NRT: Climate change: The enemy

31 comments on “NRT: Climate change: The enemy ”

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1. karol 1

   21 November 2013 at 2:26 pm

   Yes. very interesting. I read this earlier on NRT. The interactive map is great (at the “full list of companies”) – click on either investor owned, state owned etc – then on the button in the centre of the graph to return to the overview.
2. Colonial Viper 2

   21 November 2013 at 2:36 pm

   Very interesting. This complements perfectly a 2011 result which said that 40% of the global economy was controlled by a tightly knit and inter-related group of 147 trans-national corporations.

   http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21228354.500-revealed–the-capitalist-network-that-runs-the-world.html
3. Tracey 3

   21 November 2013 at 2:38 pm

   Colin Craig, National’s new coalition party post 2014, apparenly has views on this.

   However when you go to the party website and click on issues, environment doesnt feature.

   Economy
   Health
   Education
   Treaty
   Law & Order
   Social
   Sovereignty
   • karol 3.1

     21 November 2013 at 2:51 pm

     It is addressed in the “Ask Colin” section of the website.

     In his response, Craig oultines the party position on Climate & says it’s available on a brochure that can be downloaded from the website – buggered if I can find it.
     • Tracey 3.1.1

       21 November 2013 at 2:56 pm

       Yup, but he sees it as a subset of which of the above?

       His lists is like something from the 1950’s, which makes sense when you think about it 😉
       • karol 3.1.1.1

         21 November 2013 at 3:03 pm

         Yes. He obviously doesn’t consider climate change to be a priority. And he aims for the apparent simplicity of earlier times.
4. Lanthanide 4

   21 November 2013 at 2:59 pm

   Er, 90 companies don’t just create emissions.

   Customers buy and use their products. Customers create the emissions.

   If it were 9000 companies instead of 90, it would still be the customers of the 9000 companies making the emissions, not 90.

   I feel like this story really does the climate change crusade a disservice in that it’s shirking responsibility from the consumers onto the producers. The producers only make what is demanded by their customers.

   It’s pretty easy to imagine an American blaming “big oil like BP and Chevron” for climate change, instead of actually considering their own personal actions and behaviours as being the cause.
   • karol 4.1

     21 November 2013 at 3:02 pm

     I disagree. Producers these days, aim to create demand through advertising, marketing, lobbying governments to provide infrastructure for their products and services, etc.
     • Lanthanide 4.1.1

       21 November 2013 at 4:40 pm

       It’s difficult to market and create demand for a product no one wants.
       • karol 4.1.1.1

         21 November 2013 at 4:42 pm

         They do tend to encourage and cultivate desires. They certainly promote products and services no-one really needs.
         • Lanthanide 4.1.1.1.1

           21 November 2013 at 5:12 pm

           True. But like I said, if it was 9000 companies instead of 90, we’d probably see the same amount of consumption anyway, because it’s the consumers that matter.
       • Rogue Trooper 4.1.1.2

         22 November 2013 at 5:41 pm

         Having done a marketing paper at Uni, I disagree; the demand is generally created; How did we ever get on before an espresso machines, foot-spas and GHD hair-straighteners in our homes.
   • Colonial Viper 4.2

     21 November 2013 at 3:03 pm

     However customers live and behave in the social-economic framework shaped but politicians and corporates.

     We have an economic system which pushes for maximum individual consumption while doing things like building more roads, closing down railway lines, and making sure that public transport is hindered at every turn.
     • Draco T Bastard 4.2.1

       21 November 2013 at 5:05 pm

       However customers live and behave in the social-economic framework shaped but politicians and corporates.

       A good example is the roads and the suburban sprawl that we’ve seen over the last few decades.
   • Tracey 4.3

     21 November 2013 at 3:05 pm

     While people have to take responsibility for what they buy and from whom, if those 90 companies stopped producing emissions that would go a long way to easing future issues? In any event naming the 90 now gives people the chance to change their buying habits. Before this report they didnt know.
     • Colonial Viper 4.3.1

       21 November 2013 at 3:17 pm

       People don’t need to stop their buying habits.

