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Open mike 07/04/2021

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, April 7th, 2021 - 116 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

116 comments on “Open mike 07/04/2021 ”

    • Foreign Waka 1.1

      Worldwide phenomenon. Perhaps it is the legacy of no discipline, no civility, no respect. Someone has thought the wrong principles to the young generation. Its a stomping of feet saying if I cant get what I want, you cant have it. Meanwhile the environment, heritage and civilisation is slowly disintegrating.

    • Jenny How to get there 1.2

      The end of the beginning

      Best of Idiocracy- Dr Lexus! – YouTube

  1. Gosman 2

    Mickeysavage – this attitude displayed [deleted] here is why we have a housing crisis.

    I have one question for [deleted], given this is intensification rather than spread where else are the houses we need going to be built if not in this location?

    It is far too easy to oppose development while at the same time bemoaning the fact we have a housing crisis. I think people who do that (e.g. [deleted]) should be asked to identify exactly where else houses are going to be built.


    [Don’t play that game again, Gosman, and don’t SHOUT – Incognito]

    • mickysavage 2.1

      Here you go Gosman – http://gregpresland.com/the-nola-development/

      Short version:

      1. We do have a housing crisis
      2. This development however is in the wrong area. The Unitary Plan already allows for dramatic intensification in the area and we are already seeing it happen. This is outside the intensification zones which cover a significant part of West Auckland thanks to our high quality rail system.
      3. This development is outside what is considered a walkable catchment for the Sunnyvale Railway Station. People will be using their cars.

      There are twin ten story apartment blocks in the middle of Glen Eden that the local board and I supported. It is next to the railway station and also provides a significant number of social housing. There is also a six story apartment building being constructed right now for older adult housing that we also supported.

      Insisting that there are adequate parks and schools for intensification are not some form of nimbyism.

      • Sanctuary 2.1.1

        I used to live up West Coast road, and this development is a nonsense. Those locals up in the Oratia hills are a formidable lot though, as Watercare found to it's cost in 2017, so I doubt it will go ahead in it current form.

        • Gosman

          Why is it nonsense? It is almost 250 houses that Auckland desperately needs. If you can find some other location where 250 houses or units can be built in place of this then point it out.

          • Sanctuary

            I suspect you haven't actually read the posts on the topic.

          • Sabine

            there are quite a few areas where decent medium rise up to 5 levels could occur.

            Heck this site would be one.

            But that would require to think about housing differently, and it seems that even you can't conceive of it.

            As for the need, its National and labour that fucked up consistently in regards to housing. Keep that in mind.

      • Incognito 2.1.2

        I’ve moderated Gosman’s comment to avoid others doing the same kind of thing.

      • Sabine 2.1.3

        The nimbyism in Auckland comes from your Peers Mickey. Not hte poor. They don't care which cage the government is throwing them into so as long they get a key to that cage. Keep that in mind. IT si the rich and well heeled who are Nimby. And they are Nimby in Titirangi as much as they are in Remuera. Its the same crowd, arrogant, overfed, and generally unpleasant.

        Secondly, if you plant high density housing in Plattenbau, keep in mind that Plattenbau does not age well, it holds up for about 15 years. I consider that whomever the Party will import to build this crap will build it about as good as the Russians did with their mass housing in the 60/70, same as england, and yeah, shamefull comes to mind. Oh and it does not matter if you build three levels of that shit or ten. It does not age well.

        Thirdly, i hope that the overpaid goon who signs of on this will realise that if you don't provide parks, outdoor recreation, and ease bus stops, access to trains stops your party will have build an awesome slum.

        But maybe that is the intent.

        Build crap, as it has been done in NZ since ages ago.

      • Gosman 2.1.4

        Just pointing to existing apartment buildings and stating these are the sort of houses that should be built is not good enough. There are almost 250 houses that are proposed to be built. Please show me a location where 250 houses/units can be built if this development does not go ahead. I think people who oppose new housing development (especially if they are involved with local politics) should be required to do that.

