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Daily Review 21/09/2017

Written By: - Date published: 5:33 pm, September 21st, 2017 - 155 comments
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Daily review is also your post.

This provides Standardistas the opportunity to review events of the day.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Don’t forget to be kind to each other …

Graphic courtesy of the outstanding @nzsaysfun

155 comments on “Daily Review 21/09/2017 ”

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  2. feijoa 2
    21 September 2017 at 5:43 pm

    Can anyone tell me if there has been anything about Nationals position on State Asset sales? Seems very quiet on that front.
    I think they ruled it out last election, but not this one.

    I have a feeling if they get back in they will begin the process again oh joy, country being flogged off til nothings left.

    • Gristle 2.1
      21 September 2017 at 5:53 pm

      Watch out for rest of electricity generation, Transpower, ACC, state housing.

    • weka 2.2
      21 September 2017 at 6:02 pm

      They want to sell off Landcorp farms. And are busy rushing through some TPPA negotiations.

      • cleangreen 2.2.1
        21 September 2017 at 7:39 pm

        Weka; – Kiwirail, & possibly more hospitals will sold or PPP private, & roads & Ports will go PPP of sold as Port of Napier is mooted now being set up.

        National have a long list of asset stipping to go forward with.

        To totally wreck all of us and our futures for generations.

        Postoffice, Kiwibank, Air NZ, Conservation Department land. Ect.

        • Wayne 2.2.1.1
          21 September 2017 at 8:40 pm

          Do you you actually have any evidence for this, for instance like a statement from any National Party MP whatsoever.

          Or is it just your own fantasy?

          In the real world in 2011 National actively campaigned on partial sales of the power generators. That was all they sold. Nothing else.

          This time it is some Landcorp farms. Nothing else has been mentioned. Therefore none of your imaginings will happen.

          • weka 2.2.1.1.1
            21 September 2017 at 8:43 pm

            Can you guarantee that Wayne? Because whatever else is going on, I think it’s reasonable for NZers to not trust that National won’t sell assets.

          • Ed 2.2.1.1.2
            21 September 2017 at 8:44 pm

            Another Nat happy to place his interests above the vulnerable.

            Wayne, happy to accept poisoned rivers, increasing poverty and inequality, more mental health issues, worsening health and education services…

            as long as he is alright and gets his flash holidays and flash car.

          • Draco T Bastard 2.2.1.1.5
            21 September 2017 at 9:26 pm

            IIRC, Blinglish said that he would get rid of Kiwibank eventually.

          • McFlock 2.2.1.1.6
            21 September 2017 at 9:31 pm

            did they campaign on selling off state houses?

          • Stuart Munro 2.2.1.1.7
            21 September 2017 at 11:31 pm

            The budget for rebuilding Dunedin hospital is zero. They depended on privatizing it.

          • cleangreen 2.2.1.1.8
            21 September 2017 at 11:51 pm

            Go back to sleep Wayne,

            Anyone who has been here since 2008 has the same mistrust of this bloody lying Government with all the backroom slimy selloffs and you have not seen them?

            Where have you been?

            Every month we have seen new plans emerge by this mob planning to shift Government agencies out of Government owned buildings and into rented buildings for a start!!!!! It has been this Governments role to do thid repeatedly time & time again.

            Remember Napier Port going into the press two months ago and our local Labour MP Stuart Nash put signs up around Napier protesting the intention made by the port to sell the port?

            The councils are now under supervision of government and a birdie advised they were pressured to sell.

            If you are the failed National Candidate from 2014 who ran for Napier who was called Wayne, then you know what I am referring to.

            Better that you explain why your National Party have sold so many assets since 2008 that they didn’t run on at during an election time, like the sale of state houses and Landcorp land?

            Like I said, we have seen National lie so many timees and still are, then slip in some policy to sell or PPP some public asset!!!!!!

            The funnction of using PPP of any asset like roads, hospitals or Government buildings are being used frequently by National for selling off assets.

            I remember even our Tradie Petone Institute of Technology was floged off during the very first National government term 20008-11 you probably was not here then.

            Then of course there was the forced Government sale of Hilllside Rail engineering Kiwirail workshops as well in Dunedin and everyone really got riled about that engineering marvel we all lost. Now you knowthat Joyce had control over kiwirail administration because of management of their failing budget and still are in Government oversight.

            There were so many public assets sites that this Government had quietly linned up to flog off without a care in the world chappie.

          • KJT 2.2.1.1.9
            22 September 2017 at 7:50 am

            Like “Read my lips, no more taxes”. Eh Wayne.

            National’s history of lying and bullshit is obvious.

