13854584.pdf
"5.Street surveillance The concept of a “public place” is changing subtly but very significantly with the increasing use of surveillance systems. "
Also ….I have personal experience of Employer Surveillance…I pushed back HARD. Union, Community Law etc, There was theft. Turns out it the end (long trail ) it was a "manager". But WE all got surveillance. Camera in smoko room !! And its still there. Fark ..pissed off.
Anyway…always Push Back. Question Authority.
4.2.1 Absolutely !! And an FYI for anyone… When the whole 5 Eyes spy BS was started. Fark I debated and pushed back many times AGAINST John Key and the nats trying to have surveillance on ALL of us.
Now Labour is going there?
And re the Police, SIS etc? They already have more than enough Laws and Tech to do their jobs. Have done for Years.
https://thestandard.org.nz/the-right-for-spys-to-break-the-law-bill/
Aye matey ! I was not on the Standard then, but "another site"…..Its a slippery slope we end up with if :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing_to_hide_argument
kinda remember Key and nats full of that shite….
And this from Aus…
'On February 22, 2015 Australian Federal Police Assistant Commissioner Tim Morris made the following claims appealing to blind trust from the public.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_surveillance_in_Australia
To be honest I wouldnt trust them too much….Ours prob similar ?
I'm sure the judiciary will rule it's not to be used near brothels.
Leaving aside the total bullshit around National’s lies about the Green’s Wealth Tax, it’s the target audience that’s probably the most interesting aspect.
The party has been forced, in the last week, to roll out some pretty crude scare tactics to try and regather one of its usually most constant voting cohorts, wealthy, mortgage free retired kiwis.
The wealthy mortgage free retired Kiwis are the new Act Party voters.
Seymour is going to be the big winner next Saturday when it comes to a comparison on how much a leader has grown their party. His end of life bill will probably pass, as it is not harmful to others apart from immediate family starting the grieving process earlier than they would have.
For Greywarshark , who reads widely , a precis of how pandemics have dramatically changed societies
https://consortiumnews.com/2020/10/09/covid-19-how-3-prior-pandemics-triggered-massive-societal-shifts/
This one is going to accelerate changes already in train. The Americans are no longer going to provide the default security guarantee and global trade structure; we are going to rapidly see a number of powers attempt to occupy the vacuum created. It will be messy.
It was going to be about a decade off, now it's next year or so.
Is it going to be a replication of the triumphalist superpower in full spectrum domination , or perhaps something more mature and multi polar, where we accept flux and negotiation.Who knows, the art of true diplomacy may come to the fore
It's going to be a bumpy ride the next little while though
Greywarshark could also read 'Nature's Mutiny' by Blom. About the little ice age from about 1580 to 1670 and the profound effect it had on society.
In the early years they burned a few witches to appease an angry God when crops failed. When that didn't seem to work the people turned to other solutions. By the end of the century of low temperatures a embryonic capitalistic system was embedded in Europe.
A very readable and insightful book.
Climate change is going to have profound effects on life.
Taken note and will read
Thanks
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/books/2019/01/30/natures-mutiny/
There are monastry wine makers records that show that the cold from about 1590 was preceded by a very warm period when it was possible for picknickers to walk across the Rhine at Frankfurt even by ladies in the volumnous dresses of the day and only get their feet a little wet, according to Hugh Johnson in The Story of Wine and this year The Little Ice Age by Prof Brian Fagan of University of California Santa Barbara. Both excellent reads esp Fagans on how climate has shaped our history.
esp Fagans on how climate has shaped our history
Yeah, he continued that in another of his books, The Long Summer, which I've got. https://www.theguardian.com/books/2004/may/29/featuresreviews.guardianreview11
Sounds interesting – will put it in my later file Francesca and Tony V, Adrian.
And Dennis F thanks also – when we had a break in our regular trade with UK we went stir crazy and invited everybody to the selling-up auction.
Looks like Chris Bishop's office has been busy:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300129880/election-2020-im-proud-to-be-a-socialist-witch–labours-ginny-anderson-hits-back-at-graffiti-rampage
If only they were socialists…I wish!
It's sort of an attack on democracy really – people who are supposed to be able to form modern joined-up thoughts and put their reasoned thinking into choosing a capable leader with wide knowledge and the wisdom to apply it for the good of everyone. I don't feel encouraged about getting a good outcome from the brainwork of citizens revelling in this sort of graffiti. And witches are so passe' aren't they. Aren't they?
Was driving through Petone yesterday and noticed that a number of Labs signs graffitied with really facile comments like above. Facile
Said to hubby at least when the left do this we most often show wit and intelligence.
I would vote for a socialist witch, probably vote for a socialist which …
or even a socialist switch
Well, we need a war govt to deal with climate change, so that is socialism. Though National is slipping away from recognition of climate change to engineer more immediate rewards for themselves.
Be interesting to see if Ardern heads to Auckland Central in this last week? Winning is still an uphill battle for Swarbrick but she’s clearly in another league from White and Mellow.
" Winning is still an uphill battle for Swarbrick but she’s clearly in another league from White and Mellow "
Yes from what i have seen of White and Mellow ( sounds like an accounting firm ) Swarbrick would be a marvellous asset for the good people of Auckland Central.
It is a shame they don't seem to see that.
@mosa 9
I wouldn’t rule out the possibility of Swarbrick coming through the middle on election night. Be great to see that happen.
" Be great to see that happen "
Would be the highlight of the night !
totally ditto
She is fantastic
Yesterday I received an unsolicited and personalised email from Judith Collins. Its content, which is fear mongering at its worst, is attempting to link Labour policy to the Green's Wealth Tax proposal. Jacinda Ardern has stated quite categorically that this is not true and so scurrilous misinformation.
It is obviously aimed at gold card holders and a number of my acquaintances, who share my indignation, have also received it.
The serious question is, how did the National Party obtain those email addresses. If they came from a Grey Power data base or even a Gold Card data base then this must be a breach of privacy which should be investigated. Do others share my concern.
Ask the sender of this email how they obtained you email address. You could also get assurance from your grey power chairperson that they've not given it to any marketing outfit.
But how they would get your email address from a gold card database. Is there such a thing?
No way MSD would be leaking it. Grey Power on the other hand..
Grey Power need looking into telling members to vote no on the cannabis reeferendum without consulting members when 70% of elderly people are for a yes vote.
I am seriously wondering whether or not to renew my membership.
NZ Herald 12 Oct
“Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern says she will reconsider a decision to deny a grieving British family entry to New Zealand.
Ardern said this morning that she stood by a decision not to let yachts in the Pacific dock here during the Covid-19 pandemic.
She said she did not want a scenario in which people could not fly into New Zealand but could sail in.”
The blue water yachts sailing the world oceans have annually migrated and brought business to New Zealand when they sailed away from the tropical areas of the Pacific to avoid being there in the hurricane season. To sail from Tahiti to NZ, as this family will have to do , will take about 20 days so they will not arrive Covid stricken.
