Open mike 24/04/2015

87 comments on “Open mike 24/04/2015 ”

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1. coffee 1

   24 April 2015 at 6:47 am

   consider.
   i am a business owner. As a business owner under the current system I am not incentivized to make a profit. if I do make a profit I have to pay tax. (the reality is no-one likes to pay tax) Instead what i am incentivized to do is to consume. to buy more and more goods and services. Goods and services that come into existence through the extraction and use of resources.
   Consider that this is true for every business.
   Consider this in the context of climate change and the state of our planet.
   How are we supposed to fix our world when the very way in which the system is designed incentivizes consumption and the never-ending use of resources.
   Something needs to change.
   • phillip ure 1.1

     24 April 2015 at 7:19 am

     the obvious/easy quick-fix is to go vegan…

     (the notoriously conservative american food and drug administration came out the other day with the edict/confirmation that a vegan diet is the best for the planet…)

     ..so if your question is not just an exercise in hand-wringing – and you are really looking for ‘change’..

     ..you could get the basics sorted first – before looking outward/elsewhere..

     ..and start there..eh..?..
     • Coffee Connoisseur 1.1.1

       24 April 2015 at 9:40 am

       I have been Vegan. I am not at the moment but when I have the time to shift my thinking around food and to come up with healthy tasty meal plans then I would look at it again. Unfortunately at the moment life keeps getting in the way. At the moment it is the odd vegetarian meal and everything else free range.

       Aside from that, being vegan won’t help much when the very nature of the system in the way that it works and is structured actively works against helping the environment.
       • phillip ure 1.1.1.1

         24 April 2015 at 11:23 am

         @ c.c..

         ..some help with yr /meal-planning..

         http://whoar.co.nz/?s=recipies

         ..and i agree that is not all that needs to be done…

         ..but as for making a personal difference/helping the planet..eating-right has a lot going for it..

         ..and is something any/everyone can do…

         ..need i add it is also empowering..?

         ..to know that in at least one way – you are doing what you can..
         • Coffee Connoisseur 1.1.1.1.1

           24 April 2015 at 1:44 pm

           Thanks Phil that actually helps a lot. I have emailed it to my amazing wife.
     • Sans Cle 1.1.2

       24 April 2015 at 11:37 am

       Phillip – I saw this a while back, and thought of you.
       A pretty smart kid rejecting meat
       • phillip ure 1.1.2.1

         24 April 2015 at 12:07 pm

         yeah – that’s cool..
   • Huginn 1.2

     24 April 2015 at 7:27 am

     Consider this, then.

     Businesses are about doing stuff to make a profit. You only pay tax if you’ve made a profit.

     I don’t understand why you think that’s a problem.
     • Huginn 1.2.1

       24 April 2015 at 7:52 am

       Also, all the money that government collects in taxes gets spent.

       The difference is what it gets spent on, whether it goes on goods and services that people choose as individuals, or on goods & services that we choose collectively through a political process.
       • felix 1.2.1.1

         24 April 2015 at 8:43 am

         And before anyone points out that the govt doesn’t always spend money in the most effective or efficient way…

         …have you not noticed the shit that individuals spend money on???
     • Coffee Connoisseur 1.2.2

       24 April 2015 at 9:34 am

       I could make a profit in my business but instead I am incentivised to go out and buy more things, to consume, to use more ansd more resources. This is whether I need to or not.

       The point is that in terms of saving the planet the structure of the system actively works against this when you look at things in the context of Incentives and how the system by its very nature and structure incentivises certain behaviors.

       Another example is that Eco friendly products often cost more. You pay a premium for them. In other words there is a disincentive to make a choice to help the planet.

       If this was a goal of society (helping the planet rather than aiding its destruction) and for everyone in it. Then the system should be structured to incentivise the desired behaviour. At the moment it does the opposite.

       Another (unrelated to climate change) example of where the system incentivises behaviour opposite to what logic dictates we should have is with the family unit.
       Consider that a couple are incentivised to spend more time apart than together with the way the system is currently structured. i.e. the more you work theoretically the more you make the better your chance of getting ahead. Is that healthy for a relationship?
       Add a child or two into the equation and parents are incentivised to spend less time together as a family unit and to instead put their children into day care so that they can both work in order to get ahead. Is this healthy for a family? Is this what we want in society?

       When you start to look at how the system incentivises behaviour by its very structure a lot of problems become glaringly obvious and often fly in the face of logic and reason. They fly in the face of what most people would want.

