Open Mike 03/11/2017

127 comments on “Open Mike 03/11/2017 ”

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1. tracey 1

   3 November 2017 at 7:15 am

   Stuff today launched a fact checking policy tracker on the new government’s “major” initiatives. If done well (researched, balaced, investigated), I think it is a great development. I am not sure they have the resources unless they have added post election staff to do it well?

   “The concept is simple: we’ll highlight key events with short pieces of analysis, fact-checking and data-based reporting.” Which is kind of what journalism is always supposed to be.

   A “new” type of journalism? Maybe. Or maybe not.

   “Post will include a mix of the elements you’re used to from Stuff: charts, video, pictures and tweets, all wrapped up with sharp insights from our journalists.”

   How they determine “major” ( cost, number of people impact, etc) will also be interesting.

   Watching that space

   https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/98487531/the-first-draft-tracking-the-start-of-a-government
   • Carolyn_nth 1.1

     3 November 2017 at 7:22 am

     Pity they didn’t start it 9 years ago!

     Then we’d also have a comparison.
     • tracey 1.1.1

       3 November 2017 at 7:49 am

       Or during the election. Apparently Garner has been alluding to a similar thing.
     • tc 1.1.2

       3 November 2017 at 7:51 am

       There’s no way they would’ve ever done that for national.

       This will be probably be gamed to further push negative memes around the govt by cloaking them in ‘facts’ IMO as part of the rights new media strategy.

       Y’know that ‘my expert says…’ shit that shonky had as stock in trade.
       • Carolyn_nth 1.1.2.1

         3 November 2017 at 7:54 am

         It looks like a Newsroom initiative, supported by Stuff.

         So, I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt that Newsroom would’ve done it in response to the NACT government, if they’d been around then.

         However, to be fair, they do need to compare the current government’s performance with NACT’s track record.
         • tc 1.1.2.1.1

           3 November 2017 at 8:00 am

           Exactly so unless they do that it’s simply more DP.

           Alot of what’s going to get done is repairing the damage National have dished out across NZ society so unless there’s context it’s pure spin.

           Watch for synergies between stuff/granny and national attack lines.
         • Cinny 1.1.2.1.2

           3 November 2017 at 11:51 am

           Well done Newsroom, again… gosh they are a wonderful resource, kudos Newsroom
     • Johan 1.1.3

       3 November 2017 at 9:43 am

       The Fourth Estate is dead in New Zealand. John Campbell used to ask the tough questions , holding politicians responsible for their actions or inactions. Remember Campbell’s dogged determination to have John Key and Brownlee do the right thing for those suffering during Christchurch’s post-earthquake? John Campbell soon afterwards lost his job at TV3, many news host now are seen to tow the line, afraid to upset their bosses. True reporting and holding politicians accountable has flown out of the window in New Zealand. Shame on us.
   • savenz 1.2

     3 November 2017 at 9:31 am

     Yes, funny timing. When they cheerleaded shit for 9 years.
     • Anne 1.2.1

       3 November 2017 at 10:39 am

       Very true savenz but like Carolyn_nth, I’m giving them the benefit of the doubt.

       By and large Newsroom has been a success and its possible they have been galvanised into action by a new government with new ideas and lots of changes about to occur. In other words, they now have impetus which was certainly lacking under the previous government.
       • savenz 1.2.1.1

         3 November 2017 at 12:31 pm

         Yep, has been some well researched articles on newsroom.
   • eco maori 1.3

     3 November 2017 at 9:38 am

     Well my advice to our coalition government I would have someone auditing all the news videos and make sure they all show the good side to out new coalition government because some of the videos have not been flattering and everyone has a side that looks good on video. I no you have just started but u need someone on that job of keeping the media honest.
     1st point every news show except for the breakfast show has a blue back ground. This is subliminal message blue is best.
     Like in 2008 nearly every fucken article I read had key in it. It was the key to this the key to that go back you and will find the proof national still have the media in there clasp look at bill and joice videos all good shots we are in this for the long game we have to be. Kia kaha
     • eco maori 1.3.1

       4 November 2017 at 11:04 am

       There is a a nother subliminal message being put out through Our media and thats crack this a have a crack this word should be banned as the media have not figured out that they are being used by some people to put this message out there I notice these things. This shit is a design drug that does what it is designed to do which is to hook the user and then makes them a uncontrolled idiot whom has no grasp on reality and will do anything to get there next fix. Fuck that.
   • Draco T Bastard 1.4

     3 November 2017 at 10:33 am

     “The concept is simple: we’ll highlight key events with short pieces of analysis, fact-checking and data-based reporting.” Which is kind of what journalism is always supposed to be.

     True. They never did it for National though.
     • tracey 1.4.1

       3 November 2017 at 10:37 am

       Agree. But given many of us wanted it we cannot object now. Balance and investigation are key. My conern is they are going to just repackage the “I reckon and knee jerk” journalism with some pretty bells and whistles.

       I woukd have loved to have seen this during the election campaign but too many journos and editors dribbling at tge possibility of a scandal for real stuff?
   • patricia bremner 1.5

     3 November 2017 at 11:02 am

     Alarm bells went off for me when I saw “first draft”.

     Too many times I’ve seen a story get edited over a week to become a massaged message.

     So I think this is the same group finding a new way to colour public perception.

     Bill English has declared war, so we have been warned.

