What Paula is proud of

Written By: - Date published: 8:36 am, December 17th, 2016 - 76 comments
Categories: housing, national, paula bennett, useless - Tags: , , , ,

I guess Bennett didn’t have a long list to choose from, but – really? On RNZ yesterday:

Bennett says she’s proud of getting homeless into homes

Deputy Prime Minister Paula Bennett says one of her greatest achievements this year is getting homeless people into homes…

In other news that day:

Fast-growing numbers of homeless putting pressure on freedom camping

Fast-growing rates of homelessness have been revealed in a new Government report into freedom camping.

The Department of Internal Affairs report, published without fanfare this week, found “internally displaced people” were a group contributing to pressure on freedom camping facilities.

“This appears to be a fast-growing group which is adding unplanned demand and competing for public camping spaces,” the report from the DIA and more than 25 council officers found.

“Although homelessness cannot be characterised as freedom camping, due to the lack of choice, year-round, homelessness is an issue [receiving] some benefit from the provision of campsites for non-self-contained vehicles,” the working group added. …

Quite. Here are some other recent headlines that Paula’s pride might like to contemplate…

Most homeless are working poor – Otago Uni
New Zealand housing crisis forces hundreds to live in tents and garages
One in 100 Kiwis homeless, new study shows numbers quickly rising
Calls for increase in social housing as nearly half of the homeless are children
Families with children now 53% of NZ’s homeless
Work and Income sent families to garages
A week at Te Puea (and Marae has fears of ‘smear campaign’)
Government abandons social housing target of 65,000
Housing crisis blamed for Auckland’s rheumatic fever rates
New Zealand’s most shameful secret: ‘We have normalised child poverty’

76 comments on “What Paula is proud of ”

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  1. Carolyn_nth 1
    17 December 2016 at 8:44 am

    I wonder if Bennett is proud of having learned spin, misdirection and double-speak from a master?

  2. JanM 2
    17 December 2016 at 8:55 am

    Isn’t she a piece of work? What have we come to in this country when someone like this is even in parliament, let alone in her position – personally I don’t think she’s fit to be in charge of the hotel cat!

    • Anne 2.1
      17 December 2016 at 9:26 am

      I picked up on this piece of truism:

      Bragging makes you seem less impressive, not more impressive. If you are doing something worth bragging about, others will brag for you.

      Which sums up Madam Bennett nicely. She has to brag about her ‘achievements’ because in reality there are none. Indeed she has achieved the opposite… helped to make life worse for those experiencing hardship (often through no fault of their own) and the generally dispossessed.

  3. Robert Guyton 3
    17 December 2016 at 9:04 am

    What is Paula proud of?

    Paula.

  6. The decrypter 6
    17 December 2016 at 9:34 am

    Especially proud of her ” Buttons and bows”

  7. Draco T Bastard 7
    17 December 2016 at 10:44 am

    This seems to be one of those times when you take what the Minister said as the exact opposite of what she meant. After all, she’s assisted in making homelessness worse by kicking people out of the homes that they had on trumped up drugs charges.

  8. JustMe 8
    17 December 2016 at 11:06 am

    Just after being made deputy pm Paula Bennett said to the media that she will not stuff up on this(being deputy pm).
    Which means she has acknowledged she has made a complete stuff up on her previous MSD portfolio and her more recent HNZ portfolio when she became minister of each government dept.
    I am now wondering if the recent budget that English proclaimed had a wonderful surplus in was the beginning of the Bill and Benn love-affair.Within days of the budget Bennett told all and sundry that she was offering $5000 per homeless person to ‘get out of Auckand’. News items indicated she had not discussed this with English but in my opinion I now get the feeling she did.
    And it was probably about the same time Key was deciding to resign as PM and let Bill and Benn know his decision as well. Hence another reason why Bennett was grinning like a cheshire cat at the outcome of the recent Roskill by-election.
    Some people have delusions of grandeur. They think they are more important than what they truly are. One person in particular is Paula Bennett. She may promise one thing but will deliver on zilch. But in her delusional state she thinks everything is happening and she make a big fanfare about it because it’s ALL ABOUT PAULA BENNETT and Paula thinks she is a wonderful person.

  9. Sam C 9
    17 December 2016 at 11:09 am

    All I see on this site are nasty posts about the current Government.

    Where is the hope? Where are the alternative ideas and discourse?

