The Remain War Ad? You mean the campaign that has been waged mostly by the cultural and financial elites of the capital against the ordinary people of the UK who had the temerity to imagine a different future for themselves?
Given the vast amount of bullshit and outright lies leading up to the referendum, and that the referendum was between a vague idea that anyone could project their fantasies onto versus a concrete reality, was it really their choice? Or is the better path forward a second referendum after the definite deal is nailed down, so it becomes a genuine fair choice between two definite realities?
"Given the vast amount of bullshit and outright lies leading up to the referendum, "
The Remain scare lies were proven to be false within days of the result. And continue to do so. The economy didnt crash.
The UK will save billions from the total amounts going to the EU , not just the EU budget amount but there are other billions such as the customs duties and levies(£ 2.6 bill) plus nett EU VAT (£3.0 bill) adjustment amounts
There were no lies and bullshit coming the leave side? They presented a true, honest and complete picture of what leaving would actually entail? Really?
Politics, in case you hadn’t noticed is generally a ‘vast amount of bullshit and outright lies’ and the referendum was politics so go figure.
As for a second referendum, however nicely you dress the idea up, it is nothing more than remainer desperation to overturn the democratic will of UK voters. Anyone who is a democrat and believes in the rule of law should resist the idea completely.
In all the democracies I'm eligible to participate in, decisions and results are subject to re-evaluation after a period somewhere between 2 and 6 years. Nothing is locked in forever. After circumstances have significantly changed, there is nothing whatsoever undemocratic about putting the revised question to the vote.
In western democracies decisions and results aren’t subject to re-evaluation after a period of time. Rather it’s the personnel appointed to make those decisions that are required to re-affirm their continued fitness by the voting populace to make those decisions. They are not the same thing.
No I don’t particularly. Mostly cos there ain’t gonna be a new vote and circumstances haven’t actually changed significantly enough to justify one. Unless, of course, you’re an embittered remainer casting about for any chance to rewrite history.
Y'know, I really don't have an interest in whether Brexit or remain happens. I've got no roots in the UK or the EU, and it's unlikely I'll ever visit either again in my life.
But I am interested in a people's right to self-determination. From that perspective, it really looks to me like the original referendum was an exercise in how not to make a substantial decision.
Putting up a vague nebulous concept that everyone and their dog can project their fantasies onto up against a current reality simply showed the status quo didn't have majority support. That's a very different question to whether there's majority support for a hard Brexit over status quo, or majority support for the current Brexit deal.
Looks to me like those opposed to a second referendum are embittered leavers who think any cost is worth it. Since they now have the result they want, they want to deny any possibility of reconsidering to those that may have changed their minds in the interim based on new knowledge.
You have just described how messy democracy really is …. and it all mirrors the travails of the Kaipara District Council and its Mangawhai sewerage scheme… or Napiers new Swimming pool or any other local council in the country.
Greece had a referendum on the harsh EU bailout scheme, it lost 61% to 38%, but the government had it anyway.
Norway had TWO referendums about joining the EU, both lost but Norway is effectively an EU member anyway, as its covered by Diktats from Brusells
CER is not analogous with EU membership. In stark contrast with the UK NZ still retains control over affairs that the UK has had to cede control of to Brussels. A better comparison would be to liken UK membership of the EU to what our situation would be if we had taken up Australia’s (still standing) offer to join their Federation. And I’m sure you’ll agree there’s a healthy majority of opinion against Federation in this country.
Indyref 2 is by no means a certainty either. There doesn’t appear to be a groundswell of support for it, and, like the first one I suspect the whole enterprise is likely to founder on the inhospitable shore of monetary policy. Scots are not showing any sign of warming to the idea of giving up Sterling in favour of the Euro.
The UK still has plenty of national sovereignty within the EU. I know you know that. CER is the only thing that kept us afloat in the 1980s, and has functionally integrated us as countries. It's a close enough analogy for NZ.
The UK are about to find out that life on the outside is very cold. There's no changing their course now – they are going even with the new extension.
When UK leaves the customs union and single market, then the EU will start carrying out checks on British goods. Expect delays at Dover and Rottterdam and most other ports, traffic bottlenecks, supply route disruption – even with this amount of lead time.
In time the 28% of their food they get from the EU will settle down, as will the supply of medicines. In time.
There will be a sharp fall on the Pound no matter what. After that comes plenty of foreign takeover activity because it's all cheap.
A fair number of UK farms will be wiped out when the EU subsidies stop. So expect accelerated takeovers there.
Animal product exports into the EU restricted or prohibited.
No more EU research and development funding.
Then of course the travel inconveniences: EU pet passport no longer valid, new driving permit, no access to EU healthcare, mobile devices get charged on global roaming rates.
Thankfully the withdrawal agreement gives British cities living in the EU the same rights they have now.
But for the UK, massive loss of immigration. Probable decrease of business travel and tourism.
A big jump down in the economy overall.
A transition period to 31 December next year.
A degraded democracy. 2020 is the year the UK Labour Party has to figure out a way to survive. The Conservatives will just keep pushing the patriotic button and smash them.
Scotland leaves within three years.
A diminished and damaged UK.
It'll take a while to balance out whether the UK fee to the EU was worth it.
But the UK won't recover for years if at all.
With Brexit everyone loses, but the UK loses the most.
Re running the old discredited Remain scare tactics agains ?
"George Osborne released a Treasury report on the long-term economic impact of leaving the EU. The headline message from this report was that leaving the EU would cost each household an average of £4,300 each year. Using economic modelling, ….."
Treasury here cant model next years economy and the UK numbers mostly came from modelling a drop in migration to the UK.. just as we could boost the economy , and did, by boosting migration well above usual levels . Since when is that free money that doesnt cost as well for growing infrastructure and social dislocation.
"welcome to find a UK or EU or even OECD economist who says Brexit will have a positive economic impact on the UK. "
I just showed that 'economic modelling' is mostly voodoo science.
As the UK kept their pound , perhaps you would like to ask Greece how staying in the EU with the euro has worked for them.
leaving the EU fisheries alone – although it will take up to 5 years- will be a boost for Britain especially the northern ports
The Irish were stiffed by the EU as well over the bank bailouts , they were mislead in thinking the EU would cover the government saving of the banks . They didnt , Ireland had to 'pay it all back' meanwhile Iceland just said Goodbye to its banks and let them sink.
You did nothing of the kind. You didn't even bother to cite a European or UK forecast example. Just typical laziness on your part.
Euro membership is different to EU membership. But I'm sure you could see that already.
Iceland is an irrelevancy abut the size of Christchurch.
Fishing is yet another smelly pro-Brexit lie. Fishing is .12% of the UK economy. Prepare for "origin" documents for each boat and each catch. Who knows if they will be able to sell their shellfish into the EU at all?
Ireland had the freedom – while within the EU – to form its own corporate tax settings and has completely re-set its economy. It's booming.
"You are welcome to find a UK or EU or even OECD economist who says Brexit will have a positive economic impact on the UK."
I don't anyone is saying that Brexit will have a "positive economic impact" on the UK, at least in the short term term; however, I think the negatives are being overstated deliberately for political purposes, and the benefits of remaining overstated.
Yanis Varoufakis, who at the time of the referendum campaigned on behalf of the Remain option, was arguing that the UK should remain in the EU and reform it from within. Fat chance of that though, so it's probably better she gets out.
Those who promoted the benefits of leaving have been shown to be liars, and they are the ones in power continuing to both tell and implement those lies.
Remember in 2012 when the London Olympics were opened? The UK proposed itself to the world as a place of inclusiveness, global cooperation, expansiveness, confidence, renewed tradition, and a great sense of fun?
Gone.
Since the referendum, immigration into the UK has crashed, the Pound has nosedived, and the government is proposing a minimum immigrant entry salary into the UK of 36,000 Pounds which is great if you're a banker but little else.
Thankfully for the UK the economy is overall so strong that this is as good a time as any to Brexit.
I was not in London in 2012 so I'm not likely to remember it. However, I think that what has been lost since then was probably lost long before the referendum. The GFC in 2008 was probably a more important influence.
Better they get out now before EU policies weaken Britain further.
Most of the spin in the forecasts is done with a simple ruse. The leave forecasts bias towards scenarios where the UK enters a mild recession on leaving and the government doesn't react. This causes a deep recession. The model has the same outcome of course when looking at similar scenarios with the UK in the EU.
We know this as later bank of england forecasts didn't match up and they admitted treasury put pressure on them to fiddle the earlier ones (which they had).
And yet it’s the areas where sovereignty has had to be ceded to Brussels that have rankled the most over the years and been the main drivers of the referendum result.
CER is not the same as EU membership, it’s a trade and freedom of movement deal between NZ and Australia. And good on us for getting it when we did. Given the state of politics in Australia nowadays we would never be able to achieve anything like it today. Since we got it however, we’ve got plenty of trade deals with other countries too. Ironically Britain would love a CER type deal with Europe and the freedom to strike other deals across the globe but they can’t while they stay in Europe.
As for the idea that Britain is going to feel the cold shoulder of economic ruin outside of the bloc. This may well come to pass but guess what, history is littered with examples of nation-states making decisions that run counter to their economic prospects, usually because there are other, higher interests at stake. Times made indeed be tough in Blighty, probably for quite some time. It seems though that enough people there have decided the risk is worthwhile.
The EU benefits mainly countries with large agricultural sector or they are new entries which get EU giveways. Plus large manufacturing companies can send their assembly and production plants to low wage areas- even so a car plant in Slovakia will have contract only workers shipped in from Romania.
Is Britains Cornwall and Devon really an underprivileged area that needs EU regional assistance.
Greenland is the population of Nelson, so no one gave a damn. It's a client state of Denmark and the US military, beset by suicide and depression and ecological ruin.
Singapore isn't in the EU, nor Malaysia. You can run an argument about size optimization for states and the role of Lee Kuan Yew over thirty years, versus Malay integration, if you like.
Cornwall and Devon are dominated by massive private estates, some of them royal. They don't benefit from EU projects. Some may get subsidies as you say, but you can find out what the benefits are for each location here: https://www.myeu.uk
We'll only really figure out the benefits of the EU once the UK leaves. The EU has done a spectacularly poor job of either reforming internally or selling its positives.
I watched quite a bit of the Commons last night and the more I see Boris Johnston, the more he comes across to me as a patronising, boorish, lying bastard who should be kept well away from the levers of power.
Jeremy Corbyn on the other hand speaks clearly, cogently and you get the impression he is the one telling the truth.
I cannot understand why the British media in particular try to portray Corbyn as the boorish, lying one and Johnston as the people's saviour when anyone with half a brain can see for themselves it's the other way round.
Golly – that is a real Blip's list. (Or can I say golly now?)
He is one of the great AotW. A rambunctious spieler who speaks loud and confidently and attracts the enthusiasm of the mindless but aspirational (a febrile and easily ignited mass). I have seen a group excited by the declamations of someone voluble appoint that person as leader on the spot, to their discomfort.
As for ScottGN raising the narrow majority of people fed blatant lies, and voting for change with the smallest majority to holy writ, one can only wonder at the simple-minded mantra of theory being spouted in the face of practical and informed reason. This also from Bryan Gould.
The people in UK were unaware that their vote of dissatisfaction was likely to be used to break up the basics of their society, so they did not understand the need to apply themselves to attending workshops on the political ramifications and learn all the consequences, known and possible. Can I just have my understanding confirmed by one of the wise here: –
1 Was the referendum a binding one?
2 Or was it considered by the populace more as an expression of feeling, a snapshot of that point in time, more like an important poll?
Law grinds the poor, and rich men rule the law.
Oliver Goldsmith Author Profession: Poet Nationality: Irish Born: November 10, 1730 Died: April 4, 1774
Was the referendum a binding one or not? So many people making statements of what should be done and does anyone know this important point? I want one of the wise people who come here with ideas about how right Brexit is and listen to the voice of the people blah blah. Is everyone, we and the UK voters, informed about the facts of this matter.?
You always cloud the issue dou. Thank you, if you are right about that information – not binding. I wanted to establish the point, not have your brownwash over it afterwards.
Although legally the referendum was non-binding, the government of that time had promised to implement the result.[1] The succeeding government initiated the official EU withdrawal process on 29 March 2017, meaning that the UK was due to leave the EU before 11PM GMT on 29 March 2019, when the two-year period for Brexit negotiations expired.[2]
Just as NZs first MMP referendum wasnt legally binding either.
The 2nd vote wasnt part of the 'process' or mentioned during the first vote
The 2nd vote was indroduced by Bolgers government to kill off MPP, along with the massive Shirtcliffe led campaign against MMP who predicted – yes just like the Brexit one- that old chesnut economic ruin
Always good to provide a link, even if it is to Wikipedia, to give comments a certain level of validity, if you know what I mean; it sometimes helps to make it less personal. Nowadays, we don’t just take people’s word for it because we can’t, sadly.
DoU Brexit was what we were talking about. You diverted the thread to NZ. Can't you keep to the point when you find something elsewhere to scotch your argument. I wasn't talking round the subject of referendums – it was this UK one, and how the law was drawn up. Badly I think. But you go off-piste and hey presto you made a point which has little relevance.
Thanks Incognito – I did want to hear something pretty factual, not just Dous version or opinion.
So it was cloudy then, as to whether it would go ahead. If a local Council came up with that sort of policy machinery that had great loopholes in it, voters, ratepayers, taxpayers, small business etc would have been up in arms about it. When it is an august body that sits on green leather? seats, they shouldn't get a free pass out of jail.
Them and their policy writers and those whose job it is to keep legislation fit for purpose should get a boot in the backside (no important vote like that should pass on a simple majority – 75-80% rather.) Give them the Bad Sir Brian Botany treatment. A delightful rhyming piece:
Sir Brian went a journey and he found a lot of duckweed.
They pulled him out and dried him and they blipped him on the head.
They took him by the breeches
And they hurled him into ditches
And they pushed him under waterfalls and this is what they said:…
To save the ship (Britannia) from the rocks they steered it into a storm and now they’ve lost all bearings. The Officers say “trust us, we know what we’re doing as we were borne to steer this ship so stay calm and carry on”. The deckhands and crew below deck are in for a rough sailing while the Officers dine in their quarters. As it has always been and always will be.
I don't think the referendum was binding, but nor do I think it was just an "expression of feeling". I'm pretty sure the people who voted to leave believed that that the UK would leave if enough people voted the same way. Or that the UK would walk away from the EU if the opposite turned out to be the case.