     Government should claim this space to avoid false news.
     • Philg 1.5.1

       4 November 2017 at 7:02 pm

       Patricia +1
       The selective eye of the media is very concerning. It tends to focus increasingly on trivia, gore, and sensationalism. Not to mention the international component at RNZ which is dodgy, quoting suspect US sources. RNZ needs better funding and journalism. Here’s hoping.
2. joe90 2

   3 November 2017 at 7:32 am

   Looks like the Democrats have decided to emulate the Republicans and establish their very own circular firing squad.

   https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/11/02/clinton-brazile-hacks-2016-215774
   • Andre 2.1

     3 November 2017 at 9:21 am

     I won’t shed any tears if the Dem old crusties all take other out and clear the field for new blood.
     • garibaldi 2.1.1

       3 November 2017 at 10:37 am

       It would be a case of “meet the new boss, same as the old boss” in the American political machine Andre, and you know it. Both the Repugs and Dems are a lost cause.
       • Andre 2.1.1.1

         3 November 2017 at 10:45 am

         That comment is more useful for assessing your vantage point that it is for assessing the very real differences between Dems and Repugs for Americans and the rest of the world.
         • adam 2.1.1.1.1

           3 November 2017 at 1:21 pm

           There is no real difference , both parties are war mongering, corporate supporting, 1% defending, scum. Who have hurt working people ever since their inception.
           • Andre 2.1.1.1.1.1

             3 November 2017 at 1:29 pm

             Says someone who is so fukn stupid that he admitted a couple of months ago he had pen in hand with his ballot paper, and he couldn’t even put a tick in a box that would help get rid of the Nats.

             https://thestandard.org.nz/is-nz-doomed-to-lying-politics-now/#comment-1389259
             • Bill …

               3 November 2017 at 4:01 pm

               And just very politely, I’m suggesting you might want to pull your head in Andre.

               If you don’t want to address a point made, then don’t. If you can’t, that’s okay too.

               What isn’t okay is to launch into ad hom bullshit off the back of previous, unrelated comments you either disagreed with or couldn’t get your head around.
               • Andre …

                 3 November 2017 at 4:10 pm

                 The appropriate point in reply to adam had already been made at 2.1.1.1. adam’s reply to that just perfectly illustrated the point that had already been addressed, and he completely missed.
                 • Bill …

                   3 November 2017 at 4:28 pm

                   Ah. I see.

                   So more or less dismissing someone out of hand because they opined that both the Dems and Repugs are a lost cause, was addressing the point that both parties share broadly similar perspectives on specific policy fronts.

                   Erm, no. That can’t be what you meant, because all you did in response to Adam’s comment was what you did in response to Garibaldi’s – which was to side-step the substantive content of the comment and “go” the person making the comment.

                   But we’ve been through this (above) and I’m confident, that now you have had the opportunity to make a second go at comprehension, that it won’t develop into a pattern that marks your comments, and that being the case, I won’t have to start putting on hats and what-not when I stumble across your contributions to the site. 🙂
                   • McFlock …

                     3 November 2017 at 4:48 pm

                     I think it’s a fair point to make that the farther one is politically from the US political “Overton Window”, the less apparent distance there is between the dems and the republicans. Particularly if you’re viewing it from side-on.

                     But for the 10% of the US population who have affordable healthcare under the dems which they could lose under the republicans, the distance between the two parties might seem a little bit larger than it does to you or Adam.
                   • Andre …

                     3 November 2017 at 4:53 pm

                     If you or anyone else really needs a concise explanation of the difference between Dems and Repugs in how it relates to ordinary Americans, here you go.

                     http://addictinginfo.com/2013/05/09/fifteen-differences/

                     And I’ll add another one: Democrats support workers rights, such as the right to organise, equal pay, non-discrimination. Republicans want to eliminate all worker protections to allow employers complete rights to do whatever they want.

                     And there’s many many more differences that deeply affect Americans and the rest of the world.
                   • Bill …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:07 pm

                     See how easy that was to respond to the actual content of a comment? Thank-you.
                   • adam …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:12 pm

                     Come on McFlock the democrats opposed single payer, which would make a real difference to people’s lives. The democrats could stop the repeal, but they will not. loads of ways to stop the repeal of legislation but the democrats never do.
                   • marty mars …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:15 pm

                     The ‘they’re the same’ line is a rhetoric device not designed to be fact. Therefore a irreverent sharpish response with a link seems okayish. But of course I bow to greater knowledge of these things. //leaves quietly and quickly…
                   • McFlock …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:34 pm

                     Come on McFlock the democrats opposed single payer, which would make a real difference to people’s lives.

                     Oh, government paying would be better, but ACA still made a real difference to 30 million people that the republicans are trying to repeal.

                     The democrats could stop the repeal, but they will not. loads of ways to stop the repeal of legislation but the democrats never do.

                     That’s not how democracy works. Correct me if I’m wrong, but the dems are minority in Congress, Senate, and it’s a republican presidency. How are the dems supposed to outvote that?
                   • Andre …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:44 pm

                     adam, that’s slandering most of the Democrats.

                     There would be very few that don’t support single-payer in principle. There are at least three realpolitik reasons why there was no chance of passing single-payer in that tiny 2008-2010 period when they had 60 votes in the senate.

                     First is it’s an extremely complex problem how to get to single-payer from the system they had in ’08, 2 years would not be anywhere near enough time to sort out a robust solution.

