Norm is teaching himself Gordon Lightfoot’s ” Edmond Fitzgerald” Canadian folk song, on the guitar, so we are late tonight.( site is bettylouallartists)
This year “student organisers have vowed to clampown on drunkeness and ban “full nudity”.
…
“In a statement, the university went on to say that staff members attend the camp.
“Mostly the person who attends is the Dean of the Law Faculty as an invited guest.”
Funny though, if beneficiaries behave like this the middle classes get quite irate about how “they” are wasting “my” money but when a student paid for by us…
I know a guy who bought a home in Dunedin while at the Uni. Rented out the rooms. Used a student loan. All with advice of his wealthy father ( who at dinner parties railed against beneficiaries taking his hard earned money). Didnt complete the Degree. Known as a drug dealer. Maxed the student loan. Sold the house, moved home to Auckland and working for his Dad.
“Not surprised when it comes to the legal fraternity”
True. If they were like all the other Otago students they would be burning their sofas in the streets.
Favourite activity of the denizens from that University I understand. Why do the Law students try and be different?
For the people who think it’s just a bit of fun and students need to let off steam, read the whole article, then go read up on the emerging #metoo story about NZ law firms. Those things are connected, and if you’re not already making the connections it’s time to start listening to what women are saying about this.
Ah, I see. This bit has “law students as future sexual harrassment risk management nightmares” written all over it:
One girl was selected from each group to take part in a jelly wrestling competition.
…
“All the senior fifth year students pulled out chairs right next to the pit…”
So, it’s not actually a story about students drinking and taking their clothes off, it’s a story about hazing, sexual harassment and abuse of authority. It would help if journalists and the University were capable of distinguishing between those things.
Pretty much. I think anything with ‘law’ and ‘full nudity/jelly wrestling’ or similar should be raising eyebrows now. That’s one whole big mess of culture and entrenched attitudes that will take some time to unravel.
Senior students setting up chairs as the inner ring while others are behind them.
Would love to see the demographic breakdown of tge participant/organisers.
ALL claims of a changed legal culture are beginning to sound very hollow.
I left this profession in 1995 for similar reasons as are being revealed today. Add in a boss who average a secretary every 6 months for the 5 years I worked for him. Who would ask them if they liked “being such a stupid cunt”.
Stood at my door one day and yelled at me, nay screamed, what sort of stupid cunt does that?”. I stood up. Got the file. Flicked to the page whereI had recorded his instructions. Showed him. He looked said ” fuck it” and walked off. I went to the tooilet and vommitted.
The other partner had an office next to mine and must have heard the whole exchange.
This is so important. The hypocrisy I’ve seen from Otago law faculty over the Russell McVeagh revelations has made me sick. Law camp is a dangerous activity that puts young people and especially young women in harm’s way. https://t.co/AbFeii9d7R
The one point I didn’t realise, is that the Treaty of Waitangi claim on this issue is still unresolved. A great opportunity for Labour to walk the talk – as Moana Maniapoto pointed out.
Just pasting this in here from the James Shaw’s speech to the Green Summer Policy Conference thread, as I keep seeing comments along the lines of the government, and in particular the Greens, not having done much in all that lengthy time it’s been in power. Here are a few of the things they’ve done in the last few months:
Collectively, our ministers have already announced a review of the Waste Minimisation Act, so that it finally works the way Nandor intended when his Bill was passed in 2008;
We’ve announced the imminent creation of a Climate Commission and a Carbon Zero Act that will legislate the elimination of greenhouse gas pollution by 2050 – the most significant piece of environmental legislation in our country’s history;
We’ve initiated a work programme into sexual harassment in the workplace;
We’ve reconvened the pay equity group so that women can finally be paid what they deserve.
And just this week the Government announced a law change that will help ensure future legislation complies with the Human Rights Act – that’s long been our policy and that couldn’t have happened without the Greens in government.
All of this in four months, and that’s just what we’ve been able to talk about publicly.
If you find that unimpressive, and I expect there are some who would, stop to consider for a moment what a NACT/NZ First government would have done in the last four months.
“just what we’ve been able to talk about publicly”.
So what is in the other 33 pages of the Labour/NZF agreement that you committed to support and are rather embarrassed to mention?
You claim to be open and superior to all the other parties.
Well speak up. Tell us about all the secret strategy that Winston the First has ordered you to hide from the Public of New Zealand. The stuff you aren’t allowed to talk about publicly.
Reading Shaw’s list of successes does rather guild the lily doesn’t it? I mean look at his claim that “Government announced a law change that will help ensure future legislation complies with the Human Rights Act “. “Ensure” the man says. Since any Government, including his one can, and will, simply ignore anything a Court says it is hard to see how it can possibly “ensure” anything at all.
I notice James doesn’t claim credit for scrapping a Kermadec sanctuary, and carefully ignores his agreement to support the “Preserve Winnies’ perks” bill.
Come on Shaw. Take credit for everything you support.
Oh well. I guess he can hardly admit that his main achievement was to get Winston to allow a bunch of Green MPs access to the great big BMWs reserved for the Overlords.
Outside the bizarre tinfoil-hat world of right-wing blogs, in which the Labour/NZF coalition agreement is a kind of Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact complete with Secret Additional Protocol, Shaw’s talking about the stuff that is being worked on but isn’t ready to be made public yet.
And no, Shaw doesn’t waste Green Party conference time on the subjects of previous-government clusterfucks that his government is going to have to clean up, or the various dubious antics of NZ First. He’d be a pretty poor leader if he did.
It is a flag waving “Look over here” by a Right winger.
They don’t want us to look at transparency issues!
No,” look at what the Greens haven’t done.” LOL Hehe have another go.
Fascinating.
After 128 days you try and tell me it is far to soon for me to ask that the CoL should really have got round to doing something.
Now after 129 days you are asking that I forget about it because it has been such a long time that I should have moved onto something new.
Can you not make up your mind?
Actually I can’t make up my mind what Shaw is on about. He is turning out to be the flip-flopper from Hell. Perhaps you can tell me?
Is he trying to pretend that he is important and knows lots of secrets that we mere plebs don’t know anything about because we are mushrooms?
Or is he saying that he can’t talk about plans for the future because his Boss, King Winnie the First, hasn’t told him what he is going to have to support?
Those are really the only two options of course. Which of them do you think is the real one?
It’s indeed fascinating that 129 days is one day closer to your prescient 5-month time point; is that when the Government has to have achieved more of those symbolic milestones like in the first 100 days? I’d wait 2 more days as 131 is Prime, which, for some, reason seems more appropriate to me.
You enjoy freedom of mind like we all do, to some degree, therefore I cannot force your mind to consider more than those two ‘options’ that you mentioned. So, take your pick and live in your self-created reality in and of which you’re master & commander 😉
Or you could step out of the sandpit and join the adults for mature discourse. Again, the choice is yours, as always, Alwyn.
I hope you won’t mind that I don’t jump into the sandpit tonight; it is nothing personal 😉
If you refuse to consider the list of what they have actually done and ask us to box shadows instead you have no one to blame but yourself when you dont get the replies you want.
I think at this stage of the National governments first term we were just getting the job summit
To me this article highlights the gross lack of progressive governance of the last government the fault of which lies squarely at the feet of John Key and especially Bill English.
Rather than produce programs to energise and motivate young Kiwis and their communities, and give them hope for the future, they just imported economic refugees to supercharge the economy at the same time ignoring the current disadvantaged.
It was a cheap and lazy way to go about things and lacked any vision for the future of strong and hopeful New Zealand families.
At the very least the new government will attempt energise local community programs which is a start but until all the other factors which keep disadvantaged communities down are fixed it is going to be tough.
Yes, you might be right about the timing but with the news-cycle being ca. 12 hours nowadays it pays to have balance in time & space in MSM. The Green Party goes out of its way to give both candidates equal attention, which they both deserve but also it’s principally the way to conduct these (political) affairs. MSM is still behind the eight ball.
I just looked up the link Incognito put up and went further to Newshub reference to a debate on Facebook today between Genter and Marama Davidson.
The type of comment is disturbing. The sneering, malicious attitude says that these are people who are deeply negative without any sense of interest or positivity about their fellow humans and society. People who want a good society and good politicians leading it don’t talk or think like this.
First three – it gets a bit better after:
Kiore Manarette It’s like a choice between Dumb and Dumber.. 😀
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John Briggs And who’s on the Benfit this Time???, James !!.
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Donovan Greenwood it’s got to be Marama Davidson. She doesnt have a bun in the oven so is mentally, emotionally, physically ready for the job.
Easy win for her if they’re putting politics first 🙂
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I would not read too much in those comments; do you pay much attention to comments on RW blog sites? I’ve yet to come across one (in NZ) that can hold and keep together a mature constructive debate between adults but I fully admit I’ve stop searching for it …
Incognito
I don’t follow the other sites much as I can’t bear to wear out my older years reading such god-awful trashy distasteful useless braindead comments.
So every time I come across them again I am freshly upset. I don’t do it often – my old heart can’t take the sadness.
I hear you but please don’t be sad or upset and focus on the positives, the kindness, and the beauty around and in! ourselves, in all of us. Not so long ago we apparently were sea creatures that crawled on land or mud dwellers living at the tide mark, or we were cast there by a storm more likely, and started breathing air and now we’re communicating here on TS and breathing through our noses. I call that evolution and progress 😉
They try to bring us down to their level, with intended and careless comments.
This is a time to strengthen our bonds with people who share our end goals.
Now we may argue at times how to achieve them democratically, but with good will and moves towards open Government plus a momentum building good change it will happen.
Haha Incognito and Patricia. I know what you say is true. What’s the alternative to keeping on keeping on if one doesn’t want to end up sour and negative and seeing everyone in that way.
This is a great place to meet people with heart and a desire for openness and respect for others and for us all to keep learning what we need to support each other through the testing years that have been forecast ahead, but which seem to be collapsing in time.
And still people seem to think they are living in the 1980’s only with more devices. The future is so exciting they say, but they are like people looking through a keyhole. That small view can be obliterated in a trice. But they don’t know what a trice is, that’s old language!
From memory, in their interview the other day Genter listed as an advantage the fact that being a cabinet minister would give her a higher media profile. So this is evidence for her claim.
Which might seem unfair advantage at first glance, but Davidson listed as an advantage the fact that not having ministerial duties gives her more time to work directly with the communities the Greens need to reach, so it all evens out.
Yes, you’re correct and it’s a good point to bring up, thank you.
Please note that I didn’t mention fairness as such and my main concern is balanced reporting. There are already too many pushing for the Green Party to go back to its so-called roots and stick to environmentalism or something similar. For this reason I’m concerned about lack of balance in MSM on anything to do with the GP; it’s bigger than the leadership contest between JAG and MD, which may be unfair to these two outstanding individuals.
I’m also not so sure that it really evens out at this point in time because JAG may have distinct advantage with name-recognition in the lead up but I agree that afterwards it may even out; unfortunately, only one can be elected as GP Co-Leader – a tough choice.
Who are the Green MPs shown?
I thought I had identified who the Green MPs in Parliament were but they have been so overshadowed by their Overlord The Right Honourable Sir Winston the First that they have become non-persons.
Has the election of a female leader taken place yet by the way? If so who is it?
I also thought that Shaw had grown a beard. Was I mistaken? If he tried and ended up looking like Mallard of course common sense would have told him to shave.
I’d file “What Jacinda Ardern Does with Her House” in the drawer marked “None of my fuckin’ business.”
I think that, to many who read this blog, JA setting the example “Look! I’m turning down a lot of free money for the good of society!” would be a stirring and very heartening one. However, for ordinary people, deliberately failing to make use of a significant asset is a marker of foolishness, not virtue, so she’d be nuts to do it.
The government does need to do something about this, but at the level of property and tax legislation, not the setting of personal examples.
Can’t say I agree with that, sort of like if the prime minister only chose to use private healthcare while being responsible for the public health system. Then her saving grace can be “well most kiwis think you should use private healthcare if you can afford it so I will”. Just wrong.
Our P.M. is going out of her way to support small NZ businesses, in clothing shoes and gifts. She won’t do anything without planning. She told us she is a nerd with anxieties.
Yeah, see when you said “turning down a lot of free money” you nailed it. This is what has led to the situation we are in today. If she was true to her voters she would make some sort of personal statement on this, I would have thought.
It is what has led to the situation we’re in today, but individuals setting altruistic examples isn’t going to be much help, it needs legislative change – which isn’t something Ardern can just order by fiat, especially so given that a lot of voters aren’t going to like having the government take away the magic money tree.
I think it’s a bad look generally, Ardern can buy a new million dollar house without blinking an eye while the rest of Auckland and other parts of NZ are really struggling with escalating rents and sub standard living conditions (residing in garages, cars, etc).
Imagine the leadership shown if she said she will live in a motel housing beneficiaries for 6 months to get a feeling of the housing crisis. Meanwhile she could urgently kickstart work on say an Auckland community apartment complex, being a smarter use of land and one where rents were affordable for all kiwis. Once built she could live there for another 6 – 12 months as an example of how we need bold thinking to solve the house crisis.
That’s going a bit far because how could she be expected to do her job living in a way we all recognise as unliveable?
I do think the building of a property portfolio is inconsistent with what her voters expect her to be doing about the housing crisis.
I can also see how conflicted our resident Nats must be about this. On the one hand they’d love to score points by attacking JA, but also the sanctity of making free money off residential property is untouchable.
Are you people lefties? Or just nitpicking troublemakers agin everything? Get a better outlook. And leave Jacinda and our Labour people alone unless they do something out of whack or criminal. Please. Give them a one year trial with mostly positive advice, they might heed it if you aren’t countering it with negatives like this.
Find some other target for your abuse, and your Guy Fawkes fuel. Tell me what sort of a person I am in your opinion. I’m old and it would take a strongly-tipped missive to do real damage.
Living in a motel isn’t unliveable, it’s uncomfortable sure and it’s an example of the manifestation of the housing crisis too.
What better way to solve a major problem in society than experiencing it and living it. Keep your general on the frontline so they know exactly the problems the troops face and how best to win the war.
Yeah, and John Key could’ve moved from Parnell to Manurewa too.
“Ardern can buy a new million dollar house without blinking an eye?”
I hear and read often enough about the “Women’sWeeklyisation” of the PM and the trite fluffy coverage of stuff she does, might do, could do, should do, might dream about doing, did or whatever.
She does an ordinary thing, buys a house, the world goes crazy in context and now I see she didn’t even blink an eye? Jesus wept.
I suggest you do a little research before making assumptions/ judgements/accusations of amateur landlordism, retirement investments etc.
Ardern’s parents are returning to live in Auckland,NZ in the next month or so after living in the Pacific for about the last 10 years. Her father was NZ Police liaison representative first in Niue and then in Samoa, and after his retirement from NZ Police was appointed as NZ High Commissioner to Niue and has served there for the last four years. He has now been appointed NZ Administrator of Tulelau (the last NZ dependency in the Pacific) based in Auckland.
Her sister is also returning to NZ from the UK in the next few months with her husband and two pre-school children after years of also living overseas.
The family will helping with support after the baby is born. As JA’s current home is very small, they probably need both homes in the meantime to house the returning whanau until they get themselves sorted.
Well, the motives are different. They are trying to point to a sort of deliberate hypocrisy as a way of reducing her credibility. I am concerned with what messages she’s sending to the people who are struggling with housing certainty and who voted for change.
I don’t know but it doesn’t feel right to me that they (the government) acknowledge the perils to society of multiple house caching while doing it themselves.
So you are criticising JA for intending to keep an empty house but you don’t actually know if that is what she intends to do? Can you not see a problem with that?
As I have pointed out in 7.3 above and below at 7.3.1.3, the purchase of the new house would appear to be a straightforward practical one based on the small size of the current one etc and having family (four adults and two children) returning to NZ after living overseas for years. No more; no less.
Yes Kiwiblog has a continuing stream of shallow one liner comments on it – as they do on any number of topics. However, there was some discussion on the fact you have to own for two years before selling to not be eligible for paying tax on any profit. I think that JA/CG only bought their current house about 18 months ago so would be mad to sell it before the two years is up, especially when family could live in it in the meantime.
Maybe the ones trying to point to a sort of deliberate hypocrisy as a way of reducing her credibility are rabid, one-eyed pissed-off cretins who can’t think of intelligent ways of spending their limited time on planet Earth.
The statement yesterday was that they needed a bigger house (the new one) to accommodate family who would be staying and helping following the birth.
Quite frankly, from what has been shown of the inside and outside of their current house on JA and CG’s various social media accounts, it is pretty small and compact – more a pensioner 2 bedroom unit than a family home. Even with just the two of them and a baby it would be cramped, never mind with other family.
I also understand that the current property is not very suitable for security purposes; and the need to provide for DPS officers 24/7 is causing some parking and other problems for neighbours.
No statement has been made as to whether they are going to sell their current property immediately or later. But from a practical point of view, if you have bought a new house and have family returning to NZ it makes sense to keep both in the meantime to accommodate the returnees in the short term or maybe even in the longer term.
Practically Jacinda would be unwise to sell her house as she doesn’t know how soon the support from fickle NZs for her to be PM and in politics will last. If she is rejected or becomes disillusioned with the bruising and brutal arena, she might decide to retire from it for a while, look after her toddler and take up Karate or Judo or some other non-blood fighting sport.
I suppose this matter of the secret Court case has been covered on TS. I did check to see if someone noted it on the 2/3 out of the 283 comments from 18 lead comments. I should check O/M for the 3rd but am worn out. So I will just put it up so those who are interested in what is going on, or not, in NZ can be informed.
It’s about the secret High Court case and originally published by Spinoff, written by Andrew Geddis, Professor of Law at University of Otago. And its about a Court case, very strange and worrying, and perhaps an example of how a facult can be inflated into a crime that can be inflated into something coming under some newly adopted secret law or security code.
The thin edge of the wedge often gets mentioned scornfully when people bleat about bringing in some new law, me included, but it does happen at times. Is this an example of government being despotic or acting under the supremacy of another government, bending its own laws and customs to do so?? Shades of Dotcom and our country acting under another’s orders.
So, a trial where no public or media are allowed in at all? That’s a big deal. What could it involve?
The suspicions of at least some of us were confirmed when Justice Venning, the Chief High Court Judge, released a statement confirming the subject of the case. It involves an appeal by a Melbourne-based New Zealand woman against a decision to cancel her passport on the grounds that she represents a national security threat to some other, unspecified country. By removing her passport, the New Zealand government says it can neutralise that threat by stopping her from being able to travel there.
How do we know this? Because her case already has been before the High Court last year, when she sought to challenge the government’s claim that not only did her appeal have to be held in secret, but that neither she nor her lawyer were allowed to know the reasons why her passport had been cancelled.
Those reasons, said the government, constituted “classified security information”. And under the Passports Act 2002, it’s not just the public and press who can’t be in the courtroom to hear the content of such information. Neither can the person whose passport is cancelled, nor that person’s lawyer.
Justice Dobson, who heard that earlier case and is hearing the current one as well, was not entirely happy about this situation. As he noted in a judgment that somewhat reluctantly concluded that the legislation had to be read in this manner:
“The whole of our common law tradition, as bolstered by the rights and protections recognised by New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990, render the procedure under [the Passports Act] an anathema to the fundamental concepts of fairness. However, the reality is that Parliament has recognised the justification for the use of that procedure in defined circumstances.”
So, here’s what is happening in the High Court in Wellington. A woman is asking to get her passport back after the government took it off her. She is doing so without knowing the evidence the government has for deciding she represents a security risk, without being able to be in the court to watch the case being argued, and without being able to have her own lawyer present to argue for her (although some unnamed “advocates” have been appointed to “assist with issues that have to be dealt with” in her absence).
greywarshark (8) … thanks for the info. Also read that the case is being heard in the basement of the Wellington High Court, for security reasons!
If neither the woman concerned nor her lawyer are allowed in court to argue the case, then it would be interesting to know who is arguing against who in the closed hearing, something I feel in fairness, the woman and her lawyer should have details about. Unnamed “advocates” not being good enough.
And the “unspecified country” for which this woman presents a national security threat is … ??
The Ministry for Primary Industries looks set to face a $100 million bill
for the crippling cattle disease Mycoplasma bovis.
But hey – user pays innit? MPI is not ultimately paying for this giant diseased cowpat, it is we, all of us in the NZ taxpayers union who pay 15c in the $1 GST on everything if not big bags out of our income.
$100 million should be borne from a farmers insurance against disease etc out of their income and then they might start looking at the costs that they impose on the country. And the real, small, farmers can start agitating against the game players that erect the barriers of inflated land prices that add to the costs of those on the ground just getting on with the job, rather than poncing around buying and selling farms on leverage etc.