Edit
mikesh You are rather loose with your political procedures, a bit easy peasy. For instance what do you consider enough people voting would look like. The whole question about national matters of great world importance, and to those of the country that have their lives affected, is should changes be on a simple majority it 50.5 or 51% to 49%. Those few points at the centre become crucial – so easy to bribe a sizable group to vote for you in ways that are just outside any controlling law. I think you are too trusting to have a vote.
I say 70-80% should be required for a majority win on matters of great importance as this is.
The British House of Commons can be dissolved and an election held before the expiry of its 5-year term by a vote of two-thirds of the membership of the House of Commons since 2011 under the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011. This is the only supermajority required in the British Constitution. [my italics]
Oh thanks BG. I get so nervous these days. There is a sort of etiquette book on-line called the Urban Dictionary which I consult sometimes but I tend to go into a faint sometimes after reading it.
I have a 100 year old book of etiquette and may be consulted between the hours of 10.00 and 11.00am on Sundays on any matters of great delicacy on which people of a sensitive and gentle disposition wish to receive the old-fashioned advice that is such an emollient in social matters.
Boris may well be the biggest arsehole who ever lived Anne but that’s irrelevant. Westminster has a job to do, having asked the people of the UK to make a choice, they should get on with implementation of the decision they were given.
I would like to point out that anyone who was a day/a week or a month short of 18 did not vote. That is an aweful lot of people who did not get the right to decide their future, yet who is considered old enough to work, pay taxes and such.
I personally think that indeed the voting age for referendums that impact the life of everyone to that extend should have been at least 15 – which is also the age one is considered old enough to work fulltime and pay taxes.
In the same i would support a cut of age for people say over 75. Why? They will most likely not be affected by anything much.
Democracy you say? Ha, democracy depends on the sanity of the populace, and frankly people believing they can go back to the 1850's when everyone knew their place, especially the foreigners, the brown ones, the women ones, the children ones etc etc etc are not what i would consider 'sane'.
And we, as much as poeple else where we don't have a democracy, we have a selection of the most unsuited people – generally by way of birth, access to money and connections – and we get to choose every few years the least unpalatble option. Yei! Democracy!
"all their own fault for not voting – even when they are not allowed to vote."
The best nonsense comment of the week.
You have no real idea of what 16-18 yrs think and want, they arent social activists from well off families like you probably think.
Remember NZs Sue Bradford , a young activist- daughter of a professor of cell biology
The real problem is the 'teenage brain', social media campaigns financed by business and conservative political groups will have a field day with 'teenage brains'.
Money will win that game rather than ideas
For example Plenty of social tricks in music to get young woman to like it – digital high pitched voices etc.
We trusted them when we lowered the drinking age from 21 to 18.
It was a total disaster.
Property ownership is not a qualification of voting.
The week before the local government elections, hundreds of thousands of young people marched seeking political change. Next week, with voting papers sent out, worst voting turnout in a century.
So far there's no evidence they'd use it if they even got it.
The week before the local government elections, hundreds of thousands of young people marched seeking political change. Next week, with voting papers sent out, worst voting turnout in a century.
To young people this makes sense, I reckon, but to you it clearly doesn’t. Ergo, you’re not a young person.
Turnout was woefully low. Ergo, voters have no need for the vote then. At least young people get off their butts for and about stuff that matters to them, even if it might be fleetingly. Over time, they will become as apathetic as the rest of the electorate and stop acting for the greater good and opt for fretting about the QV of their house(s) instead.
Not much democracy in mass low skill immigration – our self-styled "masters" imposed that massive clusterfuck on us without asking – they knew perfectly well what the response would be. Not much democracy in rubber stamping offshore land sales when a substantial majority oppose it absolutely, or signing up for a TPP deal with investor state provisions. Democracy is such an implicit virtue even North Korea pretends to it – but try to access your Labour electorate MP about slave fishing and they'll gaslight you from asshole to breakfast – they love slave fishing, and hate NZ workers with a passion. Expect them to do their job however, and you will be disappointed. For decades, the despicable pieces of crap.
Everybody has issues that strike close to the bone.
It was my career. Government collaborated with illegal practice and basically fucked my life. We expect illegality from Gnats, they are corrupt subhuman scum who, at best, belong in prison. But Labour pretended, and still pretend to progressive values. Slavery is not consistent with that pretention.
The fisheries have failed to develop. They are not measurably more sustainable. They have failed in their treaty obligations, and their international labour standards responsibilities.
We ordinary mortals suffer life-ruining consequences if we fall short of our responsibilities. As democratic citizens we get the government we choose to accept. I do not accept Labour's toleration of slave fishing – they need to clean up their act. I'd like a few personal apologies too, from all the worthless lying stooges I've raised it with, who by collaborating, have chosen to be accomplices after the fact.
There are a few aphorisms doing the rounds such as the invisible hand and free market wisdom and its rational consumers. These are statements or constructs rather about us. I think it’s high time we wise up.
Perhaps parents should also cast a vote on behalf of their infant children, who will also be affected in the future lives by the decision. Such infants do not have time to visit the polling booths themselves in between breast feeding episodes and sleeping.
Doable, if both parents take turns at breastfeeding and looking after the sleeping defenceless infants. Assuming both parents are together in the same household otherwise a babysitter needs to be called in.
For what it’s worth I support lowering the voting age to 16 generally. And doing so would have almost certainly delivered a different result in the referendum.
The vote was conducted under the electoral rules in place at the time though and to suggest that it is somehow invalid because of that is nonsense.
Fake news, lies, misrepresentations etc have always been a part of political campaigns. I think it's safe to suggest that in recent years the bar has become very low. I don't think any rational person would argue that this is good for democracy. 'A lie is halfway around the world before Truth has it's boots on.
Where is this trend going to take us? I'm not sure there is a solution to this in law. It will have to come from the voters, but so long as there is political benefit to be gained by trickery and deception you won't see any progress.
Fanciful dreams always give the result you want , thats the reason for using them.
Should we only have those over 50 vote on retirement and super questions 'because its their future'…thats just as silly as your talk about 16 yr voting
You still try very hard to not understand what i have said.
I am all for people who don't receive the super – aka our overloard in parliament – to not vote ever on restriction super or raising the retirment age.
Yeah, i would not mind a bit of exclusion for people who are not affected by the choice to make to make these choices for others.
But the vote of Brexit was 3.5 years ago, and the only ones screwed over royally in this case are those that are now in their twenties and they still have the same incompetend and un – affected lords fucking up their lives with no recourse.
The House of Lords is strongly pro Remain…. what do you think that tells you about the age and social class who have benefited most from the EU and continue to so.
A UBI would not be of much benefit to me since I am already receiving National Super. However I would still vote for it on the grounds that it would be good for the country.
Apples with oranges. MMP was still an internal voting system.
Brexit breaks down carefully crafted measures and agreements with other nations using diplomacy and collaborative approaches, in some countries after nasty armed encounters. The Irish are a close example, have found the system okay and useful for general value. The free interflow to and from Europe which breaks down dislikes and disdain with familiarity from one country to another, modernises cultural backwaters, and stopped the UK from being insular in cultural attitudes, is being thrown out petulantly.
The hatred of EU bureaucracy isn't because it is worse than that of the UK itself. And the EU backs modern safeguards for human rights and respect that the USA is unable to match, being fuller of BS than the EU. People who have settled outside the UK are being forced to repatriate as their mutually agreed social benefits will come to an end.
It is a repeat of what Australia is doing to NZ, gradually. And seems connected with what the USA is doing as it flexes its flabby muscles, preparing to introduce automaton forces. If the USA continues in its reckless, hapless way and the UK binds into its systems, it is possible that the west will be involved in war again.
@Duke so the first MMP referendum (non-binding) had turnout of 55%, of whom 85% (1.2M) wanted change. Then the second referendum (binding) had turnout of 83%, of whom 54% wanted change.
I wasn't in the country then, so I've got no idea of the general mood of the country then (except for the timeless general disgust at politicians).
But it seems to me when presented with a non-binding question for yet-to-be-defined change (1st MMP and Brexit), there's a whole lot of meh going around, with the greatest motivation among those wanting to send a middle finger message to pollies. But for the 2nd MMP referendum, there may have been a sense of "shee-it, this is really happening" which turned a lot of the previous mehs into voters.
In terms of raw numbers, the first MMP referendum had 1031k votes for change (and the MMP option got 791k), 186k for status quo. The second referendum got 1033k votes for change, 885k for status quo. So fuck all difference in how many people wanted change, but a vast increase in the turnout for status quo.
It's not hard to imagine a similar thing happening if Brexit get a second referendum.
Can't agree ScottGN. The outcome of the referendum was narrow. Not much in it at all. Many who voted Leave were later to recant and say they didn't understand what Leave meant and if there were another referendum they would vote Remain. That's not made up. It was widely reported in the British Press.
And it is highly relevant having an arsehole as a leader. They can do so much damage in the course of their term in office. Look at Trump. A disaster in every sense of the word.
We had one of our own once who, admittedly, seems tame in comparison to Trump. I refer to Muldoon.
Leave meant leave. A simple idea at its heart. What you really mean was didnt understand 'all consequences' Even now can ordinary people understand the Irish backstop and the Irish sea border concepts.
Do the people who voted for 'Scottish independence' had any real idea of the consequences .
From what I understood about Scotlands independence vote was some thought the EU would pay for Scotland budget top up they get from Westminister now.
Look at NZs MMP many people even now dont know how it really works, especially if you lose electorate seats the gain is made in list seats. A common mistake made by media people who should know better
"it's done the Scottish independence movement no end of good."
So leaving the EU is bad , but leaving the UK is good. Only twisted logic could suggest that.
Scotland will have to have the Euro, a hard border with England and no more Westminster subsidies. Good luck with thinking the EU will pay the core government operating expenses
I didn't say independence was good, I said the last few years have done the independence cause no end of good.
Because 62% of Scots voted against brexit, and they're seeing it inflicted upon them in the most stupid manner imaginable.
Now maybe the money transfers go more one way than the other. The hard border isn't as much of an issue for Scotland as it is for Northern Ireland. But Scotland could well be better off in the EU and outside Britain than the other way around.
I seem to recall that normally you are much better at reading comprehension. My comments were in relation to the brexit bullshit helping the independence cause, not that the independence cause was an outright majority.
dou Excuses for rigid authoritarianism. The folk won't bother so don't set it out in plain terms so they can understand. In a pros and cons way – which could be done with the general aims easily.
If you believe it's not worth the bother because people won't read it or understand it, you are reflecting the worst aspects of the Westminster system that cater to class-oriented mendacity.
What you really mean was didnt understand 'all consequences'
Indeed it was. There are lots of people who will never understand electoral systems – or any other system – because they haven't the marbles and it would seem to include more than a few of our media.
I accidently bought a HoS today thinking it was the SST (yep wasn't wearing my glasses 🙁 ) and read HDPA's latest article. Talk about a diatribe of misquotes, misinterpretations, misunderstandings and mischievous inaccuracies.
David Slack would have been a far more enjoyable read. 🙁 🙁
"Many who voted Leave were later to recant and say they didn't understand what Leave meant and if there were another referendum they would vote Remain. That's not made up. It was widely reported in the British Press."
I heard of one person who said that. Was there also another?
According to the British media not long after the result came through, there were lots of them. But you'll have to take my word for it because I'm not going to hunt for them. Got better things to do with my time.
I had a friend come and watch and be bought a mate.
We were talking about team culture and the article on Stuff about all the players unload the baggage from the bus. He reckons the ABs always clean up the changing room after a test.
It reiterates the message 'Go fast, go alone. Go far, go together'.
She's got it all sorted if you are feeling confused. Sounds a bit like today's Mother Beeton's book on etiquette of old.
11.30 Kitty Flanagan's 488 Rules For Life Radionz today
The very witty Kitty Flanagan has helpfully put together a comprehensive guide to modern behaviour, and help everyone around you be a bit less irritating, with her new book, 488 Rules For Life: The Thankless Art of Being Correct.
She covers the important things: work microwave etiquette involving last night's fish curry, walking and texting, wearing far too much perfume on public transport, or what to do with the last of the toilet paper.
Oh, and whether middle-aged men should have ponytails. (Spoiler alert… They shouldn't.) It began as a bit of a joke on Kitty's popular segment on ABC TV's The Weekly, and her publishers reckon the resulting book has the power to change society.
Great! Thank you @HillaryClinton. You, the queen of warmongers, embodiment of corruption, and personification of the rot that has sickened the Democratic Party for so long, have finally come out from behind the curtain. From the day I announced my candidacy, there has been a …
"Hillary Clinton suggests Russians are 'grooming' Tulsi Gabbard for third-party run"
Clinton never mentioned Tulsi Gabbards name !
Gabbard has outed herself as Moscows plant.
Kamala Harris’s press manager has been more specific about Gabbard s Moscow connections.
Gabbard is often featured on RT News.
“Gabbard is an interesting case, because she does have some foreign policy objectives that align with Russia, so it would make sense that a candidate who is known as an Assad apologist is seeing favorable tweets and headlines from some sort of Russian apparatus.” https://www.dailydot.com/layer8/tulsi-gabbard-russia/
If I were a political satirist right now I'd be seriously considering alternative careers. How could anyone make up stuff that tops what really happening?
Too bad it's not the 1950's useful idiots like you, Andre and Joe 90 would have been right in your element disseminating paranoia, outing actors, artists, writers etc with the panty hose wearing pervert McCarthy..oh well I guess lates better than never with you dummies.
By the way that link to daily dot is a real low brow shit piece of propaganda, it's so over that top it really could have come staight out of the 50's, but you are in sooo deep you lot can't see the plainly obvious anymore..so here you go guys, this should be up your ally..
Of couse I forgot with you lot winning is everything, even if that means leaving all your ethics principles and morals on the floor to gain the win…
But to give you an answer, again your analysis is flawed as per usual, Gabbard is and has alwyas been about changing the direction of the Democratic party, primarily from one that supports and often enacts aggressive foreign interventions, to one that dosen't.
I am not actually a Gabbard supporter, but I do happen to support that particular extremely important foreign policy platform that she is pushing.
I would say that her own plan for these elections would be that she would like to see Sanders win, and picks up a (well deserved) position in his administration.
I'm sure if you squint really hard and ignore logic and basic English, you might see it that way.
Last time I counted the nominees, "several" good 'uns would leave at least a "solid half dozen" banalities, and "a couple" of duds have already withdrawn.
