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Prepare for four days of hot air

Written By: - Date published: 7:03 am, October 9th, 2017 - 40 comments
Categories: election 2017, winston peters - Tags: , , ,

For the next four (presumably) days the media is going to go nuts trying to cover the coalition talks. Quite apart from the genuine and significant public interest, they have column inches to fill, and nothing much to fill them with.

Expect to see agendas on display, and egos, and reckons, and the occasional gleaned factoid. But don’t expect predictions to be any better than chance.

I’d say that if Peters was true to his campaign and his supporters, he would go in to government with Labour and Greens. But we’ve been burned down that road before. He could do anything, and that’s that.

I’m not even sure that NZF joining or supporting a Labour led is the best long term outcome. Government with NZF is inherently risky, there are multiple problems born of National’s neglect coming to a head. Maybe it’s better to let the Nats grab the poisoned chalice, and the left to sweep in strongly in 2020. On the other hand NZ’s problems are urgent, they need urgent solutions that only the left can supply. Three more years of the Nats is three more years of drift and damage.

So roll on Thursday I guess.

40 comments on “Prepare for four days of hot air ”

  1. garibaldi 1

    My initial thought was why do a post on hot air when all we will get on the issue is hot air, but then I remembered Pete George. So howabout making this his site for the next four days and we can avoid reading him.

    • Once was Tim 1.1

      Or maybe Chris Trotter who, these days seems to want to concoct his scriblings based on the allegorical history lesson he wants to convey on any given day of the week. At least that’d be more informative (“fair and balanced” even)

      • RedLogix 1.1.1

        History being bunk eh?

        • Once was Tim 1.1.1.1

          Not at all! History being very interesting! its just that Trotter these days seems to pick out various events in history THEN base his analysis on those stories.
          It’s hard to know otherwise why the positive attitude one minute, and what almost amounts to bashing the next.
          I wish I was as pure and binary in thinking when it comes to politics. Life would be so much easier. I could even become a MSM journalist

    • Grey Area 2.1

      True but who gave him the air time to fill?

      • Heather Grimwood 2.1.1

        to Grey Area at 2.1: or asked for it (air time in a sensitive period).

        • Grey Area 2.1.1.1

          Hadn’t thought of that.

          I immediately thought it was a typical instance of our lickspittle media. They seem desperate to fill the space despite there being little or nothing worth saying at the moment.

      • veutoviper 2.1.2

        It was his regular weekly (Monday) spot on Morning Report. Jacinda Ardern is on at about the same time on Tuesday mornings.

        Morning Report has continued these regular slots since the election but presumably may change the slots post the final formation of the new government.

    • JC 2.2

      Yep! Blinglish dissing on the Greens.

      “The Greens don’t appear to understand the position they’re in or could have been in…. and have decided effectively not to play much of a part, or it appears that way, It’s pretty hard to tell. Even though they could have done they’ve kind of opted out.”

      The Greens had said it was unlikely a deal could be done, it would listen if Mr English gave them a call….. He didn’t.”

      Usual arrogance, and He needs to go back on the farm,

      • ianmac 2.2.1

        ” or it appears that way, It’s pretty hard to tell. ”
        That is belittling, arrogant and plain nasty Mr English!

        • Pete 2.2.1.1

          So nasty and arrogant from English? And what is new about that?

          It is also another attempt of authority masking desperation.

          • Anne 2.2.1.1.1

            It is an attempt to create an image of the Greens as an obstacle to “strong, stable government”. In other words he’s saying to Winston… don’t go with Labour because you’ll have to deal with the Greens too. If you come with us it’ll be so much easier and we’ll give you everything you want.

            • tracey 2.2.1.1.1.1

              And his game playing and name calling proves the Greens point, but not to the media…

            • veutoviper 2.2.1.1.1.2

              Agree, Anne. And Audrey Young seems to also!

              Here is her latest column today on English’s attacks on the Greens today in all of his regular Monday media appearances. Currently entitled ‘Why English is putting the boot into the Greens” no less!

              http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11930999

              A bit from it:

              “But English’s main criticism of the Greens was the way it exercises its power.