If they can afford to own more than one or two farms they can pay for the enormous costs the country faces trying to have biosecurity borders and the lapses thereof. In this case of disease it can be laid at their door surely.
Yes, the fact they farm to provide food and exports should not exempt them from paying forward on risk factors. They need to be brought under the rules the rest of us live by, and that may slow their appetite for risk. Insurance to cover risks and deposits of a suitable size.
Farms, like homes should not be gambling chips in our ever more fragile world.
Thanks for your thoughts Patricia. What you think seems to be towards the practical and effective – a good thing to read on TS amongst the wider and perhaps wilder inputs.
Now we know that thus Micoplasma Bovis disease can be transmitted by urine and excrement we worry that those cow wastes are being sprayed all over our roads from leaky overflowing tank traps on those long haul trucks and that pollutes our water systems from the road drains and will end up in our drinking water to!!!!!!
What about the road runoff onto our homes from trucks passing through our suburbs now???
Christ we are stuffed as this is so bloody serious now, and MPI don’t know how to control it they admitted.
I am again to write to the Ministry of Environment about this new threat to our residential communities again, Ministry of the Environment who have been so silent on this and other things ‘see here.’
Climate change emissions and truck increased use is now found to be really occurring as trucks are dirty emitters of climate emissions/carbon.
In 2018 after Napier has now become a “truck gridlocked” community with a large export port and over 90% of all export freight is still carried on trucks we are now so desperate for a safe quiet environment we have now referred this issue back to the Ministry of the Environment after 18 yrs of no solution yet being offered.
We have asked for a inland port to transfer the freight onto rail to Napier Port as it was recommended by the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment in 2006.
Ministry for the Environment
PO Box 10362
Wellington
Dear Ministry of the Environment. 3/3/18.
As you may already be aware, we have over the last 20 years, we all have had extremely serious public health related issues regarding urban residential communities who are constantly exposed to adverse health effects from heavy truck traffic passing through their urban areas on a ‘truck route’ highway that very often in NZ has inadequate mitigation measures to protect the health and well being of those communities.
As it is the policy of a Government to advocacy and to seek solutions through public and local input and consultation, as defined by the Court of Appeal 1992!!!!
We have been involved heavily in that process since our communications to you since May 2002.
Since then, we have been gathering evidence, reports and results of air quality studies independently conducted in coalition with Watercare Services, NIWA, HB Public Health and Ministry for the Environment, through the technical assistance of your staff.
Your staff has requested that we keep an open communication line to them, and that they would assist, as able, to resolve the issues of concern.
To date, three reports from Water care Services, NIWA and Public Health have validated the health concerns that affect our community living near truck routes, and with that information, we were hopeful that local and regional councils would resolve the issues surrounding public health by supporting a reasonable list of early mitigation measures, such as:
1. speed reduction to kph on Highway 50 as it passes through west Cities residential suburbs.
2. smooth road surfacing to reduce tyre particulate pollution.
3. barriers and dense vegetation to contain and absorb traffic pollution
4. return road freight to rail through Napier to the port.
We held a series of meetings with our local City and Regional councils, which resulted in the regional officers agreeing to put the matter before Council, in a bid to have those measures supported.
A press release from the Council came out on 25/2/03, supporting in principle our request for reasonable mitigation.
We had the support also of our Regional Chairman, and a Councillor, previously involved in health issues in central government.
Unfortunately, the following day in council, a majority voted against supporting those measures, which quite honestly left us gutted.
After other meetings with our City Council Mayor, the Mayor did agree to write a letter to The road controlling Authority (then in 2003) Transit NZ supporting a speed reduction to 70kph.
Our Regional Council did admit the planning was questionable before the road was re designated as a ‘Truck Route.’
Quote; “the problem has arisen because prior to the expressway’s construction, the local council allowed residential developments to abut the proposed road.
The decision was unwise and was made when environmental concerns were not as strong and awareness of the possible consequences much lower, a council report by environmental manager, Murray Buchanan states.”
“the community properties, by an act of past planning, are closely adjacent and many are well below the expressway level. This is a unique situation in the district, and because of the elevation of the expressway, noise travels over a wider area.”
Those admissions clearly suggest that both councils should now be actively supporting further mitigation measures to protect those residents, but very little is really being achieved, which now places us in a position to legally challenge their lack of providing a safe environment, and all the other issues raised in that letter by our legal counsel 1/4/02, if the situation is not resolved in the next few months prior to completion of the over bridge and State Highway extension
Important to note is that two of the mitigation measures, 70kph speed and smooth road surface, changes to planning have to be instituted ahead of the completion of that road upgrade, or else it would be cost prohibitive to promote later.
Therefore, we would request that you allow us this remaining time to seek further support prior to instigation of legal proceedings, noting that it is highly likely that this route may be required if councils do not offer adequate mitigation for the health and well-being of our community.
We hope that this further information to you addresses paragraph 3 of your letter dated 11/2/03. We are very sincere in our desire to resolve these health issues in any means available to us and support for environmental legal assistance, should it finally be required, is vital as a means to protect the health and well being of our community.
The current truck ‘movement’ counts for every 24hrs on the Napier south end of the HB Expressway is now on 3rd March 2018 is at a whopping 2489 trucks every day average when in 2001 we measured 997 every day.
Thank you very much for your consideration,
Yours truly,
My understanding is that the MPI put a movement ban on farmers moving their cattle from one farm to the next one when Mycoplasma Bovis was first detected on NZ farms?
So why hasn’t MPI enforced the movement ban on those farmers who broke the rules?
What was the last Government doing about the Mycoplasma Bovis outbreak as it happen on their watch?
Was this Mycoplasma Bovis outbreak due to the running down of the MAF/ MPI by the last Government?
Why hasn’t NZ MPI producers taken out insurance to protect themselves against such outbreaks etc?
Why hasn’t the Trucking industry brought in self contained stock trucks which stop stock urine and shit from being spray all over the place. They have these truck in Oz why not in NZ?
Why weren’t the cattle destroyed straight away, that is what you do with a foot & mouth disease outbreak ?
If farmers have broken the law they should be prosecuted and heavily fined, or put out of business. If there is a nationwide outbreak it will damage the industry and will cost the country and the taxpayers big time $.
This is actually a serious situation and MPI can not be seen to be incompetent ?
I don’t think Mycoplasma is bad as Foot and Mouth as it can’t get into the food chain. But in saying that the farmers should’ve us their common sense and obey the MAF/ MPI movement ban then we would’ve this shit fight of mess that NZ is facing ATM which is no thanks to these dumb asses who thought they knew better than the boffins within MAF/MPI.
It really makes my blood boil that these people can be so dumb, stupid and then expect the Government to give them a payout!!!!!
Also 99% of this shit fight happen under the National Government and what were they doing about it? Easy answer asleep at the wheel as usual and let the market short it out F ing dickheads.
Actresses are very brave to stand up and demand to be heard about sexual bullying and worse. Barbara Ewing interviewed this morning by Wallace Chapman wrote a book called The Actresses, being made into a film I think. It tells the stories of how the profession treats women and the way they cope. She is a NZ actress and author working from London who learned Te Reo decades before we got enthused.
Barbara Ewing’s book The Actresses was first published in 1997 and is the story of a group of actresses reuniting at their London drama school 30 years after they graduated. It explores how women are treated in the industry and reveals a toxic culture – 21 years before the current light was shone on similar behaviour through the #MeToo movement. Ewing was also an actress and her experience carried a lot of truth into the fictional work. Since then she’s written many books, but explains why The Actresses is still important.
I seem to be dominating the Open Mike so far but all these things are really interesting and meaningful to us and about people’s concerns so am just giving a heads-up on them so they don’t get missed.
The bill would amend the Education Act 1989 to enable statements about the diversity of education provision to be included in the statement of National Education and Learning Priorities.
The proposed amendments would align the statement of National Education and Learning Priorities more closely with the New Zealand curriculum, and provide an aspirational vision for the future for young New Zealanders.
2/3/18 http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1803/S00020/savecharterschools-submissions-open-over-2500-sign.htm
You might hate how National set them up, and despite Seymour and ACT equally, but there is good in the well-run concept of schools for those who don’t fit into the mainstream, and perhaps we could get back some for special needs children too that government has stepped on heavily in past years so they can have their own place. Charter schools should be able to form relationships with mainstream and fund places for some children to attnd specialist classes elsewhere, and this would be good for special schools advancing their pupils’ particular talents.
Nah, that’s not domination; domination is when you crowd out others and their opinions, which you don’t. So, keep them coming. Remember that a few bans were dished out recently too so the place is maybe a wee bit quieter than usual …
Children who don’t fit into the mainstream need to be funded and supported in their own community, at their local school. Education policy should reflect this.
The flexibility supposedly only required for high-needs children, should be demanded for all students. This is important for education.
The student in the article should know this, and by not putting in these details, it gives a false view of the situation.
The ex principal in one of the other articles is misdirecting on this issue as well. And the PISA results might be an effect of primary children who have been subjected to National Standards. Who knows?
Also, her insistent on exams is old-school and not reflective of understanding or competence.I believe examination taking is a skill over and above the level of knowledge of any particular subject, and many who fail exams often know the work, but cannot retrieve it in those situations.
Hi Molly
I will read that with your comments in mind about the tramps.
About exams – they do provide a separation from school control over assessment. Perhaps a half-year test to see how they go and prepare them for the matter, along with regular short tests and assessments so that the pupil’s knowledge level is exposed? Anything that the NZ Initiative thinks is a good idea must be viewed cautiously and they seem very strong on exams. The present assessments are too demanding for teachers. There is no need for atomic science to order teachers’ checks and so parents know to the nth degree of skill.
I was amazed when I thought I heard that parents were having to pay a fee if they wanted their children to have extra time to do their exams now. They would have to pay for a medical certificate stating why of course. But this imposition on parents with children having difficulties of some sort should not be countenanced by fair and supportive education establishment. Exams shouldn’t be a brick wall for some children.
MacLeans college used to have a good system for children with needs for reader-writer assistance. And the reputation they developed for that assistance, resulted in many students enrolling in that school.
Unfortunately, the NZQA was sceptical of the high number of students requiring that help at exams and gave the school a hard time about whether all these students were legitimate. I can’t recall the end result, but I do remember this occurring. It would be disappointing if that extra fee was a result of this situation.
I’m good at exams, mainly because I have the skill that allows me to read – even badly written exams – and know what it is that the examiner is looking for. This does not necessarily mean that the knowledge I have at that time is permanent and able to be used in workable form.
Internal assessments require that proof, and for students who just want to cram and exam, they are a pain.
But I do believe that they are a better indicator of comprehension and application of knowledge.
Moly
Too much responsibility on the teachers to being do assessments all the time. And with this evil-minded, sucpicious, government and its neolib background, the conditions and demands that teachers must comply with, with the way they are rated hanging in the balance (and with the idea of performance pay hanging like a Damocles sword) I hear that teachers have to fudge some times. The problem is the old one that is described in that saying that you can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. Just looked up my teacher Google and it says that’s been around since the 1500s.
And petit peu French. Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose (1849)!
What an uproar over nothing. Jacinda Ardern wasn’t offended, I wasn’t offended. Most people I suspect were not offended. It’s a pretty sad state of affairs when you can’t describe anyone as “attractive” without being labeled sexist. In my view, a lovely word trashed by a small bunch of vociferous individuals – and no, I don’t know who they were because I don’t bother reading that kind of silly stuff.
The continuing theme for describing female politicians is to remark on their appearance as if that is the most important thing to know about them.
It’s only okay with the Queen’s description as far as I’m concerned – traditional with Royal commenters. ‘And Her Majesty has changed her well-known hair style to one combed to the side which is very appealing under her daffodil coloured hat with the narrow brim, which she adopts so that the public can see her face’ etc.
I think that it is sort of patronising that a woman is only worth talking to if she is fashionable and attractive. Men are generally not given this sort of attention.
But when they choose to be different, they can it’s true get a notation, as Slavoj Zizek was recently. One journalist found his appearance and manner below par. (He wears a t-shirt quite often and rubs his nose all the time – terribly eccentric from some journalists point of view, the arbiters of everything!)
Those journalist comments are designed to detract from serious subjects, but Jacinda is deft at deflection. Another attractive aspect of our P.M. She is grounded.
Privilege: Unearned access to social power based on membership in a dominant social group
_ Able-bodied physically and mentally
_ Access to education
_ Christian
_ Cisgender
_ Heterosexual
_ Male
_ Native English speaker
_ New Zealand Citizen (at birth)
_ White
Becoming Aware of Privilege should not be viewed as a burden or source of guilt, but rather an opportunity to learn and be responsible so that we may work toward a more just and inclusive world.
Thanks. Next time please include the link. I’m pretty sure I’ve asked before and it’s getting tedious so I will probably moderated if I see you do that again. Honestly, if you are cutting and pasting, it’s not that hard to link as well.
Baby Boomers or Generation X; which one is more privileged?
Privilege is real but also relative and contextual. This should never be lost sight of; lack of privilege does not necessarily have to hold one back or be a bad thing – it can be a double-edged sword. As you say, it’s how privilege is used and abused that makes it an issue or a non-issue.
As James Shaw said in his outstanding speech:
It is a great honour that our members, through their elected delegates, backed us to go into government for the first time ever.
It is a privilege that neither I nor my colleagues take lightly. [my bold]
Thanks for that!
On the chart presented by Pete above – I have to say I score a tick on each one. Being aware of that is so very important and something not to be taken lightly. As Claude Levi-Strauss once said “I had to leave France to study man”.
We usually do a session or two of the Bluff Oysters when they are in.
On the Americas Cup, the construction industry is looking forward to the moment when the client gets its shit together and has a single plan. That single plan then has to be consented, costed, and constructed in time for the Louis Vuitton Cup series not much more than 18 moths away. It’s going to be tight.
If I was the type to enjoy watching someone else racing in someone else’s yachts, and then pay over the top for kai moana most of us had access to in my childhood, I guess I would understand your enjoyment.
As it is, this scenario appeals to me as much as the TPPA rally appealed to you. Find it a bit jarring to read on TS TBH.
Good anecdotal piece from Radionz on youth employment and how it can be forstered and needs to be and is wanted by youth! Lry’s not forget that.
Think that even robbing dairies requires work, planning and organisation. This should be going into something positive for the country and for themselves. An intelligent government of the 21st century has a lot of history study research and experience to fall back on to prevent crime. Young people feeling lost and impoverished in monetary and spiritual terms, found useless, a waste of space, and abused, and they haven’t even had the chance to start their lives! It’s disgraceful neglect by governments not to have decent effectual polices for them.
One young man: He earns a good wage, has opportunities for career progression, and has zero debt to his name.
It’s worlds away from the uncertainty and indecision that plagued the end of his high school education.
Mr Kirk repeated seventh form at Mana College, uncertain about what he wanted to do with his life.
One day, he was approached by a teacher who asked if he was keen to take part in a work experience programme run by Downer, a programme that would allow him to do some paid work experience with the company in the school holidays.
If he impressed, he would have the option to take up full-time work.
Mr Kirk said it was a reality check from day one.
“On my first day on site I was just sweeping up a bit of rubbish, but I couldn’t even use the broom properly. I was a bit embarrassed, but you’ve got to learn some day.
“It was pretty daunting, but once you get to know the people it’s way easier. They help you a lot more when you’re comfortable with them.”
After just a year of full-time work, Mr Kirk now has his forklift driver’s licence and is talking with his bosses about studying to become a foreman.
The bill for that – as with the forklift licence – is borne by his employer, which gets a home-trained, loyal worker in exchange.
Downer first began the programme about seven years ago, and recently joined forces with Partners Porirua to head into local high schools to invite 16 and 17-year-olds who don’t know exactly what they want to do with their lives to take part.
(This type of training should be supported and encouraged by government not just left up to business at their whim.)
Another man still hoping to get started at 24 years, who is statistically classified as – ‘NEET’ or someone who’s Not in Employment, Education or Training.
Apart from a few brief stints on a relative’s farm, he has been unemployed for the best part of a decade.
And it all started, he says, in his first year of high school.
“The second term I stopped going,” he says.
“At the time I’d seen my friends not going to school. Hanging out and that. I was like, oh, I want to be like that. I don’t want to sit in class.
“I found out the hard way that sitting in class was the place to be.”
As of February, there are more than 80,000 young NEETs in New Zealand – a seven percent increase on last year. It’s estimated each NEET costs the economy about $20,000 in lost productivity and benefits – meaning this group of young people costs more than a billion dollars every year.
(And that’s just money, the big loss is in loss of self-image, self-belief, expectation of respect from society that goes on all through life for oneself and those you connect with. We all should play our part in avoiding that with practical and considered help to all.)
That one has been going since 1995 – and is far from the only one. Not sure of the numbers throughout NZ but think there are several more in the Wellington region.
Jacinda Ardern visited He Huarahi Tamariki on 27 Sept, just a few days after the general election, after they invited her just a day or so earlier.
Discussion called “It is the fact teen parents have a choice that should be applauded” following the Salvation Army Report. But soundtrack is re pokey machines!
Its so hard to get apprentices these days, we approached 2 local high schools, spoke to careers advisors at the school arranged times to give a bit of a talk etc.
Both times we got exactly zero turnout in school hours in a school day offering jobs and training with a start rate of $17 per hour and increases partially tied to credits towards qualification.
Wages that you can actually survive on start at about $20.50. So any takers will need to be subsidised by helpful relatives or someone else – and not everyone has that.
We have a very low wage mindset in NZ – for most of the population, anyway.
Yeah hence we visited local schools, hopefully to pick someone up who is still living at home while they get started. Takes about 3 months to get over the $20 mark so not to long and given gardening is a dying art generally apprentices start from absolute scratch.
Took me a year of my apprenticeship to earn enough to move out of home it wasn’t the end of the world. TBH was easier to get my papers done living at home.
When I was talking futures with young people, we would list skills a school leaver needed to be employed in further education or contributing through environmental and social programmes.
As we were talking in the third person, they would freely offer up ideas. They listed skills and attributes needed in all of those areas. We would list them in most important to least important.
Finally, we would look at the first 10. These became a self improvement blue print.
Years later I would meet with students who would say, ” I’m still using the blue print
to build my skills and attributes Mrs.B” That was a buzz. Number 1 was communication skills.
To me that was real education, not the sad tick box stuff often offered now. So I’m pleased it is all being reviewed.
Being a good communicator and being a life-long learner have a few things in common IMO: curiosity and open mind and the realisation that the meaning or purpose of life is not a fixed goal you set for yourself, or set for you by others, but it is the journey or process of life itself – a self-referencing framework, if you like.
The President of the United States on the unelected leader of authoritarian China: “He's now president for life. President for life. And he's great," Trump said. "And look, he was able to do that. I think it's great. Maybe we'll give that a shot some day." https://t.co/Pqb7iOKiWo— Jim Sciutto (@jimsciutto) March 4, 2018
Hmmm He should be careful for what he wishes. Maybe he thinks he might become emperor one day? Not a safe occupation by all accounts – if the fate of Roman Emperors is anything to go by.
Went to the anti-TPPA-11 rally in Aotea Square Auckland this arvo.
The message is,
sign the Don’t Do it petition – they want 5,000 signatures by the day of signing the TPPA (8 March) – they have over 4,000 now
there are more similar agreements in the pipeline (RCP with Asian countries; the re-working of the China FTA; the deal with the EU; one with Sth and central American countries)
submit to the NZ select committee after the agreement is signed in Chile on March 8 – when some of the contents will be published – say “no” to re-activating the clauses put on hold – the US will try to revive them
say “no” to ISDS clauses in any future agreements
there is no protection against being sued by corporates for climate change measures; Treaty-related legislation; legislation for better workers’ rights; health care legislation, etc, etc
Robert Reid was MC in Aotea Square; speakers included Byran Bruce; Laila Harre; a nurse who works with young people; Moana Maniapoto (who also sang); Jane Kelsey.
I estimate there were around 300+ people there.
I also recall going to some anti-TPPA demos in Auckland in recent years where the turnout was small. the big demo came in more recent years.
We are in a re-grouping phase. Kelsey praised us for what has been achieved – delaying the TPPA for several years, for example, and the big demos. The message to us was to continue to hold the line
Labour only opposed because it was politically expediant and there opposition no doubt helped protestor numbers… fact they always believed in the tppa or whatever its called now hence signing up…
Nothing new really dunno why the greens dont get more left votes tbh they mean what the say and say what they mean…
A new poll shows that 75% of New Zealanders want independent analysis on the revised TPPA agreement before the government signs it.
Over 50% always opposed the TPPA. I think many will have bought Labour-NZ First’s line that the current deal has been improved. But still a lot of people are uncertain and want an in-depth analysis made public.
Was there any commentary there about President Trump raising steel and aluminum tariffs and the effects that could have on New Zealand steel and aluminum workers?
Taking one issue and spinning it to make the concerns about the revised TPPA seem irrelevant, is a bit irritating to read. The first thought I had this morning on reading your post was “Where do you start?”.
If you are unable to take in the whole view, then all discussions are going to be on surmised scenarios presented in such a way to support your pro-TPPA view. And you have provided the framework in which that discussion happens, and limited the effect it has on issues of sovereignty, health care, human rights for workers in ALL participating countries, and the ability of our government to make good legislative change in regards to environment, NZers health and wellbeing, and as an effective response to the impact of climate change.
Despite my partner working in the steel industry for over decades and having an understanding of how much produced is sold overseas, I don’t feel like entering this discussion with you, because I feel it will be pointless.
The tariff issue is one that needs to be discussed alongside the other issues. It’s a minor concern, to me really. If we are talking about sustainability, then why are we importing steel that can be produced locally, and then complaining about someone else deciding to make the opposite choice?
We import steel into New Zealand according to the kind, quality, volume, and price of steel that we need for the job. Sustainability is in there as an evaluative element in procurement, but only one element.
That is why we import steel. Most of the time local Glenbrook Bluescope does not meet the needs for those criteria. Sometimes it does. But then, as someone with a partner in the steel industry, you already knew that.
We import steel because we think that price is lower and that is the only criteria for purchase.
Not because we believe the quality is better, or that we think Chinese ore and steel workers are treated well. We also don’t consider the impact of transport is worth our time in regards to climate change, because at the moment we don’t have to pay for that impact. It is an externality.
We also import steel because our concern for our steel workers jobs is only when overseas customers might find another supplier, not when we do.
There is a raft of problems in the way we are doing business. Thinking that successful business is always selling high and paying low is wasting our resources, both natural and human.
“But then, as someone with a partner in the steel industry, you already knew that.”
I know that what you have written is incorrect. Because the steel used to replace the failed imported steel was produced by then Pacific Steel, and always could have been.
I also know, that what I consider valuable and “good” business, is poles apart from what you do. And that is a long discussion for another day.
Thank you for the first-hand update. Are there any recordings of the event(s) online?
It (still) feels like they’re trying to build the plane while flying it yet they claim all sorts of benefits to NZ and its economy to be more precise. However, even the claimed (projected?) benefits are trivial and uncertain while the price is even more uncertain. And let’s be clear that there is no free lunch.
Interesting – the New Yorker piece was the first time I’ve come across him. I think he probably has some decent arguments – which is rare enough in academia to be worth a look.
The use of the term SJW was an immediate turn-off for me. I’ve never fitted well into gender stereotypes, so I am glad to see them being weakened.
I don’t get why someone would make such a big deal about how some other people prefer to be addressed – though I will rarely use “sir” for Peter Jackson or Shonkey.
I read an interesting thread on twitter today – about how videos tend to encourage emotive engagement rather than logical critique – it was with specific reference to conspiracy theories and about how some people think everyone will be swayed by a video which uses image and audio rather than develop an argument.
I think this happens a lot with many topics these days. I prefer to read an argument – and to be entertained by audio-visual media.
Yeah – watching video isn’t how I look at arguments – We can read between six and ten times as fast. They’re for true believers I guess – though I imagine there’d be the odd decent debate topic somewhere in there.
His book is currently in the shops if you want to fork out $40 +. Had a quick flick through while waiting for someone at Paperplus, and it doesn’t read well to me. Would be interested to hear what you thought, if you did read it.
Thanks Stuart. As I mentioned though, I’ve had a bit of a look into his witterings over the last few weeks, and I can’t stomach anymore. If you find some of his work interesting and link, then I’ll look before commenting. That’s the best I can offer at the moment. 😉
I think he probably has some decent arguments – which is rare enough in academia to be worth a look.
He does. Unfortunately, he’s a conservative so he’s putting that skill at argument to work for conservative politics. Even more unfortunately, his opponents are often people who confuse feeling very strongly about something with having a compelling argument, eg in the video above, which means he mops the floor with them. Yet more unfortunately, he’d probably still be a relatively-unknown academic if Canada hadn’t tried to criminalise speech.
” Even more unfortunately, his opponents are often people who confuse feeling very strongly about something with having a compelling argument, eg in the video above, which means he mops the floor with them. “
I don’t think he does. He seems spectacularly unable to provide reasonable arguments – so it is a perspective issue I guess.
“Yet more unfortunately, he’d probably still be a relatively-unknown academic if Canada hadn’t tried to criminalise speech.”
They didn’t. He just interpreted the law change in that way. Worth having a look at the article I linked to above, and the actual bill change.
The article you linked to is a piece of weaselry based on ignoring the inclusion of “gender expression” as well as “gender identity” in the bill. However, it does helpfully link to this article, which supposedly “debunks” Peterson’s claim by pointing out that yes, not using words you don’t want to use would be actionable in the courts, but would be unlikely to be a criminal matter and anyway we can trust the authorities not to take action against people for such trivial things. In other words, more weaselry.
The article does drift off occasionally, but also includes links to pertinent information, such as the C-16 bill, and the parliamentary discussion of the same.
The link to the C-16 bill itself shows the the term “gender identity or expression” is what is added to the legislation in terms of adding a category to what constitutes a hate crime.
Peterson adds surmised application of Ontario Human Rights legislation to propose a situation where someone – most particularly himself – may be prosecuted for not using someone’s preferred pronouns.
I tried to look up prosecutions in Canada under both C-16 and the Human Rights Act, but couldn’t find an official source easily. Perhaps if you are interested in how the laws are applied, you can.
Note”: “Gender expression” is a human experience that some seem to take heated offence to, and needs to be included as a discriminatory category. There are those who will dismiss the rights of people purely on their “gender expression”. Violence is often associated with that disregard.
Peterson adds surmised application of Ontario Human Rights legislation to propose a situation where someone – most particularly himself – may be prosecuted for not using someone’s preferred pronouns.
A not-unreasonable surmise, given his opponent Crossman’s statement in this description of the legislation: “In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, though the Human Rights Tribunals and courts.”
“Gender expression” is a human experience that some seem to take heated offence to, and needs to be included as a discriminatory category.
Sure. But if you combine it with laws criminalising speech you’ve got something highly objectionable, in which case it’s unsurprising if people object.
Considering Crossman as an “opponent” to him, rather than someone who disagrees with his premise, is the kind of extension to argument that is flawed.
We have legislation and bylaws in NZ that prohibit a number of situations that will never be prosecuted in court, because the threshold is too high.
It might be of worth for you to read the submission to Bill C-16 by the Canadian Bar Association, who actually have practising human rights lawyers contributing to the discussion:
C-16 Will Not Impede Freedom of Expression
Recently, the debate has turned to whether the amendments will force individuals to embrace concepts, even use pronouns, which they find objectionable. This is a misunderstanding of human rights and hate crimes legislation.
They go into more detail on Page 3, but too much to cut and paste here.
Still can’t find any hate crime prosecution for the Canadian courts that give an indication that prosecution for the non or misuse of gender pronouns will be a result. Have you had any luck?
Yes, we have plenty of bad legislation in this country, too. That’s not a recommendation.
Still can’t find any hate crime prosecution for the Canadian courts that give an indication that prosecution for the non or misuse of gender pronouns will be a result. Have you had any luck?
I wouldn’t trouble myself to look, because it’s irrelevant. Legislation that only fails to breach your human rights as long as the authorities have the good will not to prosecute is wrong in principle, and rights “protections” that rely on authorities not taking advantage of the power they’ve been given are no protection at all, just wishful thinking.
“I wouldn’t trouble myself to look, because it’s irrelevant. “
It’s not irrelevant. If the submission by lawyers fails to give you pause for thought, then a lack of prosecutions for similar crimes under this legislation would be the next course of action.
As it is you are basing your perspective on emotive “surmises” from a psychology professor.
If the government were to pass a law that would allow people to be prosecuted for failing to use the word “whom” correctly, the subsequent complete lack of prosecutions of offenders would not make that law any less of an affront to the right to freedom of speech and expression. The same applies in this case. Prosecutions or the lack of them are irrelevant to the principle at stake.
“In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, through the Human Rights Tribunals and courts.” That isn’t the surmises of a psychology professor, it’s the submission of a lawyer.
As to the merits or otherwise of the Canadian Bar Association’s claims, case law has demonstrated that Canada’s hate speech laws do result in prosecutions for the expression of opinion, so their claims about this extension of the law should be taken with a grain of salt. I expect it is great for lawyers – lots of media coverage and lots of billable hours in those cases – but it’s certainly not great for anyone who values human rights.
The court struck down the part of the legislation that includes speech that “ridicules, belittles or otherwise affronts the dignity” of a person or class of persons. The court found those words are not rationally connected to the objective of protecting people from hate speech.
The court left in place the ban on speech that exposes, or tends to expose, persons or groups to hatred.
So the Canadian Supreme Court has already defined the bounds of when something is hate speech, and it’s (rightfully) a pretty high threshold.
However, I’d also say that any university educator who intentionally belittles their students probably deserves some formal employment discipline.
Your link outlines several cases where the threshold is quite high, and nothing comparable to the misuse of language scenario that Peterson outlines.
Do you think that pre C-16 amendment someone would have been prosecuted in Canada for referring to an imam as “Father” or “Pastor”? That would be a form of address that deliberately ignores someone’s chosen religious beliefs.
That is how specious Peterson’s interpretation is.
(Not to mention his views on women and sexuality, which may be responsible for such emphatic burblings)
Your link outlines several cases where the threshold is quite high, and nothing comparable to the misuse of language scenario that Peterson outlines.
My link outlines several cases where people were prosecuted for expression of opinion, despite lawyers’ and legislators’ earlier claims that hate speech laws wouldn’t criminalise the expression of opinion. Peterson is right to assume the claims of harmlessness about this extension of the law are just as worthless.
Publicly detesting their choice of pronoun most certainly is. Just as intentionally mispronouncing their names is belittling.
And given that belittling is not illegal, the government isn’t the one trying to compel speech. The role that the educator chose compels the educator to behave respectfully to students. If the educator refuses to do that aspect of their job, that’s not the government’s fault. Same as how I’d get a talking to if I ripped shit out of particularly annoying clients right to their face.
“The role that the educator chose compels the educator to behave respectfully to students.”
That does not include pandering to their every whim.
“If the educator refuses to do that aspect of their job, that’s not the government’s fault. ”
In Peterson’s case, the educator is being asked to use pronouns that are nothing more than a silly construct.
Peterson is a hero standing up to this nonsense…more power to him.
Publicly detesting their choice of pronoun most certainly is.
Nope. If I say here, publicly, the pronouns zi and zur are moronic insults to the English language and my intelligence, I haven’t belittled anybody, I’ve just stated my opinion. If, subsequently, I get a customer asking me to refer to them with those pronouns, I wouldn’t voice that opinion to them because it’s not my place to do so. I might well refuse to comply with their request on the basis that I prefer to speak English, but that’s not belittling them.
In short, the question of whether Peterson belittles his students or not is a matter of how he treats his students, not a matter of personal opinions he might hold. I haven’t seen anything to suggest he belittles his students.
Also worth pointing out: these days, the issue of academic staff being bullied by students is as significant as the reverse. There are plenty of horror stories at my university, and my sister was nearly driven to quit her academic job in the States by the emails she kept getting from students with plenty of opinions to share about her competence, intelligence, teaching style and personality. I doubt Peterson’s ever come up with anything even approaching the personal abuse these spoilt brats can dish out. Looking at that video above, I don’t see an academic bullying and belittling his students, but I do see an arsehole and her friends deliberately antagonising someone because they don’t like his opinions.
Haven’t watched the video, but yeah I know the sort of students you mean.
And frankly, the pronoun thing is belittling, regardless. This is something intrinsic to an individual’s identity. I’m no brilliant person at keeping up with these things, but I try. It’s no skin off my nose what somebody wants to be called, be it gender-fluid pronoun or Ali vs Clay. It is, however, important to them. If I respect them, I can try to refer to them in their preferred way. If I don’t respect them, I can think of better ways to call them a fuckwit.
But additionally, you’re not in a position to grade the student who read or watched you express your opinion of how they exist in society.
Agree with McFlock here. He vacillates from requests from students to use the terms “they” and “them” by saying he doesn’t believe they were in use previously. Then he says it depends on who is asking him. Then he changes it to whether they have asked him respectfully enough.
One student says something along the lines of ‘A given name, is one that is chosen and/or made up by parents/a person. Would you refuse to use that name to refer to a specific person?’
He does not answer because he has fallen into a logic trap of his own design. Of course he would. And to acknowledge otherwise, is to admit he will treat them differently because he does not want to recognise their right to gender self expression and identity.
This is not an issue of free speech. That is used as a vehicle to “belittle students” – as McFlock has pointed out numerous times.
And frankly, the pronoun thing is belittling, regardless. This is something intrinsic to an individual’s identity.
It’s seriously not. It’s the English language, not your identity. Feel free to play with English as much as you like, but it’s up to other people whether they want to participate or not.
It’s no skin off my nose what somebody wants to be called, be it gender-fluid pronoun or Ali vs Clay. It is, however, important to them.
And the English language is important to me. If you don’t like its pronouns, other languages are available. But this is a side, and trivial issue – whether or not an academic is willing to use words his students made up is between him and his students, and the university administration if it finds the media attention problematic for its branding. Peterson’s issue is with the government prescribing speech, and his concern’s a valid one.
He vacillates from requests from students to use the terms “they” and “them” by saying he doesn’t believe they were in use previously. Then he says it depends on who is asking him. Then he changes it to whether they have asked him respectfully enough.
So? Those are things he’s free to consider on a case-by-case basis and his opinion on them is as valid as anyone else’s. Your feelings about his opinions are irrelevant.
One student says something along the lines of ‘A given name, is one that is chosen and/or made up by parents/a person. Would you refuse to use that name to refer to a specific person?’
He does not answer because he has fallen into a logic trap of his own design.
I’d have been rendered speechless myself by such an astonishing level of irrationalism. Yes, personal names are specific to people and it’s embarrassing if you use the wrong one. Pronouns, on the other hand, exist so you can refer to people without having to know, remember or use their personal names. If you then have to know, remember and use the word they want you to use as a pronoun, the whole point of having pronouns just disappeared. That question didn’t spring a logical trap, it displayed a facepalm level of ignorance.
It’s seriously not. It’s the English language, not your identity. Feel free to play with English as much as you like, but it’s up to other people whether they want to participate or not.
Yes. It’s up to other people to decide whether their desire to label the genitalia they will most likely never get to see or touch is more important to them than the labels designated by the actual owners of those genitals. Because that’s the shortcoming of the English language.
And Peterson’s concern is not valid, because your own link shows that merely being an obnoxious, discriminatory fool with an undue interest in labelling other people’s reproductive organs does not constitute “hate speech” by itself, even if it is belittling or ridiculing.
This doesn’t rest on anyone’s promise that prosecutions won’t happen, it rests on the Canadian Supreme Court having already determined the threshold for prosecutions.
Yes. It’s up to other people to decide whether their desire to label the genitalia they will most likely never get to see or touch is more important to them than the labels designated by the actual owners of those genitals.
Whatevs. I’m sure that once the sexless utopia has arrived, in vivo gestation is a thing of the past and weka’s “Why gender equality matters” post is a quaint historical irrelevance, language might well reflect that new sexless nature of humanity. In the meantime, sex is the biggest difference between humans that there is and their languages tend to reflect that. Those who’d prefer to have the sexless utopia right now had best find an island or something.
This doesn’t rest on anyone’s promise that prosecutions won’t happen, it rests on the Canadian Supreme Court having already determined the threshold for prosecutions.
A legislative programme that rests on “Don’t worry, the Supreme Court’s said people can’t actually be prosecuted for this thing we just made illegal” is a shit programme.
Knowing which gender-specific singular pronoun to use requires knowing as much about the “Alex” who sent you an email as you might assume about the hairdresser called “Jules” you’re providing customer feedback on.
But using the wrong pronoun isn’t high enough for prosecution, according to the CSC. However, if using “her” instead of “their” was the worst thing ever done to or said about a gender-fluid (or whatever) person, that would practically be utopia anyway.
If someone beats the shit out of someone else because of the vistim’s gender identity, that’s a hate crime according to the law peterson is worried about. But not if all they did was get anal about matching pronouns to genitals they will never see.
“Pronouns, on the other hand, exist so you can refer to people without having to know, remember or use their personal names. If you then have to know, remember and use the word they want you to use as a pronoun, the whole point of having pronouns just disappeared. That question didn’t spring a logical trap, it displayed a facepalm level of ignorance.”
No it didn’t. He said that despite it all, he would refuse to address a person in their company, by the pronoun they had chosen. Not a third person reference to someone that was not present.
This shows a decided lack of respect and humanity. And is a indication of his poor validation for conflating this issue to one of free speech.
It’s not clear to me under what circumstances you’d address another person using a third-person pronoun – when I’m talking to people I call them “you,” “sir/ma’am” (I expect that’s also egregious hate-speech to some people) or their name (assuming I know it).
And the fact remains that people creating their own individual pronouns and demanding that others use them entirely defeats the purpose of having pronouns in the first place. Someone who refuses to indulge such pointless and irritating narcissism is well within their rights to do so, and it’s the people making the demands who should devote some thought to how they treat others.
There is no polite way to put this, but since Peterson claims that “If you worry about hurting people’s feelings and disturbing the social structure, you’re not going to put your ideas forward,” I’m just going to say it: Spend half an hour on his website, sit through a few of his interminable videos, and you realize that what he has going for him, the niche he has found—he never seems to say “know” where he could instead say “cognizant of”—is that Jordan Peterson is the stupid man’s smart person.
Peterson said he views university establishments as “the next best thing to a cult” due to their focus on what he calls “postmodern” themes such as equity. He says his independent project will contrast the university model by providing straight humanities education.
For about his first seven months on Patreon, Peterson earned about $1,000 per month. That changed last October, when he saw a dramatic increase in support, which has not slowed. The professor surpassed a fundraising goal of $45,000 on June 10, and is now aiming for $100,000 per month. On Monday, Peterson was making $49,460 every month from 4,432 patrons.
Why does he give a damn how someone wishes to be addressed? If it’s a restricted title that might cause confusion, ok. But a pronoun? Why does he “detest” it so?
Seems to me that he has a problem with gender identity, not the individuals. Intentionally aggravating or initimidating individuals he is supposed to educate and inspire is bad enough, but there’s an entire sector of the community he can’t help but offend, intimidate, and otherwise alienate. Which seems a bit, well, discriminatory, to me…
To hell with all his other bullshit, as a teacher he should know better than to bully students over something as easily tweakable as a pronoun. To them it’s their identity. To him, it’s simply a gesture of respect (or its absence).
I didn’t bother watching the video – if a college professor can’t run rings around someone they have 20 or 30 years experience on, their sole source of employment should be Fox News commentariat.
This looks like a construction system that will meet the goals of our new government to construct 10.000 of houses needed to meet the demands for new homes. Ka kite ano
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Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones has announced details of a multimillion-dollar investment in Whangārei for infrastructure projects that will help it recover from the economic fallout from the COVID-19 pandemic. More than 200 jobs are expected to be created through the $26 million investment from the Government’s rejuvenation package ...
Following a second incident in which a person escaped from a managed isolation facility, security is being enhanced, including more police presence onsite, Minister Megan Woods said. “The actions of some individuals who choose to break the very clear rules to stay within the facilities means that more resourcing is ...
Waste reduction and recycling programmes in Kaipara are set to get a boost with Associate Environment Minister Eugenie Sage today announcing a $361,447 grant from the Ministry for the Environment’s Waste Minimisation Fund (WMF) Sustainable Kaipara. “The new funding will allow Sustainable Kaipara to partner with local schools, kura, community ...
The Government will support the Southland economy in the wake of multinational mining company Rio Tinto’s decision to follow through with its long signalled closure of the Tiwai Point aluminium smelter. “This day has unfortunately been on the cards for some time now, but nevertheless the final decision is a ...
New tools being developed to help boost Aotearoa’s Predator Free 2050 effort were unveiled today by Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage and Under Secretary for Regional Economic Development Fletcher Tabuteau. A new rat poison, a camera with predator recognition software to detect and report predators, a new predator lure and a ...
The Coalition Government has approved the purchase of a fleet of Bushmaster vehicles to replace the New Zealand Army’s armoured Pinzgauers, Defence Minister Ron Mark has announced today. The new fleet of 43 Australian-designed and built Bushmaster NZ5.5 will provide better protection for personnel and improved carrying capacity. “The age ...
The Government’s three prevention frameworks to reduce family violence in Aotearoa were launched this week by Associate Minister for Social Development Poto Williams. The frameworks were developed in partnership with communities around New Zealand, and build on the work the Government has already begun with its new family violence prevention ...
