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Open mike 19/11/2020

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 19th, 2020 - 49 comments
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49 comments on “Open mike 19/11/2020 ”

  1. Ad 1

    Big shoutout to Minister Woods for securing us a strong pipeline of vaccines for 2021.

  2. weston 2

    Big thumbs down for Nash suggesting attracting rich tourists is a better idea than the humble backpacker and banning un flash camper vans .We need more toilets not more rules imo.

    • Ad 2.1

      Alternatively orchardists and agricultural employers could pay their workers enough to attract locals to the jobs – and so we can use Covid19 as a new floor for employment conditions.

      Nash is blunt but he is right.

      • Chris T 2.1.1

        He isn't right. He is an idiot.

        • Ad 2.1.1.1

          You are having a failure of economic imagination.

          • Chris T 2.1.1.1.1

            He seems to fail to realise most of these backpackers, freedom campers and straight out campers are kiwis holidaying on the cheap round their own country.

            He also seems intent on killing off even more small towns who rely on these people driving through them and stopping for a feed and some petrol.

            I know he is paid so much now he has probably forgotten what it is like to try to holiday with your kids when you are on a limited budget, but he surely must realise all his rich tourists mates tend to spent all their cash on foreign owned hotels and resorts.

          • Phillip ure 2.1.1.1.2

            @ ad..You seem to be having a failure of basic logic ..however which way you look @ nashs' brain-fart…it smells terrible..pray tell us the economic case in support..I can't see anything there..

          • greywarshark 2.1.1.1.3

            Ad yes A lot of that going round – can't think things through – can't understand why everything can't just go on for ever. Wah wah, 'they' are stupid and against me.

        • Patricia Bremner 2.1.1.2

          Chris T no one is allowed to live in a home without facilities. Vans become backpackers and travellers' homes for months at a time, and should have facilities.
          They should make the hire of these vans illegal to hire or sell without adequate facilities.
          We had motorhomes for 10 years, all had a proper toilet which could be used for 3 days, and there were plenty of freely available disposal facilities supplied through Councils and the Association.

      • Rosemary McDonald 2.1.2

        Nash is wrong if he thinks that all the un self contained camper vehicles are hired.

        Most low budget backpackers purchase their vehicle from one of the many on line venues or pop up sale yards around the airports. You'll see them head along to the Warehouse in Manukau and buy their camping gear and then tootle down to Bruce Pullman park to get themselves sorted for their journey.

        Many of these vehicles look just like your average family wagon…only when the doors open and poorly packed shit spills out you recognise it as a wee camper.

        But before you ban these small camping vehicles…sort out our fucking homelessness crisis…because oh so many of these camper cars have Kiwis living in them.

        Compassionate councils tend not to move these folk on unless they are posing a problem.

        • gsays 2.1.2.1

          "But before you ban these small camping vehicles…sort out our fucking homelessness crisis…because oh so many of these camper cars have Kiwis living in them."

          Amen, Rosemary.

          If only a politician or two would speak about the social failings (poverty, homelessness mental and dental health of our young) with a skerrick of the enthusiasm shown by Nash.

          Having listened to him, the solution isn't to ban toilet free 'campers', it is to build more infrastructure. What I heard was middle class pandering to NIMBY's.

          • Patricia Bremner 2.1.2.1.1

            It is also attitudes. We saw and admonished a well vanned couple emptying their grey water near the canal, they said it isn't a problem. So education and policing is needed. There should be fines for lapses.

            • greywarshark 2.1.2.1.1.1

              Grey water may not be a problem if it hasn't been sitting for a while and doesn't contain strong fluids and especially if it is thrown out onto land where it can filter. Could be that they knew and were monitoring what they were doing.

              • Patricia Bremner

                No Greywarshark, they were letting it flow out of their van onto the concrete surround. Cheers Also in a free camping area provided by Pauanui.

                • greywarshark

                  Not as bad as the other end though.

                  How can we make people think? Is the attitude that you just have to do the best for yourself and accept that others have difficulties. I'm thinking of the warning that I gave to a couple well-vanned, as some bloke high on something raved near them. I said we have a few problems here in NZ with unemployment and people being angry so be a bit wary. Their reply was 'Oh well, no worries that's how it is these days.' So I don't know how much travellers take in about 'the rules'. Perhaps it's an Oh well approach.