                     Second, literally every single Democrat senator was needed to pass Obamacare, there was no margin for even a single no. And yes, there probably were a very few dems that would not have been willing to sign on to such a massive change. So they all signed on to something they (incorrectly) believed had a chance of bipartisan support.

                     Third, they do need to consider re-electability. As it was, they went way out on a limb supporting the expansion of healthcare to those that previously couldn’t afford it. And many of them paid the political price in 2010, when Obamacare was widely considered to have added a lot of momentum to the Republican wave that year.

                     That was a lot of writing needed to address a simple throw-away bullshit line. I really hope you’ll take it on board so it won’t be neeeded again.

                     Now, how about you tell us how you think Democrats could stop the repeal if the Republicans mustered the fifty votes in the Senate?
                   • adam …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:49 pm

                     1) Filibuster
                     2) Committee hearings requests on point by point basis.
                     3) Points of order stalling as it’s a repeal – so not covered by Byrd Rule
                     4) Open up new debates within the debate to repeal
                     5) Put forward amendments rather than the repeal

                     That’s from the top of my head. They have other tools. The senate and the house can slow bills down to a snail’s pace until the midterms. There is very limited ability to go into urgency to repeal unlike us – also there is the whole talking to moderate republicans to remind them about midterms.

                     As I said, it’s about stopping the repeal. The road to do that is not a simple straight up vote.
                   • Andre …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:57 pm

                     adam, the repugs were trying to do it under reconciliation. So none of that applies. None of it.

                     The time window they had for reconciliation ran out a little while ago, so those points do apply now. And the repugs aren’t even trying now after their window closed. But they might try again next year under a new reconciliation process.
                   • McFlock …

                     3 November 2017 at 5:57 pm

                     I suppose if the trumpists look like actually winning the repeal of ACA on their (third?) attempt, the dems could make use of your great expertise on how to stop people doing anything substantial, ever.
                   • adam …

                     3 November 2017 at 6:04 pm

                     Yes they did, and now they must do it in a open floor debate – if at all.

                     They will probably not go to reconciliation again, as elections are coming up.

                     As for slandering the democrats – hell yes, and I stand by it, ‘wet liberal I know your pain politics’ is the reason we are in this mess. No good saying you agree with somthing in principle if you not go the backbone to actually support it via voting for it. Corporate donors make peons of us all.
                   • McFlock …

                     3 November 2017 at 6:17 pm

                     You do know that slander is an untruth, right? So standing by slander is standing by an untruth…

                     Anyway, regardless of whether you think dems are soft liberals or not, they have fundamentally improved (simply with the ACA) the lives of 30 million people, and the republicans want to repeal that improvement.

                     So yes, there is a significant difference between the two, the closer you are to US politics. You’re in the opposite hemisphere and on their far left. Of course the positions of the democrats and republicans look similar to you – you’re a very long way away from them. Get closer, and you’d feel the differences.
                   • adam …

                     4 November 2017 at 12:21 am

                     Took a leaf from your playbook McFlock, changed the language to suit.

                     Seeing as we can’t call acts of terror, terrorism.

                     May as well call the dishonesty of wet liberals – slander.
             • adam …

               3 November 2017 at 5:07 pm

               So we must worship at the altar of your world view, otherwise its abuse there Andre.

               Open your mind, try reading ‘A People’s History of America’ by Howard Zinn.
               • Bill …

                 3 November 2017 at 5:14 pm

                 No worshiping and no alters (except for thems that’s so inclined) and no personal abuse.

                 Pretty simple really.
                 • garibaldi …

                   3 November 2017 at 7:33 pm

                   Actually guys the main thrust of my comment was more to do with the fact that both the party machines are so corrupt that anyone half decent cannot make it through. But , yes ,I also meant that whoever Americans vote for they still get the same boss ie deep state Zionism ( for want of a better expression).
               • North …

                 3 November 2017 at 9:59 pm

                 Try stop licking Trump’s arse by default Adam.
                 • adam …

                   4 November 2017 at 12:13 am

                   Oh do try getting the point North, other wise I’ll just take you as another wet liberal who can’t handle working people actually having power.
         • North 2.1.1.1.2

           3 November 2017 at 9:55 pm

           Hear! Hear! re your response to Garibaldi at 2.1.1.1, Andre. Looking back…..and knowing what we now know, I’m even more appalled than I was then by the utterly scandalous madness of TS becoming a vehicle for cheerleading for Trump…..thanks principally to the overbearing and bawling hubris of one CV. Particularly since that self-vaunted ‘prime leftie’ seemed to be motivated more by a ridiculously indulgent reaction to an internecine shit-fest occurring somewhere south of Timaru. Self-satisfying delusions as to one’s own ‘purity’ are fucking dangerous!
           • adam 2.1.1.1.2.1

             4 November 2017 at 12:19 am

             All I’m reading is the same puritanical ranting coming from you North. Just, from a different ideological position.
3. Incognito 3

   3 November 2017 at 7:44 am

   Muon detection, or tomography, can sketch only a rough outline of the void.

   https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/africa/98511341/cosmic-rays-reveal-mysterious-void-in-egypts-great-pyramid

   This could be used to find that fiscal hole that Steven Joyce was talking about; even when he was wrong about it, he was still right 😉
   • tracey 3.1

