Open mike 22/05/2014

Written By: - Date published: 6:35 am, May 22nd, 2014 - 180 comments
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180 comments on “Open mike 22/05/2014 ”

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  1. Philj 1
    22 May 2014 at 6:56 am

    xox
    Just heard Grocer on RNZ trying to talk up the struggling TPP negotiations. Sounded like a Dr with a treminal cancer patient.

    • karol 1.1
      22 May 2014 at 7:11 am

      http://podcast.radionz.co.nz/mnr/mnr-20140522-0622-tim_groser_in_japan_to_push_for_trade_deal-048.mp3

      Grosser sounds like he’s using a lot of words to cover for the fact that he’s not achieving anything much. Talking about Japan…. yaddayaddayadda…

      • Gosman 1.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 8:37 am

        Seems all your fears of some corporate coup to impose the TPPA on unsuspecting nations is a load of nonsense.

        • Tracey 1.1.1.1
          22 May 2014 at 8:46 am

          links please to support this statement ?

        • phillip ure 1.1.1.2
          22 May 2014 at 8:53 am

          that it seems to have been killed off by/thru political self-interest/priorities by major/all(?) players..

          ..does not negate/make a lie of the claims of .. the actual original intents of that ‘corporate-coup’…eh..?

          ..(have you been taking false-equivalence lessons from that ‘bad’..?..)

          • Gosman 1.1.1.2.1
            22 May 2014 at 10:00 am

            Rubbish. It shows that the agreeement was always an attenpt to free trade and that each party to the negotiations has interest groups for or against certain aspects of it as you would expect.

        • freedom 1.1.1.3
          22 May 2014 at 9:39 am

          Gosman, you almost make me miss PG, at least he [seemed to] believe the drivel he wrote.

          There is currently underway a co-ordinated global effort to clamp down on real free trade in favour of corporate friendly regimes, written largely by those who will benefit the most from the agreements. Hint, those who will benefit the most are not the workers making the products being traded or the countries those products are being made in.

          Start with looking up what these acronyms stand for “TPP/TTIP/TAFTA/CETA/PAFTA”

          then maybe settle in and go through this:
          http://www.iuf.org/w/sites/default/files/TradeDealsThatThreatenDemocracy-e_0.pdf

          You will no doubt still insist on making your usual propaganda soaked mantras and I guess there is not much we can do about that. So many here and elsewhere have tried to educate you. What I fail to understand is your stubborn willingness to become a trade unit rather than a member of a functional democracy in a world where people come before profit.

          Of course why should you believe a bunch of unions, or doctors, or teachers, or chemists, or software engineers or builders or Universities or Aid agencies or any of the other hundreds of groups that are working full time to bring the realities of these agreements to the public’s attention. They are all just lying right?

          How about believing the leaked text on IP from the TPP itself? https://wikileaks.org/tpp/
          It plainly states how the public message from the negotiators contradicts the goals of the proposed text, and if it doesn’t why did the negotiators launch a tsunami of press attacks in the hours after it had been released, all screaming in unison that it was just a draft and the real agreement is all different now, but you can’t read it because …???? oh yeah because it’s secret. Does it compute with you that no negotiating team has seen the entire text?

          But that is just crazy conspiracy nonsense right? These trans national behemoths would never try to manipulate a nation’s laws to increase their profits and power? No they are the bastions of truth and goddness and happy happy joy joy days.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 1.1.1.3.1
            22 May 2014 at 9:55 am

            The link demonstrates little other than that the negotiating parties could not reach agreement and the US was isolated.

            • Colonial Viper 1.1.1.3.1.1
              22 May 2014 at 10:01 am

              The link demonstrates little other than that the global power elite of the negotiating parties could not find sufficient political capital from home constituencies to reach agreement and the world’s most powerful but nevertheless declining superpower the US was isolated.

              Just for a bit of context

              • One Anonymous Bloke …
                22 May 2014 at 10:09 am

                🙄

                The fifth Labour government appointed the negotiators and set their bottom lines. If I’m not mistaken you’d like to be a Labour MP, which would make you one of the “power elite”, wouldn’t it?

                • Colonial Viper …
                  22 May 2014 at 10:28 am

                  Huh? Leaving aside the idea that MPs have much actual power over anything, what you are saying would put me in the class of ‘wanna-be’ or ‘hanger-on’. And who can be fucked with that.

                  Perhaps your idea of power-elite and mine are different. The power elite IMO are the 0.1% in a developed western country. They aren’t the $100K pa to $200K pa paid lackeys and higher income professional organ grinders who work for the power elite.

                  The fifth Labour government appointed the negotiators and set their bottom lines.

                  LOL its OK then just trust them is I suppose what you are implying.

            • freedom 1.1.1.3.1.2
              22 May 2014 at 10:09 am

              OAB, are you referring to the pdf link or the wikileaks link?

              The pdf has many examples of the potential problems countries face. The pdf also includes numerous examples of current and recent cases where the efforts of big business are not in the best interests of the communities they want to profit from and how the new agreements would be even more problematic.

              The wikileaks link was widely covered at the time of its release, which was why so much effort was put into discrediting the leaked text saying it was only a draft.

              • One Anonymous Bloke …
                22 May 2014 at 10:16 am

                How does saying it’s a draft (which it clearly is) discredit it?

                The whole point of negotiations is to find compromises between competing interests, so it would be an odd negotiation that didn’t provide evidence of said competition.

                • freedom …
                  22 May 2014 at 10:28 am

                  I said effort was put into discrediting it, I did not say the text was discredited.

                  The leaked text was openly attacked by those who were embarrassed by its release because of what it exposed and the questions it raised. Questions that went to content which contradicted the numerous public statements being made by the various negotiating teams.

                  You said “The link demonstrates little other than that the negotiating parties could not reach agreement and the US was isolated.”

                  Which link? I would just like to know which link you think shows this?

                  • One Anonymous Bloke …
                    22 May 2014 at 2:55 pm

                    The Wikileaks link.

                    I don’t think it’s necessary to put much energy into discrediting opinions based on false premises. It was a draft. Anyone saying so was merely stating a fact.

                    It must have been embarrassing for all the Chicken Littles though, to have been assuring everyone that our negotiators were selling us out and then have Wikileaks prove them wrong.

                    • freedom …
                      22 May 2014 at 3:40 pm

                      Thank you for answering OAB. I think you already know I completely disagree with your interpretation of the various activity that surrounded the release of the Wikileaks material, so we will just leave that alone as it would achieve nothing.

                      When it comes to the ‘trade’ agreements mentioned above, I would like to say one thing…. I sincerely hope myself and so many others are completely wrong about our interpretation of the globalists’ plans for your mukapuna.

                    • freedom …
                      22 May 2014 at 4:52 pm

                      Please excuse my rather tragic misspelling of mokopuna. I have been making a bunch of mistakes with all sorts of words lately. must try harder

                    • One Anonymous Bloke …
                      23 May 2014 at 7:12 am

                      Don’t get me wrong: I would be implacably opposed to NZ signing up to what the US wants, I just think there is precisely zero chance of us doing so, and the leaked documents support that view.

                      I prefer to oppose things on solid ground – goes to credibility.

          • kenny 1.1.1.3.2
            22 May 2014 at 11:16 am

            Beautifully put Freedom! This should be the final answer to all the garbage written by all the RWNJ’s everywhere.

            Well done.

          • North 1.1.1.3.3
            22 May 2014 at 8:59 pm

            Freedom, for your ‘owning’ response @1.1.1.3 to GooseMan, you have my AAA+, my ten more Gold Stars than you’ll ever need, and my heartiest congratulations.

            GooseMan, you have been stunningly ‘proprietorialised’, viz. ‘owned’ by the Good Freedom. It’ll be on ViciousOldThing PaulineHenry@3 – 10.30 tonight, you see.

            Time to lick your wounds, pick yourself up, and hobble off back to SlaterPorn where for a millisecond you’ll be acknowledged as a soldier of The Dark back from The Cold, then ignored. For reside there many, many exquisitely madder people than you.

