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Open mike 21/06/2019

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, June 21st, 2019 - 182 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

182 comments on “Open mike 21/06/2019 ”

  1. A 1


    The ordeal had left them feeling intimidated and bullied and had been “financially crippling”.

    • WeTheBleeple 1.1

      What a vile dirtbag. Just being in proximity is enough to put a target on you. They must need the money for more lawyers cos people say mean things about her.

    • AB 1.2

      There will be lots more of this. Faced with a systemic threat (climate change), the wealthy will frantically protect what they have by attempting to shift costs – either onto other citizens through lawsuits or onto the taxpayer. There will be no sense of collectively confronting the problem by everyone taking a hit in proportion to their ability to do so. Expect ugly sh*tfights all over the place.

      • greywarshark 1.2.1

        Thanks AB. Intelligent thought-provoking comment from you as usual. I can understand that this will happen.

        • Adrian

          Noithing to do with climate change, if you knew anything about those cliffs you would know that they have been eroding into the sea for millennia because they are young shitty soils with hardly any rock or consolidated material in them.
          Still doesn’t stop Collins being a self-entitled arse of the first order, i’m surprised she hasn’t started a GoFundMe page like that other dickhead of the week Folau.

          I get pissed off with stupidity that equates almost everything that happens anywhere with climate change, it is dog whistling idiocy.

          • WeTheBleeple

            My favorite is those using climate change to wedge veganism into the conversation

            Have you heard about climate change?

            That's why I'm a vegan!*

            *not an actual vegan.

          • greywarshark

            Come on Adrian – climate change will result in more extreme weather events, and more prolonged. Falling cliffs in Nelson are both a result of the geology you refer to, badly controlled stormwater using gravity to clear it instead of piping it properly, and the undermining that has caused and then the ground being saturated by rivers of it going down the cliffs when there are weather bombs.

            So save your ire, bottle it and produce a nice drop of something called Adrian's Piss or some more amusing name, that gets given to everybody who comes to the news who is doing good CC stuff in your opinion! It would be a good way of catching people's attention to what is needed and what is being done by forward-looking people like yourself.

      • James Thrace 1.2.2

        A letter writer in the DomPost this morning tells of Simon Bridges visiting Karori Primary school, and in response to a question on Climate Change "you kids don't need to worry about it"

        The letter writer then goes to say what a lack of leadership this showed.

  2. Muttonbird 3

    Surge On Key grows more authoritarian and crooked as time goes on.

    National flag: Former PM John Key would now bypass referendum and just choose new ensign


    Remember when, upon losing, he packed a sad and flew out to Hawaii? 😂

    • CHCoff 3.1

      The 5th column yesterday was trying to take away NZ's Added Value of the top world cup cricket game yesterday, by making it all about our sides so called 'cheating' of the match, in what was widely seen as the best cricket game so far (probably before the NZ Bangladesh game) and which saw NZ back atop the cricket world cup table again.

      Today it's a John Key NZ flag…

      • Herodotus 3.1.1

        And "yesterday" it was the ANZ former boss being reimbursed $3.35MILLION in 8 years expenses. Who can spend that amount over the period ? And from my experience the board would be signing these expenses off i.e. They were in full knowledge of these.

        With NZHerald fascination with Key junior (I will not for taste add links).

        Re Cricket- if the keeper did not know has was someone 20+meters away to know ?? There are some sour miserable people out there. Life has enough problems, we need to "Always look on the Bright Side of Life …."


    • ianmac 3.2

      Surely Sir John is not trying to distract from the calls about his leadership of a certain Bank? Nah. He wouldn't do that.

    • AB 3.3

      I wish the fatuous little man-child had done that. He would have been torn limb from limb (metaphorically speaking). With luck this comment will accelerate the creeping sense of shame that people now feel about the mad years of Key-idolatry.

      • cleangreen 3.3.1

        John Key is a cancer on NZ.

      • alwyn 3.3.2

        Perhaps. Actually what he would have been doing would have been to implement the 2014 Labour Party Policy on having a new flag. The said that they would consult with experts on the form of the new flag but they didn't allow for the possibility of having a referendum on the matter. There was going to be a new flag.

        Of course they got slaughtered in the election that year so perhaps that was the reason.

        • Muttonbird

          You already have a reputation for fake news. Don't make it worse. 😂

          • alwyn

            "fake news"? In your dreams baby, in your dreams.

            You just don't want to remember the truth. Mind you, as soon as Angry Andy got into the top job he quickly rewrote history and pretended it had never been their policy.

            The same way as Grant and Whats-her-name have done over their promises about not increasing taxes. Or Phil and the 100,000 affordable houses. The billion trees. Or the claim they were going to improve the health system. and so on and on and on and on. b*s the lot.

            • McFlock

              As usual, wormtongue is speaking a half-truth. Labour's policy from 2014:

              The New Zealand Flag
              Labour will:
              review the design of the New Zealand flag involving flag design experts and with full public consultation and involvement.

              We believe that the time has come for a change and it is right for the issue to be put to the public. We would however support the ability of the RSA and similar organisations to continue to fly the current flag if they so wish. New Zealand changed its national anthem from ‘God Save the Queen’ on a gradual, optional basis and that process worked.

              True, they didn't stipulate "referendum". But nor did they say it was a done deal, or that it would only be left up to the review panel to make the call. They stated their position and said the issue should be put to the public.

              • alwyn

                Wow. McCockie accuses me of a "half-truth".

                How would you describe someone who, before the election states that ""There will be no new taxes or levies introduced in our first term of government beyond those we have already announced."

                And then increases the rates of those taxes that already exist, justifying this by such statements as "but that isn't a tax, it's a levy" or "It wasn't a new tax, it is just an increase in an existing one".

                I suppose you wouldn't even call those half-truths would you. When they are statements by your mates they are all completely above board?

                I would call them lies but I was brought up rather more honestly than the idiots in our Government.

                • McFlock

                  Says the dude who misrepresented Labour's 2014 flag policy and then threw a whole pile of other crap rather than explain how he wasn't a liar.

    • Jenny - How to Get there? 3.4

      So John Key in hindsight wishes he had been more like Donald Trump and ruled us more dictatorially, and imposed his commercially approved tramp stamp on us, against our will, whether we liked it or not.

      National flag: Former PM John Key would now bypass referendum and just choose new ensign


      Changing the National flag?

      We dodged a bullet on that one.

      Changing the flag was not a progressive Left movement but a Right Wing one.

      Changing the flag was a Right Wing initiative springing from the business community, the Auckland Chamber Of Commerce, the Business Round Table, and the ACT Party alongside all the other right wing neo-liberal free trade supporters wanting to suck up to Chinese and other big trading powers who might be suspicious that we harboured some secret hidden links to that old defunct trading monopoly known as the British Empire.

