web analytics

Unedifying

Written By: - Date published: 9:44 am, June 19th, 2009 - 28 comments
Categories: education, maori party - Tags:

The Herald reports Pita Sharples has backed down on his demand to ‘open’ the universities to Maori. Now he says:

“he wants Maori to have free access to universities but only if they pass a course showing they have reached required standards.”

We already have that, Pita. Just get whatever they call UE these days at school or pass a bridging course at uni and in you go.

In fact, you can even get in if you fail a bridging course sometimes but 90% of people who do that fail because they’re either just not up to it or unable to give uni study the concentration it needs. So, you’re not actually calling for any change, are you Pita?

Yeah, not enough people from poor backgrounds, disproportionally Maori, get to uni. But the solution isn’t to make getting into uni easier. That’s just setting more people up to fail and leave with nothing more than student loans. And the solution to that certainly isn’t to make getting degrees easier, they’re already too easy.

The resource has to be put into early childhood education – to get the building blocks right – and into continuing literacy and numeracy education for those who didn’t get a good education when they were young. That’s where Sharples should be concerntrating his efforts.

A pity that Sharples has no credibility on education any more after the government he is part of slashed funding for early childhood and adult education in the Budget.
-Marty G

28 comments on “Unedifying”

  1. the sprout 1

    oh well, at least he was seen acting in the interests of his constituency for one day.

  2. Merlin 2

    Ooh. exciting new error message that time guys – was it pirate ghosts or Niblet?

  3. Bill 3

    Marty, all the literacy and numeracy skills in the world count for nought if University is simply unaffordable.

    The days of university being the preserve of kids from fairly well off families have returned.

    A percentage of Maori, working class kids, PI kids and so on are excluded on purely financial grounds.

    A lesser, but important second hurdle is that education caters to middle class kids better than others because education is built around middle class pre-conceptions and mores.

    Success, as Zappa put it in relation to Africans in the US involved them trading in their dashiki for some tight ass jeans….assimilating to the dominant culture at the expense of your own history/ dignity.

    • gingercrush 3.1

      The days of university being the preserve of kids from fairly well off families have returned.

      You haven’t stepped foot on a university for years have you. Its far easier to afford University today than it was even six years ago. Allowances are easier to get. Loans don’t get interest charged anymore if you stay in New Zealand.

      • Pascal's bookie 3.1.1

        “You haven’t stepped foot on a university for years have you”

        Now there’s an image. Secret agenda! Secret Agenda!! 🙂

      • Bill 3.1.2

        Yes GC.

        Had two stints at uni. Qualified for the allowance both times. Poverty drove me out on both occasions.

        The difference in the Uni culture between my first stint and the second was quite remarkable. Students from middle class backgrounds and students from overseas dominated the student population.

        The demographic change had a marked effect on student culture. ( A detrimental one in my opinion.)

        • gingercrush 3.1.2.1

          Well I don’t see it. My uni days of 2004-2008 saw many lower and low-middle class students. Certainly not your rich students as you put it. Indeed for the vast majority of students they require an allowance or at the least are dependent on a student loan.

          Your rant that university can only be for middle and upper income people is simply absurd. Your idea that these students aren’t having part-time jobs and aren’t dependent on government support is even more absurd.

          You then attack the education standards. Yet surely that do would do even more harm for lower income students. Just because you couldn’t make it in university doesn’t mean others could. Sometimes you have to make sacrifices. You clearly weren’t prepared to that. Instead, you go on a pathetic tangent and attack so-called rich students.

          • Bill 3.1.2.1.1

            “You then attack the education standards. Yet surely that do would do even more harm for lower income students.”

            ‘Cause poor people are thick? Apart from that reading as though you’re having an apoplectic fit, way to go gc!

  4. Merlin 4

    Bill. I totally agree with what you’re saying but that’s not what Sharples is saying. He’s saying no academic barriers to entry. If anything the academic barriers are too low already. More scholarships and assistance for students from poor families but not lower academic standards.

    • Bill 4.1

      I probably did go off at a bit of a tangent in an attempt to expand on the matter. Regardless, I agree with you.

      Everything has been dumbed down to better facilitate the flow of the $. I’d like to see working class et al being able to access University again and for academic standards to rise.

      Not going to happen under market driven user pays though.