       They need to stop their buying.
       • Paul 4.3.1.1

         21 November 2013 at 3:23 pm

         Citizens not consumers
         • Colonial Viper 4.3.1.1.1

           21 November 2013 at 3:53 pm

           Correct. Simple fact: modern economic activity generates GHGs and consumes fossil fuels.

           The current belief is that we can still have it all, as much as we want, whenever we want, with maximum yields on our investments, and somehow still save the planet.
           • SpaceMonkey 4.3.1.1.1.1

             21 November 2013 at 5:38 pm

             Indeed… as technology will solve all our problems.
       • Tracey 4.3.1.2

         21 November 2013 at 4:02 pm

         That’s the spirit, hold out for the giant step and mock the small steps. It’s irrelevant what you want CV, it’s about how to shift a HUGE mental gridlock, how does your revolution look when it comes. paint me the strategic picture.
         • Colonial Viper 4.3.1.2.1

           21 November 2013 at 5:31 pm

           The mental grid lock is not going to shift; I don’t think there is any answer to making it shift.

           The most likely outcome is that our global civilisation is going to smash face first into climate change consequences and energy/physical resource depletion in the next 20 to 30 years. Poorer highly populated countries are going to be worst off. Rich countries will keep the pedal down to the metal the whole way off the cliff. (See Tony Abbott in Australia as an example).

           The paper assets and electronic financial wealth that people have been so busy acquiring and using as justification for our current economic behaviours, will rather ironically become valueless around this time.
           • Rogue Trooper 4.3.1.2.1.1

             22 November 2013 at 5:43 pm

             “when people learn they cannot eat money”. -Chief Seattle
5. Tracey 5

   21 November 2013 at 4:00 pm

   Mr Cunliffe is not anti drilling

   “Mr Cunliffe said Labour was “not opposed in principle to responsible and environmentally sensible” offshore exploration.

   But any consent to be granted under a government led by him would need world-class environment standards, top clean-up capability, full liability cover, a fair deal for taxpayers and a high level of consultation.

   Mr Cunliffe said the deep sea drilling industry was a “responsible” one, and hoped for a “mature conversation” with Texas oil giant Anadarko, which is behind the plans.”
   • karol 5.1

     21 November 2013 at 4:30 pm

     Mind you, I wonder if it is commercially viable to meet all the precautionary and “environmentally sensible”/responsible requirements, ie making these requirements could ultimately mean no drilling?
     • Draco T Bastard 5.1.1

       21 November 2013 at 5:08 pm

       Probably not.
6. vto 6

   21 November 2013 at 5:19 pm

   It’s raining at the moment. Good for the veges. When do you know a cauli is ready?
   • CnrJoe 6.1

     21 November 2013 at 7:35 pm

     raining cats and dogs?
     Collies r always up for it
   • Rogue Trooper 6.2

     22 November 2013 at 5:47 pm

     I let them grow as big, and white as possible before the florets begin separating, though, not always. Have harvested one from home, and one from the community garden these past two days (to give away, along with cabbage, silver-beet and humungous brocoli). The potatoes are ‘this tall’, beginning to flower, and the dwarf butter-beans have poked through the soil. Satisfaction!
7. johnm 7

   21 November 2013 at 9:44 pm

   My understanding is Climate Change may well finish off humanity. What do you think of this documentary? Not that anyone will bother to view it but here goes: The Arctic death spiral and the methane time bomb

   Don’t forget: Ignorance is bliss: The enemy is us and our complacency, our inability to face up to this great catastrophe, our denial and selfishness.
   • tracey 7.1

     22 November 2013 at 8:15 am

     why would you assume no one would click your link? If you thought that why waste our energy posting it?
     • johnm 7.1.1

       22 November 2013 at 5:47 pm

       My position confirmed by the lack of response. The Standard basically seems to be a forum for smart aleck commentators arguing petty irrelevant points and details in an ego inflating way who in fact are trolls w.nking off any genuine discussion. So typical of New Zealand going down the Shonkey plughole. Bye. Xtasy has found the same lack of connection to reality.

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