Yeah it is hard to imagine what sort of mental gymnastics must go in in the top four inches of a person who is trying to tell themselves that they are at all 'progressive' or left , while at the same time defending Clinton and the centrist liberal ideology…must be quite a workout.
Not sure what you are talking about, Clinton is the one who attacked Gabbard yesterday, Clinton is the one who keeps trying unsuccessfully to remain relevant..in fact I don't give a fuck about her.
If the grooming hat doesn't fit Gabbard, then the imprecise reference wasn't a slur on Gabbard. If the hat does fit Gabbard, then it's a simple truth that the hat fits Gabbard.
But whatevs, you're totally not bovvered anyway, you don't look bovvered at all, lol
You are repeating falsehoods Adrian, Clinton never mentioned Gabbards name – she said a democratic candidate. She also talked about Jill Stein and Trumps possible Russia links.
Kamal Harris's people were talking about Gabbard and Moscow 2 weeks back
You dont GaF , but bought the whole matter up. geez
Are you serious, every one knows Clinon was talking about Gabbard..they where meant too..holy shit man, it's lucky we aren't talking on the phone I might have had to do this….
The Russiagate conspiracy is the best asset Trump has, didn't see the Democrates losing their shit over all the things that Trump has done to make peoples lives worse in the US and around the world, didn't see them vote against the biggest military budget ever or the huge tax cuts for the wealthest in the States…nope their main focus for three whole years has been Russia Russia Russia.
All this while poll after poll showed that the majority of US citizens don't care about Russia or Russiagate.
And yet here you lot are, stepping right in line with a narritive that no one wants to hear, supporting a debunked conspiracy that is seriously in danger of helping re-elect Trump…job well done boys…keep flogging that dead horse.
OK yes you are right,that was wrong on the tax cuts, what I was meant to say was that the Democates didn't use that as their or similar Trump policies to form the spearhead of their push back to Trump, they instead kept using Russia as their main (blunt) weapon of attack.
Will the but her emails/the server, the server crowd stfu and go back to despising her for being her?
A State Department investigation into former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s private email account found no widespread effort by her aides or other staffers to mishandle classified information.
The three-year-long investigation by State’s Bureau of Diplomatic Security concluded that 38 individuals committed a total of 91 security violations involving emails sent to or from Clinton’s private server.
Somehow it seems a little less offensively corrupt to be hauling in megacoin from Wall Street speeches after your term in office than if you do it immediately before running for office.
Little birds and big adults can both be vulnerable, needing food and housing. Do we have to set up Give a little accounts in a country that has squeezed $7 billion of returns from various places but much from paying beneficiaries less than required and puting barriers in their way for bettering their lives. And having flexible workers who sacrifice their health and wellbeing while they work here and there at odd hours and often on call so hard to plan. Having a birthday party for your 5 year old, phone call, we are short-handed. Letall have a sweet life in NZ again and start spending that $7 billion on human investment giving enjoyment, education and security in people's lives.
So many of us need help. Perhaps the government could pay the poor to look after the nation's animals. The government has been instrumental in causing businesses to fold and import companies grow fat on replacing our own manufactures. So look for other jobs that need doing so we can put those spare hours into paid kaitiaki work. 💡 💡
Wonder who it was that got through to the bilious fake-bronze baboon that it's actually illegal for a government employee to award government contracts to their own businesses, and what arguments they used? Let alone that it's a glaring breach of two separate constitutional clauses, and therefore clearly impeachable as a standalone offence.
…an overall decline in most aspects surveyed. This is not surprising given the culmulative effects of overcrowding and understaffing experienced thoughout New Zealand prisons.
For instance:
(a) poor ventilation in cells, and cells being too hot in summer and too cold in winter. In Auckland at the end of December last year we received reports of night time cell termperatures of 27 degrees.
(b) lack of access to toilets, specifically insufficient access to toilets while being transferred, and while in yards and in day-rooms. As one person put it, “going toilet in a small bottle on a moving vehicle is extremely hard. A number of us spilled it, missed altogether, and overfilled the bottles.”
It is all very well cutting the backrooms of public agencies but it may compromise the frontlines. One of the frustrations of the Productivity Commission’s 2017 review of universities is that while it observed that their non-academic staff were increasing faster than their academic staff, it did not bother to ...
Buzz from the Beehive Two speeches delivered by Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters at Anzac Day ceremonies in Turkey are the only new posts on the government’s official website since the PM announced his Cabinet shake-up. In one of the speeches, Peters stated the obvious: we live in a troubled ...
1. Which of these would you not expect to read in The Waikato Invader?a. Luxon is here to do business, don’t you worry about thatb. Mr KPI expects results, and you better believe itc. This decisive man of action is getting me all hot and excitedd. Melissa Lee is how ...
…it has a restricted jurisdiction which must not be abused: it is not an inquisitionNOTE – this article was published before the High Court ruled that Karen Chhour does not have to appear before the Waitangi Tribunal Gary Judd writes – The High Court ...
Lindsay Mitchell writes – One of reasons Oranga Tamariki exists is to prevent child neglect. But could the organisation itself be guilty of the same?Oranga Tamariki’s statistics show a decrease in the number and age of children in care. “There are less children ...
David Farrar writes: Graeme Edgeler wrote in 2017: In the first five years after three strikes came into effect 5248 offenders received a ‘first strike’ (that is, a “stage-1 conviction” under the three strikes sentencing regime), and 68 offenders received a ‘second strike’. In the five years prior to ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has surprised everyone with his ruthlessness in sacking two of his ministers from their crucial portfolios. Removing ministers for poor performance after only five months in the job just doesn’t normally happen in politics. That’s refreshing and will be extremely ...
TL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy in the two days to 6:06am on Thursday, April 25:Politics: PM Christopher Luxon has set up a dual standard for ministerial competence by demoting two National Cabinet ministers while leaving also-struggling ...
Hi,Today I mainly want to share some of your thoughts about the recent piece I wrote about success and failure, and the forces that seemingly guide our lives. But first, a quick bit of housekeeping: I am doing a Webworm popup in Los Angeles on Saturday May 11 at 2pm. ...
It is hard to see what Melissa Lee might have done to “save” the media. National went into the election with no public media policy and appears not to have developed one subsequently. Lee claimed that she had prepared a policy paper before the election but it had been decided ...
Open access notablesIce acceleration and rotation in the Greenland Ice Sheet interior in recent decades, Løkkegaard et al., Communications Earth & Environment:In the past two decades, mass loss from the Greenland ice sheet has accelerated, partly due to the speedup of glaciers. However, uncertainty in speed derived from satellite products ...
Buzz from the Beehive A statement from Children’s Minister Karen Chhour – yet to be posted on the Government’s official website – arrived in Point of Order’s email in-tray last night. It welcomes the High Court ruling on whether the Waitangi Tribunal can demand she appear before it. It does ...
Mr Bombastic:Ironically, the media the academic experts wanted is, in many ways, the media they got. In place of the tyrannical editors of yesteryear, advancing without fear or favour the interests of the ruling class; the New Zealand news media of today boasts a troop of enlightened journalists dedicated to ...
It's hard times try to make a livingYou wake up every morning in the unforgivingOut there somewhere in the cityThere's people living lives without mercy or pityI feel good, yeah I'm feeling fineI feel better then I have for the longest timeI think these pills have been good for meI ...
In 1974, the US Supreme Court issued its decision in United States v. Nixon, finding that the President was not a King, but was subject to the law and was required to turn over the evidence of his wrongdoing to the courts. It was a landmark decision for the rule ...
Every day now just seems to bring in more fresh meat for the grinder.In their relentlessly ideological drive to cut back on the “excessive bloat” (as they see it) of the previous Labour-led government, on the mountains of evidence accumulated in such a short period of time do not ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Megan Valére SosouMarket gardening site of the Itchèléré de Itagui agricultural cooperative in Dassa-Zoumè (Image credit: Megan Valère Sossou) For the residents of Dassa-Zoumè, a city in the West African country of Benin, choosing between drinking water and having enough ...
Buzz from the Beehive Melissa Lee – as may be discerned from the screenshot above – has not been demoted for doing something seriously wrong as Minister of ...
Morning in London Mother hugs beloved daughter outside the converted shoe factory in which she is living.Afternoon in London Travelling writer takes himself and his wrist down to A&E, just to be sure. Read more ...
Mike Grimshaw writes – The recent announcement of the University Advisory Group, chaired by Sir Peter Gluckman, makes very clear where the Government’s focus and priorities lie. The remit of the Advisory Group is that Group members will consider challenges and opportunities for improvement in the university sector including: ...
Eric Crampton writes – The Reserve Bank of New Zealand desperately wants to find reasons to have workstreams in climate change. It makes little sense. They’ve run another stress test on the banks looking to see if they could find a prudential regulation case. They couldn’t. They ...
Rob MacCullough writes – Pundits from the left and the right are arguing that National’s Fast Track Bill that is designed to speed up infrastructure decisions could end up becoming mired in a cesspool of corruption. Political commentator ...
Looking at the headlines this morning it’s hard to feel anything other than pessimistic about the future of humanity.Note that I’m not speaking about the future of mankind, but the survival of our humanity. The values that we believe in seem to be ebbing away, by the day.Perhaps every generation ...
Swabbing mixed breed baby chicks to test for avian influenzaUh oh. Bird flu – often deadly to humans – is not only being transmitted from infected birds to dairy cows, but is now travelling between dairy cows. As of last Friday, Bloomberg News reports, there were 32 American dairy herds ...
On February 14, 2023 we announced our Rebuttal Update Project. This included an ask for feedback about the added "At a glance" section in the updated basic rebuttal versions. This weekly blog post series highlights this new section of one of the updated basic rebuttal versions and serves as a ...
What is it with the mining industry? Its not enough for them to pillage the earth - they apparently can't even be bothered getting resource consent to do so: The proponent behind a major mine near the Clutha River had already been undertaking activity in the area without a ...
Photo # 1 I am a huge fan of Singapore’s approach to housing, as described here two years ago by copying and pasting from The ConversationWhat Singapore has that Australia does not is a public housing developer, the Housing Development Board, which puts new dwellings on public and reclaimed land, ...
Buzz from the Beehive Reactions to news of the government’s readiness to make urgent changes to “the resource management system” through a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) suggest a balanced approach is being taken. The Taxpayers’ Union says the proposed changes don’t go far enough. Greenpeace says ...
I’m starting to wonder if Anna Burns-Francis might be the best political interviewer we’ve got. That might sound unlikely to you, it came as a bit of a surprise to me.Jack Tame can be excellent, but has some pretty average days. I like Rebecca Wright on Newshub, she asks good ...
Chris Trotter writes – Willie Jackson is said to be planning a “media summit” to discuss “the state of the media and how to protect Fourth Estate Journalism”. Not only does the Editor of The Daily Blog, Martyn Bradbury, think this is a good idea, but he has also ...
Graeme Edgeler writes – This morning [April 21], the Wellington High Court is hearing a judicial review brought by Hon. Karen Chhour, the Minister for Children, against a decision of the Waitangi Tribunal. This is unusual, judicial reviews are much more likely to brought against ministers, rather than ...
Both of Parliament’s watchdogs have now ripped into the Government’s Fast-track Approvals Bill. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāMy pick of the six newsey things to know from Aotearoa’s political economy and beyond on the morning of Tuesday, April 23 are:The Lead: The Auditor General,John Ryan, has joined the ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Sarah SpengemanPeople wait to board an electric bus in Pune, India. (Image credit: courtesy of ITDP) Public transportation riders in Pune, India, love the city’s new electric buses so much they will actually skip an older diesel bus that ...
The infrastructure industry yesterday issued a “hurry up” message to the Government, telling it to get cracking on developing a pipeline of infrastructure projects.The hiatus around the change of Government has seen some major projects cancelled and others delayed, and there is uncertainty about what will happen with the new ...
Hi,Over the weekend I revisited a podcast I really adore, Dead Eyes. It’s about a guy who got fired from Band of Brothers over two decades ago because Tom Hanks said he had “dead eyes”.If you don’t recall — 2001’s Band of Brothers was part of the emerging trend of ...
Buzz from the Beehive The 180 or so recipients of letters from the Government telling them how to submit infrastructure projects for “fast track” consideration includes some whose project applications previously have been rejected by the courts. News media were quick to feature these in their reports after RMA Reform Minister Chris ...
It would not be a desirable way to start your holiday by breaking your back, your head, or your wrist, but on our first hour in Singapore I gave it a try.We were chatting, last week, before we started a meeting of Hazel’s Enviro Trust, about the things that can ...
Calling all journalists, academics, planners, lawyers, political activists, environmentalists, and other members of the public who believe that the relationships between vested interests and politicians need to be scrutinised. We need to work together to make sure that the new Fast-Track Approvals Bill – currently being pushed through by the ...
Feel worried. Shane Jones and a couple of his Cabinet colleagues are about to be granted the power to override any and all objections to projects like dams, mines, roads etc even if: said projects will harm biodiversity, increase global warming and cause other environmental harms, and even if ...
Bryce Edwards writes- The ability of the private sector to quickly establish major new projects making use of the urban and natural environment is to be supercharged by the new National-led Government. Yesterday it introduced to Parliament one of its most significant reforms, the Fast Track Approvals Bill. ...
Michael Bassett writes – If you think there is a move afoot by the radical Maori fringe of New Zealand society to create a parallel system of government to the one that we elect at our triennial elections, you aren’t wrong. Over the last few days we have ...
Without a corresponding drop in interest rates, it’s doubtful any changes to the CCCFA will unleash a massive rush of home buyers. Photo: Lynn GrievesonTL;DR: The six things that stood out to me in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, poverty and climate on Monday, April 22 included:The Government making a ...
Sunday was a lazy day. I started watching Jack Tame on Q&A, the interviews are usually good for something to write about. Saying the things that the politicians won’t, but are quite possibly thinking. Things that are true and need to be extracted from between the lines.As you might know ...
In our Weekly Roundup last week we covered news from Auckland Transport that the WX1 Western Express is going to get an upgrade next year with double decker electric buses. As part of the announcement, AT also said “Since we introduced the WX1 Western Express last November we have seen ...
TL;DR: The six key events to watch in Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy in the week to April 29 include:PM Christopher Luxon is scheduled to hold a post-Cabinet news conference at 4 pm today. Stats NZ releases its statutory report on Census 2023 tomorrow.Finance Minister Nicola Willis delivers a pre-Budget speech at ...
A listing of 29 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, April 14, 2024 thru Sat, April 20, 2024. Story of the week Our story of the week hinges on these words from the abstract of a fresh academic ...
The ability of the private sector to quickly establish major new projects making use of the urban and natural environment is to be supercharged by the new National-led Government. Yesterday it introduced to Parliament one of its most significant reforms, the Fast Track Approvals Bill. The Government says this will ...
This is a column to say thank you. So many of have been in touch since Mum died to say so many kind and thoughtful things. You’re wonderful, all of you. You’ve asked how we’re doing, how Dad’s doing. A little more realisation each day, of the irretrievable finality of ...
Identifying the engine type in your car is crucial for various reasons, including maintenance, repairs, and performance upgrades. Knowing the specific engine model allows you to access detailed technical information, locate compatible parts, and make informed decisions about modifications. This comprehensive guide will provide you with a step-by-step approach to ...
Introduction: The allure of racing is undeniable. The thrill of speed, the roar of engines, and the exhilaration of competition all contribute to the allure of this adrenaline-driven sport. For those who yearn to experience the pinnacle of racing, becoming a race car driver is the ultimate dream. However, the ...
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Your car battery is an essential component that provides power to start your engine, operate your electrical systems, and store energy. Over time, batteries can weaken and lose their ability to hold a charge, which can lead to starting problems, power failures, and other issues. Replacing your battery before it ...
In most states, you cannot register a car without a valid driver’s license. However, there are a few exceptions to this rule. Exceptions to the RuleIf you are under 18 years old: In some states, you can register a car in your name even if you do not ...
Mazda, a Japanese automotive manufacturer with a rich history of innovation and engineering excellence, has emerged as a formidable player in the global car market. Known for its reputation of producing high-quality, fuel-efficient, and driver-oriented vehicles, Mazda has consistently garnered praise from industry experts and consumers alike. In this article, ...
Struts are an essential part of a car’s suspension system. They are responsible for supporting the weight of the car and damping the oscillations of the springs. Struts are typically made of steel or aluminum and are filled with hydraulic fluid. How Do Struts Work? Struts work by transferring the ...
Car registration is a mandatory process that all vehicle owners must complete annually. This process involves registering your car with the Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) and paying an associated fee. The registration process ensures that your vehicle is properly licensed and insured, and helps law enforcement and other authorities ...
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Introduction Computer-Assisted Translation (CAT) has revolutionized the field of translation by harnessing the power of technology to assist human translators in their work. This innovative approach combines specialized software with human expertise to improve the efficiency, accuracy, and consistency of translations. In this comprehensive article, we will delve into the ...
In today’s digital age, mobile devices have become an indispensable part of our daily lives. Among the vast array of portable computing options available, iPads and tablet computers stand out as two prominent contenders. While both offer similar functionalities, there are subtle yet significant differences between these two devices. This ...
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Voice Memos is a convenient app on your iPhone that allows you to quickly record and store audio snippets. These recordings can be useful for a variety of purposes, such as taking notes, capturing ideas, or recording interviews. While you can listen to your voice memos on your iPhone, you ...
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Powering up and shutting down your ASUS laptop is an essential task for any laptop user. Locating the power button can sometimes be a hassle, especially if you’re new to ASUS laptops. This article will provide a comprehensive guide on where to find the power button on different ASUS laptop ...
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Te Pāti Māori are demanding the New Zealand Government support an international independent investigation into mass graves that have been uncovered at two hospitals on the Gaza strip, following weeks of assault by Israeli troops. Among the 392 bodies that have been recovered, are children and elderly civilians. Many of ...
Our two-tiered system for veterans’ support is out of step with our closest partners, and all parties in Parliament should work together to fix it, Labour veterans’ affairs spokesperson Greg O’Connor said. ...
Stripping two Ministers of their portfolios just six months into the job shows Christopher Luxon’s management style is lacking, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said. ...
Tonight’s court decision to overturn the summons of the Children’s Minister has enabled the Crown to continue making decisions about Māori without evidence, says Te Pāti Māori spokesperson for Children, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “The judicial system has this evening told the nation that this government can do whatever they want when ...
It appears Nicola Willis is about to pull the rug out from under the feet of local communities still dealing with the aftermath of last year’s severe weather, and local councils relying on funding to build back from these disasters. ...
The Government is making short-sighted changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) that will take away environmental protection in favour of short-term profits, Labour’s environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said today. ...
Labour welcomes the release of the report into the North Island weather events and looks forward to working with the Government to ensure that New Zealand is as prepared as it can be for the next natural disaster. ...
The Labour Party has called for the New Zealand Government to recognise Palestine, as a material step towards progressing the two-State solution needed to achieve a lasting peace in the region. ...
Some of our country’s most important work, stopping the sexual exploitation of children and violent extremism could go along with staff on the frontline at ports and airports. ...
The Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill will give projects such as new coal mines a ‘get out of jail free’ card to wreak havoc on the environment, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said today. ...
The government's decision to reintroduce Three Strikes is a destructive and ineffective piece of law-making that will only exacerbate an inherently biased and racist criminal justice system, said Te Pāti Māori Justice Spokesperson, Tākuta Ferris, today. During the time Three Strikes was in place in Aotearoa, Māori and Pasifika received ...
Cuts to frontline hospital staff are not only a broken election promise, it shows the reckless tax cuts have well and truly hit the frontline of the health system, says Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall. ...
The Green Party has joined the call for public submissions on the fast-track legislation to be extended after the Ombudsman forced the Government to release the list of organisations invited to apply just hours before submissions close. ...
New Zealand’s good work at reducing climate emissions for three years in a row will be undone by the National government’s lack of ambition and scrapping programmes that were making a difference, Labour Party climate spokesperson Megan Woods said today. ...
More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
Te Pāti Māori is disgusted at the confirmation that hundreds are set to lose their jobs at Oranga Tamariki, and the disestablishment of the Treaty Response Unit. “This act of absolute carelessness and out of touch decision making is committing tamariki to state abuse.” Said Te Pāti Māori Oranga Tamariki ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
Cancelling urgently needed new Cook Strait ferries and hiking the cost of public transport for many Kiwis so that National can announce the prospect of another tunnel for Wellington is not making good choices, Labour Transport Spokesperson Tangi Utikere said. ...
A laundry list of additional costs for Tāmaki Makarau Auckland shows the Minister for the city is not delivering for the people who live there, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
Te Pāti Māori co-leader Rawiri Waititi, and Mema Paremata mō Tāmaki-Makaurau, Takutai Tarsh Kemp, will travel to the Gold Coast to strengthen ties with Māori in Australia next week (15-21 April). The visit, in the lead-up to the 9th Australian National Kapa haka Festival, will be an opportunity for both ...
The Green Party has today launched a step-by-step guide to help New Zealanders make their voice heard on the Government’s democracy dodging and anti-environment fast track legislation. ...
The National Government’s proposed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act will mean tenants can be turfed from their homes by landlords with little notice, Labour housing spokesperson Kieran McAnulty said. ...
Green Party co-leader Marama Davidson is calling on all parties to support a common-sense change that’s great for the planet and great for consumers after her member’s bill was drawn from the ballot today. ...
A significant milestone has been reached in the fight to strike an anti-Pasifika and unfair law from the country’s books after Teanau Tuiono’s members’ bill passed its first reading. ...
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Today’s advice from the Climate Change Commission paints a sobering reality of the challenge we face in combating climate change, especially in light of recent Government policy announcements. ...
Minister for Disability Issues Penny Simmonds appears to have delayed a report back to Cabinet on the progress New Zealand is making against international obligations for disabled New Zealanders. ...
Ambassador Millar, Burgemeester, Vandepitte, Excellencies, military representatives, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen – good morning and welcome to this sacred Anzac Day dawn service. It is an honour to be here on behalf of the Government and people of New Zealand at Buttes New British Cemetery, Polygon Wood – a deeply ...
Distinguished guests - It is an honour to return once again to this site which, as the resting place for so many of our war-dead, has become a sacred place for generations of New Zealanders. Our presence here and at the other special spaces of Gallipoli is made ...
Mai ia tawhiti pamamao, te moana nui a Kiwa, kua tae whakaiti mai matou, ki to koutou papa whenua. No koutou te tapuwae, no matou te tapuwae, kua honoa pumautia. Ko nga toa kua hinga nei, o te Waipounamu, o te Ika a Maui, he okioki tahi me o ...
Paul Goldsmith will take on responsibility for the Media and Communications portfolio, while Louise Upston will pick up the Disability Issues portfolio, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon announced today. “Our Government is relentlessly focused on getting New Zealand back on track. As issues change in prominence, I plan to adjust Ministerial ...
Recreational catch limits will be reduced in areas of Fiordland and the Chatham Islands to help keep those fisheries healthy and sustainable, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The lower recreational daily catch limits for a range of finfish and shellfish species caught in the Fiordland Marine Area and ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed an important milestone in New Zealand’s hydrogen future, with the opening of the country’s first network of hydrogen refuelling stations in Wiri. “I want to congratulate the team at Hiringa Energy and its partners K one W one (K1W1), Mitsui & Co New Zealand ...
The coalition Government is delivering on its commitment to improve resource management laws and give greater certainty to consent applicants, with a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) expected to be introduced to Parliament next month. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop has today outlined the first RMA Amendment ...
Overseas models for regulating the oil and gas sector, including their decommissioning regimes, are being carefully scrutinised as a potential template for New Zealand’s own sector, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. The Coalition Government is focused on rebuilding investor confidence in New Zealand’s energy sector as it looks to strengthen ...
Emergency Management and Recovery Minister Mark Mitchell has today released the Report of the Government Inquiry into the response to the North Island Severe Weather Events. “The report shows that New Zealand’s emergency management system is not fit-for-purpose and there are some significant gaps we need to address,” Mr Mitchell ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith is today travelling to Europe where he’ll update the United Nations Human Rights Council on the Government’s work to restore law and order. “Attending the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva provides us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while ...
Associate Agriculture Minister, Mark Patterson, formally reopened the world’s largest wool processing facility today in Awatoto, Napier, following a $50 million rebuild and refurbishment project. “The reopening of this facility will significantly lift the economic opportunities available to New Zealand’s wool sector, which already accounts for 20 per cent of ...
Hon Andrew Bayly, Minister for Small Business and Manufacturing At the Southland Otago Regional Engineering Collective (SOREC) Summit, 18 April, Dunedin Ngā mihi nui, Ko Andrew Bayly aho, Ko Whanganui aho Good Afternoon and thank you for inviting me to open your summit today. I am delighted ...
The Government is delivering on its commitment to bring back the Three Strikes legislation, Associate Justice Minister Nicole McKee announced today. “Our Government is committed to restoring law and order and enforcing appropriate consequences on criminals. We are making it clear that repeat serious violent or sexual offending is not ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has today announced four new diplomatic appointments for New Zealand’s overseas missions. “Our diplomats have a vital role in maintaining and protecting New Zealand’s interests around the world,” Mr Peters says. “I am pleased to announce the appointment of these senior diplomats from the ...
New Zealand is contributing NZ$7 million to support communities affected by severe food insecurity and other urgent humanitarian needs in Ethiopia and Somalia, Foreign Minister Rt Hon Winston Peters announced today. “Over 21 million people are in need of humanitarian assistance across Ethiopia, with a further 6.9 million people ...
Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Paul Goldsmith is congratulating Mataaho Collective for winning the Golden Lion for best participant in the main exhibition at the Venice Biennale. "Congratulations to the Mataaho Collective for winning one of the world's most prestigious art prizes at the Venice Biennale. “It is good ...
The Government is reforming financial services to improve access to home loans and other lending, and strengthen customer protections, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly and Housing Minister Chris Bishop announced today. “Our coalition Government is committed to rebuilding the economy and making life simpler by cutting red tape. We are ...
“China remains a strong commercial opportunity for Kiwi exporters as Chinese businesses and consumers continue to value our high-quality safe produce,” Trade and Agriculture Minister Todd McClay says. Mr McClay has returned to New Zealand following visits to Beijing, Harbin and Shanghai where he met ministers, governors and mayors and engaged in trade and agricultural events with the New ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has completed a successful trip to Singapore, Thailand and the Philippines, deepening relationships and capitalising on opportunities. Mr Luxon was accompanied by a business delegation and says the choice of countries represents the priority the New Zealand Government places on South East Asia, and our relationships in ...
New Zealand is demonstrating its commitment to reducing global greenhouse emissions, and supporting clean energy transition in South East Asia, through a contribution of NZ$41 million (US$25 million) in climate finance to the Asian Development Bank (ADB)-led Energy Transition Mechanism (ETM). Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Climate Change Minister Simon Watts announced ...
The Government is today releasing a list of organisations who received letters about the Fast-track applications process, says RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop. “Recently Ministers and agencies have received a series of OIA requests for a list of organisations to whom I wrote with information on applying to have a ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today announced the appointment of Wellington Barrister David Jonathan Boldt as a Judge of the High Court, and the Honourable Justice Matthew Palmer as a Judge of the Court of Appeal. Justice Boldt graduated with an LLB from Victoria University of Wellington in 1990, and also holds ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford will lead the New Zealand delegation at the 2024 International Summit on the Teaching Profession (ISTP) held in Singapore. The delegation includes representatives from the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) Te Wehengarua and the New Zealand Educational Institute (NZEI) Te Riu Roa. The summit is co-hosted ...
A stopbank upgrade project in Tairawhiti partly funded by the Government has increased flood resilience for around 7000ha of residential and horticultural land so far, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones today attended a dawn service in Gisborne to mark the end of the first stage of the ...
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters will represent the Government at Anzac Day commemorations on the Gallipoli Peninsula next week and engage with senior representatives of the Turkish government in Istanbul. “The Gallipoli campaign is a defining event in our history. It will be a privilege to share the occasion ...
Science, Innovation and Technology and Defence Minister Judith Collins will next week attend the OECD Science and Technology Ministerial conference in Paris and Anzac Day commemorations in Belgium. “Science, innovation and technology have a major role to play in rebuilding our economy and achieving better health, environmental and social outcomes ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon held a bilateral meeting today with the President of the Philippines, Ferdinand Marcos Jr. The Prime Minister was accompanied by MP Paulo Garcia, the first Filipino to be elected to a legislature outside the Philippines. During today’s meeting, Prime Minister Luxon and President Marcos Jr discussed opportunities to ...