  5. Greg 5

    Bill,

    “A percentage of Maori, working class kids, PI kids and so on are excluded on purely financial grounds.”

    How? Student allowance combined with a part time job supplies more than enough to go to university. The real plight is the kids of well off parents who refuse to fund their way through university. They don’t even get the allowance.

    • Bill 5.1

      How? Because they’re fucking poor you dick. No mummy and daddy with a handy little bail out for food or electric or whatever.

      The allowance is less than the (wholly inadequate) UB yet day to day expenses are much higher…transport, course materials, meals etc, etc.

      edit. ok. Being a bit harsh there. sorry. I have met kids of rich parents who have left them to sink without a trace at Uni.

      • Bill 5.1.1

        Maybe those kids with tight arsed rich parents should become the Bain of their parent’s life?

        • Maynard J 5.1.1.1

          Bain or bane?

          That is very funny, but I assume unintentional. Although ‘the Bain’ would solve the parental income problem 😉

    • Draco T Bastard 5.2

      Tried that – couldn’t get a part time job.

  6. Ianmac 6

    The thing that bothers me is that while our youngest went through varsity on student loans, there were some from wealthy families who had their income hidden in Trusts, thereby enabling their children to have an Allowance instead of a loan. Somehow more than 60% (?) of students qualify for Student Allowance up to about $175 pw.

    • Bill 6.1

      Hmm, thing that bothers me is that the concept of ‘free’ education has dropped right off the agenda.

      I say ‘free’, because it was retrospectively covered through higher taxation on your earnings if the education had served you well and secured you a high income job.

  7. Greg 7

    Bill,

    “How? Because they’re fucking poor you dick. No mummy and daddy with a handy little bail out for food or electric or whatever.

    The allowance is less than the (wholly inadequate) UB yet day to day expenses are much higher transport, course materials, meals etc, etc.”

    I never suggested that the allowance was enough in itself, what I did say was that combined with a part time job (say 10 hours a week) the weekly income is more than enough to educate yourself.

    Life isn’t fair, some will always get it easier than others. But to say anybody is excluded on financial grounds is ridiculous.

    You also make the big assumption that parents who can afford to, pay for their children’s university expenses. In my experience this is certainly not the norm.

    • Bill 7.1

      So I am being ridiculous when I state that I literally cannot afford to go to university? Ok. That’s your considered opinion. Whatever.

      Not so long ago education was a level playing field, at least financially speaking. Still is in some countries.

  8. Greg 8

    Also Bill,

    ‘Free’ education with high retrospective taxes is an incredibly inefficient way to fund university education. Why not pay for your own education with the help of a government backed loan? Therefore you can pay that loan back when you graduate and get a well paid job. It stops people who don’t go to university paying for others to go through. All while keeping university open to any New Zealander, irrespective of their parents income.

    Ianmac – couldn’t agree more. Why this loop hole not been closed? Another classic case of the transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich

    • Bill 8.1

      FFS Greg!

      Let’s say I’d never gone to Uni. Now lets say I have to go to the dentist. My dentist is paying off a loan. Higher charges. I pay.

      Before user pays, they were in the same higher tax bracket as now and didn’t have to up their charges to cover loan repayments.

      And you contend that the numbers of working class kids going to Uni has dropped why? You say it has nothing to do with affordability. So what is the reason?

  9. Greg 9

    Bill,

    If your starting from a level playing field (ie no debts) there is no reason why you should not be able to fund your own way through university. I do it.

    “Let’s say I’d never gone to Uni. Now lets say I have to go to the dentist. My dentist is paying off a loan. Higher charges. I pay.”

    This is true. However, if university is funded by retrospective tax your going to be in the same boat. Either way someone has to pay the university bills. Except chances are that increase is going to be even higher. Yes we used to have universally free education, but then we did not have working for families, kiwi saver and countless other policies. Now I’m not saying I entirely agree with all these policies but would you rather your tax dollars went to someone with a genuine need, who doesn’t have the prospect of a high future income.

    I agree that New Zealanders should not be excluded on financial grounds, but they are not.

    “And you contend that the numbers of working class kids going to Uni has dropped why? You say it has nothing to do with affordability. So what is the reason?”