        • mickysavage

          Stop misinterpreting what I say Gosman. Local board and I supported the construction of the Glen Eden apartment blocks when resource consent was applied for.

          I am all for affordable housing. It is crazy that we have a city where teachers and police officers and nurses, let alone cleaners and supermarket workers, can barely afford to buy a house. But the Unitary Plan attempted to design a city where intensification could occur adjacent to major public transport routes and this development is outside of where this is intended. Intensification has to be done right.

          • Gosman

            Where are the current alternatives (not previously built ones) for the 246 houses that are proposed to be built? Is there NEW land that is being made available to build these 7 story apartment blocks close to transport routes? If so can you please point me to this land that will be made available to this developer in return for not building these 246 houses in Glen Eden?

            • mickysavage

              There is a lot of vacant land around the Sunnyvale Railway Station. In Glen Eden there are a number of quarter and half acre sections that are seeing multiple unit developments being applied for.

              • Incognito

                Do you get the feeling that Gosman is a local Westie or just stirring?

              • Sabine

                Its not only about Land Mickey, its about decent smart town planning.

                so to put a new development of single family houses with the biggest footprint possible on an ex orchard ( i lived there i know the area) with no public amenities is crap, to be polite.

                Now there is Henderson, Sandringham Road, Remuera Fringe, Grey Lynn Fringe, heck Ponsonby Fringe that could and should be build up for these reasons alone

                a. access to train stations and bus hubs

                b. access to shops and doctors and medical clinics

                c. schools

                and here we are to applaud a wasted opportunity to build some crap houses that will look shite in less then 15 years, and worse if for sale will be to expensive to fix (see apartment buildings in town, see leaky house syndrom, see generally fucked up builds) and can only end up in Slums.

                So gossy might not be from Akl, but living in wellington would still make him a kiwi, and if he pays taxes then he like me or you is financially underwriting this boondoggle.

                Btw, don't we have some really nice very large Golf courses in Auckland that we could build some really nice developments with bus stops, roads wide enough to allow Fire Trucks to get in there is a fire (something that is not a given in the Hobsonville development Lol), maybe build a nice school to accomodate all the new people living htere, and rather then build a three story house or a four story house for one family, build four story buildings that house a flat on each floor – or even two ! – on the same foot print, but with a cellar for storage, a green area with play grounds and benches, etc.

                Or is that in the too hard basket. I mean labour literally only had 9 years of Key to think about such.

                • Incognito

                  Just as Gosman, you’re barking up the wrong tree. Read the comments & replies and read the links in these before you start your incessant barking again.

                  BTW, you seem to confuse local with central government. Do you pay rates in Auckland so that you can claim barking rights here again?

                  • Sabine

                    i used to pay rates in Auckland for nigh on 20 years.
                    Now i pay rates in rotorua. I pay income tax. I pay GST. I pay any other levy the government – local or regional sends me an invoice for.

                    Are you paying any rates anywhere dear Incognito?

                    other then that i have family in West Auckland. I have family in South Auckland. Does that qualify or do you need some more vitals to establish the right to have an opinion?

                    I know the area Incog because i lived there and my family still lives there.

                    • Foreign Waka

                      Why are you saying that the buildings will not last more than 15 years? Is it the climate, soil moister or building material? Not sure what you are eluding to.

                      By and large it is a good thing to have buildings near transport, I hope they will get a supermarket too. Perhaps if necessary a police station to prevent the area being infiltrated by gangs etc…

                      It will be people who design the vibe. It will put to the test whether some care and pride is part of that. As we see with Paris and so many large cities, the general population will make or break a place.

              • Gosman

                I've looked at the land around Sunnyvale station. Much of it is a carpark for park and ride. Are you pushing for this to be sold off?

                • Incognito

                  You looked at the land? How did you do that, using Google Earth?

                  • McFlock

                    Tech idea: a google earth filter that lets people pretend they are slinging lightning bolts onto the ground, leaving scorched and burning patches.