    The Left seem to be bereft of answers so just happily chip away at the status quo. Top tip for 2017 – that approach won’t get Labour into Government.

    • Rae 9.1
      17 December 2016 at 11:11 am

      Housing and the lack thereof better get this current lot out, they don’t get to play nice, nice after 8 years of ruination

    • Draco T Bastard 9.2
      17 December 2016 at 11:21 am

      Typical RWNJ – complain about the truth being pointed out about their heroes.

      • Sam C 9.2.1
        17 December 2016 at 1:04 pm

        RWNJ. Such a default setting.

        • WILD KATIPO 9.2.1.1
          17 December 2016 at 3:35 pm

          Tired of all those whining lefties?

          Sick of the critics embarrassing your political heroes ?

          Bereft of any real plans for the future yet still desire to defend the indefensible ?
          ……………………………………………………………………………..

          THEN try sAm C ‘s answer for the National party !!!!

          * Sleeps up to 5 !

          * No rent to pay – taking all those hard earned dollars from your wallet !

          * Erected within hours !

          * Open plan outdoor / indoor living !

          * Breezy and cool in summer / ‘aerated ‘ for those long winter nights – prevents steam build up that causes mold !

          * Council approved ( special conditions apply )

    • Sabine 9.3
      17 December 2016 at 11:24 am

      Hope is living in a car freedom camping, cause that sure beats living in a house with indoor plumbing.
      thanks National Party, you are doing a stellar job.

      • Rosemary McDonald 9.3.1
        17 December 2016 at 12:55 pm

        http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/87649873/fastgrowing-numbers-of-homeless-putting-pressure-on-freedom-camping

        and the Situational Analysis …..https://www.dia.govt.nz/diawebsite.nsf/Files/Freedom-Camping/$file/Freedom-Camping-Situational-Analysis.pdf

        “4. Internal displacement (homelessness) – this appears to be a fast growing group
        which is adding unplanned demand and competing for public camping spaces.
        Although homelessness cannot be characterised as freedom camping, due to the lack
        of choice, year round, homelessness is an issue that is receiving some benefit from the
        provision of camp sites for non-self-contained vehicles and is included in this analysis
        for completeness. This is discussed further below.
        Homelessness and permanent freedom camping living
        There appears to be an increasing group of local people who are living temporarily and
        permanently in motor vehicles. This activity can cause primary and secondary harms,
        especially when vehicles are grouped together. People living in these vehicles are also
        at increased risk of harm from harassment and theft [see Christchurch example]. There
        are also a number of temporary and seasonal workers who may use motor vehicles for
        the duration of their employment as the availability of affordable accommodation
        options are not present.
        Existing bylaws and public services do not manage this group well. With few places to
        park, limits on nights spent at any one place, limited litter bin capacity, and few public
        toilets open at night. ‘Homeless’ campers may be caught by enforcement action under
        the Act, which just moves them to a different location and adds to their existing
        financial burdens. This does not address the campers’ needs or the effects on public
        areas generally. Central Otago District Council has issues regarding seasonal workers.”

    • Observer Tokoroa 9.4
      17 December 2016 at 11:51 am

      .
      Hi Sam C

      . Are you suggesting that the Left has no policy of building Houses?

      . While Billy English and Paula are in fact selling Sate Houses off . As fast as they can go.

      You could try perhaps to encourage your Party to build houses – for the homeless. You old stirrer.

      • Sam C 9.4.1
        17 December 2016 at 12:46 pm

        No, I’m saying they have no CREDIBLE policy on building houses.

        Saying you’ll build 10,000 houses a year is like me saying I’ll single-handedly stop climate change. Idiotic.

        • Cinny 9.4.1.1
          17 December 2016 at 1:44 pm

          Sam you are hugely exaggerating. Back to the issues, there are plenty of ideas on this blog, maybe you have been looking on the wrong pages? Or maybe you are simply looking for a bite?

          It’s interesting that you run down others policy but do not supply any ideas of your own.

          It’s obvious that the outgoing governments housing plan has not been working for many many years now, after all if it was working there would be no housing crisis. Don’t you think?

          Re building 10k of houses in a year, how would one know if it would work or not if you don’t try. Technology has changed everything, everything.

