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The Gun Club

Written By: - Date published: 2:34 pm, March 11th, 2016 - 172 comments
Categories: capitalism, crime, Deep stuff, drugs, labour, police - Tags: , , , , ,

Following on from the Kawerau seige, Labour has called for an inquiry into the hidden and illegal gun market. Spokesperson Stuart Nash says that the time is right for an independent look into gun culture in NZ,  a discussion which he says needs to go beyond a “purely law and order perspective”.

Part time PM John Key reckons there’s nothing to see here, move on, oh look, there’s something shiny over there.

Nash is correct that we need to look at how criminals are getting hold of weapons. And we need to recognise that that further arming the police is not the answer.

This is a supply and demand issue. Any inquiry should look at ways of cutting the supply, for sure. But the also inquiry needs to identify why there is the demand for weapons in the first place. Particularly, we need to know why criminals are arming themselves.

It appears that the Kawerau seige followed on from a routine Police anti-cannabis cultivation operation. Presumably, the gun or guns were a deterrent to anyone thinking of raiding the crop, be that law enforcement or just other crims trying to rip the dope off.

To be blunt, if cannabis was not illegal in NZ, then these four police officers would not have been shot. If it was legal to possess and grow marijuana, then there would not be police operations of this nature and the criminal gangs who currently profit from drug dealing would find their customer base thinning considerably. So why aren’t we legalising marijuana?

The experience in the Netherlands, Portugal and some US states is that decriminalisation and the treatment of drug use as a health issue, not a legal matter, leads to less use overall and much, much less criminality.

So, by all means look at the black market in guns. But lets also address the wider problem that we have of criminalising a large minority of kiwis for using what is a mostly harmless intoxicant, and forcing smokers to peripherally interact with gangs and in turn, making those criminals think it’s sensible to protect their sources of profit with firearms.

If we free the weed, we can free up our police to catch real criminals and we can strike a blow against both gun culture and gang culture at the same time. So what’s stopping us?

 

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172 comments on “The Gun Club”

  1. weka 1

    There’s a table in that Labour press release that isn’t link or referenced in any way and appears incomplete. It’s supposed to detail reasons for confiscation, which seems important to this discussion.

  2. Chuck 2

    Personal cannabis use should be legal, a couple of plants out the back no problem. As for calls for an inquiry into the illegal gun market, it does not take a rocket scientist to work out the gangs and underworld bring in the military style weapons hidden in containers etc. The reason is also clear, to defend and attack against rival gangs as tens if not hundreds of millions dollars is at stake in the NZ drug industry. Its nothing to do with a “gun culture” its simply bad people (mostly gangs) who can access guns by either illegally importing or stealing from law abiding (licensed) gun owners.

    • TC 2.1

      National will not upset their tobacco and alcohol contributors by entertaining any decriminalisation actions.

      Shonky will always have another opinion on this matter regardless of the globally available data that it reduces crime and increases tax revenue.

  3. heather 3

    I agree there needs to be a complete overhaul of the gun rules in New Zealand.
    I think a very close look needs to be taken by someone of the huge gun sales that are held in Auckland, and I am sure elsewhere. I am horrified by the advertising that is posted in our letterbox and the page adverts in the newspaper advertising these gun sales.
    If cannabis was available and was not a criminal offence we would see a great change in the hours of police time given to trying to find it growing, the guns that are needed to protect it and maybe the police could give some more time to solving the outstanding number of unsolved burlaries in New Zealand.

    • Puckish Rogue 3.1

      Theres nothing wrong with the gun rules in NZ there is, however, something very wrong with the drug laws

      • weka 3.1.1

        “huge gun sales” gives us a clue. Why does NZ this?

        • Puckish Rogue 3.1.1.1

          It doesn’t matter if they’re big gun sales or small gun sales just so long as the rules and laws are followed

          I think worrying about gun sales is a red herring

          • weka 3.1.1.1.1

            The bigger the sale the more guns in circulation and the more that are going to end up being used criminally. I have no problem with people having guns for legitimate reasons, but weapons trading should be much more tightly regulated. Allowing it to be part of the free market is insane.

            • Grindlebottom 3.1.1.1.1.1

              We don’t want to end up like the US thanks. Too many guns in private hands is going to mean more shootings. People losing their rags and using the bloody things.

              • Colonial Viper

                Bullshit. You don’t understand NZ and firearms at all. People like you are going to fuck this up by trying to fire up a new moral crusade.

                • weka

                  You don’t think too many guns in private hands would a be a problem in NZ? Why not?

                  • Colonial Viper

                    You really want to fire up a new moral crusade for the Left and this is really what you want to pick?

                    • Grindlebottom

                      What are you on about? There’s no moral crusade here. Just an opinion that more guns in private hands will probably mean more shootings. I’m not a fan of encouraging lots of people to buy arms and I’d prefer all firearms to be registered rather than owners. There’s fuck all people being killed with guns in NZ because there’s fuck all people owning them.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      You’re wrong on so many counts its ridiculous.

                      Everyone knows that guns don’t kill people, people do.

                    • Macro

                      IMHO both need to be registered. That is every firearm and its whereabouts – and every firearm owner. I’ve owned a firearm under both regimes – ie when every firearm was registered, and when every owner had a firearms license.
                      Thus there is a registry of every firearm in the country, and only those permitted to use them for sporting, hunting, etc.
                      Obviously there are illegal firearms traded on a black market, there is little that can be done about that apart from undercover and vigilance by police. The use of those firearms can be reduced however with appropriate policing methods, and I agree with the suggestion in the post that the shooting at Kawarau would never have occurred if the growing of Cannabis for personal use was not illegal.

                    • weka

                      “You really want to fire up a new moral crusade for the Left and this is really what you want to pick?”

                      No, I don’t. Fuck off CV and stop making shit up about my politics and those of other people here.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      weka, gun control was originally used to take guns off communists, socialists and unionists, as well as native peoples. Probably a good idea given your attitude.

                    • weka

                      +1 Macro.

                      Grindlebottom, CV is going off on one, don’t expect much in the way of actual debate. He’s spraying his shit around the site again this evening.

                    • Grindlebottom

                      Oh ok, thanks weka. I hadn’t noticed. Must have a look around. Quite like it when he goes off sometimes. Maybe he should eat something.

                    • weka

                      I don’t enjoy it, seen him trash too many conversations. I’m also not that keen on his blatant bigotry either.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Fuck it weka, you get to call me a bigot, tell me I am spraying shit around, and then get to pretend that you’re being all good and dandy?

                      Give me a break from your self-righteousness why don’t you.

                      Grindlebottom: good call. Having a few choc thins and a nice cuppa. Feeling better for it too 🙂

                    • Sacha

                      Weka should not be the focus of your ire.

                      Try Nash or whoever sanctioned him to make this an issue. Presume Labour’s caucus, leader, party managers, political advisors, ‘strategist’, comms manager and others were involved. If not, why not?

                    • The lost sheep

                      ‘He’s spraying his shit around the site again this evening.’
                      This, from someone who earlier in the day tried to create a causative linkage between the murder of 2 defenseless Worker Grandmothers and neo-liberal politics?

                      But Guns? Do we have an issue? It’s not like we are Venezuela or anything….
                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

                    • weka

                      “Fuck it weka, you get to call me a bigot, tell me I am spraying shit around, and then get to pretend that you’re being all good and dandy?”

                      I’m not pretending I’m all good and dandy, that’s you making incorrect assumptions, again. I’m pointing out you are being a bigot (happy to say how if you want to know, but not wasting my brain when you so obviously aren’t interested in anything other than destroying) and that you’re not actually debating anything here, you’re just dumping a whole bunch of shit without any attempt to make a decent argument.

                      “Give me a break from your self-righteousness why don’t you.”

                      I’ll stop giving you shit when you stop behaving like one. Your behaviour tonight is unbelievable and I’m sick of it.

                    • weka

                      “Weka should not be the focus of your ire.”

                      Thanks Sacha, and neither should anyone else he is targeting here.

                    • Grindlebottom

                      I think you should give it a bit more time for the biscuits to work….

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Seriously weka, keep calling me names from your high horse, who cares what you are sick of.

                    • Grindlebottom

                      This is what happens when you expect biscuits to do a pizza’s job.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Yeah, noted for future reference…

                    • weka

                      “Seriously weka, keep calling me names from your high horse, who cares what you are sick of.”

                      I do. And I know other people who do too. I will keep calling you on the crappy stuff and encouraging you to comment in the intelligent way that contributes well to the place instead. I don’t mind you beefing off about Labour or whatever at times, everyone does that, but I’m not going to accept you doing wholesale negativity that sucks whole threads in its wake and misrepresents what people think.

                  • Sacha

                    more guns in private hands

                    James says it’s cool cos the phrase ‘private hands’ makes him moist.

                • James

                  CV – Hate to say it – agree with you 1000%.

                  Sad thing is – I knew as soon as it happened that this would be the squalk from some people.

                  And Grindlebottom – as sor fuck all people owning guns – NZ has the 22nd highest rate of gun ownership in the world.

                  • Grindlebottom

                    How many of those are multiple guns owned by the same licence holder James? And how many of them are rural?

