“All show and no substance”

Written By: - Date published: 7:03 am, March 16th, 2017 - 147 comments
Categories: jacinda ardern, labour, leadership - Tags: , , ,

As widely reported, the nats have launched some nasty, personal attacks on Jacinda Ardern:

Gloves off: National MPs target Labour’s Jacinda Ardern in series of attacks

The National Party has stepped up its attacks on Labour’s new deputy leader Jacinda Ardern, saying she is only interested in putting her face on billboards and has achieved nothing as an MP.

The often-personal criticism during Parliament’s general debate today was led by Youth Minister Nikki Kaye, whose long rivalry with Ardern was until a week ago a friendly affair.
…
During the general debate this afternoon, Kaye went further, saying the caucus reshuffle which lead to Ardern’s promotion was a “superficial, cosmetic facelift”.

Kaye said she “struggled to name anything Jacinda had done” in her time in Parliament – a comment which prompted howls from other MPs in the House.
…
Kaye’s criticisms were echoed by other National MPs during the debate, suggesting a strategic attack on one of Labour’s biggest weapons. …

The comments alluding to Ardern’s looks are beneath contempt. Those alleging a lack of achievements are more relevant, but what opposition back-bencher ever has an opportunity for serious results?

In combination the attack of “all show and no substance” is a curious one for a party that was led for so many years by John Key, whose major “achievements” were dirty politics, pulling pony tails, and a failed flag referendum. (It is sometimes said that he “got us through the financial crisis”, but that was Michael Cullen).

Ardern is personable and popular, that is an achievement in itself, and it is (for better or for worse) very important in modern politics. She is of course taking the high road:

“I’m going to stick with the way I like to do politics, and it’s making sure that you keep away from making it too personal. But each to their own.”

Way to go.

https://twitter.com/grantrobertson1/status/841862880714735616

147 comments on ““All show and no substance” ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. bwaghorn 1
    16 March 2017 at 7:26 am

    At least the press are calling it what it is , instead of grabbing nationals dirty tricks and running with it, they’ve woken up one would hope.

  2. EE 2
    16 March 2017 at 7:45 am

    Mathew Hooten has been running this sort of hateful (and sexist) line for some time now..
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/73319715/Jacinda-Ardern-responds-to-being-called-pretty-bloody-stupid

    • dukeofurl 2.1
      16 March 2017 at 9:51 am

      Strangely Kaye has almost exactly the same background as Adern- after university a bit of time in the leaders office in Wellington, some time in policy jobs in London, a stint in an international political group.
      Kaye made a quick jump into cabinet but without any heavy weight portfolios- Food safety, Youth etc. She did have Civil Defence for 3 years but it was found wanting recently so was dumped from this and the job went to one of the Big beasts in Brownlee.
      Kaye is hardly the one to make waves on this issue- but of course its being run by Eagleson in the beehive as another in his long line of personal attacks.

      • Sacha 2.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 10:02 am

        Backed up with polling on attack lines by their pet Farrar, no doubt: http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2017/03/the_achievements_of_jacinda_ardern.html

      • Bob 2.1.2
        16 March 2017 at 1:28 pm

        By your own research Kaye has achieved more in her political career than Adern including beating Adern in the Auckland Central seat in successive elections.
        Kaye gets given a few lighter Ministerial portfolio’s, Adern gets deputy leader.
        Is this simply a reflection of the relative strength of the National caucus? Or is there some validity to Nicky Kaye’s call that this is a “superficial, cosmetic facelift”?

        • Robert Guyton 2.1.2.1
          16 March 2017 at 1:36 pm

          Is it a competition between Kaye and Ardern? When/how did that happen? Doesn’t seem real, somehow, does it.

          • Bob 2.1.2.1.1
            16 March 2017 at 2:26 pm

            dukeofearl made the comparison, which seemed to back up Kaye’s statement. Context is a wonderful thing, why dismiss it?

        • McFlock 2.1.2.2
          16 March 2017 at 2:44 pm

          Well, the “more in her political career” includes “Civil Defence for 3 years but it was found wanting recently so was dumped from this”.

          That’s a clue for context as to why Kaye is not in the same league as Ardern.

          • Bob 2.1.2.2.1
            16 March 2017 at 3:03 pm

            “That’s a clue for context as to why Kaye is not in the same league as Ardern”
            The Auckland Central electorate seems to disagree with you.

            I did note you left out the “and the job went to one of the Big beasts in Brownlee”, that’s just a political metaphor though aye, nothing nasty or personal there.

            • McFlock 2.1.2.2.1.1
              16 March 2017 at 3:29 pm

              electorate MP != minister

              And if you think “one of the big beasts” was an allusion to body type rather than caucus seniority/rank, who are the other “beasts”?

              • Bob …
                16 March 2017 at 4:20 pm

                “if you think “one of the big beasts” was an allusion to body type rather than caucus seniority/rank, who are the other “beasts”?”
                Funny how you don’t equate that statement to physical appearance, yet you still think “superficial, cosmetic facelift” is an allusion to looks rather than changing the demographic of the Labour Leadership.
                I guess we can all jump to our own conclusions.

                • Robert Guyton …
                  16 March 2017 at 5:29 pm

                  ” cosmetic facelift” isn’t an allusion to looks?

                  I’m flabbergasted to hear that, Bob!

                  I thought it was one of the more cut and dried examples. What leads you to dissociate “cosmetic facelift” from appearance???

                  • Bob …
                    16 March 2017 at 6:29 pm

                    It was said in reference to a change from a 69 year old as deputy to a 36 year old. I see Kaye’s saying as an allusion to the fact that Adern is a younger face with no additional capability, in an attempt to appeal to younger voters. I guess I see it more as a reflection on the Labour Party rather than Adern herself.

                • McFlock …
                  16 March 2017 at 6:23 pm

                  No, I was drawing a conclusion based on the context of your faux outrage and your raising of the Brownlee beast comment in a thread about Ardern being judged on looks.

                  Basically, you just goaded me into saying “if you say Jehova one more time!!!“. Good for you 🙄

    • mosa 2.2
      17 March 2017 at 12:58 am

      Smells like desperation politics to me and National are behaving like a third term National government always does….Attack anything that moves unless its wealthy.

  3. red-blooded 3
    16 March 2017 at 7:45 am

    I’m so sick of female politicians being attacked on the basis of looks. Helen Clark was seen as too masculine, Jacinda Ardern is somehow seen as too feminine. It’s time we all got over this shallow, sexist shit. It’s not confined to NZ, of course; just ask Julia Gillard how she was treated by commentators in Australia.

    Who remembers any comments along these lines about Bill English or John Key? How about Little? Cullen? Any notable NZ male politician?

    The fact that this rubbish is being fronted by another woman is sadly ironic. Nicky Kaye needs to take a good look at herself (looking at her actions and attitude, not her appearance).

    • BM 3.1
      16 March 2017 at 7:55 am

      Actually, it’s you who’s the old sexist, male politicians attack each other all the time and no one bats an eyelid.

      A female calls out another female and it’s all shocking and outrageous and “Oh what a horrible person she is!!”.
      It’s these sort of old school sexist attitudes that keep women from being able to compete on an equal footing with males.

      If Jacinda is such a delicate wallflower and needs to be protected from any sort of criticism then she shouldn’t even be in politics let alone the deputy leader of a political party that may be running the country in six months time.

      • One Anonymous Bloke 3.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 8:16 am

        Since when does reference to personal appearance count as criticism?

        …we’re politicians, we all need to be held to account. But surely that scrutiny needs to be based on fact, and if we’re going one step further, maybe it needs to factor in the kind of representatives we want in this country by scrutinising their ideas, their advocacy, their priorities.

        Jacinda Ardern.

      • JanM 3.1.2
        16 March 2017 at 10:59 am

        Can you really not tell the difference?

      • the pigman 3.1.3
        17 March 2017 at 7:51 pm

        “If Jacinda is such a delicate wallflower…

        You know, just by bungling that phrase, you’ve demonstrated the exact attitudes you’re supposedly railing against.

        You want her to be a wallflower.
        But she’s the deputy leader of the NZ Labour Party.
        And come September, she’ll be your Deputy PM.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 3.2
      16 March 2017 at 8:14 am

      It’s time we all got over this shallow, sexist shit.

      The Left got over this shit (with occasional Brownlee-related lapses) decades ago.

      • gsays 3.2.1
        16 March 2017 at 8:41 am

        Now, not accusing you of this oab, but folk are lining up to comment on the slow strip tease of Joyce and English.
        Somehow the hypocrisy is rich this morning.

      • tuppence shrewsbury 3.2.2
        16 March 2017 at 3:39 pm

        No, as you can see over on KB, senior labour personages are still at it with the shallow sexist shit. Lets not forget the rampant homophobia of the same senior labour person, “tinkerbell” and all that.

        Or shall we forget how the labour leader wants to parachute in a roastbuster supporter? seems to me sexism and it’s ol mates, misogyny and homophobia are alive and well in the left.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 3.2.2.1
          16 March 2017 at 3:47 pm

          As I said: Robert Guyton’s comment at 9 is a better way to put it.

          • Tuppence Shrewsbury 3.2.2.1.1
            16 March 2017 at 6:00 pm

            I’m talking about Trevor mallard, not an anonymous commentator on the standard

  4. Brian 4
    16 March 2017 at 7:52 am

    I can smell the fear!!!

    • Infused 4.1
      16 March 2017 at 8:45 am

      It’s yourself you are smelling.

      • WILD KATIPO 4.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 12:53 pm

        Good on you Jacinda – don’t show fear to the primitives.

        You know,… if you listen ,.. there seems to be a strong similarity with National party MP’s to these alleged Sasquatch recordings from 1972-75…

        And they , just like the alleged Sasquatch , emit a powerful and offensive stench when they feel threatened…

        Im sure most will agree…

        Sasquatch Vocalizations: Clips from the Berry/Morehead Recordings …
        Video for ron morehead sierra sounds▶ 1:24

      • Tophat 4.1.2
        16 March 2017 at 1:38 pm

        oops sorry, beg my pardon that was me. ;->

  5. Sabine 5
    16 March 2017 at 7:55 am

    what is Nikki Kaye known for?

    • Pete George 5.1
      16 March 2017 at 8:01 am

      She’s a Minister of course, but before she became a minister she did a lot of work in support of the Marriage Equality Bill.

      She also fought (against her own party) and won against mining on Great Barrier island.

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/8226023/Kaye-brings-energy-humanity-and-commitment-to-Cabinet

      • risildowgtn 5.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 8:22 am

        She also was involved and therefore named in Dirty Politics

        Not so squaeky clean @ all

        • the pigman 5.1.1.1
          17 March 2017 at 8:29 pm

          Not just involved in Dirty Politics, holding strategy meetings with her mate Cactus Kate (that known fluffy moderate), David Farrar, Cameron Slater, Tina Nixon (Busted Blonde), Adolf Finkelstein (haven’t seen him here in a while have we?) and the then-head of the Wellington Chamber of Commerce.

          From Dirty Politics:

          Meanwhile in February 2008, a few days after the Ansell–Slater conversation, Slater convened a gathering of right-wing bloggers at the Wildfire restaurant on Auckland’s Princes Wharf. He told the group, who wrote under such pseudonyms as Adolf Fiinkensein, Gooner and Insolent Prick, and included blogger and future National MP Nikki Kaye, that their table was ‘booked under the name of
          VRWC … be careful folks it is a full moon after all.’

          This referred to the group’s tongue-in-cheek title, the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. The occasion for the dinner was their Wellington colleague David Farrar being in town.

          But don’t worry, Kaye’s a moderate, socially liberal, fluffy little bunny!

      • Sabine 5.1.2
        16 March 2017 at 8:48 am

        Marriage equality – you want to give Nikki Kaye credit for what was a Labour MP’s bill?

        as per Wikipedia

        : On 14 May 2012, Labour Party MP Louisa Wall stated that she would introduce a private member’s bill, the Marriage (Definition of Marriage) Amendment Bill, allowing same-sex couples to marry.[9] The bill was submitted to the members’ bill ballot on 30 May 2012.[10] It was drawn from the ballot and passed its first and second readings on 29 August 2012 and 13 March 2013, respectively.[11][12] The final reading passed on 17 April 2013 by 77 votes to 44.[13][14] Supporters in the galleries greeted the bill’s passage with applause and sang the traditional Maori love song “Pokarekare Ana”, with many MPs joining in.[15] Conservative lobby group Family First NZ called its passage “an arrogant act of cultural vandalism”.[16] The bill received royal assent from Governor-General Jerry Mateparae on 19 April and took effect on 19 August 2013.[17][18]
        The Marriage (Definition of Marriage) Amendment Act 2013 amendment the Marriage Act 1955 to include a definition of marriage to explicitly allow same-sex marriages and to amend other legislation as necessary. The definition reads: “marriage means the union of 2 people, regardless of their sex, sexual orientation, or gender identity”.[19] Prior to the passage of the Marriage (Definition of Marriage) Amendment Act 2013 there was no definition of marriage in the Marriage Act 1955 or other New Zealand legislation.:

        and she singlehandeldy prevented mining on Great Barrier Island?

        Nah, she was just one lone voice out of tens of thousands of Kiwis – mind, i understand that your Party really does not care about the voices of ordinary kiwis.

        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10642425
        http://www.minesandcommunities.org/article.php?a=10089
        http://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/local-news/waiheke-marketplace/3939860/Barrier-escapes-mining-threat

        ” Around 40,000 protesters united in a march up Auckland’s Queen St in May, bringing traffic to a standstill. Tens of thousands of people also put in submissions and signed a petition against the unpopular proposals.

        MP for Auckland Central Nikki Kaye backed the protests, lodging her own objections to the proposals.

        She says: “I am very pleased with the outcome. We’ve ended up with greater environmental protection.”

        Her Labour counterpart Jacinda Ardern took part in the Queen St protest and says the issue has introduced the government to a whole new generation of New Zealanders willing to march for what they believe in.

        “What this has shown is that New Zealanders are extremely passionate about conserving their clean, green image, and that it should be the people who decide how it is that we use our natural resources.”

        Waiheke Forest and Bird co-secretary Sue Fitchett was also among the protesters. She says she is delighted to hear about the u-turn.

        “It was a stupid idea. If there are going to be any further proposals over removing protection on Schedule Four land, they will be totally opposed by the Waiheke branch of Forest and Bird.”

        Meanwhile, government has announced it will undertake an aeromagnetic survey of non Schedule Four land in Northland and on the South Island’s West Coast to learn more about which areas have the highest concentrations of minerals.

        Mr Brownlee says: “New Zealanders have given the minerals sector a clear mandate to go and explore that land, and where appropriate, within the constraints of the resource consent process, utilise its mineral resources for everyone’s benefit.”” quote end.

        So really, You might want to credit the public of NZ, the Green Party, Forest and Bird, the Labour Party, for the victory, cause all Nikki Kaye did is what everyone else said. Hell no.
        and again, this only affect Great Barrier Island and the Coromandles. The rest of the country at the time was still very much and is still very much up for Sale and we are hearing peeps and have heard peeps from Nikki Kaye about that.

        http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/3935783/Government-confirms-mining-backdown

        So really we can agree that other then writing nasty and badly costed Facebook posts about breakfast that people on a benefit and without electricity can’t afford she has achieved nothing much of value for the citizens of NZ and especially her electorate.
        https://www.facebook.com/NikkiKayeMP/posts/10152351809787957

        but hey, property prices in the Inner City have gone up, so i am sure a few property speculators and owners are happy to throw dollars at her for her reelection? Cause being a do nothing Minister for the National Party for several years sure does beat putting in a honest day work.

        So maybe, if one sits in a Glasshouse with little to show for herself, she should abstain from throwing stones, lest she comes across as bitter, mean and scared of a potential hiding by voters. And if that happens, she has no one to blame but herself, after all she won the last election, so again, what has she got to show for?

        Fuck all. Just like the rest of the National Party led Government. Fuck all other high rents, high houseprices, high electricity costs, high food costs, high health care, high child care, sold state assets, children sleeping in cars, high homelessness, high unemployment, under employment, cut services, cut benefits for the needy, defunded shelters for women and men, defunded services for mental health and so on and so on and so on.

        so again, what has she done that would distinguish her from Jacintha Ardern?

  6. Robert Guyton 6
    16 March 2017 at 8:27 am

    “She also fought (against her own party) and won against mining on Great Barrier island.”
    Beat a straw man, ya mean.

  7. Keith 7
    16 March 2017 at 8:38 am

    I don’t know about Key. He toiled quietly away setting us up as a tax haven, probably on par with Cayman’s or similar until some bastard hacked some shitty accounting firm in Panama. In theory for John it was at that point – game over, thanks for playing.

    And I think that kind of thing was what Key was really about. Looking after and enhancing extreme wealth and his, using New Zealand’s first rate name as a front.

    In fact his achievements are probably far greater than we realise, in a dark sense, and nothing that did the rest of his fellow Kiwi’s any favours either!

  8. Cinny 8
    16 March 2017 at 8:39 am

    Some girls turn into real bitches when they feel jealous or threatened. That’s it in a nutshell.

    Jacinda, so impressed with how you are handling little catty issues like this one. As well just wanted to say, I’ve heard so many positive comments within my community about you, especially how you respond to the media. Clever lady, keep up the good work.

    • Heather Grimwood 8.1
      16 March 2017 at 9:19 am

      to Cinny at 8 : I agree about the cattiness observable in the House Wednesday by Nicky Kaye and supporting speakers ….akin to subteen behaviour which undoubtedly indicates a concerted attack on Jacinda. Absolutely disgusting from representatives of their electors supposedly advancing the cause of those for whom they are they are responsible.

      • Bearded Git 8.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 9:47 am

        Trust Maggie Barry to get involved…a nasty piece of work behind that personable exterior.

        • JanM 8.1.1.1
          16 March 2017 at 11:02 am

          Can you honestly name one national mp at the moment who is not? There might be one or two hidden away there but I can’t think of one !

          • rhinocrates 8.1.1.1.1
            16 March 2017 at 2:58 pm

            Plenty! A lot of them are nasty pieces of work without a personable exterior.

      • Johan 8.1.2
        16 March 2017 at 4:22 pm

        Nothing new here. Good on Jacinda to keep her eye on the ball. National have always strayed away from playing the game as a professional. Remember watching the madness of Shonkey as a “debater”, in the legislature, what a display of vile and ugliness. Wednesday’s scene by Nicky Kaye proofs again that National Party members are incapable of playing the ball, always the person.

  9. Robert Guyton 9
    16 March 2017 at 8:41 am

    It’s true, some commenters here criticize National party MPs, even mocking their physical characteristics on occasion, but usually in response to some particular appalling action by the MP, not just as a matter of course. The difference here, is that Nikki Kaye, Hooten et al, are attacking Jacinda Ardern as a matter of strategy, in order to establish a meme that will serve them as it grows and the election nears. Some fly-by rightwing commenters here are doing the same thing, for the same purpose. It’s a thing.

    • Sabine 9.1
      16 March 2017 at 9:03 am

      its when one has got nothing to show for one needs to attack ones opponents on things such as ‘their record’ etc etc etc., lest anyone talks about ones own record, and sadly for Nikki Kaye, she is a National Party MP and will have to live with the record of the John Key /Bill English do Nothing at all but sell State Assets and increase prices on everyone National Party led Government.

      Fact is that Nikki Kaye has absolutely nothing to show for, she has achieved nothing note worthy and is as happy as the rest of her party to scapegoat someone else to hide their callousness and disrespect towards the NZ public and their electorate.

      • Wayne 9.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 9:32 am

        Sabine,

        I am pretty sure Nikki is more than happy to stand on National’s record. The economic performance (growth, employment, inflation, govt surplus) is among the best in the OECD and is internationally admired.

        She can personally point to CBD rail, Aotea National Park as among her more notable achievements.

        I don’t know why Standardnistas think National MP’s will be embarrassed about the things they have done in govt. In fact they are more than happy to campaign on their achievements and their record.

        It is many on the Left who are under the delusion that they need to convince voters that NZ is some sort of hellhole.

        I note that Andrew Little does not do this. In fact he was crowing about surpluses the other day and all the choices it gave him, and how he could use them better than National. It is actually a compliment to National successfully running the economy.

        • Sabine 9.1.1.1
          16 March 2017 at 10:01 am

          Yep, i think it will be very nice to see the National Party go run on the accomplishments of the thousands of people living in cars and depending on food parcels to make ends meet. I agree with you.

          Inflation is down?
          http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/business/294499/inflation-falls-to-16-year-low
          Rents are up
          http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/77175211/Rents-increase-as-landlords-use-new-year-to-review-costs
          http://www.trademe.co.nz/property/price-index/for-rent/

          Unemployment? Mate, just because WINZ is handing out illegal contracts not containing any hours, lieu of work, like candy does not mean unemployment has gone down.
          http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/money/2016/11/major-recruitment-company-accused-of-exploiting-jobless.html

          You should have also seen that I did indeed give her praise for high costs of living in the CBD, which usually translate into high profits for a few speculators and owners, who surely will rejoice in the Tram line – which actually existed well before Nikki Kaye was born. But hey, did she do it all by herself, or is this just another instance of her jumping on the bandwagon, cause i can’t really find anything there. 🙂

          As for the Great Barrier Island, do you really want me to put up again all the publicly available links that point to several thousands of protestors against the folly of hte National Party, the work of the Green Party, the work of Forrest and Birds Society, the work of the Labour Party, NZFirst etc etc and make it ‘her’ victory”? Seriously?

          http://www.doc.govt.nz/news/media-releases/2014/new-aotea-conservation-park-approved/
          according to this little piece of paper over 7000 submission were lodged and you think that Nikki Kaye did it singlehandedly? IF she did, care to point to a statement that can be found somewhere, cause its funny her name is just popping up under other.

          http://www.forestandbird.org.nz/files/file/aotea-conservation-park-submission-form.pdf
          http://www.forestandbird.org.nz/files/file/Aotea%20National%20Park%20submission%20attachment.pdf

          She has done fuck all, and it will be fun to see the National Party run on the success story of un-affordable rental properties, un-affordable house ownership, high living costs, high unemployment, high homelessness, cut services for mental health especially in Christchurch, cut services for shelters for women and men to just name a few, rebuild of CHCH , the quality of our shitty rivers and lakes, the quality of drinking water in Havelock North and the many many more instances where the National Party put itself, its donors before country and people.

          So please what has she achieved that was not started by others, is funded by others, and was pushed through by others so that all she ever had to do is to quip but i voted for it. 🙂
          Any legislation she wrote and put forward that benefits the country? Anything? Something?
          Let her stand on the record of the John Key/Bill English do nothing National Party Goverment.
          Let her explain this winter why we have children sleeping in cars or families raking up tens of thousand of dollars in Motel bills as emergency aid.
          Let her explain why we have our emergency services overloaded with kids and elderlies sick of the flu and colds because they can’t afford to see a regular doctor.
          Let her explain why again we have people die in burning Houses because they used alternative heating methods as the line costs in our rural areas make heating a luxury not afforded to them.
          Let them explain why families have to choose between heating, paying rent or eating because they can’t afford another 50$ raise in rent per week.

          I for one look forward to the National Party MP’s running on the success of the National Party of John Key runaway PM and Bill English housing benefit fraud from Dipton.

          Bring it. ITs gonna be fun.

        • dukeofurl 9.1.1.2
          16 March 2017 at 10:02 am

          CBD Rail was all Les Browns doing

          Nikki kaye seems to think she is the local ward councillor and takes credit for every footpath and park improvement.
          She is elected to represent them in Wellington, and her achievements in Civil Defence after 3 years were such that she was recently sacked and the job given to a real minister- a busy one at that and an obvious sign of displeasure

          • Sabine 9.1.1.2.1
            16 March 2017 at 10:12 am

            yep, she has got fuck all to show for.

            All she does is jump on ‘feel good’ bandwagons to show that there are National Party Mp’s that ‘care’ but in effect she has achieved nothing. NOTHING.

            And me thinks that the Nationalistas here do protest much, without linking to any of her achievements. Mhh, might it be that there are no links no press releases or anything to link to.

          • JanM 9.1.1.2.2
            16 March 2017 at 11:06 am

            And now, just to show us all how much they value us all, they’re about to give her the Education portfolio – eeek!

        • Robert Guyton 9.1.1.3
          16 March 2017 at 10:25 am

          Wayne says,
          “I am pretty sure Nikki is more than happy to stand on National’s record.”
          However, she was, apparently, not happy with National’s attempts to mine Great Barrier Island.
          Wayne goes on,
          “I don’t know why Standardnistas think National MP’s will be embarrassed about the things they have done in govt.” but mistakes the views here, imo, where “Standardistas” rather believe that National MPs should be embarrassed by the things they have done in government, but are well aware that most of them aren’t. This is initially puzzling to “Standardistas”, I’m thinking, but only until the motivations of those National MPs are teased apart and considered. Then, most here feel a little repelled, from what I can gather.

          • Sabine 9.1.1.3.1
            16 March 2017 at 10:29 am

            i don’t think National Party MP’s can be embarrassed. It would mean that at a minimum they have to have common decency and a sense of right or wrong.
            And as the housing welfare fraud Bill English showed the country, its only wrong when a poor person does it, if a rich person swindles its a ‘not understanding of the procedures and regulations.

            heck, i don’t even think they have left he basic emotion of shame.

            • Draco T Bastard 9.1.1.3.1.1
              16 March 2017 at 11:39 am

              i don’t think National Party MP’s can be embarrassed. It would mean that at a minimum they have to have common decency and a sense of right or wrong.

              Psychopaths don’t have a conscience.

        • Robert Guyton 9.1.1.4
          16 March 2017 at 10:29 am

          “I note that Andrew Little does Bill English did not do this. In fact he was crowing about surpluses (of Michael Cullen) the other day several years ago and all the choices it gave him, and how he could use them better than National Labour. It is actually a compliment to National Labour successfully running the economy.

        • s y d 9.1.1.5
          16 March 2017 at 12:07 pm

          “The economic performance (growth, employment, inflation, govt surplus) is among the best in the OECD and is internationally admired.” so says Wayne.

          Kind of like studying a bucket of s**t and noting that there’s a nice big, shiny fatty one floating on top…

          https://www.interest.co.nz/news/86532/gdp-grows-only-04-december-quarter-versus-market-pick-07-and-rbnz-forecast-10-stats-nz

          so 0.4%GDP growth on 0.8% population growth, the old migration boost 1 trick pony is falling over

        • AB 9.1.1.6
          16 March 2017 at 2:58 pm

          The sleek, blithe voice of privilege. It is always thus.

        • Johan 9.1.1.7
          16 March 2017 at 4:28 pm

          Poor Wayne seems to suffer from tunnel vision, let him open his eyes. Of course RWNJ like Wayne aren’t allowed to see further than their nose.

        • gnomic 9.1.1.8
          17 March 2017 at 11:09 pm

          Seek treatment for your delusions.

          “I am pretty sure Nikki is more than happy to stand on National’s record. The economic performance (growth, employment, inflation, govt surplus) is among the best in the OECD and is internationally admired.”

          Pathetic bullshit I trust you don’t believe. If in case you do, get help right now today.

          This regime is the saddest I have seen in my lifetime. Key. Joyce. English. Smith. Brownlee.

          Want any of these on your life raft? I thought not. But maybe you do since you seem to be simple.

    • gsays 9.2
      16 March 2017 at 9:18 am

      Hi Robert, this is where the hypocrisy lies.
      Labour is forming a meme in election year: national are lousy financial managers ( one I would agree with), coupled with Grant Robertson smugly referring to the strip tease image over cornflakes.

      • Robert Guyton 9.2.1
        16 March 2017 at 10:18 am

        A general meme and a personal attack meme are different fish, gsays. Attempts to discredit a party are run of the mill political stuff. Premeditated and organised attacks on an individual unconnected from any actual misdemeanors is nothing more than nasty. It’s not hypocritical to practice the former in this instance, imo.

  10. mary_a 10
    16 March 2017 at 9:41 am

    Attacking on a personal basis, is losing the argument.

    National MPs running scared now. Getting nasty. Good.

    A Little/Ardern led Labour government coming up in September.

    • The decrypter 10.1
      16 March 2017 at 10:37 am

      So sad. Flotsam and jetsam is all that remains of what was once a proud political party. Looking now ,with horror,at their fellow MP’s they realise,deep down, that the skids are under both themselves and their “National lying party”. . I believe most of them have stumbled through the ‘denial’ stage of grief since ‘john the liar’ scarped .The anger stage of grief is upon most them. Out-bursts will be the norm. Some – smith, for example lag behind and remain in denial and continue lying, just like the good old days. Just who is poking him with a sharp stick I still have to determine. May you drift on through the polluted, shark infested waters to some barren rock. R.I.P.

    • Planet Earth 10.2
      16 March 2017 at 11:04 am

      “Attacking” a politician’s achievements or lack thereof isn’t “personal”, it’s professional criticism, and that’s as it should be – don’t see anyone holding back attacking John Key’s track record on TS!

      • Draco T Bastard 10.2.1
        16 March 2017 at 11:54 am

        Except that the National Party strategists started off with attacking her looks.

        And they’re lying about her achievements.

        • Planet Earth 10.2.1.1
          16 March 2017 at 12:56 pm

          Link, reference or citation please

          • Robert Guyton 10.2.1.1.1
            16 March 2017 at 1:16 pm

            Planet Earth – I wonder if you’re working up the idea that National and those associated haven’t been using Jacinda’s (pleasant) appearance as an opportunity for a spot/campaign of mockery designed to undermine her standing,’cause if you are, it’s not ringing true to me. Key was adept at demeaning by calling others, “son” and I’m sure he was advised to do so, just as Bennett used “sweetie” as a diminisher, most likely under the same guidance; those are age old bully tactics; giving your opponent a “lower status” tag in order to assert your own self-assigned “higher” status.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 10.2.1.1.2
            16 March 2017 at 3:54 pm

            Cf: the links and references in the OP. Did you read it?

            • Robert Guyton 10.2.1.1.2.1
              16 March 2017 at 4:01 pm

              I did, OAB (don’t think PE has given them anything more than a cursory glance though). This interested me;
              “Much more important to Ms Ardern’s rise, as for Mr Key’s, are her regular appearances in the likes of the Women’s Weekly and Next and on Back Benches and Breakfast.” and it was the phrase, “as for Mr Key’s” that gave me the feeling that the disquiet being exhibited by the National Party machine around Jacinda is because they recognise the strategy and fear that Labour has the candidate to exploit the advantage they held when Key walked amongst them. Key’s fled and Jacinda’s the focus of the powerful force that popular media can be. It’s a very satisfying turn of events, for those of us who enjoy irony.

            • Planet Earth 10.2.1.1.2.2
              16 March 2017 at 4:01 pm

              Yes, why? Nothing there about “National Party strategists attacking her looks”.

              • Carolyn_nth …
                16 March 2017 at 4:11 pm

                Actually, TBF, party strategists are usually behind the scenes people, and don’t do the actual attacking. They produce the approach for others (MPs, bloggers, Dirty Politics hit people) to follow.

                So there usually won’t be anything public that can be directly attributed to strategists.

                • Planet Earth …
                  16 March 2017 at 4:19 pm

                  Do you have any proof of this assertion, because I’m detecting a strong smell of bullshit. The Rules of this site are quite clear about making unsubstantiated assertions.

                  Sorry about your ankle – I know they’re very painful and can take a while to come right!

                  • Draco T Bastard …
                    16 March 2017 at 4:50 pm

                    http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/spin/

                    The only smell of BS around here is emanating from you.

                    • Planet Earth …
                      16 March 2017 at 5:07 pm

                      Ah, the guy that lied about “the National Party strategists started off with attacking her looks” – got anything to back that up?

                  • Robert Guyton …
                    16 March 2017 at 5:18 pm

                    “I believe” gets you around Planet Earth’s pedantry;
                    “I believe” National and those associated have been using Jacinda’s (pleasant) appearance as an opportunity for a spot/campaign of mockery designed to undermine her standing.
                    Or, “It’s obvious to me and most commenters here” that National and those associated have been using Jacinda’s (pleasant) appearance as an opportunity for a spot/campaign of mockery designed to undermine her standing.
                    Or, “It’s generally accepted that” National and those associated have been using Jacinda’s (pleasant) appearance as an opportunity for a spot/campaign of mockery designed to undermine her standing.

                    Planet Earth seemingly doesn’t believe that National and those associated have been using Jacinda’s (pleasant) appearance as an opportunity for a spot/campaign of mockery designed to undermine her standing, but he’s wrong, imo. His declared inability to locate any instances where this is the case caused me to feast upon my metaphorical hat, constructed, fortunately for me, from rice crackers. I admit to adding hummus to the meal.

                    • Planet Earth …
                      16 March 2017 at 5:28 pm

                      Interesting Robert – so is your belief evidence-based, or did you just make it up?

                    • Robert Guyton …
                      16 March 2017 at 5:42 pm

                      Certainly evidence based and there are numerous examples I could cite. If you had a genuine interest, you’d find some of them yourself. In fact, others here have gifted you some of those but you’ve chosen to interpret them in your own way, which from an observers pov, looks like you have an agenda of denial and an intention to choke discussion with petulant cries of “prove it!!”. Loosen up, Planet and join the discussion at the rate of flow it is travelling at. Trying to dam the flow with pedantry is…boring.

                    • Planet Earth []
                      16 March 2017 at 5:48 pm

                      OK, we’ll have to disagree- I see a sub-thread of false and unproven assertions about National or associates attacking Jacinda Ardern for her looks, you see pedantry. Good luck to you on Planet Guyton!

                    • Robert Guyton …
                      16 March 2017 at 5:49 pm

                      “OPINION: Why did National wheel out Nikki Kaye to launch a personal attack on Jacinda Ardern in the House?

                      It’s been the talk in Parliament’s corridors and in the coffee shops down on Lambton Quay today.

                      The aim was obvious; try and “frame” her as empty, superficial, without any significant achievements. A show pony. It’s the same tactic National has used with effect in the past. When Andrew Little took the leadership it immediately launched a coordinated attempt to type-cast him as “Angry Andy”.”

                      Planet Earth: here’s a snippet of OPINION, not to be dismissed, I suggest. It’s these people, closer to the action than you or I, that build their views from a myriad of information, distill it for our sakes and do so intelligently. Clamouring for “links” and “citations’ ad nauseum won’t get you anywhere when we are talking about views such as those expressed in this article. Trust your gut feelings, Planet. Jacinda has caused National’s gut to churn, I reckon 🙂

                    • Planet Earth []
                      16 March 2017 at 6:20 pm

                      No offence, Robert, but you do know that opinions are like the proverbial, in that everybody has one.
                      I will confess to not having been Parliament’s corridors or Lambton Quay’s coffee bars today, so you may have heard more of them than I.

                    • Robert Guyton …
                      16 March 2017 at 5:51 pm

                      This, Planet:
                      “The aim was obvious…”

                      And, it is. But not, seemingly, to you.

                      Curious.

                    • McFlock …
                      16 March 2017 at 6:27 pm

                      it’s a sad day when all tories can do is to pretend to be even bigger imbeciles than they really are.

  11. BevanJS 11
    16 March 2017 at 10:39 am

    “Ardern is personable and popular, that is an achievement in itself” – not really. John Key was notable for this and what did he achieve?

    • Ad 11.1
      16 March 2017 at 10:46 am

      3 terms and an easy succession into a likely 4th term.

      If all Ardern did was help do that for Labour, I’d give her an early Gold Badge.

      • dukeofurl 11.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 11:08 am

        The Wise Owls may hoot and blink rapidly in disgust, but a lot of politics is perception.
        Annette King was invisible for the vast numbers of voters and Jacs being ‘highly visible’ is a plus.
        She doesnt even have to be a ministerial power house when that time comes.

  12. michelle 12
    16 March 2017 at 10:59 am

    The fact the gnats are personally attacking Jacinda says to me they are really worried and they should be because people are sick and tired of their antics and bullshert. The water issue is but one issue but really significant.
    All Jacinda has to say is we will address superannuation if the NZ people vote for us we will conduct comprehensive research and consult widely with NZers and then develop a policy based on the findings that suits the majority of NZers rather that be weak and park the issue for 20 years like the gnats have done. The gnats need to get some guts like there mate John said despite him having non himself.

    • Matthew Whitehead 12.1
      16 March 2017 at 1:09 pm

      Yep, as we saw with Clark, the Nats don’t bother with personal attacks unless they’re skeered, and know they can’t tax cut/pretend to understand the economy their way through a debate with someone.

      While I have misgivings about whether Jacinda has the policy nous to be deputy, with Grant Robertson handling Finance and Andrew Little a bit heavier on policy than on charisma, she’s not a bad pick.

      Basically the nats are just jealous their media darling is leaving and now Labour’s one is high-profile.

    • Johan 12.2
      16 March 2017 at 4:58 pm

      The gnats should be worried, after all they are presenting a tired old bench as candidates and must front-up in the upcoming election why they have failed to tackle important issues while in power for three terms. Jacinda is young, bright and has mastered the art of the sound bite. She should attract many millennial age group people to vote Labour.

  13. saveNZ 13
    16 March 2017 at 11:28 am

    I just hope Greens and Labour do a deal on the Auckland CBD electorate votes so that we can change the central Auckland MP to a Labour/Green one!

    • Matthew Whitehead 13.1
      16 March 2017 at 1:13 pm

      They’re not, and why would it matter if they did?

      Your electorate MP is only relevant if they’re someone who wouldn’t get in on the list, which for most Auckland MPs isn’t the case.

  14. Robert Glennie 14
    16 March 2017 at 11:32 am

    When John Key quit, it was like a good cold front had arrived in the National Party.

    https://willnewzealandberight.com/2017/03/16/end-of-the-good-weather-for-national/

    Now I get the impression that a second one is approaching the Nats, bringing thunderstorms and other bad weather.

    Roll on the thunderstorms!

  15. McFlock 15
    16 March 2017 at 11:41 am

    Praising with faint damnation – the only thing the nats can bring up is criticism so petty and farcical that any guy making the criticism would be wide open to sexism allegations.

    On the plus side, at least that shows the nats are no longer as tone deaf as David Seymour. That’s, like, social improvement, right?

  16. Ethica 16
    16 March 2017 at 12:13 pm

    Jacinda proudly puts children at the forefront of her policies and speeches and has championed children and families in much of her work, even though she has only ever been an Opposition MP. That the National Party ignores all this says more about them than her. She also has integrity, a quality they probably don’t understand.

  17. Tiger Mountain 17
    16 March 2017 at 1:23 pm

    the Nat women just sat there when then PM Key insulted women and other parties women MPs in particular during the Christmas Island debacle; the Nat women too rarely show solidarity with other NZ women in public at least on anything, so this goes further than just an attack on Jacinda Ardern

    Thatcher lite types like Judith Collins and poor bashing, privacy breaching Paula “deputy dog” Bennett should be put on notice by the opposition

  18. Michael who failed Civics 18
    16 March 2017 at 1:25 pm

    Kaye’s personal attack on Ardern seems to have been effective as it was deplorable. I agree that attacks on a person’s appearance are contemptible but that’s the way the political game of Thrones is played. And Little did promote Ardern (and get rid of Annette King) largely because of her appearance. A more serious criticism of Ardern is her lack of substantial achievements during her time in politics. Of course, Ardern has spent the last decade out of government but, if she can’t lift her performance and score some solid hits against the Nats, she and her comrades will remain in opposition for a lot longer. In order to gain approval as an alternative government, Labour needs to function first as an effective opposition. I remember it did this very well between 1996-1999, with the result that it was perceived as highly competent and ready to govern by the time of the election later that year. That state of affairs does not apply to Labour in 2017 and no amount of cosmetic change will ever disguise the fact that Labour remains unfit for office.

    • McFlock 18.1
      16 March 2017 at 2:19 pm

      lol “cosmetic change”. You, Maggie Barry, and Nikki Kaye all get the same talking points?

      thanks for your concern.

      Ardern could either sling bullshit insults back, or not get personal. She’s done the latter, and that shows a better game than anything you lot have.

      • michelle 18.1.1
        16 March 2017 at 3:17 pm

        Jacinda just needs to take on board the words of Michelle Obama ‘when they go low we go high’.
        You can’t go much lower than the gnats as they have no integrity

    • Matthew Whitehead 18.2
      16 March 2017 at 2:24 pm

      Ardern’s been in opposition. Getting anything passed in opposition is a substantial achievement, and you’re qualified even if all you do is make the Minister you’re facing off against look bad.

      I’m actually not Ardern’s biggest fan, but this series of attacks against her since National realised she makes Bill look boring and Paula look heartless have definitely gone too far.

    • Johan 18.3
      16 March 2017 at 5:07 pm

      Michael: Your comment has the stench of a RWNJ.

      “And Little did promote Ardern (and get rid of Annette King) largely because of her appearance. A more serious criticism of Ardern is her lack of substantial achievements during her time in politics”.
      What evidence do you have to support these assertions? Sounds like they came directly out of you orifice. Try to remove your blinkers first before making an intelligent comment!

  19. Whispering Kate 19
    16 March 2017 at 4:11 pm

    Nikki Kaye has demeaned herself and become a lesser person by slagging off at Jacinda Adern, it has taken her from a reasonable MP into a petty immature school yard trouble maker. I would have thought her illness, serious as it was, would have given her lots of quiet time to reflect on the fragility of life and honed some life skills so that she would become a more reflective and thoughtful person to her fellow contemporaries. It is odd that she obviously hasn’t looked into herself more deeply and become a more rounded and mature person from her experience. My opinions only of course.

  20. Sacha 20
    16 March 2017 at 5:18 pm

    Political journo Vernon Small agrees the Nats are probably spooked by their polling about Ardern: http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/opinion/90508747/nationals-attack-on-labours-deputy-suggests-concerns-more-than-skin-deep

    • Carolyn_nth 20.1
      16 March 2017 at 5:34 pm

      Some extracts from the article for the benefit of some above:

      Why did National wheel out Nikki Kaye to launch a personal attack on Jacinda Ardern in the House?

      It’s been the talk in Parliament’s corridors and in the coffee shops down on Lambton Quay today.

      The aim was obvious; try and “frame” her as empty, superficial, without any significant achievements. A show pony. It’s the same tactic National has used with effect in the past. When Andrew Little took the leadership it immediately launched a coordinated attempt to type-cast him as “Angry Andy”.

      The language of the attacks by Kaye – who has squared off successfully against Ardern in two battles for Auckland Central – as well as fellow Minister Maggie Barry were unmistakably pointed.

      Her promotion to deputy leader of Labour was a “superficial, cosmetic facelift”. Youth Minister Kaye said she struggled to recall anything Ardern had achieved.

      There would be “a whole lot of photo ops … she’ll be across every billboard” but she had “failed our generation” in her comments on superannuation.

      Whether it was a wise move on National’s part is a different question.

      The speed and intensity of the attacks confirmed, if any confirmation was needed, that National sees her as a threat.

      And Alex Coleman links to kiwib to support his claim that DPF laid out the attack line last week.

  21. Robert Guyton 21
    16 March 2017 at 7:55 pm

    Who(m) said;
    “Jacinda does have many political skills. She is warm and funny. She is a good communicator. She is smart. She has been a political staffer and knows Parliament. She is comfortable in her own skin, and she is genuine.”

    Farrar, that’s whom 🙂

  22. JustMe 22
    17 March 2017 at 6:34 am

    Perhaps there is an element of jealousy by Kaye towards Adern. But then ALL National MPs have built up a wonderful(and I am speaking facetiously here)record of trying to demean others(even NZ voters)vocally. For example when NZers protested against the TPPA the then pm of NZ called the protestors as ‘rent a protestor’. In the lead up to the Mt Roskill byelection Parmjeet Parmar’s husband resorted to demeaning the wife of Michael Wood.
    And so if this is the behaviour of National MPs in attempt to demean themselves in the eyes of NZers then let them carry on. Their actions actually demean the National Party. It also shows they haven’t really grown up and are behaving like school yard bullies having temper tantrums.
    And so if a National MP cannot speak intelligently and on behalf of NZers then he/she shouldn’t speak at all. But then we all know National MPs have a habit of being asked a question by Opposition MPs at Question Time. They pounce up with a flourish and flippantly reply with a simple “Yes” or “No”. They then sit down and grin like village idiots.
    However, and yes I am getting personal here myself but I am not a politician, but most female National MPs that we have seen that are in senior positions are they look very similar to female concentration camp guards in Nazi Germany. Still I can only guess John Key didn’t want too much female eye-candy and so surrounded himself with hard looking women. He did however call Murray McCully ‘eye-candy’ which is still a puzzling statement from a male!

  23. marious 23
    28 March 2017 at 8:13 pm

    So the Nat’s are worried by Ardern.
    So they should be
    Bills falling in the polls its game on.

    As for super it should have become self funding under Kirk’s scheme but as usual National blow our chance under Muldoon. And again with Kiwi saver under Key. Some record, instead we pay out 12b a year and rising from taxes. It could have been used to pay for other much needed policies such as tax cuts for rich people instead of having to borrow public money for them.

    Kay attacks Ardern, she should be looking closer to home and defending her governments record if that’s possible. What has National actually achieved in the past 9 years.

    Record debt, the sell off of New Zealand, Deepening environmental problems, Huge increase in low paid work. Ardern may well hit a note with the voting public which is the whole point of Kay’s attack.

    Bring it on, it’ll become clear just what Ardern can achieve.

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