The Government has announced that $20 million in funding will be made available to Westport to fund much needed flood protection around the town. This measure will significantly improve the resilience of the community, says Local Government Minister Simeon Brown. “The Westport community has already been allocated almost $3 million ...
The Government is proud to support the first ever Repco Supercars Championship event in Taupō as up to 70,000 motorsport fans attend the Taupō International Motorsport Park this weekend, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. “Anticipation for the ITM Taupō Super400 is huge, with tickets and accommodation selling out weeks ...
Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced an increase to the Rates Rebate Scheme, putting money back into the pockets of low-income homeowners. “The coalition Government is committed to bringing down the cost of living for New Zealanders. That includes targeted support for those Kiwis who are doing things tough, such ...
The Coalition Government is investing in a project to boost survival rates of New Zealand mussels and grow the industry, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones has announced. “This project seeks to increase the resilience of our mussels and significantly boost the sector’s productivity,” Mr Jones says. “The project - ...
Benefit figures released today underscore the importance of the Government’s plan to rebuild the economy and have 50,000 fewer people on Jobseeker Support, Social Development and Employment Minister Louise Upston says. “Benefit numbers are still significantly higher than when National was last in government, when there was about 70,000 fewer ...
The Government’s commitment to doubling New Zealand’s renewable energy capacity is backed by new data showing that clean energy has helped the country reach its lowest annual gross emissions since 1999, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. New Zealand’s latest Greenhouse Gas Inventory (1990-2022) published today, shows gross emissions fell ...
The Government is bringing the earthquake-prone building review forward, with work to start immediately, and extending the deadline for remediations by four years, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “Our Government is focused on rebuilding the economy. A key part of our plan is to cut red tape that ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and his Thai counterpart, Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, have today agreed that New Zealand and the Kingdom of Thailand will upgrade the bilateral relationship to a Strategic Partnership by 2026. “New Zealand and Thailand have a lot to offer each other. We have a strong mutual desire to build ...
RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop and Transport Minister Simeon Brown have today announced the Coalition Government’s intention to extend port coastal permits for a further 20 years, providing port operators with certainty to continue their operations. “The introduction of the Resource Management Act in 1991 required ports to obtain coastal ...
Today’s announcement that inflation is down to 4 per cent is encouraging news for Kiwis, but there is more work to be done - underlining the importance of the Government’s plan to get the economy back on track, acting Finance Minister Chris Bishop says. “Inflation is now at 4 per ...
Refreshed health guidance released today will help parents and schools make informed decisions about whether their child needs to be in school, addressing one of the key issues affecting school attendance, says Associate Education Minister David Seymour. In recent years, consistently across all school terms, short-term illness or medical reasons ...
Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones is streamlining high-level oceans management while maintaining a focus on supporting the sector’s role in the export-led recovery of the economy. “I am working to realise the untapped potential of our fishing and aquaculture sector. To achieve that we need to be smarter with ...
I was initially resistant to the idea often suggested to me that the Government should deliver an arts strategy. The whole point of the arts and creativity is that people should do whatever the hell they want, unbound by the dictates of politicians in Wellington. Peter Jackson, Kiri Te Kanawa, Eleanor ...
Pacific Media Watch Palestine solidarity protesters today demonstrated at the Auckland headquarters of Television New Zealand, accusing the country’s major TV network of broadcasting “propaganda” backing Israel’s genocidal war on Gaza. About 50 protesters targeted the main entrance to the TVNZ building near Sky Tower and also picketed a side ...
Opinion by Lynley Hood. Forty years on from my 1985 Fulbright Grant, my disquiet over the war in Gaza evoked some troubling questions. The answer to my first question – What is the primary purpose of the Fulbright Programme? – was on the Fulbright NZ website. It says: US Senator, ...
The ministers responsible for green-lighting major projects need to be open about potential conflicts of interest, says Transparency International. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Anastasia Powell, Professor, Family and Sexual Violence, RMIT University It has been a particularly distressing start to the year. There is little that can ease the current grief of individuals, families and communities who have needlessly lost a loved one to men’s ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Gregory Moore, Senior Research Associate, School of Ecosystem and Forest Sciences, The University of Melbourne Lichen, the first described example of symbiosis.AdeJ Artventure/Shutterstock Once known only to those studying biology, the word symbiosis is now widely used. Symbiosis is the intimate ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kim Hemsley, Head, Childhood Dementia Research Group, Flinders Health and Medical Research Institute, College of Medicine and Public Health, Flinders University Olena Ivanova/Shutterstock “Childhood” and “dementia” are two words we wish we didn’t have to use together. But sadly, around 1,400 ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Whiteford, Professor, Crawford School of Public Policy, Australian National University The government’s Economic Inclusion Advisory Committee has just published its second report. It was set up by Treasurer Jim Chalmers and Minister for Social Services Amanda Rishworth in 2022 to provide: ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Adrian Beaumont, Election Analyst (Psephologist) at The Conversation; and Honorary Associate, School of Mathematics and Statistics, The University of Melbourne The Queensland state election will be held in October. A YouGov poll for The Courier Mail, conducted April 9–17 from a sample ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Amin Naeni, PhD candidate at Alfred Deakin Institute for Citizenship and Globalisation, Deakin University There’s been much talk in recent months about what a possible second Donald Trump presidency in the United States could mean for Europe, Russia’s war in Ukraine, the ...
A brief round-up of submissions on the controversial proposed law. This is an excerpt from our weekly environmental newsletter Future Proof. Sign up here. Last week, submissions on the controversial Fast-track Approvals Bill closed just hours after the government released a list of stakeholder organisations who were sent letters advising how they could ...
A poem from Robin Peace’s new collection Detritus of Empire: feather / grass / rock. Cereal giving I see a woman’s hands, see her curious hands break a stalk as she walks through the tall prairie, the savannah, the steppe, wherever it was. See her idly bite the grass that ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Hemingway’s Goblet by Dermot Ross (Mary Egan Publishing, $38)A handsomely produced (debossed cover, lovely ...
The Commissioner's decision validates the longstanding efforts of the local community and ensures that Awataha Marae will be managed to serve the needs of the local community, particularly for hosting tangihanga. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Tristan Salles, Associate professor, University of Sydney Examples of Australian landscapes.Unsplash Seventy thousand years ago, the sea level was much lower than today. Australia, along with New Guinea and Tasmania, formed a connected landmass known as Sahul. Around this time – ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Felicity Castagna, Lecturer, Creative Writing, Western Sydney University Day Day Market, ParramattaPhoto: Garry Trinh I live on the edge of Parramatta, Australia’s fastest-growing city, on the kind of old-fashioned suburban street that has 1950s fibros constructed in the post-war housing boom, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michael Ryan, Teaching Fellow in Economics, University of Waikato GettyImagesfatido/Getty Images There is an ongoing global debate over whether the high inflation seen in the aftermath of the COVID-19 pandemic can be lowered without a recession. New Zealand is not ...
The ‘Wicked Game’ heartthrob is in his late 60s now. That didn’t stop him putting on a lively, goofy and very sparkly show. Apart from ‘Wicked Game’, which graces a sultry playlist of mine simply called 💋, my last sustained Chris Isaak listening session took place when I was about ...
Analysis - Two ministers were stripped of portfolios in a warning to Cabinet, drama broke out at the Waitangi Tribunal, and the gang patch ban bill ran into opposition. ...
Tara Ward makes an impassioned plea for some vital pop culture merch. In April 1999, I became obsessed with a new reality television show called Popstars. Every Tuesday night, five strangers transformed into music royalty before my very eyes as Joe, Keri, Carly, Erika and Megan were chosen to form ...
PNG Post-Courier In the early hours of ANZAC Day, aerial photographs captured an impressive gathering of Australians and Papua New Guineans at Isurava in the Northern (Oro) Province. The solemn dawn service yesterday was held at a site steeped in history, where some of the fiercest battles of World War ...
The PSA is shocked that Oranga Tamariki has used the cost cutting drive to downgrade its commitment to Te Ao Māori and remove many specialist Māori roles. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ian Kemish, Adjunct Professor, School of Historical and Philosophical Inquiry, The University of Queensland There can be no more powerful symbol of the relationship between Australia and Papua New Guinea than the prime ministers of these neighbouring countries walking together on the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sharon Robinson, Distinguished Professor and Deputy Director of ARC Securing Antarctica’s Environmental Future (SAEF), University of Wollongong, University of Wollongong Andrew Netherwood Over the last 25 years, the ozone hole which forming over Antarctica each spring has started to shrink. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Viktoria Kahui, Senior Lecturer in Environmental Economics, University of Otago Getty Images/Amy Toensing Biodiversity is declining at rates unprecedented in human history. This suggests the ways we currently use to manage our natural environment are failing. One emerging concept focuses on ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Timothy Colin Bednall, Associate Professor in Management, Swinburne University of Technology marvent/Shutterstock Finding the best person to fill a position can be tough, from drafting a job ad to producing a shortlist of top interview candidates. Employers typically consider information from ...
Wondering where to host your next BYO? Whether its a small gathering or a massive party, we’ve got some recommendations. I was first introduced to the concept of BYOs at Dunedin’s India Gardens, a legendary but sadly defunct establishment, which purveyed enormous quantities of mango chicken to Aotearoa’s drunkest future ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Julien Cooper, Honorary Lecturer, Department of History and Archaeology, Macquarie University Julien Cooper The hyper-arid desert of Eastern Sudan, the Atbai Desert, seems like an unlikely place to find evidence of ancient cattle herders. But in this dry environment, my new ...
The sector says it’s hopeful her replacement Paul Goldsmith will be able to throw it a lifeline, after six months with a minister deemed missing in action, writes Catherine McGregor in this excerpt from The Bulletin, The Spinoff’s morning news round-up. To receive The Bulletin in full each weekday, sign ...
The government can't just rely on axing public sector jobs and has to do more to cut spending, says the chief economist at a free market think tank. ...
Rock The Vote NZ, known for its advocacy for minor party unity and its role within the Freedoms NZ Coalition during the 2023 General Election, celebrates this merger as a strategic enhancement of its operational strength and outreach. ...
Nearly everyone has experienced the frustration of something you use breaking and being difficult or expensive to fix. Proposed legislation could change that. It’s been raining on and off all Sunday afternoon but people are lining up outside a building in a corner of Gribblehirst Park in Sandringham, Auckland. In ...
What does a forever relationship look like when you don’t believe in marriage? And how do you celebrate it? This essay is part of our Sunday Essay series, made possible thanks to the support of Creative New Zealand.I’m going to do it, right now. I’m going to say ...
The Prime Minister has committed to resuming direct flights to Thailand. But it’s not a promise he will be able to deliver on anytime soon. The post Prime Minister jumps the gun in Thailand appeared first on Newsroom. ...
It’s not that long ago Eliza McCartney was seriously wondering if the Paris Olympics would be her pole vaulting swansong. After years of being hounded by injury after injury, the Rio Olympics bronze medallist was still confident she would compete at her second Olympics in Paris in July, unless something ...
FICTION 1 Take Two by Danielle Hawkins (Allen & Unwin, $36.99) There’s commercial fiction, like this book, and then there’s quality fiction, quality writers, quality literature; the forthcoming Auckland Writers Festival is full of quality, and ReadingRoom has two tickets to give away to the following events: Paul Lynch (Dublin ...
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You can’t have missed the Gallipoli story as the movies, documentaries, essays and books capture what it was like for New Zealand troops in their eight-month campaign on the Peninsula. But this Anzac Day the Auckland War Memorial Museum has published a book that sheds light on a little-known aspect of the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra In the free-for-all between the Australian government and Big Tech boss Elon Musk this week, the government had to be on a winner. Most people would have little sympathy with Musk’s vociferous opposition to ...
Asia Pacific Report Chief Mandla Mandela, a member of the National Assembly of South Africa and Nelson Mandela’s grandson, has joined the Freedom Flotilla in istanbul as the ships prepare to sail for Gaza, reports Kia Ora Gaza. Mandela is also the ambassador for the Global Campaign to Return to ...
Pacific Media Watch Journalists who report on environmental issues are encountering growing difficulties in many parts of the world, reports Reporters Without Borders. According to the tally kept by RSF, 200 journalists have been subjected to threats and physical violence, including murder, in the past 10 years because they were ...
Analysis by Dr Bryce Edwards, Democracy Project (https://democracyproject.nz)Political scientist, Dr Bryce Edwards. Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has surprised everyone with his ruthlessness in sacking two of his ministers from their crucial portfolios. Removing ministers for poor performance after only five months in the job just doesn’t normally happen in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By John Hawkins, Senior Lecturer, Canberra School of Politics, Economics and Society, University of Canberra BagzhanSadvakassov/Upsplash, CC BY-SA Australia’s inflation rate has fallen for the fifth successive quarter, and it’s now less than half of what it was back in late 2022. ...
ACT's Rural Communities and Veterans spokesman Mark Cameron responds to cancellations and protests of ANZAC Day commemorations in Wellington. He says, "These pitiful attempts to detract from ANZAC Day are not at all indicative of the feelings of mainstream ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Meighen McCrae, Associate Professor of Strategic & Defence Studies, Australian National University American and Australian stretcher bearers working together near the front line during the Battle of Hamel in 1918.Australian War Memorial While the AUKUS alliance is new, the Australian-American partnership ...
Pōneke based peace activists staged a silent protest at the ANZAC day service to highlight New Zealand’s complicity in war and genocide, and urge the government to take concrete steps to stop the genocide in Palestine. ...
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Amanda Thompson doesn’t really do Anzac Day. But what she does do is remember the people she knew who had a lifetime to remember stuff they didn’t really want to, because of a war they didn’t ask for. And she does make Anzac biscuits.First published in 2021.All my ...
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With our collective remembrance, and steadfast belief in our common humanity, we strengthen our hope and resolve to do what we can to foster dialogue and understanding, and to heal divisions in our pursuit of peace. ...
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Never mind the scoreboard – in the 2000 Bledisloe Cup decider, the real trans-Tasman battle was won before kickoff.First published in 2016. The dawn of the new millennium was a dark time for the All Blacks. Their final game pre-Y2K was a 22-18 loss to South Africa in the ...
I’m on the wrong side of 40, I never pursued creative work and now my job is killing my soul. Help! Want Hera’s help? Email your problem to helpme@thespinoff.co.nzDear Hera,May I start with the least original conversation opener you’re likely to hear around the motu at the moment, particularly in Wellington: ...