            Give up Cuzzy, melt into SlaterPorn. You’re simply not up to it. You realise of course that ShonKey Python thinks you’re a fuckwit. Bombasting and Beavering away while –
            “Me ?……..I’m off to play Baldrick to Barak”.

            Chump Sucker You !

        • thatguynz 1.1.1.4
          22 May 2014 at 10:16 am

          You are truly a retard Gosman. Do you actually read anything prior to spouting your trivial nonsense?

          • Gosman 1.1.1.4.1
            22 May 2014 at 11:02 am

            What trivial nonsense would that be?

            • framu 1.1.1.4.1.1
              22 May 2014 at 12:19 pm

              everything

            • thatguynz 1.1.1.4.1.2
              22 May 2014 at 12:29 pm

              Take your pick – the list is long and undistinguished however in this particular case, the statement you made that I replied to – you know as per the commonly accepted practice in discussion threads.

          • Tracey 1.1.1.4.2
            22 May 2014 at 11:50 am

            it seems he isamhs he is confirming he doesnt even read his own posts, which from now on makes two of us.

  2. Paul 2
    22 May 2014 at 7:07 am

    RNZ 7 am news leading with cricket scandal for 2nd day…and continuing with the Horan distraction.
    Is it taking its new selections from the Herald and ZB now?!
    This is our public broadcaster.

    • Enough is Enough 2.1
      22 May 2014 at 10:00 am

      Out of interest what news do you think should have lead the 7am news?

  3. bad12 3
    22 May 2014 at 7:26 am

    Green and brown colored cigarettes will apparently be the next battleground in the effort to deter smokers from using tobacco products,

    Personally, if it were not for the fact that i grow everything i smoke, the proposed color schemes for ciggies highlighted in today’s Herald would be pleasing when compared to the boring old white variety,

    i recommend shocking pink, that might put a few off…

      • bad12 3.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 3:37 pm

        Lolz, there goes my ability at original thought, beaten to it by many years by the look of it, if there’s a market for pink cigarettes i fail to see how Green and Brown ones are going to be off putting to us addicts…

        • North 3.1.1.2
          22 May 2014 at 9:46 pm

          Actually, driving home tonight I heard that one on RNZ and it crossed my mind that the perfect number would be to produce all the ciggies in ‘Lolly Pink’. That’d clear off all those smokey, closety homophobes in one fell swoop. Anyone smoking a lolly pink (sorry) ‘fag’ within 300 metres of a rugby clubrooms or an Eminem (MenInMen) concert’d walk right into the meanest ever re-education/rogering. Never to do it again…….well…….maybe never.

          Fark ! Then all [SHIT] would hit the fan and British American Tobacco [BAT] would come over all gay-friendly and sue [NZ] under [TPPA] for more [$$$] than your best bailout. Fark !

          And then ShonKey Python’s [BAT][SHIT] would acquire real meaning. Fark !

          Meanwhile………crossing to the Rose Room………Barak and Baldrick……..jiving ……..seductively. Fark !

          Aue ! I SO need this. Living in Kaikohe. Coining 17 grand a year……..

    • greywarbler 3.2
      22 May 2014 at 6:18 pm

      Camouflage ciggies! Does that make them invisible to drones?

  4. Colonial Viper 4
    22 May 2014 at 7:58 am

    Identity politics a political distraction in an age of energy and civilisation collapse

    Dmitry Orlov hits this one hard –

    When I gave the same talk a month later at last year’s Age of Limits conference, the reaction was rather different. There was almost no discussion of impediments to implementation or ideas for overcoming them. Instead, the conversation veered off into gender politics, with some amount of booing and hissing from the female members of the audience. You see, the examples I picked, which included, among others, traditional, religious communities with patriarchal gender roles, were said to be ill-suited as models for such a “progressive” group. (By the way, I never proposed that they be used as models, only as examples from which general principles can be uncovered.) Then there followed some harsh (and, to my mind, ridiculous) criticisms of the Amish, who were said to abuse their wives and children. Compared to the focused and productive discussion at Grand Marais, this one turned out to be a complete waste of time. I was flabbergasted by this reaction, only later realizing that I had blundered into an American cultural war zone. I later realized that none of the criticisms raised had the slightest bit of relevance to the topic under discussion.

    and this shocking suggestion about male rape in the US being the most common form – all occurring from behind prison walls. I’ve never seen any anti-rape campaigner include this fact before.

    As for minority rights, there are more black slaves in America today than there were before the Civil War—they used to work on plantations, but now they work in prisons, many of which are privately owned, where they make money for their politically connected owners. With regard to the rights of sexual minorities, it needs to be noted that not only does the US lead the developed world in rape, but that here rape is evenly distributed between men and women, male rape being most prevalent, again, among the prison population

    http://cluborlov.blogspot.co.nz/2014/05/death-by-political-correctness.html

    • Tracey 4.1
      22 May 2014 at 8:50 am

      So it’s not identity politics Orlov objects to its gender politics? Same for you in truth CV, you call it identity politics but you mean gender or feminist politics dont you? You urged someone to be clear about a comment they made about what type of people buy KFC, so be honest. You object to feminist politics as part of a politic discourse?

      • Colonial Viper 4.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 9:04 am

        You did see Orlov’s commentary on slavery and imprisonment of minorities right? They’ve essentially instituted a New Jim Crow in the USA. I think he is very clear about what he means by the American “cultural wars” of which gender politics is a big part.

        You urged someone to be clear about a comment they made about what type of people buy KFC, so be honest. You object to feminist politics as part of a politic discourse?

        I’m not interested in putting my energy into any politics which ignores or damages economic justice for the many, especially in an age of energy and resource depletion. If it is politics which does focus on economic justice for the many – I will back it to the hilt.

        • marty mars 4.1.1.1
          22 May 2014 at 9:29 am

          “While it is the entire country that is being victimized by this system of governance based on the principle of social divide and conquer, it is women and minorities that are the pawns in this game, and the biggest losers, with some of the worst outcomes out of all of the developed countries.”

          We will not be quiet.

          • Tracey 4.1.1.1.1
            22 May 2014 at 9:41 am

            when you add women and minorities together you get…

            the many

            • Colonial Viper 4.1.1.1.1.1
              22 May 2014 at 10:07 am

              Sure. If you want to imagine minorities and women as some grouped mass with largely homogenous or at least congruent opinions, identities and perspectives.

          • Colonial Viper 4.1.1.1.2
            22 May 2014 at 10:30 am

            We will not be quiet.

            It’s your right to keep advocating for new corporate dairying conversions, etc. I’m certainly not asking or stopping you from doing so.

            • marty mars 4.1.1.1.2.1
              22 May 2014 at 10:41 am

              Are you sure you aren’t because that is not what you’ve argued previously.

              What corporate supplied goods and services have you abstained from this week – you know to be consistent with your stated views.

              • Colonial Viper …
                22 May 2014 at 10:56 am

                Oh bejesus marty, are you jumping on the ‘you listen to an Apple iPod so you can’t complain about cruel Chinese worker factory conditions’ or ‘you live in Herne Bay so you’re not allowed to speak out against poverty’ style of argument.

                • marty mars …
                  22 May 2014 at 11:00 am

                  It’s a bit better than the, ‘you identify with a group and oppose some of what they do yet others lump you in to further their argument’ bandwagon imo 🙂

                  Better to walk the talk not just talk.

          • Gosman 4.1.1.1.3
            22 May 2014 at 11:07 am

            Some of the best outcomes too if you accept our ranking on that social ranking survey put out recently.

        • Tracey 4.1.1.2
          22 May 2014 at 9:38 am

          was my question at the end too hard. cmon cv… you fudged it….practice what you preached earlier in the week.

          as for orlov… he could ask why men are not outraged at the high number of men being raped in prison… and start advocating for them.

          • Colonial Viper 4.1.1.2.1
            22 May 2014 at 10:04 am

            as for orlov… he could ask why men are not outraged at the high number of men being raped in prison… and start advocating for them.

            The answer is obvious; it’s because they tend to be poor young men from minority groups and it is not politically fashionable to help them. And btw few do more useful advocacy work than Orlov, but of course it is not in the area of identity politics, it is in the area of surviving collapse.

            was my question at the end too hard. cmon cv… you fudged it….practice what you preached earlier in the week.

            I gave you a pretty simple answer. If it’s identity politics focussing on the rights of just a few while the very many still get trodden on, I don’t rate it at all.

            • Tracey 4.1.1.2.1.1
              22 May 2014 at 11:54 am

              nah, you avoided the question, which is your right.

              funny you should say no men are advocating on behalf of male rape victims cos its politically unfashionable. it was politically unfashionable to demand the vote, but women did it… same with sexual abuse and rape of children.

            • greywarbler 4.1.1.2.1.2
              22 May 2014 at 6:33 pm

              Is there a term CV for the often feminist derailing of discussions of wide social problems? Something like Ware feminist heist WFH?

              The instant hostility accompanied by well-worn argument that fits every case is notable. It’s as bad as the results of criticising anything relating to superannuitants?. The entitlement to self-absorption is great. And a morning of silence will be held (from non-feminist commenters).

  5. bad12 5
    22 May 2014 at 8:05 am

    Now there’s a good idea for the Wellington City Council to emulate, the Auckland Council is trialling the collection of food-waste from households so as to short-circuit its inclusion into its landfills,

    Not that i plan on putting out the scraps, all of mine and that of one of my neighbour’s goes into my gardens to ensure a healthy grow for the year,

    Lolz, with bins full of them in the street i will have a much boosted supply to choose from, no meat scraps please people they bring around the pesky Rats, Cats and Dogs to dig around in the garden looking for a free feed….

    • Rosie 5.1
      22 May 2014 at 10:17 am

      Yes, that is a grand idea bad12. I once heard a promoter of sustainable living say that 90% of the methane that emanates from landfill comes from kitchen waste. An excellent reason to compost right there.

      Our vego only compost bin has a wee mouse living in it. I think it is multiplying, as there is another mouse living in the woodpile in the garage, since wee mousey set up home in the compost.

      • bad12 5.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 10:34 am

        Lolz Rosie, i made that mistake once a long time ago, left the cute wee mouse to do it’s thing coz it wasn’t really doing any harm, said mice turned out to be Ma and Pa Mouses and shortly afterwards i discovered much to my surprise Mr and Mrs mouses four offspring in my wheat-bix packet,

        Yeah having the garden to compost it in saves both me and the neighbor a bit on rubbish bags, there will be a downside for Wellington Councils if they go for composting tho, in the future the elaborate set up in the tips to capture and burn that methane to generate electricity wont work so well…

      • Colonial Viper 5.1.2
        22 May 2014 at 10:38 am

        Yes, that is a grand idea bad12. I once heard a promoter of sustainable living say that 90% of the methane that emanates from landfill comes from kitchen waste. An excellent reason to compost right there.

        Dunedin city generates electricity from its landfill methane.

        • Rob 5.1.2.1
          22 May 2014 at 1:01 pm

          Extracting methane and burning it to produce electricy and heat water is a well adopted co-gen technology in landfills . Been in use for over 40 years at least.

          • Rosie 5.1.2.1.1
            22 May 2014 at 1:56 pm

            But that isn’t to say we should make efforts to reduce our waste and use it more efficiently………….? Not all landfills have methane electricity production technology do they?

            We also have to consider how much space we are taking up in landfills with kitchen waste. With up to 40% of our domestic waste being made up of compostable kitchen scraps, seems foolish to bury it when we can re use it.

            And speaking of green technology the Mill Creek Windfarm construction is going ahead in leaps and bounds. It is a sight to behold from my living room window.

  6. Rosie 6
    22 May 2014 at 8:20 am

    Radio Active interviewing Grant Robertson and Alistair Thompson now. (Suggested listening yesterday, Open Mike ) 88.6fm in Wellington or listen on line at http://www.radioactive.fm/

    Discussing GCSB

  7. phillip ure 7
    22 May 2014 at 8:25 am

    a heads-up for those ‘best-bits’ producers..

    ..tvone just had a cross to the homicide-scene in ranui..

    ..and when the reporter ..after describing the grim/dire sequence of events..threw back to ‘rawdy’…

    ..’rawdy’ said:..’thanks chris..!..fan-tast-ic..!’…(big beaming smile and all..)

    ..surely he deserves some sort of unawareness/cloth-ear-award for that one..?

    • Rosie 7.1
      22 May 2014 at 9:04 am

      phillip, instead of watching that headache inducing breakfast tv, you could have been listening to the very interesting half hour interview above. 15 mins of which covered Campbells Fletcher/Clapper/GCSB show on Tuesday night, our increasing surveillance society, 10 seconds of saying goodbye to Shane Jones, charter schools, helping babies and children of beneficiaries and Grant Robertson owing up to the mistakes of the past (excluding beneficiaries from WFF) etc etc.

      Do you provide that breakfast show with feedback on how appalling and insensitive they are?

      • phillip ure 7.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 9:25 am

        re feedback:..as they monitor social media/this place etc..i am sure they do..

        ..a couple of weeks back..’rawdy’ said/read out..(with a tone of astonishment/disbelief..)

        ..’someone has even said that i am ‘a neo-lib-apologist’..’

        ..that had a bit of a whiff of the whoar about it…

        ..(and i don’t sit and watch breakfast tv..it is going in the background..

        ..as i find/compile the stories/links for whoar…)

        ..and did robertson say anything that reassured you/gave you cause for optimism..?..)

        • Rosie 7.1.1.1
          22 May 2014 at 10:10 am

          Well phil, maybe they did sniff the wind and smell your criticism – I’m guessing a term such as “neo lib apologist” wouldn’t be a mainstay in their vocab. That show, it sounds dire.

          There wasn’t anything in today’s interview that stood out as changing my feelings in terms of optimism, although I am reassured somewhat by Grant Robertson’s genuine concern about our increasingly surveilled (is that a word?) society and Labour’s commitment to providing for ALL NZ kids. Today he was mainly on the attack towards to the PM about his approach to foreign policy and the way he has manipulated the changes at the GCSB.

          I’ve been listening to the show for years so it’s not like theres any one interview where you respond with a “YES!”, it’s more of a slow boil and a way of gauging the over all views and subtle changes in views. I have noticed that he was sometimes on the back foot but in the past 5 months or so he has been really clear on where he and Labour stand.It sounds like there’s some good momentum and confidence now where previously it sounded like he was at a bit of standstill. (during the Goff and Shearer times) He has acknowledged quite humbly Labour’s mistakes, eg, the example above.

          It’s great to listen to Alistair Thompson too. He came to the show awhile ago at a point sometime after where Chris Finlayson, who was then standing for Nat for Wgtn Central, refused to come on the show any more. He just wanted to talk about all the “good work” he was doing for Treaty negotiations and Redbird Jnr just kept trying to hold him to account for all the Government’s failings. They were just at loggerheads and it was a fruitless exercise.

          Without Finlayson and with Alistair Thompson instead you get a good show. I find it insightful.

  8. bad12 8
    22 May 2014 at 8:36 am

    Welcome to the Parliament the newest MP, Labour’s Kelvin Davis, the bar is exceptionally low as far as bettering His predecessor goes so it should be a breeze for Kelvin to achieve far far more than His predecessor accomplished…

    • Tiger Mountain 8.1
      22 May 2014 at 9:23 am

      Yep, nice to see Jones going well before the Election but his brand of egotism could well see him surface again in some spoiler role to annoy the Labour party.

      • phillip ure 8.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 10:16 am

        the person who impersonates a political reporter on prime news..

        ..she issued a jaw-dropper yesterday..

        ..saying labour ‘is losing one of its’ more liberal members’..

        ..did she actually mean to say ‘neo-lib’..?

        .(‘cos even jones admitted yesterday that he ‘is rightwing’..)

        ..or is she just so doorknob-like unaware/ignorant of the political-realities..?

        ..i dunno which answer wd be worst..