     3 November 2017 at 7:49 am

     🙂
   • Muttonbird 3.2

     3 November 2017 at 8:19 am

     Muons only detect holes that exist. Like the one inside Joyce’s head.
     • Incognito 3.2.1

       3 November 2017 at 8:30 am

       There’s a new controversial theory that anti-muons can detect virtual holes. They could run an experiment on Joyce to test the theory and publish in Nature.
       • Andre 3.2.1.1

         3 November 2017 at 9:07 am

         But in Joyce’s case, you probably won’t get a useful read because what surrounds that void is so dense.
         • DoublePlusGood 3.2.1.1.1

           3 November 2017 at 9:48 am

           On the other hand, it is such a perfect vacuum in there that you could store a very large amount of antimatter quite safely.
   • marty mars 3.3

     3 November 2017 at 9:55 am

     Joyce = a void. Absolute zero warmth – a space wasted on nothing.
     • Psych nurse 3.3.1

       3 November 2017 at 10:12 am

       Might be usefull as a carbon sink.
4. tracey 4

   3 November 2017 at 8:02 am

   India trade deal is apparently on life support and has been for many months. I guess John Key was just inflating his own importance when he said great progress was being made?

   https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2017/11/02/57753/nz-india-fta-on-life-support
   • Draco T Bastard 4.1

     3 November 2017 at 10:41 am

     All I can say to that is ‘good’. Obviously getting that FTA would increase our already unsustainable dairy herd.
   • OnceWasTim 4.2

     3 November 2017 at 2:23 pm

     @Tracey
     It basically comes down to the manner in which many of their nationals have been treated over the gNat junta’s reign.
     Strangely enough, despite corruption (overt there, covert here), India does actually give a shit about its nationals.
     Same thing with South American states. I’m not sure whether many will remember the absolute CLANGER Key, and his business enterage dropped when on a mission to Sth America at the time of Chavez’ death. They (a number of Sth American states) certainly didn’t and still haven’t.
     It went down like a cup of cold sick – even though not all were fans of the Chavez reign.
     Why would India want a trade deal with NZ when we’ve created a mechanism by which many/most of their nationals are exploited and treated as disposable human economic units. Even though India have veered right and swallowing much of the cool aid, Modi’s staked his name on fixing corruption, cosy little deals, black money, and they’re wide awake to all that now happening in lil ‘ole NuZull.
     I’ve had the popcorn out not long after the gNatz came to power, and I happened to pick up a South American diplomat’s son hitch hiking back to Wellington with his mates. And was it the start of the gNat junta’s second term that Key started rattling on about being careful not to be arrogant? Or maybe it was the first term when an astute journalist observed that the smiling assassin only knew where various blots on the Pacific Ocean were, and that they were actually Pacific Island neighbours during his flights to HhhhWoiEeee with mum and the kuds
5. tracey 5

   3 November 2017 at 8:12 am

   Parker does not seem confident of overturning ISDS clause but if we must have it I am happier ( not to be confused with happy) if the adjudication of disputes is done by;

   Fulltime Judges
   Public Forum
   Fully disclosed decisions

   He is not talking at all about IP issues. Thry had 5 bottom lines ( Labour) as Mcflock pointed out a couple of days ago but so far are publicly focusing on only 2(arguably 3) of them.

   “Parker confirmed he was interested in the alternative to ISDS developed by the European Union, based on a public investment court system.

   “One of the principles of justice is actually once you turn yourself over to becoming a judge, you put your prior biases and conflicts of interest behind you, and that’s not as clearly done in respect of arbitrations because the people who sit on those arbitration panels, once they’ve done it they go back to being a trade lawyer, perhaps accountable for their business to some of these forces who were in the contest, so a court is better in that regard.”
   • patricia bremner 5.1

     3 November 2017 at 11:46 pm

     Tracey, ISDS are now not allowed in any trade agreement. Agreed by all three parties and passed by cabinet today.

     Jacinda has said that is their biggest concern, so now it is official.
     • Antoine 5.1.1

       4 November 2017 at 11:07 am

       Not doubting you but can you post a link? I don’t see this in the news yet.

       A.
6. Muttonbird 6

   3 November 2017 at 8:51 am

   Stage four of the grieving process is depression. Stage five acceptance.

   Hosking now at bewilderment factor 9, showing indictors of both of the above.

   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11939977
7. Ad 7

   3 November 2017 at 8:52 am

   I find myself in agreement with Mike Hosking this morning:

   “So here’s the theme: Governments make a difference. Governments can cock it up, or stoke it up.

   But governments also, by and large, aren’t quite as big a deal as you might think.

   Certainly not as big a deal as the headline writers would have you believe.

   Mostly people carry on. Mostly people make their own decisons. Take their own risks. Live their own lives. Chart their own reality.

   If you’re waiting for a government to tell you what to do, where to do it, how to do it and when to do it, then good luck to you. But the rest of us are getting on with it.”

   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11939977

   We have a weak and disaggregated state and public sector.
   We have a highly deregulated and market-driven society.
   We have almost zero horizontal discipline across government policy or departments.
   We have a very delicately poised coalition government, in no position to make massive changes.
   We have no common direction as a country.

   None of that has changed in the last 20 years, and is unlikely to on current tracking.

   Certainly I didn’t notice some minor season of anomie forming during the coalition negotiations.

   And yet we have a functioning society.

   Plenty of things are getting worse, which we can all roll off as a list. All will take many years to improve.