       What is the purpose of the system?
       Who is it supposed to be for?
       • Draco T Bastard 1.2.2.1

         24 April 2015 at 12:34 pm

         I could make a profit in my business but instead I am incentivised to go out and buy more things, to consume, to use more ansd more resources. This is whether I need to or not.

         That’s because the system is designed around ever increasing GDP which means ever increasing resource use. What you seem to be asking for is Steady State Economy but that also precludes profit.

         Another example is that Eco friendly products often cost more. You pay a premium for them. In other words there is a disincentive to make a choice to help the planet.

         And all the survey’s that I’ve been involved with on such subjects are always about how much more people are willing to pay for ‘green’ products. In other words, the corporations are looking to maximise profits rather than doing what’s best for the environment.

         When you start to look at how the system incentivises behaviour by its very structure a lot of problems become glaringly obvious and often fly in the face of logic and reason. They fly in the face of what most people would want.

         yes, the system is broken.

         What is the purpose of the system?
         Who is it supposed to be for?

         ATM it’s purpose is to make a few people rich at everyone else’s expense and it’s solely for those rich people. This is why we have poverty and the system destroys the environment rather than protecting it.
   • Chooky 1.3

     24 April 2015 at 8:41 am

     re food production and overpopulation and climate change and the state of the planet….this is interesting

     ‘Crop yields can’t be increased anymore: world hunger imminent’ – eco-analyst’

     http://rt.com/shows/sophieco/248501-resources-earth-policy-warn/

     “With the population of 7 billion people living on planet Earth – and that number could increase tenfold in the coming decades – the dwindling resources of our world become a major concern, for the poor as well as the rich nations. Scientists warn of incoming famine of unprecedented proportions; water is the next gold and resource to be fighting for. Humanity demands more and more, but will mankind be able to survive at time when resources we grew used to come to an end? We discuss these perils with prominent environmental analyst, founder and president of Earth Policy Institute. Lester Brown is on Sophie&Co today.”
     • Coffee Connoisseur 1.3.1

       24 April 2015 at 9:52 am

       We could feed 10x the worlds population (pure speculation with the 10x admittedly) through the use of technology such as verticle farming.
       This won’t happen under Capitalism though as it just isn’t possible to justify the cost of building a Corporate high rise to grow and sell lettuces for $2.
       Yet the resources to do it exist. The knowledge of how to do it exists. What stops us is something that we invented originally to help resolve problems of scarcity, portability and as a mechanism for exchange. Two of those 3 no longer exist in todays society. Yet in many areas of society money or a lack of it is what stops us solving some of the biggest problems in society. These include big ticket items like poverty and war.
       • Kiwiri 1.3.1.1

         24 April 2015 at 11:02 am

         Like these?

         http://permaculturenews.org/2014/07/25/vertical-farming-singapores-solution-feed-local-urban-population/

         http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/2012/11/06/164428031/sky-high-vegetables-vertical-farming-sprouts-in-singapore
         • Coffee Connoisseur 1.3.1.1.1

           24 April 2015 at 1:50 pm

           yes just like those . Great to know that this is already happening. I wasn’t aware it was so that is great to see.
   • Lanthanide 1.4

     24 April 2015 at 8:58 am

     Weirdly, when the corporate tax rate goes down, the argument seems to be it will “encourage investment” in businesses. That seems backwards to me. If companies were paying 33% tax for retained earnings (profits), they’d get 67% of that money out of the company, meaning they have a 33% incentive to instead invest that money in the growth of the company – new employees, new plant and machinery etc. But when the tax rate drops to 28%, there is suddenly only a 28% incentive to invest in the business – ie more incentive to take profit out of the company.
     • Bearded Git 1.4.1

       24 April 2015 at 10:36 am

       Investment is usually capital which means it is depreciated over time and can’t be instantly written off at the corporate tax rate.
       • Lanthanide 1.4.1.1

         24 April 2015 at 1:16 pm

         Ahhh, good point.
   • Chch_chiquita 1.5

     24 April 2015 at 10:44 am

     I’m a business owner and I don’t get your argument.
     The incentive to consume is only if you look at it from a personal perspective, but if you do take more money out of the company for your own personal use, you will pay tax on it anyway.
     If you decide to take some of your profit and invest in the growth of the company, then you will not be paying tax on that money, you will grow the company and do good with your employees.
     If after everything you still have a profit then I don’t see a problem with paying tax. I enjoy what my tax payments are giving me (even if I don’t agree with all that they are spent on, but that’s a different argument) and have no problem paying tax. Maybe you should change the way you feel about paying tax.
     • Coffee Connoisseur 1.5.1