    Could you supply your source please. I would suspect that there would have been a drop off after university stopped being free (for obvious reasons – you increase the cost of something less people are always going to do it – but that doesn’t make it unaffordable). But obviously I can’t comment fully without seeing your stats.

Links to post

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • Support for arts and music sector recovery
    A jobseekers programme for the creative sector and four new funds have been set up by the Government to help our arts and music industry recover from the blow of COVID-19. Thousands of jobs will be supported through today’s $175 million package in a crucial economic boost to support the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    13 hours ago
  • Legislative changes to support the wellbeing of veterans and their families
    Minister for Veterans Ron Mark has welcomed the First Reading of a Bill that will make legislative changes to further improve the veterans’ support system.  The Veterans’ Support Amendment Bill No 2, which will amend the Veterans’ Support Act 2014, passed First Reading today. The bill addresses a number of ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    15 hours ago
  • Christ Church Cathedral – Order in Council
    Views sought on Order in Council to help fast track the reinstatement of the Christ Church Cathedral  The Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration, Hon Poto Williams, will be seeking public written comment, following Cabinet approving the drafting of an Order in Council aimed at fast-tracking the reinstatement of the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    17 hours ago
  • New Zealanders’ human rights better protected in new Bill
    The law setting out New Zealanders’ basic civil and human rights is today one step towards being strengthened following the first reading of a Bill that requires Parliament to take action if a court says a statute undermines those rights. At present, a senior court can issue a ‘declaration of ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Deep concern at Hong Kong national security legislation
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters today reiterated the deep concern of the New Zealand Government following confirmation by China’s National People’s Congress of national security legislation relating to Hong Kong. “New Zealand shares the international community’s significant and long-standing stake in Hong Kong’s prosperity and stability,” Mr Peters said. “New Zealand ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Government invests in New Zealand’s cultural recovery
    Thousands of artists and creatives at hundreds of cultural and heritage organisations have been given much-needed support to recover from the impact of COVID-19, Prime Minister and Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Jacinda Ardern announced today. “The cultural sector was amongst the worst hit by the global pandemic,” Jacinda ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Better protection for New Zealand assets during COVID-19 crisis
    Key New Zealand assets will be better protected from being sold to overseas owners in a way contrary to the national interest, with the passage of the Overseas Investment (Urgent Measures) Bill. The Bill, which passed its third reading in Parliament today, also cuts unnecessary red tape to help attract ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Cleaning up our rivers and lakes
    Setting higher health standards at swimming spots Requiring urban waterways to be cleaned up and new protections for urban streams Putting controls on higher-risk farm practices such as winter grazing and feed lots Setting stricter controls on nitrogen pollution and new bottom lines on other measures of waterway health Ensuring ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Record year for diversity on Govt boards
    The Government is on the verge of reaching its target of state sector boards and committees made up of at least 50 percent women, says Minister for Women Julie Anne Genter and Minister for Ethnic Communities Jenny Salesa. For the first time, the Government stocktake measures the number of Māori, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New appointments to the Commerce Commission
    The Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister and Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media Minister, Kris Faafoi, has today announced the appointment of Tristan Gilbertson as the new Telecommunications Commissioner and member of the Commerce Commission. “Mr Gilbertson has considerable experience in the telecommunications industry and a strong reputation amongst his peers,” ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Historic pay equity settlement imminent for teacher aides
    The Ministry of Education and NZEI Te Riu Roa have agreed to settle the pay equity claim for teacher aides, Education Minister Chris Hipkins announced today. This will see more than 22,000 teacher aides, mostly women, being valued and paid fairly for the work they do. “Teacher aides are frontline ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Govt delivers security for construction subcontractors
    Subcontractors will have greater certainty, more cashflow support and job security with new changes to retention payments under the Construction Contracts Act says Minister for Building and Construction, Jenny Salesa. A recent review of the retentions money regime showed that most of the building and construction sector is complying with ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New Zealand and Singapore reaffirm ties
    Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Singapore Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong have marked the first anniversary of the New Zealand-Singapore Enhanced Partnership with a virtual Leaders’ Meeting today. The Enhanced Partnership, signed on 17 May 2019, provides the framework for cooperation across the four main areas of trade, defence and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • JOINT STATEMENT BY THE PRIME MINISTERS OF NEW ZEALAND AND THE REPUBLIC OF SINGAPORE ON THE FIRST AN...