I bet the super yacht owners and all their friends will be “facilitated” to come to NZ in time for the Americas Cup Races – but will the lovers and friends ( those that do not have “partner” status) of New Zealanders currently held at bay overseas , be invited in first. What wins MONEY of Kiwi happiness ? Right now I am ashamed to be a New Zealander.
But surely the blue water yachts have had the sense to lay up at this time. Surely they can't have thought they could drift through the carnage unaffected, munching their lotuses?
Lay up where exactly?
Harden up Cupcake.
I've done this one to death elsewhere.
Frankly the opiniated tosh coming from people here who have no understanding of yachting and what's at stake for these people has been… an eyeopener.
RL, frankly the opinionated tosh coming from people who appear to have a poor grasp of pandemic epidemiology and what's at stake globally has been… an eye-opener. On 2 October, you wrote (in separate comments):
The daily number of new COVID infections continues to outstrip recovered cases, so the number of active COVID cases globally continues to rise. On 2 October, when you boldly and repeatedly opined "It's over", the number of active cases was apparently 7.72 million; currently there are 8.31 million infected patients.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
Officially, COVID-19 has infected less than 0.5% of humans , so it seems unlikely that "it's over", even allowing for vitamin D supplementation and whatever other 'magic bullet' / 'snake oil' straws one might want to clutch at. Apologies for doing "this one to death" (an unfortunate choice of words), but your opinion on this particular aspect of the COVID-19 pandemic are misleading and dangerous to public health, IMHO.
Edit: Reading those two quotes again, you appear to be implying that those critiquing your opinions might want COVID-19-related illness and death to continue – pretty offensive.
Take your complaint to WHO. They've come out this week against continued lockdowns as the only tool against Covid.
We now have an array of smarter, less blunt, tools to help manage this disease. And in the week since I made those quotes above, it looks like a lot of qualified medical people are thinking along similar lines.
RL, my "complaint" is that you are promulgating the idea that the COVID-19 pandemic is over. Don't lean too hard on the WHO for support; how do you imagine that organisation, or indeed “a lot of qualified medical people” would respond to your assertion that "It's over"?
“We now have an array of smarter, less blunt, tools to help manage” diabetic conditions, but diabetes isn’t over.
You can delude yourself as much as you want, but please don’t mislead others.
It's over from a strategic perspective. Its no longer an unknown, uncontrolled threat. Which means we can start thinking about what comes next.
I’ve made this distinction clear enough already, but obviously it suits you to pretend otherwise.
Diabetes kills between 1 – 2m people each year, and we manage it without resort to extraordinary measures that have huge costs to the whole of society. Covid is going to eventually become something similar.
Diabetes isn't highly contagious.
All comparisons are flawed. But it was DMK who made it in the first place.
But let's see, we could probably stop diabetes in its tracks if govts exerted a complete totalitarian control over diet and exercise. Comfortable with that?
Doing it for a month or so would have minimal effect on diabetes. It would also require carefully tailored programmes for each individual, lest heart attack rates and other comorbidities skyrocket.
L4 for a month or so saved thousands of NZers' lives, and means we can go to sports games without it being a "super-spreader" event.
In short, your comparison could well make the diabetes problem worse, while the "totalitarian" action actually imposed has led to greater freedoms than many other nations currently have.
You could have written 'It's not [anywhere near] over, yet', but that wouldn't have suited your argument/position, so you chose to deceive and wrote "It's over" – twice. And now your writing that:
I personally believe it’s simply more “opinionated tosh” to assert that COVID-19 is "no longer an uncontrolled threat". Recorded daily global deaths have been between 4,000 and 6,000 since 28 April, and currently at 5,285 (7-day moving average) – ffs, think for a moment if the families and friends of the thousands of people who will die tomorrow due to COVID-19 infections view it as 'over' – that’s a morally repugnant view IMHO.
Your point of view remains a mystery to me, moreso because you previously stated that:
I get that you want the COVID-19 pandemic to be over. I certainly wish it was over. But no amount of wanting and wishing by us will make a blind bit of difference. The COVID-19 pandemic is what it is, and it's NOT over, "from a strategic perspective" or otherwise. You're position on this issue is simply not credible or rational, and I can only conclude that irrationality is at the root of your apparent need to dig yourself ever deeper.
The remarkable thing about the global daily death rate is how stable it is now. This is not a pandemic spiralling out of control. It represents less than 4% of all deaths, despite the case rate continuing to climb.
Also check the data we do have for the excess death rate. This paints another picture again
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/excess-mortality-p-scores
A huge bump back in March April May, and now almost back to normal. Or below.
We did the right move at the beginning, but the right move now may well be different.
a regular 10-20% increase in some nations weekly mortality is "almost back to normal"?
Only because the peaks before substantial numbers of people did what the governments were too cowardly or corrupt to require. So now we have places like the US, where huge numbers of people are in lockdown (voluntary or locally-mandated) for months while others hug each other at maskless political events, just to keep it ticking over.
I, for one, don't want to risk an "almost normal" 20% increase in mortality in NZ.
Are you looking at the same graphic?
Yup. I also looked at the note about the reporting lag for recent weeks, and looked at the button to "add country".
But most of all, I looked at the Y-axis scale.
It's a "remarkable thing" that we can have such different opinions about what a stable global COVID-19 death rate of 5,000 (give or take) per day means for the pandemic. Your evolving position:
is an intriguing one, but I'm not convinced your selected words accurately reflect the current stage of the pandemic.
Hopefully the COVID-19 case and fatality rates will begin to edge down within a few months, and your "it's over" will eventually match pandemic reality – maybe when (or if) a moderately effective vaccine is widely available. But if the COVID-19 trajectories of some other OECD countries are anything to go by, then letting our guard down is just asking for trouble.
fatality rates will begin to edge down within a few months
And a quick glimpse of the data clearly shows that despite a rising number of cases globally, the number of deaths is stable. This absolutely means the Case Fatality Rate must be declining and has been for months … good news.
But if the COVID-19 trajectories of some other OECD countries are anything to go by, then letting our guard down is just asking for trouble.
Nonetheless the shape of these curves is broadly similar, a bump and then a decline back to nearly normal or below. Even Sweden where they never put their guard up much in the first place.
Someone might just look at them all and conclude that from the perspective of why we did the lockdowns and travel bans back in March … it's effectively over. Globally it's not exponentially spiralling out of control, and we now have an array of tools to manage this disease in the usual way. Lockdowns should no longer be the primary tool that govts reach to.
This is now the view of WHO and numerous other highly qualified medical professionals, so while I accept it's still a controversial position, it's not an uninformed or ignorant one.