“Never again - No AUKUS” was the message of the wreath laid at this morning’s national ANZAC Day commemorative service at Pukeahu National War Memorial Park this morning by the Stop AUKUS group. ...
Until this month, Auckland swimmer Hazel Ouwehand had never met a qualifying time in an Olympic event for a New Zealand team, even as a junior. Now she’s very likely off to the Paris Olympics after swimming well under the qualifying standard in the 100m butterfly twice – both in ...
I am happily surprised that not enough UK Labour MPs crossed the floor against the Brexit amendment to withhold approval.
The Remain war may be lost, but there's still honour in the fight.
https://www.theguardian.com/international
The Remain War Ad? You mean the campaign that has been waged mostly by the cultural and financial elites of the capital against the ordinary people of the UK who had the temerity to imagine a different future for themselves?
A different future brought to them by the likes of Nigel Farage and Boorish Johnson?
Brought to them by whomever they want I guess, it’s their choice after all.
Given the vast amount of bullshit and outright lies leading up to the referendum, and that the referendum was between a vague idea that anyone could project their fantasies onto versus a concrete reality, was it really their choice? Or is the better path forward a second referendum after the definite deal is nailed down, so it becomes a genuine fair choice between two definite realities?
"Given the vast amount of bullshit and outright lies leading up to the referendum, "
The Remain scare lies were proven to be false within days of the result. And continue to do so. The economy didnt crash.
The UK will save billions from the total amounts going to the EU , not just the EU budget amount but there are other billions such as the customs duties and levies(£ 2.6 bill) plus nett EU VAT (£3.0 bill) adjustment amounts
There were no lies and bullshit coming the leave side? They presented a true, honest and complete picture of what leaving would actually entail? Really?
Politics, in case you hadn’t noticed is generally a ‘vast amount of bullshit and outright lies’ and the referendum was politics so go figure.
As for a second referendum, however nicely you dress the idea up, it is nothing more than remainer desperation to overturn the democratic will of UK voters. Anyone who is a democrat and believes in the rule of law should resist the idea completely.
In all the democracies I'm eligible to participate in, decisions and results are subject to re-evaluation after a period somewhere between 2 and 6 years. Nothing is locked in forever. After circumstances have significantly changed, there is nothing whatsoever undemocratic about putting the revised question to the vote.
In western democracies decisions and results aren’t subject to re-evaluation after a period of time. Rather it’s the personnel appointed to make those decisions that are required to re-affirm their continued fitness by the voting populace to make those decisions. They are not the same thing.
You want to explain what's undemocratic about holding a new vote after circumstances have significantly changed relative to a previous vote?
No I don’t particularly. Mostly cos there ain’t gonna be a new vote and circumstances haven’t actually changed significantly enough to justify one. Unless, of course, you’re an embittered remainer casting about for any chance to rewrite history.
Y'know, I really don't have an interest in whether Brexit or remain happens. I've got no roots in the UK or the EU, and it's unlikely I'll ever visit either again in my life.
But I am interested in a people's right to self-determination. From that perspective, it really looks to me like the original referendum was an exercise in how not to make a substantial decision.
Putting up a vague nebulous concept that everyone and their dog can project their fantasies onto up against a current reality simply showed the status quo didn't have majority support. That's a very different question to whether there's majority support for a hard Brexit over status quo, or majority support for the current Brexit deal.
Looks to me like those opposed to a second referendum are embittered leavers who think any cost is worth it. Since they now have the result they want, they want to deny any possibility of reconsidering to those that may have changed their minds in the interim based on new knowledge.
You have just described how messy democracy really is …. and it all mirrors the travails of the Kaipara District Council and its Mangawhai sewerage scheme… or Napiers new Swimming pool or any other local council in the country.
Greece had a referendum on the harsh EU bailout scheme, it lost 61% to 38%, but the government had it anyway.
Norway had TWO referendums about joining the EU, both lost but Norway is effectively an EU member anyway, as its covered by Diktats from Brusells
@Duke – yeah, democracy is full of anti-democratic outcomes. But that's not a reason to stop advocating for outcomes that are more democratic.
Greater London voted 60% to remain.
Yeah and it still wasn’t enough to overcome the turnout for Leave in the rest of England and Wales. It needed to be about 80%.
But like the 62% who voted remain in Scotland, they're not all "cultural and financial elites"
Their future is clear:
– Northern Ireland effectively integrates into Ireland
– Scotland leaves
– UK becomes England meaning London with the rest sucked dry.
Just like New Zealand would be without CER.
CER is not analogous with EU membership. In stark contrast with the UK NZ still retains control over affairs that the UK has had to cede control of to Brussels. A better comparison would be to liken UK membership of the EU to what our situation would be if we had taken up Australia’s (still standing) offer to join their Federation. And I’m sure you’ll agree there’s a healthy majority of opinion against Federation in this country.
Indyref 2 is by no means a certainty either. There doesn’t appear to be a groundswell of support for it, and, like the first one I suspect the whole enterprise is likely to founder on the inhospitable shore of monetary policy. Scots are not showing any sign of warming to the idea of giving up Sterling in favour of the Euro.
The Northern Ireland situation is an historical anomaly, but if its bad for UK to leave the EU its even worse for Scotland to leave UK.
The SNP once campaigned to leave the EU,
The UK still has plenty of national sovereignty within the EU. I know you know that. CER is the only thing that kept us afloat in the 1980s, and has functionally integrated us as countries. It's a close enough analogy for NZ.
The UK are about to find out that life on the outside is very cold. There's no changing their course now – they are going even with the new extension.
When UK leaves the customs union and single market, then the EU will start carrying out checks on British goods. Expect delays at Dover and Rottterdam and most other ports, traffic bottlenecks, supply route disruption – even with this amount of lead time.
In time the 28% of their food they get from the EU will settle down, as will the supply of medicines. In time.
There will be a sharp fall on the Pound no matter what. After that comes plenty of foreign takeover activity because it's all cheap.
A fair number of UK farms will be wiped out when the EU subsidies stop. So expect accelerated takeovers there.
Animal product exports into the EU restricted or prohibited.
No more EU research and development funding.
Then of course the travel inconveniences: EU pet passport no longer valid, new driving permit, no access to EU healthcare, mobile devices get charged on global roaming rates.
Thankfully the withdrawal agreement gives British cities living in the EU the same rights they have now.
But for the UK, massive loss of immigration. Probable decrease of business travel and tourism.
A big jump down in the economy overall.
A transition period to 31 December next year.
A degraded democracy. 2020 is the year the UK Labour Party has to figure out a way to survive. The Conservatives will just keep pushing the patriotic button and smash them.
Scotland leaves within three years.
A diminished and damaged UK.
It'll take a while to balance out whether the UK fee to the EU was worth it.
But the UK won't recover for years if at all.
With Brexit everyone loses, but the UK loses the most.
https://www.piie.com/publications/working-papers/brexit-everyone-loses-britain-loses-most
Re running the old discredited Remain scare tactics agains ?
"George Osborne released a Treasury report on the long-term economic impact of leaving the EU. The headline message from this report was that leaving the EU would cost each household an average of £4,300 each year. Using economic modelling, ….."
Treasury here cant model next years economy and the UK numbers mostly came from modelling a drop in migration to the UK.. just as we could boost the economy , and did, by boosting migration well above usual levels . Since when is that free money that doesnt cost as well for growing infrastructure and social dislocation.
Brexit-With-Deal will have a less negative economic impact than a No Deal scenario. Both will be negative.
You are welcome to find a UK or EU or even OECD economist who says Brexit will have a positive economic impact on the UK.
Go right ahead.
"welcome to find a UK or EU or even OECD economist who says Brexit will have a positive economic impact on the UK. "
I just showed that 'economic modelling' is mostly voodoo science.
As the UK kept their pound , perhaps you would like to ask Greece how staying in the EU with the euro has worked for them.
leaving the EU fisheries alone – although it will take up to 5 years- will be a boost for Britain especially the northern ports
The Irish were stiffed by the EU as well over the bank bailouts , they were mislead in thinking the EU would cover the government saving of the banks . They didnt , Ireland had to 'pay it all back' meanwhile Iceland just said Goodbye to its banks and let them sink.
You did nothing of the kind. You didn't even bother to cite a European or UK forecast example. Just typical laziness on your part.
Euro membership is different to EU membership. But I'm sure you could see that already.
Iceland is an irrelevancy abut the size of Christchurch.
Fishing is yet another smelly pro-Brexit lie. Fishing is .12% of the UK economy. Prepare for "origin" documents for each boat and each catch. Who knows if they will be able to sell their shellfish into the EU at all?
Ireland had the freedom – while within the EU – to form its own corporate tax settings and has completely re-set its economy. It's booming.
"You are welcome to find a UK or EU or even OECD economist who says Brexit will have a positive economic impact on the UK."
I don't anyone is saying that Brexit will have a "positive economic impact" on the UK, at least in the short term term; however, I think the negatives are being overstated deliberately for political purposes, and the benefits of remaining overstated.
Yanis Varoufakis, who at the time of the referendum campaigned on behalf of the Remain option, was arguing that the UK should remain in the EU and reform it from within. Fat chance of that though, so it's probably better she gets out.
Those who promoted the benefits of leaving have been shown to be liars, and they are the ones in power continuing to both tell and implement those lies.
Remember in 2012 when the London Olympics were opened? The UK proposed itself to the world as a place of inclusiveness, global cooperation, expansiveness, confidence, renewed tradition, and a great sense of fun?
Gone.
Since the referendum, immigration into the UK has crashed, the Pound has nosedived, and the government is proposing a minimum immigrant entry salary into the UK of 36,000 Pounds which is great if you're a banker but little else.
Thankfully for the UK the economy is overall so strong that this is as good a time as any to Brexit.
I was not in London in 2012 so I'm not likely to remember it. However, I think that what has been lost since then was probably lost long before the referendum. The GFC in 2008 was probably a more important influence.
Better they get out now before EU policies weaken Britain further.
Most of the spin in the forecasts is done with a simple ruse. The leave forecasts bias towards scenarios where the UK enters a mild recession on leaving and the government doesn't react. This causes a deep recession. The model has the same outcome of course when looking at similar scenarios with the UK in the EU.
We know this as later bank of england forecasts didn't match up and they admitted treasury put pressure on them to fiddle the earlier ones (which they had).
And yet it’s the areas where sovereignty has had to be ceded to Brussels that have rankled the most over the years and been the main drivers of the referendum result.
CER is not the same as EU membership, it’s a trade and freedom of movement deal between NZ and Australia. And good on us for getting it when we did. Given the state of politics in Australia nowadays we would never be able to achieve anything like it today. Since we got it however, we’ve got plenty of trade deals with other countries too. Ironically Britain would love a CER type deal with Europe and the freedom to strike other deals across the globe but they can’t while they stay in Europe.
As for the idea that Britain is going to feel the cold shoulder of economic ruin outside of the bloc. This may well come to pass but guess what, history is littered with examples of nation-states making decisions that run counter to their economic prospects, usually because there are other, higher interests at stake. Times made indeed be tough in Blighty, probably for quite some time. It seems though that enough people there have decided the risk is worthwhile.
It's not going to be a complete and utter disaster. It will have negative effects.
The 52% who voted for it could not calculate the risks of the proposal, and they will realize that history is being written against them.
Greenland withdrew from EU
Singapore withdrew from Federation of Malaysia
Czechs and Slovaks split up
The EU benefits mainly countries with large agricultural sector or they are new entries which get EU giveways. Plus large manufacturing companies can send their assembly and production plants to low wage areas- even so a car plant in Slovakia will have contract only workers shipped in from Romania.
Is Britains Cornwall and Devon really an underprivileged area that needs EU regional assistance.
Greenland is the population of Nelson, so no one gave a damn. It's a client state of Denmark and the US military, beset by suicide and depression and ecological ruin.
Singapore isn't in the EU, nor Malaysia. You can run an argument about size optimization for states and the role of Lee Kuan Yew over thirty years, versus Malay integration, if you like.
Cornwall and Devon are dominated by massive private estates, some of them royal. They don't benefit from EU projects. Some may get subsidies as you say, but you can find out what the benefits are for each location here: https://www.myeu.uk
We'll only really figure out the benefits of the EU once the UK leaves. The EU has done a spectacularly poor job of either reforming internally or selling its positives.
I watched quite a bit of the Commons last night and the more I see Boris Johnston, the more he comes across to me as a patronising, boorish, lying bastard who should be kept well away from the levers of power.
Jeremy Corbyn on the other hand speaks clearly, cogently and you get the impression he is the one telling the truth.
I cannot understand why the British media in particular try to portray Corbyn as the boorish, lying one and Johnston as the people's saviour when anyone with half a brain can see for themselves it's the other way round.
A referenced list of Johnston's sexism, racism, homophobia, lies, gaffes, scandals and assorted fuckwittery.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1XzAujyzN9JxpUl9rN7EIIX0AlgaXL8rE/view
Golly – that is a real Blip's list. (Or can I say golly now?)
He is one of the great AotW. A rambunctious spieler who speaks loud and confidently and attracts the enthusiasm of the mindless but aspirational (a febrile and easily ignited mass). I have seen a group excited by the declamations of someone voluble appoint that person as leader on the spot, to their discomfort.
As for ScottGN raising the narrow majority of people fed blatant lies, and voting for change with the smallest majority to holy writ, one can only wonder at the simple-minded mantra of theory being spouted in the face of practical and informed reason. This also from Bryan Gould.
The people in UK were unaware that their vote of dissatisfaction was likely to be used to break up the basics of their society, so they did not understand the need to apply themselves to attending workshops on the political ramifications and learn all the consequences, known and possible. Can I just have my understanding confirmed by one of the wise here: –
1 Was the referendum a binding one?
2 Or was it considered by the populace more as an expression of feeling, a snapshot of that point in time, more like an important poll?
Was the referendum a binding one or not? So many people making statements of what should be done and does anyone know this important point? I want one of the wise people who come here with ideas about how right Brexit is and listen to the voice of the people blah blah. Is everyone, we and the UK voters, informed about the facts of this matter.?
No, it wasnt binding in the sense you mean, but legislation since passed committed the UK to leave. That would have to be repealed to stop Brexit.
You always cloud the issue dou. Thank you, if you are right about that information – not binding. I wanted to establish the point, not have your brownwash over it afterwards.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_United_Kingdom_European_Union_membership_referendum
I don’t guarantee there is no ‘brownwashing’ with Wikipedia 😉
Just as NZs first MMP referendum wasnt legally binding either.