                    That way they can pretend they are omnipotent as well as omniscient.

          • DukeEll

            only allowing intensification around major public transport routes, in a city with terrible public transport routes, will lead to the next generations slums.

            And if they only option for development, they are likely to be purchased by the people they aren't intended for.

            Development should be allowed if the developers away from public transport routes pay for the connections normally required of the council to connect the infrastructure. That way they will naturally be of a denser nature, without robbing the needy of the "affordable" and handy public transport located intense development.

            • Ad

              Demonstrably untrue:

              New Lynn since 2004

              Newmarket since 2002

              Hobsonville since 2007

              Takapuna since 2005

              Mt Albert since 1980s

              Avondale since 2009

              And developers already pay for much infrastructure.

              The rest is up to the public dollar, and you should only get that by delivering public policy objectives.

            • mickysavage

              West Auckland rail is first class although it still has some historical maintenance problems.

              • Sabine

                if you have a car to get to the station.

                • Incognito

                  You don’t get it, do you?

                  If you stopped barking for a second and read the comments & replies, you may actually have something useful to offer instead of you bleating ad nauseam about your rights to have an opinion because you pay taxes & rates, your rights to express your ‘opinion’ here on this free forum, and your lamentable objections against people who allegedly try to shut you down here.

                  As MS already mentioned @ 2.1:

                  This development is outside what is considered a walkable catchment for the Sunnyvale Railway Station. People will be using their cars. [my emphasis]

                • Dawn Trenberth

                  Nope you catch a bus to the station. It costs no more if in the same zone. That's what I do in South Auckland. Im sure there are plenty of buses out west as well. The trains and buses are all very frequent. Sometimes I catch another bus from the train to my destination.

          • Gosman

            Is the land in Sunnyvale at the end of Seymour road near the railway line that is available for multi-story apartments available to be purchased and built on or is it currently already occupied and any developer will have to buy the existing properties and demolish houses before they start building?

            • mickysavage

              Do you think the local board should dictate that it be sold to developers?

              Isn't that cOMmuNIst?

              • Incognito

                Please don’t do that again. I could swear you’d written cOMnuDIst. Maybe it’s time for my monthly appointment …

              • Gosman

                No but you should make it easy to develop houses rather than just be a handbrake. Even your comments around the two 10 story building built right next to the railway line is indicative of the anti-development mindset of the local board. There were comments about the make up of the number of one bedroom apartments (what business is this of the board anyway?), the height, traffic issues, AND you wanted development slowed down by allowing local people have input by it being notified. Do you not realise that is a major factor why we aren't building enough housing?

                • mickysavage

                  It is the local board job to comment on proposals. And I always recommend notification. I think people should be allowed to find out what is happening in their communities.

                  • Gosman

                    Do you acknowledge that we are in a housing affordability crisis and that a major factor in that is the amount of time it takes for developments to get off the ground?

                    If you do, then you also have to acknowledge requesting developments should be notified is going to contribute to this slowness. If you are happy to be one of the causes of the problem then keep pushing for developments to jump through more planning approval than they have to.

                    • mickysavage

                      Gee gossie I am really pleased that you have become a die hard leftie and are concerned about homelessness. Given your comments over the years I must admit that I am surprised.

        • Sabine

          nope, people have a right to point out if a planned development may not suit the site.

          I lived on Strid Road in AKL and some geezer proposed a development of 110 dwellings on two half acre sections bordering a park.

          110 dwellings = 220 cars (and i am lowballing), that is 220 cars that try to get onto a road that already is congested, no bus stop near by no train stop.

          make that dwellings rather then houses/flats or homes, and you call for trouble. this is how do gooders with no idea fuck up whole areas and turn them into gigantic slums.

          So yes, the lady has a reason to speak up. Between National and Labour the country has had nothing but horsemanure on the dinner plan when it comes to housing. Both parties are fucking useless at building anything then their own financial wellbeing.