            Not to mention Joyce throwing a dead cat into the election debate, and proving he can’t do arithmetic, at the same time. Aren’t you ashamed of them? Or, is lying and cheating your way into power, fine with you!

  3. Hongi Ika 3
    21 September 2017 at 5:47 pm

    Evidently only 5-6% of the people in the country read the party’s policies so I take it most people are making their decisions on who to vote for by listening to MSM or friends and family ?

    • weka 4.1
      21 September 2017 at 6:09 pm

      There’s a post up about this now.

      Anger and compassion

    • Muttonbird 4.2
      21 September 2017 at 6:11 pm

      Barfly. If you need help please book in to see a doctor. I agree that this incident highlights that something is not right in NZ and that many people are falling through the cracks that the National Party is creating. Please don’t be one of them!

      If you are merely thinking out loud and not serious then I say ‘chin up’, there’s even more work to be done if these clowns get to take NZ further down the wrong path.

    • james 4.3
      21 September 2017 at 6:16 pm

      If you ever do feel like this – please see somebody, talk to a friend or family.

      Its not a joking matter.

      • Barfly 4.3.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:39 pm

        No James it’s not a joking matter

        I survived one suicide attempt – my first breakdown

        I experienced 2 more breakdowns with 1-2 years clinical depression each time

        My most likely cause of death is at my own hand after falling foul of some random WINZ harassment. I think this is more likely than the heart disease, diabetes and alcoholism that I also get to “enjoy”.

        Election years are a bastard to me in 2011 and 2014 it was National’s shoot the beneficiary season. This year it’s just so depressing that greed and what I see as “evil” appear likely to triumph.

        Thank you for your consideration

        Edit: Muttonbird – My doctor is good probably saved my life on occasion without knowing

        • Sans Cle 4.3.1.1
          21 September 2017 at 7:20 pm

          Kia Kaha Barfly. You are brave sharing your experience on here – thank you. I hope you take some comfort that there are a lot of us despairing with this current political environment, and you are not alone in that. I hope your own personal circumstances improve.

        • AsleepWhileWalking 4.3.1.2
          21 September 2017 at 7:20 pm

          Winz are disproportionately responsible for a lot of unnecessary stress and I suspect suicides.

          Hang in there BF!

        • Patricia Bremner 4.3.1.3
          21 September 2017 at 7:31 pm

          Barfly we have an alcoholic son. So we can feel your pain. Kia kaha as each day is a battle. Sadly other illnesses go with this. ( Irritable bowel.) Wish I could give you a hug.
          Reward yourself with simple things when you manage. Spend time with pets.

          Keep talking to us. We are always here. I suffer with aches and often wake 1or 2 hours before meds are due, so I come online and read others’ views.

          We are more likely to win than they believe. Two days to go and over 800000 have voted. Keep the faith. 3rd time lucky.

        • cleangreen 4.3.1.4
          21 September 2017 at 7:49 pm

          Barfly;
          Try the herb St Johns wart barfly its cheaply available at most health food shops or supermarkets.
          My Daughter had deep depression after childbirth as a solo mum and the regular
          Meds they put her on drove her into almost a suicide space but she stop taking the anti-deppressant Prozac and went on St Johns and now is free of depression and is back as my daughter we all love dearly.
          Good luck.

        • james 4.3.1.5
          21 September 2017 at 8:09 pm

          Barfly, I’m Genuinely sorry to hear that.

        • JC 4.3.1.6
          21 September 2017 at 9:26 pm

          Hang in there Man! They’re Light at the end of the tunnel!

          Glad, at least you have a good DOC, They’re hard to come by!

          ( Sounds like wank) But:

          Where to get help:

          Need to Talk? Free call or text 1737 any time to speak to a trained counsellor, for any reason.

          Lifeline: 0800 543 354

          Suicide Crisis Helpline: 0508 828 865 / 0508 TAUTOKO (24/7). This is a service for people who may be thinking about suicide, or those who are concerned about family or friends.

          Depression Helpline: 0800 111 757 (24/7)

          Samaritans: 0800 726 666 (24/7)

          Rural Support Trust Helpline: 0800 787 254

          Healthline: 0800 611 116

          If it is an emergency and you feel like you or someone else is at risk, call 111.

        • JC 4.3.1.7
          21 September 2017 at 10:38 pm

          How you doing man?

          Here’s a track for You. Sure you know it!

          I do.

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfe1AnyFPD8

          Catch up tomorrow K

        • Patricia 4.3.1.8
          21 September 2017 at 10:43 pm

          Barfly – do you have any family or friends who love and support you ? If you need to go to WINZ always take a knowledgable support person / advocate – WINZ don’t like witnesses.

    • Exkiwiforces 4.4
      21 September 2017 at 10:56 pm

      Barfly,

      I’ve been the rabbit hole 3 times in the last twelve mths (one overseas on deployment, other on 26 Jan of this and the other before I went on cse) since I’ve done stabilisation case for my PTSD a mths ago. The run down the rabbit hole is not as far as it use to be, but with a good treatment team, good support network around you and there will a light at the end of tunnel for you. Yes you will hit a few bumps along way as it’s long slow journey back to recovery.

      As for me atm I go med broad in early December and if things go to plan a full medical discharge in Jun/Jul with a pension of some sort. I have to go back for the stabilisation cse again before I can do the close treatment cse as I unloaded at the assessment phase for the close treatment cse. In the near future my partner and I ( well she wants to there) back to East Timor to finally close that chapter of my life, but South Sudan and the Gan will have to wait a while. I take every day as it’s comes, I have a good day and bad days.

      I’m going to in NZ in late Nov this yr, so if you live around the Plamy Nth/ Feilding area and if you want to have chat? I’ll make the time to come to you. Never never be afraid to ask for help.

      • Eco maori 4.4.1
        22 September 2017 at 5:19 am

        Sorry I did Not realize the topic/ kappa when I put my post up Kia kaha Barfly I try to look for something positive in most situations and the positive here is the awesome support our fellow bloggers are giving you keep up the good work people and get ready for a sore face on Saturday nite

        • Exkiwiforces 4.4.1.1
          22 September 2017 at 10:57 am

          Yes, it’s good to see follow bloggers offering support to Barfly and it was the same a me a few mths ago here at the Standard despite my opinions on certain policies here at the Standard. But as we are all a bunch of lefties here, we don’t kick poor bugger down road, we extend our hand out to support our follow human regardless of gender, sexuality, race etc and get he or she back on a even keel so he or she can feel they are a part of society again.

          Being in caring society achieves far more when we work together as team/ collective for the greater good than being a selfish individual who doesn’t give a toss about his or her follow human/ environment as long as I’m ok, or as we called it in the military going Jack on your mates and those type of people tend not to last long in the military.

          So roll on Saturday night and hope I don’t have a sore head on Sunday morning as I’ve my Bush Firefighting training on this weekend.

          PS, I voted last Friday while I was in Darwin.

  5. Eco maori 5
    21 September 2017 at 6:04 pm

    We mite have to start growing rice with all this unseasonable rain.
    One of my idea”s to minimize nitrogen leaching from cows was if they could be encourage to walk like deer when urinating as this action would spread the urinal patch maybe twice the normal patch and the grass would be able to absorb more of the nitrates and leaching should be lowered maybe a device that gets cows to move I.E when a cow raises its tail that’s the trigger to have a device to encourage her to walk this would only work in theory on a flat farm and the device could train them while they are young.

    • Cinny 5.1
      21 September 2017 at 6:10 pm

      Farmers should be able to grow weed crops as well as cows, cannabis loves loves loves nitrogen. There is a balance to be found there, some growers companion plant medicine crops next to nitrogen producing plants.

      Eco M, the kids went on a school trip yesterday, and they were fuming when they returned, they saw cows mucking around in the fords, no fencing or cocky in sight.

    • Eco maori 5.2
      21 September 2017 at 7:19 pm

      When animals are in your care you learn to observe them they ain’t going to tell you when they are crook are they.

      • Cinny 5.2.1
        21 September 2017 at 11:11 pm

        Animals are similar to babies when it comes to communication.
        However the cows should not have been in the stream coming off the mountain on the way to a pristine lake.

  6. mauī 6
    21 September 2017 at 6:09 pm

    Paddy. Gower. has. started. speaking. in. one. word. sentences.

  7. ScottGN 7
    21 September 2017 at 6:10 pm

    James? James? Are you there?

    • james 7.1
      21 September 2017 at 6:18 pm

      Sorry – was just having a end of week wine with friends (having a long weekend).

      But here I am ScottGN. What did you want?

  8. Anne 8
    21 September 2017 at 6:11 pm

    Reid Research Poll is similar to CB. Someone will link but in round figures:

    National 45%
    Labour 37%

    Greens 7%
    NZ First 7%.

    The lies win.

    Jacinda’s personal rating tracking downwards. Not enough aggression against a tidal wave of lies and deceit.

    Prediction: Winston… will… go… with… National.

    • Muttonbird 8.1
      21 September 2017 at 6:13 pm

      Prediction: Winston… will… go… with… National.