   We don’t yet have a government that is strongly altering our daily lives for good..
   • tracey 7.1

     3 November 2017 at 8:53 am

     I love how he doesnt think he is a headline writer
     • joe90 7.1.1

       3 November 2017 at 9:25 am

       I doubt Mikey even knows who he is.

       https://thestandard.org.nz/mike-hosking-the-case-of-the-vanishing-journalist/
   • Draco T Bastard 7.2

     3 November 2017 at 10:49 am

     We have a weak and disaggregated state and public sector.
     We have a highly deregulated and market-driven society.
     We have almost zero horizontal discipline across government policy or departments.
     We have no common direction as a country.

     That’s all because our society has been under attack by business for the last thirty or more years which has been helped by the governments of the day.

     We have a very delicately poised coalition government, in no position to make massive changes.

     Actually, it’s not – it’s pretty solid. Probably more solid that the previous government.
     • Ad 7.2.1

       3 November 2017 at 12:26 pm

       Hasn’t had a test yet to evaluate its strength.
   • patricia bremner 7.3

     3 November 2017 at 11:16 am

     Oh I don’t agree. Asking political appointees to write a resignation letter is a start.

     Clean out the strategic interference to begin real change on day 10.
     • Ad 7.3.1

       3 November 2017 at 12:25 pm

       Health Minister is simply “considering” this.

       Now let’s go through the list of entities this government would need to clean out:

       – Electricity Commission
       – NZTA Board
       – HNZ Board
       – Boards of all power generators (since they can still roll them from 51%)
       – Boards of all Crown Research Institutions
       – Law Commission
       – Reserve Bank
       – Boards of all the hundreds of largely useless quangos circulating through Wellington, from the Walking Commission to NZ On Air
       – RNZ, TVNZ,and all the remaining State Owned Enterprises

       etc.

       You get the picture.

       This government has started with momentum in only a very few areas. And this is this government at its peak: it never gets stronger, more forceful or more popular than here.

       This is as good as it gets.

       So, Hosking is right this time.
       • marty mars 7.3.1.1

         3 November 2017 at 1:32 pm

         As good as it gets? Your lack of imagination is eclipsed only by a pessimism – an ebony hue on black.
8. John Shears 8

   3 November 2017 at 9:10 am

   Page 15 of yesterdays Herald quotes Phil Goff proposing a streamlining of Water Services.
   Let’s ignore the use of the word “streamlining” in an article about water services ??? and cut to the important possibility if this takes place.
   The concept of “three waters” ie Watercare being responsible for Potable water, Waste Water and Stormwater management is not new and shouldn’t need any great research. This was the concept proposed before amalgamation by those responsible who had spent 3–4 years carefully examining all aspects of the best way to handle this important section of infrastructure for the new Auckland.
   Sadly their deliberations were effectively thrown in the rubbish bin and Rodney Hide was given the job of sorting everything out which he did in about three months after his mate John Key had handed him the task.
   The then head of Watercare refused to have stormwater as part of their responsibility and so it became a separate section of Auckland Council. Wastewater discharges into the Waitemata continue at roughly the same rate as they did before amalgamation except in the former North Shore City area , they had followed the three waters principal during the upgrade of their infrastructure over several years.
   This is another legacy that Auckland could well do without. Let’s hope that reason will now prevail.
   • savenz 8.1

     3 November 2017 at 9:29 am

     +1 John Shears
   • Ad 8.2

     3 November 2017 at 10:19 am

     +100
   • DH 8.3

     3 November 2017 at 11:25 am

     Only slightly on topic… I discovered a while back that the (privatised) Papakura water contract was still operational. It’s not part of Watercare, I assume because they couldn’t break the contract & have to let it expire.

     It was Hide who pushed for those privatised contracts to be extended up to 25years. Interesting when one considers that if all of the councils had contracted out their utilities the SuperCity could never have come about. Doesn’t make a lot of sense does it.
9. savenz 9

   3 November 2017 at 9:27 am

   “Can there be a more wonderful humiliation?

   Paddles the cat, the twitter account for Jacinda and Clarks’s pet, now has more followers after being active only a month than the deputy leader of the National Party, Paula Bennett, who has been on Twitter since 2009.

   Jacinda’s pet has more media followers than Bill’s.”

   Ouch.

   https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2017/11/02/twitter-watch-jacindas-cat-has-more-followers-than-the-deputy-leader-of-the-national-party/
   • The decrypter 9.1

     3 November 2017 at 9:55 am

     Go paddles. Love it love it,,—what ya say to that james, –poor paula?
10. Muttonbird 10

    3 November 2017 at 9:36 am

    The killing fields. Tourist drivers are a danger not only to themselves but to Kiwis as well.

    The Germans crossed the centre line, hit a truck which then lost control and killed two (reading between the lines) locals.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11939828

    Question: is the latest road death spike associated with the spike in tourist numbers?
    • DH 10.1

      3 November 2017 at 10:18 am

      I doubt this instance is any guide, Germans have a far tougher driving licence test than we do they’re generally pretty good drivers from what I’ve heard.

      Tiredness may be a part that needs addressing. I had a near miss a while back with someone in a hire camper crossing the line on a corner. They entered it wrong and cut the white line. Their reaction was to swerve even further towards me, luckily for me they just as quickly corrected and pulled back in. That was open road, I’d taken my foot off when I saw them over the line & then nearly crapped myself when they veered further, thought for a brief moment they were aiming at me.