The 2nd vote wasnt part of the 'process' or mentioned during the first vote
The 2nd vote was indroduced by Bolgers government to kill off MPP, along with the massive Shirtcliffe led campaign against MMP who predicted – yes just like the Brexit one- that old chesnut economic ruin
Always good to provide a link, even if it is to Wikipedia, to give comments a certain level of validity, if you know what I mean; it sometimes helps to make it less personal. Nowadays, we don’t just take people’s word for it because we can’t, sadly.
DoU Brexit was what we were talking about. You diverted the thread to NZ. Can't you keep to the point when you find something elsewhere to scotch your argument. I wasn't talking round the subject of referendums – it was this UK one, and how the law was drawn up. Badly I think. But you go off-piste and hey presto you made a point which has little relevance.
Thanks Incognito – I did want to hear something pretty factual, not just Dous version or opinion.
So it was cloudy then, as to whether it would go ahead. If a local Council came up with that sort of policy machinery that had great loopholes in it, voters, ratepayers, taxpayers, small business etc would have been up in arms about it. When it is an august body that sits on green leather? seats, they shouldn't get a free pass out of jail.
Them and their policy writers and those whose job it is to keep legislation fit for purpose should get a boot in the backside (no important vote like that should pass on a simple majority – 75-80% rather.) Give them the Bad Sir Brian Botany treatment. A delightful rhyming piece:
Sir Brian went a journey and he found a lot of duckweed.
They pulled him out and dried him and they blipped him on the head.
They took him by the breeches
And they hurled him into ditches
And they pushed him under waterfalls and this is what they said:…
http://www.pointlesspoems.20m.com/custom2.html
To save the ship (Britannia) from the rocks they steered it into a storm and now they’ve lost all bearings. The Officers say “trust us, we know what we’re doing as we were borne to steer this ship so stay calm and carry on”. The deckhands and crew below deck are in for a rough sailing while the Officers dine in their quarters. As it has always been and always will be.
I don't think the referendum was binding, but nor do I think it was just an "expression of feeling". I'm pretty sure the people who voted to leave believed that that the UK would leave if enough people voted the same way. Or that the UK would walk away from the EU if the opposite turned out to be the case.
Edit
mikesh You are rather loose with your political procedures, a bit easy peasy. For instance what do you consider enough people voting would look like. The whole question about national matters of great world importance, and to those of the country that have their lives affected, is should changes be on a simple majority it 50.5 or 51% to 49%. Those few points at the centre become crucial – so easy to bribe a sizable group to vote for you in ways that are just outside any controlling law. I think you are too trusting to have a vote.
I say 70-80% should be required for a majority win on matters of great importance as this is.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermajority#United_Kingdom
"I say 70-80% should be required for a majority win on matters of great importance as this is."
I thought we were talking about what people believed might be the outcome from their voting rather than the mechanics of the voting system itself.
I looked up Golly on the web which is never wrong.
Apparently it was first used in 1775 and is a euphemism for god….so yes you can use it.
Oh thanks BG. I get so nervous these days. There is a sort of etiquette book on-line called the Urban Dictionary which I consult sometimes but I tend to go into a faint sometimes after reading it.
I have a 100 year old book of etiquette and may be consulted between the hours of 10.00 and 11.00am on Sundays on any matters of great delicacy on which people of a sensitive and gentle disposition wish to receive the old-fashioned advice that is such an emollient in social matters.
Boris may well be the biggest arsehole who ever lived Anne but that’s irrelevant. Westminster has a job to do, having asked the people of the UK to make a choice, they should get on with implementation of the decision they were given.
Having asked 'some' of the people three and a half years ago would be more accurate.
why i point this out?
all of those that were a day short of 18 at the time then were not asked, they were told to fuck off, shut up, sit down and live with it.
all of those that were a day short of death got to vote even tho it would never affect them.
So no, The People of the UK were not asked, only some were.
Pleeeese….its that supposed to be a reasoned arguement ?
No matter what age you chose, 17, 18,19 etc there will be some who are a day short!
The whole point of democracy is made by the aphorism about the wisdom of crowds.
yes, it should be.
I would like to point out that anyone who was a day/a week or a month short of 18 did not vote. That is an aweful lot of people who did not get the right to decide their future, yet who is considered old enough to work, pay taxes and such.
I personally think that indeed the voting age for referendums that impact the life of everyone to that extend should have been at least 15 – which is also the age one is considered old enough to work fulltime and pay taxes.
In the same i would support a cut of age for people say over 75. Why? They will most likely not be affected by anything much.
Democracy you say? Ha, democracy depends on the sanity of the populace, and frankly people believing they can go back to the 1850's when everyone knew their place, especially the foreigners, the brown ones, the women ones, the children ones etc etc etc are not what i would consider 'sane'.
And we, as much as poeple else where we don't have a democracy, we have a selection of the most unsuited people – generally by way of birth, access to money and connections – and we get to choose every few years the least unpalatble option. Yei! Democracy!
Most young people don't vote anyway. They prefer to shop and look at their phones all day.
Democracy is kept alive by people over 40.
yeah, that is it.
all their own fault for not voting – even when they are not allowed to vote.
and no democracy is not kept alive by people over 40 , property rights are, low taxes are, some benefits for some are but democracy?
i’ll give you a point for funniest comment of the day.
"all their own fault for not voting – even when they are not allowed to vote."
The best nonsense comment of the week.
You have no real idea of what 16-18 yrs think and want, they arent social activists from well off families like you probably think.
Remember NZs Sue Bradford , a young activist- daughter of a professor of cell biology
The real problem is the 'teenage brain', social media campaigns financed by business and conservative political groups will have a field day with 'teenage brains'.
Money will win that game rather than ideas
For example Plenty of social tricks in music to get young woman to like it – digital high pitched voices etc.
We trusted them when we lowered the drinking age from 21 to 18.
It was a total disaster.
Property ownership is not a qualification of voting.
The week before the local government elections, hundreds of thousands of young people marched seeking political change. Next week, with voting papers sent out, worst voting turnout in a century.
So far there's no evidence they'd use it if they even got it.
To young people this makes sense, I reckon, but to you it clearly doesn’t. Ergo, you’re not a young person.
Ergo they have no need for the vote then.
Turnout was woefully low. Ergo, voters have no need for the vote then. At least young people get off their butts for and about stuff that matters to them, even if it might be fleetingly. Over time, they will become as apathetic as the rest of the electorate and stop acting for the greater good and opt for fretting about the QV of their house(s) instead.
Compulsory voting would solve your problems of 'turnout' The results wont change that much , as we can see from Australia
Not much democracy in mass low skill immigration – our self-styled "masters" imposed that massive clusterfuck on us without asking – they knew perfectly well what the response would be. Not much democracy in rubber stamping offshore land sales when a substantial majority oppose it absolutely, or signing up for a TPP deal with investor state provisions. Democracy is such an implicit virtue even North Korea pretends to it – but try to access your Labour electorate MP about slave fishing and they'll gaslight you from asshole to breakfast – they love slave fishing, and hate NZ workers with a passion. Expect them to do their job however, and you will be disappointed. For decades, the despicable pieces of crap.
Even the Minister of Finance says he can control only 5% of the governments budget.
Do you think any MP has any say over slave fishing – why do you concern yourself so much that the rebuffs matter.
Did you not have a happy childhood?
Everybody has issues that strike close to the bone.
It was my career. Government collaborated with illegal practice and basically fucked my life. We expect illegality from Gnats, they are corrupt subhuman scum who, at best, belong in prison. But Labour pretended, and still pretend to progressive values. Slavery is not consistent with that pretention.
The fisheries have failed to develop. They are not measurably more sustainable. They have failed in their treaty obligations, and their international labour standards responsibilities.
We ordinary mortals suffer life-ruining consequences if we fall short of our responsibilities. As democratic citizens we get the government we choose to accept. I do not accept Labour's toleration of slave fishing – they need to clean up their act. I'd like a few personal apologies too, from all the worthless lying stooges I've raised it with, who by collaborating, have chosen to be accomplices after the fact.
Sure . At least that makes sense. I shouldnt have been so dismissive. I found my Mps office very helpful on a small matter.
There are a few aphorisms doing the rounds such as the invisible hand and free market wisdom and its rational consumers. These are statements or constructs rather about us. I think it’s high time we wise up.
Perhaps parents should also cast a vote on behalf of their infant children, who will also be affected in the future lives by the decision. Such infants do not have time to visit the polling booths themselves in between breast feeding episodes and sleeping.
Doable, if both parents take turns at breastfeeding and looking after the sleeping defenceless infants. Assuming both parents are together in the same household otherwise a babysitter needs to be called in.
For what it’s worth I support lowering the voting age to 16 generally. And doing so would have almost certainly delivered a different result in the referendum.
The vote was conducted under the electoral rules in place at the time though and to suggest that it is somehow invalid because of that is nonsense.
One could suggest the result is invalid because of the number of campaign rules broken and outright lies told by the leavers.
Then I suppose one could ask the courts to rule on assertions of electoral malpractice? Be my guest…
Fake news, lies, misrepresentations etc have always been a part of political campaigns. I think it's safe to suggest that in recent years the bar has become very low. I don't think any rational person would argue that this is good for democracy. 'A lie is halfway around the world before Truth has it's boots on.
Where is this trend going to take us? I'm not sure there is a solution to this in law. It will have to come from the voters, but so long as there is political benefit to be gained by trickery and deception you won't see any progress.
The UK electoral laws regulatory found both sides of the Brexit debate referendum committed technical breaches of the law.
As they do to this day, MPs , parliamentary parties local electorates breach the disclosure laws
The Guardian only highlights the 'failures' from one side only , doesnt mean there werent many others
eg
Green Party (Bristol accounting unit)
Late delivery of 2017 annual accounts.
Offence. £200 (fixed monetary penalty). Paid 3 October 2019.
We Are Europe (permitted participant in the EU Referendum)
Failure to submit a return containing a statement of all payments made in respect of referendum expenses.
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/who-we-are-and-what-we-do/our-enforcement-work/investigations
Fanciful dreams always give the result you want , thats the reason for using them.
Should we only have those over 50 vote on retirement and super questions 'because its their future'…thats just as silly as your talk about 16 yr voting
To an extend yes.
You still try very hard to not understand what i have said.
I am all for people who don't receive the super – aka our overloard in parliament – to not vote ever on restriction super or raising the retirment age.
Yeah, i would not mind a bit of exclusion for people who are not affected by the choice to make to make these choices for others.
But the vote of Brexit was 3.5 years ago, and the only ones screwed over royally in this case are those that are now in their twenties and they still have the same incompetend and un – affected lords fucking up their lives with no recourse.
How democratic is that?
The House of Lords is strongly pro Remain…. what do you think that tells you about the age and social class who have benefited most from the EU and continue to so.
That's a fair point. Maybe some of them realise you can shear more wool from a healthy flock than a sickly one.
A UBI would not be of much benefit to me since I am already receiving National Super. However I would still vote for it on the grounds that it would be good for the country.
nowhere di i say it is 'invalid'
i just took umbrage at the option that ' the people' of the UK got a say.
Only those of voting age got a say, everyone else got shafted. Just in case you have a hard time understanding what i said.
Look up the word referendum and find out what it says instead of your Trump like absurd claims.
Ask the Swiss about a center piece of their political system…yes referendums.
17 million voted leave and 16 million voted remain. Hardly conclusive.
Cameron should have insisted on a super-majority for such a momentous change-55% or 60%.
MMP here only won by 54 to 46. Cameron's mistake was not making it a two-step process like changing to MMP here.
edit: and in 2011 it was ‘only’ 58% in favour of retaining MMP.
Accepted-that would have been a good option.
Apples with oranges. MMP was still an internal voting system.
Brexit breaks down carefully crafted measures and agreements with other nations using diplomacy and collaborative approaches, in some countries after nasty armed encounters. The Irish are a close example, have found the system okay and useful for general value. The free interflow to and from Europe which breaks down dislikes and disdain with familiarity from one country to another, modernises cultural backwaters, and stopped the UK from being insular in cultural attitudes, is being thrown out petulantly.
The hatred of EU bureaucracy isn't because it is worse than that of the UK itself. And the EU backs modern safeguards for human rights and respect that the USA is unable to match, being fuller of BS than the EU. People who have settled outside the UK are being forced to repatriate as their mutually agreed social benefits will come to an end.
It is a repeat of what Australia is doing to NZ, gradually. And seems connected with what the USA is doing as it flexes its flabby muscles, preparing to introduce automaton forces. If the USA continues in its reckless, hapless way and the UK binds into its systems, it is possible that the west will be involved in war again.
The two step process for MMP here was designed to kill the MMP project.
The second ballot was not in the original proposal at all, which had 2 questions
1) change – 85% Yes
2) choice of 4 types of ballot – MMP 70% for that option
The second MMP referendum had the usual scaremongers out , like Brexit they claimed economic ruin !
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_reform_in_New_Zealand
Once we had a second ballot in NZ for Mps who didnt get 50% of the vote first time round 1908 -1913
@Duke so the first MMP referendum (non-binding) had turnout of 55%, of whom 85% (1.2M) wanted change. Then the second referendum (binding) had turnout of 83%, of whom 54% wanted change.
I wasn't in the country then, so I've got no idea of the general mood of the country then (except for the timeless general disgust at politicians).
But it seems to me when presented with a non-binding question for yet-to-be-defined change (1st MMP and Brexit), there's a whole lot of meh going around, with the greatest motivation among those wanting to send a middle finger message to pollies. But for the 2nd MMP referendum, there may have been a sense of "shee-it, this is really happening" which turned a lot of the previous mehs into voters.
In terms of raw numbers, the first MMP referendum had 1031k votes for change (and the MMP option got 791k), 186k for status quo. The second referendum got 1033k votes for change, 885k for status quo. So fuck all difference in how many people wanted change, but a vast increase in the turnout for status quo.
It's not hard to imagine a similar thing happening if Brexit get a second referendum.
Discussion got derailed after this – MMP and Brexit and whether the voting was similar is not an equivalency.
Different political planks. Have fallen off the Brexit, national fortunes and world history one.
Can't agree ScottGN. The outcome of the referendum was narrow. Not much in it at all. Many who voted Leave were later to recant and say they didn't understand what Leave meant and if there were another referendum they would vote Remain. That's not made up. It was widely reported in the British Press.
And it is highly relevant having an arsehole as a leader. They can do so much damage in the course of their term in office. Look at Trump. A disaster in every sense of the word.