      A historic reminder of a history the Right want to keep hidden

      Against John Key and business community's wishes we chose to retain the current flag, along with its symbol of the British Empire on it.

      One of the reasons for keeping this historic reminder of our colonial past, at least for Maori, was that the Treaty of Waitangi had been signed with the political representatives of the British Crown, Maori were uneasy that removing that historic symbolism would weaken that constitutional link. (Every depiction of the signing of the Treaty of Waitangi the Union Jack is highly visible.) Antipathy to the Treaty signed between the British Empire and Maori as equals, which white supremacists like Hobson's Pledge take as a personal affront may well have been another motivating factor for the Right's move to abolish the current flag

      So despite living in what we like to think is an independent modern republic we still carry the symbol of our historical colonial servitude.

      Long may it remain so. As a reminder that the money men who wanted to change our flag, were motivated by a venal desire to sell us into new subservient relationship to big foreign trading and commercial interests.

      From Imperial Ensign to National Flag

      The current New Zealand flag, as well as the Australian national flag, were first designed as a naval ensigns to distinguish colonial vessels in maneuvers with the British navy. (The reason they look so alike is that for practical purposes the British navy did not need to know exactly what colony these ships were from, just that they were from the colonies.)
      In all major land and naval engagements in the First and Second Word Wars New Zealand fought under the Union Jack. The one recorded exception was in the battle of the River Plate, where before the commencement of battle junior officers on the Achilles retrieved the New Zealand Ensign from the signals cupboard and flew it from the ship's mast.

      The Rebel Flag

      The New Zealand ensign, despite all its colonial and imperial baggage is a rebel flag. For most of the 20th Century the official flag of New Zealand was the Union Jack just as the official anthem was God Save The Queen. It was only when Britain entered the European Union and abandoned New Zealand as a favoured trading partner our passive aggressive response was to (finally), officially drop the Union Jack as our nation's flag and replace it with New Zealand Ensign.

      We already have another flag

      It was notable that during the flag debate the business community were able to get their, (unofficial and unloved), flag flown from the Auckland Harbour Bridge for a full month. Where as the officially recognised indigenous flag the Tino Rangatiratanga flag is only allowed to b flown there for one day a year.

      I can't wait for the day when we proudly fly both flags from the Auckland Habour Bridge all year.

      It's the right thing to do.

      We should be like Bolivia, which has two flags of equal rank, the indigenous Wiphala flag, and the flag of the republic of Bolivia.


  3. fustercluck 4

    So, Nicky Hager's attempt to smear the reputation of NZ soldiers has collapsed. Turns out there were not only insurgents but insurgent leaders on a catch/kill list present in the village at the time of the firefight. It turns out that Hager was pushing for rapid publication of the book even as his co-author was investigating contradictory information. This puts Hager squarely into the category of propagandist rather than journalist. I wonder if the left will repudiate one of their most favoured sons.

    • mauī 4.1

      So you have evidence that civilians were not killed then? As Hager says the new information straight from the Taliban confirms that civilians were killed.

      And if you’re going to call out others for being propagandists, best to have a watertight grasp of the facts first.

      • fustercluck 4.1.1

        Civilian deaths in war are both inevitable and, when taking place within legally defined rules of engagement, entirely within the laws of war. War sucks, to be sure, but it does not follow that soldiers who unfortunately kill civilians in the course of their duties are guilty of any crime at all.

        • mauī

          Shooting up a civilian village was inevitable? …strange for a country that's biggest involvement was providing a reconstruction team.

          • fustercluck

            It is inevitable that civilians will be put at risk when wanted insurgent leaders hide amongst them. War is terrible and these outcomes are an inevitable consequence of counterinsurgency.

            • McFlock

              Well, no, a "faulty gunsight" killing someone isn't "inevitable". If it's a realistic danger, you assume it has happened. That's why weapons get pointed in safe directions, even if you think they are unloaded or on "safe". So someone fucked up there.

              Killing an unarmed person with a rifle isn't "inevitable".

              Firing rockets at a village isn't "inevitable".

              Killing or injuring 20-odd civilians to hit maybe, maybe, one "insurgent" isn't "inevitable".

              But at least an RPG and an AK47 were captured. Drastically limited the number of Taliban weapons in the country, that did.

        • Psycho Milt

          …it does not follow that soldiers who unfortunately kill civilians in the course of their duties are guilty of any crime at all.

          Depends, doesn't it? That's why you have investigations – you know, like the one we're having now. And, of course, Hager and Stephenson wouldn't have had to write a book about it if there'd been a proper investigation in the first place, rather than something conducted by the organisation that killed the civilians.

          Still, nice of right-wingers to highlight their views on it being fine to kill civilians as long as it's our side doing it. Lots of wannabe Reinhard Heidrich's out there, obviously, so that's good to know.

          • fustercluck

            Well, aptly named Psycho, you are guilty of using a straw man fallacy there. I never said it was "fine" to kill civilians. I merely said it happens in the terrible fog of war and it is not a criminal act when it happens within legally defined rules of engagement. But if it makes you feel better to put words in the mouths of others and to then argue with those self-placed words, that is "fine" with me.

        • Instauration

          "catch/kill list" – is a fallacious and illegal construct.

          fustercluck – please explain why anyone pursuing such activity in Afghanistan is not just a plain old criminal – differentiated by law from those they seek – how ?

    • WeTheBleeple 4.2

      Hmm, lemme get this straight. Hagar didn't have all the information upon time of writing – thus is dishonest?

      As the two writers disagreed on publication date due to emerging information, Hager is 'making stuff up' (propagandist, dishonest?).

      If you'd ever done a piece of non-fiction writing in your life (I see no evidence to support this) you'd know that you can keep rewriting forever and publish nothing, or, at some point, present what you have to date. It's not an easy jump off point. Hager has previously published, and won awards for it, and he made a call.

      I see no evidence of deliberate misleading or obfuscation of any truths. I see no evidence of spin (except the media). I'd much rather hear from the Judges ruling and also Hager's take of this emerging evidence. You will find he's quite ready to take on facts, unlike some.

      If there wasn't a side of society that is morally bankrupt we wouldn't need reporters like Hagar that put themselves in the firing line of powerful entities and a general public with a large proportion composed of petty little pissants like yourself who just want ammo to slag off anyone they percieve as left.

      But your pitiful pissy sore picking pedantry is merely an echo of beloved leader Simon, he of the moral outrage, the sound bite, the dribble. Facts? Not so much.

      • fustercluck 4.2.1

        "Pitiful pissy sore picking pedantry" Superb alliteration.

