Daily review 08/12/2021

39 comments on “Daily review 08/12/2021 ”

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1. Sacha 1

   8 December 2021 at 7:08 pm

   Pugh a useless listener. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/maori-development-minister-willie-jackson-kicked-out-of-parliament-for-right-wing-fascist-comment/OIZQJ3QM42VSM3GSSLE7YLLIYY/

   During his speech, Jackson said democracy was about recognising indigenous people and an indigenous voice, "something that the National Party here, and the right-wing fascists on the right here, the Act Party, have forgotten and don't understand."

   Pugh stood and said she objected to being called a "right-wing fascist" and Deputy Speaker Adrian Rurawhe demanded Jackson apologise.
2. Sacha 2

   8 December 2021 at 7:28 pm

   Plunker is attracting an interesting stable.

   https://twitter.com/ZippyGonzales/status/1468442296945311746
   • Blazer 2.1

     8 December 2021 at 7:56 pm

     How many more …blanks…can Plonker fit in his…chamber.
3. Gezza 3

   8 December 2021 at 8:21 pm

   What is it about left-wingers that many of them seem to have to call people in other parties who oppose or their policies “fascists”? Are they ignorant about fascists, or are they just nasty-name callers who like to slur others by nature?

   https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/maori-development-minister-willie-jackson-kicked-out-of-parliament-for-right-wing-fascist-comment/OIZQJ3QM42VSM3GSSLE7YLLIYY/
   • Gezza 3.1

     8 December 2021 at 8:24 pm

     (Pretend that “or” between “oppose” and “their” isn’t really there. Thanks. )
     • Blazer 3.1.1

       8 December 2021 at 9:13 pm

       Still can't work out why Gezza needed the…Pacemakers!

       https://youtu.be/W1KWmMjynBE
   • Blazer 3.2

     8 December 2021 at 9:06 pm

     A bit like the right who call people who oppose their policies…Communists…I recall our P.M being branded that on a number of..occassions.
     • Gezza 3.2.1

       8 December 2021 at 9:51 pm

       Yes, indeed, those on the right who say that have the same sort of dodgy character.
   • Drowsy M. Kram 3.3

     8 December 2021 at 9:56 pm

     Have never before considered using "fascist", so thanks for drawing my attention to Jackson's comment – if he thinks the ‘cap’ fits then I'll certainly consider it in future. Maybe it's both a slur and an honestly-held belief. What is it about some right-wingers that they attract such derision?

     King horrified by Brash slur on Wellington schools

     Island ex-MP says toilet slur an insult

     The mystery of the disappearing ‘bitch’ at the heart of NZ’s democracy

     Smith given pass for Nazi slur

     Of course there's nothing like Nats slurring each other, and there's probably been a fair bit of that going on over the last four years – really speaks to their 'character'.

     “Like Maureen Pugh's f***ing useless.” – Bridges, 2018

     The left, naturally, does it too on occasion: Ben Guerin: a dirty politics fuckwit

     That such slurs don't bring you any joy is not sufficiently regrettable for me to swear off them altogether. Political matters are discussed quite freely on The Standard, and slurs are part of politics – best of luck Don Quixote.

     “Parliament, after all, is not a Sunday school; it is a talking-shop; a place of debate”. – Barnard, 1943
     [from: “WITHDRAW AND APOLOGISE: A DIACHRONIC STUDY OF UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE IN THE NEW ZEALAND PARLIAMENT, 1890-1950” (PDF)
     https://researcharchive.vuw.ac.nz/xmlui/bitstream/handle/10063/5425/thesis.pdf ]
     • Gezza 3.3.1

       8 December 2021 at 10:05 pm

       That such slurs don’t bring you joy is regrettable, but not sufficiently regrettable for me to swear off them altogether. Political matters are discussed freely on The Standard, and slurs are part of politics – best of luck Don Quixote.