      I put them down as used to driving on the right, where their swerve to the right would have been the natural reaction, and that they may have picked the camper up straight after landing & then drove north. They could have been getting tired, which may be why they took the wrong line on the corner to begin with.

      The point being it may not be a bad idea to more strongly urge people to not engage in a long drive in a camper immediately on arriving here after a long flight. They are campers after all, it’s not as if they have nowhere to sleep.
    • gsays 10.2

      3 November 2017 at 11:04 am

      This year police have a greater involvement in deaths on the road than tourists.
11. Andre 11

    3 November 2017 at 9:40 am

    Billy already getting in a whine that the elites might not be quite so coddled going forward.

    https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/national/labour-already-a-brutal-government-bill-english/ar-AAulbPV?li=BBqdg4K&ocid=mailsignout

    ” The comments came in response to Health Minister David Clark saying he is “very seriously considering” accepting resignations from District Health Board (DHB) heads that aren’t on the new Government’s “wavelength.”

    “I’m extremely disappointed,” Mr English said.

    “I thought the Jacinda Ardern Government would be different. It turns out it’s just the same old Labour trying to do its brutal tactics on the public service.”

    Mr Clark told RNZ he may ask for resignation letters from current chairs of DHBs before choosing which ones to accept back into the fold.

    “I want to be sure that the district health board chairs are in agreement with the current Government’s agenda and direction,” Mr Clark told RNZ. ”

    Good idea, Minister Clark. Would it be too much to ask you to also take the opportunity to trim bloated top-level administrative overhead and salaries? Y’know, so the money actually gets spent on providing services rather than funding lots of expensive top-level jobsworths whose only function is getting in the way?
    • tracey 11.1

      3 November 2017 at 10:13 am

      Irony alert. The last govt acted so poorly toward public servants one even got death threats as a result of one Minister’s actions.
      • McFlock 11.1.1

        3 November 2017 at 11:37 am

        I almost spat my coffee when I saw his comment about brutal tactics. Rank hypocrisy.
        • Andre 11.1.1.1

          3 November 2017 at 11:53 am

          You’ve got better control of your reflexes than I do.
      • OnceWasTim 11.1.2

        3 November 2017 at 3:22 pm

        And they did so through crony appointments to senior management positions. I suspect even public servants at the coal face in WINZ live in fear of their masters.
        I’m hoping the age of the various corporatised public service feifdoms will get a bloody big shake up. And despite someone’s pessimism on another thread about not being able to make changes needed, the neo-libs created exactly the structure that will/could allow a bloody big shakeup to happen.
        We’ll see. It is very early days.
    • patricia bremner 11.2

      3 November 2017 at 11:30 am

      Perhaps the same should happen in broadcasting. (Wouldn’t leave many though.)
    • Ad 11.3

      3 November 2017 at 12:28 pm

      “Considering” is just weak.

      He has a month tops to get his people in there and re-write the entities.

      After that, political ossification sets and the window closes.
    • greywarshark 11.4

      3 November 2017 at 6:31 pm

      $500,000 salary plus for a damn hospital CEO. Where was that? The figure stayed in my head, and everything else faded when I heard it to day or yesterday on Radionz. The hospitals are damned of course, trying to manage on short rations for the working parts, while the cock at the top is paid for playing the neo -lib game of sorting out the inefficiencies with a sinking budget level.
      • In Vino 11.4.1

        3 November 2017 at 8:02 pm

        +1 This is the essence of neo-liberal corruption. English to blame for setting it all up that way before he rose to be an outgoing prime-ministerial candidate first time he lost.
12. joe90 12

    3 November 2017 at 9:44 am

    Russophobia… fake news…
    /

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-investigation/uk-investigates-brexit-campaign-funding-amid-speculation-of-russian-meddling-idUKKBN1D14H9
    • Peroxide Blonde 12.1

      3 November 2017 at 1:11 pm

      The Electoral Commission in London has a very poor record of inquiry and prosecution. Sadly the Metropolitan police are not much better.
      Carol Cadwalladr has pushed the story in The Guardian but it is not getting any traction in the mainstream media.
      Open Democracy has done some solid work which the Electoral Commission will probably ignore.
      https://www.opendemocracy.net/dup-dark-money

      https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/oct/28/trump-assange-bannon-farage-bound-together-in-unholy-alliance
      • In Vino 12.1.1

        3 November 2017 at 8:05 pm

        I can’t help but suspect that the Russians may have interfered in our election too.
        Who did plant all that unfavourable news that kept breaking out??
        • Incognito 12.1.1.1

          4 November 2017 at 12:06 am

          Have you heard of the seed and soil hypothesis? The wind blows the seed and if it lands on suitable soil it will germinate.
          • In Vino 12.1.1.1.1

            4 November 2017 at 7:56 pm

            But who is controlling that wind?
13. savenz 13

    3 November 2017 at 10:15 am

    The Court of Appeal has dismissed an attempt by the late hotelier Earl Hagaman’s estate to reconsider a defamation case against the new justice minister Andrew Little.