              • Richard McGrath

                Can you cite evidence for your assertion? In the U.S. a few years ago, John Lott found that liberalising gun laws reduced rates of violent crime. That doesn’t mean everyone has to own a gun, but if they are allowed to, it discourages people from going on shooting sprees. Such sprees tend to occur where the shooter knows the civilian population have been disarmed.

      • DoublePlusGood 3.1.2

        People are allowed guns. Very, very few people actually need guns. This discrepancy is worth considering changes in the rules for.

        • Colonial Viper 3.1.2.1

          If Labour head down this track it will find itself in over its head very quickly.

        • Richard McGrath 3.1.2.2

          So if you don’t need something you shouldn’t have it? Very, very few people actually need swimming pools.

          • Colonial Viper 3.1.2.2.1

            Or a car with an engine over 1800cc.

          • weka 3.1.2.2.2

            How many swimming pool murders and suicides per year in NZ?

            • Colonial Viper 3.1.2.2.2.1

              How many swimming pool deaths a year, weka, is the question you meant to ask.

              And how does it compare to gun deaths in NZ.

              Hmmmm, so how does it compare, weka?

              Also, you switched the basis of the argument away from “need”. Why did you do that?

              • weka

                I asked the right question. For a reason. People are willing to accept passive death risk far more than intentional. Which is why we drive big cars despite them causing deaths. If those deaths were intentional we would be calling for more regulation of big cars.

                “Also, you switched the basis of the argument away from “need”. Why did you do that?”

                No I didn’t. It’s still a valid argument. Bet you don’t know what I think about it though. Likewise, bet you don’t know where I stand on gun control. You’re a bigot CV.

        • James 3.1.2.3

          Need is not an essential qualifier. I want a gun, because I enjoy target shooting – its a hobbie.

          Love to see a government try to take that away from people.

          • weka 3.1.2.3.1

            Do you think there should be an upper limit of the number of hobby guns someone can own?

            I don’t have a problem with limited hobby ownership, and if it’s your hobby you can argue need for ownership. Type of firearm should be better regulated too.

            • chris73 3.1.2.3.1.1

              Well I for one don’t think there should be a limit because, not to be flippant, one person can only accurately fire one weapon at a time…unless you’re this guy of course

              http://www.gstatic.com/tv/thumb/movieposters/9400/p9400_p_v8_aa.jpg

              But seriously the problem i would have with this is who decides the limit and what is the purpose of the limit?

              If you’re a responsible gun owner (and the stats back it up I’m guessing) then it doesn’t matter if you own 1, 10 or 100 firearms because you’ve proven yourself to be capable of owning and looking after them

              Now if you wanted to increase sentencing for crimes involving firearms or make it easier to confiscate firearms if the owners show themselves to be incapable of looking after them then I wouldn’t have a problem with that either (Andrew Hore springs to mind)

              Basically I feel the laws we have now are working well and any more that are implemented (especially knee-jerk reactions) now will only target people that’re already following the laws and will have no effect on the criminals

              • weka

                We do seem to have an increasing problem though.

                Why do you object to registering each firearm as well as the owner?

                I guess I’m making the argument that the more guns there are in circulation the more that are available for criminal use. Am happy to be proven wrong on that eg if stats show that most guns used by criminals are smuggled in from overseas.

                • chris73

                  It is increasing but I don’t think focusing on (I hate to say it because it sounds like the NRA) law-abiding firearms owners is the way to go

                  I really do believe that decriminalizing dak would go a long way to combating this problem

                  The issues i have with registering firearms are:

                  1. The cost and record keeping would, I imagine, be quite considerable not too mention how much time it would take the police to run it

                  2. Again it goes back to law-abiding citizens and crims, the crims won’t register their weapons and will just steal, buy stolen firearms or just import them (illegally of course)

                  Also I’m not comfortable with the government knowing what weapons i have, a new government may decide to ban all firearms and a list of weapons would be quite handy for them to have if they ever wanted to start confiscating them…

                  My argument would be that making it harder for people to legally own firearms won’t stop criminals owing firearms and that decriminalizing dak and thereby cutting into crims profits would be a more effective solution

                  • weka

                    Ok, you’ve just said that you will be willing to break the law if necessary to keep your guns, so I think that renders the rest of your argument unsound.

                    • chris73

                      I think that english comprehension isn’t your strong suit, please point out where I said I’d break the law to keep my guns

                    • weka

                      You said,

                      Also I’m not comfortable with the government knowing what weapons i have, a new government may decide to ban all firearms and a list of weapons would be quite handy for them to have if they ever wanted to start confiscating them…

                      I took that to mean if the govt banned all firearms you would try and hide yours. Was I wrong? If you wouldn’t try and keep some, why is it a problem if the govt has a list of them?

                    • chris73

                      I took that to mean if the govt banned all firearms you would try and hide yours.

                      – You assumed

                      Was I wrong?

                      – Yes

                      If you wouldn’t try and keep some, why is it a problem if the govt has a list of them?

                      – If the government has a list of weapons and the government confiscate my weapons then at the very least my property has been taken away and you don’t see any problems with that?

                      or the government decides I’m now dangerous because I’m on a list that says I’m armed and you don’t see any problems with that?

                    • weka

                      Ok, just to be clear, if guns were banned in NZ you would hand yours in?

                      – If the government has a list of weapons and the government confiscate my weapons then at the very least my property has been taken away and you don’t see any problems with that?

                      It’s not without precedent. For instance the govt currently uses the Public Works Act to force people to sell them their land. It also confiscated land from Māori with the Foreshore and Seabed Act. So yeah, I see problems. But I don’t see how the govt having a list of what firearms you have figures into that. It’s like saying that property owners shouldn’t have title in case the govt confiscates their land. If you are willing to hand over your guns were such a law passed, then why is the govt having a list a problem exactly?

                      or the government decides I’m now dangerous because I’m on a list that says I’m armed and you don’t see any problems with that?

                      That’s a different thing. Again not without precedent. I think what you have said in public on this thread means you are probably already on the radar of the authorities with regards to firearms. Not hugely, but if the govt gets repressive they already know where to find you.

                    • chris73

                      The thing is in NZ we have a high gun ownership and low gun deaths and I believe a lot of that is because of the laws that have been set up so I don’t see any reason to change those laws

                      I also haven’t seen any reasonable argument from anyone on here as to why the laws should be changed besides some vague notions that people “shouldn’t” have firearms

                      Never has been more true when its said if it ain’t broke don’t fix it

                    • weka

                      We have too many illegal firearms in NZ, why is that?

          • te reo putake 3.1.2.3.2

            “Need is not an essential qualifier. ”

            Er, yes it is. Need comes before want. Gun culture is about wants, not needs.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow's_hierarchy_of_needs

      • Richard McGrath 3.1.3

        Agree 100% there, PR. The main issue here is drug prohibition and the violation of individual freedom it represents.

        • Draco T Bastard 3.1.3.1

          /facepalm

          Answer this question: Does anybody else have the right to affect you without your say so?

          • Richard McGrath 3.1.3.1.1

            /facepalm

            No-one has the right to initiate force against me (or anyone else); if I can prove harm, I have a case for whoever harmed me to put things right.

            A person cannot live without affecting others – we don’t live on this planet completely isolated from everybody else.

            • Draco T Bastard 3.1.3.1.1.1

              I didn’t say force, I said affect. There’s a very good reason for that which is, as you point out, that nobody can do anything without affecting others. This gives others veto right on everything you do. This means that we don’t actually have “individual freedom”.

              Now, asking everybody if you can do something before you do it is impractical and so we have rules, regulations and tradition about what we can and can’t do without asking.

              I do agree that our drug laws don’t work and that they need a major overhaul. But it’s not a question of simply getting rid of prohibition.

      • Draco T Bastard 3.1.4

        Theres nothing wrong with the gun rules in NZ

        Of course there is. Neither we nor our politicians are perfect and thus the gun and all other laws aren’t perfect and so do need to be looked at and overhauled in line with new knowledge.

  4. Anno1701 4

    back in the mid 90s there was a large importation of military grade small arms into this country by organized criminals from out side NZ , they figured NZ was a good potential market as the rest of the world was pretty much saturated with this kind of weaponry buy this point

    A few months later there was an “all-gang” summit called and it was decided to get rid of these weapons before serious carnage broke out

    They were sealed into 40gallons drums with concrete and dropped by a fishing trawler into the sea of the coast of Invercargill

    The Police were advised the guns were being moved and where they were going , “word on the street” is the Law was so happy about what was happening they provided an undercover escort in case the load was mistakenly intercepted by any local plod en-route

    • reason 4.1

      ^^^^ what a load of fantasy shit Anon1701 …………………. did you read it in a Wishart magazine or something.

      The big BOOM of guns entering the black market was after the Government changed the laws in response to David Gray and the Aramoana shootings.

      Hundreds of thousands of licensed gun owners did not renew under the more strict, stringent and expensive firearms license rules. …………. and as their guns themselves were not registered or otherwise kept track of no one has a clue where they all went ( the vast majority were sold legally to licensed gun owners of course ).

      Cannabis prohibition is a political Cult built on lies and embraced by our legal system ……… whose time is drawing to an end.

      Shame about all the damage they have and still are causing ……….