The Government is pleased to confirm funding for improvements to radiology and surgical services at Hawke's Bay DHB, Health Minister Chris Hipkins says. "The Minister of Finance the Hon Grant Robertson and former Health Minister Dr David Clark approved funding for Hawke's Bay DHB’s redevelopment of their radiology facilities ...
• New funding for four beds at Napier’s Springhill Residential Addiction Centre • A new managed withdrawal home and community service, and peer support before and after residential care at Tairāwhiti DHB • A co-ordinated network of withdrawal management services throughout the South Island • Peer support in Rotorua and ...
Introduction, seafarers and POAL Good morning everyone, I am delighted to be online with you all today. Before I begin, I have to acknowledge that COVID-19 has disrupted the maritime sector on an unprecedented scale. The work of seafarers and the maritime industry is keeping many economies around the world ...
A $13 million investment from Government will create jobs and improve the resilience of the rail connection between Christchurch and the West Coast, Infrastructure Minister Shane Jones and Regional Economic Development Under-Secretary Fletcher Tabuteau say. The funding comes from the tagged contingency set aside in Budget 2020 for infrastructure projects ...
The Government is investing $761 million to assist local government upgrade under-pressure water services across the country, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Local Government Minister Nanaia Mahuta announced today. The announcement was made at the site of the water bore that was found to be the source of the fatal ...
Recognised Seasonal Employers and migrant seasonal workers stranded in New Zealand will be able to continue working and supporting themselves with more flexible hours and roles, says Immigration Minister Iain Lees-Galloway. The time-limited visa changes are: Stranded RSE workers will be able to work part-time (a minimum of 15 hours ...
The Government is making immediate short-term changes to visa settings to support temporary migrants already onshore in New Zealand and their employers, while also ensuring New Zealanders needing work are prioritised, Immigration Minister Iain Lees-Galloway says. We are: Extending temporary work visas due to expire by the end of 2020 ...
Professor Peter Skelton CNZM has been appointed as Chief Freshwater Commissioner and Alternate Environment Court Judge Craig James Thompson as Deputy Chief Freshwater Commissioner for the newly established Freshwater Planning Process (FPP). Environment Minister David Parker today also announced the appointment of Chief Environment Court Judge Laurie Newhook as the ...
Auckland Queen’s Counsel Neil Campbell has been appointed a Judge of the High Court, Attorney‑General David Parker announced today. Justice Campbell graduated with a BCom and LLB (Hons) from the University of Auckland in 1992. He spent two years with Bell Gully Buddle Weir in Auckland before travelling to the United ...
The Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration, Poto Williams, is seeking feedback on a proposal to better enable the development and operation of commercial film and video facilities in Christchurch. The Proposal, developed by Regenerate Christchurch in response to a request from Christchurch City Council, asks that powers under section ...
The Government has launched a bold plan to boost primary sector export earnings by $44 billion over the next decade, while protecting the environment and growing jobs. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern today released Fit for a Better World – Accelerating our Economic Potential, a 10-year roadmap to unlock greater value ...
A new approach to prevent family harm that encourages greater collaboration across government and community groups is being celebrated at the opening of a new facility in Auckland. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern today opened the Multi-Disciplinary Family Harm Prevention Hub Te Taanga Manawa in Lambie Road in Manukau. The facility ...
The Government has released a major new report on the options for relocating the Port of Auckland’s freight operations while deferring any decision on the issue. “That decision needs to be informed by policy analysis that is still to be completed. As a result it will be up to a ...
The history of Rāpaki is being restored through the inclusion of te reo in thirteen official place names on Te Pātaka-o-Rākaihautū / Banks Peninsula and around Lyttelton Harbour/Whakaraupō, the Minister for Land Information, Eugenie Sage, announced today. “I am pleased to approve the proposals from Te Hapū o Ngāti ...
Bookings for seats on Air New Zealand flights into New Zealand will be managed in the short term to ensure the Government is able to safely place New Zealanders arriving home into a managed isolation or quarantine facility, says Housing Minister Megan Woods. “Last week Air Commodore Darryn Webb and I ...
Grant Robertson has today announced the first major release of funding from the $265 million Sport Recovery Package announced at Budget 2020. “Today we’re setting out how $80 million will be invested, with $54 million of that over the 2020/2021 financial year for organisations from community level through to elite ...
The Government is maintaining current levy rates for the next 2 years, as part of a set of changes to help ease the financial pressures of COVID-19 providing certainty for businesses and New Zealanders, ACC Minister Iain Lees-Galloway says. “New Zealanders and businesses are facing unprecedented financial pressures as a ...
Small businesses are getting greater certainty about access to finance with an extension to the interest-free cashflow loan scheme to the end of the year. The Small Business Cashflow Loan Scheme has already been extended once, to 24 July. Revenue and Small Business Minister Stuart Nash says it will be ...
A package of 23 projects across the country will clean up waterways and deliver over 2000 jobs Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Environment Minister David Parker announced today. The $162 million dollar package will see 22 water clean-up projects put forward by local councils receiving $62 million and the Kaipara ...
Tena koutou katoa Nga tangata whenua o tenei rohe o Pōneke, tena koutou Nau mai, haere mai ki te hui a tau mo te roopu reipa Ko tatou! Ko to tatou mana! Ko to tatou kaupapa kei te kokiri whakamua Tena koutou, tena koutou, tena tatou katoa Welcome. I ...
The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) is investing $1.5 million to ensure QE Health in Rotorua can proceed with its world class health service and save 75 existing jobs, Under Secretary for Regional Economic Development, Fletcher Tabuteau announced today. The PGF funding announced today is in addition to the $8 million ...
A new programme, which sets a firm course for the Building and Construction sector to help reduce greenhouse gas emissions, has been announced by the Minister for Building and Construction Jenny Salesa. “A significant amount of New Zealand’s carbon emissions come from the building and construction sector. If we’re serious ...
The Provincial Growth Fund is investing more than $7.5 million in Northland ventures to combat the economic impact of the COVID-19 virus, Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters and Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones have announced. The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) investment is going to the Northern Adventure Experience and ...
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Education Minister Chris Hipkins today announced significant funding for Auckland’s Northcote College as part of the first wave of a new nationwide school redevelopment programme to upgrade schools over the next 10 years. The $48.5 million project brings the total investment in Northcote College to ...
The Government has opened an urgent response fund to support schools and early learning services to get children and young people back on track after the Covid-19 lockdown. “While we are seeing improvements in attendance under Alert Level 1 Ministry of Education data shows that attendance rates in our schools ...
The law to boost the economic recovery from the impact of COVID-19 by speeding up resource consenting on selected projects has passed its second and third readings in the House today. “Accelerating nationwide projects and activities by government, iwi and the private sector will help deliver faster economic recovery and ...
Five port-related projects in Whanganui will receive a $26.75 million Provincial Growth Fund investment to support local economic recovery and create new opportunities for growth, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. “This is a significant investment that will support the redevelopment of the Whanganui Port, a project governed ...
Whanganui’s Sarjeant Gallery will receive an investment of up to $12 million administered by the Provincial Growth Fund to support its redevelopment, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. The project is included in a $3 billion infrastructure pipeline announced by Finance Minister Grant Robertson and Shane Jones yesterday. ...
The Provincial Growth Fund is investing nearly $2.5 million into three Te Ara Mahi programmes to support Manawatū-Whanganui jobseekers and employees to quickly train and upskill, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. “Up to 154 local people will be supported into employment within the first year by these ...
This morning I have formally tendered my resignation as Minister of Health, which was accepted by the Prime Minister. Serving as Minister of Health has been an absolute privilege – particularly through these extraordinary last few months. It’s no secret that Health is a challenging portfolio. I have given ...
Scholarships for 57 early-career agricultural emissions scientists from 20 developing countries is another example of New Zealand’s international leadership in primary sector sustainability, says Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor. Mr O’Connor, announcing the scholarships today, says hundreds of applications were received for this fourth round of the CLIFF-GRADS programme (Climate, Food ...
A project to help rejuvenate the Horowhenua town of Foxton will receive a Provincial Growth Fund investment of $3.86 million, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. “This funding for the Foxton Regeneration project will be used to make the well-known holiday town even more attractive for visitors and ...
An intensive care doctor is outraged health officials are giving helicopter rescue trusts a daily list of Covid-19 patients, saying it's completely unnecessary. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Seth Lazar, Professor, Australian National University In the US, tireless opposition to state use of facial recognition algorithms has recently won some victories. Some progressive cities have banned some uses of the technology. Threetechcompanies have pulled facial recognition products from ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rick Sarre, Adjunct Professor of Law and Criminal Justice, University of South Australia Facial recognition technology is increasingly being trialled and deployed around Australia. Queensland and Western Australia are reportedly already using real-time facial recognition through CCTV cameras. 7-Eleven Australia is also ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Carol T Kulik, Research Professor of Human Resource Management, University of South Australia The coronavirus pandemic has forced many of us to work from home, often in less than ideal circumstances. Many employees had little choice in the decision, limited time to ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Katja Hogendoorn, University of Adelaide This article is a preview of Flora, Fauna, Fire, a multimedia project launching on Monday July 13. The project tracks the recovery of Australia’s native plants and animals after last summer’s bushfire tragedy. Sign up to The ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By SriPallavi Nadimpalli, PhD Candidate, University of Melbourne Women manage many overlapping responsibilities in both public and private spheres. Their busy routines leave them with just a little time to take a break or a pause in their activity. These pauses are a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Naoise McDonagh, Lecturer in Political Economy, University of Adelaide The pandemic has changed the way we think about supply chains, in particular the chains that feed our need for food, medical supplies, and defence equipment. It has led Prime Minister Scott Morrison ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard Holden, Professor of Economics, UNSW As Victoria grapples with a second-wave outbreak of COVID-19, the importance of large-scale testing has again been highlighted. Without its “testing blitz” aiming at 10,000 tests a day, the extent of the outbreak would have been ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jean Burgess, Professor and Director, Digital Media Research Centre, Queensland University of Technology Perhaps no single character has been as iconic a symbol of Twitter as the now-ubiquitous hashtag. The syntax of the hashtag has a few simple rules: it consists of ...
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level one – read about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. To support this ...
Good morning and welcome to The Bulletin. In today’s edition: Major implications from Tiwai Pt closure, diplomatic rift over Hong Kong deepens, and grim new approach to managed isolation.The story of Rio Tinto pulling out of the Tiwai Point smelter is one that shows the deep connections between regional stories ...
How can Southland cope without its engine and biggest employer, the Tiwai Point smelter? Invercargill's deputy mayor Toni Biddle and Dee St businesswoman Anne Marie Thomas on what happens nowToni Biddle: "We've always known this could potentially happen. So, therefore, there has been a huge amount of work done in the background ...
This week's biggest-selling New Zealand books, as recorded by the Nielsen BookScan New Zealand bestseller list and described by Steve Braunias.NON-FICTION 1 Pull No Punches by Judith Collins (Allen & Unwin, $36.99) Junk. 2 Vegful by Nadia Lim (Nude Food, $55) 3 The Book of Overthinking by Gwendoline ...
Most Kiwis aren't aware that the end of life choice act is not a concept they'll be voting for, but specific, unmovable legislation. And if we make a mistake, death is a heavy penalty, writes Caralise Trayes. A new Colmar Brunton poll revealed last weekend doesn’t do any favours in helping people ...
Talented teenage shooter Khiarna Williams is committed to travelling 18 hours a week - after school - to realise her netball dreams. Three times a week, 17-year-old Khiarna Williams gets picked up from school to make a six-hour round trip, from Whakatāne to Hamilton, to train with the Magic. Her designated driver ...
Dr Michael SW Lee uses an Easter egg hunt analogy to explain wealth distribution and our innate sense of fairness Ten kids are at an Easter egg hunt searching for 100 eggs. Donald was fortunate, he inherited an Easter egg detector. He spends four hours looking and collects 40 eggs. Steve is a ...
In theory, the closure of Tiwai Point aluminium smelter should bring down electricity prices and help get New Zealand closer to its Carbon Zero 2050 goal. In practice, that isn’t so easy. The announcement Tiwai Point aluminium smelter will close by August next year is a massive blow for the ...
Today The Beths release Jump Rope Gazers, the follow-up to their beloved and acclaimed debut album Future Me Hates Me. Back in December, Side Eye cartoonist Toby Morris joined the band in the studio while they recorded ‘Just Shy of Sure’, which you can listen to here: ...
Three big announcements this week heralded our healthy and profitable future. Those standing in the way, argues Rod Oram, are as out of step as the Think Big world from which they hail. ...
Making the capital earthquake resilient involves billions of dollars, a tonne of anxiety and apartment owners who've had enough of the yellow-sticker nightmare. Time is running out for hundreds of apartment owners in Wellington who face big bills to fix their earthquake-risk buildings. About 1000 buildings in the capital ...
SPECIAL REPORT:By David Robie, who sailed on the original Rainbow Warrior to Rongelap and is author of the bookEyes of Fire. Thirty five years ago today the Greenpeace ship Rainbow Warrior was bombed in Auckland’s Waitematā Harbour by French secret agents in a blatant act of state terrorism, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Scott Morrison summoned his self-restraint and resisted temptation. Invited on Thursday to attack the Victorian government over its disastrous decision to use private security guards to monitor people in hotel quarantine, the prime minister was ...
A new EP from an unknown Auckland singer ignited a bidding war before she’d released a single. Today ‘Call You Out’ is released, with eerie parallels to Lorde’s rise. Duncan Greive meets the artist known as Deryk.Madeline Bradley wasn’t expecting a lot. She’d been to dozens of these meetings over ...
Editorial by Selwyn Manning. Selwyn Manning, editor of EveningReport.nz. New National Party leader Todd Muller has presented his party’s vision for New Zealand as it grapples with the economic cost of the Covid-19 pandemic. But Muller’s vision was unsurprisingly National while surprisingly short on economic detail. And, after a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Former Liberal Minister Christopher Pyne attracted critics for his political front. But he always had plenty of friends and networks, enabling him often to be a player, if not always a “fixer”. After his election ...
Power Play - It's only been three weeks since Minister Megan Woods and Air Commodore Darryn Webb brought fresh eyes to the country's isolation and quarantine facilities, yet cracks in operating procedures are already being conceded. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Alex Reilly, Professor, University of Adelaide Prime Minister Scott Morrison has announced new visa arrangements to help Hong Kong passport holders stay in Australia. This has the potential to impact thousands of Hong Kong visa holders, either already in Australia or overseas. ...
Power Play - It's only been three weeks since Minister Megan Woods and Air Commodore Darryn Webb brought fresh eyes to the country's isolation and quarantine facilities, yet the blinkers are already coming on. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Hannah Dahlen, Professor of Midwifery, Associate Dean Research and HDR, Midwifery Discipline Leader, Western Sydney University The pandemic is prompting some Australian pregnant women to give birth at home without a midwife or registered health provider, according to a survey out this ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Louise Stone, General practitioner; Clinical Associate Professor, ANU Medical School, Australian National University Metropolitan Melbourne and Mitchell Shire are beginning another six weeks of lockdown due to a spike in COVID-19 cases. While this second round of lockdown may bring the case ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Debbie Bargallie, Postdoctoral Senior Research Fellow, Griffith University The Morrison government has just announced a plan to boost the number of Indigenous Australians in the top ranks of the Australian Public Service. The plan may be well-intentioned, but it is also one ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Russell Dean Christopher Bicknell, Post-doctoral researcher in Palaeobiology , University of New England If you ventured to the New York seaside in summer, you might see a large dome-shaped animal with a spiky tail, slowly moving towards the water. These are horseshoe ...
Wellington, July 8th 2020 – The Opportunities Party (TOP) today announces a new tranche of candidates for the 2020 election with leader Geoff Simmons standing for Rongotai, south Wellington. Simmons, longstanding Rongotai resident and former Treasury ...
The New Zealand Taxpayers' Union is welcoming National Party Leader Todd Muller's commitment to limiting Crown debt incurred in the COVID-19 recovery and targeting infrastructure investment, should he be elected in September. Taxpayers' Union spokesperson ...
Business is Boring is a weekly podcast series presented by The Spinoff in association with Callaghan Innovation. Host Simon Pound speaks with innovators and commentators focused on the future of New Zealand. This week he talks to Lovina McMurchy from Movac.If you think about how central to life Starbucks wifi ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Girl, Woman, Other by Bernadine Evaristo (Penguin Classics, $24)Joint winner of the 2019 Booker prize. That was ...
Latest from the Beehive – Northland was missing from the regions to benefit from government announcements in the past 24 or so hours. Southland, on the other hand, is being promised government support for its economy in the aftermath of Rio Tinto’s decision to close its operations at Tiwai ...
E tū union is calling for a ‘Just Transition’ for workers in the wake of Rio Tinto’s announcement it will be closing its smelter at Tiwai Point. Around 1000 workers directly employed by the smelter will be affected, as well as at least a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Adam Kamradt-Scott, Associate professor, University of Sydney This week US President Donald Trump made good on his threat to withdraw the United States from the World Health Organisation (WHO) by sending a formal letter of withdrawal to the UN Secretary-General. In so ...
At midnight last night, metropolitan Melbourne returned to lockdown and is scheduled to stay there until late August. Melbourne-based New Zealander Joe Nunweek reports from a city finding itself once more in the grip of Covid-19.On Monday morning I got a parking ticket. Previously I only used to use my ...
The Chief Ombudsman has identified significant gaps in the Ministry of Health’s collection and use of information about the deaths of people with intellectual disabilities receiving full-time residential support. The report Off the record examines the data ...
The announced closure of Tiwai Point is welcome news for the clean energy future of New Zealand, and presents huge opportunities in areas such as electrifying transport and developing new, high-tech industries, Coal Action Network Aotearoa said today. ...
National leader Todd Muller has given a speech at a business luncheon in Christchurch outlining what he says is his party's first big announcement on its economic plan for New Zealand. ...
The team of five million successful in beating Covid-19 also consists of about 350,000 temporary visa holding migrants. About 42,000 temporary visa workers are stranded overseas due to Aotearoa's border closure. Many have NZ born children and all of ...
The government says there will be a permanent police presence at every managed isolation and quarantine facility in New Zealand from today, following this week's breach in central Auckland. ...
The government says there will be a permanent police presence at every managed isolation and quarantine facility in New Zealand from today, following this week's breach in central Auckland. ...
After almost 50 years, New Zealand’s only aluminium smelter is due to close next August. We take a look at what it means for the economy and the environment.What’s all this then?Multinational metal and mining corporation Rio Tinto has today announced it is planning to close the Tiwai Point aluminium ...
The government is providing an update on its response to the Covid-19 epidemic and the management of isolation facilities, as well as comments on the closure of the Tiwai Point smelter. ...
By Barrie Saunders (who chaired the Port CEO Group from 2002-2015, and has his own blogsite www.barriesaunders.wordpress.com ) The most interesting thing about the Ministry of Transport-commissioned Sapere report on the future of POAL’s freight operations is that, compared with the status quo, all options will add costs to the ...
COMMENT:By Benny Wenda, chair of the United Liberation Movement of West Papua For over 50 years, Indonesia has been promising West Papua “autonomy”. Each time, underneath autonomy lies only bullets and killings. As the 2001 Special Autonomy law expires this year, the United Liberation Movement (ULMWP) and all the ...
Fonterra’s boss might have been ultra-cautious but out on the country’s dairy farms there was a subdued cheer at the news that the wholemilk powder price had leapt 14% at the latest GDT auction.. The GDT index rose 8.3%, the biggest rise since November 2016, and the fourth successive ...
After Newsroom's business coverage? You can get advanced access to our business reporting with a Newsroom Pro subscriptionor find our free coverage in the business section. ...
Despite dark clouds on the horizon, New Zealand’s post-lockdown spending spree is still going strong. Mary Jo Vergara from Kiwi Economics shares insights into what’s driving it – and how long it will last.Covid-19 and the level four lockdown has bought about some dramatic shifts in New Zealanders’ spending and ...
Today’s Tiwai Point closure announcement will result in cheaper electricity for New Zealand households and the chance to swiftly decarbonise transport and industry, says Greenpeace. Rio Tinto’s smelter, which uses 13 percent of New Zealand’s ...
While Matariki and Pūanga rose last month in Pipiri, they are most visible this month, in Hōngongoi (July). Our celebration of them continues.With thanks to Matua Rereata Mākiha, Sam Rerekura and Rangiānehu Mātāmua for sharing their knowledge.Pūanga and Matariki shine high and bright in Tāmaki (Auckland) this month, bringing with ...