Possibly more “controversial” for NZ than for the nine OECD countries with rates of COVID-19 deaths per million at least 100 times ours. Might relaxing NZ’s border controls now be likened to gradually decreasing the concentration of fluoride in drinking water?
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2020/10/covid-19-who-official-s-lockdown-criticism-probably-doesn-t-apply-to-new-zealand-dr-siouxsie-wiles.html
It's hardly surprising that a global pandemic would increase inequality and so hardship, but is the optimal solution really to allow the virus to spread until herd immunity (still rather contentious for COVID – remember your perceptive comment regarding our incomplete understanding of COVID epidemiology) is established? This would appear to be advocating that the total number of COVID-19 cases globally should be allowed to increase to a point were there are roughly 100 times the number of people infected – this would presumably (somehow) occur in a controlled fashion. Still, I can't help wondering if there might be some other way to alleviate poverty – some other way. After all, there really is more than enough wealth to go around.
Don't know about Aussie, but found these links.
Then there's this.
Seems to relaxing border controls for NZ now would be akin to not finishing a course of antibiotics.
Yes. I get that, we saved lives at the front end, but now we're faced with another kind of challenge at the back end. It seems to me NZ is betting the farm on an effective vaccine.
At present NZ is nowhere near 'herd immunity', at whatever level you choose to put that number, effectively COVID has never really happened in NZ, which is forcing us into a posture of extreme vulnerability all the while waiting on a vaccine to rescue us. Is this really a sustainable strategy?
As I've said repeatedly, back in March when faced with many unknowns lockdowns were absolutely the right thing to do. But in six months the ground has shifted.
With over a million dead, and at least as many seriously debilitated, the ground has indeed shifted – we now know that COVID-19 is a dangerous virus. I'll behave accordingly until a reliable treatment and/or vaccine is available – it's an easy personal choice to make here.
As NZ progressed down the COVID alert levels for the first time, we went to a popular local resaurant to celebrate level 3 –> 2. It was a little too popular, and wasn't observing the mandated health safety rules. Haven't been back – fortunately there are plenty of safety-conscious eateries to choose from.
"At present NZ is nowhere near 'herd immunity'", and as you point out we don't even know if as few as 50% of the population (or even less) would need to be infected to achieve effective herd immunity (if herd immunity is even possible for this virus.) If ~50% turns out to be the level of exposure required for herd immunity, then we're already ~1% of the way down that road – yay.
I'm under no illusions that economic considerations will eventually dominate health concerns, but I'll get (well) behind any government, health service, organisation and individual applying the brakes and urging caution, and drag my heels every step of the way.
Stamp it out, keep it out – "We don't know how lucky we are…", and I'd rather that didn't become "We don't know how lucky we were…"
Stamp it out, keep it out
Nah, a completely idiotic and in the long term, impossible dream. It will fail.
There are only two ways out of this, a vaccine or herd immunity.
The article I linked to on herd immunity above is a reasonably well balanced read on this. It could be a number as high as 70% based on a simple analysis, or as low as 20% if you start introducing other considerations. Differing specialists are making various argument. But NZ has effectively taken this possibility off the table for the time being.
So a vaccine it is … what if we never get one? How many more lockdowns can we do?
And here is a WHO spokesperson speaking to the NZ situation; effectively saying the same thing as I am. Use all the tools at your disposal, but don’t rely on lockdowns as your primary tool:
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/covid-19/428204/covid-19-nz-is-in-an-advantageous-position-who-spokesperson
Vaccines create herd immunity. Herd immunity without vaccines is just infecting millions and watching people die.
The third way out of this is that we keep mandatory border isolation. It'll also help with the next pandemic, too.
You’ve repeatedly stated "it's over", so why do we need a 'way out'? Is the COVID-19 pandemic over, and if not then why were you promulgating the idea that it was?
Herd immunity remains a dream until ~50% of NZers have been infected; maybe not even then. At the moment ~1,800 NZers have been infected, so one of your "ways out" consists of letting the number of people who have been infected with COVID-19 rise (gradually?) to ~2,500,000. No thanks – that's a BIG fail, IMHO.
I'm not holding out much hope for an effective vaccine either, but that's still a better bet than banking on at least 2,500,000 NZers being infected.
If you're planning on returning to NZ anytime soon then you'll have to do the 14-day managed isolation, just like everyone else.
Lucky L4 is not our only tool then, isn't it.
This it what I ve written elsewhere. Note I am in the business myself.
"While I would be inclined to support the yachties, being one myself, and living in an area where many jobs depend on boating and visitors. However New Zealand has hundreds of thousands asking for exemptions. Including industries that make a lot more than services, to notoriously frugal, cruisers. Every group that is exempted increases the risk, even if by a small amount. At the moment we have totally free movement within NZ, no covid outside isolation, and most of our industries working, unlike the USA. A resurgence puts all that at risk, including the many people, most of NZ, whose jobs depend on keeping covid out. The Government has to draw a line in the sand with our border, somewhere. As the more people we have to quarantine the greater the chances of more outbreaks. It is a numbers game. The more we let in the more risk. I'm an essential worker that travels around NZ. Very pleased our Government has kept covid away from me so far. Unlike similar people in other countries. People I knew in the USA are dead! Those ignoring the rules are somewhat arrogant, to say the least. Just look at the US reaction to those disobeying border rules. Indefinite detention without trial."
In short, "I'm alright Jack … fuck you".
So. We should fuck the entire country and the rest of our workers and businesses that can go to work.
For the benefit of a few.
You can fuck off.
Yeh, cracks me up how RL gets all passionate about groups he cares about but shows zero regard for others.
If we self-identify as "yachties" would he have time for "woke" principles, I wonder 👿
you'd have to buy all them black and queer folk boats mate. If people were getting shot for sailing while black you'd see some action for sure.
By the way there are a huge number of commercial ships crews that have been stuck on board for 17 months or more now. With no shore leave. Including in New Zealand.
On many ships little or no contact with family.
Having accidents after months of 12 hour split shifts.
No one gives a stuff about them. accept to crucify them if something goes wrong.
And you expect me to be worried about a few yachties. Who can fly home and pay a New Zealand crew to sail their boat to Opua, if it is that desperate.
Already pressure from our "poverty stricken" farmers and growers to let their slave labour back in. Not to mention the education sector wanting to resume their student scam. If they all had their way, as National is dog whistling, we would be back to 10’s of thousand of arrivals per month, in private quarantine.
If anyone should be given priority to enter NZ, it should be shore leave and repatriation for the ships crews, that deliver our groceries and depart with our exports.
but they no special.
RL. Personally, I would be better off financially if the yachties were allowed in.
NZ does not have any responsibility to the boaters but we do have a responsibility to those here in NZ.
Living on boats comes with risk. No point whinging about it when those risks call due.
KJT @ 7.49 am Really good explanation of why we should be maintaining our tight line on the borders. Then the government can decide who to let in on what basis and how to handle them. Well said.
"She said she did not want a scenario in which people could not fly into New Zealand but could sail in"
That is the bottom line. The sooner yachties understand this the better.
Yet oddly enough several thousand people are arriving by air each week, all of them a much higher Covid risk.
Kiwis are making total dicks of themselves on this.
You’re comparing people with different entry qualifications, i.e. apples with oranges.
Covid doesn't care about entry qualifications.
Someone who set out to sail across the Pacific is in a very different position to someone who can't fly here. There's your apples and oranges for you.
Several thousand New Zealand citizens and permanent residents are arriving by air each week.
Any New Zealand citizens and permanent residents on yachts in the South Pacific have been free to return at any time. But if they arrive with crew that aren't currently eligible to arrive here considering the pandemic situation, then those crew members won't find a welcome. And if the yacht they arrive on isn't NZ owned etc, then that's problematic too.
No, i think just one, hereabout anyway.
"several thousands per week"might be considered overstating it….
"There was a net gain of 5200 New Zealand citizens between April and August this year, which was partially offset by a net loss of 3500 non-New Zealand citizens, leaving a net gain of 1700 overall."
https://www.interest.co.nz/property/107477/net-population-gain-migration-including-returning-nz-citizens-was-just-1700-five
In what way does someone leaving NZ reduce the total risk. Arrivals are the only number that matter.
and arrivals were 5200 between april and august…hardly several thousands per week.
"Statistics NZ estimated that in the 12 months to August, there was net population gain of 71,500 people from migration, with 98% of that gain occurring over the seven months prior to border restrictions being introduced."
https://www.interest.co.nz/property/107477/net-population-gain-migration-including-returning-nz-citizens-was-just-1700-five
Dunno how they work that. Actual arrivals were around 9000ish June and July, 11000ish August and September.
https://www.customs.govt.nz/covid-19/more-information/passenger-statistics/
interesting…there must be a swarth of 'critical workers' in those totals
If they arrive by air and are NZ citizens of course they permitted entry. The difference is that those coming by boat that are not permitted entry are not NZ citizens. How difficult is that to understand?
In the normal course of events they would have been granted visitor visas. That's what they were relying on when they set out.
If you got on a plane to a country like Australia with automatic visa entry, and half way into your flight the authorities of that country cancelled all entry, arrested you when you landed, put you in prison, deported you and fined you a sum equal to the value of your home, I think you would see this as unreasonable.
That's a gross misrepresentation. They've been made aware they’re not welcome before boarding, not mid-flight.
Circumstances change during travel. It happens. When you became aware that you're not welcome at your next intended destination, you change plans and routes before you leave where you are currently.
Once you depart the Eastern Pacific, the only practical destination for most is going to be Aus/NZ. The route is pretty much predetermined.
Sure it's a long slow flight with many stopovers, and the timetable might change, but the parallel is reasonably apt in my view.
Once you depart the Eastern Pacific, the only practical destination for most is going to be Aus/NZ.
When I was connected to the industry, there were plenty of boats doing all kinds of alternative routes that I was aware of. Sure, they weren't all cushy downwind slides, some of them were long and uncomfortable slogs upwind. But they were doable and were being done.
In the right boat with a strong crew yes. But most short handed cruisers would be exhausted in less than a week.
Sailing upwind is doable for short legs, but for 3 – 4 weeks or more, it's not an option for most. Throw in the constant ocean swell and performance is even worse. Most cruising boats are not set up to do it for long periods, and things start to break.
Yeah, that can happen, too.
There are no guarantees in international travel. Sailors should know this better than anyone.
Are their visitor visas still valid?
If they don't travel here, the visa remains valid until its expiry date, but they can't use the visa to travel to and enter NZ currently. If they travel here and are refused entry, then the visa is cancelled automatically under the Immigration Act.
Qualified medical people are missing their employer funded or tax write off overseas conferences and sabbaticals, overseas holidays, au pairs, school student exchanges and the opportunity to host overseas colleagues. This is a source of bias towards thinking along similar lines. An elderly obese diabetic person would think along different lines I suspect, and rightly so.
The family can fly out of Tahiti- and assumedly could leave their boat there as well or at worse hire a kiwi yacht broker to sail it here and sell it. It's worth $1m.
They may not arrive covid free in NZ if they sailed with one infected person and it was transmitted to others during the voyage.
As for cyclones -this is a fact free zone by the media. The cyclone season is Nov- April. The pacific nations closed borders at the end of March. Boats were assumedly some where safe for the last cyclone season and basically have been unable to move since.
FP has only very limited exposure to cyclones. There has been a lot of links on that.
On a small yatch either everyone has Covid or none at all. Your sequential infection scenario is exceedingly unlikely.
Besides no-one was going to arrive and walk off the boat without testing and quarantine.
The rest of your comment is equally misleading.
"To sail from Tahiti to NZ, as this family will have to do , will take about 20 days so they will not arrive Covid stricken."
Maybe but they could still be carrying covid as latent infection. How many people on board total?
Most yatchs are crewed by a couple. But the usual range of crew is between 1 and 6. More than this would be rare.
As for latent infection, this claim would invalidate the whole basis of quarantine if we took it seriously.
Covid 19 has an incubation period of around 5 days but it can incubate up to 14 days. Symptoms develop at the end of the incubation period. Tbe contagious period begins 2-3 days before symptoms begin and lasts for up to 10 days, or longer if symptoms persist.
With a little bad luck, a sailor could contract covid the day they left, become infectious around day 10 and infect the rest of the crew, experience mild symptoms around day 13 and then recover. The other crew, who may experience no symptoms at all, will likely be contagious as they disembark on day 20.
The other point is that those timeframes are the most probable ones, there will be statistical outliers.
And even if we're talking a solo sailor taking three weeks for the voyage, what if they have it upon arrival or require urgent help from within our rescue area only a part way through their "isolation"? Everyone in the crew compartment would be a close contact, and the chopper is down a crew for the next fortnight. Mostly because the sailor wants to sell their boat for a better price than in the islands.
This scenario is the same basis on which family groups are already treated. Are you telling me that quarantine for 14 days is far too short? You should alert the appropriate medical authorities.
It is not the same because in managed quaratine the original case would be tested on day 3 and 12, and checked daily for symptoms.
In addition, medical authorities do acknowledge that there is a risk that undetected infections may pass through MIQ. This is why only NZ residents are permitted entry and random yachties aren't.
Sighs … yet no-one is proposing that these yachties just get off the boat untested. As a group they've worked to develop a quarantine protocol that makes sense for their situation. In effect they'd be doing two quarantines, one at sea and another when they get here. If that isn't enough for you I don't know what would be.
I struggle to imagine any other group arriving with a lower risk profile than these people, and they'd self isolate on arrival in the safest possible manner. At almost no cost to NZ.
This is why only NZ residents are permitted entry and random yachties aren’t.
This isn't the biggest political issue of the year, but it sure has uncovered just how smugly irrational and mean spirited kiwis have become over their covid situation.
They want to come to New Zealand because they think they can sell their yacht quicker and for more money here.
Given that the alternative for many is going to abandon the boat where it is and likely become a total loss, this seems a reasonable motivation.
All the safe places to store a boat in the Pacific were filled up ages ago.
Their other option is (from the same link):
Not going to be an option for everyone at all.
In order for this to be viable they need visas and funds to stay in FP for that period. Plus somewhere they'll be allowed to anchor long term. And nothing else to go wrong.
It was an option for those Greman chancers that apparently decided instead to do a bandit run and see how it turned out for them (badly, they shoulda stayed where they were).
It's an option for the family at issue right here right now.
So far there hasn't been any of them with a woe is me story for whom it hasn't been an option. I'm gonna need actual evidence to be persuaded it's not option. Vague unbacked assertions won't cut it.
If they are EU citizens (including the UK currently), they can stay and work in Tahiti without special visas. Not much use for the North American travellers obviously.
Then they should have factored a pandemic into their passage plan and activated a contingency plan.
BTW, link for the Harold piece that started the thread:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/newstalk-zb-mike-hosking-leaders-breakfast-jacinda-arderns-vision-for-next-three-years/N7C5TPZEJRIYJK5IAHQA7LFWXA/
ta.
I don't really get it. Is there a reason they can't stay in that part of the Pacific until cyclone season is finished, and then sail back to Europe and sell the yacht there?
They started sailing in Jan, by the end of Feb it was clear we were heading into a pandemic. NZ borders have been closed since mid-march. I appreciate they are grieving, but what have they been doing all year? The complaint about the America's cup is a big rich, given they were pretty much intending to go on holiday for a year. They can put their daughter into school in the Pacific until they can move on.
They started sailing in January 2019 not 2020
The America's cup is part of that whole Auckland exceptionalism thing – they think there might be a few votes in it – but real sailors, not so much. No salt in this govt's blood.
This line from Janet catches my eye.
The blue water yachts sailing the world oceans have annually migrated and brought business to New Zealand…
Sounds like the godwits. These birds have been traversing the globe from time immemorial. They have birdbrains and are most adept at doing what their instincts tell them.
Whereas humans have few instincts, but large brains and we do not seem to be adept at using them to capacity. Pity we are such a failing species that we are taking ourselves down, and the rest of the animal crew on the planet as well who had adapted and knew their limits.
No not like Godwits, every year a different fleet of yachts arrive in the Pacific and many drop down to NZ for cyclone season shelter and boat repairs near the end of the safe sailing season, which is now. Yachts generally sail westwards along what we call the barefoot route.It takes most yachties about 3 years to sail right around the world This family left England in January 2019 . No covid in sight then.
But why is it NZs problem that they cannot now sail on their predetermined course? Why does an exception have to be made for them?
It was understandable for everything to be shut done in the panic when Covid hit NZ. By now things like “yachts” coming into New Zealand should be reconsidered.
Actually the only reason we cannot have more people coming into NZ is because of the limitation of quarantine facilities for air travellers. Anyone arriving on a yacht to any country of the world is not allowed to disembark until a health check of all people on board has been undertaken and they are signed off as OK by a health department doctor. In the current situation , if the people on board did not get a clearance because maybe the signing off doctor thought, despite the time it took to sail here, that the captain and crew may be infectious or may yet become infectious with Covid then everybody stays on board until that clearance is given.
So really NZ could be opened up for yachties to arrive because they will not be needing our quarantining facilities.If they need to quarantine they will stay on their boats.
New Zealand is turning away the good seasonal business that comes with the yachties for no really sensible reason.
With the current case there is a humanatarian aspect.
The only people allowed into NZ are NZ citizens/residents, people on humantiarian grounds, and people that Labour believe bring some kind of urgent economic benefit. The family on the yacht don't fit into any of those categories.
"The family on the yacht don't fit into any of those categories."
Precisely.
It's achingly simple.
yep. If we let in yachties, then why not private jets?
Except humanitarian, they are grief-stricken as their 13 year old son was killed by a yobbo in a small boat in Tahiti who crashed into their yacht and they wish to return home and bury him and give up the cruising dream. I can understand that completely. Bit unfair to say "Harden up ".
We have the author of his story about being held on Manus Island speaking in Nelson soon. If you have a yacht you are entitled to have superior arrangements obviously, to all the other suffering people in the world.
The only people allowed into NZ ….. …. limited to NZ citizens etc because of our limited border / quarantining facilities. The family on the yacht do not need to go into our border quarantine facilities – they can quarantine on board if thought necessary.
Woops, More news from today’s NZ Herald…
“New Zealand's door has been opened to overseas students again “
As (next headline) “Global infections surge – a million new cases in three days”
Sorry yachties
250 post-grad students who already had visas and didn't make it here before the borders closed in March.
Does anyone know if rescues are still being carried out at sea?
I would want to know if a cyclone damaged my yacht and I was left drifting.
It is nice of Judith to have a photo OP with the man they are replacing her with after the election. I wonder if they have been discussing her big golden parachute exit out of parliament?
Once Collins is no longer the leader she will probably bailout. Her brand is not the future of National and the election result will consolidate this.
Who wants to sit in opposition calling out to get noticed?
It's an interesting question, the future of National.
Some might argue that they don't have one, at least not as they are.
The Luxon waiting in the wings doesn't seen to have any splendid new ideas, and there's no sign thus far of them going to the mattresses to sort out what they stand for that the public could conceivably swallow.
Dreadful shame – and all on the public's tab.
My crystal ball says no future on being in government on the 18th.
Nothing will change with the National caucus being united. Also a leadership change before the 2023 election.
.
To buttress his argument that "a 4% swing from Labour to National or ACT in the last two weeks" of the current election campaign is certainly achievable (and thus "there is a credible path to victory for National") ,David Farrar cites polling evidence from the final stages of the 2002 campaign, suggesting the "Govt (ie Labour) dropped 5% from 46% to 41% in last two weeks".
What DPF doesn't mention is that in the same Colmar Brunton, the National Party Opposition suffered an even steeper plunge from 27% down 6 points to 21% over those same final 2 weeks.
In other words, far from the gap closing .. Labour's lead over the Nats during those final few weeks in 2002 opened up a little by 1.4 points. There was no "5% swing" from Govt to Oppo.
https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2020/10/over-interpreting_a_sarky_tweet.html
# Lies, damned lies, and statistics
Heh. He failed to notice that?? Maybe he noticed, then went straight into denial. False hope is better than no hope.
Still I never like the thought of tightrope walking. I would like to have seen planned electorate party voting by the Greens and Labour, in a keen left electorate, to be sure of one in Green hands. Pragmatic and legal, politics is the art of the possible etc.
