Open mike 23/06/2016

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, June 23rd, 2016 - 153 comments
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openmikeOpen mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

153 comments on “Open mike 23/06/2016 ”

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  1. Paul 1
    23 June 2016 at 6:29 am

    Another day in John Key’s neo-liberal nightmare.
    We have become a cruel, greedy, uncaring and selfish nation under his wretched leadership.

    Uncaring.
    New Zealand’s housing.

    Complaints of ‘despicable’ mould and leaking prompt Housing NZ to act
    Step inside, make yourself at home. Breathe in the mouldy air.
    You even get a free shower when you go to the toilet, Craig Ryan says, pointing to the dripping, sagging bathroom ceiling in the Porirua state house he calls home.
    Ryan lives there with father Ross and brother Aaron, and they say mould grows relentlessly in the badly ventilated, east-facing house.
    The Ryans said they did spend time and money on cleaning, and trying to warm the house, which was sorely lacking in ventilation. Even frequent scrubbing, cleaning and bleaching was no match for the cold and damp.
    When lawyer Paul Surridge learned of the home’s condition, he was appalled.
    “This is just despicable,” he said. “It’s not the New Zealand way.”
    There was a limit to what tenants could do to the house without Housing NZ’s approval, he said. “The decent New Zealander would say ‘Look, this is horrific.’ ”

    By contrast, Austrian and Singapore’s public housing systems…….
    http://www.shareable.net/blog/public-housing-works-lessons-from-vienna-and-singapore

  2. Paul 2
    23 June 2016 at 6:37 am

    Another day in John Key’s neo-liberal nightmare.
    We have become a cruel, greedy, uncaring and selfish nation under his wretched leadership.

    Selfish.
    Paul Henry and Mike Hosking

    Every morning they pronounce New Zealand a paradise.
    For them it is because they are wealthy and they choose to ignore the plight of others in the country.
    Maybe they should read this article by a Bay of Plenty journalist…..

    ‘Mismanaged NZ is no paradise
    ‘After moving to New Zealand 12 years ago I heard a lot from locals about what a great place it was to raise kids.
    But, as I took my children to school, I saw huge numbers of kids heading to class without shoes – in the middle of winter.
    That was a shock. Couldn’t their parents afford shoes, I wondered?
    To add to the picture many of the children didn’t have raincoats, others didn’t even have jumpers.
    I didn’t think about it then, but now I would expect many of the kids didn’t have lunches and hadn’t had food for breakfast.
    Nowadays when people say to me that New Zealand is the best country in the world to raise children I ask them why they think that?
    They cannot say exactly why, I guess most just parrot the myth of this paradise for children.
    Then I ask them if this is the best place to raise kids – why are there more than 270,000 children living in poverty right now?
    Ummm.
    Why do so many children go to school without being fed?
    Ummm.
    Why does a Kiwi kid die about every five weeks at the hands of parents or caregivers?
    Ummm.
    Is it true police are called to domestic violence incidents every seven minutes?
    Ummm.
    And can a United Nations’ report possibly be true when it states that one in four NZ girls are sexually assaulted before they are 15?
    Ummm.
    That doesn’t sound like a child paradise to me…..”

    Another excellent excerpt….

    ‘In Auckland’s central suburbs rent is, on average, just under $600 a week.
    On the North Shore you are looking at just under $570 per week.
    Even in South Auckland the average rent is $450.
    A TV3 investigation the other month found families in Auckland were hiring out garages for $400 a week.
    Read more: Tauranga woman works fulltime but sleeps in car
    Tauranga’s homeless: 4-year-old lived in car for six weeks
    When the minimum wage is $620 a week, before paying $120 tax, even Blind Pew can see there is a crisis.’

    Read more at ….
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/bay-of-plenty-times/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503346&objectid=11660630

  3. Paul 3
    23 June 2016 at 6:41 am

    Another day in John Key’s neo-liberal nightmare.
    We have become a cruel, greedy, uncaring and selfish nation under his wretched leadership.

    Cruel.
    The government.

    ‘Government fights workers seeking minimum wage.

    A Court of Appeal hearing begins today for a case that could lead to a big payout for thousands of respite carers.
    Kapiti worker Jan Lowe was paid a “subsidy” of just $75 for a 24-hour shift for the Capital Coast DHB. Her work involved supporting people with disabilities, such as dementia, and caring for them while family caregivers were away.
    Last year, the Employment Court found under the “home worker” definition in the Employment Relations Act, she was an employee and entitled to the minimum wage of $15.25 an hour, holidays and other minimum employment entitlements.
    But her employer, Capital Coast DHB, and the Ministry of Health appealed the decision, arguing she was not an employee, and if she was, they were not the employer.
    A hearing for the Court of Appeal case begins this morning.
    The Ministry of Health says the case has implications for 30,000 respite carers.
    E tu assistant national secretary John Ryall said respite carers did an important job in supporting some of the most vulnerable New Zealanders and deserved to be paid the minimum wage.’

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11661691

  4. Paul 4
    23 June 2016 at 6:43 am

    Another day in John Key’s neo-liberal nightmare.
    We have become a cruel, greedy, uncaring and selfish nation under his wretched leadership.

    Greedy.
    Google, Facebook, Apple….

    ‘Is it right these companies collectively extract hundreds of millions of dollars of profit each year from the New Zealand economy, yet contribute little or nothing to the funding of a civil society?
    And not only that, cause New Zealanders to pay more tax to make up the difference required to fund our schools, hospitals and welfare.’

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11661266

  5. North 5
    23 June 2016 at 7:24 am

    Key…….”cruel, greedy, uncaring and selfish”. All that need be said. Except that “love to have a beer with you……..” is a complete wank created by some amoral ad-man. To hoodwink us. Good work Paul !

