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John Key: telling it like it isn’t

Written By: - Date published: 6:12 pm, February 1st, 2014 - 119 comments
Categories: child welfare, greens, john key, Metiria Turei, poverty, racism, sexism, slippery - Tags:

There are many things I like about The Greens.  One of them is that they don’t treat Question Time in the House as a place for cheap point scoring and irrelevant personalised attacks.  Most usually they keep on the issues – very often in a focused and on-going way.

Julie Anne Genter’s well-researched questions about transport policy comes to mind, as having been really good in exposing the weaknesses in the government’s destructive focus on Roads of National Significance, rather than upgrading public transport.  This is the opposition doing its job – they are there to probe government policies for weaknesses.

So John Key’s contribution yesterday to the great Metiria Jacket Diversion was just plain wrong.

In response to the criticisms of Key’s ministers (Tolley and Collins’) personal attack on Turei’s clothes, Key said this:

Prime Minister John Key defended his female colleagues.

“Lots of members of Parliament, on both sides of the House live in actually, much better conditions than a lot of other New Zealanders, and buying much more expensive clothes, so it was a bit rich of Metiria Turei having a go at the minister,” he said.

“But I don’t think it’s racism.”

The Greens were often among the most personal in their attacks on the Government Key said, citing the number of times they called for ministers to be sacked.

“They go hard, they really go hard,” Key said.

Calling for ministers to be sacked is not in the same category of “personal” attacks as diversionary, smear attacks on someone’s clothes or appearance.  Calling for ministers to be sacked is a standard opposition response to ministers failing to do the job for which they have responsibility.

It’s telling that, as an example of “personal” attacks by the Greens, this is all Key could come up with.

3 News last night also had Key repeating his Greens “go hard” line.  It is also telling that 3 News was able to come up with several clips of Key “going hard” with some nasty little personal jibes:

Because noddy over there…

The devil beast…

I’m pleased yesterday when I described the opposition as deluded….”

And that’s just some of Key’s milder contributions in the House.  But, in contrast, 3 News didn’t seem to havene be able to produce any clips of the Greens “going hard” in a personal way.

About the nearest I can think of is Turei’s wonderful response to Key’s and other Nat’s jibes against the opposition as being on “Planet Labour” or Planet Greens” – meaning they are out of touch with reality.

Turei on “Planet John Key”.

Bring back Lockwood.

So, where are the examples of the Greens’ going hard with diversionary digs at irrelevant aspects of other people’s clothes and appearance?

In contrast, I’m sure 3 News could have come up with some examples of Key being far nastier and more diversionary than the examples they used last night.

The Green Party earns kudos for the way they focus on the real issues for ordinary Kiwi and don’t get into cheap point scoring in the House.

NB: Could Judith Collins be any more contradictory with her 2 sentences:

“It would be hard to bully Metiria Turei,” Collins said on the way into National’s all day caucus at Premier House.
“Oh my goodness, isn’t she a sensitive wee sausage?”

What is it Ms Collins?  Turei is unbulliable, or overly sensitive? It’s just so frustrating to see other women collude with the regressive pressure in society, whereby women are judged way more on their physical appearance than men.  I would have expected women politicians to be more clued up than Tolley and Collins on this.

Turei – telling it like it is about growing up in poverty, and the way it is for those on low incomes today.

119 comments on “John Key: telling it like it isn’t”

  1. Clemgeopin 1

    I agree. I am not a Green party voter per se as I generally vote Labour on their social, economic and environmental policies. But I do find the Green party leaders and MPs most disciplined, well mannered in their behaviour, courteous and sharp in their parliamentary questions and speeches. Key has simply exaggerated and told another glaring unfair porky.

  2. SHG (not Colonial Viper) 2

    Hey, I’m not saying that Turei isn’t able to manage her finances, but remember – she complained that the bank wouldn’t give her a 100% mortgage because saving a deposit on 5 years of a 160,000+ salary was too hard.

    • weka 2.1

      [citation needed]

      • Disraeli Gladstone 2.1.1

        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11132060

        “She and her family left Auckland in 2002, partly because of the cost of housing on an MP’s salary.

        She says there were good homes available in Dunedin for $140,000 to $180,000 when she was house hunting.

        But her bank wouldn’t lend her less than $200,000 as she had no deposit and had to take out a 100 per cent mortgage.”