    On 17 May 2019, New Zealand and Singapore established an Enhanced Partnership to elevate our relations. The Enhanced Partnership – based on the four pillars of trade and economics, security and defence, science, technology and innovation, and people-to-people links – has seen the long-standing relationship between our countries strengthen over the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Government investment supports the acquisition of new Interislander ferries
    State-Owned Enterprises Minister Winston Peters has welcomed KiwiRail’s announcement that it is seeking a preferred shipyard to build two new rail-enabled ferries for the Cook Strait crossing. “This Government is committed to restoring rail to its rightful place in New Zealand. Bigger, better ships, with new technology are yet another ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Better protection for seabirds
    Better protection for seabirds is being put in place with a new National Plan of Action to reduce fishing-related captures, Fisheries Minister Stuart Nash and Conservation Minister Eugenie Sage announced today.   The National Plan of Action for Seabirds 2020 outlines our commitment to reduce fishing-related captures and associated seabird ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Milestone in cash flow support to SMEs
    Almost $1 billion in interest-free loans for small businesses More than 55,000 businesses have applied; 95% approved Average loan approx. $17,300 90% of applications from firms with ten or fewer staff A wide cross-section of businesses have applied, the most common are the construction industry, accommodation providers, professional firms, and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Government protects kids as smoking in cars ban becomes law
    Thousands of children will have healthier lungs after the Government’s ban on smoking in cars with kids becomes law, says Associate Minister of Health Jenny Salesa. This comes after the third reading of Smoke-free Environments (Prohibiting Smoking in Motor Vehicles Carrying Children) Amendment Bill earlier today. “This law makes it ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Parliament returns to a safe normal
    The special Epidemic Response Committee (ERC) has successfully concluded its role, Leader of the House Chris Hipkins said today. The committee was set up on 25 March by the agreement of Parliament to scrutinise the Government and its actions while keeping people safe during levels 4 and 3 of lockdown. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Foreign Minister makes four diplomatic appointments
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters today announced four diplomatic appointments: New Zealand’s Ambassador to Belgium, High Commissioners to Nauru and Niue, and Ambassador for Counter-Terrorism. “As the world seeks to manage and then recover from COVID-19, our diplomatic and trade networks are more important than ever,” Mr Peters said. “The ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • New Bill to counter violent extremism online
    New Zealanders will be better protected from online harm through a Bill introduced to Parliament today, says Internal Affairs Minister Tracey Martin. “The internet brings many benefits to society but can also be used as a weapon to spread harmful and illegal content and that is what this legislation targets,” ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Mycoplasma bovis eradication reaches two year milestone in good shape
    New Zealand’s world-first plan to eradicate the cattle disease Mycoplasma bovis is on track the latest technical data shows, says Agriculture and Biosecurity Minister Damien O’Connor. “Two years ago the Government, DairyNZ and Beef + Lamb New Zealand and industry partners made a bold decision to go hard and commit ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • New payment to support Kiwis through COVID
    Further support for New Zealanders affected by 1-in-100 year global economic shock 12-week payment will support people searching for new work or retraining Work programme on employment insurance to support workers and businesses The Government today announced a new temporary payment to support New Zealanders who lose their jobs due ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • PGF reset helps regional economies
    The Provincial Growth Fund will play a vital role in New Zealand’s post-COVID-19 recovery by creating jobs in shorter timeframes through at least $600 million being refocused on projects with more immediate economic benefits, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones has announced. The funding is comprised of repurposed Provincial Growth ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Government exempts some home improvements from costly consents
    Government exempts some home improvements from costly consents Homeowners, builders and DIYers will soon have an easier time making basic home improvements as the Government scraps the need for consents for low-risk building work such as sleep-outs, sheds and carports – allowing the construction sector to fire back up quicker ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Concern at introduction of national security legislation for Hong Kong
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters says the New Zealand Government has reacted with concern at the introduction of legislation in China’s National People’s Congress relating to national security in Hong Kong.  “We have a strong interest in seeing confidence maintained in the ‘one country, two systems’ principle under which Hong ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Samoa Language Week theme is perfect for the post-COVID-19 journey