        I think there is abundant evidence, just on the face of the matter, that Hager accepted a version of events from the villagers that was potentially self-serving and overtly damning of NZDF without fully exploring alternative scenarios. There are many, many conflicting motivations that are obvious to anyone with a passing familiarity of the complex nature of the region. Why were these not fully explored before rushing to publication? A reporter must treat every witness with scepticism, even those for whom they feel great sympathy. Hager failed in this regard and thus reveals himself to be more of a propagandist than a credible journalist.

        • WeTheBleeple

          "It can’t have been easy for the New Zealand Defence Force (NZDF) and their political leaders to deny the results of a botched military intervention in which 21 civilians were killed or wounded. The task becomes next to impossible in the face of testimonies from survivors and witnesses and the local government documents listing the names of the killed and wounded. When such evidence is fact-checked against the known coordinates and timeline of the operation, only one conclusion seems plausible: the official deniers inhabit an alternative world beyond the reach of inquiry, research, proof, disproof and argumentation."


          The Daily Bog gets it. You are just a dead eyed dog whistling dickhead.

          [lprent: And you are a witless arse dragger with hemorrhoids putrefying as they bounce on the ground as you walk.

          Rein it in or I will assist you out ]

          • fustercluck

            The USA has already suggested a faulty gunsight on an attack helicopter could have contributed to the outcome. When you consider that these machines fire an abundance of explosive 30mm rounds, the terrible toll on civilian life is not too difficult to understand. The implication of the public understanding of the Hager narrative is that NZDF forces were directly, personally responsible for shooting these civilians. This was never, ever supported by facts, even in the earlier versions of the story. I think that one problem is the fact that most NZers do not know anyone in the military and thus find it easy to accept the murderous cowboy narrative offered up by Hager, et al. I suggest, Bleep, that you take the time to get to know some officers and enlisted personnel who actually put on battle rattle and go into harms way on our behalf. I think the experience would be edifying.

            • WeTheBleeple

              I have several members of family in the military, some quite high up.

              You make all sorts of assumptions in your statements.

              "the terrible toll on civilian life is not too difficult to understand"

              Actually, it is. And admitting mistakes is orders of magnitude more acceptable than denying everything. Was it a vendetta? That's for the judge to decide.

              • fustercluck

                I certainly did make assumptions, Bleep. And I do not believe you about family in the military. A conversation with somebody "high up" would have cleared up your mistaken perceptions long ago. And it appears there was a military inquiry shortly after the event as is the case with every incident like this and it further appears that the side of the story put forward by the military holds water. But the judge will definitely make a decision.

                • WeTheBleeple

                  Your beliefs are of no concern to me except where you try defame people with little in the way of facts.

                  More ASSumptions.

                  It doesn’t appear the military story holds water at all. They lied denied and covered up. You news source is KIwiblog?

                  You should go there and make friends. I’m not interested.

            • Psycho Milt

              When you consider that these machines fire an abundance of explosive 30mm rounds, the terrible toll on civilian life is not too difficult to understand.

              Let's phrase that another way: when you consider that these machines fire an abundance of explosive 30mm rounds, the evil inherent in firing them at people's houses, or at unidentified people in the neighbourhood, becomes very obvious.

              Hager narrative is that NZDF forces were directly, personally responsible for shooting these civilians.

              In that case, you'll be able to quote the passages where he does that. Regardless, the Defence Force seems to have admitted that one unarmed man was shot by a SAS sniper, and the helicopter fire support was there to support an SAS operation at their direction, so there's no weaseling out of the responsibility.

              • fustercluck

                You really should acquaint yourself with the international laws of warfare. War is ugly and dangerous and shooting at a village harbouring insurgents is not outside those laws. Perhaps the inquiry should focus on the politicians who send our soldiers into harm's way and who define the rules of engagement for them. I'd support that!

                • The laws of war have no bearing on the evil inherent in directing automatic cannon fire at civilians' houses, or at unidentified people in the surrounding area.

                  That said, the NZDF clearly doesn't share your confidence about it being entirely legal to kill or injure civilians if you have intelligence that there's likely to be an enemy combatant or two in the area. If they did share your confidence, they wouldn't have lied about it and tried to cover it up.

          • WeTheBleeple

            Who told you about the hemorrhoids?

            Are you spying on subscribers?

            Fucking conspiracy!

            Read your feedback to Solkta too, I can TRY take it on board.

            Hard to insult talking points, or am I just lacking imagination?

            I'll TRY devil

            • Robert Guyton

              I've read that crouching in the salty ocean cures what ails ya, WTB.

              Your "try" emoticon should be holding a try-dent.

          • greywarshark

            Hey WtB better use a spellcheck before you press submit ie to check if you are under some nasties' evil spell! While is is interesting to read lprent's latest creation of invective I we wouldn't want your excellent input to be lost or marred by concentration on your sometimes vivid expressions.

            • WeTheBleeple

              I aspire to be more like Frankie Boyle 😀


              • greywarshark

                I didn't think you were Scottish. I don't think that any other ethnic group could produce such sharpness.

                • WeTheBleeple

                  Scot, Pom, Irish, Kiwi…

                  Enough Scot muppet to knock the tops off some sock puppets.

                  I really admire Frankie, not just for his skills in audience interactions, but the way he can bring the funny to darkly depressing current events, while never shying from them.

                  Obviously I need my own style in all this. The writings coming along really well, and Frankie’s certainly helped me to see that nothing is a sacred cow if approached deftly.

        • greywarshark

          How do you know it was self-serving – what have you ever gone out in the field and researched? And how long were they collecting evidence and putting the book together; not 'rushing to publication'?

          This sounds like pontification from an armchair windbag. "A reporter must treat every witness with scepticism, even those for whom they feel great sympathy."

    • AB 4.3

      Turns out that fc's bizarre attempt to smear Nicky Hager has just collapsed. Because the latest revelations from Stephenson don't contradict the central thesis of the book – that (only) civilians were killed and the NZDF lied about it. I wonder if the RW troll community will now repudiate fc for a lousy, shallow effort?

      • fustercluck 4.3.1

        It seems the " central thesis" is a movable feast. My understanding of the story is that the killings were unjustified/unlawful and that NZDF lied about it. Now it is revealed that the firefight was justified by the presence of not only combatants but specifically targeted leaders in the village. Now the "central thesis" narrows. But the unfortunate death of civilians in legally prosecuted warfare, i.e., within legally defined rules of engagement, is in no way a crime. So what is the book about then?

        • Robert Guyton

          fuster; were the "combatants" and "specifically targeted leaders" in the village at the time the guns began to blaze, or had they already left, do you think?

        • New view

          Money from the book and a agenda follow. I agree with all your comments. The fact that Hager believed the villagers rather than the NZ forces shows up his agenda. The WTB bollocks comment about using the information you have at the time should have read “information I want to believe “ Hager’s CALL to publish was based on testimonies from people that may have had their own agenda to follow. He is either very naive or a slimy turd. I’ll leave everyone to choose which one.

