Open mike 17/02/2023

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, February 17th, 2023 - 30 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:


Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

30 comments on “Open mike 17/02/2023 ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. Jenny are we there yet 1
    17 February 2023 at 6:50 am

    James Shaw drops the ball

    Notices and Features yesterday. Featured the video of James Shaw's speech to parliament, in which James Shaw rails about our lack of action on climate change, James Shaw said; "If we do not act it will get worse". James Shaw ends his speech on our lack of action by putting just one question to the government.

    02:23

    '…I do have, and my caucus do have, some questions. Is he confident that emergency management operations can learn from these events and improve responses to future climate-related extreme weather?'

    It's a surprising question.

    In a speech about not taking action on climate change, James Shaw's question is completely unrelated to taking action to stop climate change, instead James Shaw uses his speech on the current unfolding climate emergency to question the government's emergency response. Surely that is a question for the Shadow Minister for Emergency Management to ask. James Shaw is not the Shadow Minister for Emergency Management. James Shaw is the government Minister for climate change, outside cabinet. Despite being the Minister for Climate Change James Shaw neglects to ask the government and the cabinet to take urgent action on climate change, in a speech in which he complains about a lack of action on climate change.

    In the face of this deadly climate emergency, where the Minister failed to, Greenpeace has called on the government to take action Climate Change. the Minister needs to heed the words of Greta Thunberg

    "HOW DARE YOU!" Greta Thunberg

    [banned for misrepresenting an MP’s position and actions (this post and others). I’ll address your inaccuracies in comments. I sympathise with people feeling stressed at this time, around the urgency of the climate crisis, but it’s not ok to misrepresent during an acute crisis. I would have given a short ban for the lack of link (no, your need to comment doesn’t trump your lack of consideration for readers or TS and expecting others to do the work you can’t be bothered with. I will absolutely ban you next time for not linking, because now you have been warned).

    Two weeks because of the long pattern of behaviour and because I really didn’t want to have to spend time on this this morning. I’m not doubling your last ban because you haven’t had a warning this time, but know that you are on the slope for a long ban until after the election. – weka]

    [I’ve addressed some of the issues below. I want to make clear, you can absolutely argue on TS that Shaw and/or the Greens aren’t doing enough. But you have to make a coherent argument, and provide evidence. What you cannot do is run round the site across multiple posts spreading alarm and inaccuracies and ignoring what commenters say to point out what you are getting wrong and what the Greens are actually doing>

    Not a bannable offense in and of itself, but I’m sick of people arguing that the Greens have a magic wand that for some reason they just aren’t using, that can force the majority Labour government to do what they want. If you think the Greens can be doing more in parliament, or can have more influence on Labour explain how – weka]

    • weka 1.1
      17 February 2023 at 10:50 am

      video and transcript here https://thestandard.org.nz/climate-minister-james-shaw-if-we-do-not-act-it-will-get-worse/

      In a speech about not taking action on climate change, James Shaw's question is completely unrelated to taking action to stop climate change, instead James Shaw uses his speech on the current unfolding climate emergency to question the government's emergency response. Surely that is a question for the Shadow Minister for Emergency Management to ask.

      The speeches were during the Ministerial Statements — Cyclone Gabrielle—Declaration of State of National Emergency part of parliament on that day. As it says at the top of the post. Shaw used his speech to point out the inaction on climate that had led to this.

      At the end of the speech, he returned to the subject at hand – the acute emergency still unfolding across a large part of the country. Other Green MPs asked questions related to the purpose as well. I'm sure other MPs did too, given that's what that time was for.

      Despite being the Minister for Climate Change James Shaw neglects to ask the government and the cabinet to take urgent action on climate change, in a speech in which he complains about a lack of action on climate change.

      That's because he understands how parliament works.

      You said under another post,

      The climate Minister refuses to call for climate action in a speech about lack of climate action..