          You can build high density, but a good place to start would be around train stations, bus hubs and the likes. there are a whole heep of people in akl that don't have cars, are good with public transport and they also don't insist in gardens. But rather then building decent sized Apartment blocks with cellars for storage and balconies, we build dwellings that will look shit within 10 years.

          • Gosman

            Yeah you can always build higher density so long as it is somewhere you are not eh? Please provide the exact locations where people can build the same number of housing units that people are trying to stop being built?

    • Incognito 2.2

      See my Moderation note @ 6:56 am.

  2. Jester 3

    Graeme Hart apparently lost around $2 billion last year!

  3. KSaysHi 4

    There is a golden nugget at the end of this article on rent freezes.

    But rental advocates argued there was still no limit on the size of an increase – only the requirement that it not exceed market rent, defined as the average rent for a similar house in the same area. And while tenants could apply to the Tenancy Tribunal to have rent reduced, the onus was on them to prove increases exceeded market rent.

    Rogers wanted the law flipped, forcing landlords to justify a rent increase ahead of time, rather than tenants having to challenge an increase after the fact.

    Eaqub agreed this might go some way to correcting an existing power imbalance.

    But “as a tenant, are you really going to challenge a rent increase? The answer is no”.

    There must be some way to make this feasible.

    Another thing – has anyone modeled how average market rent is achieved? As long as people can’t move out of the rental market the rents would continue to spiral upwards because the majority of landlords keep pushing them up so the “average” is more indicating a driver of the market, no other value if that makes sense. Perhaps what is needed is a different method of establishing average market rent, eg demographics/wages of the area.

  4. Nic181 5

    “The Market” will never build enough 3 bedroom, 1 bathroom houses needed to fix the housing crisis. There is not enough profit in a basic house and wage workers can’t afford McMansions. Government intervention is needed, bring back the Ministry of Works and bring in teams of Chinese builders!

    • woodart 5.1

      good comment nic. leaving it to builders and developers gives us mcmansions, as there is waaaay more profit in a mcmansion than a small two bedroom house. dont know about the teams of chinese builders though. they are masters at not following plans correctly to save on time and materials(plenty of new builds fall over in china because of shonky workmanship.)I had brief involvement with builder checking and fixing new houses in waikato, that had been built by team of chinese builders. put in roof insulation, get council to inspect and sign off,then take insulation out and put into next house! unbelievable! wouldnt have believed it if I hadnt seen it myself.

      • Brigid 5.1.1

        You actually saw workers remove all the ceiling insulation from one house and place it in another? That's one hell of a lot of work for little gain.

        Sounds like the urban myth of contractors removing concrete floor steel reinforcing and placing it in the next build. Which of course is ludicrous. Anyone who has ever placed rebar steel for a concrete floor will know this.

      • Cricklewood 5.1.2

        Haha same happens with structural steel… get it inspected prior to the pour then lift it out and replace with half the amount…

        This sort of stuff will get worse with a 15% jump in basic materials costs ie timber and steel about to hit.

        Inflationary pressure is now building. Nearly every supplier I use has sent out letters flagging increases of 5 to 15 percent in the last 2‐3 months we're about to do the same.

        Once inflation creeps up the Reserve bank will be forced to lift interest rates, the banks will follow and the increased costs on what are now very large mortgages will suck alot of discretionary spending out of the economy… thats when the rubber will really hit the road.

    • Sabine 5.2

      The market rent will be what the government is happy to pay in Accomodation benefits.

      • woodart 5.2.1

        not talking about rents.

        • Sabine

          not talking to you btw, i answered to nic.

          . And if no one can afford the houses the market builds, the government will pay the rents via the accomodation benefits, or does it did two weeks ago increases a government hand out to those that want to buy an affordable 700.000 dollar house.

          bye now. .