          • WeTheBleeple

            "He is either very naive or a slimy turd"

            Or an award winning journalist who puts himself on the line to uncover corrupt practice.

            Many journalists killed recently for speaking truth to power. Not a game you'd play for money, no, some people run deep.

            • WeTheBleeple

              And then there's the timeline: 2010 the incident occurs, 2017 they publish. You think Hager should have waited till 2027?

              Rushed it?

          • greywarshark

            It's nice to see you RW bring seconds onto TS when duelling – that's an old tradition I believe. And it's important for you to hold onto old traditions because you feel helpless and agitated when faced with the new. Admit it New view.

            And when people like Oldview and festereggs get rotten eggs thrown at them, having two makes a wide target hard to miss. Expose' are so annoying aren't they hennypenny and cause RW to run in circles squawking.

        • Robert Guyton

          And did they number 2, those combatants/leaders?

          Does the pursuit of 2 such figures justify the deaths of 21 villagers, do you think, or is that to your mind, merely "unfortunate"?

        • KJT

          So. Killing unarmed civilians is fine, then?

          It was within the rules!

          So was murdering 6 million Jews.

        • McFlock

          So US+NZDF attacked a village that did have insurgents in it (for given values of "in" and "did"), but managed to only kill civilians and caught nobody? And then lied about it?

          How is this an improvement?

        • Psycho Milt

          Now it is revealed that the firefight was justified by the presence of not only combatants but specifically targeted leaders in the village.

          What did this "firefight" consist of? The interview with the Taliban leaders who were being sought suggests they promptly buggered off without firing a shot, once they realised their opponents had air support. Was there any return fire at all? Certainly it sounds like there couldn't have been any that didn't come from local citizens defending their property against armed intruders.

    • Gabby 4.4

      Turns out some tallywhackers CLAIM to have been in the vicinity cluckaduck. Do you trust them?

  4. Sanctuary 5

    Nick Smith really is the poster child for term limits. He may have been OK once, but now he is choleric, arrogant and utterly self serving.

    • greywarshark 5.1

      So right Sanctuary – every word.

      Here's a song for Dr Nick Smith (he's bad medicine.)

      Nobody Does it Better

  5. bewildered 6

    Good to see Mike Hoskins pick up another radio award, obviously big following out there in general public but also respect from his peers Barry Soper also best journalist

    • Muttonbird 6.1

      Cupboard's very bare, he's only competing against another RW shock-jock in Garner.

      • bewildered 6.1.1

        What about red radio ?

      • Enough is Enough 6.1.2


        I think you need a new dial on your radio if you think there are only two players in the market

        • Muttonbird

          Shallow pool. The scum inevitably floated to the top.

          • WeTheBleeple

            LOL. It's yet another self serving award. Industry insiders vote for their favorite industry insider. Similar to many other meaningless accolades people adorn themselves with. Sir, Dame…

    • AB 6.2

      Are you a time traveller from Pravda – circa 1958?

      • greywarshark 6.2.1

        I love these TS games. Connect the plots – which previous comment is a new one directed at? 6.2 at 10.10 am so must have arisen from #6 at 8.43 am. Is that right? Do I get the chocolate fish? Any idiot who understands the system could follow that I hear you say. But I speak up for all idiots who might want to come here and follow the wit and wonder of TS comment (unique in the world – and that is irrefutable so don't take the mickey).

    • Stuart Munro. 6.3

      Yes, it shows NZ broadcasting standards descent into the abyss is almost complete, and thus new media will provide the only serious news to be had. Mission accomplished for the haters and wreckers.

    • greywarshark 6.4

      bewildered – You work so hard for the RW but I fear your award will be in heaven – here's hoping for that.

    • Gabby 6.5

      Horeskin worked hard for the respect of Soapy Bazz. I'm sure they're mutually gratified.

    • bewildered 7.1

      AOC grasp of history is certainly limited, probably up there with Trumps To be fair her grasp of anything is limited beyond possibly making cocktails and pouring a beer Even she denies she was linking to Nazi concentration camps when called out, yet used the well understood phrase never again in her rant, she really needs to engage what little grey matter she has before she opens her mouth

    • Gabby 7.2

      Well the yankers pretty much invented concentration camps.

      • Puckish Rogue 7.2.1


        Although the first example of civilian internment may date as far back as the 1830s, The English term concentration camp was first used in order to refer to the reconcentrados (reconcentration camps) set up by the Spanish military in Cuba during the Ten Years' War (1868–78). The term saw wider use around the Second Boer War (1899–1902), when the British operated such camps in South Africa for interning Boers.

        • McFlock

          You missed the bit of your link that listed the US civil war as an example.

          Did they invent the term? Nope.

          Verey early adopters of the practise? Yup.

        • McFlock

          Funny where the wikipedia rabbit hole can lead.

          The Spanish learnt it from the yanks:

          He came to the same conclusions as his predecessors as well: to win Cuba back for Spain, he would have to separate the rebels from the civilians by putting the latter in safe havens, protected by loyal Spanish troops. By the end of 1897, General Weyler had divided the long island of Cuba in different sectors and relocated more than 300,000 into areas nearby cities. Weyler learned that tactic from studying General William Tecumseh Sherman's campaign[7] while he was assigned to the post of military attaché in the Spanish embassy in Washington D.C.[8]

          • Puckish Rogue

            Pretty sure if you go back far enough there'll be examples to be found in any culture so it can't really be laid at the foot of any culture

            • McFlock

              I don't think it's a culture thing.

              It essentially requires three things:

              • an assymmetric warfare environment where the opposing force gains support from the local population;
              • A strong bureaucratic structure in your own forces;
              • a political environment that shies away from mass slaughter of civilians, at least initially, but that can be persuaded to overlook less overt crimes against "deserving" populations.

              And it's a tactic that evolved. ISTR the British used a similar tactic to isolate and deprive Malayan insurgents of logistic saupport and recruits, but without the mass death. But feeding the internees was a prime priority as part of the "hearts and minds" concept, not just relocation. And the yanks totally clusterfucked the concept in Vietnam. Which is odd, given that they had Grant to study.

    • ianmac 7.3

      Not that different to what the Aussies are doing to their immigrants – and get away with it.

  6. Observer Tokoroa 8

    It doesn't Pay

    It is not wise to build structures on steep hills in New Zealand. Nor is it wise to build or buy houses beneath steep hills.

    I do not know if City Councils are aware, but most New Zealanders know that the NZ landscape consists of mud. Give it enough rain and it becomes a nightmare.