          • Draco T Bastard 9.4.1.1.1
            17 December 2016 at 2:17 pm

            That’s one way of 3D printing houses. I’m more in favour of this one:

            Apis Cor’s machine (pictured above) only consumes eight kilowatts of energy while constructing and as it involves additive manufacturing it produces little-to-no waste. The machine is designed to be portable in that it can be transported in the back of a truck to and from sites. While it does not have any rails to move around while printing, the machine is able to print these small designs with ease and means no additional rails need to be assembled prior to printing. The printer operates in a maximum operation area of 132 m² and can be set up in just thirty minutes.

            And I’m pretty sure that the government could easily develop such devices here in NZ using local capability and resources which will provide jobs and develop the economy.

            • Cinny 9.4.1.1.1.1
              17 December 2016 at 3:41 pm

              that was a primo link Draco, so many merits to using this kind of technology. Nice floor plan too.

            • ropata 9.4.1.1.1.2
              18 December 2016 at 8:15 pm

              Aussie robot prototype builds a house in 2 days. The next design should be even faster. Making waves on the ASX

        • Foreign waka 9.4.1.2
          17 December 2016 at 2:01 pm

          Sam, if anyone out there would really be serious – there are models the NZ government can copy – admittingly in Europe but mind you if successful and I think they are and will be, its worth a look. MILLIONS of refugees and immigrants have entered the mainland Europe in the last 2-3 years. To absorb that many people, feed, house and support them has to be one of the toughest jobs and they are pretty good in what they do. It takes brain, courage and sincerity, qualities that MR Bennett with her pursed lips giving condescending advise wont be able to emulate. Unfortunately, this is all NZ has got at the moment and the only saying that comes to mind is: There is a sucker born every minute.

        • Draco T Bastard 9.4.1.3
          17 December 2016 at 2:09 pm

          No, really, it isn’t. It just requires doing what you RWNJs are incapable of – planning the necessary resources.

        • Macro 9.4.1.4
          17 December 2016 at 2:31 pm

          Actually we have the capacity to not only build 10,000 house per year already – we also have the resources necessary to develop the infrastrucure within which to site them. All it needs is the dedication and commitment to do it. Houses do not need to be built on site. This is a slow and inefficient building process. Creating housing modules off site in a factory set up and then transporting to prepared sites for assembly is a far more efficient and better method. Currently every house built on-site is a bespoke creation and has to be individually inspected and certified at regular intervals – it’s like having every shirt or piece of clothing you buy made as a one off. This is nice for those who can afford it – but now-a-days we are happy to buy our clothes off the peg. We still treat our house in this manner.
          I have a 2 bedroom cottage of 72 sq m that was built off site and transported and assembled onsite, connected up to services, and ready to be lived in, in a day. It came complete with its fridge/freezer, dishwasher, full stove and oven, carpets, decks… everything one needed. The cost 8 years ago was less than $90,000. It is steel framed with wooden cladding, and highly presentable. I understand that Alan Duff has exactly the same building – so if it ok for him..
          We just need to commitment to ramp up the process.

          • Sam C 9.4.1.4.1
            17 December 2016 at 2:54 pm

            I actually really hope Labour get in next year. Seeing such simple plans implemented will be so rewarding.

            Because the current government hasn’t thought of or investigated these options already. They’re just being bloody minded, right?

            • Cinny 9.4.1.4.1.1
              17 December 2016 at 3:29 pm

              One just has to look at the building suppliers, the monopoly etc to understand why the outgoing government likes to do things their way. Capitalism and it’s a real shame

              http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/201818170/new-zealand's-sky-high-building-costs

            • WILD KATIPO 9.4.1.4.1.2
              17 December 2016 at 4:12 pm

              The current govt knows very well theres options but wont do anything because :

              * It would show up their free market neo liberalism for the fraudulent ideology it is.

              * It would erode the base who voted National that has been seduced into the false notion of being paper millionaires.

              * It would mean donations to the National party would therefore drop.

              * It would lessen the neo liberal agenda to weaken national sovereignty by increasing the number of land and home owners and thereby politically empowering them.

              * It would weaken the case for justifying having an unrealistic , unsustainable and irresponsible immigration policy.

              * Along with that immigration , – the ability of unscrupulous employers to undermine unions , wages and conditions in NZ.