      • Anno1701 4.1.1

        “^^^^ what a load of fantasy shit Anon1701… did you read it in a Wishart magazine or something.”

        settle down sweetheart

        i was told by someone who was on the boat

        • reason 4.1.1.1

          “settle down sweetheart

          i was told by someone who was on the boat”

          gee I guess that makes it true then ……………. was it David Icke and were shape shifting reptiles also present?.

    • Sacha 4.2

      That’s a great story. Imagine if their ancestors had been as smart about who wins when gangs/tribes take foreign guns and fight amongst themselves?

  5. Andre 5

    Just out of curiosity, imagine the our authorities had never heard of cannabis prior to the Psychoactive Substances 2013, and hadn’t specifically banned it. Would cannabis have met the requirements for legal sale? After all, hundreds of millions, if not billions of willing human subjects have used it with very little credible evidence of substantial harm to users.

  6. Colonial Viper 6

    I would take a similar but stronger position on this than TRP.

    Chasing down gun laws is a complete red herring for liberal lefties to get all excited about. NZ gun laws and NZ gun culture work very well.

    Taking marijuana out of the purvue of criminals is where the big game for societal change is.

    As well as replacing it with legal, productive, economic alternatives in the regions so that people can continue to earn a solid income.

    One more thing which hasn’t been mentioned so far: all attempts to routinely arm or militarise our police must be resisted.

    • weka 6.1

      “NZ gun laws and NZ gun culture work very well.”

      But it is changing. And there isn’t one gun culture in NZ, there are multiple ones. Can you name them?

      I’d like to know if there is any evidence that shows the number of gun violence incidents in NZ related to cannabis alone.

      • Colonial Viper 6.1.1

        Name the gun cultures in NZ? Why are you asking absurd questions?

        You want to start a Lefty hunt for these bad subcultures in NZ now?

        You think that the Left can deal with these bad subcultures by passing new laws?

        • weka 6.1.1.1

          “You want to start a Lefty hunt for these bad subcultures in NZ now?”

          No I don’t. Where did you get that from? Get off your high horse CV and try and make some politically based debate instead of slurs.

          • Muttonbird 6.1.1.1.1

            The ‘thoughtful comment’ from CV which Ropata referenced in today’s daily review is part of CV’s general view on ‘lefties’ as he puts it.

            CV, in that ‘thoughtful comment’ explains why he thinks Chinese do not engage in politics. A part of his explanation is that Chinese was…

            Further, for a lot of “Asians”, politics is not some benign harmless thing you turn off when the news comes on. Without putting too fine a point on it, leaders get deposed, shit gets blown up, billion dollar nepotism is common, family members are placed incommunicado under Internal Security Acts, helicopters crash in mysterious circumstances, journalists end up floating in the gutter, and you’re lucky if your so-called body guards aren’t the ones to pull the trigger on you one day.

            I haven’t been here long but I think CV’s crusade against ‘lefties’ is a product of being kicked out of the Dunedin Labour Party branch. I think a grudge is being held by CV which would be consistent with his explanation of the attitude of Chinese towards politics.

            • weka 6.1.1.1.1.1

              I’ve only just read that thread, and probably need to reread it as there is a lot in there, but on the face of it I don’t see what you mean. The bit you quote, I took him to be referring to Asian immigrants, not NZ Chinese (of which is he one), so I don’t see how it applies.

              Here’s the thread for those that haven’t seen it. It’s a good read.

              “The greatest polling error in primary history”

              • Muttonbird

                I referenced the comment in response to your call to CV to engage in political debate instead of slurs.

                It made me think of Ropata’s reference to the ‘thoughtful comment’ by CV in which he explained that Asians don’t do politics because of the inherent corruption and flat out nepotism in the politics and daily business life that they are used to.

                • weka

                  Are you saying that CV is akin to an Asian immigrant who comes from a country that is corrput?

                  • Muttonbird

                    No. I referenced his post and I’ll ask you not project what I’m saying in future.

                    CV in his ‘thoughtful comment’ detailed why he thinks Asians (Chinese) don’t engage in politics. He said they tend to be self employed and use their own in family labour and the connections they can trust because their wider experience is one of nepotism and corruption at higher government levels.

                    Let’s be honest here. Chinese people don’t enjoy democracy in any way shape or form and verily are persecuted for agitating for such so no wonder they shy away from politics when the relocate to NZ.

                    Those relocating just want to use the gains they have made from a country with weak labour laws and poor social justice to maximise their situation in NZ.

                    You can say CV comes from a country which is corrupt if you like.

                    • weka

                      I’m not projecting, I’m trying to guess because I honestly don’t know what you are getting at here.

                      CV, afaik, is a Kiwi. I don’t understand why you are comparing him to an Asian immigrant.

            • Colonial Viper 6.1.1.1.1.2

              I haven’t been here long but I think CV’s crusade against ‘lefties’ is a product of being kicked out of the Dunedin Labour Party branch.

              Kicked out was I?

              Link or explanation, please.

              The post I wrote at the time was very clear: all the officers of the branch resigned and the branch I was a member of voted to go into recess; I decision I also voted for.

              Please explain to me where you got “kicked out” from that.

              Unless you meant that we kicked out the Labour Party from our personal lives, which might be a bit more accurate.

              • Muttonbird

                There’s bad blood there. That is plain to see. Also plain to see is the effect it has had upon your vision when talking about the Labour party in particular and ‘lefties’ in general.

                • Colonial Viper

                  Oh there’s definitely bad blood, that’s not in question.

                  The post I read at the time also detailed out why our branch officers quit their posts. Off the top of my head:

                  Mushy stance on the TPP, mushy stance on the Right to Fire, badly judged Chinese sounding last names gambit, voting for NAT social welfare legislation, voting for NAT spying and anti-terrorism legislation, etc.

                  • Muttonbird

                    Meh.

                    Nationally, the TPP debate is mushy because of the secrecy, condescension, and partisanship imposed by the National Government negotiators.

                    The Labour Party has always been for the right of workers and have forced a government policy reversal on zero hours just this week.

                    The Chinese names was a call for foreign buyers information because your beloved National Party government refused to collect such information. Now it does, thanks Phil Twyford.

                    Not sure what you mean about ‘voting for NAT social welfare legislation’, and ‘voting for NAT spying and anti-terrorism legislation, etc’. You appear to have fallen into generalities at that point.

                    • weka

                      Labour voted for bene bashing and the GCSB legislation put up by National.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I didn’t mean that the debate on the TPP is mushy, I mean that Labour is totally mushy on the TPP.

                      Secret agreement which is against the long term interests of NZers.

                      Not that difficult or unclear a political position to maintain is it?

                      But that might put big transnational corporates like Big Pharma etc. off side and they might not want dinner with you.

                    • Muttonbird

                      What bene-bashing?

                      As for the GCSB/SIS laws, I don’t have an issue monitoring gang, drug, and terror activities in NZ but I do have an issue with sitting governments like this one using taxpayer funded spy and police resources to discredit the opposition, critical journalism, and Kiwis subject to foreign civil cases.

                    • weka

                      You can look up the welfare legislation. It’s been talked about a bit on ts.

                    • Muttonbird

                      That’s lazy weka. Please reference where the Labour party have bashed beneficiaries rather than just saying look it up.

                    • weka

                      it’s not laziness it’s that I’m not here to do your homework for you.

              • pat

                a question CV…I assume (though one never should, or so Im told) you are a NZer (chinese heritage) of many generations….that being so, what is the basis of your connection/knowledge of recent Chinese immigrants?

                • Colonial Viper

                  I have a Chinese last name.

                  • pat

                    lol…or a Chinese sounding one. It was a genuine inquiry…I have an Irish surname but that fact gives me no insight into why or how any Irish immigrants may vote.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I’ve met a few Irish in my time. The ones who were politically inclined…can talk for hours about the politics of their countrymen. If there are sufficient drinks available to water the tongue…

                    • pat

                      it would appear its not only the Irish who kiss the Blarney

        • weka 6.1.1.2

          “Name the gun cultures in NZ? Why are you asking absurd questions?”

          You said,

          “NZ gun laws and NZ gun culture work very well.”

          You appeared to be speaking authoritatively. I want to know if you actually know much abotu gun use in NZ, who uses them, why etc i.e. do you know what gun cultures are?

        • RedLogix 6.1.1.3

          @CV

          Here my proposed deal on this. There are only three legitimate reasons to own any sort of gun.

          1. You are a collector.

          You own them for their intrinsic value, not to use them. In this case there is no reason for any gun in your collection to be in working condition, nor should you ever own ammunition.

          All ‘collectables’ are registered and ownership tracked by a National Association that you pay a substantial fee to belong to. Anything not on the register cannot be bought or sold legally, and can be destroyed by the Police.

          2. You are a target shooter.

          In this case you will belong to an official shooting club that has access to a range. Your guns will be registered and any ownership changes tracked by the club, and all your ammunition will be issued by the club for use on a range only. If you cease to be a member in good standing, you surrender your weapon to the club.

          3. You are a bona-fide hunter or farmer.

          You will be a member of Federated Farmers or one of the recognised Hunting Associations. In this case the current rules around Police registration, secure storage and separation of ammunition will apply stringently.

