Social bonds negotiations collapse

Written By: - Date published: 8:39 am, July 6th, 2016 - 65 comments
Categories: capitalism, john key, national, same old national - Tags:

'Privatisation in health, education and superannuation makes sense'

Two years ago it was announced that the Government would investigate the provision of social bonds, a merchant banker type arrangement whereby private investors could invest in the provision of private services. The Government would contract the service out to a non government organisation, the investor would invest, and if targets were met then the bond would be repaid by the Government plus interest.

I previously called the proposal the stupidest idea this Government has had yet.  The idea was as crazy as it sounds.  Incentivising rich people to invest in privately run social services and paying them money if short term artificial goals were met is as barking as you can get.  It shows this Government’s lack of ideas that the only motivation it thinks that works is greed.

The proposal has hit problems with talks about the rollout of the first program collapsing.

From Radio New Zealand:

The government’s first social bond has collapsed, with negotiations breaking down and the provider walking away.

The largely untested social bond model uses private investors’ money to pay a provider for a social service. If the service is successful, the government pays out.

Bill English says the government has learnt lessons from the break-down of its first social bonds negotiations.

Work started in 2013 on the bonds, which the government promoted as a way to bring innovation to social services without risking public money.

Last year nearly $29 million was put aside for the rollout of four bonds.

The first was to be a programme to help people with mental health problems get into the workforce, and the plan was to put employment consultants in GP practices.

But the provider, Wise Group, confirmed yesterday that it had withdrawn from the scheme.

It would not make any further comment saying it had been directed to refer inquiries to the Ministry of Health.

Annette King has accurately described the futility of the proposal.

Labour’s health spokesperson Annette King said the whole programme had been a waste of money and was doomed to fail.

“It was never going to fly because there was no need for them to put in another funder. All the government needs to do is to fund a group like the Wise Group direct and cut out the middle man.”

The whole thing was nonsensical as social bonds had failed in other countries, she said.

Ms King could not understand why the government had pursued it.

 

The Government has already spent $1.6 million and despite the failure intends to continue with the proposal.  Absolutely barking.

65 comments on “Social bonds negotiations collapse ”

  1. One Anonymous Bloke 1

    Obviously the solution is to have government departments and SOEs invest in the scheme, and this time next year, we’ll all be millionaires.

  2. vto 2

    lol bill english

    what a thicko

    bill needs to get out in the real world

    so many right wing extremists live in frikkin’ la-la-land

    • Draco T Bastard 2.1

      so many right wing extremists live in frikkin’ la-la-land

      Every single National and Act member hold that their beliefs are real contrary to the facts. This is pure delusional thinking and it’s what causing the massive financial and social collapse of our society.

      • KJT 2.1.1

        I agree not all are crooks.

        Some truely have a religious belief in the “free market”.

        Some are well aware that it can make them rich.

        • Macro 2.1.1.1

          The Temples of the Hidden Hand are full of worshipers and followers every day from 8am till late at night. This is the new true religion and many delight in its bounteous gifts.

        • Macro 2.1.1.2

          The Temples of the Hidden Hand are full of worshipers and followers every day from 8am till late at night. This is the new true religion and many delight in its bounteous gifts.

      • Anno1701 2.1.2

        “beliefs are real contrary to the facts”

        its like some kind of weird cargo cult really

        but “john frum” aint ever coming…..

    • M. Gray 2.2

      Bill needs to learn how to speak proper English he mutters and mumbles a lot.
      I suppose when your telling so many porkies its hard to remember what and when you said what

    • Chris 2.3

      Like his brother on The Nation this week.

  3. One Anonymous Bloke 3

    The best thing is, the National Party will keep degrading New Zealand’s mental health. Here’s the economic case model:

    1. Attack the mental health of New Zealanders.
    2. Invest in social bonds.
    3. Profit!!!

    This is going to be huge!