            • Macro 9.4.1.4.1.3
              17 December 2016 at 4:13 pm

              No the present government is unable to think outside the square Sam – that is why they are such a completely hopeless and shoddy administration. Furthermore they are hamstrung by the ideology that says “small government is good government”. This is nonsense when firm action is required on an issue. To leave these things to the private sector (their modus operandi), is in effect to do nothing, and because they chose to do nothing – business will continue as usual. Of course that is what National wants. BAU. But that is not what is now required. So essentially they have to go, before anything constructive for the population can occur.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                17 December 2016 at 4:20 pm

                No the present government is unable to think outside the square Sam – that is why they are such a completely hopeless and shoddy administration.

                All indications are that they’re incapable of thinking inside the square as well. They’re just robots with outdated programming that’s incapable of recognising that things have changed and so they keep doing the things that have failed.

                • Macro …
                  17 December 2016 at 4:31 pm

                  True. Here we have Businesses with the technology that could well be expanded – but hey – let’s just sit on our hands and do nothing.

            • michelle 9.4.1.4.1.4
              21 December 2016 at 8:44 am

              Sam C they aren’t being blooded minded they don’t give a f

          • Foreign waka 9.4.1.4.2
            17 December 2016 at 2:54 pm

            Exactly.
            But unfortunately, it sometimes seems to me that there those in charge must harbor a almost pathological hatred of those who are not able to afford even a modest house. I truly belief that this pathology is the reason nothing has been done and a lot of sitting on hand is on display.
            If we would talk about a casino it would go up in a flash.

            • Draco T Bastard 9.4.1.4.2.1
              17 December 2016 at 3:03 pm

              The present people in charge don’t want poor people to be able to afford their own home because then they and their donors wouldn’t be able to become rentiers and live well on the hard work of others.

            • Sam C 9.4.1.4.2.2
              17 December 2016 at 3:12 pm

              My grandparents lived their entire adult lives without owning their own home. They seemed to live a happy and fruitful existence.

              What’s with this obsession that everyone has to own their own homes?

              • Cinny …
                17 December 2016 at 3:36 pm

                For me it’s so my family can live where they want to live for as long as they like. Was lucky enough to find my paradise before the crisis, no way on earth we could afford buying a house in the present climate.

                • The PInk Postman …
                  17 December 2016 at 4:16 pm

                  If you have ever lived in a “tied house” you would know .We lived in ties houses foe 30 odd years ,The last fifty years in our own house have been serious worry free, Thanks to Labour’s State loans. Lets bring a similar system back for the present young people.

              • WILD KATIPO …
                17 December 2016 at 3:53 pm

                Caves don’t count as a definition for a ‘ home’ ,… sAm C… and some people aspire to have more security than a tent.

                I’m also surprised that far right wing neo liberal sycophants such as yourself cant see that a society that can no longer afford housing means the financial sector suffers in the long term ( just whose side are you really on ??? )… yet you still defend your beloved party’s idiot incompetence.

                Are you a landlord sAm C ?… do you have vested interests in there being lack of adequate housing? Is this why you support a sub standard and deregulated rental accommodation industry ?

              • Macro …
                17 December 2016 at 4:18 pm

                They don’t have to be for ownership Sam – they can be built for state housing.
                The added advantage of these homes is this: – if for whatever reason they need to be resited – that can be achieved just as easily as they were installed in the first place – because they are built to be transported. I know – I did it with my own.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                17 December 2016 at 4:27 pm

                Although a reasonable question why is it that renting should provide others with more wealth?

              • Delia …
                19 December 2016 at 5:18 pm

                Try raising a family with insecure tenancy, shifting schools, going from rental to rental right through the year, that is the reality of families renting in New Zealand. We used to have state houses to stop that constant churn.

          • Cinny 9.4.1.4.3
            17 December 2016 at 3:39 pm

            That makes perfect sense, offsite building, especially when it comes to getting things ‘ticked off’ by inspectors, as well as so many other benefits. Awesome, what a cool buzz that would have been the day the house was delivered, amazing.

    • AB 9.5
      17 December 2016 at 11:51 am

      “nasty posts”
      Ho hum – some of us get a tad miffed at people who harm others while enriching themselves and their friends, and then lie about what they’re doing.
      Strange that.
      And there are plenty of alternatives – our own history is full of them. 1984 is not year zero. Go read a book or something.