      That will be a car-crash of a government.

      • mlpc 8.1.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:20 pm

        And you really think Lab/Green/NZF wouldn’t be?

      • Hongi Ika 8.1.2
        21 September 2017 at 7:17 pm

        Doubt NZF will go with National however if NZF do they will have Bill over a barrell ?

        • cleangreen 8.1.2.1
          21 September 2017 at 8:00 pm

          Agreed with you Hongi Ika.

          Peope watch what winston said here and find the clues it is obvious it will be labour. http://www.radionz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=201858966

          I’ll bet on it.

        • Freddo 8.1.2.2
          21 September 2017 at 8:12 pm

          In tonight’s Newshub poll 37% think NZF will go with Nats and 31% think NZF will go with Lab, but more interestingly to me, in the more detailed breakdown of that, 45% of NFZ supporters think NZF will go with Nats while only 35% think NZF will go with Lab. That doesn’t look promising for your thought that Winnie won’t go with the Nats. I think NZF has likely held onto more disaffected former Nats than it has held onto disaffected former Labourites. I think many of those moved away from NZF and went back to Labour once Jacinda became leader.

      • Anne 8.2.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:26 pm

        Thanks Cinny. So, the Nats in round figures are 76%. That’s a difference of 9%.

        I received a phone call from the National Party yesterday. Think it was from Farrar’s Curia outfit reminding me to vote.

        Two hours ago I received a recorded call from Bill English telling me that the elderly (I don’t class myself as ‘elderly’ 😡 ) are better off under National. Another gross lie. Presume there are recorded calls going out on landlines nationwide.

    • BM 8.3
      21 September 2017 at 6:14 pm

      What lies and cheating?

      Funny thing is Little could have probably worked a deal out between Labour/Greens and NZ First.

      Jacinda. not a chance.

      • james 8.3.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:22 pm

        I dunno …. she use to run the socialist youth that had members from Lebanon, Palestine and Israel – so Labour / Greens / Winny should be a walk in the park

        [lprent: And the US, Israel, and any number of other obnoxious places. There was no point to that comment. You are just trying to start a flamewar. I’d suggest that you get very cautious if you want to carrying on commenting because my finger was on the very lengthy peace for moderators button. ]

        • BM 8.3.1.1
          21 September 2017 at 6:27 pm

          Good point, also she’s probably had to deal with the odd drunken customer at that fish and chip shop she used to work at.

          I’ve changed my mind, Peters will be no match.

      • Eralc 8.3.2
        21 September 2017 at 6:44 pm

        Jacinda could always do a captain’s call.

      • Draco T Bastard 8.3.3
        21 September 2017 at 6:59 pm

        What lies and cheating?

        All the well documented ones by National.

        But, then, you already knew that so all you’re here to do is psychopathically defend them – as per ALL RWNJs.

    • james 8.4
      21 September 2017 at 6:20 pm

      “Prediction: Winston… will… go… with… National.”

      I have been saying that was in the bag since forever ago – the price was JK leaving.

      Not enough stardust for Jacinda – or it wore off too quickly.

      I could be wrong with Winston – but he has always discussed with the largest party first and Labour are dropping back again – too far away from National to be credible.

      • JC 8.4.1
        21 September 2017 at 9:57 pm

        Playing the safe ground eh.

        What were you saying about Predictions again ? .. And the links to Jacinda’s background?

        PS Still waiting for a reply from an earlier question to you today… Just look in the Reply box.

        But will elaborate here to save you disturbing All your friends over a wine …

        http://thewireless.co.nz/articles/narcissistic-men-are-more-likely-to-troll-on-facebook-study

        Or

        “It goes all the way to people who have a real clinical disorder called the Narcissistic Personality Disorder and that is marked by extreme forms of a desire for attention, grandiosity, lack of empathy, sense of entitlement, a willingness to exploit others and so often a sense of fragility, so that underneath the narcissism is quite an unstable sense of self or self-esteem, so the person is quite brittle and can be easily ashamed and that is when they begin to lash out in rage. There is the grandiosity on the surface, but there can be underneath an underlying fragility or vulnerability and a panic where they are really worth as much as they say.”

        http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/201815681/the-new-culture-of-narcissism

    • millsy 8.5
      21 September 2017 at 6:25 pm

      NZF may be able to keep National from straying too far right. While ACT and the Maori Party are all pro private everything. Not all doom.and gloom

    • Bearded Git 8.6
      21 September 2017 at 6:26 pm

      Winston is really pissed off about his pension overpayment details being leaked by National…and the health scare attack he believes National leaked last Friday….look forward to Prime Minister Jacinda, probably with the Greens shut out of the coalition.