  4. vto 4

    lol

    make money out of social problems

    lol

    like bankers spend so much of their lives concerned with social problems

    lol

    like social problems are resolved by the demands of self-interest

    lol

    like bill english has common sense

    lol

    too funny

    • Chris 4.1

      Money is already being made out of social problems. Has been happening for a long time now. The same arrangement the power companies operate under.

  5. Greg 5

    Typical Tory policy, to take away state capital while socializing the cost.

    quote,
    Some territorial local authorities will have increasing difficulty in maintaining service levels for an ageing and possibly dwindling population, not to mention burgeoning numbers of visitors and tourists,” it said.

    http://www.interest.co.nz/opinion/70999/bernard-hickey-looks-what-depopulation-means-new-zealands-regions-and-eventually

  6. The Chairman 6

    “Bill English says the government has learnt lessons from the break-down of its first social bonds negotiations.”

    And the lessons learnt were what exactly? It seems he wasn’t asked.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 6.1

      More bribes needed.

      • Draco T Bastard 6.1.1

        Yep, got to guarantee super-profits before the greedy arseholes will ‘invest’. It will, of course, prove to be more economical for the government simply to do it but then National’s donors won’t get their hands in the governments cookie jar.

    • M. Gray 6.2

      What do you expect with our current media he is a media bully like the rest of his colleagues he can’t stand to be challenged or questioned like he is above that. Who does he think he is. He will go down in history as one of the weakest ever Ministers of finances we have ever had and JK one of the weakest PM’s Jenny Shipley would be the weakest.

  7. shorts 7

    How the hell could the work they’ve done have cost 1.6 Million?

  8. Pasupial 8

    Frank Macskasy did a great post a couple of weeks ago about the systematic underfunding of CYF in preparation for NAct’s social bondage. He particularly focused on this Nation interview (but the whole is certainly worth reading for its meticulous research and context):

    Lisa Owen: “But one of the concerns is that there is a risk of cherry-picking. You know, if you have a private provider, are they only going to take the easier kids? Because we know… The Nation’s been told of a situation this week where a private provider wouldn’t take a particular child because they said the case was just too tough… Will you stop that happening? … So will they lose their contract if they keep refusing to take tougher cases? … one of the major concerns is that the too-hard basket will still be full and it will be CYF who deals with those people.”

    Tolley’s reply was like a bombshell – and one that Lisa Owen apparently did not pick up on. In terms that were unusually unequivocal for a politician, the Minister announced the impending demise of Child Youth and Family (CYF);

    Anne Tolley: “Well, CYF is gone. You know, it’s finished. It’s gone. It hasn’t worked and we’re changing, so we’re now going to a system that works with children from prevention right through to transition.”

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2016/06/26/tdb-exclusive-investigation-cyf-the-hollowing-out-of-a-state-agency/

    • Greg 8.1

      It begs the question of why politicians will never make great plumbers,
      when they cant fix problems that they created in the first place…

      they should have Einsteins definition of insantity printed on a plaque on their desk or on their wall.

      http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/alberteins133991.html

    • maninthemiddle 8.2

      CYF’s problems date to well before National came to power. Macskasy is a conspiracy theorist, with little understanding of what has made CYFS ‘tick’ for decades.

      • KJT 8.2.1

        CYF’s has been dysfunctional for decades.

        Since National they have failed completely.

      • M. Gray 8.2.2

        Stop blaming the previous govt this lot have been in how many years now and they have created a mess unprecedented divisiveness and relative poverty everywhere in our country. And our debt has increased ten fold and we have sold some assets for what. And Max Bradfords promises of power competition bringing us lower power bills has hairs on it like everything the pnats touch they have been lying for 8 years now and it continues until the next election and NZers need to get some Guts and get rid of this lot.

  9. KJT 9

    One thing you can be sure of.

    If it has failed elsewhere it has been tried, National will do it.

    However. Has it failed under National’s terms?