       24 April 2015 at 1:57 pm

       I personally have no issue paying tax but do think that because of the way the system is structured and how it passively incentivises people that we are missing opportunities for better system structure that gears incentives toward the outcomes that we want in society.
       example:
       If you went out into a business (do it with your one) and said would you given the choice ideally want to work

       more than you do now
       less than you do now
       or the same as you do now

       With no loss in standard of living what would you prefer?

       my pick is that the overwhwelming majority would choose to work less.
       Worldwide I imagine it will be the same. Yet in spite of this the system is geared to ensure that the opposite happens.
       Automation has the ability to change this and to do so without any loss in the standard of living provided we change the way the system is structured.
   • Murray Rawshark 1.6

     24 April 2015 at 1:43 pm

     Maybe we should tax you on capital invested instead, irrespective of whether you make a profit or not? Would that solve the problem?
     • Coffee Connoisseur 1.6.1

       24 April 2015 at 2:02 pm

       That capital has already been taxed. You want to tax it again?
       I am not here asking for the tax incentives to be changed. What I am saying (although to be fair I haven’t said it) is how about we determine the outcomes we want in society as individuals, as families, as society and ensure that the system is restructured to meet those goals.
       • Murray Rawshark 1.6.1.1

         24 April 2015 at 3:02 pm

         The capital may not have been taxed at all. What if it came from property speculation?
         The problem is not taxation. It’s the search for profits and growth, which is killing us.
         • Coffee Connoisseur 1.6.1.1.1

           24 April 2015 at 10:49 pm

           yes that is the point I was looking for! Essentially the taxation is a disincentive toward profit and an incentive toward growth through spending. ie. a business is continuously incentivised to grow leading to an environment where more and more resources are used. Growth for growths sake and nothing else.
2. millsy 2

   24 April 2015 at 7:18 am

   It is amusing to see Flavell complain about the state of rental properties, given that his party was the one that supported the sale of state houses, the changes to state house tenancies, and also insisted on staying in a coalition with with the party who has presided over all this.
   • vto 2.1

     24 April 2015 at 7:24 am

     Agreed.

     Often the cry is made around NZ that ‘oh noes, we are nothing but a third world country’ …… with few believing it to be true.

     But this is true. The housing conditions for many people in east Christchurch and central are third world. The facts show it.

     What a terrible thing for a NZ government to let happen. There is no way it needed to happen. It has been either totally incompetent or totally evil – there is no middle here.
   • Bearded Git 2.2

     24 April 2015 at 10:40 am

     @millsy Agree entirely, but since Fox came on board (and maybe since Hone didn’t get back?) has there been a bit of a change of allegiance from the MP? A bit of a shift Leftwards? I notice Fox is criticising Key over his young woman/child ponytail fetish today.

     Mr. Little will be taking note.
3. miravox 3

   24 April 2015 at 7:26 am

   What, if anything connects these two stories, I wonder?
   Story One

   Every day, I serve food to some of the most powerful people on earth, including many of the senators who are running for president: I’m a cook for the federal contractor that runs the US Senate cafeteria. But today, they’ll have to get their meals from someone else’s hands, because I’m on strike.

   I am walking off my job because I want the presidential hopefuls to know that I live in poverty. Many senators canvas the country giving speeches about creating “opportunity” for workers and helping our kids achieve the “American dream” – most don’t seem to notice or care that workers in their own building are struggling to survive.

   I’m a single father and I only make $12 an hour; I had to take a second job at a grocery store to make ends meet. But even though I work seven days a week – putting in 70 hours between my two jobs – I can’t manage to pay the rent, buy school supplies for my kids or even put food on the table. I hate to admit it, but I have to use food stamps so that my kids don’t go to bed hungry.

   Story Two

   ”You’re making the point with me about job losses. I’m making the point to you about job opportunities,” he said.

   Asked if the report considered the carbon miles involved in trucking meals and meal components to the South, he said it did not.

   The plan includes trucking frozen meals on wheels from Auckland to Dunedin and Invercargill. Meals for patients would be assembled on site with pre-prepared components.

   Mr Snedden, a former DHB chairman, said the southern board had serious financial issues and had to find savings.

   Savings are projected to be $6.96 million or more over the 15 years of the contract, which could be about 0.05% of board income over that period, assuming flat funding.