  7. Jenny - How to Get there? 9

    Waikato coal exploration permit for Bathurst Resources branded hypocritical

    ……But with the Government’s Zero Carbon Bill announced last month – which sets a target of zero net emissions by 2050 – the coal mining exploration permit is being criticised as a contradiction.

    Time we put an end to this

    Cindy Baxter of Coal Action Network Aotearoa said it was "extraordinary" that with the Zero Carbon Bill in Parliament, "miners are continuing to just dig up coal and the likes of Fonterra will use it to dry milk".

    Hardly a contradiction or “extraordinary” The sole purpose of the Zero Carbon Act (by 2050) is to continue business as usual in the present.. And prevent any disruption to the fossil fuel industry

    Why the permit was granted

    When asked why the coal exploration permit was granted, LINZ Minister Eugenie Sage told Newshub: "LINZ made the decision to grant the access agreement in line with the laws as they stand."

    She said coal mining has occurred in the Rotowaro area "for some years"…..



    • Jenny - How to Get there? 9.1

      The much celebrated, at the time Zero, Carbon Act, (now mostly forgotten and hardly ever mentioned) is the major law which Eugenie Sage mentions that this decision is in line with.

      And as for coal mining has occurred in the Rotowaro area for some years

      So what?

      Slavery occurred for some years too.

      The Green Party in government need to better than this

      • solkta 9.1.1

        The much celebrated, at the time Zero, Carbon Act, (now mostly forgotten and hardly ever mentioned) is the major law which Eugenie Sage mentions that this decision is in line with.

        Where does she say this? Not in the article you link to. Stop telling lies.

        • Jenny - How to Get there?

          I never said that Sage said that. Sage said that this decision is line with the laws as they stand.

          I said, that the Zero Carbon Act is the major law which permits continued new coal mining. The Zero Carbon Act permits the increase of every other type of fossil fuel pollution, containing not one single measure to rein in fossil fuel expansion and development.

          This is just a fact.

          • solkta

            Look you stupid cow i have quoted you. It was a cut and paste from your immediately prior post. Stop telling lies about telling lies. For fucks sake it is right there above for you.

            [lprent: Look you fuckwit – we can’t help that you have teeny weeny small genitals and are ashamed of them. Sure your pathetic hand-wringing are incapable of raising more than a gooey mess rather than pleasure. But that really isn’t the point is it.

            Calm it down a bit or I will start really start to help you out with the personal insults (before I boot you off the site). The idea is to deal with the points and make the insults related to that rather than going full-on personal. ]

            • Blazer

              You should try and play the ball,not the 'man'.

              You are wrong and Jenny's version is accurate to any impartial observer.

              • solkta

                Any observer capable of reading, impartial or not, can read the words that she has written.

                • Blazer

                  'Look you stupid cow '

                  such vitriol,such passion.

                  • greywarshark

                    Such sexism. It is why female humans often like to have pseudos.

                    They may deserve to be called cows but not as a first line of name-calling. Anyway now we are being told to respect animals as often more sentient beings than we are, I am having trouble choosing suitable denigrations, what about rabid dog. That's scary, but not nice cows they rarely hurt or kill anybody and are just very agreeable and helpful to human kind. Here's an award for Jersey cows and their curious faces and long eyelashes.

                    But mosquitoes I hate them, no mercy. Whine, whine.

            • Brigid

              "Look you fuckwit – we can’t help that you have teeny weeny small genitals and are ashamed of them. Sure your pathetic hand-wringing are incapable of raising more than a gooey mess rather than pleasure……..Calm it down a bit or I will start continue really start continue to help you out with the personal insults"


              • lprent

                Thank you for the grammer lesson.

                I don't get that much time to moderate, so I am far more concerned about getting the message across.

                So, as the dedicated critic, do you think that I succeeded?

                • Brigid

                  Succeeded? Who cares? I don't care who owns the skipping rope either and that the owner will ban me from skipping if I complaining about it.

                  The question is do you feel better now that you've taken your socks off?

                  Too many cut glass egos, too many forelock pulling sycophants. Such a small world.

            • solkta

              Thanks for reminding me where the line is lprent. I agree i could have shown better restraint. It is hard for me to understand how this poster has such a poor understanding of an issue she has put so much time into commenting on. This is an issue that i have large chunks of my life invested in and it is hard to be tolerant of those who only wish to criticize.

              I will take a couple of days of self imposed ban. Thanks heaps for what you do in providing this site.

              ps. The small penis thing is a getting bit stale.

          • solkta

            Also, the Carbon Act is not currently a law.

            • Jenny - How to Get there?

              That is true.

              Proper climate change legislation would stop all new fossil fuel projects.

              Or at the very least, load a cost on them, that made them less likely.

              And coal is the most dangerous of all the fossil fuels.

              from the Newshub article:

              Failing to deliver

              Coal is the most carbon-intensive fossil fuel, according to Coal Action Network. Its website describes: "Of the fossil fuels left in the ground and available to burn, 79 percent of the global warming potential is from coal."

              As James Hansen has said, “If we can’t stop coal it is all over for the climate”

              We are living in deadly times for the bio-sphere. It is time we started acting like it.

              • WeTheBleeple

                Good comment and suggestion:

                "Or at the very least, load a cost on them, that made them less likely."

                We can't be challenging Australia about Adani, or anyone burning coal, while pulling it out of our own land.

                A line has to be drawn, yesterday!

                Where's the solar supplements – hiding behind excuses. The EV supplements – hiding behind excuses.

                The excuse being our power supply is largely sustainable…

                That doesn't get combustion engines off the road.

                Nor does it reduce power demand on the grid so we don't burn coal – you know, in the aforementioned sustainable grid.

                Solar rollout! Not another institute for blue sky bullshit. We have the tech, roll it out.

              • Proper climate change legislation would stop all new fossil fuel projects.

                Or at the very least, load a cost on them, that made them less likely.

                NZ First wouldn't accept either of those proposals, which makes them untenable in the current Parliament. Even Labour is being tentative about taking stronger action because of the likely voter backlash. So, if you want to see these kind of policies enacted, persuade people to vote Green in 2020. You might want to gloss over the effects the policies would likely have on their lifestyle, though.

                • WeTheBleeple

                  Roll out so much solar we don't notice we're not burning coal anymore?

                  A few billion spare bucks might be a good start.

                  Unless we are protecting shareholders. Those private folks with our power now in their pockets.

                  I can't imagine Chennai's industrialists making much money right now. Unless they own desalination plants. It's all interconnected and the more parts of the picture that turn away from destructive practice the better chance we have.

                  But solar is decentralised, could the so called movers and shakers (thwarters and rorters) actually give up power mongering in exchange for the planet?

            • greywarshark

              Unrepentant solkta, more like sulkta.