  6. weka 6
    23 June 2016 at 7:56 am

    For those that missed it here’s the Get Rid of Mike Hosking petition, going strong at over 18,000 signatures,

    https://www.change.org/p/tvnz-get-rid-of-hosking-1347aa6d-8044-4a33-ba59-7fe0a5dba42b

    • vto 6.1
      23 June 2016 at 8:20 am

      And here’s the Keep Mike Hosking petition, flying along on 39 signatures.

      https://www.change.org/p/keep-mike-hosking-at-tvnz

      lol

      • weka 6.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 8:23 am

        Not sure giving that exposure is a good thing 😉

        • North 6.1.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 8:59 am

          Actually I suspect that this “Keep Mikey……” thing is tongue in cheek. Which is a nice change from Mikey’s imperative……tongue in Key’s botty. What a magnificent chain gang ! Richie at the top, somewhat bemused, Jonno Key’s tongue lashing lizard like at number 2, and “Crikey Mikey that’s good !” at number 3. Slurping away hard out !

      • b waghorn 6.1.2
        23 June 2016 at 8:59 am

        That is very interesting , when I first heard of the get rid of hoskings poll, I thought that a keep hoskings poll would be the obvious way to retaliate and that he’d get a legion of viewers supporting him, that its not happening is a little ray of sunshine in my day.

      • Richardrawshark 6.1.3
        23 June 2016 at 11:39 am

        I wonder how many votes it will get.

        this should be interesting sort of like a election,

        • Puckish Rogue 6.1.3.1
          23 June 2016 at 11:50 am

          Or you could go off the ratings his show gets I suppose

          • Robert Guyton 6.1.3.1.1
            23 June 2016 at 11:52 am

            Bit like deciding the health value of Coke by looking at the sales data.

          • Richardrawshark 6.1.3.1.2
            23 June 2016 at 11:56 am

            ratings lol

            are they like the music industries top 10 bestsellers? or books? or Farrars? or any vested interest poll.

            • Puckish Rogue 6.1.3.1.2.1
              23 June 2016 at 11:59 am

              Well it worked for Campbell Live 🙂

              • McFlock …
                23 June 2016 at 12:50 pm

                yeah, funny that.

                Wasn’t Campbell Live doing better at 6pm news audience retention than the tv1 crowd?

                It fascinates me how people argue that Hosking’s views are popular because people watch him. They could have a trained monkey in that job and it’d still get audience pickup – fucksake, wasn’t that the timeslot that stopped NZ when they sheared a fucking sheep?

                People watch Hosking because of the timeslot and genre (inoffensive chat with pretensions of current event interest), and this makes the views he spews more popular. He’s a propagandist, pure and simple.

                • Rodel …
                  23 June 2016 at 6:31 pm

                  I don’t (I mean can’t) watch Hoskings on TV (don’t want to waste grey matter)- but occasionally can’t avoid his sudden appearance on TV1 promos.
                  Why oh why does he wear what appears to be paint splattered old jeans?
                  At least I hope it’s paint.

                  • North …
                    23 June 2016 at 8:06 pm

                    Hosking’s gear is all about the mutton as lamb of bewildered narcissism. Never comes off. Just embarrassing. Like Key’s DPS dyed hair.

                  • Rosie …
                    23 June 2016 at 8:49 pm

                    We’ve been wondering about the painters pants when we’ve had the misfortune of catching him in the ads. Probably designer kit worth $1K

          • Draco T Bastard 6.1.3.1.3
            23 June 2016 at 2:10 pm

            Why would we do that when it’s obviously a failed system?

            This pitting of two petitions will be far more accurate.

            • Puckish Rogue 6.1.3.1.3.1
              23 June 2016 at 3:32 pm

              Well no it won’t be because you have one side that irrationally want his removal but theres no need for a counter petition because he’s not being removed

              This isn’t Campbell Live we’re talking about, its a show people actually watch

              *Disclaimer, I don’t watch Mike Hosking on TV or listen to his radio show either

      • Draco T Bastard 6.1.4
        23 June 2016 at 2:13 pm

        Up to 100 now after a day.

        IIRC, the petition to get rid of him reached 5000+ in the first day.

        • Richardrawshark 6.1.4.1
          23 June 2016 at 4:50 pm

          It’ll taper off, far more people working in TV and ZB than I thought, and I wonder how many times Katie signed it.

          Hey Hoskings, they sell 5 dollar reviews over sea’s on the interweb, maybe you could pay people to sign or crowdfund it if your a bit tight.

      • b waghorn 6.1.5
        23 June 2016 at 2:36 pm

        http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/81322479/opposition-renew-calls-for-media-charter-after-mike-hosking-petition-gains-traction
        Surprise surprise national dismantled the rules in place that would of stopped hoskings from getting away with his shit.
        On a brighter note it was public pressure that got henry moved along in 2010

        • Colonial Viper 6.1.5.1
          23 June 2016 at 2:41 pm

          Labour should have returned TVNZ to a true public broadcasting basis instead of trying to keep gaming $$$ off it.

    • Rosie 6.2
      23 June 2016 at 3:47 pm

      There were 90,000 signatures to save Campbell live, but we didn’t manage to do it.

      http://www.newshub.co.nz/nznews/save-campbell-live-petition-marched-to-mediaworks-2015042413#axzz4CN2XZtis

      I think if that number was doubled TVNZ might consider it. (Classic line coming up) – “I read somewhere” the other day that TVNZ was happy with 7 Blunt’s ratings. I don’t see that creepy mike hoskings getting shown the door any time soon but we can live in hope and I signed petition in that spirit.

      • weka 6.2.1
        23 June 2016 at 4:40 pm

        I see value in the petition even if Hosking remains. A little bit of water wears away the rock. A big petition is humiliating for Hosking and TVNZ and at the same time buoys up the people who know how fucked the situation is. That alone is worth the petition.

        • Rosie 6.2.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 8:47 pm

          You’re right. Each action contributes to the growing snowball. Such actions might provoke viewers to ask themselves why there would be a petition. As long as it gets people thinking, that’s the best start, and a part of the whole slow but growing movement of dissent.