Stacey Morrison talks to Chloe Irvine about life with breast cancer through Covid-19. Breast cancer doesn’t wait for anything – not even a global pandemic. The effects and social restrictions of Covid-19 have put immense strain on women (and men) who are receiving treatment for breast cancer, and the pandemic has ...
The Government plans to increase primary sector export earnings by $44 billion over the next decade with a goal of getting 10,000 more New Zealanders working in the sector over the next four years. Prime Minister Ardern said the sector, which has ...
Pacific Media Centre Newsdesk Papua New Guinea’s Controller of the National Pandemic Response and Police Commissioner, David Manning, has told the public that a rumour circulating on social media about new cases of covid-19 in Port Moresby is false, the PNG Post-Courier reports. He also cautioned the public from spreading ...
Rio Tinto finally pulls pin on Tiwai Point smelter, which employs 2,600 directly and indirectly, uses 13 percent of NZ's power and exports $1.2b of aluminium each year This time they weren't bluffing. Rio Tinto has finally announced it will close the Tiwai Point aluminium smelter at Bluff by August 2021 with the loss ...
This story first appeared on rnz.co.nz and is republished with permissionAfter a 90 minute escape by a Covid-19 positive patient from a central Auckland isolation hotel, the Government points to security improvements. The Covid-19 border control minister has signalled there could be more police involvement in managing returnees after ...
There can be few more spectacular political own goals than that just scored against the National Party by first-term Clutha-Southland MP, Hamish Walker this week. The consequences for Walker personally, and his eminence grise, Michelle Boag, have been ...
Yesterday Ātea editor Leonie Hayden suggested a number of Māori whose great deeds deserve to be memorialised in stone. Today Pākehā historian Scott Hamilton picks four heroic early New Zealanders of European descent.Recently I publicly suggested that Akaroa’s Bully Hayes Restaurant and Bar should change its name. Bully Hayes was ...
<center><center><img src="https://img.scoop.co.nz/stories/images/2007/88ff99564d4a71d68d16.jpeg" width="720" height="462"></center> </center> <center>Tweet posted by Nick Bertram </center> In 2017, ...
A highlight from the latest issue of literary journal Landfall is a remarkable poem inspired by I Dream Of Jeannie.Barbara Eden’s Screams 1. It was the 70s. There wasn’t much on. They lured us in with cartoon credits smacked us with the laugh track. Why weren’t ...
The minister in charge of quarantine and isolation facilities has signalled there could be more police involvement in managing returnees after two escapes in a week. ...
Open Mike 04/03/2018 
Reprehensible: There is much that could be said about Michael Woodhouse, but what would be the point? Any man who willingly involves himself in a situation as reprehensible as the one depicted in the above photograph has already vouchsafed all that decent people need to know about his character. That there have ...2 hours ago
As the debate over assisted dying rages in the run-up to the referendum at the election on September 19, a persistent problem continues to dog the discussions. That is to say, a prominent spokesperson for a particular group takes a strong public stand in opposition without acknowledging that they don’t ...2 hours ago
Remember the government's tyrannical Terrorism Suppression (Control Orders) Bill? Remember how it was rammed through Parliament, with a four-day submission period and a select committee process that was a democratic fraud? At the time, the government gave the impression that there was an urgent need for this legislation, that a ...19 hours ago
Attack journalist - Tova O'BrienWe all know that much of the mainstream media in New Zealand is terribly biased. They are in effect another branch of the National Party, and can often be even more prejudiced than their right wing bosses.In fact many right wing politicians moonlight as journalists and ...20 hours ago
One of the challenges of working on illegal wildlife markets, is you don’t really have scope to talk about your research into illegal wildlife markets. There is some stuff though that willbe coming out on Asiatic black bears in China, and before Covid19, I was delving more into rhinos. Which ...2 days ago
79 Articles Observations & observational methods of global warming & effects Six hundred years of South American tree rings reveal an increase in severe hydroclimatic events since mid-20th century (open access) Late summer temperature variability for the Southern Rocky Mountains (USA) since 1735 CE: applying blue light intensity to low-latitude ...2 days ago
Some are surprised at this sudden brain implosion on the part of both Michelle Boag, former National Party President, and the National Party in general, in exposing the private, confidential details of COVID patients. Others…? Let’s be blunt: not so much. Too many of that Party have long operated with ...2 days ago
So now we know, beyond all doubt. The National party has no interest in joining the “team of five million” in our fight against the pandemic but its priority is to take every opportunity it can to damage the government. The cynicism is breathtaking. It was prepared to leak the ...2 days ago
If the government has not lined up behind a "Yes" vote in this year's cannabis referendum the way some reformers would have liked, one entirely laudable thing it did do was commission some science around the public's choice.That science landed today, in the form of the report from an expert ...3 days ago
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Is the consequence of the Simpson Report proposals for restructuring the health system poorer accountability to people? When in doubt, centralise‘ has been a persistent theme in New Zealand public policy throughout our history. The current government is no exception. Here are some examples. - The regional polytechs have been ...7 days ago
Unfortunately, due to a medical emergency, I have landed in hospital so am not able to do a current update on the NZ blog statistics. Let’s hope I can get back to this in good time. ...1 week ago
When the Christchurch murderer pleaded guilty to 51 counts of murder and a number of other violent assault charges a few months ago, he effectively closed the door on what the public will know about the lead up to and commission of the event. His plea means that no evidence ...1 week ago
Daphna Whitmore The Philippines is enduring one of the longest lockdowns in the world. For President Duterte the lockdown provides an opportunity to garner more powers and to push through a brazen assault on human rights. A new law called the Anti-Terror Bill has been passed under urgency and it ...1 week ago
Mark Patterson MP, Spokesperson for Primary Industry New Zealand First is supporting calls by hunters and the New Zealand Tahr Foundation (NZTF) to halt a large scale cull of Himalayan Tahr by the Department of Conservation in National Parks. The calls are supported by a 40,000 strong petition and the ...3 days ago
New Zealanders deserve healthy rivers and lakes that are safe to swim in - but they have been getting worse for decades. That's why, with our latest announcement, we're investing in projects that will help clean up our rivers and lakes and restore them to health, within a generation. ...5 days ago
The Green Party has opposed the COVID-19 Recovery Fast-track Consenting Bill which shortcuts normal consenting processes under the Resource Management Act (RMA), reduces public participation and narrows environmental considerations. ...1 week ago
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters has announced that the New Zealand Government is reviewing the settings of its relationship with Hong Kong. “China’s decision to pass a new national security law for Hong Kong has fundamentally changed the environment for international engagement there,” Mr Peters said. “New Zealand remains deeply ...16 hours ago
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Mark Warburton, Honorary Senior Fellow, University of Melbourne Federal Education Minister Dan Tehan released his Job-ready Graduates Package on June 19 2020. In his National Press Club address, he said it would help drive our economic recovery after COVID-19 and “put more ...39 mins ago
An intensive care doctor is outraged health officials are giving helicopter rescue trusts a daily list of Covid-19 patients, saying it's completely unnecessary. ...44 mins ago
Tiwai Point closure decision hammers Meridian, Contact and Genesis shares on fears wholesale power prices could drop ...1 hour ago
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For me … the first electronic dance music I got into was Leftfield … I still like it / them
Joy division had their moments too
For me it was Jeff Mills…
BTW – small but important point….this is New Order, not Joy Division….my seem trivial but I’m a huge music geek and these things matter!
Cheers JohnS, and thanks for the accuracy …. I knew they had evolved but was having a mental block on their name …… Joy Division to New Order.
The past has a lot of gems for music and video clips…. the Artists deserve correct recognition.
Old school rocks …. 🙂
If we are taking Madchester – I always preferred Happy Monday’s to either Joy Division or New Order
Whats taking Madchester ? 🙂
I sort of went from Punk to Ska to a lot of Aussie rock and other rock and blues.
And then ended up liking a lot of electronic dance stuff …. some of which linked back to the punk 😉
Madchester?
Happy Mondays…. New Order… Joy Divsion… A Certain Ratio… Factory Records… Martin Hannit…Tony Wilson….The Hacienda…
Dude, the start of rave culture (outside of Detroit). You can’t talk electronica and Leftfield without the history of it.
Start with the movie “24 Hour Party People”.
It’ll be ok…. (I’m a fucking audio nerd, man)
EDIT – I meant ‘talking Madchester’
Thanks for the movie tip
Listened to a few songs by The Seekers last night and enjoyed it 😉
Norm is teaching himself Gordon Lightfoot’s ” Edmond Fitzgerald” Canadian folk song, on the guitar, so we are late tonight.( site is bettylouallartists)
Love the seekers too. New Order and the Seekers. Why not
Yeah was going to say. I loved New Order
Otago Uni law camp + naked jelly wrestling.
This year “student organisers have vowed to clampown on drunkeness and ban “full nudity”.
…
“In a statement, the university went on to say that staff members attend the camp.
“Mostly the person who attends is the Dean of the Law Faculty as an invited guest.”
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12005929
Drunkenness and nudity at otago Uni……..I’m shocked, shocked I tell you !
Study is intensely boring. It needs to be liberally interspersed with Noise, Narcotics and Nakedness. Otherwise, what’s the point?
Funny though, if beneficiaries behave like this the middle classes get quite irate about how “they” are wasting “my” money but when a student paid for by us…
I know a guy who bought a home in Dunedin while at the Uni. Rented out the rooms. Used a student loan. All with advice of his wealthy father ( who at dinner parties railed against beneficiaries taking his hard earned money). Didnt complete the Degree. Known as a drug dealer. Maxed the student loan. Sold the house, moved home to Auckland and working for his Dad.
Definition of a bludger?
😉
Not surprised when it comes to the legal fraternity, they are a different life form from normal human beings.
“Not surprised when it comes to the legal fraternity”
True. If they were like all the other Otago students they would be burning their sofas in the streets.
Favourite activity of the denizens from that University I understand. Why do the Law students try and be different?
Moral panic. If Otago had their act together there’d be a place where students could have a bonfire and a few drinks.
You mean like a beach?
For the people who think it’s just a bit of fun and students need to let off steam, read the whole article, then go read up on the emerging #metoo story about NZ law firms. Those things are connected, and if you’re not already making the connections it’s time to start listening to what women are saying about this.
Ah, I see. This bit has “law students as future sexual harrassment risk management nightmares” written all over it:
One girl was selected from each group to take part in a jelly wrestling competition.
…
“All the senior fifth year students pulled out chairs right next to the pit…”
So, it’s not actually a story about students drinking and taking their clothes off, it’s a story about hazing, sexual harassment and abuse of authority. It would help if journalists and the University were capable of distinguishing between those things.
Pretty much. I think anything with ‘law’ and ‘full nudity/jelly wrestling’ or similar should be raising eyebrows now. That’s one whole big mess of culture and entrenched attitudes that will take some time to unravel.
Senior students setting up chairs as the inner ring while others are behind them.
Would love to see the demographic breakdown of tge participant/organisers.
ALL claims of a changed legal culture are beginning to sound very hollow.
I left this profession in 1995 for similar reasons as are being revealed today. Add in a boss who average a secretary every 6 months for the 5 years I worked for him. Who would ask them if they liked “being such a stupid cunt”.
Stood at my door one day and yelled at me, nay screamed, what sort of stupid cunt does that?”. I stood up. Got the file. Flicked to the page whereI had recorded his instructions. Showed him. He looked said ” fuck it” and walked off. I went to the tooilet and vommitted.
The other partner had an office next to mine and must have heard the whole exchange.
This from someone much closer to that scene,
TPPA protests against the signing
Our Nationwide Day of Action has morphed into a Nationwide Week of Action
Events around the country;
Whangarei Sunday 4th of March:
Rally 1pm, Tawera Park near the Whangarei Info Centre
https://www.facebook.com/events/571225906585646/
Auckland Sunday 4th of March:
Rally 1pm, Aotea Square, Queen Street
https://www.facebook.com/events/805505526324341/
Waihi Sunday 4th of March:
Details to come
https://www.facebook.com/events/155211191848613/
New Plymouth Sunday 4th of March:
Rally and picnic, 1pm Puke Ariki Landing
https://www.facebook.com/events/1804674232898957/
Wellington Thursday 8th of March:
Rally, 1pm, Parliament grounds
https://www.facebook.com/events/161873691200281/
Nelson Saturday 3rd of March:
Rally, 10.30am, Cathedral Steps
https://www.facebook.com/events/143815816431911/
Christchurch Thursday 8th of March:
Details to come
https://www.facebook.com/events/218094512072247/
Dunedin Sunday 4th of March:
Rally, 12pm, Upper Octagon
https://www.facebook.com/events/577900969251483/
Nothing has made it into MSM yet as far as I can tell, admittedly from a cursory look.
About 120-150 at Auckland Aotea Square. Great speakers, and close enough to hear well for once!
That won’t impress MSM; all I could find on Stuff was this piece in the Taranaki Daily News: https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-daily-news/news/101957790/small-handful-turn-out-to-protest-against-controversial-international-trade-deal
Nothing in the NZH as far as I can tell (surprise, surprise).
So, what are the next steps given that David Parker has already left NZ to sign the CPTPP/TPP-11?
Carolyn_Nth summarised the situation well below.
Worth going down there to make a comment.
The one point I didn’t realise, is that the Treaty of Waitangi claim on this issue is still unresolved. A great opportunity for Labour to walk the talk – as Moana Maniapoto pointed out.
Just pasting this in here from the James Shaw’s speech to the Green Summer Policy Conference thread, as I keep seeing comments along the lines of the government, and in particular the Greens, not having done much in all that lengthy time it’s been in power. Here are a few of the things they’ve done in the last few months:
Collectively, our ministers have already announced a review of the Waste Minimisation Act, so that it finally works the way Nandor intended when his Bill was passed in 2008;
We’ve announced the imminent creation of a Climate Commission and a Carbon Zero Act that will legislate the elimination of greenhouse gas pollution by 2050 – the most significant piece of environmental legislation in our country’s history;
We’ve initiated a work programme into sexual harassment in the workplace;
We’ve reconvened the pay equity group so that women can finally be paid what they deserve.
And just this week the Government announced a law change that will help ensure future legislation complies with the Human Rights Act – that’s long been our policy and that couldn’t have happened without the Greens in government.
All of this in four months, and that’s just what we’ve been able to talk about publicly.
If you find that unimpressive, and I expect there are some who would, stop to consider for a moment what a NACT/NZ First government would have done in the last four months.
“just what we’ve been able to talk about publicly”.
So what is in the other 33 pages of the Labour/NZF agreement that you committed to support and are rather embarrassed to mention?
You claim to be open and superior to all the other parties.
Well speak up. Tell us about all the secret strategy that Winston the First has ordered you to hide from the Public of New Zealand. The stuff you aren’t allowed to talk about publicly.
Reading Shaw’s list of successes does rather guild the lily doesn’t it? I mean look at his claim that “Government announced a law change that will help ensure future legislation complies with the Human Rights Act “. “Ensure” the man says. Since any Government, including his one can, and will, simply ignore anything a Court says it is hard to see how it can possibly “ensure” anything at all.
I notice James doesn’t claim credit for scrapping a Kermadec sanctuary, and carefully ignores his agreement to support the “Preserve Winnies’ perks” bill.
Come on Shaw. Take credit for everything you support.
Oh well. I guess he can hardly admit that his main achievement was to get Winston to allow a bunch of Green MPs access to the great big BMWs reserved for the Overlords.
Outside the bizarre tinfoil-hat world of right-wing blogs, in which the Labour/NZF coalition agreement is a kind of Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact complete with Secret Additional Protocol, Shaw’s talking about the stuff that is being worked on but isn’t ready to be made public yet.
And no, Shaw doesn’t waste Green Party conference time on the subjects of previous-government clusterfucks that his government is going to have to clean up, or the various dubious antics of NZ First. He’d be a pretty poor leader if he did.
It is a flag waving “Look over here” by a Right winger.
They don’t want us to look at transparency issues!
No,” look at what the Greens haven’t done.” LOL Hehe have another go.
Plus 100well said
Today is 129 days since swearing in of the Government, Alwyn. https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-03-03-2018/#comment-1456504
Your MO still seems to be a mixture of blame and gotcha politics. Time to change your tune to something a little more uplifting?
Fascinating.
After 128 days you try and tell me it is far to soon for me to ask that the CoL should really have got round to doing something.
Now after 129 days you are asking that I forget about it because it has been such a long time that I should have moved onto something new.
Can you not make up your mind?
Actually I can’t make up my mind what Shaw is on about. He is turning out to be the flip-flopper from Hell. Perhaps you can tell me?
Is he trying to pretend that he is important and knows lots of secrets that we mere plebs don’t know anything about because we are mushrooms?
Or is he saying that he can’t talk about plans for the future because his Boss, King Winnie the First, hasn’t told him what he is going to have to support?
Those are really the only two options of course. Which of them do you think is the real one?
Hi Alwyn,
It’s indeed fascinating that 129 days is one day closer to your prescient 5-month time point; is that when the Government has to have achieved more of those symbolic milestones like in the first 100 days? I’d wait 2 more days as 131 is Prime, which, for some, reason seems more appropriate to me.
You enjoy freedom of mind like we all do, to some degree, therefore I cannot force your mind to consider more than those two ‘options’ that you mentioned. So, take your pick and live in your self-created reality in and of which you’re master & commander 😉
Or you could step out of the sandpit and join the adults for mature discourse. Again, the choice is yours, as always, Alwyn.
I hope you won’t mind that I don’t jump into the sandpit tonight; it is nothing personal 😉
If you refuse to consider the list of what they have actually done and ask us to box shadows instead you have no one to blame but yourself when you dont get the replies you want.
I think at this stage of the National governments first term we were just getting the job summit
AND all that came out of the job summit was cycle tracks!!!!
And 90 day by stealth… just for the GFC… then just for big companies then then
Plus 100
To me this article highlights the gross lack of progressive governance of the last government the fault of which lies squarely at the feet of John Key and especially Bill English.
Rather than produce programs to energise and motivate young Kiwis and their communities, and give them hope for the future, they just imported economic refugees to supercharge the economy at the same time ignoring the current disadvantaged.
It was a cheap and lazy way to go about things and lacked any vision for the future of strong and hopeful New Zealand families.
At the very least the new government will attempt energise local community programs which is a start but until all the other factors which keep disadvantaged communities down are fixed it is going to be tough.
https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/insight/audio/2018634437/insight-no-job-no-training-no-hope
Muttonbird
Thanks for spelling it out so plainly. Keeping our minds on reality can be hard when there is so much obfuscation abounding from Gnats.l
Here’s a good anecdote on teaching that says a lot about teachers job load.
It may have be put up elsewhere on the blog but just include it in case wasn’t.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/101824114/ncea-is-damaging-kids-learning-and-breaking-teachers-thinktank-report-finds
1000%
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics
At 10.38 am this morning three Green Party politicians feature with thumbnail photos and all.
One though is conspicuously missing.
Discuss.
Timing favoured JAG today?
Yes, you might be right about the timing but with the news-cycle being ca. 12 hours nowadays it pays to have balance in time & space in MSM. The Green Party goes out of its way to give both candidates equal attention, which they both deserve but also it’s principally the way to conduct these (political) affairs. MSM is still behind the eight ball.
I just looked up the link Incognito put up and went further to Newshub reference to a debate on Facebook today between Genter and Marama Davidson.
The type of comment is disturbing. The sneering, malicious attitude says that these are people who are deeply negative without any sense of interest or positivity about their fellow humans and society. People who want a good society and good politicians leading it don’t talk or think like this.
First three – it gets a bit better after:
Kiore Manarette It’s like a choice between Dumb and Dumber.. 😀
14
· Reply · 2h
11 Replies · 36 min
John Briggs And who’s on the Benfit this Time???, James !!.
1
· Reply · 2h
3 Replies · 1 hr
Donovan Greenwood it’s got to be Marama Davidson. She doesnt have a bun in the oven so is mentally, emotionally, physically ready for the job.
Easy win for her if they’re putting politics first 🙂
1
· Reply · 2h
I would not read too much in those comments; do you pay much attention to comments on RW blog sites? I’ve yet to come across one (in NZ) that can hold and keep together a mature constructive debate between adults but I fully admit I’ve stop searching for it …
Incognito
I don’t follow the other sites much as I can’t bear to wear out my older years reading such god-awful trashy distasteful useless braindead comments.
So every time I come across them again I am freshly upset. I don’t do it often – my old heart can’t take the sadness.
I hear you but please don’t be sad or upset and focus on the positives, the kindness, and the beauty around and in! ourselves, in all of us. Not so long ago we apparently were sea creatures that crawled on land or mud dwellers living at the tide mark, or we were cast there by a storm more likely, and started breathing air and now we’re communicating here on TS and breathing through our noses. I call that evolution and progress 😉
They try to bring us down to their level, with intended and careless comments.