          You will attend regular association meetings, and a safety course at least once every five years. Your equipment and storage will be inspected regularly. Gun owners pay for the cost.

          There are absolutely NO other ‘kiwi cultural’ scenarios that have any legitimacy whatsoever.

          The legal position on gun ownership must be perfectly clear that it is a privilege not a right. Any breach of the rules is an automatic suspension of that right with no compensation. Exactly the same as say … a drivers license.

          Any possession or use of a weapon outside these clear boundaries will be an automatic presumption of guilt in the context of any criminal charges arising, and maximum sentencing will be the indicated direction to the Courts.

          That’s the real New Zealand ‘gun culture’ for you CV. And most safe, competent and responsible gun owners would largely agree with me.

          • weka 6.1.1.3.1

            I agree with pretty much all of that, very good summation.

            This not so much though,

            “You will be a member of Federated Farmers or one of the recognised Hunting Associations.”

            There are plenty of farmers who don’t belong to FF and shouldn’t be required to. Having a wider range of associations to belong to might solve the issue, but it’s not a good idea to mix FF, who are a lobby group with huge influence on the govt nationally and local bodies and who are basically politically amoral, and gun control. Think NZ’s version of the NRA.

            Many poor people rely on hunting to supplement their diets. It’s not ok to penalise them via fees, and it’s probably not safe either as it will encourage illegal ownership and trade.

            • RedLogix 6.1.1.3.1.1

              I agree my proposals above could stand for some refinement. They were meant as a broad expression of intent.

              Conventionally we’ve relied on the State to define and enforce a ‘social license’ to own and use guns. But I do see a much expanded and more effective role for community based organisations. My sense is that if you are a member in good standing of a recognised association this is the most effective way of creating strong, safe and clear expectations around gun use.

              In my experience, if your out regularly bagging a decent amount of wild game for the family, this adds up to a substantial monetary value over the course of a year. Most good hunters finish up with too much at times and a bit of of cash often changes hands with their mates. A few hundred bucks a years in costs is not that big a hurdle. Not if your legit.

              • weka

                My sense is that if you are a member in good standing of a recognised association this is the most effective way of creating strong, safe and clear expectations around gun use.

                How would you see say Tūhoe fitting into that?

                In my experience, if your out regularly bagging a decent amount of wild game for the family, this adds up to a substantial monetary value over the course of a year. Most good hunters finish up with too much and a bit of of cash quite likely changes hands with their mates. A few hundred bucks a years in costs is not that big a hurdle. Not if your legit.

                You’re suggesting that hunters sell meat illegally to cover the increased costs of owning firearms?

                I’m not in favour of laws being written with that kind of rationale (or policy). Nor am I in favour of laws being written that give privilege to people with resources. The people you are talking about are not poor.

                • RedLogix

                  How would you see say Tūhoe fitting into that?

                  If Tuhoe want to operate outside of the current national law, then I guess it’s up to them to say so and work through the consequences. Or if they want to write their own laws and rules around gun use, or abolish them altogether, then as a white male Pakeha I guess I have to remain silent. It’s the sort of thing I’m not allowed to have an opinion on these days.

                  You’re suggesting that hunters sell meat illegally to cover the increased costs of owning firearms?

                  Well you were suggesting that poor hunters might choose to illegally own their firearms to avoid paying some pretty modest fees in the context of the value that their hunting produces.

                  Which do imagine is of more concern, a bit of low level under the table meat trading that has always gone on (done it myself) … or tolerating slack enforcement of gun laws? I know which lane I pick.

                  • weka

                    I’m not suggesting any of those things about Tūhoe. I’m suggesting that if we want to write laws that are inclusive we need to make them work for a broad range of people and I’m not sure that some of your suggestions do that.

                    Well you were suggesting that poor hunters might choose to illegally own their firearms to avoid paying some pretty modest fees in the context of the value that their hunting produces.

                    Yes, but I’m not suggesting we write laws in such a way that accomodates and encourages that. We should write laws that enable people to obey them.

                    Not sure what you mean by modest fees. It’s already pricey to get a licence. If we add on fees for gun registration and various reinspections/tests over time, that puts it out of affordability for some people. I think that will create problems.

              • Colonial Viper

                RL: you believe that those 3 steps you proposed being implemented would have prevented those police officers from being shot?

                I’m not so sure about that.

                I am however 100% sure those officers would not have been shot if cannabis was legalised.

                Perhaps that latter measure would be both more direct, and more effective, at ensuring police safety.

                • RedLogix

                  You know way better than to leap from the general to the specific like that 🙂

                  I would argue that more political effort to constrain gun ownership and use would on balance reduce the probability of people, including police, from being shot. Whether or not it prevents any given incident from happening is a different question that neither you nor I have an answer to.

                  But on the other hand I do accept that legalising cannabis would have in this case have completely changed odds for the better.

                  • Colonial Viper

                    A party in power has a certain amount of political capital it can burn doing unpopular stuff.

                    It’s very rare that a government gets an opportunity to make a big change which will net gain it political capital.

                    From the political calculus point of view a Left Govt trying to knuckle down on gun owners is going to cost it big time. Whereas sorting out the legalisation of cannabis, with appropriate processes and controls, is going to gift it big time.

                    So as a lefty political party, which should avenue should they raise to media prominence?

                    Labour has picked one and I reckon its the wrong one.

                    • weka

                      FWIW, I think Labour were wrong on this too (although possibly for different reasons).

                    • RedLogix

                      It’s very rare that a government gets an opportunity to make a big change which will net gain it political capital.

                      I’ll not quibble with that in principle. But at the same time much of the rest of the world looks on the slow train crash which is the gun-culture in the USA with unmitigated horror and bafflement.

                      There is your net political gain.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      And in what way is our gun culture, gun rules, and gun deaths similar to the USA?

                      It’s not really at all, is it. We are way ahead of the game, by a country mile.

                • Gabby

                  Do you think the legalisation of cannabis would lead growers to stop using land that doesn’t belong to them? If not, do you think police would turn a blind eye to that?

                • Lucy

                  The latest lot would not but most of the cops getting shot when dealing with P suppliers, are you suggesting this should be legalised too? If guns were registered like they used to be we would have an idea of how many were legitimately in the country.

          • chris73 6.1.1.3.2

            1. You are a collector.

            You own them for their intrinsic value, not to use them. In this case there is no reason for any gun in your collection to be in working condition, nor should you ever own ammunition.

            All ‘collectables’ are registered and ownership tracked by a National Association that you pay a substantial fee to belong to. Anything not on the register cannot be bought or sold legally, and can be destroyed by the Police.

            – I disagree with this, part of the fun in collecting is using what you’re collecting (for some people that is), would you expect someone who collects of cars to not drive them so why would you expect someone who collects firearms to not fire them

            – I don’t believe that setting up an association will achieve anything as its not legally acquired firearms that’re causing the problem and you can’t buy firearms without a licence anyway

            2. You are a target shooter.

            In this case you will belong to an official shooting club that has access to a range. Your guns will be registered and any ownership changes tracked by the club, and all your ammunition will be issued by the club for use on a range only. If you cease to be a member in good standing, you surrender your weapon to the club.

            – To get a pistol licence you need to be a member of a pistol club anyway but why foist responsibility for registration onto a club (which are mostly run by volunteers) when there isn’t that much of a major issue?

            – and as for having your ammo issued by the club, good luck with that…theres a lot of different ammunition out there because everyone has their preferences and what about the reloaders, what do they do?

            3. You are a bona-fide hunter or farmer.

            You will be a member of Federated Farmers or one of the recognised Hunting Associations. In this case the current rules around Police registration, secure storage and separation of ammunition will apply stringently.

            You will attend regular association meetings, and a safety course at least once every five years. Your equipment and storage will be inspected regularly. Gun owners pay for the cost.

            – Gun owners will pay for the cost, its not the gun owners that follow the rules that’re the problem, its the criminals breaking the laws so why are you wanting gun owners to have more of their rights taken away, penalties forced on them and pay more money?

            The legal position of gun ownership must be perfectly clear that it is a privilege not a right. Any breach of the rules is an automatic suspension of that right with no compensation. Exactly the same as say … a drivers license.

            – We know its a privilege (well most of us do) thats why we in NZ have one of the highest rates of gun ownership (22nd in the world)

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

            but have one of the lower gun deaths by firearm totals

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

            Don’t mess with a good thing, we have a good balance between rights and responsibilities

            • RedLogix 6.1.1.3.2.1

              Nope … the current balance is sliding towards tolerating more and more gun ownership without much in the way of legitimacy.

              I could have proposed a much more draconian regime that simply stated – no guns at all. Like we don’t for instance allow people to collect deadly snakes or piles of enriched uranium because they think it’s ‘fun’.

              My view is that in a civilised society, guns have a very narrow legitimacy. I argue that if you want to partake in owning one, there will be a significant hurdle to leap over … and very real constraints.

              New Zealand is still a small country. With a bit of political and social will, we could quite readily eliminate illegal and criminal gun ownership. A classic carrot and stick approach would work quite readily.

              • chris73

                Nope … the current balance is sliding towards tolerating more and more gun ownership without much in the way of legitimacy.