              It was not a last-minute bid by English to get the Greens to switch sides for a so-called “teal deal”.

              It was a bid by English to talk up the power that the Greens hold in the hope that the party negotiators exert more pressure in their talks with Labour.

              The more Green policy that Labour has to accept, the more attractive a National deal might be for New Zealand First.”

          • Once was Tim 2.2.1.1.2

            Bill will NEVER understand the Greens (and nor, it seems most of the MSM).
            They (Greens) should see it as a compliment as I’m sure most do – especially when there’s an even sillier puppet master Joyce pulling his stringy sensory thrill bits.
            Even bro Connor can’t offer anything other than support based on emotion if you watched him on whatever it was that masquerades as Sunday morning current affairs MSM TV recently (either the Nayshun or Q+A).
            At least someone must have told him what caused his children a wee while ago (as the old Catholic joke goes), and it had no relationship to rythym.
            A 21st Century fossil with an evolving SSJ amoeba schooling him – probably at $2K per hour plus GST

        • katipo 2.2.1.2

          Yeah he seemed to be giving off a vibe of an entitled kid who is angry and can’t understand why everyone is reluctant to play with him.

  2. Cinny 3

    Policy is important to Winston

    Where as bill appears to put more importance on being the party with the most votes, totally missing the point of MMP and team work.

    Maybe some media could step back a bit from the speculation for a few days, so many opinions, just like the weeks prior to the specials.

    Can we have some more investigative journalism in mainstream media please instead of coalition speculation? Thanks.

    Really enjoying newsroom, kudos to them.

    Three more sleeps 😀

  3. Paul Campbell 4

    Remember that making compromises is hard, but a necessary, important, part of an MMP democracy. The dickering involved is an important part of the process, not something to complain about.

    We’ve voted our representatives to that table (or tables in this case), we have to sit back and trust them to do what we’ve elected them to do, we know what they represent, it’s why we voted for them, the main things we get to demand now is that hold as true as they can to their ideals, and, most importantly, that whatever they agree to is open and above board, no secret deals

  4. Ed 5

    More hot air.

    From the master of hot air.

    Hosking.

    Another tool who should understand MMP and chooses not to in the service of his corporate masters.

    ‘Major parties acting like subservient wimps’

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11930957

  5. Ad 6

    Oh Christ Almighty could we just get this over with?

  6. roy cartland 7

    The left is in a good position anyway, I’m feeling pretty positive about it.

    Think about it – if it goes NAT/NZF, we’ll be a f’n effective opposition; if not, NAT will be an opposition of discredited known liars.

  7. RedLogix 8

    No-one is in a ‘good position’. None of the four plausible coalition combinations feel like a comfortable fit at this moment. The next three years are not going to be easy for any government.

    This is a big test for NZ’s experience of MMP; all the parties need to step up their understanding and skill at managing healthy coalitions, because so far we’ve been crap at it.

    • tc 8.1

      “The next three years are not going to be easy for any government. ”

      Exactly and why a Nat/NZF isn’t all that bad, National get to own the damage they caused whilst NZF make them redo their homework on immigration, housing, health, education.

      Get them to start repairing their own damage whilst their backers don’t get what they want. I can see Winnie enjoying the longer term damage that does to the party that’s spent 9 years trying to bury him.

      • cathy 8.1.1

        awful awful.. sounds like rough justice, the nats having to repair the damage they’ve done in the last nine years.

        except that they won’t repair anything, just do more damage

        like flog off ACC
        dismantle housing NZ
        surreptitiously tighten their hold on power
        and more
        and more

        • tc 8.1.1.1

          NZF are against further assets sales, charter schools and open door immigration.

          You assume it’s national light rather than the party national have been trying to remove from the scene since Key showed up.

          For all we know Winnies got what he wants from Blinglish, who is desperate, and is just playing this out.

  8. I watched Katie Bradford last night obviously thrilled to tell us that this (the lead story on the news being that there’s nothing to report about coalition negotiations) will continue for the next four days. Uh, yeah, thanks but no thanks, Katie. Our media’s ability to make lead stories about how there’s nothing to report but they’re going to blather at us with made-up bullshit about it anyway is something to behold, but not in a good way.