    It awarded Mr Little costs.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/342933/court-dismisses-defamation-appeal-against-andrew-little
    • patricia bremner 13.1

      3 November 2017 at 11:34 am

      Good . Minister. Little holds honest stances.
    • greywarshark 13.2

      3 November 2017 at 6:27 pm

      Hooray.
14. tracey 14

    3 November 2017 at 10:17 am

    If you havent had a chance to listen to the spoof of Max Key dissing Eminem you might lije to. Lil Max will be very pouty
    • Andre 14.1

      3 November 2017 at 10:26 am

      This one?

      https://thespinoff.co.nz/music/27-10-2017/maxclusive-max-key-destroys-eminem-career-in-diss-track/
15. savenz 15

    3 November 2017 at 10:23 am

    Hamilton Boys’ High School student injured in girls’ nude bike prank

    (not sure how running someone over at a school on a motorbike can be considered a ‘prank’)

    You also have to wonder about the girls who thought it was a good idea????

    If it was a youth gang that deliberately ran amok around a school and ran someone over, they would be in custody.

    http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2017/11/hamilton-boys-high-school-student-injured-in-girls-nude-bike-prank.html
    • DH 15.1

      3 November 2017 at 10:45 am

      I say good for the boy’s parents, they at least have their priorities right. IMO the Police should respect their wishes and stay out of it… provided the boy agrees too.
    • Draco T Bastard 15.2

      3 November 2017 at 10:59 am

      not sure how running someone over at a school on a motorbike can be considered a ‘prank’

      Sounds like it was simply an accident. The prank was simply riding nude which seems to be the only reason why this was ‘news’.
    • Whispering Kate 15.3

      3 November 2017 at 11:06 am

      My oh my Waikato Diocesan School for Girls, a prestigious Anglican private school – and they let their “gals” out of bounds topless to play truant. What on earth is the world coming to. I have heard tales of yore from other Hawkes Bay Private schools for girls as well – doesn’t say much for the upper echelons of society in this country does it. Breeding our young ladies to be such utter trollops!!!!! Tongue in cheek here but seeing our prisons are littered with the poor and products of our public schools it just shows tacky-ness comes from all stratas of our society, you’d better believe it.
    • mauī 15.4

      3 November 2017 at 11:51 am

      I have always found single sex schools to have a certain elitism and super-patriotism about them that was pretty gross. This could be a consequence of that.
      • John Shears 15.4.1

        3 November 2017 at 1:21 pm

        Maui ,
        You are entitled to your opinion but I disagree, depends on the on the ethics of the school and the way it is run surely. Your experience may well have been much less
        agreeable than mine was.
    • Molly 15.5

      3 November 2017 at 11:52 am

      Just to reinforce the “just a prank” perspective, the Herald has kindly come up with an article High school pranks that have annoyed teachers.

      Also – allows them to repeat the gratuitous publishing of three photos of teenage girls in their underwear (restrained?) on the back of a motorbike, and to reinforce the notion that privilege denotes respectability to all actions without critique.
    • McFlock 15.6

      3 November 2017 at 12:02 pm

      never happened in my day. Pity – would have been a highlight of my teenage years…
    • greywarshark 15.7

      3 November 2017 at 6:26 pm

      True savenz. Depends whether you view pranks top-down or bottom-up.
      • In Vino 15.7.1

        3 November 2017 at 8:19 pm

        I think it the best-conceived streaking prank so far carried out. The Herald even did a cartoon based on it. Unfortunately, the boy was run over and cut in the leg. Without that, it would have seemed impressive and harmless. But now, the question of whether the girls had the appropriate licences to be driving the bikes could come into question, and it could end in tears. There was no malice here, as there is when the poor bash a dairy-owner, so I am not sure that it is a matter of privilege. Wait and see if prosecution follows.
        Without modern phones, there would have been no photos for the NZ Herald to so cynically publish as click-bait (and the article reached the top of their internet chart). That is also a sad commentary – on what the general public want to see.
        • greywarshark 15.7.1.1

          4 November 2017 at 10:00 am

          In the old days they used vehicles for pranks, like seeing how many people you could pile into a volkswagen. Probably now it would have to be that they were all nude.

          Then if there were both sexes one of the males would get an erection, then there would be some tale of sexual malpractice, and that would be good click bait. So watch the media over the next year when there is a low point in the news cycle, and no sexual malpractice of some luminary being investigated, or a new war, or shooting in a school, mall, concert, church, or particularly horrific bombing or picture of a child suffering. /sad and disillusioned not sarc
16. Antoine 16

    3 November 2017 at 10:34 am

    The squealing in this Kiwiblog thread should amuse – https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/11/labour_confirms_national_awards_will_be_compulsory.html
    • savenz 16.1

      4 November 2017 at 8:02 am

      The rise in motocross bikes in public places is everywhere. They are super dangerous and often ridden by unlicensed people – aka – kids without the brains or understanding that they can kill people with their behaviour. The parents cheer it on.

      Somehow whenever there is an accident of this kind, surprise surprise it is always considered a prank gone wrong and hushed up. Even when someone is killed or severely injured.