This is a time to strengthen our bonds with people who share our end goals.
Now we may argue at times how to achieve them democratically, but with good will and moves towards open Government plus a momentum building good change it will happen.
Haha Incognito and Patricia. I know what you say is true. What’s the alternative to keeping on keeping on if one doesn’t want to end up sour and negative and seeing everyone in that way.
This is a great place to meet people with heart and a desire for openness and respect for others and for us all to keep learning what we need to support each other through the testing years that have been forecast ahead, but which seem to be collapsing in time.
And still people seem to think they are living in the 1980’s only with more devices. The future is so exciting they say, but they are like people looking through a keyhole. That small view can be obliterated in a trice. But they don’t know what a trice is, that’s old language!
Or “A wink of the eye”
From memory, in their interview the other day Genter listed as an advantage the fact that being a cabinet minister would give her a higher media profile. So this is evidence for her claim.
Which might seem unfair advantage at first glance, but Davidson listed as an advantage the fact that not having ministerial duties gives her more time to work directly with the communities the Greens need to reach, so it all evens out.
Yes, you’re correct and it’s a good point to bring up, thank you.
Please note that I didn’t mention fairness as such and my main concern is balanced reporting. There are already too many pushing for the Green Party to go back to its so-called roots and stick to environmentalism or something similar. For this reason I’m concerned about lack of balance in MSM on anything to do with the GP; it’s bigger than the leadership contest between JAG and MD, which may be unfair to these two outstanding individuals.
I’m also not so sure that it really evens out at this point in time because JAG may have distinct advantage with name-recognition in the lead up but I agree that afterwards it may even out; unfortunately, only one can be elected as GP Co-Leader – a tough choice.
Who are the Green MPs shown?
I thought I had identified who the Green MPs in Parliament were but they have been so overshadowed by their Overlord The Right Honourable Sir Winston the First that they have become non-persons.
Has the election of a female leader taken place yet by the way? If so who is it?
I also thought that Shaw had grown a beard. Was I mistaken? If he tried and ended up looking like Mallard of course common sense would have told him to shave.
Alwyn, there is a link @ 6 you can click!
But given that I feel altruistically helpful tonight, so here especially for you:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/101934329/david-slack-politics-is-in-your-tapwater [Chloe Swarbrick]
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/101725307/julie-anne-genter-minister-for-women-mothertobe-fulltime-feminist [Julie Anne Genter]
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/101922537/green-party-to-open-diaries-refuse-lobbyistfunded-perks [James Shaw]
And if you click more top stories:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/more_headlines
You’ll get a bonus one:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/101909936/statistics-minister-james-shaw-delivers-census-to-wellington-retirement-village [James Shaw]
Would anyone else like JA to sell her other house, if she hasn’t already, in order to set an example?
The example being you only need one house to live in and amateur landlordism and using residential property as a retirement scheme is not ok.
I’d file “What Jacinda Ardern Does with Her House” in the drawer marked “None of my fuckin’ business.”
I think that, to many who read this blog, JA setting the example “Look! I’m turning down a lot of free money for the good of society!” would be a stirring and very heartening one. However, for ordinary people, deliberately failing to make use of a significant asset is a marker of foolishness, not virtue, so she’d be nuts to do it.
The government does need to do something about this, but at the level of property and tax legislation, not the setting of personal examples.
Can’t say I agree with that, sort of like if the prime minister only chose to use private healthcare while being responsible for the public health system. Then her saving grace can be “well most kiwis think you should use private healthcare if you can afford it so I will”. Just wrong.
Our P.M. is going out of her way to support small NZ businesses, in clothing shoes and gifts. She won’t do anything without planning. She told us she is a nerd with anxieties.
Yeah, see when you said “turning down a lot of free money” you nailed it. This is what has led to the situation we are in today. If she was true to her voters she would make some sort of personal statement on this, I would have thought.
It is what has led to the situation we’re in today, but individuals setting altruistic examples isn’t going to be much help, it needs legislative change – which isn’t something Ardern can just order by fiat, especially so given that a lot of voters aren’t going to like having the government take away the magic money tree.
I think it’s a bad look generally, Ardern can buy a new million dollar house without blinking an eye while the rest of Auckland and other parts of NZ are really struggling with escalating rents and sub standard living conditions (residing in garages, cars, etc).
Imagine the leadership shown if she said she will live in a motel housing beneficiaries for 6 months to get a feeling of the housing crisis. Meanwhile she could urgently kickstart work on say an Auckland community apartment complex, being a smarter use of land and one where rents were affordable for all kiwis. Once built she could live there for another 6 – 12 months as an example of how we need bold thinking to solve the house crisis.
That’s going a bit far because how could she be expected to do her job living in a way we all recognise as unliveable?
I do think the building of a property portfolio is inconsistent with what her voters expect her to be doing about the housing crisis.
I can also see how conflicted our resident Nats must be about this. On the one hand they’d love to score points by attacking JA, but also the sanctity of making free money off residential property is untouchable.
Her parents might live there later. Would that annoy you as well?
Are you people lefties? Or just nitpicking troublemakers agin everything? Get a better outlook. And leave Jacinda and our Labour people alone unless they do something out of whack or criminal. Please. Give them a one year trial with mostly positive advice, they might heed it if you aren’t countering it with negatives like this.
Find some other target for your abuse, and your Guy Fawkes fuel. Tell me what sort of a person I am in your opinion. I’m old and it would take a strongly-tipped missive to do real damage.
Living in a motel isn’t unliveable, it’s uncomfortable sure and it’s an example of the manifestation of the housing crisis too.
What better way to solve a major problem in society than experiencing it and living it. Keep your general on the frontline so they know exactly the problems the troops face and how best to win the war.
Yeah, and John Key could’ve moved from Parnell to Manurewa too.
“Ardern can buy a new million dollar house without blinking an eye?”
I hear and read often enough about the “Women’sWeeklyisation” of the PM and the trite fluffy coverage of stuff she does, might do, could do, should do, might dream about doing, did or whatever.
She does an ordinary thing, buys a house, the world goes crazy in context and now I see she didn’t even blink an eye? Jesus wept.
I suggest you do a little research before making assumptions/ judgements/accusations of amateur landlordism, retirement investments etc.
Ardern’s parents are returning to live in Auckland,NZ in the next month or so after living in the Pacific for about the last 10 years. Her father was NZ Police liaison representative first in Niue and then in Samoa, and after his retirement from NZ Police was appointed as NZ High Commissioner to Niue and has served there for the last four years. He has now been appointed NZ Administrator of Tulelau (the last NZ dependency in the Pacific) based in Auckland.
Her sister is also returning to NZ from the UK in the next few months with her husband and two pre-school children after years of also living overseas.
The family will helping with support after the baby is born. As JA’s current home is very small, they probably need both homes in the meantime to house the returning whanau until they get themselves sorted.
The family may also be helping financially.
Is the family going to use that extra house, even if they probably don’t need to?
Just saying that RW attack blogs are using this multiple house owning to undermine her.
You know that the average home ownership of Nat MP’s is >3.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/92409698/the-many-houses-of-our-mps–which-mps-have-a-stake-in-multiple-properties
RW’s should think about removing the mote in their own eye first.
“Just saying that RW attack blogs are using this multiple house owning to undermine her.”
really? Because I thought you were running your own lines.
Well, the motives are different. They are trying to point to a sort of deliberate hypocrisy as a way of reducing her credibility. I am concerned with what messages she’s sending to the people who are struggling with housing certainty and who voted for change.
Ok, fair enough on the motives. What are JA and her partner intending to do with the house?
I don’t know but it doesn’t feel right to me that they (the government) acknowledge the perils to society of multiple house caching while doing it themselves.
What do you mean by caching?
Storing, building up.
So you are criticising JA for intending to keep an empty house but you don’t actually know if that is what she intends to do? Can you not see a problem with that?
As I have pointed out in 7.3 above and below at 7.3.1.3, the purchase of the new house would appear to be a straightforward practical one based on the small size of the current one etc and having family (four adults and two children) returning to NZ after living overseas for years. No more; no less.
Yes Kiwiblog has a continuing stream of shallow one liner comments on it – as they do on any number of topics. However, there was some discussion on the fact you have to own for two years before selling to not be eligible for paying tax on any profit. I think that JA/CG only bought their current house about 18 months ago so would be mad to sell it before the two years is up, especially when family could live in it in the meantime.
Maybe the ones trying to point to a sort of deliberate hypocrisy as a way of reducing her credibility are rabid, one-eyed pissed-off cretins who can’t think of intelligent ways of spending their limited time on planet Earth.
LOL! Well said. Whaleoil has a post up with almost a 100 comments. I now need a very long shower.
The statement yesterday was that they needed a bigger house (the new one) to accommodate family who would be staying and helping following the birth.
Quite frankly, from what has been shown of the inside and outside of their current house on JA and CG’s various social media accounts, it is pretty small and compact – more a pensioner 2 bedroom unit than a family home. Even with just the two of them and a baby it would be cramped, never mind with other family.
I also understand that the current property is not very suitable for security purposes; and the need to provide for DPS officers 24/7 is causing some parking and other problems for neighbours.
No statement has been made as to whether they are going to sell their current property immediately or later. But from a practical point of view, if you have bought a new house and have family returning to NZ it makes sense to keep both in the meantime to accommodate the returnees in the short term or maybe even in the longer term.
Practically Jacinda would be unwise to sell her house as she doesn’t know how soon the support from fickle NZs for her to be PM and in politics will last. If she is rejected or becomes disillusioned with the bruising and brutal arena, she might decide to retire from it for a while, look after her toddler and take up Karate or Judo or some other non-blood fighting sport.
I suppose this matter of the secret Court case has been covered on TS. I did check to see if someone noted it on the 2/3 out of the 283 comments from 18 lead comments. I should check O/M for the 3rd but am worn out. So I will just put it up so those who are interested in what is going on, or not, in NZ can be informed.
It’s about the secret High Court case and originally published by Spinoff, written by Andrew Geddis, Professor of Law at University of Otago. And its about a Court case, very strange and worrying, and perhaps an example of how a facult can be inflated into a crime that can be inflated into something coming under some newly adopted secret law or security code.
The thin edge of the wedge often gets mentioned scornfully when people bleat about bringing in some new law, me included, but it does happen at times. Is this an example of government being despotic or acting under the supremacy of another government, bending its own laws and customs to do so?? Shades of Dotcom and our country acting under another’s orders.
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/351672/secret-court-case-anathema-to-fairness
Andrew Geddis 2/3/18
So, a trial where no public or media are allowed in at all? That’s a big deal. What could it involve?
The suspicions of at least some of us were confirmed when Justice Venning, the Chief High Court Judge, released a statement confirming the subject of the case. It involves an appeal by a Melbourne-based New Zealand woman against a decision to cancel her passport on the grounds that she represents a national security threat to some other, unspecified country. By removing her passport, the New Zealand government says it can neutralise that threat by stopping her from being able to travel there.
How do we know this? Because her case already has been before the High Court last year, when she sought to challenge the government’s claim that not only did her appeal have to be held in secret, but that neither she nor her lawyer were allowed to know the reasons why her passport had been cancelled.
Those reasons, said the government, constituted “classified security information”. And under the Passports Act 2002, it’s not just the public and press who can’t be in the courtroom to hear the content of such information. Neither can the person whose passport is cancelled, nor that person’s lawyer.
Justice Dobson, who heard that earlier case and is hearing the current one as well, was not entirely happy about this situation. As he noted in a judgment that somewhat reluctantly concluded that the legislation had to be read in this manner:
“The whole of our common law tradition, as bolstered by the rights and protections recognised by New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990, render the procedure under [the Passports Act] an anathema to the fundamental concepts of fairness. However, the reality is that Parliament has recognised the justification for the use of that procedure in defined circumstances.”
So, here’s what is happening in the High Court in Wellington. A woman is asking to get her passport back after the government took it off her. She is doing so without knowing the evidence the government has for deciding she represents a security risk, without being able to be in the court to watch the case being argued, and without being able to have her own lawyer present to argue for her (although some unnamed “advocates” have been appointed to “assist with issues that have to be dealt with” in her absence).
There was considerable discussion on Daily Review 28 Feb under Anne’s comment at 4.
My understanding is the the court proceedings will be continuing this coming week.
Thanks VV. Those of us catching up have some good material to connect with.
greywarshark (8) … thanks for the info. Also read that the case is being heard in the basement of the Wellington High Court, for security reasons!
If neither the woman concerned nor her lawyer are allowed in court to argue the case, then it would be interesting to know who is arguing against who in the closed hearing, something I feel in fairness, the woman and her lawyer should have details about. Unnamed “advocates” not being good enough.
And the “unspecified country” for which this woman presents a national security threat is … ??
New Zealand Country
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/351650/mpi-faces-100m-bill-over-cattle-disease
MPI faces $100m bill over cattle disease
4:34 pm on 2 March 2018
Eric Frykberg, Reporter
eric.frykberg@radionz.co.nz
But hey – user pays innit? MPI is not ultimately paying for this giant diseased cowpat, it is we, all of us in the NZ taxpayers union who pay 15c in the $1 GST on everything if not big bags out of our income.
$100 million should be borne from a farmers insurance against disease etc out of their income and then they might start looking at the costs that they impose on the country. And the real, small, farmers can start agitating against the game players that erect the barriers of inflated land prices that add to the costs of those on the ground just getting on with the job, rather than poncing around buying and selling farms on leverage etc.
If they can afford to own more than one or two farms they can pay for the enormous costs the country faces trying to have biosecurity borders and the lapses thereof. In this case of disease it can be laid at their door surely.
Yes, the fact they farm to provide food and exports should not exempt them from paying forward on risk factors. They need to be brought under the rules the rest of us live by, and that may slow their appetite for risk. Insurance to cover risks and deposits of a suitable size.
Farms, like homes should not be gambling chips in our ever more fragile world.
Thanks for your thoughts Patricia. What you think seems to be towards the practical and effective – a good thing to read on TS amongst the wider and perhaps wilder inputs.
Thank you.
Yes greywarshark
Now we know that thus Micoplasma Bovis disease can be transmitted by urine and excrement we worry that those cow wastes are being sprayed all over our roads from leaky overflowing tank traps on those long haul trucks and that pollutes our water systems from the road drains and will end up in our drinking water to!!!!!!
What about the road runoff onto our homes from trucks passing through our suburbs now???
Christ we are stuffed as this is so bloody serious now, and MPI don’t know how to control it they admitted.
I am again to write to the Ministry of Environment about this new threat to our residential communities again, Ministry of the Environment who have been so silent on this and other things ‘see here.’
Climate change emissions and truck increased use is now found to be really occurring as trucks are dirty emitters of climate emissions/carbon.
In 2018 after Napier has now become a “truck gridlocked” community with a large export port and over 90% of all export freight is still carried on trucks we are now so desperate for a safe quiet environment we have now referred this issue back to the Ministry of the Environment after 18 yrs of no solution yet being offered.
We have asked for a inland port to transfer the freight onto rail to Napier Port as it was recommended by the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment in 2006.
Ministry for the Environment
PO Box 10362
Wellington
Dear Ministry of the Environment. 3/3/18.
As you may already be aware, we have over the last 20 years, we all have had extremely serious public health related issues regarding urban residential communities who are constantly exposed to adverse health effects from heavy truck traffic passing through their urban areas on a ‘truck route’ highway that very often in NZ has inadequate mitigation measures to protect the health and well being of those communities.
As it is the policy of a Government to advocacy and to seek solutions through public and local input and consultation, as defined by the Court of Appeal 1992!!!!
We have been involved heavily in that process since our communications to you since May 2002.
Since then, we have been gathering evidence, reports and results of air quality studies independently conducted in coalition with Watercare Services, NIWA, HB Public Health and Ministry for the Environment, through the technical assistance of your staff.
Your staff has requested that we keep an open communication line to them, and that they would assist, as able, to resolve the issues of concern.
To date, three reports from Water care Services, NIWA and Public Health have validated the health concerns that affect our community living near truck routes, and with that information, we were hopeful that local and regional councils would resolve the issues surrounding public health by supporting a reasonable list of early mitigation measures, such as:
1. speed reduction to kph on Highway 50 as it passes through west Cities residential suburbs.
2. smooth road surfacing to reduce tyre particulate pollution.
3. barriers and dense vegetation to contain and absorb traffic pollution
4. return road freight to rail through Napier to the port.
We held a series of meetings with our local City and Regional councils, which resulted in the regional officers agreeing to put the matter before Council, in a bid to have those measures supported.
A press release from the Council came out on 25/2/03, supporting in principle our request for reasonable mitigation.
We had the support also of our Regional Chairman, and a Councillor, previously involved in health issues in central government.
Unfortunately, the following day in council, a majority voted against supporting those measures, which quite honestly left us gutted.
After other meetings with our City Council Mayor, the Mayor did agree to write a letter to The road controlling Authority (then in 2003) Transit NZ supporting a speed reduction to 70kph.
Our Regional Council did admit the planning was questionable before the road was re designated as a ‘Truck Route.’
Quote; “the problem has arisen because prior to the expressway’s construction, the local council allowed residential developments to abut the proposed road.
The decision was unwise and was made when environmental concerns were not as strong and awareness of the possible consequences much lower, a council report by environmental manager, Murray Buchanan states.”
“the community properties, by an act of past planning, are closely adjacent and many are well below the expressway level. This is a unique situation in the district, and because of the elevation of the expressway, noise travels over a wider area.”
Those admissions clearly suggest that both councils should now be actively supporting further mitigation measures to protect those residents, but very little is really being achieved, which now places us in a position to legally challenge their lack of providing a safe environment, and all the other issues raised in that letter by our legal counsel 1/4/02, if the situation is not resolved in the next few months prior to completion of the over bridge and State Highway extension
Important to note is that two of the mitigation measures, 70kph speed and smooth road surface, changes to planning have to be instituted ahead of the completion of that road upgrade, or else it would be cost prohibitive to promote later.
Therefore, we would request that you allow us this remaining time to seek further support prior to instigation of legal proceedings, noting that it is highly likely that this route may be required if councils do not offer adequate mitigation for the health and well-being of our community.
We hope that this further information to you addresses paragraph 3 of your letter dated 11/2/03. We are very sincere in our desire to resolve these health issues in any means available to us and support for environmental legal assistance, should it finally be required, is vital as a means to protect the health and well being of our community.
The current truck ‘movement’ counts for every 24hrs on the Napier south end of the HB Expressway is now on 3rd March 2018 is at a whopping 2489 trucks every day average when in 2001 we measured 997 every day.
Thank you very much for your consideration,
Yours truly,
My understanding is that the MPI put a movement ban on farmers moving their cattle from one farm to the next one when Mycoplasma Bovis was first detected on NZ farms?
So why hasn’t MPI enforced the movement ban on those farmers who broke the rules?
What was the last Government doing about the Mycoplasma Bovis outbreak as it happen on their watch?
Was this Mycoplasma Bovis outbreak due to the running down of the MAF/ MPI by the last Government?
Why hasn’t NZ MPI producers taken out insurance to protect themselves against such outbreaks etc?
Why hasn’t the Trucking industry brought in self contained stock trucks which stop stock urine and shit from being spray all over the place. They have these truck in Oz why not in NZ?
These are sensible serious questions. Perhaps they should be sent to the Ministers of Health/Transport/ Agriculture, as well?
Why weren’t the cattle destroyed straight away, that is what you do with a foot & mouth disease outbreak ?
If farmers have broken the law they should be prosecuted and heavily fined, or put out of business. If there is a nationwide outbreak it will damage the industry and will cost the country and the taxpayers big time $.
This is actually a serious situation and MPI can not be seen to be incompetent ?
I don’t think Mycoplasma is bad as Foot and Mouth as it can’t get into the food chain. But in saying that the farmers should’ve us their common sense and obey the MAF/ MPI movement ban then we would’ve this shit fight of mess that NZ is facing ATM which is no thanks to these dumb asses who thought they knew better than the boffins within MAF/MPI.
It really makes my blood boil that these people can be so dumb, stupid and then expect the Government to give them a payout!!!!!
Also 99% of this shit fight happen under the National Government and what were they doing about it? Easy answer asleep at the wheel as usual and let the market short it out F ing dickheads.
Actresses are very brave to stand up and demand to be heard about sexual bullying and worse. Barbara Ewing interviewed this morning by Wallace Chapman wrote a book called The Actresses, being made into a film I think. It tells the stories of how the profession treats women and the way they cope. She is a NZ actress and author working from London who learned Te Reo decades before we got enthused.
http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018634587/barbara-ewing-why-her-novel-the-actresses-still-hits-home
author interview books
9:36 am today
Barbara Ewing: Why her novel The Actresses still hits home
From Sunday Morning, 9:36 am today
Listen duration 22′ :23″
Barbara Ewing’s book The Actresses was first published in 1997 and is the story of a group of actresses reuniting at their London drama school 30 years after they graduated. It explores how women are treated in the industry and reveals a toxic culture – 21 years before the current light was shone on similar behaviour through the #MeToo movement. Ewing was also an actress and her experience carried a lot of truth into the fictional work. Since then she’s written many books, but explains why The Actresses is still important.