Yes, strategic planning is unknown on the left still. The electorate is viewed as a market, so party providers are meant to promote their brands separately. Gambling on faith. Whereas the right get that democracy is a game, so to win you must figure out how best to game the system – not that they're much good at this in Aotearoa currently!
Politics as a sport. If we openly treated it as such, showing how people have allegiances with the brand and the team, we would understand why there is often little intellectual power put into the process and understand the outcome better.
Media certainly cover it that way.
Swordfish….but that doesn't mean it won't happen this time….and if the Greens get 4.9% Standardistas could wake up to Crusher as PM and ACT with 5 cabinet posts.
Based on current polls, the route to that happening would need 1% or 2% of the electorate shifting from Green to Labour, and a massive exodus of Labour voters to Nat.
Former Green voters aren't gonna go anywhere but to Labour (unless the nutter faction in Greens is waaay bigger than I thought and they go to Billy Te Kookiha). So if they do bail, then the 47%ish Labour are showing in the polls goes up closer to 50% vs a combined NACT vote around 40%.
To lift NACT above Labour, nearly 1 in 10 voters currently planning to vote Labour would need to swap to Nat. Disregarding the fact that over a quarter of the electorate has already voted.
To be fair, we were saying the same thing when the margins were the other way.
An interesting concept that may have real possibilities although it contains a potential difficulty with the EU and its in house factions.
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/were-not-even-close-to-our-nuclear-free-moment
Action Station's director explains change praxis to progressives (in the hope that they learn to make it happen instead of just talking about it): https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/12-10-2020/moving-the-rock-an-election-manifesto-for-people-led-change/
So this is a community-building praxis, in which like-minded communities operate as social organisms. They appeared in our media during the latter half of the 1960s. I went on a HART demo in 1970 after several years of resolutely refusing to be a joiner, and remember how alien it felt – being part of a group of strangers.
In the pandemic era infection teaches us there's danger in such groups. Praxis of how to drive group process to make progress happen has to become more sophisticated in response. Non-local communities are now how humans exercise social agency.
The praxis is gnosised.
Through pedagogy?
I had a call from a woman representing the National Party
after my "/lol you are calling the wrong person "
she assured me it was just a call to remind me to vote –
" already have thank you have a good evening"
It gave me a good chuckle
To be fair Labour does it too. I was part of numerous phone campaigns in past years. Asking people to get out and vote was the opening gambit then you took it from there – depending on the recipient's response.
I gave up doing it because too many people were rude and just hung up. Looking back I don't blame them.
Am hearing JA had Hoskings eating out of her hand this morning.
I posted about this interview last week. Good to see JA's team did the right thing and got her in studio.
Shoring up his revenue streams for the next 3 years by stepping back from going full troppo?
Totally, the hosk is a very predictable shill for the right. His power comes from a medium we all know is dying out along with it’s audience.
Michele A'Court describes the sheeple styling of wimping out, then gets proactive:
Those Green Fairies sound like great ladies. For all the female elderly arthritic ladies and gents mustn't forget them, and those who have anxiety and stress in their lives young or old bring it on. Being a reformed non drinker for health reasons a calming balm of the devil's lettuce sounds a pretty good thing to me. Kicking back at the end of the day – when I miss my drink the most – would be wonderful. I am good at growing vegies etc in the garden and have successfully grown the most amazing specimen of the devil's lettuce once upon a time, it was wondrous to behold, I am looking forward to cultivating a couple of the plants in the corner of my garden when this reform becomes law.
Bless these Green Fairies for they are the salt of the earth.
Why is there not an option for medicinal cannabis?
My weeping gut cannot take meds for arthritic pain in several places and when the pain gets so debilitating I would like the option of smoking away the pain.
When it comes to being stoned when driving I am wavering being a yes vote for legalising cannabis. Screening for being stoned is not up to the mark. The strength and 14 grams is an issue for me as well. Most other reasons to legalise can be worked around. The end of life choice is a yes.
I am a bit stumped for the first time in voting for 40 years on giving Labour my electorate vote. I might just do a party vote this time around.
Like you I have erosive gastritis and arthritis. The gut wont take anti-inflammatories so I just take fish oil and glucosomine and its amazing how pain tolerant one can become. I have had foot surgery and a knee replacement but I still do get out and walk and keep fit. I think there will be some leeway with driving. Its not like the elderly will be stoned witless every day. As for the euthanasia bill its a big no for me. Just can't get my head around it. Like taxes, laws are just waiting to be changed, altered, got around, loopholed you name it. So its a big nono for me. However this will be an interesting election I must say.
Hi Treetop, re cannabis.
To date, probably the best piece I've seen this election, that examines both sides of the story was Paddy Gowers last week. Here's the link
There was also a good debate on the subject between Chloe Swarbrick and dr custard (aka nick smith).
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2020/08/cannabis-referendum-chloe-swarbrick-and-nick-smith-get-fired-up-over-cannabis.html
Mum disclosed she voted yes for cannabis the other day, she's a conservative person in her late 70's, originally she was going to vote no. Same with the old man, almost fell over when he said he voted yes, he's always been fiercely anti weed.
Hope that is of help and all the best making your decision. How lucky are we that we get to have choices, yay for referendums 🙂
The shit doctors prescribe (enough to knock a horse out) or cause a serious addiction is a worry.
Did you see that from 5 November a prescription is required for codine?
I only take pain meds when I cannot get up using my own steam, cannot turn over without waking up or close to chucking from a headache.
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Barely acknowledged, if at all by commentators … the last Reid Research Poll found a whopping 21% of 2017 –Nats– planning to swing to –Labour–.
Not surprising, of course, given the significant re-alignment suggested by all the post-COVID Lockdown polls … but it's worth pointing out just how massive this is … means around 242k Nats have moved to Labour (putting aside questions of turnout).
By comparison, at the last two Turnover Elections (ie where a change of Govt occurred), only around 94k Labour voters swung to the Nats in 2008, while about 105k Nats moved to Labour in 2017.
The closest we've come to something on this scale (assuming it eventuates) was in 2002 when 112k Nats swung to Labour (representing a little over 17% of 1999 Nat voters).
Give them something to vote for and they will come eh!. Go on cleaving through the Slough of Despond and we can see off some of the crippling rentiers and con corporates and private equity outfits with our own versions. Use the attackers own weapons, hoist them on their own petards.
Someone worthy to vote for is my take on That.
People generally don't like the low blows that Collins eminates like a spoilt child who doesn't get her whey will mean she will be put out to pasture ,being a negative ninny like whinny means he is dog tucker.
Great comment Trickledown – lots of nuances.
Swordfish…do you have any data on how many 18-25's are enrolled this election compared with the last?
Also, I'm guessing the percentage of enrolled 18-25's that will turn up and vote is likely to be higher due to the cannabis issue. The Green's will benefit from this.