       “Parliament, after all, is not a Sunday school; it is a talking-shop; a place of debate”. – Barnard, 1943
       … … … …

       Fair point, Drowsy. Wonder what Barnard would make of today’s Parliament & whether it differs much if at all from the 40s & 50s? Probably not.
     • Gezza 3.3.2

       9 December 2021 at 6:17 am

       That Unparliamentary Language (UPL) study you linked to looks like it will be a fun read, Drowsy 😀 :

       “The following discourse exchange provides an example of the rebuke and repair discourse structure of UPL.

       Mr RICHARDS. Yet we have the honourable member for Hamilton and those who support her, with the audacity to say that the Labour Government is neglectful, indolent, and is incapable of realizing the needs of education.
       Mr JOHNSTONE. – So it is.
       Mr RICHARDS. – Hear the “little kiwi” from Raglan chirping up.
       Mr SPEAKER. – Order. The honourable member must not refer to any honourable member as a kiwi.
       Mr RICHARDS. – I will withdraw the word.
       Mr SPEAKER. – The honourable member must not use the term at all.
       Mr THORN.- The kiwi is a rare bird.
       Mr RICHARDS. – And I am a great admirer of the forest, Sir.
       Mr SPEAKER.- Order, the honourable gentleman must comply with the Standing Orders.3”
   • weka 3.4

     8 December 2021 at 11:10 pm

     Stupid comment from Jackson, just a casual slur without meaning.

     But other times the left naming fascism on the right is on point eg Trump and his team were intent on an authoritarian state.

     https://thestandard.org.nz/trumps-not-so-bad/
   • McFlock 3.5

     9 December 2021 at 12:48 am

     So Pugh thought Jackson called her a facist and complained, when he quite clearly called ACT fascists, and they didn't complain. And the Speaker wasn't listening either. So Jackson got kicked out because he wouldn't apologise to the wrong person.

     Not sure I'd go so far as to call ACT fascist, but I can see why Jackson might regard the impact of past ACT policies on the poor and the Treaty to be somewhat adjacent.

     But hey, maybe the new lot of ACT mps will show their colours one way or the other sometime. You would have thought they still had only one MP, so far.
     • Stuart Munro 3.5.1

       9 December 2021 at 6:01 am

       Storm in a teacup.

       Labour can at present be properly called fascist: "“Fascism should rightly be called corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power." ~ Benito Mussolini.

       The Brownshorts are the bit most progressives don't like, but they are less socially destructive than the 1%ers and their neoliberal enablers. The growth in inequality is anything but accidental.
       • McFlock 3.5.1.1

         9 December 2021 at 1:47 pm

         Reasonable point. It largely depends on how cynical the actoids are – they're often as utopian as socialist revolutionaries (in my experience of them). As opposed to cynically exploiting the utopians to maintain a dystopia with them at the top.
4. RedLogix 4

   8 December 2021 at 10:00 pm

   Not sure if anyone has posted on this yet, but this story on AdBlue is yet another potential post-COVID crisis:

   Diesel trucks and cars that use AdBlue simply will not run without the chemical, according to British insurer AA, and would have to be parked until more supplies were found.

   While that might sound like an inconvenience for a householder, it would be calamitous for the broader economy.

   Trucks are indispensable to the smooth functioning of the economy and supply every business imaginable.

   Most importantly, they supply businesses essential to the lives of almost every Australian, including supermarkets and fuel retailers.

   Much of the heavy machinery used by agriculture, such as harvesters and tractors, is also fuelled by diesel.

   Without the additive, activity on Australia's farms would also be laid low.

   What's more, urea is not only a key ingredient in AdBlue — it's just as important as a feedstock for fertilisers used in agriculture around the world.

   The implication for consumers is that even if they can get their hands on many products – and that's a big if – prices for many things are likely to shoot upwards.
   • weka 4.1

     8 December 2021 at 11:00 pm

     "For anyone with a diesel car, you might be familiar with the blue cap that sits alongside the cap for the fuel tank."

     Never seen or heard of this. Is it on newer diesel vehicles?