        ..for political-journalism..

  9. Chooky 9
    22 May 2014 at 9:04 am

    From the Daily Blog…Frank Macskasy

    “National – self-censoring embarrassing statements?

    There is disturbing activity taking place on National’s website. The Party is self-censoring itself and quietly, without fuss, removing certain embarrassing information from it’s website….

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/05/22/national-self-censoring-embarrassing-statements/

    –

  10. phillip ure 10
    22 May 2014 at 9:19 am

    (this is (kinda) funny..)

    “..FBI ‘weed’ problem in cyber-war..”

    ..The bureau is struggling to hire young hackers –

    because its long-standing drug policy does not allow the use of marijuana.

    Unfortunately – hackers like their weed.

    “I have to hire a great work force to compete with those cyber criminals –

    and some of those kids want to smoke weed on the way to the interview” –
    FBI Director James B. Comey told a White Collar Crime Institute conference on Monday..”

    (cont..)

    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/fbi-weed-problem-in-cyberwar-9409739.html

    • Tiger Mountain 10.1
      22 May 2014 at 9:28 am

      what says the bureau on staff using nicotine, caffeine, alcohol, prescription medicines, ‘32 ounce sodas’ and sitting at work stations with a gut full of decaying high cholesterol junk food?

      still they are in a bind it seems with their young stoners… a nice quandary for them

      • Colonial Viper 10.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 10:40 am

        oxycontin nice legal drug

        of course prescription drug abuse in the USA is way more prevalent than illicit drugs

        as long as what you are using profits a corporate they care about it much less…

        • Lanthanide 10.1.1.1
          22 May 2014 at 12:06 pm

          Which gives a clear route to legalisation of drugs. I guess anyone attempting this would have to battle both the pharmaceutical companies and alcohol/cigarette companies, in addition to public opinion.

    • The Lone Haranguer 10.2
      22 May 2014 at 11:04 am

      I read recently that some “expert” is claiming that weed can cure cancer, and mugs all over the interweb are taking it as the gospel truth..

      Just to let you know, Bob Marley is calling bullshit on that one.

      • bad12 10.2.1
        22 May 2014 at 11:17 am

        Yes someone linked to an article the other week from a doctor Tashkin which extolled the virtues of marijuana in such a way,

        The subjects of these tests which were said to have shown positive results were of course not humans but a bunch of furry little critters, first fed with various cancers and then fed with various amounts of dope,(definitely not an ethical means of introducing medical marijuana into a debate),

        To give the ‘link’ a little credit it did then go on to list quite a few downsides to the use of marijuana including a propensity for smokers of the stuff to exhibit pre-cancerous conditions in their airways,

        There seems to be other ingredients in Marijuana’s chemical makeup other than the THC which gets us stoned that have some medical benefit which are worth exploring…

      • phillip ure 10.2.2
        22 May 2014 at 11:39 am

        the weed/curing cancer evidence isn’t recent/new..

        http://whoar.co.nz/?s=cannabis+cancer

  11. Sanctuary 11
    22 May 2014 at 9:32 am

    hey hey! I see Pete George is spreading his special kind of love on Public Address now, any bets on how long the Republic of Grey Lynn will tolerate him before he gets a DCM email?

    I’m giving him a week, two at the outside.

    • greywarbler 11.1
      22 May 2014 at 6:56 pm

      No PG – it’s like a balmy summer’s day, with him around it’s a barmy winter’s day.

  12. Once was Tim 12
    22 May 2014 at 10:11 am

    China is describing the US as a ‘mincing rascal’ and a ‘high-level hooligan’

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/technology/digital-living/60072881/us-a-mincing-rascal-china-says-over-hacking.html

    I’d have thought the former was a more apt description of Dear Leader

    • bad12 12.1
      22 May 2014 at 11:05 am

      Just listened to an interview on Nine to Noon that has me agreeing with the comment above this morning decrying the content of the current RadioNZ National,

      Some author who’s name i didn’t remember banging on endlessly about ”Chinese spying” elicited a big Yawn and had my ears switch off after 5 minutes as i concentrated on a far more productive activity,(the kitchen ceilings annual wash),

      Talk about unbalanced BUT, expect to hear this sort of mind wash to develop even further as attitudes harden with Russia and China signing yesterday an economic pact over the supply of gas which will result in a pipeline being built from Russia across China,

      As a contrast to this news of the energy rich Russia reaching this deal with China effectively allowing the Russians to wave a big middle finger at ”sanctions” imposed by ”the West” a story in the Herald this morning highlighted the fact that Shale oil will not be as big a boon for the US as first thought,

      Using current methods the expected extraction of shale oil has now dropped in total from 1.6 billion barrels to 600 million,

      On energy, the wind type an item of interest i forgot to comment upon was a ”new” means of generating electricity from wind in the herald the other day, this device is said to only need wind speeds as light as 3 kilometers an hour to produce viable electricity as opposed to the wind towers that need a wind speed of at least 13 K,

      The way of the future perhaps, if those maddened by their addiction to fossil fuels don’t fry us all in some future ”energy war” that is…

      • Gosman 12.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 11:12 am

        Apparently the US has oil technology that no other nation has access to so Russian oil extraction will soon collapse.

        • bad12 12.1.1.1
          22 May 2014 at 11:25 am

          Apparently Gosman you cling to stupid arguments that will result in your brain soon collapsing, your insertion of this comment in this particular piece of this mornings discussion is simply the actions of one attempting Diversion as a means of debate,

          The short version of the above is F-off to the sewer and play your stupid games of low level intelligence…

          • framu 12.1.1.1.1
            22 May 2014 at 12:22 pm

            “F-off to the sewer and play your stupid games of low level intelligence…”
            \
            glad someone said it

      • Colonial Viper 12.1.2
        22 May 2014 at 12:30 pm

        Using current methods the expected extraction of shale oil has now dropped in total from 1.6 billion barrels to 600 million,

        yes the extractable amount and extraction rate sustainability was always highly over-hyped as a way of drawing in massive initial investments from unwary money – hence the ‘shale oil bubble’. It also fit in well with politicians’ narratives that America was going to become “energy independent” at long last. Everyone had a reason for playing along with the myth.

        However one can’t fool Mother Nature and physical realities have set in, and with them financial realities. A lot of shale oil plays have breakeven pricing at over $90/barrel.

      • greywarbler 12.1.3
        22 May 2014 at 6:52 pm

        China is describing the US as a ‘mincing rascal’ and a ‘high-level hooligan’
        I like this fresh style of invective – so don’t belittle Chinese efforts. We try out all sorts of new descriptions here and why get bogged down in the verbal hegemony of the west.

        • Murray Olsen 12.1.3.1
          22 May 2014 at 8:55 pm

          We don’t want to be verbiose running dogs of western verbal hegemony. Pete George already has that role covered.

          Seriously though, the insults a people use can give us small insights into their culture. A Kiwi/Chinese colleague told me that most of the insults used by new immigrants were about family poverty. This immediately made me think that they would quickly develop links with NAct and now they have. (Gross generalisation, but proof by anecdote requires that.)

          A Russian colleague told me many Russian insults were about sex with someone’s mother, so I think we can expect to see Jamie Whyte encouraging Russian immigration.

          • greywarbler 12.1.3.1.1
            22 May 2014 at 9:16 pm

            Very amusing MO. I notice that about many immigrants. After making the big leap, they want to get on to feathering their own nests. Welfare begins at home to them. They can be quite cutting about us trying to do the right thing by indigenous people.

            Thinking about nests I looked up godwits and they are just so amazing. We should think of reducing our numbers to ensure that there is room for these creatures more wonderful than us.