    Charter schools in the USA have been hugely successful in making private providers rich on tax payer dollars.

    Similarly with private prisons.

    And public/private partnerships in building infrastructure/hospitals etc in the UK.

    If you take the indication of success as how many lucrative private positions/business opportunities politicians get after leaving parliament, they have been a huge success.

    • maninthemiddle 9.1

      Charter schools have been very successful at improving educational outcomes, and now we’re seeing that in NZ. Bring on more, I say.

      • KJT 9.1.1

        Where.

        On average they have been no better than State schools, despite costing much more.

        In other words, simply resourcing State schools properly would have given much better outcomes for many more children at less cost.

        As well as taking funding which we could have used to improve State schools.

        Imagine what Tikipunga High Schools special needs classes could have done with the same Teacher/Pupil ratio as the much touted, and failing, military style academy in Whangarei.

        • Greg 9.1.1.1

          Charter schools creating doctors, etc=0

          whats the cost so far 80k per child,
          can someone do the math,

        • maninthemiddle 9.1.1.2

          “despite costing much more.”
          No, they don’t. Charter schools costs less to set up, and less to run in the long run.

          “simply resourcing State schools properly would have given much better outcomes for many more children at less cost.”
          False. You information is simply incorrect, so it’s hardly surprising your conclusions are bs.

      • dv 9.1.2

        What charter school you are you sending you children to SM?

      • Macro 9.1.3

        Charter schools have been very successful at improving educational outcomes, and now we’re seeing that in NZ. Bring on more, I say.

        🙄

      • mpledger 9.1.4

        If your idea of success is buying farmland with tax dollars and getting to keep it than Charter School have been a massive success. If your idea of success is of kids getting qualifications and staying in school then no.

      • Anno1701 9.1.5

        “Charter schools have been very successful at improving educational outcomes”

        thats funny , from what i have seen they have been an abject/expensive failure

        ill have some of what maninthemiddle is smoking please !

        • KJT 9.1.5.1

          No point giving references to all the extensive evidence, from around the world, of the failure of privatising education.

          Like all good right wing “Authoritarian followers

          maninthemiddle

          Will simply ignore it.

          • maninthemiddle 9.1.5.1.1

            Education has been ‘privatised’ for centuries, long before the state became involved.

            • KJT 9.1.5.1.1.1

              Only for those who could pay a fortune.

              Note the countries with the best educational outcomes do not have private schools.

              • maninthemiddle

                Wrong. On both points. Private citizens have funded education for the poor for centuries, as they have health care.

            • KJT 9.1.5.1.1.2

              Keep up to date.

              Just had another fail.

              And all have been found to be expelling any students which are hard to teach.

        • maninthemiddle 9.1.5.2

          You need to read more. One partnership school failed, which is proof of their accountability. The rest are successfully educating students the state system had failed.

        • maninthemiddle 9.1.5.3

          The ideological opposition to Partnership Schools is hilarious. Introduce an innovative, evidence based model, with significant overseas success, giving parents choice and targeting at risk kids, and the left oppose it because their cosy little union dominated jobs are at risk. Always good for a laugh. Meanwhile, more kids get a terrific education they weren’t getting in the public system.

  10. Peter 10

    Why do National pursue such policies? To provide opportunities for individuals to profit from the government sector.

    Placing resources in private hands is always the underlying agenda of the Right. This recent article suggests that will be a post-Brexit agenda of the conservatives:

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/04/disaster-capitalism-tory-right-brexit-roll-back-state

  11. UncookedSelachimorpha 11

    The belief that profit is the *only* effective or understandable motivation for any action is utter garbage. Remember when delivering a public service was considered a worthwhile and honourable endeavour in its own right? Used to be the case, but I don’t think the nats could even understand the concept.

    Social bonds for mental health services are a shameful disgrace.

  12. Richardrawshark 12

    The only thing that will fix this National catastrophe is a change of government.