     The solution to ag shortages of urea is to transition to regenag and organics which tend to maintain fertility through closed loops systems. We need to transition anyway. Presumably this would free up some of the urea stocks for diesel, but it's still not sustainable, so best we look at different systems. Relocalising economies would drop diesel demand but globalists will resist this because money.
     • RedLogix 4.1.1

       8 December 2021 at 11:20 pm

       The urea addition to diesel is a relatively short-term measure that will disappear as hydrogen takes over at the heavy end of the transport sector.

       (It's there to greatly reduce the production of NOx byproducts in diesel engines, which occurs due to the relatively high combustion pressures and temps necessary to make them work. It works quite well and I think it more or less became mandatory to meet the Euro6 standard. Volkswagen got into quite a lot of strife some years ago trying an alternative approach that was more convenient for the end users, but didn't work nearly as well.)

       But until diesel is phased out, we need it to meet the current standards. And I suspect, although I'm not certain, that the engine management systems on all new engines will simply not run unless the AdBlue is present. And govts will have regulations in place as well. So for the next five to ten years we need this technology.

       It’s technically possible to bypass the AdBlue requirement and I’d imagine if push comes to shove this is what will happen – but in the short-term there could well be a lot of disruption for a few months as operators sort this out.

       As for fertiliser – put simply without it you are condemning billions of people to die of starvation and chaos. I'm not ruling out the possibility of doing agriculture differently, but getting there with anything like the same productivity would be the work of decades.
       • weka 4.1.1.1

         9 December 2021 at 12:27 am

         the article seems to be saying those engines won't run at all without Adblue.

         Regenag may or may not have lower production per acre, but we waste an incredibly large amount of food globally, so it's not a case of regenag not being able to feed the world, but global supply chains and neoliberalism poking sticks in the spokes of the wheels. It's just a different system and it's our lack of imagination that is the issue not the amount of land needed or the ability of farmers to get good production.

         Pretty mainstream orgs are predicting that there will be major shortages of food as conventional ag starts to fail under climate change (eg grain monocropping can't handle the temperature swings). Best we transition while we still have all the current advantages.
         • RedLogix 4.1.1.1.1

           9 December 2021 at 12:50 am

           Regenag may or may not have lower production per acre, but we waste an incredibly large amount of food globally, so it's not a case of regenag not being able to feed the world,

           Honestly with this much at stake I would demand to see rock solid evidence before buying into it. Prior to the invention of the Haber-Bosch process at the beginning of the 1900's that produced industrial urea we barely got to 1.5b people – and famine still stalked humanity regularly.

           Now we feed at least 5 times that population with brunch to spare. Famine, except in the case of political incompetence, is a thing of the past. And since 1960 improvements in plant genetics has reduced land use per capita by half.

           If you're going to advocate to take all that technology away, that's one hell of a gap to backfill.
           • Poission 4.1.1.1.1.1

             9 December 2021 at 1:04 am

             Urea is in short supply globally due to the shortage of natural gas,and subsequent price increases.

             https://twitter.com/BrightonCap/status/1468028059462873090?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1468028059462873090%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fpublish.twitter.com%2F%3Fquery%3Dhttps3A2F2Ftwitter.com2FBrightonCap2Fstatus2F1468028059462873090widget%3DTweet

             Starvation and instability due to high food prices are a very real risk.

             https://necsi.edu/food-crisis
           • weka 4.1.1.1.1.2

             9 December 2021 at 10:07 am

             If you're going to advocate to take all that technology away, that's one hell of a gap to backfill.

             Can't eat straw men my dude.

             No-one is saying take all that tech away. Transition obviously, and if you reread my comments you'll see I was talking about reducing the load on the urea production and distribution system to make it go further. Until you understand both/and approaches I suspect it will impossible for you to get how regenag, relocalising economies and such function.

             Meanwhile, some quick links from online.