    • Pat 2.2

      Mass tourism isnt likely to be a major problem anytime soon….suspect Nash may be running interference for more pressing issues

      • Peter 2.2.1

        There was a tourism shindig he was to speak at. What should he have talked about?

        And if he said all sectors of our tourism are important and recognise somewhere that the 'freedom camper' thing reaches into our economy through employment of foreigners what would the upshot have been?

        Another speech, another anonymous conference another politician just saying stuff. Another brief mention on the news.

        Look at the attention and discussion that's been generated.

        • Phillip ure 2.2.1.1

          Perhaps the absolute idiocy of his musings has drawn all that attention ..?…just saying..,!

        • Pat 2.2.1.2

          alternatively..look at the attention and discussion thats been generated

          • Phillip ure 2.2.1.2.1

            Much hot air…signifying nothing..'cos the random musings of nash were so bone-achingly stupid in the first place..eh..?..everything from his basic premise onwards..but if it gets more public toilets built..?..good on him..!

            • Phillip ure 2.2.1.2.1.1

              Nash dug himself a hole so big…you could almost bury a van in it..

              • RosieLee

                Or use it for a long drop. LOL.

              • greywarshark

                You tend to be definite always Phillip. The quote from Bertrand Russell about wise people being slow in judgment about stuff could be a useful brake.

                The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.

                (Then he said this, to put another slant on thinking.)

                The point of philosophy is to start with something so simple as not to seem worth stating, and to end with something so paradoxical that no one will believe it.

                (And just for a cherry on the top): America… where law and custom alike are based upon the dreams of spinsters…

                Bertrand Russell https://www.azquotes.com/author/12791-Bertrand_Russell?p=23

                Now there is an interesting mind that could keep your quick mind full of notions.

                • Phillip ure

                  I think if looking to big brains from that era I would lean more towards shaw..I find that I agree with pretty much all he said..on most things..(now there was a person who was definitely very 'definite'…)

                  • Phillip ure

                    Also..most of the things I argue for/against I have been arguing for/against for quite a long time..(As in animal slavery for decades) I am pretty certain of the ground I am standing on…with those things..questions/queries welcomed…happy to relate how I got there..

            • Pat 2.2.1.2.1.2

              Unless hes completely devoid of intelligence he must realise his proposal would have almost zero impact on what he announced as the problem (and again one that isnt going to return in a hurry) …so it would be reasonable to ask oneself what possible purpose is served?

              The gov is under pressure on a number of critical areas

            • joe90 2.2.1.2.1.3

              Every year these fuckers climb the fence to unleash their bowels in my yard and the first I know of it is when the damn dogs roll in human excrement and tramp it through the house. We've had summers when you can't take the dogs to a local beach because of the piles of reeking excrement in the dunes and the shitty bog paper flying like a flag from the lupins.*

              And then there's the bludging fucks overwhelming minimal facilities payed for by residents for use by locals and domestic travelers.

              Nash is right, fuck ém

              ( *a local fishing comp was moved for this very reason).

              Okato surfer Chris Wilkes said Paora Road, a well-known South Taranaki break, was overrun and the new freedom camping bylaw was not being policed.

              The bylaw allows three self-contained vehicles there a night.

              "Basically we have a carpark being used as a campground and we had about 28 vehicles here last night," he said.

              "I tell them there's a campground just five minutes down the road. They can go down there and, for $5 a night, there's showers and toilets available so it's a much better option."

              Mr Wilkes said most of the campers had been understanding and left, but others refused to budge. He took the registration numbers of those who stayed and later chained up the toilet.

              "You've got a small toilet here that's not actually designed for the capacity … It's actually overflowing at the moment."

              https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/319668/freedom-campers-overrun-surf-spot

              • The Al1en

                I checked out the DOC website yesterday and found the fees for their campgrounds. $20 pppn for a fully serviced site, coming down to the $5 options. They even do free in some places.

                If these people aren't prepared to even pay that much to stay (or zip), preferring instead to litter the countryside, why should the country bare the cost of building facilities for them, which local councils have to service and maintain, when freeloader campers wilfully choose to pay nothing?

                If there is a toilet block building boom, and low value campers are still allowed, a $250 pp surcharge at the border, as a condition of entry for those without contained vans, will go someway to funding it.