We had one of our own once who, admittedly, seems tame in comparison to Trump. I refer to Muldoon.
Leave meant leave. A simple idea at its heart. What you really mean was didnt understand 'all consequences' Even now can ordinary people understand the Irish backstop and the Irish sea border concepts.
Do the people who voted for 'Scottish independence' had any real idea of the consequences .
From what I understood about Scotlands independence vote was some thought the EU would pay for Scotland budget top up they get from Westminister now.
Look at NZs MMP many people even now dont know how it really works, especially if you lose electorate seats the gain is made in list seats. A common mistake made by media people who should know better
Whatever the brexit outcome, I reckon it's done the Scottish independence movement no end of good.
Brexit's a complete clusterfuck in conception, election, and implementation. I'm glad I'm on the other side of the planet.
"it's done the Scottish independence movement no end of good."
So leaving the EU is bad , but leaving the UK is good. Only twisted logic could suggest that.
Scotland will have to have the Euro, a hard border with England and no more Westminster subsidies. Good luck with thinking the EU will pay the core government operating expenses
I didn't say independence was good, I said the last few years have done the independence cause no end of good.
Because 62% of Scots voted against brexit, and they're seeing it inflicted upon them in the most stupid manner imaginable.
Now maybe the money transfers go more one way than the other. The hard border isn't as much of an issue for Scotland as it is for Northern Ireland. But Scotland could well be better off in the EU and outside Britain than the other way around.
Outside of a few outliers , no opinion poll in Scotland has shown a lead for Independence
Why would you 'suppose' that
I seem to recall that normally you are much better at reading comprehension. My comments were in relation to the brexit bullshit helping the independence cause, not that the independence cause was an outright majority.
And your link demonstrates exactly that: for most of 2019 independence seems to have been gaining support. Polls being polls, of course.
dou Excuses for rigid authoritarianism. The folk won't bother so don't set it out in plain terms so they can understand. In a pros and cons way – which could be done with the general aims easily.
If you believe it's not worth the bother because people won't read it or understand it, you are reflecting the worst aspects of the Westminster system that cater to class-oriented mendacity.
What you really mean was didnt understand 'all consequences'
Indeed it was. There are lots of people who will never understand electoral systems – or any other system – because they haven't the marbles and it would seem to include more than a few of our media.
I accidently bought a HoS today thinking it was the SST (yep wasn't wearing my glasses 🙁 ) and read HDPA's latest article. Talk about a diatribe of misquotes, misinterpretations, misunderstandings and mischievous inaccuracies.
David Slack would have been a far more enjoyable read. 🙁 🙁
No, I ain't going to link to it.
You would have copped an instant ban 😉
"Many who voted Leave were later to recant and say they didn't understand what Leave meant and if there were another referendum they would vote Remain. That's not made up. It was widely reported in the British Press."
I heard of one person who said that. Was there also another?
According to the British media not long after the result came through, there were lots of them. But you'll have to take my word for it because I'm not going to hunt for them. Got better things to do with my time.
You can have a go.
Nah. It would probably be like looking for a needle in a haystack (if you'll excuse the rather hackneyed simile).
Boris may well be the biggest arsehole who ever lived Anne but that’s irrelevant.
What does an actor need a conscience for anyhow? – Jiminy Cricket
Awesome game last night well done the ABs.
Like mercury over rusted steel.
England had some luck with the two intercepts.
Since when are intercepts lucky?
Always.
Fantastic performance last night.
I had a friend come and watch and be bought a mate.
We were talking about team culture and the article on Stuff about all the players unload the baggage from the bus. He reckons the ABs always clean up the changing room after a test.
It reiterates the message 'Go fast, go alone. Go far, go together'.
She's got it all sorted if you are feeling confused. Sounds a bit like today's Mother Beeton's book on etiquette of old.
11.30 Kitty Flanagan's 488 Rules For Life Radionz today
The very witty Kitty Flanagan has helpfully put together a comprehensive guide to modern behaviour, and help everyone around you be a bit less irritating, with her new book, 488 Rules For Life: The Thankless Art of Being Correct.
She covers the important things: work microwave etiquette involving last night's fish curry, walking and texting, wearing far too much perfume on public transport, or what to do with the last of the toilet paper.
Oh, and whether middle-aged men should have ponytails. (Spoiler alert… They shouldn't.) It began as a bit of a joke on Kitty's popular segment on ABC TV's The Weekly, and her publishers reckon the resulting book has the power to change society.
Russiagate conspiracy nutter, 2016 loser and unashamed war monger Hillary Clinton drags US politics down into the gutter yet again…
Hillary Clinton suggests Russians are 'grooming' Tulsi Gabbard for third-party run
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/18/politics/hillary-clinton-tulsi-gabbard/index.html
Gabbard had a pretty good reply though…
Great! Thank you
@HillaryClinton. You, the queen of warmongers, embodiment of corruption, and personification of the rot that has sickened the Democratic Party for so long, have finally come out from behind the curtain. From the day I announced my candidacy, there has been a …the rest here….
https://twitter.com/TulsiGabbard/status/1185289626409406464?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet
"Hillary Clinton suggests Russians are 'grooming' Tulsi Gabbard for third-party run"
Clinton never mentioned Tulsi Gabbards name !
Gabbard has outed herself as Moscows plant.
Kamala Harris’s press manager has been more specific about Gabbard s Moscow connections.
Gabbard is often featured on RT News.
“Gabbard is an interesting case, because she does have some foreign policy objectives that align with Russia, so it would make sense that a candidate who is known as an Assad apologist is seeing favorable tweets and headlines from some sort of Russian apparatus.”
https://www.dailydot.com/layer8/tulsi-gabbard-russia/
Maybe Stein can start calling herself a Democrat now to take the heat off Tulsi.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/466594-jill-stein-i-am-not-a-russian-spy
If I were a political satirist right now I'd be seriously considering alternative careers. How could anyone make up stuff that tops what really happening?
Satire is dead.
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1185643744932106240
Satire is dead.
Don't look at me. I didn't kill the bugger.
It's been rather ill for the past 45years or so. The recent goings on have finished it off.
Political satire became obsolete when they awarded Henry Kissinger the Nobel Peace Prize.
Tom Lehrer
He does a pretty bigly caricature of a satirist.
Wait until Spitting Image gets a hold of him.
https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/news-opinion/spitting-image-return-time-stop-17102857
The sooner, the better. He won’t get it though.
Too bad it's not the 1950's useful idiots like you, Andre and Joe 90 would have been right in your element disseminating paranoia, outing actors, artists, writers etc with the panty hose wearing pervert McCarthy..oh well I guess lates better than never with you dummies.
By the way that link to daily dot is a real low brow shit piece of propaganda, it's so over that top it really could have come staight out of the 50's, but you are in sooo deep you lot can't see the plainly obvious anymore..so here you go guys, this should be up your ally..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w86QhV7whjs
We love you too, Adrian! Pucker up now for a big sloppy one 💋
Gabbard is nothing.
She'll be lucky to even keep her seat.
Even if that were true, it's hardly the point.
Gabbard protests, but only Gabbard cares. An unremarkable politician. You won't hear her name again after this cycle.
Wrong as usual.
Ok she's winning then.
Of couse I forgot with you lot winning is everything, even if that means leaving all your ethics principles and morals on the floor to gain the win…
But to give you an answer, again your analysis is flawed as per usual, Gabbard is and has alwyas been about changing the direction of the Democratic party, primarily from one that supports and often enacts aggressive foreign interventions, to one that dosen't.
I am not actually a Gabbard supporter, but I do happen to support that particular extremely important foreign policy platform that she is pushing.
I would say that her own plan for these elections would be that she would like to see Sanders win, and picks up a (well deserved) position in his administration.
You would flip in an instant , if Sanders was the democratic candidate and Gabbard was the 3rd party spoiler
If you believe she is unremarkable, who is going to be the remarkable 2020 candidate to defeat Trump then?
Oh, great. This time Gabbard's the Chosen One. What happened to Bernie's cred?
Grow up man.
Sop the dems have several nominees who might do the job and beat dolt45, then?
Good to know. Tell Mauī
Sounds a bit like – we'll go along with whoever the party chooses and hope for the best.
I'm sure if you squint really hard and ignore logic and basic English, you might see it that way.
Last time I counted the nominees, "several" good 'uns would leave at least a "solid half dozen" banalities, and "a couple" of duds have already withdrawn.
Gabbard is a nothing… and all the neoliberal posterboys are here to tell us so.
This is a hoot!
Show evidence otherwise.
Yeah it is hard to imagine what sort of mental gymnastics must go in in the top four inches of a person who is trying to tell themselves that they are at all 'progressive' or left , while at the same time defending Clinton and the centrist liberal ideology…must be quite a workout.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNjzBJWUyWI
Dude, three years have passed. This is unhealthy. Let her go.
Not sure what you are talking about, Clinton is the one who attacked Gabbard yesterday, Clinton is the one who keeps trying unsuccessfully to remain relevant..in fact I don't give a fuck about her.
lols whatevs.
What do you mean "laugh out loud, whatever"? are you saying Clinton didn't attck Gabbard yesterday?
If the grooming hat doesn't fit Gabbard, then the imprecise reference wasn't a slur on Gabbard. If the hat does fit Gabbard, then it's a simple truth that the hat fits Gabbard.
But whatevs, you're totally not bovvered anyway, you don't look bovvered at all, lol
You are repeating falsehoods Adrian, Clinton never mentioned Gabbards name – she said a democratic candidate. She also talked about Jill Stein and Trumps possible Russia links.
Kamal Harris's people were talking about Gabbard and Moscow 2 weeks back
You dont GaF , but bought the whole matter up. geez
Are you serious, every one knows Clinon was talking about Gabbard..they where meant too..holy shit man, it's lucky we aren't talking on the phone I might have had to do this….
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj1jkrGCV_0
Kamala Harris's people were saying the same , and directly mentioning Gabbard , 2 weeks ago. has your outrage been only building since then?
Deflecting again…
Secret agents everywhere! Romney has just been unmasked as Democrat plant!
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/466553-trump-knocks-romney-as-democrat-secret-asset-in-new-video
Clinton didnt mention Gabbrad by name but she did say Moscow had компрома́т on Trump!
Trump is the best Democrat asset since Barry Goldwater.
Maybe a bit premature for that judgement … especially since arguably Goldwater laid the foundation for Nixon's '68 win.
Nixon was pretty close against Kennedy – didn't need anyone else hitting the ball up for him.
Trump was a revival programme for the Republicans first time around.
Mid-terms he was better for the Dems.
The Russiagate conspiracy is the best asset Trump has, didn't see the Democrates losing their shit over all the things that Trump has done to make peoples lives worse in the US and around the world, didn't see them vote against the biggest military budget ever or the huge tax cuts for the wealthest in the States…nope their main focus for three whole years has been Russia Russia Russia.
All this while poll after poll showed that the majority of US citizens don't care about Russia or Russiagate.
And yet here you lot are, stepping right in line with a narritive that no one wants to hear, supporting a debunked conspiracy that is seriously in danger of helping re-elect Trump…job well done boys…keep flogging that dead horse.
'didn't see them vote against the biggest military budget ever or the huge tax cuts for the wealthest in the States
Yes they did vote against tax cuts. You are telling lies again.
Tax Cuts , House votes 205 against 227 for . Senate 49 against 51 for
Trumps Defence budget is more trickier to consider as the Democrats only been control of the House this year
OK yes you are right,that was wrong on the tax cuts, what I was meant to say was that the Democates didn't use that as their or similar Trump policies to form the spearhead of their push back to Trump, they instead kept using Russia as their main (blunt) weapon of attack.
Will the but her emails/the server, the server crowd stfu and go back to despising her for being her?
A State Department investigation into former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s private email account found no widespread effort by her aides or other staffers to mishandle classified information.
The three-year-long investigation by State’s Bureau of Diplomatic Security concluded that 38 individuals committed a total of 91 security violations involving emails sent to or from Clinton’s private server.
https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/18/state-department-hillary-clinton-emails-051380?
Obama was the 'dream candidate' he ended up just like Clinton would have as President …and after.
'Barack Obama to make $1.2m from three Wall Street speeches"
Somehow it seems a little less offensively corrupt to be hauling in megacoin from Wall Street speeches after your term in office than if you do it immediately before running for office.
Trump is strategically brilliant – well so he reckons.
"Trump's Great and Unmatched Wisdom"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMrL2LGzJuQ
Little birds and big adults can both be vulnerable, needing food and housing. Do we have to set up Give a little accounts in a country that has squeezed $7 billion of returns from various places but much from paying beneficiaries less than required and puting barriers in their way for bettering their lives. And having flexible workers who sacrifice their health and wellbeing while they work here and there at odd hours and often on call so hard to plan. Having a birthday party for your 5 year old, phone call, we are short-handed. Letall have a sweet life in NZ again and start spending that $7 billion on human investment giving enjoyment, education and security in people's lives.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018718181/a-poverty-crisis-new-figures-show-demand-for-food-housing
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/401390/south-bay-banded-dotterel-chicks-nearly-wiped-out-by-cats
So many of us need help. Perhaps the government could pay the poor to look after the nation's animals. The government has been instrumental in causing businesses to fold and import companies grow fat on replacing our own manufactures. So look for other jobs that need doing so we can put those spare hours into paid kaitiaki work. 💡 💡
Wonder who it was that got through to the bilious fake-bronze baboon that it's actually illegal for a government employee to award government contracts to their own businesses, and what arguments they used? Let alone that it's a glaring breach of two separate constitutional clauses, and therefore clearly impeachable as a standalone offence.
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/10/19/politics/trump-property-no-longer-considered-for-g7-summit/index.html
https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2019/10/20/prison-conditions-in-decline-howard-league-survey/
…an overall decline in most aspects surveyed. This is not surprising given the culmulative effects of overcrowding and understaffing experienced thoughout New Zealand prisons.
For instance:
(a) poor ventilation in cells, and cells being too hot in summer and too cold in winter. In Auckland at the end of December last year we received reports of night time cell termperatures of 27 degrees.
(b) lack of access to toilets, specifically insufficient access to toilets while being transferred, and while in yards and in day-rooms. As one person put it, “going toilet in a small bottle on a moving vehicle is extremely hard. A number of us spilled it, missed altogether, and overfilled the bottles.”
A gang problem with bells and miniguns.
https://twitter.com/diazbriseno/status/1185032042041479168