            Beringia is where the godwits begin their journey. This outcrop of land where Asia and America nearly touch is a global cross roads, a springboard for millions of migratory birds of a variety of species. Just to name a few mingling with the bar–tailed godwits bound for New Zealand, are Hudsonian godwits aiming for Tierra del Fuego; Arctic warblers which migrate to the Philippines; Wilson’s warblers which fly to Central America; fox sparrows and golden-crowned sparrows that winter in Pacific coastal woodlands, and gray-cheeked thrushes that travel to the Amazon; northern wheatears traveling across Asia for wintering grounds in Africa, and Swainson’s thrushes moving south to the equatorial forests of Venezuela and Brazil. Approximately one-quarter of the world’s shorebirds breed in tundra and boreal habitats of the arctic and sub-arctic. These habitats provide well-camouflaged nesting sites for these ground-nesting species, and the abundance of invertebrates following snow-melt provides the conditions for rapid chick growth during a very short season.

            A team of researchers headed by Robert Gill Jr. of the U.S. Geological Survey Alaska Science Center in Anchorage implanted tiny satellite trackers in female godwits near the Alaska coast. Prior to their southward migration, the godwits eat up large, until up to 55 per cent of their body weight is fat. They then reduce the size of their gut, kidney and liver by up to 25 per cent to compensate for the added weight. The scientists think that the birds reshuffle proteins in their bodies before they set out and that this allows them to reduce the size of their food-processing organs. Stuffed with fuel, the godwits are ready for the air. Assessing the weather patterns in Alaska, the team found that the godwits timed their departures to coincide with favorable tail winds that helped them fly south. “All birds took off with favorable winds,” says Gill, who added that tail winds caught in Alaska can shoot these birds 3,000 to 5,000 kilometers. “Some birds get shot almost to Hawaii,” says Gill. Scientists don’t know how the godwits assess weather patterns or navigate. What’s more, the satellite trackers can’t measure altitudes — the birds could be skimming the ocean or flying thousands of feet above the surface, says Gill.

            A female bar–tailed godwit, implanted with a tiny satellite tracker, lifted off from her Alaskan breeding ground and flew south 11,680 kilometers, nonstop, until she reached her winter home in New Zealand. Called E7 by the scientists who monitored her, she flew more than eight days without food, water or rest, on the longest direct flight by a bird ever documented – See more at: http://www.nzbirds.com/birds/kuaka.html#sthash.5LfsiwQA.dpuf

        • North 12.1.3.2
          22 May 2014 at 10:06 pm

          GreyWarbler @ 12.1.13……..are we talking ShonKey Python here or what ?

          • greywarbler 12.1.3.2.1
            23 May 2014 at 10:35 am

            North
            Could be..could be. Just a bit of discursion? flying away from the original about immigrants looking after No.1 rather than joining in the nation’s zeitgeist. Then I got onto feathering their nests and took off with the amazing tale of the bar tailed godwit. Makes a difference from the usual kittens on youtube.

      • Draco T Bastard 12.1.4
        23 May 2014 at 2:39 am

        California’s Shale Fail: The Case of 13 Billion Barrels of Missing Oil

        On May 21 the Los Angeles Times reported that “Federal energy authorities have slashed by 96% the estimated amount of recoverable oil buried in California’s vast Monterey Shale deposits, deflating its potential as a national ‘black gold mine’ of petroleum.” The EIA had already downgraded its technically recoverable reserves estimate for the Monterey from 15.4 to 13.7 billion barrels; now it was reducing the number to a paltry 0.6 billion barrels.

        So much for the US oil boom that was going to save us and make renewable energy irrelevant that the RWNJs had been telling us enthusiastically about for the last few years. Seems to have gone up in a puff of reality.

  13. AB 13
    22 May 2014 at 10:40 am

    An Open Letter to Tony Astle

    Dear Tony,
    17 years ago my wife an I had our wedding reception at your very fine restaurant. However, on reading in the Herald yesterday that you may ban David Cunliffe from Antoine’s for no reason other than being leader of the Labour Party, I have a confession to make.

    17 years ago I neglected to tell you that we are Labour voters. I apologise for sullying your fine establishment with unacceptable opinions. In mitigation of this offence I can only say that at no point during the evening were our opinions expressed, so there was no risk of us contaminating other diners or any of your staff.

    I know this is a weak excuse, so I think the best thing would be for you to retrospectively ban us from Antoine’s and return the approximately $3,000 we paid you. When you pop the cheque in the mail, could you kindly ensure that it is addressed to the individual named at the bottom of this letter, and not to the National Party.

    Warmest regards
    AB

    • newsense 13.1
      22 May 2014 at 12:44 pm

      So everyone is questioning Linda Clark and not the bestie of Collins who keeps pumping this stuff out…

    • Blue 13.2
      22 May 2014 at 2:41 pm

      Certainly AB, I’ll refund your money when you return the product we provided in its original condition. I will deduct 15% because you’re so fucking boring.
      Love
      Tony.

      • North 13.2.1
        22 May 2014 at 10:19 pm

        Original condition ? Very well. Vomit to Vomit. Turd to Turd.

        15%………that’s not to answer the GST heist is it ?

  14. Tiger Mountain 14
    22 May 2014 at 10:55 am

    Astle is exactly the type of Tory maggot whose establishment should be banned for good as a return favour. Not that ‘Parnhell’ is exactly a Labour enclave. Knew he was dodgy from the time it was made public that Antoines actually served tripe! Surprising how many restaurants a left supporter might not like to eat at if they knew the owners political bent.

    • Gosman 14.1
      22 May 2014 at 11:10 am

      You let your political ideology restrict your choice of eating establishments do you? Rather limiting move if you do I would suggest.

      • robertguyton 14.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 11:21 am

        Rats will eat anything, anywhere.

      • bad12 14.1.2
        22 May 2014 at 11:35 am

        i sure as hell wouldn’t spend my money in any establishment that i knew funded the National Party in any way…

        • fender 14.1.2.1
          22 May 2014 at 12:32 pm

          +1 Bad12

          Not only that it would put one off the overpriced food having to suffer being around Gosman/Srylands/Key clones..

        • Blue 14.1.2.2
          22 May 2014 at 2:42 pm

          You couldn’t afford them, so it would hardly be a choice.

          • Murray Olsen 14.1.2.2.1
            22 May 2014 at 9:04 pm

            I ate at Antoine’s once. It was nothing special, but then NActoids base their taste on the price column of the menu anyway. Mind you, I was shouted by a working girl I knew, so I didn’t pay.

            • Draco T Bastard 14.1.2.2.1.1
              23 May 2014 at 2:43 am

              It was nothing special, but then NActoids base their taste on the price column of the menu anyway.

              Yep, been thinking the same thing.

      • framu 14.1.3
        22 May 2014 at 12:25 pm

        astle lets it restrict you will pay him to eat there though – strange you are more focused on distraction – again

      • Draco T Bastard 14.1.4
        22 May 2014 at 3:58 pm

        And yet you say nothing about Atsle restricting his customers because of his political ideology?

        You don’t see your hypocrisy do you? Of course not, that would be another defining characteristic of a RWNJ.

      • North 14.1.5
        22 May 2014 at 10:31 pm

        It’s not the tucker, GooseMan Fool, it’s the people you find there. Farting foie gras is vile. Mopped up by the P’Astle mo’ of the bro’ who runs the sho’. It’s shocking to watch.

    • Johnm 14.2
      22 May 2014 at 11:39 am

      Hi Gosman
      Do you realise that you are the standard’s school cert level simple simon right wing pet? You afford light relief for serious contributors to have a snigger at regularly? have a nice day, mate!

      • Gosman 14.2.1
        22 May 2014 at 11:57 am

        There are serious contributors on this thread ?!? Do tell who they might be as I haven’t spotted any.

    • tc 14.3
      22 May 2014 at 12:42 pm

      Antiones screams ‘old money establishment’ projecting its insecure owners psyche like similar joints around inner akl channelling those class divides from the old country.

      Been there done that, overpriced and olde world with very snooty floor staff for those who enjoy the feeling of superiority and smugness.

      Little wonder JK’s a regular.

      • North 14.3.1
        22 May 2014 at 10:39 pm

        And at last look, P’Astle drives an aged old RR.

        Like a crazy old queen stuck in the 30s.

        Still pinching the GST.

        For the ShonKeyAss.