    • Foreign Waka 5.3

      Nic – Exactly, well said. They haven't cut corners to fit profit margins and produced leaky homes. Roads that were build under MOF are still being used with no major issues. And look at the Kapiti motorway. The waste water system that was build has lasted 100 years but alas the profit takers just let it rot. WCC deferred maintenance to put a plib lib sign on the hill to greet Airplane passengers with "Windy Wellington". The way Wellington is governed just makes my blood boil.

  5. Anne 6

    How infantile can you be:


    I well remember PM John Key cancelling his regular slot with RNZ radio. Iirc, he did not accept any RNZ invitations to speak on the station for several years. That was his prerogative. Did RNZ kick up a fuss? No. They continued to invite him and each time the news host would note he had been asked to comment but had declined. End of story. No histrionics.

    Now we have this arrogant upstart, Hosking who has to turn it into a he said/she said fit of the sulks when he only had himself to blame. He constantly carped at her, refused to allow her to complete her replies, found non existent faults or misinterpreted (deliberately) everything she said and generally behaved like a misogynistic arsehole.

    Jacinda will be grinning with glee that she doesn't have to waste any more of her precious time on his third rate show.

    • woodart 6.1

      hoskings will do as his advertisers want. he is a poodle with advertisers holding his leash. we have seen overseas, other right wing bigmouths being told what to do and how to grovel by their paymasters(alan jones in aus, piers morgan in u.k.etc). his worth to advertisers has fallen sharply since the days of nightly tv shows, and the new trend in broadcasting is to give the expensive mouths the flick ,hire no-names who can read an autoprompter, and save $$$$.

      • Sabine 6.1.1

        this can be said of anyone who has 'sponsors' be that advertising, or donations to public officials.

      • McFlock 6.1.2


        He's a little boy who thinks that advertisers threw him money because he's so awesome, rather than because his particular flavour of nausea happened to catch the mood of a market segment with disposable cash.

        Now he no longer catches that mood, folks are distancing themselves from him and he thinks it must be because they're the ones slowly getting further out of sync with the money that gave him a job.

        Our little Piers Morgan, angry that angry dudes who can't take being rejected by a woman are slowly shrinking as a market segment.

    • joe90 6.2


      • Stuart Munro 6.2.1

        I should hope so – MF is one of the best journalists we've got. Hoskings, not so much.

    • Anker 6.3

      has Mike (hell has no fury like a narcissist scorned) Hoskings just scored an own goal???

    • David 6.4

      I would hope the PM doesn’t return.

      Having listened to this morning’s interview I think it would be advantageous to both parties if she didn’t.

      • Stuart Munro 6.4.1

        Quite – the sooner Mike starts a job he's actually good at, the better. I understand there are many opportunities in animal husbandry for folk who love dirt.

        • Peter

          Hosking fancies himself at a job that's already taken. He knows he would be better than the incumbent.

          I don't think God will step aside for him though.

    • Jane Dear 6.5

      Guy on Espiner recently told us that John Key declined only once to appear on Morning Report and gave the reason that he needed more time to prepare. Only once.

      So why keep repeating this myth that he refused to appear on his regular spot on Morning Report?

    • Chris T 6.6

      TBF. She doesn't actually say anything when asked direct questions.

      Shame, but it will bite her own arse in the end.

      • Drowsy M. Kram 6.6.1

        TBF. She [PM Ardern] doesn't actually say anything when asked direct questions.

        TBF, it's not credible to suggest that PM Ardern is mute when asked direct questions. I find her easy to hear, so you might be suffering from selective hearing (slightly more common in men, believe it or not), or even simple hearing loss – you and the Hosk could get tested together laugh

  6. woodart 7

    public officials dont get replaced by anybody who can read an autoprompter.

  7. greywarshark 8

    How come commenters aren't spelled more often when they attempt to take over the discourse? The commenter variety has shrunk and it would be better to have fewer surely, than have those reiterating self-centred wilfully ignorant or a combination of these traits fill up the gaps. It trivialises what is an important political discussion outlet, and it is preferable to have light and enjoyable trivial stuff occasionally rather than having to suck on acid drops or gobstoppers so often.