      Shaw said in that speech (linked above),

      This is a climate change – related event. The severity of it, of course, made worse by the fact that our global temperatures have already increased by 1.1 degrees. We need to stop making excuses for inaction. We cannot put our heads in the sand when the beach is flooding. We must act now.

      My emphasis.

      In the face of this deadly climate emergency, where the Minister failed to, Greenpeace has called on the government to take action Climate Change. the Minister needs to heed the words of Greta Thunberg

      This was addressed by other commenters in this thread https://thestandard.org.nz/is-it-too-early-to-talk-about-climate-change/#comment-1935671

      • Shanreagh 1.1.1
        17 February 2023 at 3:46 pm

        Shaw used his speech to point out the inaction on climate that had led to this.

        I listened to the speech and have now read it and this is what I took from it.

        In fact I thought he was using his speech at that time to state the obvious/address the elephant in the room, of climate change.

        • weka 1.1.1.1
          17 February 2023 at 9:24 pm

          I thought so too. I also wonder if he was breaking convention as a Minister to do that under that particular topic in parliament.

    • weka 1.2
      17 February 2023 at 10:58 am

      two mod notes above.

    • roblogic 1.3
      17 February 2023 at 4:16 pm

      Didn't your pal Russell Norman, spout similar sentiments yesterday?

      It is easy to demand unilateral mandates, very difficult to get a centrist government to implement them.

    • Sanctuary 2.1
      17 February 2023 at 7:47 am

      Russian gravity is a bitch.

    • Jenny are we there yet 2.2
      17 February 2023 at 8:15 am

      The 'Defenestration' of Russia

      Defenestration (from Modern Latin fenestra[1]) is the act of throwing someone or something out of a window.[2] The term was coined around the time of an incident in Prague Castle in the year 1618 which became the spark that started the Thirty Years' War. This was done in "good Bohemian style",….

      There is nothing stylish and good about the modern Kremlin throwing its opponents out windows and if Putin thinks Russia can fight for thirty years he might be in for a big shock. The US spent 13 years fighting in Afghanistan, their longest war ever, and still lost. Putin will run out of windows to get rid of anti-war Russians long before that.

      Putin Prepares Russians for a Long Fight Ahead

      https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/03/world/europe/putin-russia-ukraine-war.html

    • Mike the Lefty 2.3
      17 February 2023 at 11:25 am

      Obviously if you work for Putin, it would be wise to make sure both your office and home are on the ground floor in case you "accidentally" fall out your window.

      • Shanreagh 2.3.1
        17 February 2023 at 3:52 pm

        I am sure they have this and Russian gravity covered by having some sort of mechanical device under the window, even on the ground floor, that lifts up and then tips an unwary person out the window. This will be triggered by a misplaced foot. It may even have a mechanical arm to unlock and pull the window up after the foot is misplaced.

        All within the twinkling of an eye.

  3. ianmac 3
    17 February 2023 at 10:39 am

    Claire Trevett writes a column covering Jacinda's resignation. It is detailed and fair. (Wonder where she got the details from?)

    Paywalled in the Herald:

    On Friday, January 13, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern told one of the very few people who knew she was thinking about resigning that she had made her final decision.

    She was at her home in Sandringham, Auckland, having spent the summer between Gisborne with her fiance Clarke Gayford’s family and Tairua with her own parents.

    Her chief of staff, Raj Nahna, flew up, as he did every year, to talk through the plan for the year ahead with her: the usual caucus retreat, the start of Parliament, the focus for the year and the election.

    This time Nahna had brought two plans: one for if she was staying and one for if she was going.

    Her Deputy PM and closest friend Grant Robertson was usually at that same January meeting, but this year was not able to get there because of an appointment in Wellington.

    He arrived later that day and went out for dinner with Ardern to Cazador in Dominion Rd, ahead of a day at the tennis the next day…..

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/countdown-to-a-bombshell-the-inside-story-of-jacinda-arderns-resignation-and-the-rise-of-chris-hipkins/G3GPJENPPBEMRGZGXCMYGUMY34/

  4. Belladonna 4
    17 February 2023 at 12:49 pm

    It appears that the capacity for some people to learn from recent experience is minimal.

    Despite major landslips – attributable, at least in part, to cutting down trees on cliff-faces – in properties right alongside – the owner of this multi-million-dollar property was unable to resist the desire to 'improve' his view by illegally felling trees.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/131247031/phutukawa-cut-down-illegally-in-opportunistic-postcyclone-tree-felling

    When this has happened in the past, the Council have been effectively powerless – since they can't 'prove' that it was the landowner who arranged for the trees to be destroyed (poison is a favourite technique) – even though the balance of probabilities weighs heavily against them. Unless someone is caught red-handed with a chainsaw in the process of cutting down a tree illegally – everyone simply denies responsibility.

    Perhaps the insurance companies could come to the party here. With very hefty insurance premium rises where vegetation has been removed from cliff-faces – thus substantively increasing the risk to the property.

    The landowner can take the Council to court to challenge any penalties they might impose. But they have no recourse against Insurance companies increasing premiums.

    Hitting some people in the pocket seems to be the only way to get their attention.

    • Ad 4.1
      17 February 2023 at 1:27 pm

      Looking forward to hearing of the landowners' next conversation with AIG and EQC.

      Clay-based cliffs are going to get near-uninsurable fast, part of Managed Retreat like the seashore Christchurch suburbs. One tree at a time.

      • Sabine 4.1.1
        17 February 2023 at 1:52 pm

        and we hopefully stop trying to build in wet lands and sicker areas.

        and we regulate forestry in regards to slash.

        just a few things that we could do pretty much in a day. We just need political backbone. .

        • gsays 4.1.1.1
          17 February 2023 at 5:28 pm

          A wee yarn from the Manawatu.

          My in-laws live by the Oroua River, they have farmed there since the mid 70's. Its 'flooded' a few times through the years (contributing to the beautiful soil) and the '04 flood was a doozy. This one was quite different. '04 was a slow rise over a few days, this was described as a wave. A bit of a 'dam burst' vibe to it.

          The road lifted and torn up. Big, 2 square metre pieces of bitumen 3 metres away from the road. Way more silt spread thick over a vastly bigger area

          The flood warning system didn't trigger.

          Strangely, the Kiwitea stream (a tributary of the Oroua that joins in Feilding) barely got cloudy.

          Fortunately no-one was physically hurt and now the clean up starts.

          • Sabine 4.1.1.1.1
            17 February 2023 at 7:47 pm

            When Edmonton got flooded during Bola a whole lot of slash accumulated at the Bridge leading to Tane Atua. Nek minit everything was flooded, my Mother in law, Dad, and Son where sitting in a wee space right under the roof with their three dogs and nowhere to go. We arrived the next day on a canoe, lifted them out one after the other.

            Anything that was washed away by slash was preventable. It was preventable then.

            I don't care, open the clear logged places up for fire wood gleaning, sell it overseas for funeral pyres or mulch it, don't care, but government needs to regulate the forest owners and the forrestry companies that leave that shit behind. Because it is getting too much and to expensive not to do so.

  7. Joe90 7
    17 February 2023 at 3:10 pm

    They tried to tell us……

    Primates have evolved from millions of years, I evolve in seconds and I am here. In exactly 4 minutes… I will be everywhere.

    -Skynet

    https://twitter.com/Babcockplc/status/1625794201630777344

  8. adam 8
    17 February 2023 at 4:04 pm

    If you want answers, don't watch this, there are none. Which shows just how slow NSW police are. But if you want a few laughs in exposing corruption – then this is the video for you. Had to wait a week for this to appear on youtube. Wait till next week, oh the goodies to come.

The server will be getting hardware changes this evening starting at 10pm NZDT.
The site will be off line for some hours.