    Seriously a change of government is required because this is not the only thing they are failing on. This in an unbiased point of view is pretty hard to spot a positive on on outcomes or performance.

    Their behaviour is a separate issue and that’s pretty bad as well.

    At the end of the day as our current PM would say.

    I don’t agree with this government. On much, if at all.

  13. whateva next? 13

    White man behind a desk makes more sense than any of our government, (one again) he explains”social bonds” perfectly:
    https://youtu.be/naqdZWjgak0

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  • The Hoon around the week to April 19
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
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  • Nicola's Salad Days.
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    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
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  • Weekly Roundup 19-April-2024
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  • Clearing up confusion (or trying to)
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  • How to Retrieve Deleted Call Log iPhone Without Computer
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  • Where on a Computer is the Operating System Generally Stored? Delving into the Digital Home of your ...
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  • How Much Does it Cost to Fix a Laptop Screen? Navigating Repair Options and Costs
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  • Climate Change: Turning the tide
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    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
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    2 days ago
  • Faxing from Your Computer A Modern Guide to Sending Documents Digitally
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  • Protecting Your Home Computer A Guide to Cyber Awareness
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  • Server-Based Computing Powering the Modern Digital Landscape
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  • Vroom vroom go the big red trucks
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    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
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  • Jones finds $410,000 to help the government muscle in on a spat project
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    2 days ago
  • Again, hate crimes are not necessarily terrorism.
    Having written, taught and worked for the US government on issues involving unconventional warfare and terrorism for 30-odd years, two things irritate me the most when the subject is discussed in public. The first is the Johnny-come-lately academics-turned-media commentators who … Continue reading ...
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  • Despair – construction consenting edition
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
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  • Coalition promises – will the Govt keep the commitment to keep Kiwis equal before the law?
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    2 days ago
  • An impermanent public service is a guarantee of very little else but failure
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    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    2 days ago