  8. greywarshark 9

    Could DoC and Far Northern Maori kaitiaki get together to lessen or solve this problem? Dead kiwis are cropping up often up in the Far North I think.


    • AB 9.1

      They are unlikely to look like the harmless, bedraggled pooch in the picture that accompanied the article. In that part of the world they are more likely to be the nasty things much favoured by people who want a legal way of projecting their own aggression. On the surface, shooting sounds like a good option.

      • Sabine 9.1.1

        The SPCA and the pound are pretty useless in the Far Noth if they actually do still any work there with dumped dogs.

        That pooch in that picture has been on its own for a while now.

        how about we shoot the people that breed these dogs and then abuse them first? or would that be considered rude?

        [How about you don’t suggest, advocate, or promote violence of any kind on this site? – Incognito]

        • Incognito

          See my Moderation note @ 1:43 pm.

          • Sabine

            I was not the first one to use violence as a suggestion unless you of course consider the shooting of dogs not part of the violence thing.

            My comment was in jest, i forgot the snark emojicon. Sorry for the oversight, it will not happen again.

            • Incognito

              Apology accepted, thank you. Please don’t joke about violence either, with or without “the snark emojicon”.

            • AB

              "I was not the first one to use violence as a suggestion unless you of course consider the shooting of dogs not part of the violence thing"

              Quite right – it was me. Though it was more (I'd hope reluctantly) endorsing someone else's suggestion. Much as I care about animals, I don't have any tolerance for dogs that are a threat to humans or wildlife.

              • Incognito
                • Directly or indirectly advocating violence in any shape or form (including ‘jest’ and advocating self-harm) to individuals or groups is simply not allowed. Moderators will have a no-tolerance humourless response as the only possible response. If you want to talk about political conflicts around the world, then do so being mindful of this proscription.


  9. joe90 10

    Who's funding Jordan Williams and his shitty wee scam?

    McLachlan said ACT "weaponised" astroturfs.

    He claimed the New Zealand Taxpayers' Union did a lot of the groundwork for the party in the 2020 election with their Campaign for Affordable Housing to fight the Green Party's proposal for an asset tax.

    "So when they were saying 'This is a problem', it was actually a contrived problem that the ACT Party told them to create.

    "That's the problem."

    The campaign involved letters to thousands of householders, a website and media work.


    • Gosman 10.1

      What nonsense. The Taxpayers Union has around 60,000 subscribed members . Much more than ACT. In the early days of the TU it was overshadowing the ACT party and taking away potential donors.

      • Sacha 10.1.1

        Any proof of that membership other than their own say-so?

        • Incognito

          According to the Gospel of Gosman, it is nonsense, and he’d know, wouldn’t he?

        • Gosman

          What proof do you want considering there are privacy issues around releasing people's personal information?

          • joe90

            What proof do you want considering there are privacy issues around releasing people's personal information?

            I guess they could clear things up by doing what other unions are required to do and file an annual return.

            • Gosman

              Do you mean like they already do?

              "As an incorporated society, the Taxpayers' Union must file annual accounts with the Registrar of Incorporated Societies. That means we will be more transparent about our income and spending than most political parties. In relation to individual donations, we will publicise the identity of donors where they have requested public acknowledgment of their support. "


              • joe90

                Of course they do.


                However, it was unlikely the Taxpayers' Union would now declare its financial relationship with British American Tobacco even though the company had outed itself.


                • Gosman

                  Do Trade Unions list the members who pay subs?

                  • joe90

                    And nor should they. OTOH, the TPU is book-ended by dirty politics and the dirty money of the purveyors of disease and addiction.

                    • Gosman

                      Let's get this clear.

                      You think organisations you disagree with politically should be forced to reveal their supporters details but not those you do support.

                      There are words to describe that view and they don't include free tolerant pluralistic and democratic.

                    • Incognito []

                      Astroturfing and DP are the opposite of democratic, as they pervert the democratic process.

        • McFlock

          Got bored at work.