Oct 2020
Age 18-24 … 72.4% enrolled (326k)
2017
Age 18-24 … ? % enrolled (333k)
Thanks Swordfish much appreciated…even if that wasn't the answer I wanted.
I thought this time there would be more.
Mind you, 2020 stats are, of course, pre-election … 2017 were post-election (over 94,000 (of all ages) enrolled over the final 3 days before 2017 election day). So if similar last minute surge then final 2020 tally for 18-24 yo may well exceed 2017.
Ah you just made my day….very 18-24 to enrol so late.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/123047516/election-2020-hopes-for-higher-voter-turnout-as-more-than-585000-people–cast-their-ballot-early
Cheers … Serves me right for going to the official Elections.NZ site … they're clearly a little behind the times.
Last Updated 9 Oct.
25-29 year-olds clearly higher enrolment than 18-24.
Let's imagine the Greens come out of this election strong enough that they can ram through a wealth tax. What does everybody think will then happen in 2023, and the fate of the wealth tax after the next change in government?
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/428115/ruling-out-conversation-on-wealth-tax-not-credible-shaw
Firstly, I don’t think the Greens will be in a position to ram through anything. In any case, this will have to be dealt with during the post-election talks between parties.
Secondly, it is not in their nature [pardon the pun] to try a ram through anything.
Insisting on a conversation is not equal to ‘ramming through’, IMHO.
On past form they may insist on a public education campaign between now and 2023, if that's not too much trouble Jacinda.
Ok then, let's assume the polite and respectful conversation they insist on having results in a wealth tax being implemented over the many statements so far from Labour that it ain't gonna happen.
What does everybody think will then happen in 2023, and the fate of the wealth tax after the next change in government?
In that case I guess we know that you'll vote Nact who will promise to throw it out to gain votes from the likes of you.
AmIright?
Very unlikely, but not impossible.
What would need to happen for that is Labour looking tired, out of ideas, and authoritarian, and Greens to still be stuffed full of social activists and woo-meisters with very few actual grounded greens. Kinda like 2008, only worse.
But of the people in my circles that are currently going Labour or Greens, I'd tend more to be one of the later ones to switch. Most of the others will flip somewhat more easily.
Perhaps you will keep on watching what happens in the USA Andre and advise us on what to do so we turn the opposite way. Or perhaps you will go back and give them the benefit of your excellent analytical skills that you have honed here.
Ah, so you want to do a thought experiment? Seems a bit abstract to me.
As said above, the Greens are unlikely to try and ram anything through, politely or otherwise. What Shaw is saying is that they will bring the wealth tax to the table during negotiations. I assume this includes the GMI and the ACC reforms and so on, they're not wanting a tax for tax' sake. And I take the positioning this week to be about not letting Labour treat them like some rag tags who will do as they are told. Which is a good thing, to stand up to that.
Personally I think Lab should just give them the welfare portfolio. Sepuloni obviously isn't managing it well, and Labour can let the Greens do the heavy lifting on it for a while. The Greens aren't going to get all their policy enacted off the vote this year, but it's completely reasonable to bring the whole policy to the table and say this is our starting point, these things are very important, and remember it's the members who decide if we form govt with you or let you come to us on each piece of legislation for the next three years while we are on the cross benches.
this is more succinct,
https://twitter.com/MJWhitehead/status/1315459250051661824
If that comes about and the other areas brought to the fore are actual green topics, then I'd consider that a win. But it would be a win somewhat tempered by the apparent shortage at the top of the Greens list of actual green talent and substance to take advantage of it.
you still seem to be under the mistaken impression that the Green Party is only meant to be about the environment, as if that is somehow separate from human social and economic wellbeing.
But green politics has always been about the intersections of environmental and social justice.
Getting NZers out of poverty is a climate priority. Does that really need explaining?
meanwhile the Greens, after change not power, are yet again pulling NZ in the right direction. They've been doing that on climate and other environmental issues for decades and I don't see that has changed much, it's just that the policies are integrated more I guess. But shifting the debate on welfare is huge.
Well spoken Weka-there is too much tribal Labour and Jacinda worship being used to justify voting for Labour, rather than debate about the policies.
In particular the Wealth Tax is a good idea but clearly would benefit by being modified/fine-tuned, perhaps so that it only targets the top 4% rather than 6% as now, so that it can gain more widespread support.
For me to support it, the Green Party needs to balance a strong green focus with those other aspects. Right now, that balance isn't there because the green side of things is very weak and way under-represented. I'm not interested in a radical social activism party that's trying to pretend to be something else by holding a Green tissue paper in front of themselves.
The Green Party can make their philosophy and politics about whatever they want it to be. But if they don't have an actual strong green focus, they shouldn't expect to attract votes from those whose actual interest is green issues just by calling themselves Green.
And no, moving people up out of poverty doesn't automatically improve the climate or environment. In fact, to first order, by itself it might even make climate and environment issues worse, because those people will likely consume more. Making environmental and climate improvements needs actual work and priority on those topics, not self-delusion that social activism somehow also magically creates climate and environmental improvement.
The party weeps copious tears at this news.
They're welcome to.
But if they're interested in why their vote share falls short of their hopes and dreams and previous highs, my view is there for the consideration. And I know there's other sometime Green voters with similar views. I couldn't say how common they are outside my circles tho, we could just be weirdos. Or not.
Andre we've got the message that you hate the Greens. Time to move on.
@Andre
It's OK, most Green supporters are not as self-absorbed as you are.
"But if they're interested in why their vote share falls short of their hopes and dreams and previous highs, my view is there for the consideration."
This seems reasonable and I would assume they are looking at why previous green voters are still voting Labour after 2017. But I think the reasons are complex. I doubt it's primarily the wealth tax, which would affect so few NZers. I think it's more likely to be a combination of the Ardern effect, along with a smaller party having been successful in pulling the larger party closer to its own platform and no longer standing out.
Lots of people won't see a huge amount of difference between Lab and Green and will vote on feels (they like JA). Those that look at policy more in depth will shy away from the welfare stuff, not because of the woke thing so much as most liberals in NZ are centre left and happy with neoliberalism.
There is probably a hang over from 2017 of perception of competence (Shaw's Green School gaff won't have helped), along with lots of new faces that people don't know.
Then there is covid, and I have no doubt that there is both the effect of thinking Labour handled it well, and people being afraid and wanting stability and centrism rather than radical change.
Weird thing for me this week is seeing a number of actual lefties saying to vote GP when they've been slagging them off all year. Don't quite know how that is supposed to work, they want people to suddenly think the GP are a good bet?
don't know what you are on about Andre. Leaving aside the referends, there are 8 major policies currently on the campaign part of the website, and 5 of them are environment focused,
Here are the three top priorities this year, that will feature in any post-election negotiations,
"And no, moving people up out of poverty doesn't automatically improve the climate or environment."