        SHG’s playing with the facts, but his point does sort of ring true. I’m a little confused at how she couldn’t save up a deposit with such a decent salary. I know friends who have done the same with a lot less.

        But I don’t really see how or why she spends her money is relevant to us, unless it’s in regard to a political point. Because in the end, it’s her money.

        • karol 2.1.1.1

          2002 was Turei’s first year as an MP. So she would have had to wait a bit to save for a house deposit. Depends also what her husband earns. Meanwhile, they had a young daughter.

          • QoT 2.1.1.1.1

            And you need a history of at least six months’ savings to get approval. And who knows, the banks could have decided that a first term MP didn’t have the long-term financial stability to service a mortgage.

        • Naturesong 2.1.1.2

          His point does not ring true.

          She was not able to get a 100% mortgage – Sure.

          A statement of fact != a complaint .

          Metiria does not whinge. She’s stands up and fights.

        • Pasupial 2.1.2.1

          SHG

          You, and Bennett of the NZH, fundamentally misunderstand Turei’s position re: mortgage terms, and she using her own situation to illustrate this. Green MPs’ incomes are effectively less than than that of nactlings (whose instinct is always to just take the money and run) because they are substantially used to fund the party. On top of personal contributions (considerable), Turei also has a 10th of her salary tithed to the Green Party.

  3. Chooky 3

    Not only is Metiria Turei always immaculately dressed and very pleasantly good looking ( way better than her scruffy Nact hecklers) but she is the consummate professional

    ….a trained lawyer and an extremely able speaker …..I can not think of anyone I would like better to represent me if I was “down and out” in New Zealand

    These personal attacks by Nact female MPs on Metiria Turei ( and the attacks by John Key on Hone Harawira) are symptomatic of desperation ……. an awareness of how professional and good the Greens and Mana really are !….and how ready they are to lead and govern New Zealand with integrity .

    …..It is a sad Nact government on the wane , which knows it is on the ropes…… and is on the way out..

    …Key and his Nact cronies will be out by the end of 2014!

    • fisiani 3.1

      Satire is not dead

      [Fisi you will have to do better than this if you want to keep posting comments. How about a bit of analysis? – MS]

      • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 3.1.1

        Oh HA HA! Fisiani, that is so sad, you ripping off KJT’s witty point about your delusional comment in another thread and trying to apply it to a realistic comment here. LOL You are so bereft of ideas and originality you have to rip them off someone else and use them within a day of coming across them.

      • Chooky 3.1.2

        Chookies don’t do satire………..too hard….easier to tell the SIMPLE TRUTH…..the Greens and Mana and Labour are going to whip John Key’s and the Nacts arse…..and dont you know it

        fisiani ……i reckon you are a ferret or a weasel …..or maybe even a stoat ..go suck on a bad egg…your side is losing…ha ha

  4. Draco T Bastard 4

    Calling for ministers to be attacked is not…

    I take it you mean sacked.

  5. blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 5

    It appears that the theme of National’s approach this year is going to be to attempt to accuse the Opposition parties of activities that National have been doing and are criticized for.

    Example A: Accusing Mr Cunliffe of lying – Mr Key would have to be the most blatantly dishonest PM we have had. “I didn’t read the report”.

    Example B: Now it’s the Greens turn: “often among the most personal in their attacks on the Government Key ” This is simply not true. (a good illustration of Example A ) & Karol makes the rest of the point well!

    Example C: Hone Harawira accused of not being in parliament enough and going on ‘Jollies’ – John Key is discovered to be out of parliament for more time – and just look at the ‘jollies’ he’s been on (Balmoral and the Brit Conservative Party get-together springs immediately to mind)

    I am guessing this probably is a well known technique – probably has an official name – confuse the opponent by accusing them of what you are doing yourself.

    It brings to mind another trend we have been also seeing, which is simply to state the exact opposite of what is going on. There is a problem with inequality in NZ – “no there isn’t – the gap is closing”. There is a problem with lack of jobs – “no there isn’t we have people leaving the unemployment benefit in record numbers” It is raining “it is sunny” …..This one is being conducted throughout the Western world – I am seeing it on a regular basis and it reminds me of something out of ‘Animal Farm’ or the old Jedi mind-trick. Look out for it – it is everywhere at the mo.

    • gem 5.1

      In the case of accusing the Greens of using personal attacks, it appears to be the Karl Rove doctrine of attacking your opponents on their strengths, not on their weaknesses.
      As Karol indicates, the Greens are noted for focusing on issues, and behaving respectfully in Parliament.

      • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 5.1.1

        Yes I very much agree – Greens are incredibly professional – must piss Nact off no end! 😀

        • Arfamo 5.1.1.1

          I think National’s strategy’s pretty obvious. Because the greens don’t make personal attacks and focus on issues, you can probably expect them to be getting a lot of petty personal attacks from National this year. All designed to provoke a personal attack in response. Their defence should be just to ignore them and focus on the issues. The minute they fall into the trap of responding in kind they lose that mana.

          • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 5.1.1.1.1

            Yes, I agree and I hope the Nastis-I-mean-Nacts carry on with that strategy – because it just makes the Nacts look petty – not the Greens.

            I think that Metiria’s response this time wasn’t as good as usual for the Greens, hopefully they have realised that.

            • North 5.1.1.1.1.1

              Blue Leopard @ 5: top marks for your comment thus – “I am guessing this probably is a well known technique – probably has an official name – confuse the opponent by accusing them of what you are doing yourself.”

              You might have said “contemptibly cynical obfuscating falsehoods”. Too demanding of the minimal intellects of zealots Fisiani and others ? Never mind. They can always consult the towering conceit and spin-intellect of “philosopher” Jamie Whyte of ACT.

    • Chooky 5.2

      …it is a very confusing world out there….i blame the lying stoats and weasels and ferrets….all they want is our nest eggs

  6. BLiP 6

    You gotta admit, this tactic from the Crosby/Textor Manual of Dark Arts has managed to capture the MSM. Now the nation is talking about designer jackets and not the fact that the John Key led National Party has completely failed to address child poverty in New Zealand. National Ltd™ hasn’t even gone so far as to recognise a measure which could be applied, nor has it adopted even one of the 78 recommendations from its expert advisory group on child poverty.

    • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 6.1

      +1 BLiP

      • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 6.1.1

        Inability to foresee these tactics, inability to negate them, and inability to have a prepared response = incompetence

        • Pasupial 6.1.1.1

          Inability to foresee these gutter tactics, inability to descend to that level of mendacity, and inability to have a responsible policy reported in a soldout media environment = integrity.

        • Tracey 6.1.1.2

          Yes cos its a game that doesnt involve real lives of real people… oh wait.

          Biggest wanker wins and the poor get poorer.

  7. BM 7

    Turei needs to get a back bone and stop acting like a little child.

    Wha,wha Judith said mean things to me, suck it up princess you’re softer than a bowl full of jelly.

    • karol 7.1

      And there you go making cheap shots that avoid addressing the substantial issues.

      • Colonial Viper 7.1.1

        You got to hand it to Judith, she knows how to speak to her constituency clearly and precisely.

        • Draco T Bastard 7.1.1.1

          +1

        • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 7.1.1.2

          Unlike a certain expensively-dressed List MP, Collins actually HAS a constituency.

          • karol 7.1.1.2.1

            And, SHG, you have dismissed all of us who voted Green Party. We are the constituents of all the GP MPs: MPs who represent the whole of NZ.

            You also show you don’t understand MMP.

      • BM 7.1.2

        The way I see it is this.
        Turei took a shot at Tolley, Tolly gave her a broad side, Turei couldn’t handle it and collapsed into a incoherent mess.

        The substantial issue that I see is that Turei is far too delicate for politics, if I was in charge of the Greens I’d give her the boot and replace her with some one can take a bit of stick and not run off the the media and have a cry about it.

        Bunch of lefty wusses

        • weka 7.1.2.1

          “The substantial issue that I see is that Turei is far too delicate for politics,”

          lolz. You haven’t been paying attention, have you. Turei is very strong. You just can’t tell the difference between wahine toa and the macho culture that lives in parliament. Which is odd given how different they are.

        • Sacha 7.1.2.2

          “Turei took a shot at Tolley” – what about?

        • QoT 7.1.2.3

          collapsed into a incoherent mess

          Oh, the spin is so strong on this issue. We hear that Turei “collapsed”, she “panicked”, she’s “too sensitive” … because when a woman stands up for herself the first recourse is to accuse her of being too emotional. Which is code for “too female.”

        • Tracey 7.1.2.4

          Could you post the source for tureis attack on tolley in parliament last week?

    • Draco T Bastard 7.2

      And BM proves that it’s the RWNJs that are outright nasty.

      • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 7.2.1

        And won this round easily.

        • karol 7.2.1.1

          More of the diversionary cheap shots….. meanwhile the rest of us will keep talking about important issues like poverty, inequality, housing crisis, democracy, etc.

        • Tracey 7.2.1.2

          Perhaps you can give us the source and substance of tureis attack k on tolley in parliament last week. Fascinating that you announce bm the winner despite him having no factual basis for his comments.

    • fender 7.3

      BM needs to get a brain and stop acting like parrot.

      Can he not see the inconsistency of having the gross Collins on the one hand condemning cyber-bullying while on the other she behaves like a pig in flesh.

      • Stuart Munro 7.3.1

        I’m sorry but I don’t think your comparison is quite accurate.

        Pigs are relatively sociable creatures – Collins has that whole ponderous truculence thing going on, her mum didn’t name her ‘Crusher’ by accident you know. Her cabinet presence is probably just another hoof in the door from dirty dairying.

        The saddest thing is that she displays many of the classic symptoms of BSE: odd changes in activity and attitude, is becoming increasingly uncoordinated, and has trouble performing to UN standards.

    • North 7.4

      So baggage Collins’ $250K plus for the contribution “…..wee sausage” is all cool ?

      Any guesses on the outcome of a face to face between the bowl of snot BM and the bowl of jelly Metiria ?

    • Tracey 7.5

      You missed the bit where tolley launched an unprovoked attack on turei. And you such a stickler for true facts

  8. phil 8

    It also demonstrates the petty and vindictive mind of the Crusher Collins. Beneath contempt.

  9. bad12 9

    i am amused, as a Party member i wish to thank Tolley and Collins for the free publicity, they might have seen such stupidity as attacking Mets over the clothes She wears and their cost as a wedge to drive into the Green Party support base,

    Playing well for Nationals core of ‘wing-nut’ supporters but effect the Green Party support in any way, not a show,

    The damage Tolley and Collins are in danger of inflicting on their own Party tho is not of a nature that can be easily calculated, But, in the National held seats there is a definite trend for the young born to rule National voter to split their votes, expressing their ecological/conservationist values in the most practical of ways electorate voting for National while Party voting for the Green Party,

    One thing about such people, the born to rule young National voters, they dress for success and wouldn’t be seen dead in anything less than the best, Ware Whare shoppers they aint and the danger for Tolley and Collins is that these younger members of their own party apply their dress sense to their view of what this allows them license to comment upon or not which may cause them some personal offense and thus have them become firmer in their ideas of how to vote this election,

    A nice own goal from National for the week…

    • srylands 9.1

      Shit good luck with that interpretation. You do sound like the English cricket coach – all words and no belief. The two Ministers I think were pointing out that an obese woman with an enormous carbon footprint who lives in a large house and wears madly expensive clothes looks a bit dopy lecturing about poverty. I think they won!

      • bad12 9.1.1

        Pissed again SSLands, pretty obvious, so only those who live in a shack wearing only sack-cloth are allowed to comment upon poverty in your world, who would have thunk it,

        Check the stats you little dullard, between elections 2008 and 2011 the Green Party party vote rose by 58%,(at least), in the Auckland electorates held by National,

        Tolley,Collins along with Slippery the Prime Minister should keep up the ridiculous personal attack on Metiria the free publicity for the Green Party is worth mega.bucks…

        • Anne 9.1.1.1

          I see Anne Tolley described herself as being “insulted by getting a lecture from Metiria Turei”.

          A lecture? Who does the ignorant woman with the gauche colour sense think she is?

          Remember her put-down lecture to a group of experienced teachers? She had the gall to read a children’s story to them as a way of lecturing them about some silly perception she had conjured up in her less than average IQ brain. What did she know about teaching? Zilch.

          • bad12 9.1.1.1.1

            My belief is that the ‘hate’ from Tolley is personal toward Metiria, i well remember a debate on RadioNZ befor the 2011 election where Tolley continually interrupted Mets with her whining until Met’s let go a 30 second burst that sounded much like the skill-saw in my shed working at full capacity,

            Lolz, that certainly shut ‘its’ trap…

          • Tracey 9.1.1.1.2

            I wonder if the number of poor in tolleys electorate has fallen while tolley has been their mp.