              Brigid the great lprent built this blog, with others, and spends hours of his own time maintaining it, and we only have it because he is a full-on guy at anything he does. So he gets exercised now and then when there is a persistent nasty carry-on that threatens to spread its smelly way throughout.

              It's no use coming on and wringing your delicate little hands and trying to get us to be really nice. It can only be maintained for a while, and then clash. Maybe you should stick to the cookery blogs! Now that is going to make you annoyed also, at my patronising stance.

              We're getting into the Jack Nicholson mode of confronting with 'You want the truth, you couldn't handle the truth'! And so many who come here, just can't and are like wet matches striking against others' opinions to produce such a pallid light that they can't see further than their next step. How is that for fanciful analogy. We, or I, like to read some ironic points as we go. Why don't you just join in looking to the ghastly future and thinking ways around it and help buoy each other up?

  8. greywarshark 11


    The polytechnic sector lost millions of dollars amid falling student enrolments last year, annual reports show. Of the 16 institutes of technology and polytechnics, 10 have confirmed that they made deficits in 2018.

    The net result from the 13 annual reports published to date was a deficit for the sector of $34 million, a figure that would grow further after Whitireia, Weltec and Tai Poutini announced their results. The figures were in line with a Cabinet paper that last year warned the government 10 of the institutes were likely to make deficits in 2018 and seven were considered high financial risks.

    Unitec in Auckland had the single largest net deficit in 2018, $29.5m, after full-time student numbers fell by about 500 students. However, the institute said improved property valuations reduced the overall deficit to $8.3m.

    (This raises a practice that has evolved from neolib of not having education establishments as government provided but turning them to run as businesses, commercial enterprises with land and buildings valued, and business-style assessment as success being related to profit etc. This warps NZ public provision assessment and I think this also relates to hospitals being in great debt. This assessment system needs changing.)

    This is what the Secretary-General of the OECD says – sounds practical and in touch with reality.

    We are facing unprecedented challenges – social, economic and environmental – driven by accelerating globalisation and a faster rate of technological developments. At the same time, those forces are providing us with myriad new opportunities for human advancement.

    The future is uncertain and we cannot predict it; but we need to be open and ready for it. The children entering education in 2018 will be young adults in 2030. Schools can prepare them for jobs that have not yet been created, for technologies that have not yet been invented, to solve problems that have not yet been anticipated. It will be a shared responsibility to seize opportunities and find solutions.

    Do you want to take part in OECD Education 2030?
    OECD Education 2030 welcomes countries and stakeholders to contribute to the project. If you are interested, please contact: education2030@oecd.org.

    To find out more about the project, please visit our website at: oe.cd/education2030
    Write to us

    Directorate for Education and Skills-OECD
    2 rue André Pascal – 75775 Paris Cedex 16-France



    Acronyms – (Hieroglyphics?): The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) is an international organisation that works to build better policies for better lives.

  9. Robert Guyton 12


  10. greywarshark 13

    NZ Herald says John Key regrets asking the public to vote on a new flag – now you can put for a replacement. Or something like. WTF trivia personified.

    Not even good enough to wrap our precious fish and chips methinks. And National daleks chant – Diversion Diversion Diversion!

    • Drowsy M. Kram 13.1

      Thanks for that marvelous image of National Daleks chanting 'Diversion. Diversion.'

      Alternatives: 'Distraction. Distraction.', or (alluding to a "grasp and tug” commenter),

      'Bewilderment. Bewilderment.'

      [Apologies for the dated humour.]

      • higherstandard 13.1.1

        Heh you wouldn't get away with that sketch these days – even though most Pakastani's in the UK would be highly amused.

      • greywarshark 13.1.2

        Oh thanks Drowsy M Kram – nice to meet someone on the same wavelength. I never realised when watching some of those farces in the past that they illustrate human events and thinking so well. I seem to remember just looking at that one that everything dispatched was to be Put In The Curry. I think that may be a phrase I will use FTTT now.

        She says ‘Now you know what’s wrong with the country’ when Mr Dalek exterminates another member of the ‘family’ the caged bird, and says to put it in the curry. Her reply, ‘Now you know what’s wrong with the curry’. I suggest we are getting further from the country and closer to the curry!

  11. Fireblade 14

    I hope Police are monitoring the right-wing blogs. There are comments threatening to shoot cops and politicians on Kiwiblog today.

    • higherstandard 14.1

      There's comments here on a not too infrequent basis threatening to execute persons. All hot air.

      [lprent: Yeah, prove it or apologize. I think that you are simply lying. But I am always prepared to be proven wrong…

      Find some that haven’t been moderated on a not too infrequent basis. I will accept no more than a month between them and not less than 3 instances. And within the last year.

      Otherwise I ban you for 3 months tomorrow.

      Threatening violence including executions is something that isn’t acceptable here. ]

      • greywarshark 14.1.1

        You keep count higherstandard? We would want to know that our standards weren't sinking below your home base.

        • higherstandard

          "You keep count higherstandard? We would want to know that our standards weren't sinking below your home base."

          No, Apparently that's the artist formerly known as fireblade you're thinking of.

      • Higherstandard 14.1.2

        What no penis allusions ?


        Can’t be bother trawling back through the rest …

        • lprent

          Thank you.. Missed that one.

          Updated: As to being lazy – it isn’t a problem to me if you aren’t here for 3 months.

          • higherstandard

            Updated: As to being lazy – it isn’t a problem to me if you aren’t here for 3 months.

            Or me Lyn, feel free to ban away, I’m not trawling back through all the other comments I’ve noted over the last few weeks – perhaps a background search on keywords would do the trick ?

            • Incognito

              Lynn said:

              Yeah, prove it or apologize.

              You choose the ban? Is that where your user name comes from?

        • Muttonbird

          Right wing snowflake. Don't melt, will you!

          • higherstandard

            🙄 as I said all hot air, more importantly Lyn as owner of the blog has a point as to what is and isn't acceptable.

            • lprent

              I don’t own the blog. I operate it because I set it up for others and no-one competent has ever wanted to take it over. We fixed the ownership question back in 2010

              As the About says:

              Legally this website is owned by The Standard Trust, an entity set up by the authors to own The Standard’s url and handle any advertising revenue.

          • WeTheBleeple

            Such a silly insult though. Snowflakes are multi faceted and all are unique. (so they say, I've not examined them all yet).

  12. WeTheBleeple 15

    Avocado thieving in the news again. The Police are at a loss as to how to catch them. We don't have the resources to patrol entire regions.

    What could be done?

    Well… only theoretically, the orchards may have unique genetic signatures to their trees (or not?).

    If they do, we can identify said signatures and catch the stolen fruit wherever it might emerge.

    If they don't ah well. The fact they're largely grown on Zaytuna rootstock grown from seedlings gives me hope that, even if the tops are cloned, unique DNA should be present/identifiable.