    • roy cartland 9.1

      Heh, and then they moan about Winston calling press conferences then saying nothing.

  9. Ed 10

    And on 9 to Noon there will another veteran of bs and hot air Matthew Hooton given airtime by Griffin on RNZ.

  10. lurgee 11

    I imagine Winston will need to be stuffed to bursting with baubles of office if he is going to be persuaded to back either side. He probably realises he’s screwed whichever way he goes, alienating a chunk of his support that wanted him to go the other way. Being crafty, he will argue that sitting on the cross benches and supporting the government on a case by case basis will give him more influence. And having the PM continually asking him for help will gratify his monstrous ego.

    • ianmac 11.1

      These “baubles of office” that get tossed around when dealing with Peters. Coined by the Right so long ago but really? Are any other Ministers labelled in this way? Is the dreaded Paula Bennett hung with baubles?

      • red-blooded 11.1.1

        Winston invented that phrase. Going into the ’96 negotiations, he claimed not to be interested in the “baubles of office”.

        • David C 11.1.1.1

          Wrong.
          2005 just before going into coalition with Labour. (and screwing the Greens)

          “It involves for my colleagues a real sacrifice, but we willingly make it. For my part, I never took as deputy Prime Minister ministerial cars or a house, so we genuinely don’t care about the baubles of office.”

          All complete lies too. You will remember the difficulty that the difficulty that DIA had in recovering the ministerial limo from Winston after he was chucked out in 2008.

    • RC 11.2

      And now he claims to be interested in policy. Will his detractors claim he is stuffed to bursting with policy concessions for New Zealanders or will they continue to denigrate him with “Baubles of office” and other such tripe. I have to give the left credit where it is due they have done their best to keep hits above the belt it has mostly been the right landing low blows, smearing everyone who disagrees with them which makes me wonder about you.

  11. red-blooded 12

    I think we have to acknowledge that whoever forms the government isn’t going to have an easy time. If it’s a Nat-led government, we’ll have a pretty strong opposition team given a chance to show why they’re a government in waiting. If it’s a Labour-NZF-Greens arrangement people on the left (and that means us) will have to try to be less critical than we usually are. It’ll be a compromise arrangement; we won’t like some policies, some of our priorities won’t get the attention we want them to. And complex problems take time and resources to turn around – progress isn’t instant. If we want a chance for a left leaning government for more than one term, we’ll need to actively support them.

  12. Sparky 13

    Both NZF and the Greens have said a big fat “no” to the TPPA and NZF has demanded the biggest increase in the minimum wage at $20 an hour. The real risk in my opinion is Labour who to me look a lot like a watered down version of National.

  13. cathy 14

    “I’m not even sure that NZF joining or supporting a Labour led is the best long term outcome. ”

    depends on whose best long term outcome.

    if you’re thinking just of the comfort of the Labour party, you could just about make a case.

    if you’re thinking of the country, then it is urgent to get rid of National, no matter what.

  14. tracey 15

    The CEO of BNZ backs capital gains Tax… after the election

    Retailer confidence dropped…. not told til after the election

    Food prices outstrip wages… not published til post election

    National supporting media and business telling National to be more like labour but not to actually be Labour… cos they cannot vote/support labour…

  15. mary_a 16

    Although I’d dearly love to see a Labour/Greens government emerge for the sake of NZ, I sometimes think it might be best in many respects, for them to miss this time and go for it hard and fast at the next general election, when they are likely to win on their own merit, minus NZF.

    Winston Peters is a wrecking ball. So to join that other wrecking ball National would be fitting. They could go for it hammer and tongs until there is nothing left to govern with, thereby increasing the likelihood of an early election being called, when Labour and the Greens will be firing off on all cylinders, ready to govern.

    Watching Natz and Peters tearing themselves apart piece by piece, should be entertaining, if nothing else! That will give msm something to feed on! Have the popcorn ready.

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