      • JK 9.1.2

        This sort of negative malice towards leftie women is just so typical of Nat “cats” – they’ll do anything they can to bring a strong woman down in public. They did it with Helen Clark, now they’re doing it to Metiria Turei. But they won’t succeed – they’re only making themselves look extremely silly and petty. Not pretty. Petty !

        • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 9.1.2.1

          This sort of negative malice towards leftie women is just so typical of Nat “cats” – they’ll do anything they can to bring a strong woman down in public.

          What National does for strong women is PROMOTE them. Compare the National cabinet with Labour’s front bench, compare the women in each and the portfolios they’ve been assigned. I know which party looks like it has a problem with strong women and it ain’t National.

      • Chooky 9.1.3

        @ srylands

        she is not obese!….really i think a lot of these comments are pure racism…..shows where John Key’s Nact Party is really at…They should be called out for what they are ….RACISTS

        ….the Maori Party should be DISASSOCIATING itself from National fast ….and All Maoris should take note and beware ….the National Party is a racist party

        ….RACISM was one of the reasons why Winston Peters never made it as leader of the National Party….even although he was head and shoulders above every other contender in terms of ability….even Muldoon realised it

      • Tracey 9.1.4

        If you think potential green voters would be deterred by that you dont have any idea of the green constituency. Seems odd that a government t you consider doing so well needs to stoop to name calling and personal attacks. Preaching to the choir by the look of your post.

  10. Sacha 10

    “telling it like it isn’t”

    the word we need to use more is *liar*

  11. newsense 11

    More Nasty Negative attacks from the Nats:

    and surely the Herald must get points here for helping them.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11195130

    Another Herald article where they provide ‘balance’ by putting a few words from a left source tokenly at the bottom of the article. How much of this is driven by contracted out or overseas subbing I wonder?

    This is callous, obnoxious crap deserving of being called what it is, and the Herald is a loathful paper for running it.

    “If she cared about child poverty she could always sell the coat and feed a child for a year” Collins.

    And then they ask COLIN MAthura jeffrees FOR HIS OPINION.

    Fuck me. tack on Godfrey and a rebuttal from Turei herself at the bottom.

    Same thing with an article about the baby bonus policy- economists say its cack screams the headline with screeds of negativity from one economist and something different from Susan St John at the very bottom.

    • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 11.1

      “If she cared about child poverty she could always sell the coat and feed a child for a year” Collins

      That’s a great line. Turei walked straight into it, whack. Knockout victory, Collins.

      • Pasupial 11.1.1

        SHG

        You really are totally ignorant.

        • idlegus 11.1.1.1

          $2000 feeds a child for a year? those arnt great lines from collins, they are extensions of ‘i know you are but what am i’, but whatever floats your boat, idiot.

      • karol 11.1.2

        Actually, that line says everything about Nat values. So all those in the Nats who spend a lot of money on clothes and houses – clearly, according to statements of their own MPs – don’t give a shit about poverty.

        And they’d rather diss opponents’ clothes than even talk about poverty and inequality.

  12. newsense 12

    Where’s that smugness and more knowledgable than thou from Dr Mapp? Is this what he thinks too?

  13. Tanz 13

    Key is very nasty and arrogant in the House debates, I wish the wider public was more aware of this. Speaks volumes.Yet he gets away with it, as the media ignore this side of Key.
    The real Key.

  14. idlegus 14

    collins was ‘overly sensitive’ when cunliffe called her an old trout.

  15. Tim 15

    Any one else noticed that Hekia Parata 19thC Brit colonial soldier jacket? The only thing missing is the gold braid and fake medals

    • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 15.1

      That’s coded racist for “Uncle Tom bitch”, right?

      • Pasupial 15.1.1

        No: I’d call her kūpapa.

        • North 15.1.1.1

          In delightfully subversive giggles people in Moerewa call Parata “Heki Pirau” – rotten egg. So telling. The Egg Key/Potato Parata dynamic is pretty stenchy.

    • Anne 15.2

      Any one else noticed that Hekia Parata 19thC Brit colonial soldier jacket?

      Yes. She has a fetish for military-style designer clothing.

  16. Chooky 16

    lol again

  17. Stuart Munro 17

    Actually I don’t think it’s racism. Though botox might change things briefly, by the time you are middle-aged you are responsible for your own face. Metiria looks infinitely better than Collins and Tolley and likely always will – smiling makes for a better complexion than sneering.