Thank you I will read this.
I seem to be dominating the Open Mike so far but all these things are really interesting and meaningful to us and about people’s concerns so am just giving a heads-up on them so they don’t get missed.
The NZ Institute has made some interesting statements relating to NCEA. I heard a report on Radionz News but can’t find an individual heading and haven’t time to listen through the mass of news.
https://nzinitiative.org.nz/reports-and-media/reports/spoiled-by-choice-how-ncea-hampers-education-and-what-it-needs-to-succeed/
Here are headings from google about NZ Institute release and their findings and thoughts.
(Keywords – news report on NZ Initiative on NCEA)
Business thinktank: ‘External exams needed in NCEA to … – NZ Herald
http://www.nzherald.co.nz › New Zealand
NCEA debate: How can physics and tramping be valued equally? – NZ …
http://www.nzherald.co.nz › New Zealand
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/101824114/ncea-is-damaging-kids-learning-and-breaking-teachers-thinktank-report-finds
https://www.newsie.co.nz/news/84398-ncea-failing-disadvantaged-students-report.html
NCEA an ‘alluring facade’ – Newsroom
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2018/03/03/93585/ncea-an-alluring-facade
Further from Scoop:
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1803/S00030/have-your-say-on-the-education-amendment-bill.htm
You have until Friday 13 April 2018 to have your say on the Education (National Education and Learning Priorities) Amendment Bill. The Education and Workforce Committee is now inviting submissions on this bill.
The bill would amend the Education Act 1989 to enable statements about the diversity of education provision to be included in the statement of National Education and Learning Priorities.
The proposed amendments would align the statement of National Education and Learning Priorities more closely with the New Zealand curriculum, and provide an aspirational vision for the future for young New Zealanders.
2/3/18 http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1803/S00020/savecharterschools-submissions-open-over-2500-sign.htm
You might hate how National set them up, and despite Seymour and ACT equally, but there is good in the well-run concept of schools for those who don’t fit into the mainstream, and perhaps we could get back some for special needs children too that government has stepped on heavily in past years so they can have their own place. Charter schools should be able to form relationships with mainstream and fund places for some children to attnd specialist classes elsewhere, and this would be good for special schools advancing their pupils’ particular talents.
Radionz path to education matters if you want to update your general info:
http://www.radionz.co.nz/search/results?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=education&commit=Search
I sent you some reading on NZ aid to the Pacific which we discussed yesterday on OM.
Here is the link to my comment. https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-03-03-2018/#comment-1456717
Thanks vv. Appreciate.
Nah, that’s not domination; domination is when you crowd out others and their opinions, which you don’t. So, keep them coming. Remember that a few bans were dished out recently too so the place is maybe a wee bit quieter than usual …
Children who don’t fit into the mainstream need to be funded and supported in their own community, at their local school. Education policy should reflect this.
The flexibility supposedly only required for high-needs children, should be demanded for all students. This is important for education.
Hi again greywarshark,
Just had a quick google to check out one of the articles on the Herald which I noted you had on one of your links.
The “experience day tramps” unit actually is a time consuming standard.
Also, it is a unit standard and not an achievement standard, which means that if you are looking for entry into tertiary education then it will not be weighted the same.
The student in the article should know this, and by not putting in these details, it gives a false view of the situation.
The ex principal in one of the other articles is misdirecting on this issue as well. And the PISA results might be an effect of primary children who have been subjected to National Standards. Who knows?
Also, her insistent on exams is old-school and not reflective of understanding or competence.I believe examination taking is a skill over and above the level of knowledge of any particular subject, and many who fail exams often know the work, but cannot retrieve it in those situations.
Hi Molly
I will read that with your comments in mind about the tramps.
About exams – they do provide a separation from school control over assessment. Perhaps a half-year test to see how they go and prepare them for the matter, along with regular short tests and assessments so that the pupil’s knowledge level is exposed? Anything that the NZ Initiative thinks is a good idea must be viewed cautiously and they seem very strong on exams. The present assessments are too demanding for teachers. There is no need for atomic science to order teachers’ checks and so parents know to the nth degree of skill.
I was amazed when I thought I heard that parents were having to pay a fee if they wanted their children to have extra time to do their exams now. They would have to pay for a medical certificate stating why of course. But this imposition on parents with children having difficulties of some sort should not be countenanced by fair and supportive education establishment. Exams shouldn’t be a brick wall for some children.
MacLeans college used to have a good system for children with needs for reader-writer assistance. And the reputation they developed for that assistance, resulted in many students enrolling in that school.
Unfortunately, the NZQA was sceptical of the high number of students requiring that help at exams and gave the school a hard time about whether all these students were legitimate. I can’t recall the end result, but I do remember this occurring. It would be disappointing if that extra fee was a result of this situation.
I’m good at exams, mainly because I have the skill that allows me to read – even badly written exams – and know what it is that the examiner is looking for. This does not necessarily mean that the knowledge I have at that time is permanent and able to be used in workable form.
Internal assessments require that proof, and for students who just want to cram and exam, they are a pain.
But I do believe that they are a better indicator of comprehension and application of knowledge.
Moly
Too much responsibility on the teachers to being do assessments all the time. And with this evil-minded, sucpicious, government and its neolib background, the conditions and demands that teachers must comply with, with the way they are rated hanging in the balance (and with the idea of performance pay hanging like a Damocles sword) I hear that teachers have to fudge some times. The problem is the old one that is described in that saying that you can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. Just looked up my teacher Google and it says that’s been around since the 1500s.
And petit peu French. Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose (1849)!
https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/winston-peters-says-language-police-upset-comments-jacinda-arderns-appearance-have-gone-too-far?auto=5744520985001
Peters tells it like it is. Thank goodness.
What an uproar over nothing. Jacinda Ardern wasn’t offended, I wasn’t offended. Most people I suspect were not offended. It’s a pretty sad state of affairs when you can’t describe anyone as “attractive” without being labeled sexist. In my view, a lovely word trashed by a small bunch of vociferous individuals – and no, I don’t know who they were because I don’t bother reading that kind of silly stuff.
The continuing theme for describing female politicians is to remark on their appearance as if that is the most important thing to know about them.
It’s only okay with the Queen’s description as far as I’m concerned – traditional with Royal commenters. ‘And Her Majesty has changed her well-known hair style to one combed to the side which is very appealing under her daffodil coloured hat with the narrow brim, which she adopts so that the public can see her face’ etc.
I think that it is sort of patronising that a woman is only worth talking to if she is fashionable and attractive. Men are generally not given this sort of attention.
But when they choose to be different, they can it’s true get a notation, as Slavoj Zizek was recently. One journalist found his appearance and manner below par. (He wears a t-shirt quite often and rubs his nose all the time – terribly eccentric from some journalists point of view, the arbiters of everything!)
Agreed Anne. I actually really enjoy watching JA and WP in Question Time. They really are a good tag team! Minds very much on a similar plane.
I think WP is really enjoying working with JA and vice versa, despite the age and political differences. A feeling of mutual respect.
Those journalist comments are designed to detract from serious subjects, but Jacinda is deft at deflection. Another attractive aspect of our P.M. She is grounded.
Check your privilege
Privilege: Unearned access to social power based on membership in a dominant social group
_ Able-bodied physically and mentally
_ Access to education
_ Christian
_ Cisgender
_ Heterosexual
_ Male
_ Native English speaker
_ New Zealand Citizen (at birth)
_ White
Becoming Aware of Privilege should not be viewed as a burden or source of guilt, but rather an opportunity to learn and be responsible so that we may work toward a more just and inclusive world.
(Adapted from OUIT)
DNFTT
Can you please put a link and a proper reference (I have no idea what OUIT is)?
“An actual official checklist, so you can “check your privilege”, with some explanation, from the University of Ontario”
Thanks. Next time please include the link. I’m pretty sure I’ve asked before and it’s getting tedious so I will probably moderated if I see you do that again. Honestly, if you are cutting and pasting, it’s not that hard to link as well.
Baby Boomers or Generation X; which one is more privileged?
Privilege is real but also relative and contextual. This should never be lost sight of; lack of privilege does not necessarily have to hold one back or be a bad thing – it can be a double-edged sword. As you say, it’s how privilege is used and abused that makes it an issue or a non-issue.
As James Shaw said in his outstanding speech:
In this context privilege can be used to do good for the benefit of many and not just for the few who are privileged.
I had a look at the University of Ontario Institute of Technology website – really some very insightful and challenging courses there, particularly wrt human relationships.
eg:
http://alumni.uoit.ca/connect/stamp/training_modules/module-3-diversity-.php
Thank you and I return the favour with some local flavour: https://www.auckland.ac.nz/en/about-us/about-the-university/equity-at-the-university/safe-inclusive-equitable-university/unconscious-bias/overcoming-unconscious-bias/how-privileged-are-you-.html
Thanks for that!
On the chart presented by Pete above – I have to say I score a tick on each one. Being aware of that is so very important and something not to be taken lightly. As Claude Levi-Strauss once said “I had to leave France to study man”.
Or go incognito 😉
Spent the afternoon down the Viaduct with the celebrations of the Volvo around the world race.
Great vibe, amazing setup and neat to see so many families out and about.
Hoping that the Americas cup will be more of the same – but bigger!
It would be an amazing event if ‘we’ get it right.
Recommendation – There is an oyster festival going on down there at the moment – if you like bluff oysters its a must do!!!!
edit – here is the flyer: http://www.eurobar.co.nz/application/files/4315/1840/1468/OysterFest_2018_A3_Flyer_WEB_FA1.pdf
Cheers for the link James.
We usually do a session or two of the Bluff Oysters when they are in.
On the Americas Cup, the construction industry is looking forward to the moment when the client gets its shit together and has a single plan. That single plan then has to be consented, costed, and constructed in time for the Louis Vuitton Cup series not much more than 18 moths away. It’s going to be tight.
Indeed it is – not just the Client tho’ – Auckland Council and the Government have to get their shit set up also.
The client is the Auckland Council. They are paying for the bases.
Central government has big inputs. But no cash so far.
Follow the money 🙂
Emirates Team New Zealand/NZYS are a kind of specifier, with a major timing problem.
The client needs to stabilize this fast, to stop ETNZ taking the Cup to Dubai, which their key sponsor would be just fine with.
“The client needs to stabilize this fast, to stop ETNZ taking the Cup to Dubai, which their key sponsor would be just fine with.
Me too.
Sluuuuuuuurp!
Rip them from their salty beds, prise them open with a knife, tip ’em down ya froat!
“Sluruuuuuuuuuuuuuurp!
Caligula would be proud!
Because enjoying a few oysters = approval of ancient mad dictator…
Truly James is the devil.
Riverton already is, and has been for over 150 years.
Bring back Ed I say.
He’s still scuttling about under his many pseudonyms.
Being stalked by you?
Bang!
If I was the type to enjoy watching someone else racing in someone else’s yachts, and then pay over the top for kai moana most of us had access to in my childhood, I guess I would understand your enjoyment.
As it is, this scenario appeals to me as much as the TPPA rally appealed to you. Find it a bit jarring to read on TS TBH.
Seems that’s how it is at the moment Molly. James just trolls along.
Agree with you about the AC, Molly…Let Dubai host it…
Then the event can’t be used as a cloak to cover the myriad of crises going on within NZ…
Good anecdotal piece from Radionz on youth employment and how it can be forstered and needs to be and is wanted by youth! Lry’s not forget that.
Think that even robbing dairies requires work, planning and organisation. This should be going into something positive for the country and for themselves. An intelligent government of the 21st century has a lot of history study research and experience to fall back on to prevent crime. Young people feeling lost and impoverished in monetary and spiritual terms, found useless, a waste of space, and abused, and they haven’t even had the chance to start their lives! It’s disgraceful neglect by governments not to have decent effectual polices for them.
https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/insight/audio/2018634437/insight-no-job-no-training-no-hope
So this is good stuff. One example of positive moves:
One young man:
He earns a good wage, has opportunities for career progression, and has zero debt to his name.
It’s worlds away from the uncertainty and indecision that plagued the end of his high school education.
Mr Kirk repeated seventh form at Mana College, uncertain about what he wanted to do with his life.
One day, he was approached by a teacher who asked if he was keen to take part in a work experience programme run by Downer, a programme that would allow him to do some paid work experience with the company in the school holidays.
If he impressed, he would have the option to take up full-time work.
Mr Kirk said it was a reality check from day one.
“On my first day on site I was just sweeping up a bit of rubbish, but I couldn’t even use the broom properly. I was a bit embarrassed, but you’ve got to learn some day.
“It was pretty daunting, but once you get to know the people it’s way easier. They help you a lot more when you’re comfortable with them.”
After just a year of full-time work, Mr Kirk now has his forklift driver’s licence and is talking with his bosses about studying to become a foreman.
The bill for that – as with the forklift licence – is borne by his employer, which gets a home-trained, loyal worker in exchange.
Downer first began the programme about seven years ago, and recently joined forces with Partners Porirua to head into local high schools to invite 16 and 17-year-olds who don’t know exactly what they want to do with their lives to take part.
(This type of training should be supported and encouraged by government not just left up to business at their whim.)
Another man still hoping to get started at 24 years, who is statistically classified as – ‘NEET’ or someone who’s Not in Employment, Education or Training.
Apart from a few brief stints on a relative’s farm, he has been unemployed for the best part of a decade.
And it all started, he says, in his first year of high school.
“The second term I stopped going,” he says.
“At the time I’d seen my friends not going to school. Hanging out and that. I was like, oh, I want to be like that. I don’t want to sit in class.
“I found out the hard way that sitting in class was the place to be.”
As of February, there are more than 80,000 young NEETs in New Zealand – a seven percent increase on last year. It’s estimated each NEET costs the economy about $20,000 in lost productivity and benefits – meaning this group of young people costs more than a billion dollars every year.
(And that’s just money, the big loss is in loss of self-image, self-belief, expectation of respect from society that goes on all through life for oneself and those you connect with. We all should play our part in avoiding that with practical and considered help to all.)
you may also enjoy this excellent piece from RNZ as well…
https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/thiswayup/audio/2018634233/a-school-for-teen-parents
had no idea it was happening and sounds brilliant.
That one has been going since 1995 – and is far from the only one. Not sure of the numbers throughout NZ but think there are several more in the Wellington region.
Jacinda Ardern visited He Huarahi Tamariki on 27 Sept, just a few days after the general election, after they invited her just a day or so earlier.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/97298387/lets-eat-this–when-jacinda-ardern-popped-in-for-cake
wonder if that piece was the inspiration for the RNZ one?
Could be but they seem to get a reasonably steady amount of publicity from the Google search I did.
There was an article in Maori on Waatanews in mid Feb 2018 (sorry no translation and way beyond my te reo)
https://www.waateanews.com/waateanews/x_story_id/MTgzNzE=/H%C4%ABkoi-hei-whakah%C4%93-kia-kati-ng%C4%81-kura-hourua
And also this in Feb 2018 https://soundcloud.com/thomas-airey-860885140/clip-1
Discussion called “It is the fact teen parents have a choice that should be applauded” following the Salvation Army Report. But soundtrack is re pokey machines!
yes. i found a 2014 RNZ report as well….its a damn good idea for all sorts of reasons that i hope dosnt constantly struggle for funding though I suspect it does.
https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/teahikaa/audio/2589005/he-huarahi-tamariki-school-for-teenage-parents
Its so hard to get apprentices these days, we approached 2 local high schools, spoke to careers advisors at the school arranged times to give a bit of a talk etc.
Both times we got exactly zero turnout in school hours in a school day offering jobs and training with a start rate of $17 per hour and increases partially tied to credits towards qualification.
Just no interest any more I guess…
.
what trade?
Amenity Horticulture
Wages that you can actually survive on start at about $20.50. So any takers will need to be subsidised by helpful relatives or someone else – and not everyone has that.
We have a very low wage mindset in NZ – for most of the population, anyway.
Yeah hence we visited local schools, hopefully to pick someone up who is still living at home while they get started. Takes about 3 months to get over the $20 mark so not to long and given gardening is a dying art generally apprentices start from absolute scratch.
Took me a year of my apprenticeship to earn enough to move out of home it wasn’t the end of the world. TBH was easier to get my papers done living at home.
I have a daughter looking at horticulture. Would you happen to be in Auckland, cricklewood?
When I was talking futures with young people, we would list skills a school leaver needed to be employed in further education or contributing through environmental and social programmes.
As we were talking in the third person, they would freely offer up ideas. They listed skills and attributes needed in all of those areas. We would list them in most important to least important.
Finally, we would look at the first 10. These became a self improvement blue print.
Years later I would meet with students who would say, ” I’m still using the blue print
to build my skills and attributes Mrs.B” That was a buzz. Number 1 was communication skills.
To me that was real education, not the sad tick box stuff often offered now. So I’m pleased it is all being reviewed.
Being a good communicator and being a life-long learner have a few things in common IMO: curiosity and open mind and the realisation that the meaning or purpose of life is not a fixed goal you set for yourself, or set for you by others, but it is the journey or process of life itself – a self-referencing framework, if you like.
Rule #1: Believe the autocrat. He means what he says.
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/03/03/politics/trump-maralago-remarks/index.html
Hmmm He should be careful for what he wishes. Maybe he thinks he might become emperor one day? Not a safe occupation by all accounts – if the fate of Roman Emperors is anything to go by.
Just 10 more days….
hehehe
Went to the anti-TPPA-11 rally in Aotea Square Auckland this arvo.
The message is,
sign the Don’t Do it petition – they want 5,000 signatures by the day of signing the TPPA (8 March) – they have over 4,000 now
there are more similar agreements in the pipeline (RCP with Asian countries; the re-working of the China FTA; the deal with the EU; one with Sth and central American countries)
submit to the NZ select committee after the agreement is signed in Chile on March 8 – when some of the contents will be published – say “no” to re-activating the clauses put on hold – the US will try to revive them
say “no” to ISDS clauses in any future agreements
there is no protection against being sued by corporates for climate change measures; Treaty-related legislation; legislation for better workers’ rights; health care legislation, etc, etc
Robert Reid was MC in Aotea Square; speakers included Byran Bruce; Laila Harre; a nurse who works with young people; Moana Maniapoto (who also sang); Jane Kelsey.
I estimate there were around 300+ people there.
I also recall going to some anti-TPPA demos in Auckland in recent years where the turnout was small. the big demo came in more recent years.
We are in a re-grouping phase. Kelsey praised us for what has been achieved – delaying the TPPA for several years, for example, and the big demos. The message to us was to continue to hold the line
Labour only opposed because it was politically expediant and there opposition no doubt helped protestor numbers… fact they always believed in the tppa or whatever its called now hence signing up…
Nothing new really dunno why the greens dont get more left votes tbh they mean what the say and say what they mean…
Apparently some recent research shows 75% of respondents want an indepth analysis of TPPA-11. Poll done funded by Action Station, conducted by UMR, and published last Wednesday.
Over 50% always opposed the TPPA. I think many will have bought Labour-NZ First’s line that the current deal has been improved. But still a lot of people are uncertain and want an in-depth analysis made public.
Was there any commentary there about President Trump raising steel and aluminum tariffs and the effects that could have on New Zealand steel and aluminum workers?
Taking one issue and spinning it to make the concerns about the revised TPPA seem irrelevant, is a bit irritating to read. The first thought I had this morning on reading your post was “Where do you start?”.
If you are unable to take in the whole view, then all discussions are going to be on surmised scenarios presented in such a way to support your pro-TPPA view. And you have provided the framework in which that discussion happens, and limited the effect it has on issues of sovereignty, health care, human rights for workers in ALL participating countries, and the ability of our government to make good legislative change in regards to environment, NZers health and wellbeing, and as an effective response to the impact of climate change.
Despite my partner working in the steel industry for over decades and having an understanding of how much produced is sold overseas, I don’t feel like entering this discussion with you, because I feel it will be pointless.
The tariff issue is one that needs to be discussed alongside the other issues. It’s a minor concern, to me really. If we are talking about sustainability, then why are we importing steel that can be produced locally, and then complaining about someone else deciding to make the opposite choice?
I’ll take that as a No.
Thought not.
About time some of the logical ends were met.
We import steel into New Zealand according to the kind, quality, volume, and price of steel that we need for the job. Sustainability is in there as an evaluative element in procurement, but only one element.