      • james 8.6.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:29 pm

        Thats whats makes Winston so much fun – who knows what he will do.

        Still – I doubt he will support a ‘leader’ in the mid to high 30’s

      • Anne 8.6.2
        21 September 2017 at 6:32 pm

        Baubles trump everything BG. National have no moral principles. They are open to shady deals… if you come with us we”ll let you be PM for the second half and we’ll implement your policies… and we’ll build your bridges in the next 12 months and… a new railway line which we’ll name after you blah blah blah.

        • Bearded Git 8.6.2.1
          21 September 2017 at 6:42 pm

          Jacinda has just as many baubles to offer, or simply agree to,

          It is a straight choice, and he hates the Nats.

    • Pat 8.7
      21 September 2017 at 6:41 pm

      prediction:….the poll will not be reflected….it appears the youth vote may have finally mobilised
      http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/09/decision-17-youthquake-arrives-in-new-zealand.html

      • Anne 8.7.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:49 pm

        Nothing could give me more pleasure than to be proved wrong. 🙂

      • McFlock 8.7.2
        21 September 2017 at 7:10 pm

        Interesting – if all the pollsters are using demographic weights to correct their sample bias, then all of those weights could be off significantly.

        Not opening the lindauer yet, but still…

        • Pat 8.7.2.1
          21 September 2017 at 7:15 pm

          those weightings are almost certainly off given that a week ago youth registrations were 20 % down on last election and are now apparently 30 % up

          • AsleepWhileWalking 8.7.2.1.1
            21 September 2017 at 7:27 pm

            That’s huge

            • Pat 8.7.2.1.1.1
              21 September 2017 at 7:37 pm

              innit…and with such a late surge you would expect a comparable turnout….i.e. they havnt registered and forgotten, probably registered and voted at same time

              • feels surreal …
                21 September 2017 at 8:20 pm

                I’d been working on getting a colleague to vote for the past few months and today at lunchtime he let me drag him to CAB and we voted together – first time at 29. He heard Jacinda singing on Mai FM this morning and said he liked the sound of her and what she said, etc. He’d previously said he ‘went his own way’ and always brushed off my rants that politics wasn’t his place. It seemed to me that deep down he didn’t feel he had permission – until this morning. Anyway, thanks Mai FM. I now have a bit of hope back after last nights shitty poll.

          • Pat 8.7.2.1.2
            21 September 2017 at 8:09 pm

            correction, 20,000 down a week ago (not 20%)

      • Cinny 8.7.3
        21 September 2017 at 7:31 pm

        That should always happen…. and just has 😀 Thanks for the link Pat

        “Between writ day [August 23] and September 20, the number of people enrolled has increased by 62,169, which is a 39.2 percent increase on the same period in 2014, when the roll increased by 44,674.”

        Last day to enroll as you vote tomorrow, the start of the Spring Equinox, an auspicious day. Am going to vote then, went to early vote but it was closed, has been happening a bit around the nelson/tasman regions

        Voting only on Saturday no enrollments.

  9. Stuart Munro 9
    21 September 2017 at 6:14 pm

    Bill’s rump government has finally established a parallel with the last days of the Diem government https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TglBTa32j_k
    A corrupt and ineffectual colonial regime propped up by foreign capitalists but hated by the people they oppress has reached the point where burning oneself alive is a more attractive option that enduring further misery and misgovernance.

    • james 9.1
      21 September 2017 at 6:24 pm

      “but hated by the people they oppress has reached the point where burning oneself alive is a more attractive option that enduring further misery and misgovernance.”

      Its sick using that poor persons situation for a cheap political shot – but that says a lot about you.

      Funnily enough it seems that all those oppressed people still find it more attractive to support National than voting Labour.

      • Stuart Munro 9.1.1
        21 September 2017 at 6:31 pm

        The sickness James, lies in trying to construct a defense of a government so bad its people are burning themselves to death.

        But go on – tell us how this is a ‘problem of success’ and leads to an even more aspirational society – you twisted piece of subhuman trash.

      • Ed 9.1.2
        21 September 2017 at 6:37 pm

        James happy to accept poisoned rivers, increasing poverty and inequality, more mental health issues, worsening health and education services….
        as long as he is alright and gets his flash holidays and flash car.

      • Cinny 9.1.3
        21 September 2017 at 7:33 pm

        Which oppressed people James? The working poor living in cars who can’t enrol to vote because they have no permanent address?

  10. Ed 10
    21 September 2017 at 6:30 pm

    40 to 45 % of New Zealanders happy to accept poisoned rivers, increasing poverty and inequality, more mental health issues, worsening health and education services….
    as long as they’re alright and get their flash holidays and flash cars.