  15. captain hook 15
    22 May 2014 at 11:39 am

    +1
    and just read an old quote from richard griifin,”radio new zealand is staffed by a gang of sad little lefties”.
    now the that griffin is in charge it has become a gang of very very sad little whining righties.
    gluon spinelesser and suzy fungus are the worst suckups and kissarses that have ever whined over the airwaves of our proud nation.

    • Tracey 15.1
      22 May 2014 at 12:04 pm

      is that the griffin who recently was employed to work for the prime minister

    • tc 15.2
      22 May 2014 at 12:48 pm

      Sad little lefties like Mora, Crump, Laidlaw…LOL.

    • Gosman 15.3
      22 May 2014 at 12:59 pm

      Does Richard Griffin have any say so over the hiring decisions for New staff at Radio NZ National?

      • phillip ure 15.3.1
        22 May 2014 at 3:17 pm

        as in all organisations..those doing the actual hiring will ‘know’ what their bosses want..

        ..if they don’t ..they won’t have that hiring-job for long..

        ..the control doesn’t need to be formalised

        ..you have quite a simple/literal way of looking at things..don’t you gossy..?

        ..pretty much a nuance-free zone there..eh..?

      • Tracey 15.3.2
        22 May 2014 at 4:56 pm

        you mean like john key being involved in the selection of the head of the gcsb, but then forgetting?

      • Puddleglum 15.3.3
        22 May 2014 at 10:23 pm

        If Griffin is ‘chair of the board’ then I guess he had some say over appointing Paul Thompson (ex Press editor, ex Fairfax chief editor) as CEO of National Radio.

        If you ever read Paul Thompson’s editorials in The Press (over anything economic or party political) you’ll know Paul is hardly a sad little leftie.

        (In fact, the interesting thing about the economically focused and party political editorials in The Press over the last three editors – Paul Thompson, Anthony Holden and Jane (?) Norris – is that they all have had exactly the same discursive style, used the same rhetorical devices and, of course, have expressed the same political leanings. Very odd that. Almost as if they have been written by the same person despite a changing of the guard in the editor’s office.)

  16. Tracey 16
    22 May 2014 at 11:59 am

    police interview with john banks played in court today. excerpts available are worth reading.

    of additional note is his last comment about not going for supercity mayor again, especially if he knew he would lose.

    http://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10072385/No-actual-knowledge-of-Dotcom-Sky-City-donations-Banks

    national shooting association is laying a complaint against collins for discharge of a firearm without being registered to do so.

    • North 16.1
      22 May 2014 at 10:46 pm

      Judge Judy is registered though not yet certified. Please dolt……some respect for your betters !

    • Rosie 17.1
      22 May 2014 at 5:39 pm

      Hey fender.

      This Nat candidate was in the news a few weeks ago, at the same time as Todd Barclay but he was totally overshadowed by the Barclay furore. Interesting that fearfux are running the story again but in more depth. Funny, because, by doing so they are drawing attention to Nat’s highly questionable morally bankrupt candidates. Usually when National and/or the Government are doing something dodgy they report it but kind of mumble and walk off. This time they’ve amplified it. Check out the comments too, a major turnaround for Stuffed commenters.

      Those two blokes could be carbon copies of one another.

      • fender 17.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 7:06 pm

        Hey Rosie, oh I thought the difference was that he’s been confirmed as the Hutt South candidate now, not merely a contender.

        Like you say, these two kids are a couple of clones, maybe they were able to get extra funds from their previous employer via a cabinet club smoke up session.

        It’s great watching the comments on stuffed and other sites changing to an anti Nat tune, helps to keep the spirits up while enduring this painful regime.

        Keep up your great efforts to rid Ohariu of the Dunney 🙂

        • Rosie 17.1.1.1
          22 May 2014 at 7:46 pm

          Lol, I didn’t realise “I coulda been a contender” was only a contender at that point.

          I’ll have a chat to my friend who lives in Wainuiomata and see what they’ve all got to say about the cancer promo guy. I’m sure him and his friends will think he’s a big joke.

          Thanks for your support on Dunney. All of us living in this electorate need to pull out all the stops to get the long drop filled in and decommissioned. For the country!!!

  18. Rosie 18
    22 May 2014 at 1:45 pm

    Hi Stephanie, are you around today?

    Hey, I could do with a hand from the Labour campaign team in fighting off ultra retarded RWNJ’s in the local paper in our Ohariu electorate.

    I am trying to wake up the sleepy little letters section (there isn’t really one) by submitting letters in response to Dunne activity, Ginny Anderson news and the Nat twerp, Brett Hudson. It’s a bit lonely and a concerted Left effort in the letters section might give this Pro Dunne, conservative rag a bit of a wake up slap. We need to get the upper hand. Whaddya reckon?

    In the meantime I have written a response with actual facts that should put the RWNJ contributor firmly in their place, easy enough of course but many versus one would be better than one versus one.

  19. joe90 19
    22 May 2014 at 2:18 pm

    Amid the doom and gloom this says it all:

    In a neoliberal universe, where markets are the gauge of value, money becomes, more straightforwardly than ever before, the measure of all things. If hospitals, schools and prisons can be privatised as enterprises for profit, why not political office too?

    http://www.lrb.co.uk/v36/n10/perry-anderson/the-italian-disaster

    • Gosman 19.1
      22 May 2014 at 3:03 pm

      This is hardly the fault of neo-liberalism. Politicians doing favours for money goes back thousands of years. The Romans were notorious for it.

      • RedLogix 19.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 3:08 pm

        The ‘neo’ in neo-liberalism is a clue…

      • Draco T Bastard 19.1.2
        22 May 2014 at 4:28 pm

        You saying that just proves that RWNJs haven’t learned a damn thing in 1500 years. Of course, when we look at that study, it’s actually 5000+ years as civilisation has been collapsing from the hubris of the rich in all of recorded history.

        • Tracey 19.1.2.1
          22 May 2014 at 5:25 pm

          remember someone posted on here the other day that capitalism only arrived in india in 1991, so some of these posters cant be trusted on history

          • Once was Tim 19.1.2.1.1
            24 May 2014 at 4:16 pm

            +1
            …. and I don’t expect that person was an Indian from whatever his/her ancestry. Nor do I suspect they’ve actually lived and breathed amongst any!

  20. grumpy 20
    22 May 2014 at 3:15 pm

    Looks like KDC, his estranged wife and the security guard didn’t take enough time to get their stories in order……………..

    • mickysavage 20.1
      22 May 2014 at 3:20 pm

      I would be more worried if they had their stories perfectly matched. Human beings remember things differently and some disagreement about the odd detail is not an unusual occurrence.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 20.2
      22 May 2014 at 3:25 pm

      It would be far more suspicious if they had, and all gave exactly the same evidence. The fact is human memory is unreliable, at this remove it’s no wonder theirs differ.

      The judge knows this, even if you don’t. I hope sentencing is carried out just before lunch.

      Edit. Snap! MS

    • Tracey 20.3
      22 May 2014 at 5:00 pm

      is this the wayne tempero that many on the right posted here probably leaked who had been visiting the dotcom mansion? cos you would think a simple recant yesterday would have done the job, but no, his recollection aligns with dotcoms…

      then theres banksies police interview today… skycity say they gave the cheque to banksie, banksie says… wait for it… he doesnt remember getting a cheque from them.

    • Anne 21.1
      22 May 2014 at 4:59 pm

      Also from Stuff…

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/10073284/Cunliffe-attacks-PM-over-spy-agency

      He calls Key “a liar” and “we should get rid of him”.

      • Tracey 21.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 5:06 pm

        good for him. let the public decide if it is plausible the pm attended discussions about unsuitable candidates to head gcsb, suggested fletcher and had rennies agreement that key contact fletcher but forgot. i call a big BS on that.

        i think what the pm couldnt remember whether he needed to lie about it or not = default position lie

        pm said had to buy bmws cos labour had locked them in = untrue

        blip cover the list that so many choose to ignore.

        now cunliffe needs to tell people that if the pm cant recall contacting someone to head one of his two portfolios he is treating everyone as fools.