    • karol 17.1

      Morgan Godfery explains well the workings of racism in the 21st century.
      \

      We live in the age of racism without racists. Racism comes with its own stigma. People want to avoid that. But rather than change their behaviour, society has invented rhetorical parachutes. Suddenly racism can’t exist without racial words. Racism becomes the use of “Wogistan”, but not the history and ideas that sustain it.

      Tolley didn’t need to mention race. Her attack is loaded with social, political and racial assumptions. The unspoken context is that Metiria, a Maori woman who lives well and dresses better, is acting out of turn and out of step with her community. How can she be in touch with her community when she isn’t living like them? The premise is that a Maori woman cannot dress well and claim to represent her people. Because Maori live exclusively in poverty, amirite.

      It seems to me, in a context where Maori are treated as having secondary status in too many ways, that’s how Tolley’s statements felt to them.

      • Chooky 17.1.1

        +100 karol

        ….Metiria in ability, appearance, poise, compassion and ability to see the breadth of the real issues facing all New Zealand…… is head and shoulders above the motley, alley cat, NACT gang of female MPS ..of mediocre ability , no class, no style and only envy….so they resort to bullying and claws to compensate

        It was the same with Winston Peters in the National Party….he was head and shoulders above the rest and he never fell for monetarism , Neo Lib economics, sale of State Assets ….but was for all New Zealanders First….He has been hounded by National MPs unrelentingly on the most trivial of things …( thinly veiled racism imo….for someone of far superior ability…”How dare he get above his station?”….so he has had to resort to being a bush fighter( one of his former university law lecturers said he was the most able law student he had ever had)…and NACT have never quite killed him off ( lets hope Winnie does not do a deal with them…now that they desperately need him)

        Now we have Hone Harawira being hounded by John Key on going to South Africa to Mandela’s funeral and taking leave from Parliament ….when Key himself was no friend of Mandelas’ cause at the time when it counted ( couldnt even remember the Springbok Tour) and has taken more leave from Parliament than Harawira himself ( hypocrisy and racism?)

      • One Anonymous Knucklehead 17.1.2

        Thanks Karol.

  18. Wayne 18

    The issue for the Nats is they constantly get “holier than thou” lectures and homilies from the Greens in the House. For instance Metiria’s constant repetition about “dirty deals”, “the 1%”, “rich mates”, “don’t care about the children” “hate families” etc.

    If you believed Metiria, New Zealand is some sort of third world hellhole that has sold its entire birthright to the United States.

    Now none of this involves insults as such, but I know from experience that it is very irritating. Hence Anne Tolley’s reaction.

    Interestingly it is not a tactic used by Labour, who use more typical forms of debating insult.

    • Flip 18.1

      It is called opposition.

      Insults tell you a lot about the quality of the person delivering them and do not represent either a defence or an argument.

      • Sacha 18.1.1

        “Labour, who use more typical forms of debating insult”

        Part of the same cosy law school/high school club.

    • Paupial 18.2

      W

      The issue for the Nats is they are unable to debate issues on their merits, so fall back on facile insults – eg; “Devil Beast”, and the; Full Meteria Jacket hooha. I do believe Turei that New Zealand is well on the path to becoming some sort of third world hellhole that has sold its entire birthright to the United States.

      Speaking truth to power can indeed be irritating to those in power.

      • Flip 18.2.1

        I suspect given half a chance Key would have NZ join the Union and become the 51st State of the USA or a US territory.

      • karol 18.2.2

        Speaking truth to power can indeed be irritating to those in power.

        And that is the crux of the whole issue. Turei and the Greens have definitely touched on a sensitive point for the Nats.

        • Wayne 18.2.2.1

          It is more the sanctimony that accompanies it that is the cause of the reaction. After all, Labour runs similar themes but you don’t see the Nats getting that affected by it.

          • One Anonymous Knucklehead 18.2.2.1.1

            “Sanctimony” (aka competence) gets under the Tory skin and gets a reaction. Keep it up Greens.

          • Sacha 18.2.2.1.2

            People of principle can sound sanctimonious to those steeped in a culture of pragmatic clinging to power. It’s revealing that Labour has not annoyed the Nats in the same way.

          • North 18.2.2.1.3

            Jeez Pompous Wayne…….can you hear yourself ?

            I recall you in your parliamentary troughing days being one of the most loquacious, shoutiest, spittliest Tory boys in the chamber when it came to levelling charges along the lines of “Socialists Hate Freedom !”. Your snorted rounded vowels made it a spectacle of outrage all the more appalling.