   I reckon it might be this lot… and it’s pretty obvious where the ‘savings’ will come from.
   • Pasupial 3.1

     24 April 2015 at 11:32 am

     miravox

     You’re not the only one who can see where Compass’ profits will be coming from:

     The Service and Food Workers’ Union has warned the cash-strapped Southern District Health Board could find itself embroiled in costly legal action if it goes ahead with food service outsourcing.

     National secretary John Ryall said the union would lodge the a similar case against Southern to the one it is fighting with the Auckland DHB over outsourcing…

     Outsourcing is an issue for the Southern and Auckland boards, which directly employed their food workers.

     Most boards opting into the national Compass contract had previously outsourced, making the process easier.

     Mr Ryall urged scepticism about promised benefits of the food service ”experiment”, which he had seen before with a different company in the 1990s.

     ”What looks pretty nutritious at one time turns out to be a mouthful of crap at another time.

     http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/340039/union-warns-sdhb-legal-action
     • miravox 3.1.1

       24 April 2015 at 7:02 pm

       Crazy isn’t it? – and then when you look at the wealth gap tower (h/t Notices and Features) it’s obvious that, because of these types of contracts with companies such as Compass, a heap more workers join other 50% of the residents in half the ground floor.
4. vto 4

   24 April 2015 at 7:26 am

   I expect there will be Key protests at his creepy weirdo bully behaviour ……….

   and I look forward to seeing all the protestors with ponytails attached…. hee hee Key would sink further into the quicksand. What a sight it would make
   • veutoviper 4.1

     24 April 2015 at 10:00 am

     And Kiwiri has already done the work to source cheap ponytails!

     http://thestandard.org.nz/dear-john-updated/#comment-1004444
5. vto 5

   24 April 2015 at 7:46 am

   Has anyone noticed how all the excuses being put up for Key are falling flat?

   The overriding wildly inappropriateness of Key’s behaviour is impossible to escape.

   It is seared into EVERYONE’S mind and eyes. There is no other conclusion.

   Mind you that hasn’t stopped his disciples following and even throwing themselves in front of their dear leader…..

   This mornings anonymous Press editorial opinion (the only one read for many a long moon as I don’t rate them) spent the entire piece saying how stupid Key was, how inappropriate the behaviour was, how it was poor this and poor that……. yet at the end the anonymous opinion writer says something like “Key has learned his lesson and that should be enough”…

   … ffs, talk about head in sand. Spend the entire piece saying how wrong it is and then dismiss with no reason provided and in one sentence at the end. No justification or reasoning for this.

   Daily newpaper anonymous editorial opinions are pieces of shit due to the elevated position they are given relative to the very averageness of the anonymous writer in behind

   Proved again
   • halfcrown 5.1

     24 April 2015 at 8:09 am

     Ah, but, It was all “political” according to some legal dick Henry had on his programme this morning. A trivial incident. It’s not sexual, it’s not this , it’s not that, blah blah blah. As usual “move along nothing to see. ” Not once was there any concern shown about the waitress, The whole fucking interview stank of how Key can get away with it.
     Incidentally watching Prat Henry is not a habit I have, and I did have a shower soon after. I was up early as I have no books to read at the moment.
   • Philip Ferguson 5.2

     24 April 2015 at 8:42 am

     It’s interesting though that it’s all about damage limitation. No-one can pretend it’s acceptable, especially since it’s not the first or only time he couldn’t keep his hands off the hair of women and girls.

     I think he’s an oddball and his years in the money markets certainly wouldn’t have helped socialise him into what is acceptable and what is not acceptable social behaviour.

     What I find oddest of all is that someone who made millions moving money around has been able to present himself as “the bloke next door”. The bloke other blokes would have a beer with and invite over to help lay the driveway or do DIY on the house or build a shed.

     Every now and then we get a glimpse of how NOT like the bloke next door he is. Like the dude can’t hammer a nail – even I can do that, and I’m fairly hopeless with DIY.

     And we get some weird behaviour, like the swishing he put on that time he was on the catwalk. That was just unbelievable.

     He is the nerdy kid who somehow got to be prime minister and is slowly getting found out.

     Ultimately, however, I’m more interested in his politics. And, despite the efforts of some on the left to demonise him, the reality is he’s a fairly bland, middle-of-the-road politician. And people like that are as likely to be found atop the Labour Party as atop the National Party.