    The Minister for Pacific Peoples Aupito William Sio, says the theme for the 2020 Samoa Language Week is a perfect fit for helping our Pacific communities cope with the unfolding COVID-19 crisis, and to prepare now for the journey ahead as New Zealand focuses on recovery plans and rebuilding New ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Adult kakī/black stilt numbers soar
    A nearly 40-year programme to protect one of New Zealand’s most critically endangered birds is paying off, with a record number of adult kakī/black stilt recently recorded living in the wild, the Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage announced today. “Thanks to the team effort involved in the Department of Conservation’s ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Waikato-Tainui settlement story launched on 25th anniversary of Treaty signing
    The story of the Waikato-Tainui Treaty process and its enduring impact on the community is being told with a five-part web story launched today on the 25th anniversary of settlement, announced Associate Arts, Culture and Heritage Minister Carmel Sepuloni. “I am grateful to Waikato-Tainui for allowing us to help capture ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Taita College to benefit from $32 million school redevelopment
    Taita College in the Hutt Valley will be redeveloped to upgrade its ageing classrooms and leaky roofs, Education Minister Chris Hipkins announced today. “The work is long overdue and will make a lasting difference to the school for generations to come,” Chris Hipkins said. “Too many of our schools are ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Redeployment for workers in hard-hit regions
    The Government is allocating $36.72 million to projects in regions hard hit economically by COVID-19 to keep people working, Economic Development Minister Phil Twyford and Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. Projects in Hawke’s Bay, Northland, Rotorua and Queenstown will be funded from the Government’s $100 million worker ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • $35m to build financial resilience for New Zealanders
    A $35m boost to financial capability service providers funded by MSD will help New Zealanders manage their money better both day to day and through periods of financial difficulty, announced Social Development Minister Carmel Sepuloni. “It’s always been our position to increase support to key groups experiencing or at risk ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New District Court Judge appointed
    Dunedin barrister Melinda Broek has been appointed as a District Court Judge with Family Court jurisdiction to be based in Rotorua, Attorney-General David Parker announced today. Ms Broek has iwi affiliations to Ngai Tai. She commenced her employment in 1996 with Scholefield Cockroft Lloyd in Invercargill specialising in family and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • $206 million investment in upgrades at Ohakea Air Force Base
    The Coalition Government has approved a business case for $206 million in upgrades to critical infrastructure at Royal New Zealand Air Force Base Ohakea, with the first phase starting later this year, Defence Minister Ron Mark announced today. The investment will be made in three phases over five years, and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Review of CAA organisational culture released
    Transport Minister Phil Twyford today released the Ministry of Transport’s review of the organisational culture at the Civil Aviation Authority. Phil Twyford says all employees are entitled to a safe work environment. “I commissioned this independent review due to the concerns I had about the culture within the CAA, and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Board appointed at Stats NZ
    Ensuring that Stats NZ’s direction and strategy best supports government policy decisions will be a key focus for a new Governance Advisory Board announced today by the Minister for Statistics, James Shaw. The new Governance Advisory Board will provide strategic advice to Stats NZ to ensure it is meeting New ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Principal Environment Judge
    Environment Judge David Kirkpatrick of Auckland has been appointed as the Principal Environment Judge, Attorney-General David Parker announced today.  Judge Kirkpatrick was appointed an Environment Judge in February 2014. From December 2013 to July 2016 he was Chair of the Auckland Unitary Plan Independent Hearings Panel. Prior to appointment he ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Digital connectivity boost for urban marae
    A programme to connect marae around the country to the internet has received $1.4 million to expand to include urban marae in Auckland, Wellington and Christchurch, Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media Minister Kris Faafoi and Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. The funding for the Marae Connectivity Programme ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Govt increases assistance to drought-stricken Hawke’s Bay farmers
    The Government will provide $500,000 to the Hawke’s Bay Mayoral Drought Relief Fund to help farmers facing one of the worst droughts in living memory, says Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor. “Yesterday afternoon I received a letter from Hawke's Bay's five local Government leaders asking me to contribute to the Fund. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Investment in New Zealand’s history
    Budget 2020 provides a major investment in New Zealand’s documentary heritage sector, with a commitment to leasing a new Archives Wellington facility and an increase in funding for Archives and National Library work. “Last year I released plans for a new Archives Wellington building – a purpose-built facility physically connected ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago