- Date published:
10:40 am, August 13th, 2014 - 104 comments
Categories: accountability, capitalism, democracy under attack, election 2014, john key, Spying, us politics - Tags: nicky hager, surveillance
Nicky Hager has certainly got the attention of political circles in NZ, by announcing his (untitled) book launch today at 5.15pm – time to make the 6pm TV news.
John Key is bracing for the release, suspecting, like many of us, that the book will relate to the GCSB, 5 Eyes and the Edward Snowden leaks.
Hager has had a journalistic interest in the Snowden leaks, the “Echelon network” (otherwise known as the 5 Eyes, US, Canadian, UK, Australia, NZ surveillance network).
Key has tried to blunt any potentially damage the book may do to him, by smearing Hager.
Tracey Watkins reports on Stuff:
The Government is bracing itself for revelations about the extent of New Zealand’s role in the Five Eyes spy network as author Nicky Hager prepares to unveil his latest book.
Hager is keeping silent on the subject of the book but Prime Minister John Key yesterday said he could not rule out the likelihood that Hager had obtained leaked documents from former American defence contractor Edward Snowden.
The Government appears certain that Snowden has documents detailing New Zealand’s spying activities as part of the United States-led Five Eyes surveillance network and that they will eventually come out.
Key said it was well known that Snowden had accessed a huge number of files, some of which related to New Zealand and Five Eyes. Asked if Hager was likely to reveal New Zealand had spied on other countries, he responded: “He might do.”
Key said he did not believe it was a coincidence that Hager was releasing his book now.
“Most people know that Nicky Hager is a screaming Left-wing conspiracy theorist. He’s hardly an authority on these matters . . . I’m not terribly worried.”
However, contrary to Key’s claims, Hager is a thorough research of international repute.
Back in December last year, security and strategic analyst, Paul Buchanan, warned:
It is not a matter of if but when Snowden makes damaging revelations about New Zealand’s role in the 5 Eyes network, including whom the GCSB spies upon at home and abroad. Prime Minister Key has already admitted as much, but maintains that he is unconcerned.
Given that possibility, the Government needs to prepare contingency plans for the diplomatic fallout that inevitably lies ahead.
There are many things about NZ’s current state surveillance services that are of concern: the lack of sufficient oversight (checks and balances that it is operating for the benefit of all Kiwis, in ways that do not undermine democracy); mission creep from a focus on security that protects against physical attacks on/in NZ, to a focus on “economic security” in ways that privilege multinational corporates; and from focus on external threats, to concerns about spying on New Zealanders.
While waiting for the launch, many have been tweeting possible Hager book tittles, as reported by Toby Manhire. Suggested titles include:
Smiley Wavey’s People
2 Hollow 2 Furious
An Agent at My Table
O Brethren, Where Art Thou
‘Seeds of Distrust – A Manual for the Sceptical Gardener’
[update: Livestream of book launch]
So far it sounds like a lot of squeaky to me.
Update #2] Title is “Dirty Politics” Iwas wrong.
It’s on attack politics, Key, Slater, Jason Ede.
I’d call it “Damp Squib”
you would! (@PR) Standard procedure.
infused and others are busy consulting their spin doctors and holding evening prayers – with or without Jamie Lee or his disciples. (Jamie Lee is unavaliable and still taking instructions from above)
Jason and Blubber have got past thinking “shit!”, and are now thinking – “how do we get out of this?” – Answer: KEEP BULLSHITTING, ramp up the spin – nothing to lose (Nicky H is a well known conspirissy theeerist, etc., etc. – Mind the lithp Dear Leader – some people might think you’re g-g-GAY)
Pop is still clutching his pearls and thinking of something ‘deep and meaningful’ to comment on – being the expert on all and sundry, and the master/mistress of the Universe, and in consideration of how his/her ‘minority’ status might pass the RW prejudice test – sugar daddies aside. (never mind – wipe it up wipe it up with XLO …… next …. next ….. get back to the stove bitch)
john and a few others are a bit challenged – but Yeah, but Nah – couldn’t happen here – we’re decent blokes
Pardon the reference to ‘Pop’, but he’s the ultimate vanity project
I reckon Karol knows exactly what’s in the book, otherwise why risk so much credibility on a guess?
Anyway, the only thing needed to be done to justify GCSB and SIS surveillance is to print the photo of the 7yr old Aussie kid holding a guy’s head.
you reckon do ya grumpy? I reckon you are wrong. Or are you saying you reckon John Key knows too?
“the photo of the 7yr old Aussie kid holding a guy’s head.”
It was a soldiers head.
Using a 7 year old is certainly child abuse.
How many children have the Israeli government just intentionally killed in Gaza grumpy?
It may well have been a “soldier” but ISIS have also been hacking children’s heads off too. I realise you are quite pro Hamas but are you also pro their allies, fellow Sunni terrorists ISIS?
Actually I don’t believe pretty much all the shit that comes out of those places, and nor do I believe the shit that comes out of Washington or Canberra or the Herald or the Times or whatever.
What I do believe is that hundreds of children were deliberately killed in Gaza last week.
I also believe the word “terrorist” is bullshit in almost all cases including the one you just mention.
I mostly believe that from our little corner of the world it is virtually impossible to take sides in most conflicts around the world – unless one still believes in cowboys and indians, which is about the level of knowledge, debate and consideration around these issues imo.
Explain how the secret services of the world helped that soldier
The soldier has helped the world. He has exposed the true evil facing civilisation. The Australian jihadist’s use of his 7yo son shows that we need to be super vigilant of the extremists in our midst. This is why Australia is ramping up it’s anti terrorist laws and why the vast majority of Kiwis want the same.
So, go ahead with this anti GCSB/SIS ranting, it just drives New zealand further way from the left.
I totally agree grumpy.
The book will be published.
NZ spies on the bad guys.
The bad guys are really bad.
The world likes NZ for spying on the bad guys.
Hagar likes the bad guys Quelle surprise……
5eyed fishy so if Key used 5eyes for his own political gain that would thrill you no doubt!
You were so Right Fishy Hager likes the bad guys !
i.e. John Key is the bad guy using the SIS to usurp democratic processes can’t wait for McCready with crowd sourcing to prosecute!
Cameron Slater should be arrested along with John Key for breaking the laws of the land this is far worse than a couple of cheques!
you used the awful beheading of the soldier to justify gcsb spying on us to keep us safe but you didnt answer my question about how spying to keep us safe, kept the soldier safe. It failed him didnt ir?
Because that family, the father, his brother and now his children will now be constantly monitored by our allies, including Australia. As Australian citizens, they have free access to New Zealand so it is good to know that they, and hundreds of others like them will be identified and stopped at the border. Likewise, those already in our midst, as shown at the anti Israel demo, will now be identified, tracked and monitored.
So in the 70’s there was a poster around of an American soldier in Viet Nam holding the head of an enemy (civilian or combatant unclear cause it’s only a head) with the caption:
Join The Army – Get A Head
I also remember pictures of US soldiers with collections of ears.
I assume that exposed the true evil facing civilisation as well.
Or maybe go and watch The Act Of Killing and be reminded us of the evil right wingers who tortured and killed those of the left in Indonesia.
All wars are shit and both sides in all wars can do (maybe even must do, cause it’s war for goodness sake) shitty things.
It seems to me that picking out one particular group of extremists on one side is rather odd.
With you all the way on your posts on this spying issue Grumpy!!
Well, grumpy, you now have given me a very good idea of how much credibility to attach to your opinions/guesses.
You really do wildly mis-understand my lack of powerful connections to the likes of Nicky Hager. That is way out of the realms of my networks.
Note in my post, I said there is an important security role for the state surveillance services.
Do you have any comments about the parts of my post that refer to mission creep, sovereignty, and poor level of oversight of the surveillance services.
Well……I can say that I EXPECT our government to keep tabs on those who would destroy our country and way of life. I realise that attitude might not be popular on this site but the extreme hatred displayed at the anti Israel march and the threat of radical Islamism mean any government would be negligent not to “spy” on citizens who are a threat.
I EXPECT our government to keep tabs on those who would destroy our country and way of life. I realise that attitude might not be popular on this site
Again – did you read (and comprehend) the parts of my post on that.
And (alleged) threats of radical Islam would destroy our country and way of life, how?
he prefers to deflect which is why he editted his first post to add something about the boy and thexhead to seem on topic
Now you really making shit up. I did not edit that post.
apologies. I didnt recall the bit about that awful man wi th his nephew holding a head when i first read your post
About as awful as this. Which is why we need security services.
The real world, coming to you soon.
Now do you see why we need the GCSB and SIS?
Grumpy are they really more evil than us?
What does history have to say about this?
apologies. I didnt recall the bit about that awful man wi th his nephew holding a head when i first read your post
“I EXPECT our government to keep tabs on those who would destroy our country and way of life.”
Unfortunately those who are keeping tabs on us ARE those who would destroy our way of life. The TPPA, which will destroy our way of life by inflicting US Corporate Rules on NZ by writing many of our laws, is being pushed by the US to gain control over our country. The NSA, with its puppet GCSB, will be tracking those activists who are putting up resistance against this “economic colonialism” (Idiot Savant’s apt term.)
Grumpy- you are looking in the wrong direction.
Most blokes (as we have seen in UK and Aussie) are quite adaptable and don’t have any strongly held religious beliefs. We could eaasily join the Caliphate, Islam is quite a cool religion for guys (unless you like booze a bit much). However for the rest, women, gays, bible bashers etc. the outlook is not so rosy.
Islam is a religion for guys, made by guys, if you feminists are happy with that, then fine…………..
is anyone else confused about what exactly grumps is saying here in relation to the comment it replies to?
What extreme hatred displayed at the Gaza Peace march? Demanding that Zionists stop killing civilians is hatred? Saying “God is great” is hatred?
I didn’t see any calls for anyone to be gut shot. That would be hatred. Oh, and FJK.
“You really do wildly mis-understand my lack of powerful connections to the likes of Nicky Hager. That is way out of the realms of my networks”
And who would be scared of your connections? Bring them on I say
Why are you trying to impress cos it doesn’t impress me . Like climate changes, etc you are full of unproved and incorrect theoretical rubbish.
Mate, you really have misunderstood my comment – My point was, I don’t have any such powerful connections. So there’s nothing to be impressed by. It was grumpy who was implying that I do have such powerful connections.
If you read my posts, you will see that I usually base my arguments on evidence and information that is in the public domain.
In the case of Hager’s about to be launched book, I am not basing my posts on any secret insider information. I am just going with the main body of opinion, as available online, that Hager’s book will be of some significance, and that it more than likely will focus on surveillance issues.
you understand what the words “lack of” actually mean ?
This attempted smear is so funny now we know the book has nothing to do with GCSB/Five Eyes/Snowden.
““Most people know that Nicky Hager is a screaming Left-wing conspiracy theorist. He’s hardly an authority on these matters . . . I’m not terribly worried.”
Worth noting he made this statement before the others attributed to him about it having Snowden stuff… so not terribly worried to spending time surmising what it might be about, and sharing it with the media.
In the past Hager has focused on issues and from his investigations highlighted people’s behaviours, be they Helen Clark (Corngate) or Brash, key, Joyce, Hooton) The Hollow Men and so on.
I don’t expect it to be some kind of rabid assault on John Key. I do expect it to have been researched and to have evidence to back his assertions.
it will be good if he lists all those nz’ers who have been spied on..
Agreed, that would give us a great basis for discussion.
My guess is the left will say its a game breaker and John Key must resign, the right will say its nothing and business as usual, the media will stoke the fires of controversy as much as possible and the general public will be bored of it after a couple of days
Yeah you wish, Puckish Rogue
Does anyone not interested in politics (ie most of NZ) really care about the hollow men book?
Nope. People wouldn’t even know the name.
Enough to put an end to Don Brashs career
I’m always interested in Hager’s writings, whatever the topic. He is one of the best, if not THE best, investigative journalists in NZ.
Such journalists are essential to democracy.
Have you forgotten about Ian Wishart 🙂
Ian Wishart doesn’t even come close. He did some good work in his younger days, but became more of a tabloid journalist after that. His hatchet job on Clark was part of a homophobia and misogynist-pandering smear campaign.
His evidence was thinly stretched associations that went well beyond even being in the realms of circumstantial evidence.
So you like who you agree with politically?
I have read the Wishart book quite closely and looked at his evidence. It doesn’t hold up.
And you seem to be praising him purely because of his politics. Hager has a strong international reputation as an investigative journalist. Wishart, on the other hand, is a legend in the minds of a few NZ right wingers.
Clark was Hager’s target in 2002.
He was okay until he became a born-again (read fundamentalist) christian.
You mean the guy who [deleted]
[lprent: That is defamatory. Banned 6 weeks. Read the policy. ]
The man’s a complete and utter fool!
You can take ANYTHING he writes and know that the complete opposite is most likely true.
Wishart is a delusional nutter. I suspect that, whatever his condition is, it has been worsening. At the end of his winebox writings he started making some weird claims that seemed full of paranoia. Everything he has written since (that I’ve looked at) has gotten worse. You can see the progression. I think the voices in his head interview each other.
Nicky Hager, on the other hand, is very careful with his research and what he claims. He is getting better with time.
yup, he shines a light into dark places that make grumpy and puckish feel uncomfortable ( so prefer to prefer to avert their gaze).
His naysayers seem to overlook the documents he posts in support.
Or it could be titled ” The Spy Who Shagged Us”
Is that some subtle reference to Wikileaks?
Anyone who thinks that the surveillance state and its paramilitary gangs of faceless cybermen are there to protect us from Islamists needs to think again.
The ‘threat’ of radical Islam has been carefully constructed and these images coming out of Syria are very useful to a government which is trying to change its already strong ‘anti-terrorism’ laws.
The US and its allies have used radical Islam in their attacks on any forces that they deemed to be detrimental to ‘western’ interests: Iran, Indonesia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria and Israel, given that the Israeli state provided arms to Hamas in its sectarian struggle against the PLO.
The problem with religious fanatics is that they have a habit of biting the hand that armed them – but for the warmongers it’s win win – because the threat that extremists pose (some real, some fictitious) are then used to justify the erosion of democracy, the increase in surveillance and the militarisation of the police.
which might explain the inability to save those 300 girls in africa…. Not a territory they give a shit about.
Bollix, take your blinkers off for a change.
“Nigeria is the 12th largest producer of petroleum in the world and the 8th largest exporter, and has the 10th largest proven reserves. (The country joined OPEC in 1971). Petroleum plays a large role in the Nigerian economy, accounting for 40% of GDP and 80% of Government earnings.”
So yeah its a territory they probably do care about but more importantly Nigeria didn’t invite the USA in to rescue the girls
Had the americans invaded Nigeria (without the permission of Nigeria thats what it would have been) it would have been an act of war and then lefties all over the word would have had something extra to whinge about
how long after they were kidnapped did the west start to notice? When was the last update? 300 black girls.
I thought Michell Obama had that sorted with he card with #bringourgirlsback on it. The extent of leftie concern.
I thought you had dismissed the whole affair by asking what were they wearing and had they been drinking.
Like this you mean?
“The ‘threat’ of radical Islam has been carefully constructed…”
That might be very true in relation to ourselves here in NZ but I don’t think we can underestimate the appalling tragedy that’s unfolding throughout some of the middle eastern countries and asian countries
What a waste of time all this rubbish is.
We are getting “spied” on everyday through CTV in cities and towns, malls, banks etc. Following the use of EFTPoS and mobile phones is continuous and these avenues are used to solve many crimes and finding lost people.
It all goes to keep me safe as I go about my LAWFUL business and long may it last!!
history test graeme
Has there ever been a single point in history, in any country, where the state used vast powers of monitoring and information gathering for the purposes of 1) demonising those it disliked or spoke up against the state – 2) maintaining power and – 3) controlling the general populace through fear and intimidation?
Is it foolish to consider that those who lust for and attain power havent really changed that much over the years?
for the crowd who love to whinge about getting the state out of your personal life you lot are really weird about the state doing the exact opposite
Graeme You are using a pathetic propaganda technique using a 1/2 truth to spin out a lie!