          It would be far worse if there were no action at all.

        • Tom 6.2.1.2
          23 June 2016 at 9:15 pm

          Not as humiliating as poor ratings.

      • Richardrawshark 6.2.2
        23 June 2016 at 4:53 pm

        That’s because it had been in the plan since John key pushed his mate wheldon to work there.

        and that ain’t no wack conspiracy either.

  7. Rosemary McDonald 7
    23 June 2016 at 8:09 am

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/307064/disabled-boy-had-'diabolical'-post-op-aftercare

    This is what National means when they talk about “building resilience”.

    People are left on their own……

    • North 7.1
      23 June 2016 at 8:24 am

      From the rotting fish head John Key down, those with power over us know the cost of everything and the value of nothing……..until it comes to their vanities and dodgy imperatives……..26 mill’ for a flag wank ?

      “Go right ahead, this is for my legacy, money no object !”

    • Draco T Bastard 7.2
      23 June 2016 at 10:16 am

      It was then that the family were told their order for a hospital bed, wheelchair and a hip spica chair – which allows someone in a hip cast to sit up unaided – had all been cancelled by the Whanganui DHB. They were also told the occupational therapist assigned to them would not be visiting.

      Cancelled?

      WTF were the DHB thinking?

      And as for National continuously cutting the health budget I suspect that this is actually their desired result. Individuals having to go out and buy stuff for short term use will result in more sales and higher profits for the bludging shareholders.

      • Rosemary McDonald 7.2.1
        23 June 2016 at 10:27 am

        WTF were the DHB thinking?

        Indeed. See what a spica cast looks like here…http://www.webmd.com/children/spica-cast-667

        1. While I’m am not suggesting for a single itty bitty second that the Whanganui DHB has such a policy…is it pure coincidence that this is the DHB that the world famous in New Zealand eugenicist Michael ‘if you choose to give birth to a disabled kid don’t expect the State to care for it’ Laws was once an elected member of?

        2. Fact….. Non ACC disabled are entitled to NOTHING in the way of support.

        3. It has always been the case that applications for funding for equipment are delayed/declined….often forcing disabled people to seek out other funding sources.
        It’s just getting worse.

  8. Sabine 8
    23 June 2016 at 8:14 am

    and then there was this

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/house-democrats-gun-bills-sit-in_us_576ab443e4b0c0252e77ecb8

    the cynic in me says ohhhhh….. kabuki theater, the romantic in me says…..ohhhhhh a sit in, and the pessimist in me says…….ohhhh, grandstanding for nothing.

    But then a good sit in is a good sit in. 🙂

    Maybe our Opposition could do the same in regards to our homeless. T’would be fun to see the speaker spit bricks.

  9. North 9
    23 June 2016 at 9:47 am

    Haven’t read The Ombudsman’s report on the Rebstock findings re the leak about minister’s bashing of MFAT. However, going by what’s been said on Nine to Noon this morning (interview with one of Rebstock’s MFAT scapegoats/victims) The Ombudsman has roundly concluded that Dame Rebstock’s findings are Dame Rebstock’s Rubbish Findings.

    Key and his lackeys had better be careful if they set out to rubbish Ombudsman Boshier in favour of ‘Their Loyal Servant’ Dame Rebstock.

    • Muttonbird 10.1
      23 June 2016 at 10:59 am

      It is welcome analysis from Eaqub, but I get the feeling that he is constantly a little surprised at the sometimes slow, sometimes fast degradation of the socially conscious New Zealand we once enjoyed.

      And talk about ‘New Politics’. The deliberate policy of pitting peoples against each other has developed the world over by various right of centre governments. See Brexit, see the US election, and see John Key’s government of divisiveness.

      • whateva next? 10.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 12:05 pm

        “The deliberate policy of pitting peoples against each other has developed the world over by various right of centre governments….”

        Absolutely, it feels like one big game of “the Block”, the axing of TV7 and the endless, mindless TV contest shows, cooking, singing, house decorating and finding a mate…….and distracting us.

        Police regularly blaming “Mental Health Services”, and CYPFS blamed for the appalling lack of societal infrastructure and the tragic, yet inevitable consequences.

  11. weka 11
    23 June 2016 at 10:04 am

    A question about MMP from yesterday. Do party votes from parties that don’t reach 5% or get an electorate MP get reallocated?

    First link says yes they do, second apparently says no they don’t. The context is whether if Harawira doesn’t win TTT, are the Mana votes ‘lost’, or do those lost votes give an advantage to other parties? e.g. in 2014 IM got something like 1.4% of the vote.

    Since 1996 these “wasted” votes have averaged 4.96%. After each election the St Laguë formula has reallocated between two and nine list seats to qualifying parties (see table below). This disproportionately benefits the parties with the largest share of the primary vote. Of the total of 38 seats reallocated this way, Labour has won nine and National 14; the other 15 went to smaller parties. In addition, between 2005 and 2011 the Maori Party had a total of four overhang seats.

    http://www.listener.co.nz/current-affairs/politics/state-your-preference/

    http://www.elections.org.nz/voting-system/mmp-voting-system/sainte-lague-allocation-formula

    • Draco T Bastard 11.1
      23 June 2016 at 10:23 am

      The overhang seats were a known issue when we voted MMP in. That said, I don’t think that the people who recommended MMP thought that we’d be getting so many of them and so often.

      As for the ‘wasted votes’ being effectively reallocated the only option for that is to decrease the threshold from 5% to 0.8%. If a party gets enough votes for a seat then they should have a seat.

  12. Draco T Bastard 12
    23 June 2016 at 10:35 am

    P test finds NZ banknotes may be the most meth-contaminated currency ever found

    All four note bundles tested positive for methamphetamine but not for precursors used to manufacture it, so the drug traces had likely come from contact with users rather than from a P lab.
    Nonetheless, three of the bundles tested above the health guideline for remediation if those samples had been taken from a P lab site.
    That guideline limit is 0.5 microgrammes per 100cm2 of wall or other surface. The note bundles showed levels from 0.4 to 0.8 microgrammes per 100cm2.