                – Thats not true at all, the current licencing rules came in after the Aromoana massacre and since the gun deaths in NZ are running at:

                New Zealand 1.07 per 100 000 and thats broken down into:

                0.18 (2013) attributed to homicide
                0.84 (2011) attributed to suicide
                0.05 (2010) unintentional

                I’d say the current laws are doing very well

                I could have proposed a much more draconian regime that simply stated – no guns at all. Like we don’t for instance allow people to collect deadly snakes or piles of enriched uranium because they think it’s ‘fun’.

                – No we don’t however comparing deadly snakes and enriched uranium to firearms is a very long bow to draw

                The fact is that in a civilised society, guns have a very narrow legitimacy. I argue that if you want to partake in owning one, there will be a significant hurdle to leap over … and very real constraints.

                – You say they have a narrow legitimacy, I say that for hunters, collectors, target shooters, pest control workers and farmers its not very narrow at all

                – There are already hurdles in place if you want to own firearms and, again, harking back to the low cause of death by firearms I’d say they’re working well

                New Zealand is still a small country. With a bit of political and social will, we could quite readily eliminate illegal and criminal gun ownership. A classic carrot and stick approach would work quite readily.

                – No you can’t unless you want to instigate policies like these guys who were also into gun control:

                In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

                In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

                Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, leaving a populace unable to defend itself against the Gestapo and SS. Hundreds of thousands died as a result.

                China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

                Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

                Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated. The total dead are said to be 2-3 million

                Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, 1-2 million ‘educated’ people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

                Although lets be fair those numbers are merely estimates because who really keeps count

                • Colonial Viper

                  Some days a group of activists wants to make it easier for people to kill themselves. Some days those same activists want to make it harder for people to kill themselves. It’s all over the map.

                • RedLogix

                  No we don’t however comparing deadly snakes and enriched uranium to firearms is a very long bow to draw

                  They’re all very dangerous when misused and often kill people. As a society we place strict rules around snakes and uranium because in NZ we simply do not accept them in any shape or form. And if guns were invented tomorrow, we’d not tolerate them either.

                  Christ on a bike … do you really imagine a population can defend itself against the modern state?

                  If really you want to get into an arms race with the military you’ll ultimately need some big bazookas buddy. I guess a few of them in the back shed would have real bragging rights 🙂

                  • chris73

                    They’re all very dangerous when misused and often kill people

                    Theres a lot of things that could be applied to as well:

                    https://www.health.govt.nz/system/files/documents/publications/nz-mortality-statistics-1950-2009-provisional.pdf

                    an easier chart to read:

                    http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2013/02/what_kiwis_die_of.html

                    However death by firearm is extremely low

                    • RedLogix

                      Take another look.

                      We spend billions on a health system that is designed to minimise early or avoidable death to disease.

                      We strongly legislate public, transport and workplace environments to minimise death or injury to avoidable accident.

                      Our legal system counts homicide among the worst of crimes.

                      Our efforts to placate disease, accident and malice can be uneven, sometimes misdirected even … but nonetheless as a society we direct huge resource to this endeavour.

                      But guns are different. Death by guns are entirely 100% preventable, and they bring very little in the way of positive benefit to society, outside of perhaps agricultural and animal control purposes. Their risk-benefit trade-off is awful.

                    • weka

                      “Death by guns are entirely 100% preventable,”

                      That’s not quite true. For some of those deaths people would use a different weapon (or tool in the case of suicide) if a gun wasn’t available.

                      The ones that are completely preventable are the accidental death ones.

                      “and they bring very little in the way of positive benefit to society, outside of perhaps agricultural and animal control purposes. Their risk-benefit trade-off is awful.”

                      Lots of people love hunting and do it for the love of it. That brings benefit. I think target shooting is similar. I don’t know where the risk/benefit trade off should be, but I’d favour some better regulating to prevent it from getting worse rather than assuming it’s already too bad.

                    • RedLogix

                      You should not mis-interpret what I am saying to mean that I’m anti-gun. I’ve spent more time with hunters and target shooters than you probably imagine.

                      I do know which end of one to point.

                      A close friend spent decades as a professional pest controller putting more rounds through his rifle in a year than few other people manage in a lifetime.

                      Close relatives of mine live on a busy gun range.

                      I understand their legitimate uses.

                      But equally I’m bloody clear on the boundaries as well. Especially the kind of gung-ho boof-headed attitudes you can see in c73’s ideas.

                    • chris73

                      But equally I’m bloody clear on the boundaries as well. Especially the kind of gung-ho boof-headed attitudes you can see in c73’s ideas.

                      – Give me an example of my so-called boof-headed attitude

                • Interesting incidental correlations, chris73.

                  Here’s a summing up of the evidence from some Harvard guy:

                  Scientific studies have consistently found that places with more guns have more violent deaths, both homicides and suicides. Women and children are more likely to die if there’s a gun in the house. The more guns in an area, the higher the local suicide rates. “Generally, if you live in a civilized society, more guns mean more death,” said David Hemenway, director of the Harvard Injury Control Research Center. “There is no evidence that having more guns reduces crime. None at all.”

                  Elsewhere in the same link:

                  Despite the ubiquitous presence of “good guys” with guns, countries like Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador, Colombia and Venezuela have some of the highest homicide rates in the world.

                  Indeed, even as some Americans propose expanding our gun culture into elementary schools, some Latin American cities are trying to rein in theirs. Bogotá’s new mayor, Gustavo Petro, has forbidden residents to carry weapons on streets, in cars or in any public space since last February, and the murder rate has dropped 50 percent to a 27-year low. He said, “Guns are not a defense, they are a risk.”

                  “If you’re living in a ‘Mad Max’ world, where criminals have free rein and there’s no government to stop them, then I’d want to be armed,” said Dr. Hemenway of Harvard. “But we’re not in that circumstance. We’re a developed, stable country.” [Referring to the US]

                  • And, chris73, you’re inviting an illogical inference: ‘Authoritarian governments introduce gun controls prior to slaughtering their citizens therefore any government that introduces gun control is increasing the risk of their citizenry being slaughtered.’

                    It ain’t necessarily so.

        • Draco T Bastard 6.1.1.4

          Name the gun cultures in NZ? Why are you asking absurd questions?

          Not really absurd at all – need to know what we’re addressing before we know how to address it.

          And off the top of my head there’s the gun cultures of:

          1. Farmers
          2. Sportspeople
          3. Collectors
          4. Police
          5. Criminals
          6. Enthusiasts

          • RedLogix 6.1.1.4.1

            Well you can more or less conflate enthusiasts and police together. They’re both primarily interested in target shooting in controlled situations. They both typically train on the same ranges, and both are very safety and control conscious as a rule.

            And this group often has a fair bit of overlap with collectors. Especially people into vintage guns, and the like. And if collectors are into firing their weapons it’s almost always in a club context on a controlled range of some sort. There’s often a fair overlap with archers and bow hunters as well.

            And farmers and sports hunters both operate in back country settings where the target is always animals. Only a problem when they mis-identify their target. Which sadly happens a bit too often.

            Criminals are actually a much easier proposition than most people imagine. All it takes is a sustained message from the Police that any whiff of illegal weapon ownership, threat or use will get the ton of bricks treatment. Over time the crims have the option of either engaging in an arms race with the cops, which tends to be Darwinian in its outcomes, or they smarten up and get rid of them.

          • Don't worry. Be happy 6.1.1.4.2

            And the gun cultures of the Armed Forces…territorials as well as regular…..cops seem to get off on guns as well.

            • RedLogix 6.1.1.4.2.1

              Well another way of looking at it is that Police and the Services are more or less the professional version of the amateurs enjoying a Saturday afternoon banging away at the local range.

              Often both police and enthusiasts will share the same facilities. What they both have in common is a strong safety and control culture that does not tolerate untrained idiots who put lives in danger.

              Indeed if you’ve ever watched a SWAT team training, the level of discipline and skill is impressive.

              • Colonial Viper

                and its mindblowing to consider that they operate at a big performance step below operators like the NZSAS.

    • “One more thing which hasn’t been mentioned so far: all attempts to routinely arm or militarise our police must be resisted.”

      That’s part of Nash’s point. He called for an inquiry that didn’t have a “purely law and order perspective”. I reinforced that in the post, too. The answer isn’t more guns.

      • Sacha 6.2.1

        Why is this coming from Nash?

      • miravox 6.2.2

        The other thing that I’m wondering about is if gun sellers are attempting to grow their business with increased presence on-line, and in the community. I’m not suggesting in illegality – just that weapons are in the same socially undesirable category and cigarettes, alcohol, gambling etc and so promotion of the product should be heavily regulated.

        Has regulation of promotion/advertising kept up with gun shows, billboards, on-line sales etc.? Maybe this should be included in any inquiry into illegal gun use and culture (or possibly more appropriately acculturation).

        • Colonial Viper 6.2.2.1

          I’m wondering if we can get some journalists to try ordering some guns online.

          • miravox 6.2.2.1.1

            Heh! Nah – been done 🙂

            Is that still ongoing, or sorted now?

            I was thinking more about whether there was increasing demand for guns, not the legality of a sale.

        • chris73 6.2.2.2

          Why are firearms in the same category as cigarettes, alcohol, gambling etc?