  11. Draco T Bastard 11
    21 September 2017 at 6:41 pm

    Wheels of Misfortune

    Houston was built for cars. What happens when Harvey destroys 250,000 vehicles? Three weeks after Hurricane Harvey hit Texas with the worst rainfall event in U.S. history, many low-income residents are still stuck at home, unable to afford a replacement vehicle and get back to work.

    Prior to the hurricane, 94.4 percent of households in the Houston area owned cars, making it second only to Dallas in vehicle ownership. While people in the city center can commute by bus or bike, it’s much harder for residents in the city’s sprawling suburbs, living far from bus lines, to get into town without their own wheels.

    “I don’t have nothing to do,” one construction worker in northeast Houston told the Texas Tribune. “I don’t have work. I don’t have a car.”

    Car culture and sprawl carried to it’s inevitable end.

  12. millsy 12
    21 September 2017 at 7:06 pm

    What Cindy needs to do now, is declare that would be open to ditching the water tax in return for Peters’ support.

  13. ianmac 13
    21 September 2017 at 7:15 pm

    Yesterday an intelligent well educated man said, “It really shook me when I saw the huge full page ad in the press by the Taxpayers Union which shows how we are all going to pay for a change of Government.”
    If he was scared off what about all the others?

    The total for National claims that National will only cost $8.3 billion of new spending.
    The total for Labour was $20 billion.

    Something wrong there.

    I braved their web site and found this proviso near the bottom.
    Note: The Bribe-O-Meter does not include Budget 2017 announcements (for National) as they are seen as the baseline.

    To my mind this denies all the Budget 2017 “promises” that National made at that time.
    Under the Electoral act isn’t that misleading (lying) political advertising on behalf of the National Party via Farrar via the taxpayer Union?

    • Pete 13.1
      21 September 2017 at 7:30 pm

      The ‘true oil’, no big reveal about a Cabinet Minister happened. In the end that’s all the difference could be. On the other hand the big reveal(s) about Peters could make a significant difference to the make-up in the end.

    • Hanswurst 13.2
      21 September 2017 at 8:38 pm

      I despise the term “Bribe-O-Meter” and all its variants (Pork-O-Meter, etc.). The implication that any public spending constitutes a “bribe” or some sort of frivolity is simple-minded, neoliberal bullshit.

  14. newsense 14
    21 September 2017 at 7:18 pm

    Labour or Greens? Would Michael Wood be transport minister or Julie Anne Genter? Swarbrick instead of Seymour. Mariana Davidson. Not sure about Shaw. Do wanna vote Labour, but how many NZF preferring cabinet members are there? Will we zombie walk into a odd TPPA? But Jacinda! Tell me internets. Genuinely unsure

    • weka 14.1
      21 September 2017 at 7:30 pm

      There’s a zillion posts telling you to vote Green (or Labour) 😉

      The case for the Greens is this. One they’ve got more progressive policies e.g. on climate change they will do more, faster, and with better care for transforming NZ to a post-carbon economy. They really are the experts on this.

      It’s possible they could drop below 5% and be out of parliament. Which would be a tragedy in and of itself, but it also jeopardises Labour being able to form government.

      The more Greens there are the less influence NZF will have and the more likely it is that Labour will choose them as coalition partners over NZF.

      The Greens are packed with talent. This isn’t to say there aren’t good people in Labour, there are. But Labour are going to have a lot of MPs and they have different experience to the Greens. So a higher party vote for the Greens means we get more diversity of experience and in areas that we need (CC, ending poverty, cleaning up rivers).

      The Greens are very opposed to the TPPA. Labour is kind of, but will probably compromise on it.

      Julie Anne Genter should be transport minister. Shaw should be something important (CC I guess, or associate finance). Davidson’s influence on welfare seems crucial. For that to happen the Greens need more votes.

      🙂

      • Cinny 14.1.1
        21 September 2017 at 7:36 pm

        + 100%

      • newsense 14.1.2
        21 September 2017 at 11:51 pm

        what does compromise on the TPPA mean?
        seems like a take or leave it deal. With no backsies. and not one with a lot of benefits at that

        • weka 14.1.2.1
          22 September 2017 at 12:14 am

          They want to renegotiate a bunch of things. Or they did (there were five). I’m not that clear on what they intend now.