    One point I made in my Cashless was the effect it would have on criminal undertakings – essentially criminals wouldn’t be able to use money at all. Now it appears that it would be good for everyone’s health as well.

    • weka 12.1
      23 June 2016 at 10:53 am

      Handling eftpost receipts is looking like being a problem as a source of endocrine disruptor toxicity,

      https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/10/141022143628.htm

      I’m guessing that most people handle eftpost and other thermal receipts far more than they do banknotes.

      • Draco T Bastard 12.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 12:28 pm

        I keep wondering why they hand them out. I just refuse them myself so I’m not handling them anyway. Would much prefer it if I could get online and check my purchases through my bank. Of course, I happen think that the bank should be a state bank and not a private one. I don’t trust private banks with my data.

        • weka 12.1.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 1:44 pm

          I think the machines in shops have to print out. Lots of places ask if you want the receipt, so heaps just go straight in the bin. ATMs give an option of no receipt. Till receipts are trickier if you need proof of purchase.

          Years ago I used to keep them all but then realised I never used them. Utter waste and health/ environment damaging.

    • Sabine 12.2
      23 June 2016 at 10:55 am

      and its still not a good enough reason to only have electronic money.

      i rather have a bit of meth on my hand, then a government like our current one just cut of access to our cash for the sake of it, or to teach the plebs a lesson in obedience.

    • Colonial Viper 12.3
      23 June 2016 at 11:09 am

      One point I made in my Cashless was the effect it would have on criminal undertakings – essentially criminals wouldn’t be able to use money at all. Now it appears that it would be good for everyone’s health as well.

      Sorry mate, you’re not thinking ahead. What happens when you or your political movement are criminalised for taking a set against the establishment.

      Tracking, suspending, banning, revealing, reversing all your financial transactions and the financial transactions of associated parties would be just the start.

      The cashless society, having tracking modules on all vehicles, we’re stupid for thinking that these things will not be used to crush future dissent.

      Look at how they fucked over Julian Assange and wikileaks by banning their access to paypal and the credit card system. Or how they threaten to ban entire countries from SWIFT.

      People need to learn for fucks sake.

      • Draco T Bastard 12.3.1
        23 June 2016 at 12:32 pm

        That’s why you put in place rules and processes about it that cannot be broken by the parliament of the day. If they try it becomes an automatic act of treason and they a) lose everything and b) go to jail for the rest of their lives.

        • Colonial Viper 12.3.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 1:51 pm

          Fuck your magical thinking mate.

          • Draco T Bastard 12.3.1.1.1
            23 June 2016 at 1:57 pm

            So, I take it that you’re in favour of getting rid of laws against murder, Laws for health and safety at work sites and Minimum wage laws?

            You know, to get rid of all this “magical thinking”.

            • Colonial Viper 12.3.1.1.1.1
              23 June 2016 at 2:03 pm

              ???

              no idea what you’re talking about, also no idea why you’re promoting systems which will make it easier for the power elite to make political activists lives miserable.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                23 June 2016 at 3:07 pm

                We make laws against bad behaviour all the time but you’re here saying that that is magical thinking.

                • Colonial Viper …
                  23 June 2016 at 3:13 pm

                  yeah those laws have effectively stopped violent crimes and other bad behaviour in NZ haven’t they

                  • Draco T Bastard …
                    23 June 2016 at 3:19 pm

                    So you must be in favour of getting rid of all those laws then, to get rid of all that “magical thinking”.

                    Or do you think that we should keep the laws and hold people accountable for their bad behaviour? To let them know that there are consequences and that those consequences will be grave?

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      23 June 2016 at 3:42 pm

                      Dude, I don’t give a fuck about your laws, I give a fuck about you wanting to empower people with the technology to do shitty things to us, even knowing full well that your precious laws have never stopped that happening in the past.

                    • North …
                      23 June 2016 at 8:33 pm

                      DTB 1 : CV Nil. And a very naughty and graceless Nil too !

      • b waghorn 12.3.2
        23 June 2016 at 1:03 pm

        Might be a good reason to not take banking back into complete control of the government a Draco

    • reason 12.4
      23 June 2016 at 1:14 pm

      “Dr Nick Kim, a senior lecturer in environmental chemistry at Massey University, tested the residue left on walls by meth smokers and found the potential health effects of past P smoking was no worse than those of tobacco, or handling meth-contaminated bank notes.”

      So you are now pushing a Paula Bennett myth that is being used to demonize state tenants and evict them from state houses Draco ? .

      Classy.

      Dr Nick Kim: “What seems wrong is the idea of kicking people out of houses where residues are not too dissimilar to [tobacco] smoking residues on walls.”

      Draco & Paula ….”We are not going to risk houses suspected of being drug dens today, becoming potentially toxic playgrounds for innocent children in the future.”

      As many as 600 state homes will need P decontamination this year, amid claims retirees are now smoking the toxic drug.

      Each home needing decontamination cost between $8000 and $16,000, with the work costing the agency $2.3 million last year.

      Dr Nick Kim: “Tenants who found that their houses had been smoked in could wash down walls and curtains but Kim said he personally would not worry. There was no need to tear down gib or replace carpets and insulation unless there was strong suspicion that there was a lab and the chances were lower than people feared.”

      • save nz 12.4.1
        23 June 2016 at 1:32 pm

        +1 Reason – now P is the new scare device with everyone running about and plenty of money to be made out of the P scare scam by some (especially the government to explain why nobody lives in state houses anymore and why State houses are the new ‘ghost’ houses!).

      • Draco T Bastard 12.4.2
        23 June 2016 at 2:00 pm

        Draco & Paula ….”We are not going to risk houses suspected of being drug dens today, becoming potentially toxic playgrounds for innocent children in the future.”

        Don’t attribute to me that which I never said nor have ever indicated that we should be doing.