          • miravox 6.2.2.2.1

            Dangerous in the wrong hands and associated with social harm, ‘health’ consequences and criminality if used incorrectly. NO, I’m not suggesting here that guns should be banned. No, I’m not anti-hunting, target shooting or collecting.

            However, I do believe they should be thoughtful purchases, and marketing and advertising should reflect this. You may have a different view and that’s fine – all the more reason for this to be part of an inquiry, if that’s what is being called for. Sort out the issues.

          • weka 6.2.2.2.2

            They’re all potentially dangerous.

            • chris73 6.2.2.2.2.1

              Name me something that isn’t potentially dangerous

              • weka

                Most things. You’re not that stupid chris.

                • chris73

                  Most things are potentially dangerous depending on how you use them

                  • weka

                    Theoretically true but not relevant to the point that was being made.

                    • chris73

                      Well yes it, food wasn’t mentioned yet thats probably the biggest killer out there, I didn’t see motor vehicles anywhere, I’m betting (and it’d be a pretty safe bet) that knives are used to kill more people in NZ then firearms

                      So why demonize something thats not only safe but something you have to get a licence for

                    • weka

                      No-one is demonising firearms. We’re having a conversation about risk assessment and the public good. We also have that conversation about drugs, alcohol, gambling and yes, food and cars and regulate accordingly.

    • vto 6.3

      True mr viper true, about taking crims out of one great big silliness.. namely marijuana …

      However I don’t think it will solve any criminal problem because the gangs and the like will simply crop (pun pun) up somewhere else. This is what they do. Decriminalising marijuana will distort the criminal raising of incomes by gangs to another activity.

      It may provide some criminal easing around the edges by local losers who make some extra pocket money, but they will also crop (pun again) up elsewhere..

      Which of the two above would the local Kawerau chap belong to? The gang? Or the local loser?

      • Colonial Viper 6.3.1

        Yes the gangs will try and raise revenue from other illegal sources, but there is little out there which can replace the $$$$$ from the massive volume of marijuana grown and used in this country.

    • Draco T Bastard 6.4

      all attempts to routinely arm or militarise our police must be resisted.

      QFT

  7. maui 7

    Not too worried about the guns, I don’t see how you could ever keep them out of criminal hands anyway. What about focusing instead on reducing criminal activity with a new economic model that doesn’t drive thousands of people into poverty like the current one does.

  8. adam 8

    Prohibition is just making the gangs rich.

    The police are the poor suckers on the front line fighting a war on drugs that can not be won.

    Just in case you missed it folks – the war on drugs has been going on since Ronald Reagan. No wait… Nixon and that was in 1971.

    So Incredible failure.

    • Draco T Bastard 8.1

      Just in case you missed it folks – the war on drugs has been going on since Ronald Reagan. No wait… Nixon and that was in 1971.

      Since Al Capone actually. First the alcohol and, once prohibition ended, the police needed something else harmless to beat upon to keep the high budgets rolling in.

  9. vto 9

    I always liked bazookas because of their name. Can you buy them in NZ?

  10. Wainwright 10

    Hear hear.

  11. Draco T Bastard 11

    If we free the weed, we can free up our police to catch real criminals and we can strike a blow against both gun culture and gang culture at the same time. So what’s stopping us?

    What’s stopping us seems to be a fundamental inability of our governing body to accept that marijuana shouldn’t have been made illegal in the first place. Regulated like cigarettes and alcohol would have been a much better idea and it’s safer than both of those.

    And then think of the good we could do developing medicines from that freely available weed.

    • sabine 11.1

      @draco t bastard

      And then think of the good we could do developing medicines from that freely available weed.

      …… but there is no profit in freely available.

      but other then that, yes, I firmly believe that making week legal, or tolerated as in the Netherlands would be a vote winner. alas, it seems that the collective body of politicians regardless of colour and affiliation has no spine, not guts, nor anything when it comes to advocating that the evil weed might be a good cash crop if legal.

  12. Stuart Munro 12

    I think the sudden interest in guns is MPs trying to pretend they’re doing something. Scaremongering to justify increased police and surveillance powers perhaps. But of course police should be working more on guns and burglary, and less on traffic and marijuana. VTO, a bazooka may be required to get the benefits of marijuana law reform through Peter Dunne’s thick skull.

  13. Jay 13

    Excellent and very well-written article.

    Nz will eventually follow the example of the US if the model works there, which it sounds like it is.

    If England jumps on board too, then it will certainly just be a matter of time.

    I was 100% in favour of legalizing all drugs before the synthetic cannabis debacle and the trouble caused by it being legal, but my gut tells me this had more to do with cannabis still being illegal. I now agree though with seeing how it works out in the states before we rush into it.

    I don’t want to see cannabis smoked openly on the streets, but if I had to vote on it tomorrow I’d say legalise all drugs, make the harder ones available on prescription, and thereby suck billions out of the gang’s economy.