                • solkta

                  I think most come into the country sans vans.

                  • The Al1en

                    I'm sure they all fly in without vans, though I probably should have written 'without a self contained van already booked up'.

                    • solkta

                      Yes but then do all tourists coming into the country have to provide a full itinerary?

                    • The Al1en

                      They already have to provide proof of a return ticket, funds to support themselves during their stay and a reason to get entry to the country, so if people are looking for solutions to the problem, then as a talking point, it's one to consider for them who aren't on package tours and/or arrive with nothing more than a backpack.

                      Happy to read other suggestions.

                    • solkta

                      It doesn't sound very practical. They could just say that they are going to buy a car and stay at hostels and motels, then buy a cheap van and off they go. A lot of them buy rather than hire already. Can't see that it is possible to police what they all do once here.

                      I do think there is a problem but not a simple solution. I'm not sure if the minister has thought it through either. Will we all have to provide proof of citizenship/residency before hiring non-self contained campers?

    • Bearded Git 2.3

      Agree Weston….better toilets at roadside lay-bys would solve 80 per cent of the problem….of course camp ground owners hate this solution and are a powerful lobby

  3. Sacha 3

    Strong action needed now on housing – can this government deliver? https://www.newsroom.co.nz/housing-jacinda-arderns-achilles-heel

    Even if she won’t intervene with the Reserve Bank, Ardern and her ministers will need to develop some kind of meaningful solution on housing if she is to live up to her claims towards transformational government – and her party’s grip on power.

    Housing affordability has consistently rated among the top five issues for Kiwi voters in recent years, and disproportionately so for left-wing voters.

    • Sacha 3.1

      Well, we can see who isn't the handbrake.. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300162010/housing-crisis-green-party-urge-prime-minister-to-reverse-ruling-out-taxing-property-wealth

      “During the election campaign voters simply weren’t looking down the barrel of ongoing, unsustainable house price increases. The Government has a responsibility to keep housing affordable for all New Zealanders and that may mean looking at ideas that weren’t previously on the table.

      • Phillip ure 3.1.1

        Yeah…I am really looking forward to all those policies nz first handbraked in the first term…now being enacted in full…that'll do for starters…and could someone please remind j. ardern that the pot referendum was non-binding…so..?

        • Sabine 3.1.1.1

          tsk tsk tsk, she knows all that, she just can't be bothered.

          • Phillip ure 3.1.1.1.1

            Little was almost gasping in relief when he announced the 'no!' result..falling over his words as he rushed to confirm that labour were locking the bong in the cupboard for the term of their government ..

            • Sabine 3.1.1.1.1.1

              i have always maintained that Weed will not only be legalized but regulated, taxed and become a booming business with National. They will run on that, and they could/would win with it.

              Oh well, it's Labours loss. No guts, no glory as they say, and its Labour personified.

      • Incognito 3.1.2

        Well, we can see who isn't the handbrake..

        Well, somebody has to make that irritating beep sound when they’re going backwards and about to reverse into an unmovable obstacle.

    • Phillip ure 3.2

      J. ardern is promising some more middle-class welfare..as her solution..she will help the children of the rich get on the ladder ..by paying part of their deposit for them ..all of which will do absolute zilch to solve the issues we face..hang on..!..maybe nash should advocate giving the homeless camper-vans..(with toilets of course..!)..and then sending them off on their way..thereby solving the homeless problem…(much cheaper than building then houses)..as well as lmaking use of that huge glut of unused r.v.'s..and supporting the campground sector of his portfolio….(there's another kite for him to fly ..)

    • Sabine 3.3

      I hope for Jacinda Ville in the Domain. Free tents for all the homeless, a soup kitchen, and winz drone somewhere to tell everyone to fuck off.

      That is about the best we can hope from this Labour "Do fuck all" government.

  4. DS 4

    Further analysis of the election suggests the Left has work to do in the lower South Island:

    Southern Gothic Politics: The Bluing of Otago-Southland

  5. drmumdough 5

    Is left or right (wing or any other flighty thing) able to be determined, given current political climate, identity, philosophy and both ideals mixed with foundations (traditional and newer)?

    Is politicking essentially a fluid concept derivative, along with the ideals of humans who support (or obstruct) it?

    What is 21st century politics anyway.

    A past-time perhaps.

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