        • reason 12.4.2.1
          23 June 2016 at 6:15 pm

          Sorry Draco …. I thought you were using Paulas cult science for your own agenda.

          I may have overestimated your intelligence ,,,,,,,,,, sorry.

          You may be sincere about wanting to protecting our health from meth on bank notes …….

          In which case you are A fool with good intentions ,,,,,,, helping to spread Paulas witch trial drug hysteria ……… and the rip-off industry and eviction program that it enables …..

          p.s using Paulas lies to back up your argument massively undermined your points ……….

          What other lies and myths do you support?

          • Draco T Bastard 12.4.2.1.1
            23 June 2016 at 8:46 pm

            I don’t support any and I certainly do not support the ones that you’re making up about me and that’s all you’ve done so far in this thread.

            Which makes you the fool.

            • reason 12.4.2.1.1.1
              24 June 2016 at 7:28 am

              really? ………….. then you didn’t type this on the basis of Paula’s contamination cult? …..”Now it appears that it would be good for everyone’s health as well”

              vrs Dr Nick Kim …..”Even that level was 24 times lower than “the lowest level that could you could plausibly have a health risk”.

              You need to Explain yourself and your use of the same ugly false fear mongering which Paula is using to evict the poor and their children onto the street…..

              Keep your explanation simple for a fool like me 😉

              I get confused nowadays in New Zealand, when rivers that WILL make you sick,with their soup of fecal matter, pathogens and nitrates are not called polluted and toxic…… these are instead to be known as ‘up to national standards & Wade-able’.

              Yet at the same time we have hundreds of perfectly safe state houses which pose no health risk labeled ‘contaminated’ and ‘toxic’ sitting empty, awaiting millions to be spent on them, after needless evictions … in the middle of a housing crisis.

              Now you and your contaminated notes may know something which supports Paulas and your science ….

              She certainly needs help to continue her war on the poor.

      • Gangnam Style 12.4.3
        23 June 2016 at 2:03 pm

        “amid claims retirees are now smoking the toxic drug.” – Really? Where was that claim made? I always see retirees wasting their money at the pokeys now they are smoking P? End times cannot be too far away, oh my poor children!

  13. Richardrawshark 13
    23 June 2016 at 11:19 am

    FLASH ALERT IMPORTANT

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11661851

    hmm what does this mean, can we get rid of this Failed UK Rebstock Person, mums got nothing good to say about her, apparently she was crap there and bought her poison over here, mums words good enough for me, always trust a granny.

    • Colonial Viper 13.1
      23 June 2016 at 11:33 am

      Yes Rebstock, we need more women in leadership positions like her.

      • Richardrawshark 13.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 11:36 am

        Did you forget the /sarc tag?

        • I Feel Love 13.1.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 11:54 am

          Nah CV doing his anti feminist thing, going hard for the mens.

          • Richardrawshark 13.1.1.1.1
            23 June 2016 at 12:00 pm

            Oh did Helen tell him off? Or does he have gender issues with women I’m happy to toast his nuts over?

            If Rebstock was a bloke i’d say the same.

            • Colonial Viper 13.1.1.1.1.1
              23 June 2016 at 1:48 pm

              If Rebstock was a bloke i’d say the same.

              That’s my point. Rebstock is at least the equal of any man that National could put in that role, if not even superior.

              • weka …
                23 June 2016 at 2:47 pm

                Why do we need more women leaders like her then?

                • Colonial Viper …
                  23 June 2016 at 3:01 pm

                  Same rationale that Hillary Clinton should be US President. Women in top leadership roles can do at least a good a job as men, if not better.

                  • weka …
                    23 June 2016 at 4:42 pm

                    Interesting to know that you now think that Clinton should be US president. Bit of a turn around though.

                    • Gangnam Style …
                      23 June 2016 at 5:53 pm

                      He is been sarcy I think, like saying ‘see, women can be as big as horrible leaders as men’, am I right CV? Thatcher & Imelda already proved that years ago.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      23 June 2016 at 6:18 pm

                      Interesting to know that you now think that Clinton should be US president. Bit of a turn around though.

                      I didn’t say that Clinton should be US President. I said that she could do the job as well as most other men could, if not better.

                      Whether or not I think her politics are any good is another matter entirely.

                    • weka …
                      23 June 2016 at 6:18 pm

                      @Gangnam Style, he’s being an arse to people about so called identity politics, he just can’t do it honestly.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      23 June 2016 at 6:19 pm

                      He is been sarcy I think, like saying ‘see, women can be as big as horrible leaders as men’, am I right CV? Thatcher & Imelda already proved that years ago.

                      What’s sarcy about women being able to equal or exceed men in every respect?

                    • Rodel …
                      23 June 2016 at 7:05 pm

                      Heard a rumour (No I started it) that Hillary is going to nominate bill as the vice president..so she can keep an eye on him.
                      Hey. Anything’s possible.

                    • Colonial Viper …
                      23 June 2016 at 8:30 pm

                      @Gangnam Style, he’s being an arse to people about so called identity politics, he just can’t do it honestly.

                      You know how to read between the lines right weka?

                    • weka …
                      23 June 2016 at 8:33 pm

                      Actually I’m finding the numbers of not very well explained ideas and thoughts on ts at the moment tedious. It’s like people value their own cleverness over communicating well, which is problematic given the context.

              • Richardrawshark …
                23 June 2016 at 2:50 pm

                Ouch, that’s down right harsh CV, but I like it.

              • North …
                23 June 2016 at 5:57 pm

                It seems inoffensive to say that Dame Rebstock is at least the equal of any man that National could put in (what role ?). But how might she be even superior in (what role ?) as you suggest CV ? Are you talking the role of bought and paid for report ‘signer’ or the role of independent report ‘writer’.

                Certainly an Ombudsman thinks she’s a pretty shit independent report ‘writer’. If on the other hand she’s merely a report ‘signer’, she is corrupt. Dame Ratshit whichever way.