            And I don’t recall you having demurred when that buffoon National MP from Tauranga, Clarkson was it, told the nation from his parliamentary bench that if the lady dependent for her life on electricity had paid her power bill……..well…….she wouldn’t be dead……..would she ?

            Now you turn up here like some latter day Sir Robert Smith fresh from writing a parliamentary ethics manual, gratuitously offering objective “wisdom”. Like butter wouldn’t melt in your mouth. Doesn’t work.

            • felix 18.2.2.1.3.1

              Exactly, North.

              It’s a bit fucking rich of Dr Wayne to accuse others of sanctimony when you consider the holier-than-thou, passive-aggressive bullshit he peddles here on a daily basis.

              And yes, he was a disgusting vile infection on the house of representatives.

            • Tracey 18.2.2.1.3.2

              +1

              The greens get under nats skins cos there is more than a grain of truth. Despite the mistruths that come out of some nats mouths or keyboards they dont fully believe their schtick… and the greens truth seeps through.

              Wayne knows the economic good news is the same news we have had before and will do Nothing g to reduce poverty… shorten the gap between rich and poor or prevent a meltdown on cue in a out 13 years time.

            • Wayne 18.2.2.1.3.3

              Well, I’ll admit that I interjected a bit, but I think you would find that most on the other side would say it was always in good humour – more or less.

              • Tracey

                So you were a bit of a comedian… by your account. The greens are sanctimonious though. So if its your side its funny but the other side are sanctimonious. Its always good to have someone masquerading as rational to help us judge the greens

      • Draco T Bastard 18.2.3

        +1

    • Paul 18.3

      You would defend anything.
      The nasty Nats.

    • Delia 18.4

      No women right or left or inbetween should be criticised for her appearance and that should be a given. This has actually been going on for a year. It is just mobbing and if I tried it on in my workplace, all hell would break loose.

    • Delia 18.5

      Poor old Anne, sensitive wee sausage being told she does not care for the poor. Poor wee petal. Truth hurts.

      • greywarbler 18.5.1

        We have a super Anne that comments here, so to avoid confusion mention Tolley so we know who you are talikng about, or say my favourites Annatolly or Annatolled. (As in the bell tolled for…)

        • Anne 18.5.1.1

          Must say it took me aback until I realised who Delia was referring to.

          Thank-you greywarbler. :)

    • Macro 18.6

      If you believed Metiria, New Zealand is some sort of third world hellhole that has sold its entire birthright to the United States.

      And you are trying to tell us that it hasn’t? TPPA? GCSB? “Hobbit Act”? “Three strikes”? Imprisonment rate just below the States? Anti nuclear stand gone by lunchtime? to name a few… All Nact..

      • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 18.6.1

        Nz’s incarceration rate is approximately one quarter that of the USA, but don’t let the facts stop you.

        • Macro 18.6.1.1

          Well Key doesn’t!

        • Pasupial 18.6.1.2

          SHG

          Our incarceration rate is second highest in the OECD after USA. Hence Macro’s characterisation of an; “Imprisonment rate just below the States”. By comparison, Australia (where I suspect you are commenting from) is at 18%, while we are at 27% of USA levels. At least we’re not as bad as Russia (68%) or Greenland (47%) yet, but in Olde Zeeland it is much lower (Netherlands 11%).

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

          Our privately owned prison incarceration proportion is swelling towards USA levels though.

    • newsense 18.7

      can you put references to everything you put in quotes?

      So you don’t think that Sky City was a dirty deal? Or Warner Bros?

      Did or didn’t National push through a confused labour law in order, they said, to make a film deal? Is our law up for sale for every piece of investment? This seems like a legitimate political target.

      So, to sum up, if you don’t like your opponent opposing where you are most vunerable you insult their clothing?

      Weak. But an attempt to stay loyal I suppose.

  19. Draco T Bastard 19

    The Left Don’t Want Leftovers; Or Why Metiria Should Keep Her Jacket!

    However it did highlight another issue, the misconception amongst the political right that activist groups and political parties concerned with fighting poverty and inequality, such as the Greens and the Alliance, demand austerity – that we believe that no one should have any fun or treats or own nice things.

    Quite the opposite is true. We want everyone to have nice stuff! We want everyone to have the sort of lifestyle that means they can live comfortably and even splash out on some really nice clothes, or a plush new sofa, or an overseas holiday now and then.

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