    Wrote to industry, will find out soon enough the nature of genetic variance in our Avo industry.

    Then we put a masters student on the job getting said genetic signatures.

    Then we catch them thieves.

    This will not catch hungry people taking a few for home use. It will catch the organised criminals (perhaps).

    Similar to how genetics was used to prove the origins of whale meat in Japan.

    • Gabby 15.1

      Or the orchardists could, you know, shoot them.

    • greywarshark 15.2

      Patrolling geese? They are very territorial and fierce.

      Maybe drones could be of use here, just taking photos, and quietly tracking from above and following them home.

      There was an article in the paper about the number of devices available under $100 to take photos of people which have been used by immature or twisted males to view females' intimate moments. Perhaps these cheap camera applications could be used for a virtuous use in flying cameras to avoid violent confrontations, shootings.

      • WeTheBleeple 15.2.1

        Can't shoot em, not in NZ there'd be hell to pay, and rightly so. Killing is a long cry from thieving, unless you are a MAGA magnate, then it's the logical next step.

        They have all sorts of photos and footage of masked people, surveillance isn't working.

        Guard geese are a great idea. They'll raise the alarm, but trying to catch crooks full of adrenaline is a very dangerous business. Cops pulled up on one and got rammed. Nasty fuckers.

        Just buy an avocado at the market(s), test them…

        Knock knock. Gotcha!

        • greywarshark

          One of my points is the drones following the thieves and plotting them on GPS of course, also somewhere along the way it could drop some identifiers on the vehicle that would be hard to wash off.

          We have a problem that in NZ could parallel the mafia in Italy. They steal and blackmail so much that it prevents enterprise and the economy follows a style similar to that of NZ at present, some living high, their employees reasonably well, and a large group of a precariat. Once it becomes embedded it can't be changed. Judges who want to apply the law get shot.

          • WeTheBleeple

            Similar to a model I proposed to some drone companies to help police pursuits (tag em, back off, follow with drone & GPS).

            Not sure if we're there yet… sound thinking again however. We will get there sooner or later. There's the drones range and speed to consider. But if we can GPS tag em, haha, nobody drives faster than a two-way radio. If we can tag without detection, game over crooks.

            The DNA approach will totally mess their game up could hit every market in the country and still only need to run one (batchlot) test. They were here, these are legal, these are from there…

            You could think you're good moving fruit the length of the country – wouldn't make a lick of difference. Dodgy restaurants etc would get caught, and there's plenty of them about – my old skipper had no problem flogging illegal crayfish in Auckland. They voraciously ate em up!

            • WeTheBleeple

              Just a thought – in the dark thieves wouldn't know one avo from another. Could GPS a few fakes in prime picking positions – computer picks up when they move…

  13. Does anyone know if the band MGN (just featured on RNZ's Afternoons) is Auckland based? (I'm hoping)

  14. Kevin 17

    The beginning of the end? The bank that once crowed about not requiring a bailout, bailed out by the government.


  15. Eco maori 18

    Kia ora Nation's Newshub.

    I have Already given my opinion on volunteering euthanasia.

    Electric vehicles A favorite topic of mine.

    That was my thoughts pollies in Britain and America a sideshow Simon.

    Ma te wa Simon in good time I say our Government will get some great incentives for our people to buy electric vehicles. Good on Meridian energy for change there fleets to EVs . I say a fee bait scheme would be nice gas guzzling cars subsidized the up take of EVs.

    Very cool Russell your whare with solar green roof and EV. Kia kite ano

  16. Eco maori 19

    The Aviation industry needs to be chasing Electric Hybrid Planes not long flight gas guzzling beasts if you want to stay competitive in the Aviation industry this is what you have to do. The tide has turned everyone knows that Human Caused Climate Change is a REALITY so we are backing clean energy. With new technology Skype ect there is no need to fly to other destinations for big business meetings just use Skype and save money and our environment.

    Electric planes herald new era for aviation at the Paris Air Show

    The rise of hybrid and electric aircraft was on full display at the biannual aviation showcase, where startups competed with industry giants to show off technology that's more efficient and better for the environment than traditional designs.

    The focus on electrically-propelled aircraft reflects a rush to develop urban flying taxis (coming soon) and longer range fully electric planes (coming later

    According to the consultancy Roland Berger, the number of electric aircraft in development increased by roughly 50% over the past year to 170. The number could swell to 200 by the end of 2019

    Ka kite ano link below.


  17. Eco maori 20

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

  18. Eco maori 21

    Kia ora The Hui .

    For one you should not be held accountable for someone else actions.

    2nd I thought powercompanys can not refuse a service that is basic human right like water housings whare power in Aotearoa if that is not the case it should be.

    I have dealt with the lines company when i was managing a farm in the King Country the bloody invoices are confusing for me let alone a Kuia trying to work it out .The Power suppliers and line company should work out a better system there are many other bad stories about bad customer servicers.

    Ka kite ano

  19. Eco maori 22

    Kia ora Marae .

    I don't think it's acceptable for other cultures to question and respect tangata whenua O Aotearoa to not use te reo Maori on the sports field or anywhere in Aotearoa it a national language.

    There will always be some people who don't respect others.

    With Te reo Maori culture that is what makes Aotearoa unique .

    Eco Maori is going to get a ta moko of a Octopus riding a Whale ma te wa. Ka kite ano

  20. Eco maori 23

    I will let Bernie words speak for me thanks for having the —- to speak the TRUTH on this subject.

    We must stop the US from going to war with Iran Trump campaigned on getting the US out of ‘endless wars’ – but his administration is taking us down a path that makes war more and more likely

    We need to rethink our current approach. A war with Iran would be an absolute disaster. As former general Anthony Zinni has put it: “If you like Iraq and Afghanistan, you’ll love Iran.” If the US were to attack Iran, Iran could respond with attacks on US troops and on countries around the region. It would lead to the further destabilization of that region in a way that is unimaginable and would result in wars that would go on years and probably cost trillions of dollars

    The Iran nuclear deal put Iran’s nuclear program under the most intense inspections regime in history. It got Iran to give up more than 98% of its stockpileof enriched uranium. Trump’s “maximum pressure” campaign has reversed those gains. Iran recently announced that, in response to a year’s worth of increased US sanctions, it would increase its stockpile of enriched uranium beyond the limits imposed by the nuclear deal. Bizarrely, Trump is now warning Iran not to violate an agreement his administration violated over a year ago.

    want to be clear on this: Iran pursues many bad policies. It violently represses its own population and supports extremist groups around the region. The same could be said of our longtime partner Saudi Arabia. We need to take a more even-handed approach to the Middle East, and not simply support one side against another in a regional conflict. The US is strong enough to deal with these issues diplomatically, working with allies around the world, and that is what we should be doing. We must not fight another unnecessary war.