                Who appointed her to (what role?) CV ? Who made her a dame ? Oh yes…….it’s like dogs’ balls.

      • miravox 13.1.2
        23 June 2016 at 5:48 pm

        The opportunity to prove oneself an arse shouldn’t depend on gender.

        That arsery is not dependent on gender shouldn’t be a reason for commenting on gender instead of abilities, imo.

      • srylands 13.1.3
        23 June 2016 at 9:14 pm

        Yes we do. Whatever the errors of this inquiry, Paula has contributed much to New Zealand. She worked in Treasury in the late 80s and made an important contribution to the machinery of government reforms advocated by Treasury in 1987.

        I think you should be ashamed of your childish disparaging of her

        • One Anonymous Bloke 13.1.3.1
          24 June 2016 at 7:52 am

          So she’s been sucking on the public teat all this time. The problem with delusional trash like Paula is they’ve never worked in the real world.

        • Pat 13.1.3.2
          24 June 2016 at 7:58 am

          1987 was the first year of her employment at treasury shortly after graduating ….dont think she would have had much input to those recommendations somehow.

          • Gangnam Style 13.1.3.2.1
            24 June 2016 at 4:35 pm

            Ha, nice one Pat, Srylands caught in a lie, though must be hard defending the indefensible gotta admit.

      • Muttonbird 13.1.4
        23 June 2016 at 9:44 pm

        National Party apologists, you mean?

    • Richardrawshark 13.2
      23 June 2016 at 11:47 am

      http://www.newshub.co.nz/politics/commission-acted-unreasonably-in-mfat-leak-report-2016062309#axzz4CITeYEnU

      on NewsHub now to, stuffs bit slow too pick it up.

      Personally this is one the left should pick up and get vocal on for the reasons it was Keys appointment and Rebstock did an attack job it cements into the voters minds this governments inquiries are all cover ups, we can then get the DP inquiry pressure going again and any other BS inquiries Keys had.

      I’ve been waiting for a powerful body like the ombudsman to make decision man that office is slow to respond. But finally a proper report Key can’t rebuttal as plainl;y wrong. I dare him to say the Ombudsmans wrong.

      Get that pressure on my Beauties, fly fly…

      • ianmac 13.2.1
        23 June 2016 at 12:02 pm

        “a proper report Key can’t rebuttal”
        Wanna bet Richard?
        “That is just one opinion and I could find another report that would vindicate the wonderful Paula Rebstock. Mr Farrar would be one of course.”

        • Richardrawshark 13.2.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 12:15 pm

          What?, I don’t think an ombudsmans report is just an opinion.

          If Key wishes to use a Farrar’s opinion against the Ombudman’s fire away, can’t wait.

          What I should have said, is any rebuttal would looks silly and just fake to the public, as there are not many bodies as respected as the Ombudsmans office.

          To critique the office of the Ombudsman is bad form.

          Mum must be senile, she’s from the states, my bad, must be getting confused then with someone else, it was a passing comment she made.

          • ianmac 13.2.1.1.1
            23 June 2016 at 1:18 pm

            Tis Okay Richard. I was just mocking the way that Key denies uncomfortable facts by quoting a different source. He knows that by the time we try to undo his dissemblage the story has moved on.
            Wonder if the release of this report just happens to be while Parliament is in recess for four weeks?

            • North 13.2.1.1.1.1
              23 June 2016 at 8:45 pm

              Well the bastard doesn’t even ‘quote’ a different source. Just says there would be one. That’s it. Discussion over.

          • ianmac 13.2.1.1.2
            23 June 2016 at 1:30 pm

            Funny how quickly the Herald moved the story down to about 15th online?

    • ianmac 13.3
      23 June 2016 at 11:58 am

      We might wonder about other “enquiries undertaken by Rebstock. Education? Social Welfare?
      When a Government has a pet Enquirer would we expect an independent unbiased report? Doubt it. Or unbiased means you will not get another job from John Key.

      • Gangnam Style 13.3.1
        23 June 2016 at 2:06 pm

        “We might wonder about other “enquiries undertaken by Rebstock. Education? Social Welfare?” Yes ianmac!

    • integralenz 13.4
      23 June 2016 at 12:01 pm

      I don’t think you can hold the UK accountable for this lamentable stooge. Believe she’s all the way from the USA.

    • Rodel 13.5
      23 June 2016 at 6:53 pm

      Rennie said that he:
      “accepted that the way the inquiry dealt with Mr Leask “could have been better”.

      Mr Goff said, “It was not simply unfair. The treatment of those two men was disgraceful.”

      The Prime Minister mumbled ..” There’s um clearly been some…some…errors that have been made.” …Did he also say..’It was all Labours fault?’

      Mike Hoskings said. ..#@^@$##&^#x.. Hey-Who cares what he said..

    • srylands 13.6
      23 June 2016 at 9:07 pm

      Paula is from America. She has a distinguished career in New Zealand spanning 30 years. You must be thinking of someone else.

  14. save nz 14
    23 June 2016 at 1:29 pm

    About time we had a Scandinavian approach to prisons and criminal activity. Even if you don’t care about society as a rampant neoliberal – think of how much money the state could save if they bothered to look at what is successful in prisons around the world!

    Intentional homicides:
    Norway: 0.6 per 100,000 people
    United States: 6 per 100,000 people
    Incarceration rates:
    Norway: 71 for every 100,000 people
    United States: 743 for every 100,000 (in 2009)
    Recidivism rate:
    Norway: 20%
    United States: 50%-60%
    Hard to believe, isn’t it?

    Perhaps Norway’s way of doing things isn’t as bizarre as we think.

    http://www.upworthy.com/how-a-tour-of-a-norwegian-jail-might-make-you-reconsider-how-effective-the-us-justice-system-is?c=ufb4

  15. save nz 15
    23 June 2016 at 1:34 pm

    This is an interesting site, and check out

    He found a way to build mini homes at no cost, and he’s donating them all to the homeless. (via NationSwell)

    https://www.facebook.com/nationswell/

  16. marty mars 16
    23 June 2016 at 2:04 pm

    When Susan Devoy became Race Relations Commissioner I was skeptical – however I think she has done well to date.