             1. predicted conventional crop failures
             2. food wastage stats
             3. regenag/organics stats
             • weka …

               9 December 2021 at 10:26 am

               1. predicted conventional crop failures

               

               https://www.nationalgeographic.com/climate-change/how-to-live-with-it/crops.html

               I’ll hazard a guess they’re using conservative IPCC figures.
             • weka …

               9 December 2021 at 10:30 am

               2/ food wastage stats

               

               Food loss is the decrease in the quantity or quality of food resulting from decisions and actions by food suppliers in the chain, excluding retailers, food service providers and consumers.

               Empirically, it refers to any food that is discarded, incinerated or otherwise disposed of along the food supply chain from harvest/slaughter/catch up to, but excluding, the retail level, and does not re-enter in any other productive utilization, such as feed or seed.

               Food loss, as reported by FAO in the FLI, occurs from post-harvest up to, but not including, the retail level.

               Food waste refers to the decrease in the quantity or quality of food resulting from decisions and actions by retailers, food service providers and consumers. Food is wasted in many ways:

               • Fresh produce that deviates from what is considered optimal, for example in terms of shape, size and color, is often removed from the supply chain during sorting operations.
               • Foods that are close to, at or beyond the “best-before” date are often discarded by retailers and consumers.
               • Large quantities of wholesome edible food are often unused or left over and discarded from household kitchens and eating establishments.

               Less food loss and waste would lead to more efficient land use and better water resource management with positive impacts on climate change and livelihoods.

               https://www.fao.org/food-loss-and-food-waste/flw-data)

               This is a systems management issue. It's not a natural limit of nature or food growing tech.
             • weka …

               9 December 2021 at 10:36 am

               3/ regenag/organics stats

               

               From Regenerative Agriculture: An opportunity for businesses and society to restore degraded land in Africa report in this link

               https://www.iucn.org/news/nature-based-solutions/202110/regenerative-agriculture-works-new-research-and-african-businesses-show-how
           • Robert Guyton 4.1.1.1.1.3

             9 December 2021 at 10:29 am

             There will have to be a change of crop and a change of eating habits.

             I predict tree crops will become widespread (I back sweet chestnut for the win!).

             Regenag approaches will be help with the transition away from conventional agriculture but will be but a stepping stone on the path to where we will end up (a good place).
             • weka …

               9 December 2021 at 10:37 am

               I envision lots of different kinds of food growing tech being used, agree about the need for tree crops. Why aren't we reforesting the South Island especially all that marginal grazing land?
               • Robert Guyton …

                 9 December 2021 at 10:43 am

                 Bone of contention – big bone too, and growing fast (mixed allusions, sorry).

                 Trees are being planted, at pace, on South Island farmland (ex) at a pace that has the farming community highly agitated; pines, that is, black (carbon) gold. My suggestion, to council and central Government is not, stop planting, but plant intelligently, plant diversely, plant more!!
                 • weka …

                   9 December 2021 at 11:08 am

                   yep, it's the thing that some don't get yet.

                   Also, can I say wilding pines, lol. Am completely ok with some areas being managed as native ecosystems but we could be much more strategic about this and let forests grow where they want to grow in many places and then as you say diversify species.
                   • Maurice …

                     9 December 2021 at 11:18 am

                     There are also 'wilding' Douglas Fir; Willow and Poplar (of various types) which are being hacked down and not replaced. Willows in particulsr are being stripped out of river valleys. Also mature farm wood lots are being hacked down all over the place and the logs shipped out of the country. Just watch the roads to district ports to see how much of that is going on.
                   • weka …

                     9 December 2021 at 11:45 am

                     yep. And trees being removed for dairying and being sold as firewood.

                     The removal of willows from rivers outside native ecosystems is criminal.
                   • joe90 …

                     9 December 2021 at 12:22 pm

                     The removal of willows from rivers outside native ecosystems is criminal.