     Phil
     • Bearded Git 5.2.1

       24 April 2015 at 10:43 am

       Key thinks he is a rock-star politician and all women around him are groupies.
       • Murray Rawshark 5.2.1.1

         24 April 2015 at 1:57 pm

         All the Tory women around him probably are his groupies.
         • rawshark-yeshe 5.2.1.1.1

           24 April 2015 at 2:04 pm

           @Murray .. pse read #17 if you haven’t already .. thx
6. Philip Ferguson 6

   24 April 2015 at 8:34 am

   A number of us at Redline blog were involved at various times in the Marxist magazine revolution, which was produced between 1997 and 2006. A total of 26 issues were produced during that time. We’re slowly getting up on Redline features from the magazine that are still of relevance. Here we reproduce two closely-related pieces that appeared several years apart on wages, profits, crisis.
   https://rdln.wordpress.com/2015/04/23/from-the-vaults-two-articles-on-wages-profits-lies-and-capitalist-crisis/
7. Philip Ferguson 7

   24 April 2015 at 8:49 am

   And lastly,
   . . . as we approach Anzac Day. . .
   https://rdln.wordpress.com/2015/04/12/as-we-approach-anzac-day/
8. adam 8

   24 April 2015 at 8:51 am

   “Bugger the constitution, there’s a quid in this…”

   This is just too wonderful for words.

   Mr Clarke and Mr Dawe

   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmvqJDj1dB8
   • halfcrown 8.1

     24 April 2015 at 9:01 am

     That’s cheered my day up Adam.
   • rawshark-yeshe 8.2

     24 April 2015 at 2:09 pm

     brilliant, thx for the links. my day is a little brighter now !
9. Pasupial 9

   24 April 2015 at 9:10 am

   It is now the 24th of April over in Instanbul; marking the start of the centennial of the Aremenian Genocide. I doubt that there will be much coverage of this in the NZMSM as the genocide denying Turkish government has also scheduled their Gallipoli event for this day. Previously, Turkey has marked the day on the 18th, when the bombardment preceding the invasion began, with the ANZAC commemoration being on the 25th. The Guardian has been good at keeping this issue live:

   On 24 April 1915, near the end of the Ottoman empire, more than 200 Armenian intellectuals in Istanbul, most of whom were in government custody, were killed. More than a million of their kin were killed in the following year as part of a national program designed to quite literally decimate the Armenian populace of the crumbling empire.

   http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/apr/23/obama-armenian-genocide-end-the-charade
   • veutoviper 9.1

     24 April 2015 at 9:55 am

     Just before reading your comment, I was reading Andrea Vance’s Twitter feed and the Armenian centennial came up on one thread, here.

     https://twitter.com/avancenz/status/591174635883900928

     Hopefully, Andrea will follow through on this on either her twitter feed, or in an article on Stuff.

     Andrea is currently studying in the UK until July, but is doing coverage for Fairfax at the Gallipoli commemorations.
   • Murray Rawshark 9.2

     24 April 2015 at 2:12 pm

     “designed to quite literally decimate the Armenian populace”

     Grrr. I wish they wouldn’t do that. They had no intention of stopping after killing 10% of the Armenians. Turkey has never accepted responsibility for this crime against humanity.
   • Chooky 9.3

     24 April 2015 at 7:03 pm

     Robert Fisk on Armenian genocide

     ‘Armenian genocide: To continue to deny the truth of this mass human cruelty is close to a criminal lie’

     http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/armenian-genocide-to-continue-to-deny-the-truth-of-this-mass-human-cruelty-is-close-to-a-criminal-lie-10188119.html

     “I dug the bones and skulls of massacred Armenians out of the Syrian desert with my own hands in 1992…
10. cogito 10

    24 April 2015 at 10:40 am

    That NZ flag jacket Paul Henry was wearing this morning….. sickening, and almost creepy on the eve of Anzac Day.
    • phillip ure 10.1

      24 April 2015 at 11:18 am

      and so poorly-made/ill-fitting..

      (‘world’ ran it up for him apparently..clearly not their finest hour..)
      • cogito 10.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 12:43 pm

        agreed. Would even have been ok at a summer kiwiana garden party, but not as worn.
11. Puckish Rogue 11

    24 April 2015 at 11:02 am

    I don’t know if anyones interested in the latest Roy Morgan Poll:

    http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/6187-roy-morgan-new-zealand-voting-intention-april-2015-201504230106

    Support for National has dropped to 45.5% (down 1%) and support for Prime Minister John Key’s Coalition partners the Maori Party has dropped to 1.5% (down 0.5%). Support for Key’s other two Coalition partners is unchanged: Act NZ 1% (unchanged) and United Future is still on 0% (unchanged).