Using the spy network for one sides political gain where paid bloggers try and undermine free speech
The leader of the country uses the network for his own political gain proves we need more transparency around the GSCB.
After all you Conmen keep saying its all about defending our freedoms Yeah Right wing nut jobs!
We don’t need freedom anymore. Haven’t you heard?
The world is perfect.
There is no need to dissent.
We have no need for radical ideas which challenge the status quo.
We don’t need journalists to be able to protect their sources when uncovering the wrongdoings of the powerful. Those willing to reveal such wrong doings are traitors to Dear Leader and must be punished!
We must not question Dear Leader.
We must not disagree with the prevailing orthodoxy.
We must trust that those in power know what is best for us.
We must understand that those in power make these decisions behind closed doors in order to keep us safe.
We must understand that they have our best interests at heart, and – unlike you and I – Dear Leader is perfect and infallible and never makes a mistake: Not of policy. Not of identity. Not of implementation.
We must understand that Dear Leader’s men will find security flaws in every day systems we all rely on to transact and communicate securely. We must understand that in the interests of keeping us safe those security flaws will not be fixed.
We must trust Dear Leader when he tells us who the enemy is. After all, he is perfect and must be correct.
We must understand that never in history has a powerful spying apparatus been used for political ends.
Never in history has a previously legal action or belief subsequently become illegal or a cause for persecution.
Never in history has a detestable character risen to power and attempted to use that power to eliminate those they consider to be inferior. We must know that that would never happen in a democracy.
We need only to trust that Dear Leader will keep us safe, that the things they do in secret are necessary and proportional, and that they do not require any oversight for they act solely in our interests.
We need not think the thoughts they do not want us to think.
We need not read the books they do not want us to read.
We need not freely discuss whatever we wish, with whomever we wish, whenever we wish.
If we can all close our eyes and blindly believe what we are told, we will be safe from those whom Dear Leader labels “terrorists.”
(It’s just a shame Dear Leader can’t do anything about stair cases – after all, stairs injure more people than terrorists. Perhaps we should invest billions of dollars replacing all stairs with elevators? Then we can all feel really safe!)
Politi no satire either by orders of granny
but graeme it doesnt keep you safe at all
none of those would stop anyone from perpetrating some awful act on you , it only assists in their prosecution AFTER the fact..
so your dreams of security are just that , dreams…
Some have already scored on the Nicky Hager Spin Bingo card. I expect a lot more before the next day or two are over.
Both Labour and National will look bad in the book. The public are over GSBC stuff anyway.
Wow you may want to review this comment soon.
I don’t understand this paranoia about the GSCB by Hager & co when 100s of thousands if not millions of kiwis willingly give away information about themselves to corporate entities every time they go on the internet
The book is called dirty politics and it is about the use of Farrar and Slater by the National Party and John Key to promote an extremely vile sort of politics.
3 News Livestream as linked in my updated post – has Hager talking on it.
Going by the audio of that Livestream, I would say that the book is an expose of ShonKey being an Amphibious Shape-shifting Alien bent on World Domination, and is written in the language of his home planet. He only denied being Reptilian, not the “Shape-shifting Alien bent on World Domination” part.
Release the vet records now, if you dare!
This Livestream is better (less garbled, but very quiet sound:
Yes, I updated my past to use that link.
I’m so glad Nicky has had the guts to write the story. Only caught the last bit of his interview but we’ve all known there was very dirty, underhand and probably illegal activity going on in the back-ground and that they included the top floor of the Beehive.
I have found it distressing at times – especially not being able to do anything about it.
Hurrah for Nick Hager!!
Edit: and thank-you again to the decent, principled members of the National Party who have apparently (once again) helped him to reveal the truth.
When Slater’s site was hacked and went down. Someone came away with thousands of documents they gave to Hager.
Oh the irony!
Thank you Nicky Hager. Shine that sunlight…
Yep r0b there must be a god!
Oh WOW ! !
he who speaks least says the most
I’ve been out of the political loop (rebuilding my house, no power or internet at various times). But I’m nearly done, and about ready to start taking an interest in politics again. Hager’s book certainly puts a cat amongst the pigeons!