    This month when I opened a copy of the Wairarapa Times-Age, a New Zealander wearing a Neo Nazi uniform stared back at me…

    …These are a few of the reasons why I will never think that it is okay for New Zealanders to wear Nazi-styled uniforms.

    Why? Because people wearing Nazi uniforms murdered 1.5 million children.

    They did it on purpose and they would have kept murdering children if they had not been stopped…

    …I’ve written this article to help ensure that those children aren’t forgotten and to make it clear that Neo Nazi fascism and racism does not belong in Aotearoa New Zealand…

    …Some say we should ignore these kinds of extremists but sometimes we need to stand up publicly and say that their philosophy is ‘Not Okay’.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/north-island/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503932&objectid=11661907

    Those children, their relatives alive and dead will never be forgotten – the horror of what happened will not be pretended-away.

    No it is not okay marae-burner-kyle and your mate just-another-sad-tocker. You parade around in your dress up neo-nazi uniforms – such sad losers yet they are here with us and in our faces – in the paper!

    Saying their philosophy is not okay is the least we can do – we need to make this place the way we want it and stepping out bullies, racists and their enablers (and those who use these dims for their own political ends) is a crucial step – for our self esteem, our values and so we can sleep at night.

    • Gangnam Style 16.1
      23 June 2016 at 2:14 pm

      Yeah she’s all right, def takes the job seriously. Tough job to do well, so thank you Ms Devoy.

      • Colonial Viper 16.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 2:39 pm

        A lot of commentators on TS hated on Devoy when she first got the job. I may have been one of them. However, she sharply picked up the pace after her first few months and is filling the role quite nicely now I think.

    • Colonial Viper 16.2
      23 June 2016 at 2:37 pm

      Why? Because people wearing Nazi uniforms murdered 1.5 million children.

      I rather suspect that is an under estimate, too.

  17. Olwyn 17
    23 June 2016 at 2:06 pm

    The comments under this article have the look of counteroffensive action against last week’s reckless show of compassion for the homeless. It is about a couple who have been given notice in a Huntly state house they have lived in for 23 years because they are now deemed able to pay market rent, although there is a shortage of rental houses in Huntly anyway. Comments that mercilessly bag the family are getting about 200 up-ticks. Comments that say “show some compassion” or “in other countries people are able to rent permanently” or similar are getting equivalent numbers of thumbs-down. http://i.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times/news/81162744/huntly-mums-plea-to-stay-in-her-state-home.adaptive.html

    • indiana 17.1
      23 June 2016 at 3:58 pm

      Do you think it is acceptable that this family occupied a state house for 23 years? In that 23 years, what did other people do who met the criteria for state housing? The Greens have a policy to build more state houses – in my view this is oppression by stealth as there is no incentive for state house occupants to better themselves and not remain life long welfare dependants. State housing should always be for those who need it most and those that get a state home should never expect to build a lifestyle from it – especially starting a new family or occupying it for 23 years!. Its the steeping stone they need at a relevant point in their situation, improve their situation and then move on.

      • Gangnam Style 17.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 4:00 pm

        “Do you think it is acceptable that this family occupied a state house for 23 years?” Yes, I do, couldn’t care less if they live in for 50 years, whats it to ya? Build more!

      • Richardrawshark 17.1.2
        23 June 2016 at 4:22 pm

        I see Indiana, the state should follow people around prodding them with a cattle prodder to better themselves. What’s your measure of better? At what point does your nanny state say your own your own now, ?

        Secondly council housing is housing for life in the UK, well it was, they did the same over there, big sell off, but you know a caring state, worked with these long term tenants and worked a good deal with them to pay the houses off, or assist them into a loan, they had a plan.

        AFAIK State housing was introduced because the working poor could never expect to own a house, there was over crowding poor conditions, a progressive labour government backed by the unions as at that time you greedy mine, shipyard owners etc had to be forced into compliance, so damn greedy, Labour state housing bettered the lives of millions of people. Something you lot have been rabidly trying to reverse ever since?

        whether you know it or not that’s what high Tories are doing. But you’re not one of them you actually think they care for all, and the left are loonies.

        IMHO

      • Anne 17.1.3
        23 June 2016 at 4:35 pm

        @indiana

        Did you grow up in a family home that at some point was owned by the state? Thousands upon thousands of us did. And when we finally fled the nest, many of our parents were given the opportunity to purchase the properties for their retirement years. That my dear was the aim of the exercise. To give a whole generation, young and old, security and stability. And it worked.

        People like you sicken me. It’s NOT welfare dependency to have a warm, dry home provided by the state. It’s a necessity especially in this neo liberal dog eat dog society we live in. And the security of knowing it is there for as long as you need it is a prerequisite for a generation of balanced, healthy citizens.

        You remind me of Paula Bennett. Grab all the benefits yourself and use them to climb the ladder of success, then drag the ladder away so nobody can follow in your footsteps.

      • Olwyn 17.1.4
        23 June 2016 at 4:45 pm

        Yes I do think it is acceptable for them to live in that house for those years. In a society where are large percentage of the population do not earn enough to buy their own homes, I think that secure long term rental, both state and private, should be the norm. That is the case in many other countries, and it has not made the population of Germany, for instance, feckless and lazy. The couple in the article are working and contributing to their community – in fact they want to buy their house now but have not been able to raise the necessary loan. It is just not good enough to price people out of home ownership, sell off state houses and force a huge percentage of the population to rely on amateur landlords with high rents and minimal rights as tenants.

        • indiana 17.1.4.1
          24 June 2016 at 11:11 am

          ” in fact they want to buy their house now but have not been able to raise the necessary loan.”