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    BMG research have unleashed their final poll of the 2019 campaign:Westminster voting intention: CON: 41% (-)LAB: 32% (-)LDEM: 14% (-)GRN: 4% (-)BREX: 3% (-1)via @BMGResearch , 06 - 11 Dec Chgs. w/ 06 Dec That's a bit of a "Dunno why we bothered" sort of poll. "Phillip, I'm afraid I've been a ...
    13 hours ago
  • Grant Robertson Spends Up Large – On The Establishment!
    Grant Keeps On Trucking: Out of the $12 billion Robertson has announced for infrastructure investment, $8 billion will be allocated to specific projects, with the balance of $4 billion held in reserve. What does it say about this Government's "transformational" ambitions that 85 percent of that $8 billion is to ...
    15 hours ago
  • Boris Johnson … Hides … In a Fridge
    I am not making this up.First few lines of the Dail Mail write up:Boris Johnson's exasperated media minder swore on live TV today as the PM refused to speak to Good Morning Britain before trotting into a fridge as he started an early milkround in Yorkshire. Piers Morgan was visibly ...
    23 hours ago
  • Shy Labour Voters?
    In previous elections pollsters have bemoaned the 'shy Tory' - the respondent who is so fearful of being judged as a cruel and heartless bastard by an anonymous pollster, or their spouses, workmates and friends, that they lie about their intention of voting Conservative, skewing the poll figures in Labour's ...
    1 day ago
  • Seven reasons to be wary of waste-to-energy proposals
    Climate Explained is a collaboration between The Conversation, Stuff and the New Zealand Science Media Centre to answer your questions about climate change. If you have a question you’d like an expert to answer, please send it to climate.change@stuff.co.nz I was in Switzerland recently and discovered that they haven’t ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    1 day ago
  • Reviewing the whitewash
    Back in 2015, then Ombudsman Beverley Wakem conducted a review of the OIA, Not a game of hide and seek. The "review" was a whitewash, which found no need for legislative change, and instead criticised the media and requesters - which destroyed Wakem's reputation, and undermined that of the Office ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 day ago
  • You Gov MRP Poll Out
    So, You Gov's MRP poll - the weird one that tries to reflect what will happen at a constituency level and which pretty much nailed the hung parliament in 2017 - is not looking too good for Labour:
    UK #GE2019 MRP seat projection:CON: 339 (-20)LAB: 231 (+20)SNP: 41 (-2)LDEM: 15 ...
    1 day ago
  • Climate Change: Accountability?
    We've known about climate change for over forty years now,and it has been a major political issue for twenty. And yet fossil fuel companies have kept polluting with impunity, while government have looked the other way and twiddled their thumbs and refused to do anything because "the economy", or just ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 day ago
  • Delusional And Irrational: The Rise Of Paranoid Politics In New Zealand.
    Sheer Loopiness: Many of those expressing bemusement at the antics of these #turnardern effacers, were convinced that they were yet another expression of the National Party’s increasingly spiteful anti-government propaganda campaign. They marvelled at the oddness of the perpetrators’ mindset and questioned the common-sense of allowing the rest of New Zealand ...
    1 day ago
  • Things to know about Whakaari/White Island
    Brad Scott, GNS Science VolcanologistThis post was originally published by GeoNet. Following the 9 December devastating eruption at Whakaari/White Island we have put together some information about the island. New Zealand’s most active volcano Whakaari/White Island is currently New Zealand’s most active volcano, it has been since an eruptive episode ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    2 days ago
  • Status quo supports status quo
    The Justice Committee has reported back on its Inquiry into the 2017 General Election and 2016 Local Elections, with a host of recommendations about how to improve our electoral systems. Some of their recommendations are already incorporate din the Electoral Amendment Bill currently before Parliament, but there's also a recommendation ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • The Greens abandon NeoLiberalism
    Back in 2017, in order to make themselves "electable" in the eyes of rich people who oppose everything they stand for, the Greens signed up for NeoLiberalism, adopting a restrictive set of "Budget Responsibility Rules" which basicly prevented them from using government to make things better. Now, they're finally abandoning ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • Lying about a failed war
    Since invading in 2001, the US has consistently claimed that their war in Afghanistan has been going well, even when it continued year after year after year. Of course, they were lying, and thanks to the Washington Post and the US Freedom of Information Act, we get to see just ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • Artificial Intelligence and You
    How should we think about artificial intelligence and the implications that it has for our work and leisure? There are many articles on artificial intelligence and its potential impacts on jobs, and the ethics of applications. These are important topics, but I want to focus on some less discussed aspects, ...
    SciBlogsBy Robert Hickson
    2 days ago
  • Statistical manipulation to get publishable results
    I love data. It’s amazing the sort of “discoveries” I can make given a data set and computer statistical package. It’s just so easy to search for relationships and test their statistical significance. Maybe relationships which ...
    2 days ago
  • More lies on the Twitter (Dan Hodges edition)
    The other big story concerning Leeds Hospital is Boris Johnson's bizzare behaviour at Leeds Hospital, where he was confronted by a journalist and challenged about a four year old boy with suspected pneumonia who was left sleeping on the floor, rather than getting  abed like a sick kid would in ...
    3 days ago
  • LabourActivistPunchedMattHancock’sSPADGate
    So, for a brief period of history, it was alleged that a protester had punched Matt Hancock's SPAD (not a euphemism; special adviser) when Hancock visited Leeds Hospital.This was reported by the likes of Robert Peston and Laura Keunssberg, as well as the less credible Guido Fawkes.  It also quickly ...
    3 days ago
  • France’s anti-Zionism is anti-liberté
    by Daphna Whitmore Last week France passed a law that equates anti-Zionism with anti-Semitism. It is based on a definition of anti-Semitism that includes criticism of Israel such as: “Denying the Jewish people their right to self-determination, e.g., by claiming that the existence of a State of Israel is a racist ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    3 days ago
  • Another bus lockout
    Over the past year we've seen major bus problems in Hamilton and Wellington, as drivers have sought better wages and an end to the bullshit of split shifts, which basicly see them "married to the job". And now its Auckland's turn. When NZBus's drivers planned low-level strike action of not ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • Climate Change: Showing us how its done
    The government has been congratulating itself over the passage of the Zero Carbon Act, which sets out long-term emissions targets. But those targets are insufficient. Meanwhile, Denmark is showing us how its done:Denmark’s parliament adopted a new climate law on Friday, committing to reach 70% below its 1990 emissions in ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • New Fisk
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • Public sector dysfunction should not be allowed to undermine freedom of information
    Another day, another piece of legislation with a secrecy clause. This time its the innocuous-seeming Mental Health and Wellbeing Commission Bill, which (after establishing a new body and making it subject to the OIA in three different ways) includes the rapidly-becoming-standard clauses enabling it to request information from other public ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • “This is England, this knife of Sheffield steel…”
    The state of the United Kingdom is fractured, torn up, shredded. The Empire is gone, it died a long time ago. And yet, the country is still tracking with a lead in favour of the ones who play to the ingrained, class-bound division for political gain. It is a disgrace ...
    exhALANtBy exhalantblog
    5 days ago
  • CORSIA, coming soon to an airport near you
    On 27 September, Greta Thunberg addressed a crowd of 500,000 at the School Strike for Climate in Montreal, saying: “You are a nation that is allegedly a climate leader. And Sweden is also a nation that is allegedly a climate leader. And in both cases, it means absolutely nothing. Because ...
    SciBlogsBy Robert McLachlan
    5 days ago
  • Cloaking hate speech and fake news in the right to free expression.
    It should be obvious by now but let’s be clear: The same folk who regularly traffic in disinformation, misinformation and “fake news” are also those who most strongly claim that their freedom of expression rights are being violated when moves are made to curb hate speech (as opposed to protected ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    5 days ago
  • The Physics (and Economics, and Politics) of Wheelchairs on Planes
    Michael Schulson When Shane Burcaw flies on an airplane, he brings along a customized gel cushion, a car seat, and about 10 pieces of memory foam. The whole arsenal costs around $1,000, but for Burcaw it’s a necessity. The 27-year-old author and speaker — who, alongside his fiancée, Hannah ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    6 days ago
  • To Advance Civil Rights, Oppose Transgender Extremism
    We are very pleased to publish this submission is from Lucinda Stoan. She is a social justice activist, mother, and educator, based in Washington State in the  US.   This detailed and comprehensive source-linked overview of trans issues and what is at stake will be useful for many people, especially in ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    6 days ago
  • Faafoi should be fired
    Newshub last night reported that Broadcasting Minister Kris Faafoi had apparently promised to help out a mate with an immigration issue. While its normal for people to approach MPs for assistance in this area, when you're a Minister, the rules are different: as the Cabinet Manual says, Ministers must "at ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago
  • Adrian Orr – The Reserve Bank’s Revolutionary Governor?
    New Zealand's Underarm Banker: It bears recalling that the “independence” of the Reserve Bank Governor was for decades held up by neoliberal capitalists as the most compelling justification for passing the Reserve Bank Act. Interesting, is it not, how the ruling class’s support for the Bank’s independence lasted no longer than ...
    7 days ago
  • Driving Us Up The Poll.
    Rubbish In, Rubbish Out: Put all this together, and it’s difficult to avoid the conclusion that anyone who responds positively to a pollster’s request to “answer a few questions” is just ever-so-slightly weird. Desperately lonely? Some sort of psephological train-spotter? Political party member primed to skew the poll for or against ...
    7 days ago
  • Jordan Williams, Colin Craig podcast series announced
    “Free at last, Free at last, Thank God almighty we are free at last.” ― Martin Luther King Jr. A long and bitter court feud between former Conservative Party leader Colin Craig and Jordan Williams has been settled, with an apology and compensation from Williams. On Tuesday, Craig sent out ...
    The PaepaeBy Peter Aranyi
    1 week ago
  • How plant-based meat is stretching New Zealand’s cultural and legal boundaries
    Samuel Becher, Victoria University of Wellington and Jessica C Lai, Victoria University of Wellington Earlier this year, the New Zealand-based pizza chain Hell Pizza offered a limited-edition “Burger Pizza”. Its customers weren’t told that the “meat” was plant-based. Some customers complained to the Commerce Commission, which enforces consumer law in ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    1 week ago
  • Scientific integrity requires critical investigation – not blind acceptance
    Some people seem to want to close down any critical discussion of the current research into the relationship between water fluoride and child IQ. They appear to argue that claims made by researchers should not be open to critical review and that the claims be accepted without proper consideration ...
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: The shameful reality
    The government has been congratulating itself over the passage of the Zero Carbon Act, which sets out long-term emissions targets. Meanwhile, Climate Action Tracker has the shameful reality: those targets are insufficient:While New Zealand is showing leadership by having passed the world’s second-ever Zero Carbon Act in November 2019, under ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • More secrecy
    The government introduced a Racing Industry Bill today. As an urban who horse racing as pointless-to-cruel, and gambling as a tax on stupidity and/or hope, this isn't normally a bill which would interest me in the slightest, beyond grumpiness at more government money for a dying industry. But there is ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Unlikely online bully, Liam Hehir
    Check. Check. One, two, three, four. Is this thing ON? Hello readers, I logged in last night (yeah, it’s been a while) to mark THE END of the landmark legal case, Jordan Williams v Colin Craig, which (gulp) reached The Supreme Court, in which New Zealand’s most-defamed man was suing the politician he ...
    The PaepaeBy Peter Aranyi
    1 week ago
  • The Birth Of Israel: Wrong At The Right Time.
    Before The Birth: Israel’s most fervent supporters set their clocks ticking in Biblical times. They cite the kingdoms of David and Solomon as proof that, in the words of the Exodus movie’s theme-song: “This land is mine.” The majority of Israel’s backers, however, start their clocks in 1933 – the year Adolf ...
    1 week ago
  • Hard News: Public Address Word of the Year 2019: Korero phase
    In an unreliable, strange and confusing world, Public Address is proud to present a measure of comfort and stability by annually asking everyone what words or phrases sum up the year that's been – and then giving some of them consumer goods as prizes for being clever or simply lucky.Well, ...
    1 week ago
  • Generalist to specialist
    Both my parents are pretty handy – and they seem to have the right tools for most jobs in the garage and they know how to fix practically anything. A similar story could be told about their generation’s experience in the workforce – being a generalist was not unusual and ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    1 week ago
  • A “coincidence”
    When it was revealed that NZ First had tried to enrich itself from public office via the Provoncial Growth Fund, the Prime Minister assured us that everything was OK as Shane Jones, the Minister responsible for the fund, had recused himself. Except it seems that that recusal came very late ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Member’s Day
    Today is a Member's Day, and probably the last one of the year. After the marathon of the End of Life Choice Act, most of the bills up for debate today are uncontentious. First up is the second reading of Chlöe Swarbrick's Election Access Fund Bill. This will be followed ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Worse than I thought
    The Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee has reported back on the government's odious and tyrannical control orders bill. As expected, the fraudulent select committee process has made no significant changes (partly because they couldn't agree, but mostly because it was a stitch-up from the start, with no intention of ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • The cannabis bill and the referendum
    Yesterday, the government released its draft Cannabis Legalisation and Control Bill, which will be put to a non-binding referendum at the next election. I'm not a drug policy expert, but Russell Brown is, and he thinks its pretty good. And pretty obviously, it will be a massive improvement on the ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Hard News: The Cannabis Legalisation and Control Bill: pretty good so far
    As you're probably aware, the draft bill outlining the proposed legal cannabis regime to be put to a referendum late next year was published yesterday, and has already attracted a flurry of comment. It's notable that a good deal of the comment is about proposals that aren't actually new.A minimum ...
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: Alignment
    One of the big problems in New Zealand climate change policy is the government working at cross-purposes with itself. It wants to reduce fossil fuel use, but encourages oil and gas exploration. It wants to reduce transport emissions, but then builds enormous new roads. The problem could be avoided if ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • How climate change will affect food production and security
    Climate Explained is a collaboration between The Conversation, Stuff and the New Zealand Science Media Centre to answer your questions about climate change. If you have a question you’d like an expert to answer, please send it to climate.change@stuff.co.nz According to the United Nations, food shortages are a threat ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    1 week ago
  • More bad faith
    Last year, the government announced it was ending offshore oil exploration by no longer issuing new permits. The idea was that the industry would then die off as permits expired. Except almost immediately the government revealed its bad faith, by saying they would extend permits and alter conditions to keep ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Banning foreign money from our elections
    The government has said it will ban foreign donations to political parties and candidates, and will be introducing legislation to be passed under all-stages urgency this afternoon. While I agree with the goal, I don't see a particular case for urgency, unless the government is concerned about a flood of ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Reforming the Education Acts
    The government introduced the Education and Training Bill to Parliament yesterday. Its a massive bill, which replaces both existing Education Acts, as well as various other bits of legislation (including some which are still proceeding through the House). I'll leave the serious analysis to teachers and people who actually know ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Bite-sized learning
    Amelia SharmanThere’s no one-size-fits-all when it comes to micro-credentials, those bits of bite-sized learning that can help workers stay on top of technological change.  What’s a micro-credential? While definitions vary, micro-credentials can be understood as short courses that allow people to learn new skills or have an existing competency recognised. ...
    SciBlogsBy Guest Author
    1 week ago
  • “Not The Labour Party We Once Knew.”
    All Smiles Now: Claire Szabo is taking up her presidential role after serving as the CEO of Habitat For Humanity. Which is absolutely perfect! After KiwiBuild was so comprehensively mismanaged by Phil Twyford, the party has not only elected a new president from a thoroughly respectable not-for-profit, but one who ...
    1 week ago
  • Marxist versus liberal methodology on transgender ideology/identity politics
    While much of the NZ left has transitioned to postmodern and identity politics in relation to transgender ideology, there are some very good articles about that deploy Marxist methodology in relation to this subject.  The one below is from the British marxist group Counterfire and appeared on their site here ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Book review: The Farm by Joanne Ramos
    by Daphna Whitmore At Golden Oaks, a luxurious country retreat in the Hudson Valley, pregnant women have the best care money can buy. From the organic food, personalised exercise programmes, private yoga instruction and daily massages Golden Oaks looks like a country lodge for the upper class. Set some time ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Loosening the purse strings
    When Labour was running for election in 2017, it felt it needed to demonstrate "fiscal responsibility" and signed itself up to masochistic "budget responsibility rules". It was a fool's errand: the sorts of voters who demand fiscal responsibility are also the sorts of voters who believe that labour can never ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: How to get there
    Writing in Stuff, Joel MacManus looks at what we need to do to meet the Zero Carbon Act's targets. The core of it:1. Convert 85 per cent of vehicles on the road to electric. 2. Eliminate fossil fuels from all industrial heating up to 300 degrees Celsius. 3. Double our ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • anti-vaxxers in a measles epidemic: so many ways to be untruthful
    “Anti-vaxers are a pro-death movement,” those comments from Dr Helen Petousis-Harris speaking about six more Measles related deaths in Samoa over the past twenty-four hours. “Anti-vaxers are a pro-death movement,” those comments from Dr Helen Petousis-Harris speaking about six more Measles related deaths in Samoa ...
    SciBlogsBy Alison Campbell
    1 week ago
  • Is Youth Vaping a Problem in New Zealand?
    Professors Janet Hoek and Richard Edwards, Emeritus Professor Phil Gendall, Jude Ball, Dr Judith McCool, Anaru Waa, Dr Becky Freeman Recent media reports have presented conflicting evidence on youth vaping in NZ. While some NZ school principals report concerns about increasing vaping on school grounds and confiscating vapes, ASH Year ...
    SciBlogsBy Public Health Expert
    2 weeks ago
  • In pursuit of “Freedom and Democracy”: Forever Wars in “America’s backyard”.
    “America the Beautiful!”, staunch defender of democracy, freedom and… a whole lot of despotic tyrants that play nice with what is called “the Washington Consensus.” America is indeed capable of immense good, but like any Nation, and most assuredly any aspirant to the mantle of Empire, great, immense evil. All ...
    exhALANtBy exhalantblog
    2 weeks ago
  • November ’19 – NZ blogs sitemeter ranking
    Image credit: The beginner’s guide to blogging I notice a few regulars no longer allow public access to the site counters. This may happen accidentally when the blog format is altered. If your blog is ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Whodunnit? Finding the mystery 1080 testing lab
    1080 is used to control pests in NZ. Its use is contested by a noisy few. A new report claims high levels of 1080 in rats washed up on a beach. Flora and Fauna of Aotearoa (F&F) won’t name the laboratory that did their testing. It has sparked a hunt ...
    SciBlogsBy Grant Jacobs
    2 weeks ago
  • Authoritarian Friends, Democratic Enemies.
    What Kind Of Empire? The thing for Kiwis to decide is what kind of empire they want to belong to. The kind that, while offering its own citizens democratic rights, demands absolute obedience from its “friends”? Or, the kind that, while authoritarian at home, takes a relaxed attitude to the ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Boris Johnson Goes Down
    It hasn't been a good week for the Conservatives, pollwise.  All major recent polls are showing their lead shrinking.Comparing each pollster's current (between 29/11 and 22/11) and previous most recent poll.Com Res - Conservative lead down 3 points.You Gov - Conservative lead down 1 point.Kantar - Conservative lead down 4 ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Interesting
    Within quick succession, Countdown maths wizard and twitterer Rachel Riley, alleged comedian David Baddiel and prominent lawyer Andrew Julius have all expressed very similar opinions / ideas:
    These #3billboards are going round London today, organised by ex-Labour people, horrified by what their party has become. Their principles haven’t changed, they’re ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Damn the Polls
    So, there have been a bunch of bad polls out for Labour, and even the Leftie's friend, Survation, have recently given the Conservatives a rip-snorting 11% lead.  You Gov's much vaunted MRP poll - which pretty much nailed the result in 2015 - is currently predicting a comfortable majority for ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Climate Change: Europe declares an emergency
    The European Parliament has voted overwhelmingly to declare a climate emergency:The European parliament has declared a global “climate and environmental emergency” as it urged all EU countries to commit to net zero greenhouse gas emissions by 2050. The vote came as scientists warned that the world may have already crossed ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • A Bi-Partisan Commitment To X-ing “P”.
    Pure Fear: Worse than Heroin, this drug’s addictive power was terrifying. People under its influence didn’t drift off to Elysium. Nor did it persuade inadequate individuals that they could conquer the world. No, this drug – pure crystal methamphetamine, “P” for short – unlocked the gates of Hell itself. It ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Advice about measles: when ignorance is definitely not a virtue
    As the rate of measles infection, and of deaths, continues to climb in Samoa, antivaccination activists infectious disease proponents seem intent on doubling down on their claims about vaccination. (Check pretty much any news-media FB post about measles & you’ll see exactly what I mean.) Unfortunately, some of them have ...
    SciBlogsBy Alison Campbell
    2 weeks ago