      • Chooky 21.1.2
        22 May 2014 at 5:16 pm

        +100….sounds very good Anne

        …Cunliffe’s fighting talk and pitching it home to John Key and the NACTS on Key’s lies and Nacts betrayal of New Zealanders and poor economic performance

      • karol 21.1.3
        22 May 2014 at 5:36 pm

        Has anyone claimed this, as in the Stuff article:

        Key yesterday branded TV3 television presenter John Campbell a conspiracy theorist over claims that Fletcher, who was shoulder-tapped by Key to head the bureau, was hired to help facilitate the FBI raid on Kim Dotcom’s mansion.

        I don’t think such claims were made in this week’s Campbell Live. I have always thought Fletcher’s appointment was part of a shift to focus on “economic terrorism” and support for the big corproates – protection of didgital “rights” on behalf of media such as the Hollywood Studios is part of that – surveillance and arrest of Dotcom was one isntance of the broader aim.

        • Anne 21.1.3.1
          22 May 2014 at 6:39 pm

          Has anyone claimed this, as in the Stuff article:..

          Don’t believe so.

          Either the author of the Stuff article stuffed up big time which is par for the course for so many in the MSM or…

          Key is misrepresenting the material highlighted in the C.L. programme which is equally par for the course for him.

          • karol 21.1.3.1.1
            22 May 2014 at 6:43 pm

            But then, why would Key bother, given that the MSM had largely ignored the Campbell Live programme. Could it be the programme pointed to something else? Something that Cunliffe picked up on and was saying to Key “I know where you are vulnerable on this issue…and it aint so much to do with Dotom.”?

            An the main focuses of the CL programme weren’t really KDC. They were US-NZ relations, and the appointment and start date of Ian Fletcher, and the meetings that led up to that.

            • Anne 21.1.3.1.1.1
              22 May 2014 at 7:16 pm

              Fascinating karol. I think you might be on to something.

              I was surprised and a bit perplexed at Cunliffe’s warning to Key to be careful what he says, but it would fit in nicely with your interpretation that Cunliffe is saying “I know where you are vulnerable on this issue…and it aint so much to do with Dotcom.”?

              I love a political mystery. 🙂

              • karol …
                22 May 2014 at 7:31 pm

                Given the programme makers know how far they can go without out putting their existence under threat…. what if the programme was designed to point in a specific direction, without making an accusation?

                • veutoviper …
                  22 May 2014 at 8:15 pm

                  Karol – I think you have nailed it IMO.

                  The CL programme was very carefully crafted’ again IMO with a lot of legal input. It just pointed towards the joining of the dots; it did not make any specific accusations or conclusions. And its goes well beyond KDC. That might have been the starting point; but KDC in some respects has now become irrelevant (to a degree). It is all about Key’s ‘truthfulness’ or otherwise; and what he is seeking to achieve (or that of the people who really pull his strings).

                  • karol …
                    22 May 2014 at 8:24 pm

                    It’s also about the changing role of the GCSB, and it’s role in the 5 Eyes, and in relation to that, NZ’s relationship to the US.

                    And it’s about why Key wanted Fletcher for the job, and why he organised several meetings with Fletcher prior to taking up the GCSB role, etc.

                    • Anne …
                      22 May 2014 at 8:44 pm

                      It’s been my suspicion for some time that Fletcher was groomed for a special role within the 5 Eyes arrangement before he returned to NZ. I also suspect that role has not got a lot to do with our security considerations. And if I’m right then Key knows all about it and is happy for NZ to be used in such a way.

                      So, what does he get in return?

                    • Anne …
                      22 May 2014 at 8:55 pm

                      Oh well, I can answer my own question. He gets to have palsy walsy conversations and golf games with the American president. In other words, special privileges. All good for the re-election campaign.

                    • marty mars …
                      22 May 2014 at 9:01 pm

                      i was surprised by how lightly they stepped around key – almost like the program was about fletcher. I certainly think the whole knot gets untied when fletcher is pulled.

                    • karol …
                      22 May 2014 at 9:30 pm

                      This on Techday

                      And Grant Robertson’s question to PM’s proxy today.

                      And Joyce chose a fairly novel way to avoid answering any further questions.

      • Martin 21.1.4
        22 May 2014 at 9:09 pm

        all uses of the words Liar and Lies have been expunged.

    • Chooky 21.2
      22 May 2014 at 5:18 pm

      @ phillip ure

      great news!…together the Mana Party and the Internet Party could be a force to be reckoned with!

  22. ScottGN 22
    22 May 2014 at 5:51 pm

    It’s not just us of course.
    Todays editorial from the Globe and Mail in Toronto calls for a Royal Commission on spying.
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/editorials/we-need-a-royal-commission-on-spying/article18786038/

  23. ianmac 23
    22 May 2014 at 6:32 pm

    “Today’s New Zealand Roy Morgan Poll shows a gain in support for National (45.5%, up 3%) now back ahead of a potential Labour/Greens alliance (44%, down 1.5%).

    Support for Key’s Coalition partners is little changed with the Maori Party 1% (unchanged), ACT NZ (0.5%, unchanged) and United Future 0% (down 0.5%).

    Support has fallen for the Opposition with the Labour Party down 0.5% to 30.5%, the Greens down 1% to 13.5%, New Zealand First 6% (unchanged), Mana Party 1% (unchanged). Support for the Conservative Party of NZ is 1% (up 0.5%) and the Internet Party is now at 0.5% (down 1%).

    If a National Election were held now the latest New Zealand Roy Morgan Poll shows that the result would be too close to call and would largely depend on who New Zealand First decided to support.

    The latest NZ Roy Morgan Government Confidence Rating has fallen to 132pts (down 3.5pts) with 60% (down 2%) of New Zealanders saying New Zealand is ‘heading in the right direction’ compared to 28% (up 1.5%) that say New Zealand is ‘heading in the wrong direction’.”

    • ianmac 23.1
      22 May 2014 at 6:34 pm

      It does sort of confirm the previous poll by Morgan.

      • Anne 23.1.1
        22 May 2014 at 6:48 pm

        Its so much inside the margin of error there could – in reality – be a small net gain for the opposition parties and a small net loss for the govt. parties.

  24. Don't worry be happy 24
    22 May 2014 at 6:51 pm

    Umm….not sure where to put this observation…but tonight was watching TV3 news cover of Bank’s trial..The camera lingered on him as he dug into his ear, removed…something….looked at it…then put it in his mouth. Yuck.

  25. Ergo Robertina 25
    22 May 2014 at 7:01 pm

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/technology/news/article.cfm?c_id=5&objectid=11259165

    Sue Kedgley, former Green MP, now on the board of Consumer New Zealand, calls for the Government to adopt sensible measures to minimise the effects of electromagnetic exposure in an opinion piece published in the Herald today.

    ‘[The Govt] should also review our out-dated standard on electromagnetic radiation, which is one of the most permissive in the world, and set up an independent body to evaluate the health risks of electromagnetic radiation.’

  26. Draco T Bastard 26
    22 May 2014 at 8:04 pm

    America Dumbs Down

    The U.S. is being overrun by a wave of anti-science, anti-intellectual thinking. Has the most powerful nation on Earth lost its mind?

    Yes, yes it has.

    • Martin 26.1
      22 May 2014 at 9:13 pm

      yes Draco. back to the early 1980’s when the Reagans got into the White House.

  27. captain hook 27
    22 May 2014 at 8:20 pm

    has john key resigned yet?
    has he legalised pot?
    has he ever done anything useful?
    when is he going back to where he came from?

  28. Jenny 28
    22 May 2014 at 8:34 pm

    President Obama says that he is fortunate that he doesn’t have to face a crisis as great or greater than that faced by FDR or Lincoln.

    “I think we are fortunate at the moment that we do not face a crisis of the scale and scope that Lincoln or FDR faced.”

    Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/a-call-to-arms-an-invitation-to-demand-action-on-climate-change-20140521#ixzz32QlGqCyM
    Follow us: @rollingstone on Twitter | RollingStone on Facebook

    The US President may choose not face it, but climate change is the greatest threat that humanity has ever faced.