    Despite the rise in support for the Opposition Parties on the whole, Labour’s decision to advise Labour supporters to vote for NZ First Leader Winston Peters in the Northland by-election appears to have dented Labour support – now at 27.5% (down 3.5%). In contrast, support has increased strongly for both the Greens 13.5% (up 2.5%) and NZ First 8.5% (up 2.5%).
    • Colonial Viper 11.1

      24 April 2015 at 1:35 pm

      what information did Roy Morgan issue which led you to conclude that Labours drop was anything to do with Northland?
      • alwyn 11.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 1:53 pm

        The final two paragraphs should have been in quotes.
        They are directly out of the Roy Morgan release of the poll results and they are Morgan’s opinions, not conclusions Puckish Rogue has come to. (He may of course agree with them)
      • Puckish Rogue 11.1.2

        24 April 2015 at 1:55 pm

        Not my writing, thats Roy Morgans conclusion however its not a good result for Little…still plenty of time until the next election
12. felix 12

    24 April 2015 at 11:11 am

    Michelle Boag on Radiolive right now.

    She says wherever Key goes, people want to touch him.

    And then she said it’s not unusual for MPs to hug constiotuents.

    She also lied and said it all happened over a year ago, and lied again saying the waitress never complained to anyone until now.
13. esoteric pineapples 13

    24 April 2015 at 11:19 am

    This type of thing will be coming to New Zealand soon;

    http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/montreal-woman-convicted-of-posting-anti-police-graffiti-on-instagram-1.2341840

    because there is a law in the pipeline which will put people in prison for up to two years for putting anything on line that causes people emotional harm.

    http://norightturn.blogspot.co.nz/2015/04/national-wants-to-jail-people-who.html
    • greywarshark 13.1

      24 April 2015 at 6:44 pm

      @ esoteric

      Some more things about the Canadaian case.

      The judge expressed skepticism about Pawluck’s claim on the identity issue, given her involvement as an activist during student demonstrations in 2012.
      Lafreniere is the main voice of the police force during major events and was very visible on TV during the highly charged student protests, which featured numerous clashes between authorities and demonstrators….

      A smirking Pawluck left the courthouse repeating “no comment” as a friend shielded her from cameras. Her lawyer, Valerie De Guise, also declined to speak.
      Pawluck was charged under a summary offence, meaning the maximum sentence is six months in jail or a $5,000 fine. Sentencing arguments will take place May 14.

      The fact that she was at a student demonstration in 2012 had been noted and formed part of the facts in Court. The policeman had been highly involved in the handling of the protests which involved clashes.
      It is possible that this was a retaliatory, punitive reaction on his part against this student. She could be punished heavily. If a policeman actually shot a student, would he/she be facing prison or a $5000 fine or recompense to the person’s family?

      Smirking. That’s a loaded adjective from the media. They could easily have labelled it a brave smile.
14. Philip Ferguson 14

    24 April 2015 at 11:23 am

    I originally wrote this article on the gay marriage referendum in the south of Ireland on April 7 and advertised it here then. But I’ve just updated it a bit, so people might like to take a/nother look:

    https://rdln.wordpress.com/2015/04/07/irish-society-and-politics-and-the-referendum-on-gay-marriage/

    Phil
15. wyndham 15

    24 April 2015 at 12:56 pm

    Anyone know what’s happened to Karol ?

    I keep going over to her site @ Edge Times but there have been no recent postings.

    She was a star whilst commenting at TS.
    • rawshark-yeshe 15.1

      24 April 2015 at 1:15 pm

      Hope someone knows .. her star is missed here.
      • joe90 15.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 1:25 pm

        Seconded.
16. Murray Rawshark 16

    24 April 2015 at 12:58 pm

    Labor loves spying on us as much as Labour does. Die, sellout social democracy, die. You are already a smelly and useless zombie.

    http://www.theage.com.au/comment/a-chilling-step-closer-to-australian-secret-police-20150421-1mpgdk.html
    • greywarshark 16.1

      24 April 2015 at 2:01 pm

      @ Murray R
      That certainly is chilling and horrific.

      This paper from 1986 from an Oz Uni looks deeply at the threats of political violence to Australia and its response. Very good study I think. It comments wryly on the apparent wistfulness of Oz media that the country is regarded as a bit of a boring backwater where no exciting terrorism ever occurs. The media they think would enjoy having some good drama to report and boost circulation with.
      http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/previous%20series/vt/1-9/vt09.html#5

      They break the violence into headings, and under terrorism they say there has been sporadic examples, but no trend. It seems that this sporadic nature will continue and while not ignoring it, there is no necessity to ramp up a major response.