          But they had plenty of money to raise 7 children instead of saving for a deposit on a house. Was there a housing crisis in Hamilton 20 years ago? I’m presuming that in the first 3 years of them being a state home, they would have thought about this because if I put myself in their situation, this would be one of my first considerations – start a family or get out of the welfare trap.

          Its a pity that default position to take is that I’m a heartless bastard and that I have no concept of living life on the edge, but feel free to make assumptions.

          • Olwyn 17.1.4.1.1
            24 June 2016 at 11:23 am

            At the time when they moved into their state house, it was considered to be theirs for as long as they wanted and needed it, so it was not unreasonable for them to live their lives accordingly. There is such a thing as a decent humble person who is happy to contribute to a community but is not driven by material ambition – being a good or bad person is not contingent on owning or not owning a house. And I myself did not comment on your character, I simply disagreed with you. You, however, seem to feel quite free to comment negatively on the character of the people in the article.

      • North 17.1.5
        23 June 2016 at 6:34 pm

        “Indiana wants me…..on the streets he wants me !”

        What a dog ! And supremely stupid – to say that need for housing is reflected in availability of housing. To say that need for housing beyond numbers of available houses is not actually need. It is welfare bludging. What a dumb, extremist fuckwit ! Maybe Indiana should experience the unavailability of a supply of oxygen. No problem. No availability. No need.

        The couple have lived in this house throughout the onslaught of neo-liberalism. During this period, by design, only a relative few were ever supposed to advance their fortunes, viz. those already at the top. That is the true ethos of neo-liberalism. Masked by cynical promises of trickle-down. The days when we might have regarded neo-liberals as fantasists truly believing in trickledown are well gone. They know it’s shit but they insist. They are amoral crooks.

        Indiana invokes failure to triumph over the conditions created by Indiana and ilk. That’s a bit much like the rapist blaming the rape victim for the debilitating STD the rapist inflicted.

        Ordinary people don’t advance under neo-liberalism. They were never meant to. You weren’t meant to be a dog Indiana but I see you’re trying your hardest. Dumb Fuckwit !

    • Richardrawshark 17.2
      23 June 2016 at 4:43 pm

      Hootens banked on the fact 80% of the voting people are too young and dumb to remember why state housing was a house for life at one time, why and what it was set up for, what it was like before labour saved them, and probably all of them owe there current lifestyle to that fact.

    • Johan 17.3
      23 June 2016 at 5:38 pm

      To Olwyn:
      Tory Trolls have been placing a team effort to falsify comments on Stuff, ie. up-ticking the bagging comments and down-ticking the supportive comments. Many of these trolls appear to have vacated Newshub NZ (TV3)comments section and moved to Stuff to do their dirty work.

      • Olwyn 17.3.1
        23 June 2016 at 6:48 pm

        OK – I did wonder if it was something like that. They have relied for eight years now on generating contempt and division between social groups, so the humane response to homelessness last week must have given them a bit of a jolt. Now they are no doubt keen to regain their grip on the agenda.

  18. Ad 18
    23 June 2016 at 2:06 pm

    An interesting if controversial comparison between women in power on Game of Thrones, and how women change in real life when they ascend power:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11661912

    And yes, they compare Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump at the same time as they compare Danys in Game of Thrones.

    • marty mars 18.1
      23 June 2016 at 2:24 pm

      Bit silly really as the show is reflecting current modes of thinking not new ones or for that matter old ones – to find the truth about power and some of the women who have held it – go back – indigenous women leaders are plentiful and their stories, memories and abilities are well known within their communities.

  19. Richardrawshark 19
    23 June 2016 at 2:30 pm

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/81380931/john-key-admits-confidential-cafe-slipup-while-defending-protection-officer

    This guy key, you know the CEO of NZ inc, doesn’t know the difference between running a business and running a country and protecting it’s secrets. I would love to know the security level of the docs he just left about, some are not to be removed and eyes only.

  20. Kay 20
    23 June 2016 at 3:19 pm

    All is not well in the State of Denmark:
    http://www.humanityinaction.org/knowledgebase/59-the-danish-illusion-the-gap-between-principle-and-practice-in-the-danish-welfare-system

    It reads all to familiar. How long do you reckon they have?

    • Colonial Viper 20.1
      23 June 2016 at 6:20 pm

      The right wingers have been screwing Denmark for a bit over 10 years now so I figure another 10 years or so.

      • Gangnam Style 20.1.1
        23 June 2016 at 8:36 pm

        Denmark only shut down their dog brothels a few years ago, I like their bonfire culture though.

        • Colonial Viper 20.1.1.1
          23 June 2016 at 11:24 pm

          I thought you were kidding and then I googled it.

          • Gangnam Style 20.1.1.1.1
            24 June 2016 at 4:40 pm

            I know right!!! Sweden & Finland had them too, though I think they were underground, but Denmark it wasn’t actually illegal to run dog brothels til the mid 2000s? sometime in the last 10-15 years anyway. Was a worldwide petition helped get them banned too.

  21. North 21
    23 June 2016 at 6:48 pm

    Nothing to see here…….except the PM’s security boys do a shocking job of dying the PM’s hair…….and even dogs don’t trust Mark Mitchell…….

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/81380931/john-key-admits-confidential-cafe-slipup-while-defending-protection-officer

  22. Chooky 22
    23 June 2016 at 7:32 pm

    Some in power in the USA don’t want peace in Syria …which is what many around the world thought all along…a dangerous situation…especially if Hillary becomes President

    ‘Dissent memo’

    https://www.rt.com/shows/crosstalk/347703-syria-russia-pentagon-cia/

    “A Syrian showdown is looming. Rebellion has broken out in the ranks of the State Department against Obama’s handling of the conflict. The Pentagon and the CIA are at odds. And Russia has demonstrated it has lost patience with Washington’s so-called moderates. The status quo cannot hold. CrossTalking with Richard Weitz, Mark Sleboda, and Lawrence Wilkerson.”

    ( and who is running the State Department?…what is their long term agenda for the Middle East?…whose interests are they representing?…surely not the American public’s)

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