  29. karol 29
    22 May 2014 at 8:36 pm

    Does the Kingdom of Hawaii still exist as a sovereign country? Is the US extracting taxes, and conducting other unlawful operations in Hawaii, in violation of international law?

    Whaddya think of that, Mr Key?

  30. xtasy 30
    22 May 2014 at 9:03 pm

    When even David Farrar on Kiwiblog finally sees the “light” and publishes this, some of us are WINNING:

    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2014/05/a_disabling_bug.html#comments

    “A disabling bug”
    “May 19th, 2014 at 7:00 am by David Farrar ”

    “Sarah Wilson writes in the Nelson Mail:”

    (See links provided)

    Farrar’s comment:
    “Sarah’s story is gripping, and as you read it I guess the reaction is that this could have happened to me – it was just a bug after all. Sarah has become an activist on welfare issues, after her frustrations with WINZ – which she wrote about here. WINZ has apologised for what happened.

    But it does highlight that there is a balancing act with welfare reforms, and how WINZ implements them. And we shouldn’t assume the balance is absolutely right. There are some on welfare who are able to work, and some of the measures introduced are necessary to target them.

    But there are also many on welfare who have had horrible things happen to them, and a system which makes them prove every x months they are still unable to work needs some flexibility and judgement involved.

    UPDATE: Sarah has written a sort of response to this blog, on her blog.”

    So read some of the comments, and some are actually confirming what our concern has been for years. The welfare reforms have been an attempt to push things beyond the acceptable boundaries, and here even a government supporting blogger now acknowledges this!!!

    I thought I let you know this, I am signing off again, as I have offended too many. I say sorry to Lprent, who I accused of being “corrupt”, but it was a rushed, unjustified comment, like a few others. I am just worked up on issues, like welfare, and the lot of sick and disabled, and I have a bit of a grudge against Labour and Helen Kelly. Maybe they will learn? I will speak my mind anyway.

    I feel some “wins” are made when even the government spinners are now conceding something in welfare may have gone over the top. That is worth noting, let us work on more achievements!!!

  31. North 31
    22 May 2014 at 9:57 pm

    You know you’re fucked when national television decides to run you eating your ear wax at your High Court trial. Oh Banksie Banksie Banksie………the wages of being an arsehole for ALL of your life !

  32. xtasy 32
    22 May 2014 at 10:31 pm

    Inti Illimani – El Pueblo Unido:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7F_9FEx7ymg

  33. xtasy 33
    22 May 2014 at 10:53 pm

    campbell Live dropped a damned bomb, I know of more to come, and John Key, the greatest lying PM we ever had, better watch out, he is on the line. The revolution goes on, it must go on, and the few feeble minded better take note:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86LSuXi5TLU
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2o83FQ1xTs

  34. xtasy 34
    22 May 2014 at 11:19 pm

    How good or bad can it ever get, this song is stuck in my brain forever:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPDixDqAUh0

  35. Penny Bright 35
    23 May 2014 at 12:04 am

    My reply to Cathy Odgers (Cactus Kate).

    FYI

    http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/05/court-reporting-public-gallery-circus-high-court-6/#more-137180

    “From the dead cat wearing rates avoider Penny Bright to the feral in front of me in the public gallery wearing socks with his jandals and track pants, I cannot help feeling sorry for John Banks having to put up with his career and legacy tried in front of a bunch of rabble. I do not particularly like John Banks as a politician, but no one deserves this….”

    errrr….I was actually wearing a beret Cathy?

    And I wouldn’t describe you as ‘rabble’ 🙂

    “Rates avoider Bright is allowed to harangue witnesses right down to the Hyatt Hotel. It is a scenario that awaits a Steve Braunias column.”

    errr….. to whom were you referring Cathy?

    “And David Fisher nice punk for informing the rates avoider Bright I was in attendance. The only ray of sunshine was that I got to say to her face what I had previously published. I don’t think she’s ever experienced that before.

    There is a first and a last time for everything.”

    What a wee SPINNER you are Cathy!

    My side of the story is that I recognised your face, and asked David Fisher if it was indeed ‘Cactus Kate’.

    He said it was and that your name was ‘Cathy’.

    You may recall that it was I who approached you, in Auckland High Court room 6, (before proceedings commenced), extended my hand and said “Hello Cathy – I’m Penny Bright – we haven’t yet met.”

    You looked VERY much like you didn’t want to shake my hand and – quite frankly – it was the most revolting handshake I have ever experienced (even worse than John Key’s – and that is saying something!).

    I then said words to the effect “Hypocritical rich prick? (Which is how you described me in this NBR article you wrote
    http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/rich-prick-doesnt-want-pay-rates-ck-135024 – 29 January 2013)

    (My home is freehold – I was lucky enough to pay off a 24 year loan in less than 9 years as a result of falling interest rates)

    “Isn’t that the politics of envy? I thought you people didn’t do that sort of thing?”

    When you asked me if I had paid my rates, I said ‘absolutely not’.

    (Which is still the case.

    Auckland Council is not complying with the Public Records Act 2005, and giving citizens and ratepayers the ‘devilish detail’ and showing where exactly rates monies are being spent on private sector contracts.)

    You see Cathy Odgers – you may not be interested in ‘open, transparent and democratically accountable’ local government – which is probably unsurprising, given that I understand you are connected with tax havens for the wealthy?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathy_Odgers

    “Odgers holds bachelor of commerce and bachelor of laws degrees from the University of Auckland and is an admitted barrister and solicitor in New Zealand.[2] Odgers is a full member of STEP (Society of Trust and Estate Practitioners), the Asia Offshore Association and the Inter-Pacific Bar Association.[2] ”

    http://www.fbsemirates.com/confidential-banking-and-banks-in-the-dubai/

    Confidential Banking and Banks in the Dubai

    Click Here – Essential UAE Company Practical Information and Facts.

    Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) – An Absolute “Must Read” …

    What does the ‘Near Future’ hold and Dubai – ‘The New Switzerland’ for the Rich

    Anonymity / confidentiality of beneficial owners

    Here is a list of benefits of the UAE relating to SAFE and confidential banking in a rich and economically stable country with huge financial (and oil) reserves.

    14th largest economy in the world having the 5th largest oil reserves and notably the reserves of the emirate of Abu Dhabi alone amount to over 1 trillion USD$!

    FULL confidentiality for beneficial owners at banks and the authorities and NO information exchange agreements with any other country. Do we disclose UBO details / identity to the authorities? In RAK we do not! (the reason for choosing RAK) in Jebel Ali (Dubai) we do and authorities need bank ref of UBO! To the banks? Yes as a general rule we disclose BUT there are no information exchange agreements

    Solid bank confidentiality with NO exchange of information agreements with any country

    The emirates have not signed exchange of information treaties with any nation, not even the European Union

    …………….”

    (Of course – you can’t believe everything you read on Wikileaks – so please correct any information which is wrong (as I am doing with that which you have written about me 🙂

    You see Cathy Odgers – you may not be into ‘transparency’ (understandable if you’re into tax havens and the like) – but I am.

    Maybe you’re not used to people approaching you directly, and challenging you to your face over what you have previously
    published?

    I very much doubt that you’ve previously experienced that before.

    But I did enjoy your ‘spin’ (sorry – ‘take’) on this event 🙂

    Is it your intention to visit the Defendant John Banks, if and when he is incarcerated following this trial?

    He’ll probably appreciate visitors.

    (“Even rats have feelings” ).

    I understand that Kim Dotcom was looking forward to a visit from John Banks when he was imprisoned.

    Possibly if Kim Dotcom had been a beagle or a ‘lab rat’ John Banks would have been more concerned about his circumstances?

    Of course – I’d post this directly on Whaleoil – but unfortunately Cameron Slater doesn’t believe in ‘freedom of expression’ on HIS ‘blog’ (like the equally phony Martyn Bradbury with HIS ‘Daily Blog’)

    Kind regards

    Penny Bright

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