      And this:
      The final problem has to do with assumptions about the nature of terrorism and how to deal with it. Much of the discussion which follows predictions of an increased level of terrorism seems to be predicated on the assumption either that terrorism generally can be defeated (that is, reduced to a low enough level so as not to occasion great national or international concern) or that, given the will (manifested by adequate security measures), any country can reduce the probability of attack against it to a very low level.

      In fact, neither of these assumptions is realistic. Worse, they are dangerously unrealistic. The danger is that accepting them can lead to an uncritical acceptance of security measures domestically, and military measures internationally, which may themselves be counterproductive, destabilising and contribute to further terrorism.

      The reality that, whatever we do, terrorism will be a feature of the international landscape for the foreseeable future and that no country can prevent all acts of terrorism, must be accepted as a basis for rational threat assessments and discussions of counter-terrorist policy and machinery.

      Here are some other events that Australia managed to live through concerning Croatian and Yugoslav immigrants into the country and relationships with disgreements in their home country. where they were returning to fight. One organisation the Ustasha was connected with genocide camps 1941-45 and Serbo-Croat violence and Milosevic and Karadzic, notorious who have appeared before international tribunals were involved. Heavy stuff.
      Page 10 of The Age 17 July 1973
      Murky situation concerning a bombing.
      http://members.iimetro.com.au/~hubbca/hilton_bombing.htm
      • Murray Rawshark 16.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 2:59 pm

        “In fact, neither of these assumptions is realistic. Worse, they are dangerously unrealistic. The danger is that accepting them can lead to an uncritical acceptance of security measures domestically, and military measures internationally, which may themselves be counterproductive, destabilising and contribute to further terrorism.”

        I agree 100% with this. Cracking down on the whole of society makes those with a grievance more desperate and dangerous, whether the grievance is imagined or not. I am appalled, but not overly surprised, that Labo(u)r goes down the same route.
17. rawshark-yeshe 17

    24 April 2015 at 1:30 pm

    This is posted as a comment yesterday on Blubber’s home ..

    “Has anything been said about Rawshark being arrested yesterday? Was he? Haven’t heard anything from the msm. Any information about this?

    If so, a big coincidence that it occurred on the same day as the ponytail saga!”

    Omg I hope it’s not true ..
    • Murray Rawshark 17.1

      24 April 2015 at 3:04 pm

      I hope it’s bullshit. FJK should be arrested, not Rawshark. Hoskings can be his cellmate and all his dreams would come true.
      • rawshark-yeshe 17.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 4:17 pm

        Hw would we know I wonder ? He would let us know somehow, surely ? Or Nicky H would ?
      • b waghorn 17.1.2

        24 April 2015 at 6:03 pm

        Hosking would have to grow a pony tail!
18. te reo putake 18

    24 April 2015 at 2:05 pm

    Latest Guardian article on Key’s difficulties. Includes a rather damning video.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/23/woman-whose-ponytail-was-pulled-by-pm-identified-by-new-zealand-herald
19. marty mars 19

    24 April 2015 at 3:39 pm

    fuck me that earthquake was big here in Golden Bay
    • joe90 19.1

      24 April 2015 at 3:48 pm

      It rocked and rolled here in Whanganui too.
      • marty mars 19.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 3:57 pm

        I spose they’ll call it the Wellington quake then
    • Lanthanide 19.2

      24 April 2015 at 3:55 pm

      In a meeting at work, I’d say we could still feel it wobbling for 20 seconds – we all knew it was a fairly big one far away from us (Christchurch). I pulled up geonet on the projector and waited for it to give us the location 🙂
      • marty mars 19.2.1

        24 April 2015 at 3:58 pm

        Good that you guys didn’t have to have another over 6er
        • rawshark-yeshe 19.2.1.1

          24 April 2015 at 4:15 pm

          please stay safe .. is this another on top of yesterday’s Seddon quake ? Not nice. Sending brandy !
          • ianmac 19.2.1.1.1

            24 April 2015 at 8:06 pm

            Felt here in Blenheim for about 17 seconds. OK though.
20. Philip Ferguson 20

    24 April 2015 at 3:59 pm

    Tim Leadbeater looks at three New Zealand writers – Robin Hyde, Ormond Burton and Alexander Aitken – on the absurdity and obscenity of Gallipoli:
    https://rdln.wordpress.com/2015/04/24/the-absurdity-and-obscenity-of-gallipoli-three-new-zealand-writers-accounts/
21. rawshark-yeshe 21

    24 April 2015 at 4:14 pm

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/68000611/graham-mccready-lays-complaint-about-police-inaction-over-pms-ponytail-pulling

    McReady laying compliant with IPAC over lack of response … good on him. Can we send him money somehow ?
    • Puckish Rogue 21.1

      24 April 2015 at 4:24 pm

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graham_McCready

      In 2006, McCready was sentenced to 75 hours community service after he traded while bankrupt

      In 2009, McCready was convicted on charges on charges of making false tax returns involving $183,155. He was sentenced to six months’ home detention.