      I’m all for harmless pranks but if they could have pulled the same prank on bicycles and nobody would have been hurt and it would not have been doing something illegal (aka riding motocross bikes in public places without permission or a motorbike license + injuring someone to boot).
17. eco maori 17

    3 November 2017 at 10:35 am

    Now I no my money from my business is not thunderous I made 2× this when I was 14 but in my line of business it’s all about the good will and if some people are shitting all over my good name there goes my earning sliding backwards. By 2 thirds but the potential earnings from my eco Maori pseudonym is thunderous but the same people are interfering with this. So I will be making a claim on the breaches of my rights under the Treaty of Waitangi there are many injustices that are being dealt out to me and my whanau. like the red head guy whom thought that he would come over to the farm house that I was living in that the farm owner had just sacked me idiot an say boo and the dumb ass Maori would run away. Well no because this Maori is a proud and brave Maori that knows his rights and told him were to go. So they have stuffed my farming career that I had planed to be managing and making $80.000 WTF. Now the big picture is that this sort of service can be dealt out to anyone in New Zealand if they are not in the who gives a________ club ie millionairs club. They now no that Im not a dumb ass Maori now. I wonder if the generals want to negotiate well no sorry they are God’s and are never worng
    WTF just like the orange man Kia Kaha
    • greywarshark 17.1

      3 November 2017 at 6:23 pm

      Well that is a comment with lot of possibilities.
18. Ad 18

    3 November 2017 at 12:19 pm

    Kushner is now a target:

    http://edition.cnn.com/2017/11/02/politics/jared-kushner-robert-mueller-documents-russia-investigation/index.html
    • joe90 18.1

      3 November 2017 at 12:57 pm

      Family dinners will be fun.

      http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/358248-vanity-fair-trump-blaming-kushner-for-mueller-investigation
      • Andre 18.1.1

        3 November 2017 at 1:01 pm

        Thanksgiving is coming up soon.
        • joe90 18.1.1.1

          3 November 2017 at 1:10 pm

          And Mr Clovis won’t be on the invite list.

          The White House first learned one of its senior staffers met with the grand jury hearing the case presented by the special counsel into alleged Russian meddling into the 2016 election not from the staffer but from media reports, sources with knowledge of the investigation tell ABC News.

          Former Trump campaign co-chairman Sam Clovis recently testified before that grand jury into his role on President Donald Trump’s campaign. Clovis currently serves as the senior White House adviser to the Department of Agriculture.

          http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/white-house-unaware-top-adviser-testified-grand-jury/story?id=50895265
    • Andre 18.2

      3 November 2017 at 1:38 pm

      Al Franken is going after Sessions for lying under oath to the Senate.

      http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/11/jeff-sessions-under-fire-as-new-revelations-cast-further-doubt-on-his-russia-testimony/
      • joe90 18.2.1

        3 November 2017 at 2:10 pm

        Floodgates are opening.

        Former Trump foreign policy adviser Carter Page privately testified Thursday that he mentioned to Jeff Sessions he was traveling to Russia during the 2016 presidential campaign — as new questions emerge about the attorney general’s comments to Congress about Russia and the Trump campaign.

        During more than six hours of closed-door testimony, Page said that he informed Sessions about his coming July 2016 trip to Russia, which Page told CNN was unconnected to his campaign role. Page described the conversation to CNN after he finished talking to the House intelligence committee.

        http://edition.cnn.com/2017/11/02/politics/carter-page-testimony-russia-trip/index.html?sr=twCNN110217carter-page-testimony-russia-trip0734PMVODtop
19. Andre 19

    3 November 2017 at 12:35 pm

    The Repugs release their tax reform bill. Like all “conservative” tax plans anytime anywhere, it borrows money to pay for big tax cuts to those that already have the most (especially those that write the rules and their owners), sticks it to those that have the least, and lies that it will increase growth.

    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/11/2/16595980/winners-losers-house-republican-tax-bill
    • joe90 19.1

      3 November 2017 at 12:54 pm

      It’s almost like they have an agenda.

      Only about 5% of US mortgages are over $500k. But take a look at where they are in the US… (good chart via @NLIHC) pic.twitter.com/fAybZajulY— Heather Long (@byHeatherLong) November 2, 2017

      https://twitter.com/byHeatherLong/status/926139481052385285
      • Andre 19.1.1

        3 November 2017 at 12:59 pm

        Must be coincidence, surely? They wouldn’t really act with considered malice towards regions that don’t support them, would they?
      • Andre 19.1.2

        3 November 2017 at 2:39 pm

        Still has to be coincidence…

        http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/11/charts-of-the-day-how-republicans-are-using-the-tax-code-to-screw-blue-states/
20. adam 20

    3 November 2017 at 1:24 pm

    Is it just me then, that repealing the all the crazy laws from national over employment is not much of a victory.

    Actually feels shallow, weak, and if this is the great example of a changing government.

    Then don’t expect much change.
    • McFlock 20.1

      3 November 2017 at 3:37 pm

      If that’s all they manage in the frist hundred days (let alone the entire term), I’d agree with you.

      I suspect that a few more changes than that are on the cards, despite the nats’ desire to become a cancer on the side of parliament.
      • adam 20.1.1

        3 November 2017 at 5:13 pm

        I hope you’re right McFlock, I hope you’re right.
21. Ad 21

    3 November 2017 at 2:26 pm

    Looks like Iceland’s Left-Green alliance is about to become a governing reality under Katrin Jakobsdottir:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/02/iceland-president-left-greens-form-coalition
22. Andre 22

    3 November 2017 at 5:11 pm

    “I am the only one that matters…” – the Grabemfuhrer in response to questions about why positions are being left unfilled.

    http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/358573-trump-on-lack-of-nominees-i-am-the-only-one-that-matters

    The good news is he doesn’t understand that those positions are there to help him actually achieve things.

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