          This is about the Greens, but it has some info about Labour in it, and a bunch of discussion from Labour supporters and those that don’t trust Labour on this,

          Reasons to vote Green: the TPPA

  15. Ross 15
    21 September 2017 at 7:24 pm

    Meanwhile National have received a free pass over their false and misleading advertising. Lawyer Steven Price isn’t happy.

    http://www.medialawjournal.co.nz/?p=682

    The clear message it sends is that political ads will always be treated as opinion, and that as long as a party has a fleck of a sliver of a shard of justification for its claims, these bodies will not call them out even if their ads are very seriously misleading and misinforming people about issues that are pivotal to the election.

    Oh well, looks like Labour has been given a green light to scare-monger at the next election.

    • Hanswurst 15.1
      21 September 2017 at 8:08 pm

      Oh good God, no. The immediate prospect in terms of adverse consequences is that they produce negative ads against the Greens if the Left vote gets squeezed. The long-term prospect is that everybody ends up flinging poo left, right, up, down and round and round until even comparatively engaged and informed voters have no idea what any party might do. A better solution would be to raise the standards required in the broadcasting act and of candidates and parties in general.

  16. Eco maori 16
    21 September 2017 at 7:33 pm

    Good poll Project

  18. greywarshark 18
    21 September 2017 at 8:55 pm

    Man set himself on fire in front of Parliament. Every second report makes the point that it has been done only two days before the election. Pretty sad that someone doing a desperate act like that can only enter the news spectrum if there is some connection with the election. Ordinarily it would have been quite run-of-the-mill./sarc

    There is a report about the child’s mother being taken away written on a card.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/97105434/Man-sets-himself-on-fire-outside-Parliament-in-Wellington

    People are desperate – my simple recipe for a better future is the promise and action that all will be done that helps with problems with kindness and practicality. It would make so much difference if 99% of actions were considered quickly to see if they were in line with those words and meanings.

  19. swordfish 19
    21 September 2017 at 9:22 pm

    The final internal Lab UMR Poll leaked

    National 43%
    Labour 38%
    NZF 8%
    Green 7%
    TOP 2.7%

    https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2017/09/21/latest-umr-poll-national-43-labour-38-nzf-8-green-7-top-2-7/

    • Ed 19.1
      21 September 2017 at 9:25 pm

      Bomber’s thought on the Reid Research poll.

      ‘The most terrifying part of the last poll before the election is that 45.8% of NZ’s voters support more homelessness, more poisoned rivers, more property speculation, less mental health funding, more experiments in education, no infrastructure investment, more NZers in prisons and 300000 kids in poverty in return for $20 extra a week and half a dozen more bloody roads!’

      • KJT 19.1.1
        22 September 2017 at 8:18 am

        Support a party that publically pretends they are going to do something about it, while in reality intending to make things worse.
        Lying is paying off, for National.

    • ianmac 19.2
      21 September 2017 at 10:23 pm

      That looks OK Swordfish. Still an open door. But of course NZF. Can they agree to Lab+Green+ NZF.
      There appears to be early warnings that a downturn economy is is imminent.

    • Pat 19.3
      21 September 2017 at 10:29 pm

      MoE?…am guessing around 3%

    • Bearded Git 19.4
      21 September 2017 at 10:57 pm

      That 45-43 and Winston hating the Nats looks bloody good to me.

      My best cab sauv is on the bench and ready to toast our 3rd female PM.

    • swordfish 19.5
      22 September 2017 at 12:17 am

      National Latest Internal Poll

      Nat 43%
      Lab 39%
      NZF 6%
      Greens 6%

      Sources told Newsroom that National’s latest internal polling has it at 43 percent and Labour at 39 percent. NZ First and the Greens were both on six percent. But there were suggestions from those close to National that its figures had softened overnight

      https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2017/09/20/48879/election-2017-live-an-awkward-jet-fuel-crisis

      Still everything to play for – “softened” = Voters swinging back to Left ???

  20. Ed 20
    21 September 2017 at 9:36 pm

    Im not religious myself, but I don’t see how Bill English can reconcile the social teachings of Jesus and the National Party’s policies on wealth, homelessness, poverty….

    He must get into some convolutions justifying the chasm between the two philosophies.

    • JC 20.1
      21 September 2017 at 10:07 pm

      10 Bill ion Hail Mary’s

      • Whispering Kate 20.1.1
        22 September 2017 at 11:09 am

        What mystifies me is he has admitted opently to being a committed, practising Roman Catholic which means he attends Mass each week. As I know it you cannot receive the sacrament at Mass unless you have attended confession and confessed of your venal or mortal sins. How does he cope with going into the confessional knowing he is dirty and a liar – the deleting of his emails – leaning on the police over the investigation of his MP in Dipton, the backing up of Joyce’s big hole theory which was pure spin and lies and many other transgressions. He doesn’t do the church a service at all and I am surprised the church doesn’t actually come out more vocally over the poverty and disgraceful treatment of unwell fragile people.