    • michelle 9.6
      20 December 2016 at 11:26 am

      Sam C do you want us to do these bastards work when they are getting paid for it and some

  10. Rae 10
    17 December 2016 at 11:10 am

    People in temporary shelter, old motels, boarding houses, marae, anything without any secure tenure are NOT in homes. The word HOME means permanency, it means a place of belonging, it means stability and security.
    I think it is time we stop using the word home for where people live unless it fits those criteria. Other than that it is just shelter, that’s all, just shelter and state and social houses have become that as well, just shelter.
    If we start regarding the word home for what it really is, and then start thinking what is really required for people to have them, THEN we might start getting somewhere.
    Mr Landlord-out-there, you do NOT provide homes.

    • Draco T Bastard 10.1
      17 December 2016 at 11:23 am

      +1

      Well said.

    • Red Hand 10.2
      17 December 2016 at 11:53 am

      I asked a man about life in the Soviet Union and he told me he had grown up there in the Brezhnev years. He had a happy childhood with permanent right to an apartment. an education, healthcare and stable, secure jobs for his parents. After tertiary education in the USSR and the regime change, he started a successful career in the US. He said the problem with being an adult in the USSR was not being allowed to work, live and travel where you wanted to and the narrow wage difference between professional and non-professional workers.
      What this tells me is that when a modern state attempts to provide citizens with “a place of belonging, stability and security” some citizens, perhaps mainly the tertiary educated, will not be happy and most other states, enabled by their voters, will not be supportive,

      • Draco T Bastard 10.2.1
        17 December 2016 at 12:03 pm

        live and travel where you wanted to and the narrow wage difference between professional and non-professional workers.

        I think the big problem is that he thinks that some workers aren’t professionals.

        • Red Hand 10.2.1.1
          17 December 2016 at 12:56 pm

          He said why shouldn’t someone with a higher education, specialized and sought after skills and making life and death decisions (his father was a doctor) be paid more ? He might have mentioned prestige as well, I can’t recall.
          I asked him why he hadn’t gone back to Russia and he said that if he started a business there, he would have to pay off the mafia.
          I agree with Rae, but as Sam C at 9 says “where are the alternative ideas and discourse”.
          How to achieve Rae’s ideal without people feeling they are enslaved by the state ?

          • Draco T Bastard 10.2.1.1.1
            17 December 2016 at 2:23 pm

            He said why shouldn’t someone with a higher education, specialized and sought after skills and making life and death decisions (his father was a doctor) be paid more ?

            Why should they? They’re not actually working any harder and, for many of them, they’re actually less in demand.

            As for prestige: We actually used to value people who simply did work in this country. Now we disparage those who do critical work such as clean our parks and public toilets while holding those who crash the economy for their own benefit.

            Yeah, I think we’ve got our values really badly wrong and your friend from Russia is a glaring example of that wrongness.

            http://neweconomics.org/a-bit-rich/?lost=true&_sf_s=+publications+++a+bit+rich

            • Sam C 10.2.1.1.1.1
              17 December 2016 at 2:57 pm

              This is hilarious. Life under Brezhnev was all beer and skittles, is that what you’re implying?

              That sort of view is so deluded, I don’t really know where to begin.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                17 December 2016 at 2:59 pm

                Ah, I see that, as a typical RWNJ, you don’t have an argument and thus revert to ad hominem attacks.

                • Sam C …
                  17 December 2016 at 3:34 pm

                  As opposed you, who when faced with a view contrary to your own, simply dismisses it as the ravings of a “RWNJ”.

                  • WILD KATIPO …
                    17 December 2016 at 4:03 pm

                    Who was the idiot who gave $5000 to leave Auckland then another $2000 to come back again and do it all again ?

                    Ahhhh… that’s right ! Paula lard – brain Bennett.

                    Shes quite the funny lady , really ,… didn’t even tell her daddy when he was planning the national budget … great show of teamwork there, one must admit.

                    But never mind,… both of them reunited and back together in the bonds of holy sanctimony once again.

                    They’ll make a good team, – If they ever let the other one know what the other ones up to.

                  • Draco T Bastard …
                    17 December 2016 at 4:42 pm

                    You didn’t provide a contrary view – just an ad hominem.

                  • Red …
                    17 December 2016 at 6:03 pm

                    It simple for Draco he simply parrots the ramblings of a deluded 18th century German dude that wiped out a forest on some book called Das Kapital while bludging off a champaign socialist called Engels

                    • One Anonymous Bloke …
                      17 December 2016 at 6:16 pm

                      Whereas you parrot Ayn Rand. Is it her amphetamine use or love of psychopaths that appeals to you?

                    • Draco T Bastard …
                      17 December 2016 at 9:18 pm

                      No, I don’t do that either. So, that would be another RWNJ making up lies about me.

                  • WILD KATIPO …
                    17 December 2016 at 10:55 pm

                    Charming?

                    Wasn’t meant to be.

                    At all.

              • Paul …
                17 December 2016 at 3:38 pm

                Any chance you could go away?

                • WILD KATIPO …
                  17 December 2016 at 4:22 pm

                  These far right wing neo liberal extremists are great sport though, they are so extreme , – so blindly loyal they just cannot even see when their own party has just shit all over them.

                  Or even refuse to admit it. They cannot cope with being wrong so they simply argue blindly and without direction to save their egos.

                  Therefore, I welcome them. As I said,… they make great sport , and , here’s the important role they play ,… in spite of their ridiculousness, – or at least because of it ,- it gives a marvelous opportunity for so many brilliant ideas and solutions to be brought forth into the public arena.

                  As well as provide a background for other issues such as this govts corruption and collusion over the murder of 29 workers at Pike River.

                  • Red …
                    17 December 2016 at 6:07 pm

                    You are becoming obsessive over pike river, not healthy WK

                    • One Anonymous Bloke …
                      17 December 2016 at 6:08 pm

                      You’re fond of pretending to diagnose people, just like your role-model – Josef Stalin.

                    • Rae …
                      17 December 2016 at 7:29 pm

                      What is not healthy, where Pike River goes, is a society that allows for a total denial of even an attempt at justice for 29 dead people.

                    • WILD KATIPO …
                      17 December 2016 at 7:58 pm

                      red.

                      One could say the same about you – the same obsessive preoccupation with cheerleading a dying ideology and a dying govt.

                      NEWSFLASH !!! – KEYS GONE!

                      Last one to leave turn out the lights.

                      And that’s little old you , Red… all alone in the corner with a few die hard sycophants with a penchant for blogging jaded political ideas.

                      You best try that trolling finger a whole lot harder from here on in because the cheap salesman is no longer around to keep Farrar in clover.

                      Obsessive?… I guess your the type of sycophant that agreed with trying to cover up things such as the Holocaust , Watergate in the early stages. Or any number of otherwise obvious cases of govt and officialdom acting in collusion.

                      That’s the thing with you far right wing neo liberal sycophants…. always finding yourselves at odds with history and the law in pursuit of your short term goals.

                      Maybe it demonstrates who you really are rather than anyone being obsessive here.

                      Let the games commence.

                • Red …
                  17 December 2016 at 6:05 pm

                  Now be nice Paul, many could ask the same of you but are to polite

                  • WILD KATIPO …
                    17 December 2016 at 8:11 pm

                    Unfortunately for you mate , I however am more of a blunt bastard – so fuck the hell off , moron .

                    There.

                    Hope you enjoyed the clarity of expression of having outstayed your welcome.

                    Next time if your going to open your ridiculous trap , feel free to contribute something of use instead of just being an advertisement of how useless you far right wing neo liberal idiots really are.

            • Red Hand 10.2.1.1.1.2
              17 December 2016 at 4:34 pm

              From the report you referenced.

              “This report is not about targeting any individuals in the highly paid jobs it scrutinises. Neither is it simply suggesting that people in low paid jobs should be paid more. The point we are making is a more complex one – that there should be a relationship between what we are paid and the value our work generates for society.”

              I think the point my friend was making, and I agree with him, is that workers who generate more for society deserve more than a medal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hero_of_Socialist_Labour

              • One Anonymous Bloke …
                17 December 2016 at 5:44 pm

                From each according to their ability to each according to their need. (1)

                I have no objection to someone making a buck so long as they cover the costs of doing so, provided (1) has already occurred.

                Those who benefit the most from society – the wealthy – have every reason to see society succeed.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                17 December 2016 at 9:15 pm

                But that’s just it – our present system doesn’t actually do that and what your friend said, as reported by you, is the exact opposite of that. Where he demands more just because he’s a professional and dismisses the fact that the cleaner is a professional as well.

      • Rae 10.2.2
        17 December 2016 at 7:01 pm

        Guess what, no-one is suggesting the state provide everyone with a home, far from it, but we are demanding the state turn the knobs and adjust the levers so that people are able, from the work they do, provide them for themselves. At the end of that there will be some, for whom that will never be possible for one reason or another, that is when we all pitch in and make sure they can. That, my poor misinformed friend, is what “left”actually is.