No-one actually said it would though, you just made that up.
"In fact, to first order, by itself it might even make climate and environment issues worse, because those people will likely consume more."
Which is why the Green Party has an integrated set of policies based on systems thinking, not reductionist, linear, solve this problem then that one thinking.
"Making environmental and climate improvements needs actual work and priority on those topics, not self-delusion that social activism somehow also magically creates climate and environmental improvement"
Fuck sake, get a grip and go read some actual policy as well as what they've been doing for the past three years.
I have some problems with some of the GP positioning on things woke too. Their rigid stance on gender ID is very risky given what is happening in the UK were left wing women voters are basically now at war with the Labour Party. I just don't think that throwing the baby out with the bath water will help. On climate alone, there are compelling reasons to vote Green, not least is that Labour have no commitment to acting in time.
as for the party list, the point there is that everyone is on board with eco and social and economic. Everyone. So eg Ricardo Menendez will be supporting the enviro stuff while he works on his area of social justice, because he understands the connection between the two.
Personnel is policy.
Vagueish short documents can always be interpreted and implemented in a wide variety of ways.
Manifesto policies that don't align with a pollies actual interests tend to get a token once-over to satisfy the notion that they're trying to implement the policy before finding their way to the too-hard basket.
But the stuff that gets that pollies juices going, that gets a lot of attention and effort whenever it can somehow get related to the manifesto.
Looking at the personnel at the top of the Greens list, I see very little actual green talent and substance, so I have little confidence serious green efforts will be made. But I see a lot of background and experience and enthusiasm for social activism I'm meh about, but I think it's very likely that's where the effort and enthusiasm will go.
As for the last three years, one of the very few individuals that had actual green talent and substance has retired and isn't standing this time around.
yet in the top five are the Minister for Climate, the Minister for Conservation and Associate Minister of Transport. Are they the ones not enthused about their portfolio?
Have a look at Hughes' portfolios, not a lot of enviro stuff there.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Party_of_Aotearoa_New_Zealand
Unless of course we acknowledge that the GP build the enviro stuff into all their policies.
But Weka, that would require Andre actually reading the Green's policies. He is obsessed with the Wealth Tax, in part because he will have to pay some extra tax because of it.
Let them eat cake eh Andre?
There is always Vernon Tava's party if you don't want your greenery with a side of social justice.
Vernon Tava … … good one .
I'm not averse to a side of social justice with my greenery, but I'm not keen on a heaping helping of social activism and moral superiority with a tiny sprinkling of ineffectual green on top to hide it.
Andre ACT and Nstional will tax the poor more.
Yep. So that's a good reason to not hand them a really powerful weapon they can use to grab power back in 2023.
Almost 1.2 million have already voted…heading for a very high turnout?
https://vote.nz/voting/get-ready-to-vote/about-the-2020-general-election/?ref=vote-cta-1
Could be a higher turnout or higher early vote percentage than forecast or both. I hope it's both personally.
https://twitter.com/nzbenedict/status/1315452455124045824
Clearly a Nat/Lab voter, ole Kate. Does a chair speak for the org or not? Depends which way the political wind is blowing. I suspect members have been blowing up a bit of a storm in the general direction of her…
No idea about her politics, but deeply unprofessional to stake out such a firm stance without supporting analysis.
The College of GPs by contrast respected the diversity of opinion amongst their members all along: https://rnzcgp.org.nz/RNZCGP/Advocacy/Cannabis_referendum.aspx
and then the ensuing justifications for being sloppy and loose with the truth.
Do you put the increase in early voting just down to avoiding an unknown community case of Covid – 19?
Tory hack John Armstrong:
Blimey, even the devious Mr.Armstrong is abandoning the sinking ship.
Trubble ut mill lad?
Trying to con voters into not bothering to turn out.
" Barack Obama, Justin Trudeau and Emmanuel Macron each, like Ardern, spoke the language of “hope” and “change”. Yet, ultimately, all further entrenched a poisonous status quo "
Glen Johnson from Al Jazeera has summed up politics in New Zealand very succinctly.
Why can't this be replicated through out our MSM.
https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2020/10/11/new-zealand-elections-4/
True.
Campaign farce … Says Judith today,
" We don't do wussy stuff in the National Party,"
On border protection from Judith today more yeah..nah.. confusion.
"She said lockdowns led by the border protection agency and minister in charge should be the last resort."
On introducing new, unknown road tolls, Judith negates the whole point of better roading,
" People don't mind, because they have the alternative.
"People can always go the slower way," she said. "
And for her claims, the only party with a tech plan, which then has a tech blunder, Judith ices the "pick me cake",
" About National's ad error, Collins said it was a digital error that was fixed quickly and was now fine. She put the blame on the "digital people"."
Ah, those digital people ay, they keep fecking up Natz great tech policy.
And when you are short on answers to the media's questions today, after ' re-introducing' the same tech policy and probably some more tolls for Auckland roads, Judith looks to her inner Trump mentor,
" I think we just out work, out compete and basically be far more fabulous than [anyone] on the other side."
Jesus she's thick
Actually there's not much between her and Billy T K.
They both just start spouting utter rubbish when challenged; totally illogical garbage with not a trace of ignominy or flicker of embarrassment.
Crushless Collins Born to rule attitude stinks and pisses everyone off.
Last ditchDesperately throwing lies around which makes her look evil and even more unlikable.
NZ is going to ditch the …….
What brilliant observations by Glen Johnson from Al Jazeera. Shows up our local media. Listened briefly to something on Newshub of some sort of discussion between their women reporters. They were like a group of 14 year old teenage girls as they giggled about someone's birthday cake.
Sean Plonker can't understand why the PM doesn't want a bar of Magicktalk. Why can't snoflake Plonker's listeners join the team of 5 million? whines Sean. Maybe they could try a different station.
If almost half of voters have already voted, doesn't that make a nact turnaround in this last week about twice as hard an ask?
#heartbroken lol
Shhh, don't tell St. Jude the patron saint of lost causes that she has an actual lost cause on her hands. We don't want her to give up. I'm quite enjoying the show as it's currently playing out.
I have had enough of Trump and I cannot wait to see the back of him. His BS and his unconvincing leadership style is in a category on its own.
Collins will be remembered for the leader who got the job that no one wanted because of a party coming apart.
And on and on Red Logix goes – sail away I say. What about spending
six months on a leaky boat and we'll just trudge along without you.
And as for people arriving by air. We want to keep our airline going, on a lesser level no doubt in the future, fewer tourists etc. But to do that we have to use it and have return passengers. Comparing our airline entries and exits with people who own their own boats with lives separate from being permanent NZ citizens on land, is spurious.
Or do you think they will put their backs into becoming transport for our people and visitors – a sort of Dunkirk. That would earn them some brownie points here. But actually they need to shelter here don't they, so they have little structural value to us in a time of crisis.