      In 2013, McCready was convicted of blackmailing a company director and sentenced to six months’ community detention.[13] He wrote in an apology to the victim that: “My conduct was criminal, unnecessary, and I am sure caused you some considerable distress.” Although he escaped jail time, the court costs bankrupted him.

      Yep thats what this guys needs, encouragement
      • rawshark-yeshe 21.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 4:37 pm

        What he did against Banks was honourable. What he is doing now is honourable. Can’t speak for then. Thanks for info, but maybe he has paid his dues ?

        I am in the present day and admire what he is doing, and am very grateful about it.
      • greywarshark 21.1.2

        24 April 2015 at 5:47 pm

        Puckish Rogue
        Do you supply any information you can Garner on us to the NACTs too? Have you got a little list? They never will be missed etc. G&S
22. rawshark-yeshe 22

    24 April 2015 at 5:43 pm

    Herald reporting that Sparks all networks is down Wellington and south .. hope they are all safe from that big 6.2 rolling and long quake.
23. Once was Tim 23

    24 April 2015 at 7:15 pm

    I’m not sure whether this is a kosha question to ask, but I’ll do so anyway (after watching the ‘expert’ Bill Hodge on that abomination of a programme called Henry something or other on TV3/RadioLive this morning.
    Does anyone else know Bill? (My brother did before he karked it).
    The guy seems to have changed quite a bit …. not sure his expertise these days isn;t clouded by curmudgeonhood and a dribble of right wing sauce – shaken not stirred.
    Just curious.
    Phil U perhaps? (probably under the same circumstances my brother and the hodge came to become friends)
    Rhinocrates perhaps?
    If you do – have you noticed a change (and I mean in basic principles/honesty/ that sort of thing)

    No big deal …… just curious

    Probably like Rhino, I’m really beginning to despair at the quality of the tertiary that’s being slopped up these days. (There’s a Bryce we should prolly throw in there as well – and they seem to justify their cosy little pozzies and minimal effort brain fart comments in the MSM and elsewhere along the lines of “The world has changed”……)
    Rhino: any thoughts – and U 2 @ PU
    • the pigman 23.1

      24 April 2015 at 8:08 pm

      I know Bill. He was my employment law lecturer and indeed had some small role in awarding me the Simpson Grierson Employment Law Prize many years back *swells with pride*

      He is marginally political, and nailed a slight RW-bent to his mast, but he is very circumspect and very honest about the effect of the pendulum of politics on Employment Law.

      It always strikes me as a little odd that he is the resident expert on every area of law when the media come calling.

      With that said, he is a thoroughly intelligent and affable chap, he runs marathons frequently, and he is literally brimming with jokes about bears (it was kinda his thing to start every lecture with a joke involving a bear…).

      He also has friends on both the right and left. Among others, he brought in Simon Mitchell (prominent Auckland employment law barrister with good union client base, was also a nominee for Mt. Albert before mumblefuck was handed it) to lecture us, who is also a great left-wing thinker. So I wouldn’t say that Bill imposed RW thought on his students (most of whom are already arch-tory Kings/Dio/St Cuths students anyway).
      • Once was Tim 23.1.1

        24 April 2015 at 8:39 pm

        I can’t disagree with all that you say .
        I was kind of surprised at his bent on the Henry abomination this morning however.
        And that “Mild RW” bent that’s now nailed (VERY FIRMLY) to his mast, never used to be present – which is what concerns me in terms of where he sees himself now and the quality of his media contributions (There was once a word we used to use – it was called BIAS)
        Anyway ….. He’s elected to be in fine company and I’ll view his MSM contributions from now on with the view they deserve

        Thankyou @pigman. Good to know your view and perception of things.
        Thank you
24. the pigman 24

    24 April 2015 at 8:02 pm

    A bit late in the day for this, but I thought of Once was Tim when I read this:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/fashion/68016399/Its-wrong-to-tell-fat-women-they-look-fabulous

    Totally with you on calling out the sugar merchants, by the way!

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