Hopefully Hager will be pushing Cameron and Farrar off the MSM and back to their blogs. Key will have to distance himself from the lot of them.
Good luck with finishing the house r0b. It will be good to see you back.
breaking now on Prime News .. it’s on dirty politics .. Jason Eade and the two nasty bloggers ///
Yes. I’ve published another post on the book as the topic is not what I expected – see, Grumpy – I had no inside knowledge at all.
You should be flattered that random wingnuts on the internet think you’re more of an insider than you are. They’d only think that because you’re effective in your advocacy.
Slater aint said a word yet bahhahahahahaha ,
Whats wrong o great lump ?
I see he’s in Israel. Don’t know if he’s going to Gaza.
It says Korea on his site…?
In response to tinfoilhat 6.2 – no-one can understate the tragedy of the MIddle East, my point is who is primarily responsible for it.
The Americans and their allies have been happy to use radical Islam, which is essentially reactionary, to counter movements that were perceived to be a threat to US interests – i.e. nationalists, communists, socialists.
In the eyes of extreme fundamentalist Muslims (a tiny minority) secular political movements are heretical and they easily persuaded that fighting/killing heretics is their religious duty. Arm them and point them in the direction of people deemed to be apostates, sit back and watch the mayhem and then try to take political and military advantage of it. It doesn’t always work out as planned of course – but what always does happen is that innocents die – millions of them and often horribly.
Now that radical Islam has become a nuisance, it has been labelled a threat to our way of life – to our very existence – and in the ensuing heat of moral outrage and panic – governments grant themselves powers they would never dare attempt in more temperate times.
Only a fool or an ideologue would deny the possibility of those powers being used to stifle legitimate dissent.
We must guard democracy and we must counter anti-Islamic propaganda because the only way we all get to win is if all shades of intolerance, bigotry and religious / political extremism lose.
And in response to Puckish Rogue 6.1.1 “Bollix, take your blinkers off for a change.”
5 giant multinationals (US, Anglo-Dutch and Italiian) dominate oil production in the Niger Delta – and run the dirtiest, most polluting oil fields in the world in one of the most ecologically sensitive regions. Gas flares in the Delta are reckoned to be the largest single emitter of greenhouse gases – as well as pumping out vast clouds of toxins and carcinogens which are impacting hugely on local human and animal populations. Because of the wasteful and ecologically harmful way oil production is managed, the country’s increasing reliance on the product and the appropriation of profits by a economic and political elite instead of reinvestment in the country, agriculture has declined as oil exports have risen. Agriculture employs 90% of the rural population so its decline is causing a depopulation of the rural areas and massive poverty and unemployment. The wealth from oil does not even trickle down to the base of Nigerian society – it goes into the pockets of western investors and technocrats and the Nigerian elite while 61% of Nigerians live in poverty.
The country has high unemployment and poverty, a huge gap between rich and poor, endemic corruption and intense ethnic and religious divisions. The kidnapping of Christian girls by Islamic militants did not result in western intervention or even extensive use of the situation as fuel for anti-Islamist propaganda because intervention by the West could spark off a civil war – and a civil war, (for at the moment at least) in Africa’s largest oil producer which exports most of its oil to the US, is to be avoided at all costs.
The world is run by and for a bunch of vile and venal bastards – not to put too fine a point on it.
Nicky is one of a few very courageous writers we have . We need more . All power to him and those as brave. I will be buying the book tomorrow .
Was expecting more to be honest.
Kind of a let down.
If the allegation that Key fed Slater info he got from the SIS proves true, then I’m afraid Dear Leader has committed a criminal offence.
I’m looking forward to the excuses flowing thick and fast and affecting the verdict not one jot 🙂
Even if that was true, Key wouldn’t be that stupid. No one of that ‘power’ directly engages in this sort of stuff, for this exact reason.
So far here, no one has read it. Will wait to see what comes out.
And back to the topic. It’s very interesting that TV3 did a poll (it was also Yahoo!Xtra’s news poll) on National’s reliance on the Key factor just in advance of Hager’s book release.