    • Bernie Sanders is a US senator from Vermont and a candidate for president Ka kite ano link below.


  21. Eco maori 24

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

  22. Eco maori 25

    I had a sore face when I seen this story about people or the youth growing horns or unusually bone growth because of Cellphone use.

    I also laughed A similarly accusation about Cellphone causing cancer I will put a link to this story that points that RF radio frequency does not having enough power in cellphones to break down one's DNA as that is what causes cancer .

    I put it down to a group of people losing control of the Papatuanuku to our technology industry's.

    Are young people growing horns because of mobile phones? Not so fast

    Gideon Meyerowiitz-Katz

    Mobile phones probably aren’t turning young people into literal demons from hell just yet

    People are strange about mobile phones. On the one hand, we can’t live without them. A modern existence is almost entirely reliant on the ability to at all times be connected to virtually every person alive today, which if you think about it is pretty cool. On the other hand, we are constantly terrified that our technological advances are going to kill us all, because nothing is scarier than a risk that we don’t understand. People who’ll happily get into a car despite the ever-present risk of a crash will spend enormous amounts of time and energy avoiding wifi and 5G, even though there is a great deal of evidence that they are safe for human health.

    As a species, we’re pretty scared of the unknown

    The study also had some worrying problems. As a number of people on Twitter pointed out, the data in the study directly contradicted itself, showing in a graph that men had fewer enlarged EOPs than women but saying in the text that they had more. There were also a number of minor numerical errors – calling the young group 18-29s in one place and 18-30s in another – and a somewhat problematic method of sampling. In fact, the top comment on the paper in the online journal asks how it got through peer-review in the first place, implying that it probably shouldn’t have been published at all. While all of these errors may not be the fault of the authors – the journal editors might be to blame – it makes it much harder to trust the results as reported

    Ka kite ano links below.



  23. Eco maori 26

    Kia ora Newshub.

    Condolences to the people who lost family in the skydiving plane crash in Hawaii.

    That's was good of the Auckland council gave the public a fear free Sunday to raise the awareness of public transport .

    There you go another story attacking digital devices were is the pair review of this claim of a spike in tamariki short sighted problems you know i can count the number of attacks on the technology industry the oil barons money is at play once again. Ka kite ano

  24. Eco maori 27

    Kia ora te ao Maori news

    Its sad those 2 hapu can't get along and work together to raise their mokopuna up to their highest rung on their ladders of life.

    Ka pai to the Auckland City Council for investigating a way to counteract the discrimination of Maori and Pacific Business i knew what that was like I have tried a few business but failed Eco Maori does not give up thought I will secede .

    We had a good sports weekend I have a sore face from watching the stars. It's is very cool that the respect for Tangata whenua O Aotearoa Cultural is showing I knew that the stars could get their mana back with great coaching.

    Ka kite ano

  25. Eco maori 28

    There was a Earthquake in Rotorua at 430 Am this morning.

  26. mac1 29

    Local boy Craig Harper, fourth in the world, cycles the distance of 1 and a third Tour De France in half the time!

    This should be ranked alongside the NZ cricket team's performances, too!


  27. Eco maori 30


    No, Teenagers Are Not Growing 'Skull Horns' Because of Smartphones ka kite ano link below.


  28. Eco maori 31

    Kia ora The Am Show.

    Good on you Sam Stubbs I agree as a person with a KIWIs saver account so i will have shares in ANZ the CEO should be not wasting shareholders money.

    There is a fine line to popularity one has to not be a plutocrat holding your hands out when they are Already full.

    I think education for young Wahine about their monthly is needed as well as a subsidy for the lower classes of people for sanity products.

    Ka kite ano

  29. Eco maori 32

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

  30. Eco maori 33

    I am quite glad that there is a new found respect for tangata whenua O Aotearoa.

    Now we need to have trust that we are not fools and can have a very positive inputs into social policy aimed to reduce Maori un equality. Like I have stated before for the correct care to be given there has to be Aroha not loathing or looking down one's nose. There needs to be a understanding of the culture and circumstance for the situation that is being reviewed.

    Back in the 1980s, two Labour Government ministers — Anne Hercus (Social Welfare) and Koro Wetere (Māori Affairs) — agreed that it was time that Māori began to have a fair go in the social welfare system. So they set up a high-powered group to look into what was going on, and to report back with their findings and answers.

    John Rangihau, a Ngāi Tūhoe leader and a formidable figure in New Zealand education, was the chair. And the other members were Emarina Manuel, Donna Hall (who was a young solicitor with the Department of Social Welfare at the time), Hori Brennan, Peter Boag, John Grant — and Neville Baker, who was then head of community affairs at the Department of Māori Affairs.

    They presented their report in 1988. It was called Pūao-te-Āta-tū, “heralding the light of the new dawn.” And it was praised for its thorough research, its insights, and its sheer common sense.

    There was a feeling that this would bring about a revolution in social welfare, especially because of a long-absent but newfound respect for Māori values and Māori knowledge being embraced within the system

    No. The situation today is no different from what we found 30-odd years ago.

    It’s a recurrence of the mistake that government departments keep making — and it’s not just with Oranga Tamariki. It’s the belief among social service officials that they don’t need support or advice from our people

    It’s also clear that, for 100 years now, Māori have been the most incarcerated people in the corrections system. We’ve been the most prominent people in the social welfare system as well

    What particularly bugs me is that Roger Douglas and Richard Prebble decided to do away with trades training because, so they argued, it was too expensive

    I think you’re right. It’s been evident in this recent Oranga Tamariki situation that a number of our people working in that organisation have become distanced from who they are as Māori people. They forget who they are and where they’ve been brought up. Instead, once they go into a bureaucracy, they start following the bureaucracy’s rules

    Ka kite ano link below.


  31. Eco maori 34

    Kia ora Newshub.

    With KIWIs built at least our new government is trying to fix our housing shortage the last lot just ignored the short rubbing there hands together.

    The insurance industry is all about there profits just like the banks the fine print in policy is very confusing and that small a print it hard to read .

    Ka kite ano

  32. Eco maori 35

    Kia ora te ao Maori news

    Wellington most vaunrable are going to get new Whare very good as most of them will be Maori Whare are near impossible to rent now days

    Wharekahika is getting it rightfully place as the name of Hicks bay very cool.

    It awesome that the Council elections is going to include more inputs from Te Arawa.

    Cool that Te Tai Tokerau is rasing the profile of there te reo awesome.

    The Mayan people are rising the awareness of their plight and championing their language to have more people using it ka pai these other indigenous cultures airing their concerns on Aotearoa Maori tv te ao Maori news.

    Ka kite ano

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