        You can see why so many people turn away from their traditional religions and look at them in contempt.

    • joe90 20.2
      21 September 2017 at 10:20 pm

      Take it away, Mr Hitchens.

      • adam 20.2.1
        21 September 2017 at 11:33 pm

        It does feel like there is a war within Catholicism sometimes. Between those who accept Second Ecumenical Council of the Vatican, and those who reject it.

        http://vatican2voice.org/

        Those who reject it, generally are on the spectrum of Christofascism. And have natural allies in the far right church groups.

        In NZ that link up is most notable between the exclusive brethren and their relationship with bill english. Also the national party and fundamentalist churches like equippers, the life churches, city impact church, and other wealth theology focused churches who are mainly Pentecostal.

  22. swordfish 22
    21 September 2017 at 10:38 pm

    Some talk today about ACT possibly creating 121 overhang but I would’ve thought Māori Party the more likely culprit

  23. swordfish 23
    21 September 2017 at 10:42 pm

    Jeez Louise ! … Greens best not get too complacent … they’re by no means out of the woods yet. Usually over-stated by 1-4 percentage points in final polls

    Greens %
    Last 6 Polls (latest 1st)
    UMR 7
    RR 7.1
    CB 8
    CB 7
    RR 4.9
    RM 9

    • Pat 23.1
      21 September 2017 at 10:49 pm

      greens have averaged something like 1.3 % below polling over MMP elections so safe enough…plus it appears youth vote up, which likely to favour their numbers
      p.s.
      (is that 1 to 4 or 1 point 4 in your post)

      • swordfish 23.1.1
        21 September 2017 at 11:27 pm

        1 to 4

        Eg (higher end) Final Reid Research

        2014 14.4 (over-states by 3.7)

        2011 13.4 (over-states by 2.34)

        2008 9 (over-states by 2.28)

        RR 2017 … 7.1% = not quite as rosy as you might initially assume

    • Bearded Git 23.2
      21 September 2017 at 10:59 pm

      Take out the rogue, add in some tactical voting, and all is well.

    • Cinny 23.3
      21 September 2017 at 11:16 pm

      Greens gained a seat and nat’s lost a seat after the specials were counted last election

  24. swordfish 24
    21 September 2017 at 10:48 pm

    Definitely don’t want NZF to fall below the 5% threshold (+ lose Northland). On the latest Colmar Brunton & Reid Research numbers (adjusting slightly for historic Final Poll vs Election Result differentials) that would give the Nats a big enough boost to see them winning a majority of seats and the ability to govern alone.

    The possibility of a Labour-led Government depends on NZF (& the Greens) staying above that 5% barrier. Fortunately, a 5% Colmar Brunton & 7% Reid Research final poll rating probably means 6-9% on Election Night for NZF (also taking into account the previous CB and the last RR from 10 days ago).

    Can’t quite bring myself to strategically Party-Vote for Winnie. But we better hope NZF make it. The declarations (on TS last night) of secret joy at the thought of Winnie’s electoral demise are possibly just a teensy-weensy bit self-indulgent for the Left ? Be bloody careful what you wish for.

    • Bearded Git 24.1
      21 September 2017 at 11:00 pm

      Agreed Swordfish-can’t believe I’m saying this but I hope Winnie wins Northland.

      • NewsFlash 24.1.1
        21 September 2017 at 11:23 pm

        I can’t see how he can win the seat again, last time he had Labour and Greens voting for him to “send them a message”, but those voters will be voting for their parties and candidates, he’ll need more than 5%

    • Matthew Whitehead 24.2
      22 September 2017 at 1:28 am

      NZF falling below threshold benefits whichever bloc gets the highest number without NZF, as they will get even bigger.

      If you believe Nats are ahead of Labour, Greens, and the Māori Party taken together (or ahead of Labour + Greens and that the Māori Party are as fickle as Peters is) then and only then is NZF going under threshold and losing Northland a bad thing.

      • Antoine 24.2.1
        22 September 2017 at 1:51 am

        Matthew, any chance you could take a look at the Green Party manifesto thread? I have some questions over there and wondered if you could answer. Thanks! A.

      • swordfish 24.2.2
        22 September 2017 at 9:32 pm

        You may have missed the bit where I said

        On the latest Colmar Brunton & Reid Research numbers (adjusting slightly for historic Final Poll vs Election Result differentials) that would give the Nats a big enough boost to see them winning a majority of seats and the ability to govern alone.

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