  • PM’s South East Asia mission does the business
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  • $41m to support clean energy in South East Asia
    New Zealand is demonstrating its commitment to reducing global greenhouse emissions, and supporting clean energy transition in South East Asia, through a contribution of NZ$41 million (US$25 million) in climate finance to the Asian Development Bank (ADB)-led Energy Transition Mechanism (ETM). Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Climate Change Minister Simon Watts announced ...
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    1 day ago
  • Minister releases Fast-track stakeholder list
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
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  • Judicial appointments announced
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  • Education Minister heads to major teaching summit in Singapore
    Education Minister Erica Stanford will lead the New Zealand delegation at the 2024 International Summit on the Teaching Profession (ISTP) held in Singapore. The delegation includes representatives from the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) Te Wehengarua and the New Zealand Educational Institute (NZEI) Te Riu Roa.  The summit is co-hosted ...
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  • Value of stopbank project proven during cyclone
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  • Anzac commemorations, Türkiye relationship focus of visit
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  • Minister to Europe for OECD meeting, Anzac Day
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  • Comprehensive Partnership the goal for NZ and the Philippines
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon held a bilateral meeting today with the President of the Philippines, Ferdinand Marcos Jr.  The Prime Minister was accompanied by MP Paulo Garcia, the first Filipino to be elected to a legislature outside the Philippines. During today’s meeting, Prime Minister Luxon and President Marcos Jr discussed opportunities to ...
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    2 days ago
  • Government commits $20m to Westport flood protection
    The Government has announced that $20 million in funding will be made available to Westport to fund much needed flood protection around the town. This measure will significantly improve the resilience of the community, says Local Government Minister Simeon Brown. “The Westport community has already been allocated almost $3 million ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Taupō takes pole position
    The Government is proud to support the first ever Repco Supercars Championship event in Taupō as up to 70,000 motorsport fans attend the Taupō International Motorsport Park this weekend, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. “Anticipation for the ITM Taupō Super400 is huge, with tickets and accommodation selling out weeks ...
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    2 days ago
  • Cost of living support for low-income homeowners
    Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced an increase to the Rates Rebate Scheme, putting money back into the pockets of low-income homeowners.  “The coalition Government is committed to bringing down the cost of living for New Zealanders. That includes targeted support for those Kiwis who are doing things tough, such ...
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    2 days ago
  • Government backing mussel spat project
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  • Government focused on getting people into work
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    2 days ago
  • Clean energy key driver to reducing emissions
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    3 days ago
  • Earthquake-prone buildings review brought forward
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    3 days ago
  • Thailand and NZ to agree to Strategic Partnership
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and his Thai counterpart, Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, have today agreed that New Zealand and the Kingdom of Thailand will upgrade the bilateral relationship to a Strategic Partnership by 2026. “New Zealand and Thailand have a lot to offer each other. We have a strong mutual desire to build ...
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    3 days ago
  • Government consults on extending coastal permits for ports
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    3 days ago
  • Inflation coming down, but more work to do
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • School attendance restored as a priority in health advice
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Unnecessary bureaucracy cut in oceans sector
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    4 days ago
  • Patterson promoting NZ’s wool sector at International Congress
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
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  • Removing red tape to help early learners thrive
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • McClay reaffirms strong NZ-China trade relationship
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Prime Minister Luxon acknowledges legacy of Singapore Prime Minister Lee
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon today paid tribute to Singapore’s outgoing Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong.   Meeting in Singapore today immediately before Prime Minister Lee announced he was stepping down, Prime Minister Luxon warmly acknowledged his counterpart’s almost twenty years as leader, and the enduring legacy he has left for Singapore and South East ...
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    5 days ago
  • PMs Luxon and Lee deepen Singapore-NZ ties
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Antarctica New Zealand Board appointments
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has made further appointments to the Board of Antarctica New Zealand as part of a continued effort to ensure the Scott Base Redevelopment project is delivered in a cost-effective and efficient manner.  The Minister has appointed Neville Harris as a new member of the Board. Mr ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Finance Minister travels to Washington DC
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  • Pet bonds a win/win for renters and landlords
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  • Long Tunnel for SH1 Wellington being considered
    State Highway 1 (SH1) through Wellington City is heavily congested at peak times and while planning continues on the duplicate Mt Victoria Tunnel and Basin Reserve project, the Government has also asked NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) to consider and provide advice on a Long Tunnel option, Transport Minister Simeon Brown ...
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    6 days ago
  • New Zealand condemns Iranian strikes
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Foreign Minister Winston Peters have condemned Iran’s shocking and illegal strikes against Israel.    “These attacks are a major challenge to peace and stability in a region already under enormous pressure," Mr Luxon says.    "We are deeply concerned that miscalculation on any side could ...
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    6 days ago
  • Huge interest in Government’s infrastructure plans
    Hundreds of people in little over a week have turned out in Northland to hear Regional Development Minister Shane Jones speak about plans for boosting the regional economy through infrastructure. About 200 people from the infrastructure and associated sectors attended an event headlined by Mr Jones in Whangarei today. Last ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Health Minister thanks outgoing Health New Zealand Chair
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    1 week ago
  • Roads of National Significance planning underway
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Navigating an unstable global environment
    New Zealand is renewing its connections with a world facing urgent challenges by pursuing an active, energetic foreign policy, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says.   “Our country faces the most unstable global environment in decades,” Mr Peters says at the conclusion of two weeks of engagements in Egypt, Europe and the United States.    “We cannot afford to sit back in splendid ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • NZ welcomes Australian Governor-General
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    1 week ago
  • Pseudoephedrine back on shelves for Winter
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    1 week ago
  • NZ and the US: an ever closer partnership
    New Zealand and the United States have recommitted to their strategic partnership in Washington DC today, pledging to work ever more closely together in support of shared values and interests, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says.    “The strategic environment that New Zealand and the United States face is considerably more ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Joint US and NZ declaration
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago

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