That is why we import steel. Most of the time local Glenbrook Bluescope does not meet the needs for those criteria. Sometimes it does. But then, as someone with a partner in the steel industry, you already knew that.
We import steel because we think that price is lower and that is the only criteria for purchase.
Not because we believe the quality is better, or that we think Chinese ore and steel workers are treated well. We also don’t consider the impact of transport is worth our time in regards to climate change, because at the moment we don’t have to pay for that impact. It is an externality.
We also import steel because our concern for our steel workers jobs is only when overseas customers might find another supplier, not when we do.
There is a raft of problems in the way we are doing business. Thinking that successful business is always selling high and paying low is wasting our resources, both natural and human.
“But then, as someone with a partner in the steel industry, you already knew that.”
I know that what you have written is incorrect. Because the steel used to replace the failed imported steel was produced by then Pacific Steel, and always could have been.
I also know, that what I consider valuable and “good” business, is poles apart from what you do. And that is a long discussion for another day.
Not that I recall. Laila Harre is researching workers’ issues and trade agreements as I recall.
Hi Carolyn_Nth, we’ll have to set up a Standardista signal. Would have been good to put a face to one of the names I enjoy reading on TS.
Good summary of what was said. Really enjoyed the speakers today.
😎
I was in sunnies. So… incognito! 😂☺
Thanks. Yes. It was good to experience others working to rebuild momentum.
I did feel different today, lighter with a spring in my step and a je ne sais pas … 😉
Sunnies you say, I’ll remember that for next time..
Thank you for the first-hand update. Are there any recordings of the event(s) online?
It (still) feels like they’re trying to build the plane while flying it yet they claim all sorts of benefits to NZ and its economy to be more precise. However, even the claimed (projected?) benefits are trivial and uncertain while the price is even more uncertain. And let’s be clear that there is no free lunch.
An interesting take on problems like PC pronouns and other matters of life and death.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/03/05/jordan-petersons-gospel-of-masculinity?mbid=social_facebook
Had a few interesting conversations with my son, who has friend enamoured with Jordan Peterson.
A good article on the facts behind his appropriation of the C16 bill can be found on medium.com.
And a telling video on his actual interaction with transgender people that is linked to in that article, can be found on youtube.
Interesting – the New Yorker piece was the first time I’ve come across him. I think he probably has some decent arguments – which is rare enough in academia to be worth a look.
From what I could bear to watch, he is a moving sedgway in his arguments, pulling analogy after analogy to prove his point – not just to explain it.
I don’t have much time for him tbh. I can see his appeal for my son’s friend, whose acknowledgement of gender, race and class is very limited.
The use of the term SJW was an immediate turn-off for me. I’ve never fitted well into gender stereotypes, so I am glad to see them being weakened.
I don’t get why someone would make such a big deal about how some other people prefer to be addressed – though I will rarely use “sir” for Peter Jackson or Shonkey.
I read an interesting thread on twitter today – about how videos tend to encourage emotive engagement rather than logical critique – it was with specific reference to conspiracy theories and about how some people think everyone will be swayed by a video which uses image and audio rather than develop an argument.
I think this happens a lot with many topics these days. I prefer to read an argument – and to be entertained by audio-visual media.
But are you being entertained, or propagandise at, all the same?
Good audio-visual entertainment does directly affect you, as all well crafted story telling should.
There is a reason it’s called soft power…
I think I have an inkling where he’s coming from, but I’d have to read some of his stuff before I’m game to attempt a paraphrase.
…. or watch the hundreds of hours of videos he recommends to his detractors…. 🙂
As one of the people in the video says, why should I waste so much of my time to do that when you could explain it right now?
Yeah – watching video isn’t how I look at arguments – We can read between six and ten times as fast. They’re for true believers I guess – though I imagine there’d be the odd decent debate topic somewhere in there.
His book is currently in the shops if you want to fork out $40 +. Had a quick flick through while waiting for someone at Paperplus, and it doesn’t read well to me. Would be interested to hear what you thought, if you did read it.
His main book is free as a pdf – just as well as my budget is a bit constrained these days.
Thanks Stuart. As I mentioned though, I’ve had a bit of a look into his witterings over the last few weeks, and I can’t stomach anymore. If you find some of his work interesting and link, then I’ll look before commenting. That’s the best I can offer at the moment. 😉
Yes… I didn’t mean to inflict him on you. Seems he’s read a bit of Jung anyway – can’t be all bad.
“Seems he’s read a bit of Jung anyway “
🙂 … that’s what got me into looking deeper rather than instant dismissal too.
I think he probably has some decent arguments – which is rare enough in academia to be worth a look.
He does. Unfortunately, he’s a conservative so he’s putting that skill at argument to work for conservative politics. Even more unfortunately, his opponents are often people who confuse feeling very strongly about something with having a compelling argument, eg in the video above, which means he mops the floor with them. Yet more unfortunately, he’d probably still be a relatively-unknown academic if Canada hadn’t tried to criminalise speech.
” Even more unfortunately, his opponents are often people who confuse feeling very strongly about something with having a compelling argument, eg in the video above, which means he mops the floor with them. “
I don’t think he does. He seems spectacularly unable to provide reasonable arguments – so it is a perspective issue I guess.
“Yet more unfortunately, he’d probably still be a relatively-unknown academic if Canada hadn’t tried to criminalise speech.”
They didn’t. He just interpreted the law change in that way. Worth having a look at the article I linked to above, and the actual bill change.
The article you linked to is a piece of weaselry based on ignoring the inclusion of “gender expression” as well as “gender identity” in the bill. However, it does helpfully link to this article, which supposedly “debunks” Peterson’s claim by pointing out that yes, not using words you don’t want to use would be actionable in the courts, but would be unlikely to be a criminal matter and anyway we can trust the authorities not to take action against people for such trivial things. In other words, more weaselry.
The article does drift off occasionally, but also includes links to pertinent information, such as the C-16 bill, and the parliamentary discussion of the same.
The link to the C-16 bill itself shows the the term “gender identity or expression” is what is added to the legislation in terms of adding a category to what constitutes a hate crime.
Peterson adds surmised application of Ontario Human Rights legislation to propose a situation where someone – most particularly himself – may be prosecuted for not using someone’s preferred pronouns.
I tried to look up prosecutions in Canada under both C-16 and the Human Rights Act, but couldn’t find an official source easily. Perhaps if you are interested in how the laws are applied, you can.
Note”: “Gender expression” is a human experience that some seem to take heated offence to, and needs to be included as a discriminatory category. There are those who will dismiss the rights of people purely on their “gender expression”. Violence is often associated with that disregard.
Peterson adds surmised application of Ontario Human Rights legislation to propose a situation where someone – most particularly himself – may be prosecuted for not using someone’s preferred pronouns.
A not-unreasonable surmise, given his opponent Crossman’s statement in this description of the legislation: “In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, though the Human Rights Tribunals and courts.”
“Gender expression” is a human experience that some seem to take heated offence to, and needs to be included as a discriminatory category.
Sure. But if you combine it with laws criminalising speech you’ve got something highly objectionable, in which case it’s unsurprising if people object.
Considering Crossman as an “opponent” to him, rather than someone who disagrees with his premise, is the kind of extension to argument that is flawed.
We have legislation and bylaws in NZ that prohibit a number of situations that will never be prosecuted in court, because the threshold is too high.
It might be of worth for you to read the submission to Bill C-16 by the Canadian Bar Association, who actually have practising human rights lawyers contributing to the discussion:
They go into more detail on Page 3, but too much to cut and paste here.
Still can’t find any hate crime prosecution for the Canadian courts that give an indication that prosecution for the non or misuse of gender pronouns will be a result. Have you had any luck?
Yes, we have plenty of bad legislation in this country, too. That’s not a recommendation.
Still can’t find any hate crime prosecution for the Canadian courts that give an indication that prosecution for the non or misuse of gender pronouns will be a result. Have you had any luck?
I wouldn’t trouble myself to look, because it’s irrelevant. Legislation that only fails to breach your human rights as long as the authorities have the good will not to prosecute is wrong in principle, and rights “protections” that rely on authorities not taking advantage of the power they’ve been given are no protection at all, just wishful thinking.
“I wouldn’t trouble myself to look, because it’s irrelevant. “
It’s not irrelevant. If the submission by lawyers fails to give you pause for thought, then a lack of prosecutions for similar crimes under this legislation would be the next course of action.
As it is you are basing your perspective on emotive “surmises” from a psychology professor.
If the government were to pass a law that would allow people to be prosecuted for failing to use the word “whom” correctly, the subsequent complete lack of prosecutions of offenders would not make that law any less of an affront to the right to freedom of speech and expression. The same applies in this case. Prosecutions or the lack of them are irrelevant to the principle at stake.
“In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, through the Human Rights Tribunals and courts.” That isn’t the surmises of a psychology professor, it’s the submission of a lawyer.
As to the merits or otherwise of the Canadian Bar Association’s claims, case law has demonstrated that Canada’s hate speech laws do result in prosecutions for the expression of opinion, so their claims about this extension of the law should be taken with a grain of salt. I expect it is great for lawyers – lots of media coverage and lots of billable hours in those cases – but it’s certainly not great for anyone who values human rights.
So the Canadian Supreme Court has already defined the bounds of when something is hate speech, and it’s (rightfully) a pretty high threshold.
However, I’d also say that any university educator who intentionally belittles their students probably deserves some formal employment discipline.
Your link outlines several cases where the threshold is quite high, and nothing comparable to the misuse of language scenario that Peterson outlines.
Do you think that pre C-16 amendment someone would have been prosecuted in Canada for referring to an imam as “Father” or “Pastor”? That would be a form of address that deliberately ignores someone’s chosen religious beliefs.
That is how specious Peterson’s interpretation is.
(Not to mention his views on women and sexuality, which may be responsible for such emphatic burblings)
Your link outlines several cases where the threshold is quite high, and nothing comparable to the misuse of language scenario that Peterson outlines.
My link outlines several cases where people were prosecuted for expression of opinion, despite lawyers’ and legislators’ earlier claims that hate speech laws wouldn’t criminalise the expression of opinion. Peterson is right to assume the claims of harmlessness about this extension of the law are just as worthless.
However, I’d also say that any university educator who intentionally belittles their students probably deserves some formal employment discipline.
Disliking the government trying to compel speech from you is not “intentionally belittling your students.”
Publicly detesting their choice of pronoun most certainly is. Just as intentionally mispronouncing their names is belittling.
And given that belittling is not illegal, the government isn’t the one trying to compel speech. The role that the educator chose compels the educator to behave respectfully to students. If the educator refuses to do that aspect of their job, that’s not the government’s fault. Same as how I’d get a talking to if I ripped shit out of particularly annoying clients right to their face.
“The role that the educator chose compels the educator to behave respectfully to students.”
That does not include pandering to their every whim.
“If the educator refuses to do that aspect of their job, that’s not the government’s fault. ”
In Peterson’s case, the educator is being asked to use pronouns that are nothing more than a silly construct.
Peterson is a hero standing up to this nonsense…more power to him.
Oh, you’re back. Did your hornet handle get banned lol
Publicly detesting their choice of pronoun most certainly is.
Nope. If I say here, publicly, the pronouns zi and zur are moronic insults to the English language and my intelligence, I haven’t belittled anybody, I’ve just stated my opinion. If, subsequently, I get a customer asking me to refer to them with those pronouns, I wouldn’t voice that opinion to them because it’s not my place to do so. I might well refuse to comply with their request on the basis that I prefer to speak English, but that’s not belittling them.
In short, the question of whether Peterson belittles his students or not is a matter of how he treats his students, not a matter of personal opinions he might hold. I haven’t seen anything to suggest he belittles his students.
Also worth pointing out: these days, the issue of academic staff being bullied by students is as significant as the reverse. There are plenty of horror stories at my university, and my sister was nearly driven to quit her academic job in the States by the emails she kept getting from students with plenty of opinions to share about her competence, intelligence, teaching style and personality. I doubt Peterson’s ever come up with anything even approaching the personal abuse these spoilt brats can dish out. Looking at that video above, I don’t see an academic bullying and belittling his students, but I do see an arsehole and her friends deliberately antagonising someone because they don’t like his opinions.
Peterson is a hero standing up to this nonsense…
OK, let me just distance myself from that one in case people reading this think I might hold a similar view. Heroes are for dumb cunts.
Haven’t watched the video, but yeah I know the sort of students you mean.
And frankly, the pronoun thing is belittling, regardless. This is something intrinsic to an individual’s identity. I’m no brilliant person at keeping up with these things, but I try. It’s no skin off my nose what somebody wants to be called, be it gender-fluid pronoun or Ali vs Clay. It is, however, important to them. If I respect them, I can try to refer to them in their preferred way. If I don’t respect them, I can think of better ways to call them a fuckwit.
But additionally, you’re not in a position to grade the student who read or watched you express your opinion of how they exist in society.
Agree with McFlock here. He vacillates from requests from students to use the terms “they” and “them” by saying he doesn’t believe they were in use previously. Then he says it depends on who is asking him. Then he changes it to whether they have asked him respectfully enough.
One student says something along the lines of ‘A given name, is one that is chosen and/or made up by parents/a person. Would you refuse to use that name to refer to a specific person?’
He does not answer because he has fallen into a logic trap of his own design. Of course he would. And to acknowledge otherwise, is to admit he will treat them differently because he does not want to recognise their right to gender self expression and identity.
This is not an issue of free speech. That is used as a vehicle to “belittle students” – as McFlock has pointed out numerous times.
And frankly, the pronoun thing is belittling, regardless. This is something intrinsic to an individual’s identity.
It’s seriously not. It’s the English language, not your identity. Feel free to play with English as much as you like, but it’s up to other people whether they want to participate or not.
It’s no skin off my nose what somebody wants to be called, be it gender-fluid pronoun or Ali vs Clay. It is, however, important to them.
And the English language is important to me. If you don’t like its pronouns, other languages are available. But this is a side, and trivial issue – whether or not an academic is willing to use words his students made up is between him and his students, and the university administration if it finds the media attention problematic for its branding. Peterson’s issue is with the government prescribing speech, and his concern’s a valid one.
He vacillates from requests from students to use the terms “they” and “them” by saying he doesn’t believe they were in use previously. Then he says it depends on who is asking him. Then he changes it to whether they have asked him respectfully enough.
So? Those are things he’s free to consider on a case-by-case basis and his opinion on them is as valid as anyone else’s. Your feelings about his opinions are irrelevant.
One student says something along the lines of ‘A given name, is one that is chosen and/or made up by parents/a person. Would you refuse to use that name to refer to a specific person?’
He does not answer because he has fallen into a logic trap of his own design.
I’d have been rendered speechless myself by such an astonishing level of irrationalism. Yes, personal names are specific to people and it’s embarrassing if you use the wrong one. Pronouns, on the other hand, exist so you can refer to people without having to know, remember or use their personal names. If you then have to know, remember and use the word they want you to use as a pronoun, the whole point of having pronouns just disappeared. That question didn’t spring a logical trap, it displayed a facepalm level of ignorance.
Yes. It’s up to other people to decide whether their desire to label the genitalia they will most likely never get to see or touch is more important to them than the labels designated by the actual owners of those genitals. Because that’s the shortcoming of the English language.
And Peterson’s concern is not valid, because your own link shows that merely being an obnoxious, discriminatory fool with an undue interest in labelling other people’s reproductive organs does not constitute “hate speech” by itself, even if it is belittling or ridiculing.
This doesn’t rest on anyone’s promise that prosecutions won’t happen, it rests on the Canadian Supreme Court having already determined the threshold for prosecutions.
Yes. It’s up to other people to decide whether their desire to label the genitalia they will most likely never get to see or touch is more important to them than the labels designated by the actual owners of those genitals.
Whatevs. I’m sure that once the sexless utopia has arrived, in vivo gestation is a thing of the past and weka’s “Why gender equality matters” post is a quaint historical irrelevance, language might well reflect that new sexless nature of humanity. In the meantime, sex is the biggest difference between humans that there is and their languages tend to reflect that. Those who’d prefer to have the sexless utopia right now had best find an island or something.
This doesn’t rest on anyone’s promise that prosecutions won’t happen, it rests on the Canadian Supreme Court having already determined the threshold for prosecutions.
A legislative programme that rests on “Don’t worry, the Supreme Court’s said people can’t actually be prosecuted for this thing we just made illegal” is a shit programme.
Knowing which gender-specific singular pronoun to use requires knowing as much about the “Alex” who sent you an email as you might assume about the hairdresser called “Jules” you’re providing customer feedback on.
But using the wrong pronoun isn’t high enough for prosecution, according to the CSC. However, if using “her” instead of “their” was the worst thing ever done to or said about a gender-fluid (or whatever) person, that would practically be utopia anyway.
If someone beats the shit out of someone else because of the vistim’s gender identity, that’s a hate crime according to the law peterson is worried about. But not if all they did was get anal about matching pronouns to genitals they will never see.
“Pronouns, on the other hand, exist so you can refer to people without having to know, remember or use their personal names. If you then have to know, remember and use the word they want you to use as a pronoun, the whole point of having pronouns just disappeared. That question didn’t spring a logical trap, it displayed a facepalm level of ignorance.”
No it didn’t. He said that despite it all, he would refuse to address a person in their company, by the pronoun they had chosen. Not a third person reference to someone that was not present.
This shows a decided lack of respect and humanity. And is a indication of his poor validation for conflating this issue to one of free speech.
It’s not clear to me under what circumstances you’d address another person using a third-person pronoun – when I’m talking to people I call them “you,” “sir/ma’am” (I expect that’s also egregious hate-speech to some people) or their name (assuming I know it).
And the fact remains that people creating their own individual pronouns and demanding that others use them entirely defeats the purpose of having pronouns in the first place. Someone who refuses to indulge such pointless and irritating narcissism is well within their rights to do so, and it’s the people making the demands who should devote some thought to how they treat others.
Gender expression is the right of every human being. Forcing that delusion onto others should not be.
Peterson’s a favourite over at the sewer so until now I haven’t bothered to find out too much about him.
I shoudn’t have bothered.
There is no polite way to put this, but since Peterson claims that “If you worry about hurting people’s feelings and disturbing the social structure, you’re not going to put your ideas forward,” I’m just going to say it: Spend half an hour on his website, sit through a few of his interminable videos, and you realize that what he has going for him, the niche he has found—he never seems to say “know” where he could instead say “cognizant of”—is that Jordan Peterson is the stupid man’s smart person.
http://www.macleans.ca/opinion/is-jordan-peterson-the-stupid-mans-smart-person/
Peterson said he views university establishments as “the next best thing to a cult” due to their focus on what he calls “postmodern” themes such as equity. He says his independent project will contrast the university model by providing straight humanities education.
For about his first seven months on Patreon, Peterson earned about $1,000 per month. That changed last October, when he saw a dramatic increase in support, which has not slowed. The professor surpassed a fundraising goal of $45,000 on June 10, and is now aiming for $100,000 per month. On Monday, Peterson was making $49,460 every month from 4,432 patrons.
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2017/07/04/controversial-u-of-t-professor-making-nearly-50000-a-month-through-crowdfunding.html
I don’t get it.
Why does he give a damn how someone wishes to be addressed? If it’s a restricted title that might cause confusion, ok. But a pronoun? Why does he “detest” it so?
Seems to me that he has a problem with gender identity, not the individuals. Intentionally aggravating or initimidating individuals he is supposed to educate and inspire is bad enough, but there’s an entire sector of the community he can’t help but offend, intimidate, and otherwise alienate. Which seems a bit, well, discriminatory, to me…
To hell with all his other bullshit, as a teacher he should know better than to bully students over something as easily tweakable as a pronoun. To them it’s their identity. To him, it’s simply a gesture of respect (or its absence).
I didn’t bother watching the video – if a college professor can’t run rings around someone they have 20 or 30 years experience on, their sole source of employment should be Fox News commentariat.
A good sports week New hub I happy with some of the outcomes Ka pai Ka kite ano
This looks like a construction system that will meet the goals of our new government to construct 10.000 of houses needed to meet the demands for new homes. Ka kite ano
https://i.stuff.co.nz/business/money/101956360/the-future-of-nz-housing-is-prefabs-and-180000-tiny-homes
Prime Minister Ardern is playing the Australian media like a black grand piano.
I suspect she is building up momentum in order to use their media to ask something big of Turnbull.
This is one skilful pollie we have here.
After 9 years of the pony tail puller, the Aussies I speak to with are mighty impressed with our current PM.
Most can’t even remember the one before Bill the Bumbler (love Aussie humour somtimes) , name
Or Bill who?
Skilful or natural?
Earn billions, be the richest man in the world… pay no taxes.
Amazon, another tax avoider.
https://www.inquisitr.com/4811819/amazon-earned-billions-in-2017-but-paid-no-us-income-taxes/