          Lowest "Membership" costs $25. Most expensive option is $500.

          TU 2019 accounts show $156k in membership fees.

          If all members pay the minimum: $156000/25 = 6240.

          If all members pay the maximum: $156000/500 = 192

          Gossie is overstating the membership by a factor of anywhere between ten and two hundred, lol.

  10. Chris 11

    Right from the horse's mouth – the greater the residential property investor's wealth the less likely removing interest as a tax write-off helps the housing crisis. The latest tinkering targets the wrong people, as per fucking ususal:


    • Stuart Munro 11.1

      The solution to that lies with increasing the slope of the progressive tax system – the opposite of the trend since that freeloader, Roger Douglas, screwed everything up.

    • McFlock 11.2

      So he either pays more tax, or he buys fewer properties to pay down his debt, helping to cool off the property market for both renters and first home buyers?

      How is this not part of a comprehensive housing policy?

    • Pat 11.3

      “If you have no debt on your rental properties, there will be no interest to pay … My goal has always been to eventually have no debt on any properties and by bringing in this new rule, I may accelerate this and sell off some properties to reduce or eliminate the residential debt."

      And there you have it…he has options.

  11. Tricledrown 12

    Chris the simple fact this hard done by property investor overlooks is people need somewhere affordable to live.

    Home owners don't get a tax deduction on interest.

    He has 70 houses but not much debt then claims he makes most of his money out of capital gains.Then hopes when National gets back in they will drop the tax.

    Then he forgets that if he sells the home for more than he paid for it he has to pay the tax deductions back.

    This is poor journalism a whinging very wealthy property investor who knows this is the only form of tax free money.

    If he was in NSW he would have to pay CGT Victoria land tax Labour has finally got some balls to even the playing field which even National has been goading them.

    • Incognito 12.1

      Home owners don’t get a tax deduction on interest.

      That’s correct, but the reason is that home owners don’t derive income from living in their family home unless you’d (ac)count forgone ‘rent’ as income.

  12. RP Mcmurphy 13

    who watched juddy do the histrionics in the house this arvo on the bubble bill.


    putrid lump of bellyaching and irrational proposals all delivered with a snide twist.

    not a good advertisement for proper governance at all

  13. Descendant Of Smith 14

    Yeah lets not forget how the last National government reacted when an overseas person on benefit taunted a minister by sending them photos of themselves overseas. They made every single person on benefit have to reapply every year.

    That is punishing the many for the few.

    Or what about the puritan policy of anyone having a child while on a benefit not being able to get a sole parent benefit but having to look for work as a job seeker. That also obfuscated how many unemployed there were and still does today.

    Not that labour has fixed either being national lite. Not that the media could (were willing) to work that out.

    Making the poor jump through hoops – that's mean spirited. Wealthy people not being able to claim their interest back – meh. I don't think they'll be going hungry tonight.

  14. logie97 15

    On the National Programme today I think I heard an orchardist bemoaning the fact that migrant workers have not been available to work for him and as a result he has acres of exportable fruit just "rotting away".

    I am certain that I have seen it written here, but why didn't he reassess his profit margins, pay inflated wages and bonuses to those who may have been available right here in New Zealand, and everyone would have been a winner. Unfortunately, because he has a fixed outlook on the world and what people are worth, he decided to let his crop rot. Brilliant!

    Incidentally, if I was to buy some suitable land and plant it in fruit trees, and have wonderful yields. It would not mean that I was necessarily entitled to have that fruit picked…

    • Descendant Of Smith 15.1

      I also notice they are not talking about whether they actually have markets to sell to or transport to get those apples to market. Typically there is over production in case of hail or drought. If anyone thinks they grow exactly the right number of apples they they have markets for they are sadly mistaken.

      Of course the media will never ask that question – pictures of rotting fruit suit the capitalist agenda.

      Would be interesting to know the gap between production and market. Watties were (and maybe still are) well known for requiring crops they don't need having to be destroyed.

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