                     Not all willows are equal. Some, like crack willows, are proper bastards, flat-out hybridising, altering local hydrology and jiggering creaks, rivers and wet lands. Their roots dominate water uptake, trap more and more sediment, slow and divert flows, reduce aeration, and root-invaded/altered watercourse beds flood. Their dense summer canopy does nothing good and their winter leaf drop is polluting.
                   • weka []

                     9 December 2021 at 7:51 pm

                     Or,

                     Willows enable biodiversity, provide important food for bees, other insects and stock, support rehydration of the land, protect against erosion, provide critical shade for deforested streams thus lowering water and air temperature, provide in-water habitat for aquatic life and on land habitat for birds, bees, skinks, and other insects, and provide mulch via leaf drop in the autumn.

                     And, they can be used to change the micro climate so that natives plants can establish (and take out the willows later).

                     It’s all about appropriate placement and management

                     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JWrGpTPALI&ab_channel=TALSInstitute

                     John Fry, environmental project manager, addresses how the science on willows got it wrong, and how the science is changing,

                     The willow’s actually a water conditioner and storer and manager, it’s a management plant. It’s not just an open cycle pump.
                   • joe90 …

                     9 December 2021 at 8:34 pm

                     Meanwhile, in the central NI where rainfall is twice that of central NSW, several species of willow are extending their range, spreading into alpine areas, aggressively invading wetlands and becoming the dominant vegetation. They're changing wetland habitats and interrupting ecological processes. They're impeding water flows and exacerbating flooding. More than 50K hectares has been affected and given a chance, they'll choke every waterway in the region.
                   • weka []

                     9 December 2021 at 8:44 pm

                     Did you miss the bit above where I said this?

                     Am completely ok with some areas being managed as native ecosystems but we could be much more strategic about this and let forests grow where they want to grow in many places and then as you say diversify species

                     Obviously native ecosystems should be protected. But try looking at the largely denuded dry places in the South Island and see what a boon willows are. They’re regenerative, including for natives.
                   • Molly …

                     9 December 2021 at 8:50 pm

                     IIRC willows can also efficiently remove contaminants from soil, so is used to help decontaminate poisoned sites.
5. Pete 5

   8 December 2021 at 10:37 pm

   Last week I saw references to and for Dr Shane Reti backing up his virtues for leadership of the National party. A number commented that he is a 'medical doctor' attributing to him worth because of that qualification.

   I thought at the time that history shows that having that qualification does not deign someone to be especially special. I thought of the doctor in Dunedin who murdered a young woman. The doctor in Murupara and the one from Methven with their views on covid vaccinations and their actions around those came to mind.

   And the one in the news today from Kaiapoi. Some will see her as a hero. There is no question she brings the medical profession into disrepute. She seems to be operating in a low trust world – you can't trust the information from the MOE from experts all around the world. But her patients can trust her? She undermines the credibility of all other doctors who accept the science and all medical professionals involved in the vaccine exercise.

   I found online:

   "Dr. Jonie Girouard. My family and I arrived in New Zealand in 2015. Being a Wyoming (USA) native, I've enjoyed living and working in North Canterbury."

   "At The Girouard Centre, we are dedicated to improving the health and wellbeing of our patients."

   "Her passion and most recent adventure in preventing disease and promoting healthier lifestyles for her patients involves her efforts to tackle obesity with new, unique and novel treatments, fulfilling the goal of providing her patients with general lifestyle wellness AND healthier, happier lives!"

   https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-gp-caught-giving-medical-certificates-as-vaccine-exemptions/NCOVS3SQW63GK25OJKMZ5UL3QE/

   The behaviour of American pharmacist in Northland with his bizarre attitude suggests we would have been better importing a fruit picker from anywhere in the world rather than him. The same for Dr Girouard. I hope she goes back to the US.
6. RedLogix 6

   8 December 2021 at 11:30 pm

   And on a more cheerful – obviously pre-COVID note – every now and then the YT algorithm throws up something truly wonderful

   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1O3xjhC9MHU
7. Patricia Bremner 7

   9 December 2021 at 11:14 am

   Enjoyed that

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