  • Government takes bite out of loan sharks
    The days of vulnerable consumers falling victim to loan sharks, truck shops and other predatory lenders are numbered, following the Credit Contracts Legislation Amendment Bill passing its third reading tonight. “Too many Kiwis are being given loans that are unaffordable and unsuitable, trapping them in debt and leaving their families ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 hours ago
  • New Zealand safer as Terrorism Suppression (Control Orders Bill) becomes law
    A Bill that prevents terrorism and supports the de-radicalisation of New Zealanders returning from overseas has passed its third reading, Justice Minister Andrew Little says. The Terrorism Suppression (Control Orders) Bill is a carefully targeted response to manage the risk posed by a small number of New Zealanders who have ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 hours ago
  • Foreign Minister and Pacific Peoples Minister to visit Samoa
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters and Minister for Pacific Peoples Aupito William Sio will travel to Samoa on Friday, where New Zealand medical teams are helping Samoa respond to an outbreak of measles. “New Zealand has been working closely with the Government of Samoa and offering our assistance from the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 hours ago
  • New Pastoral Care Code will support tertiary students in 2020
    The Government has changed the law to improve student safety and welfare in university halls of residence and other student accommodation. The Education (Pastoral Care) Amendment Bill passed its third reading this afternoon and details of an interim Code of Practice setting out the Government’s expectations of tertiary providers have also been released. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 hours ago
  • New infrastructure funding tool to build housing developments faster
    A new tool to help councils fund and finance infrastructure could mean some housing developments happen a decade earlier than currently planned, Urban Development Minister Phil Twyford said today. “This new tool, developed by the Government in partnership with industry and high-growth councils, will allow councils to access private debt ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 hours ago
  • Vision to unite the primary sector launched today
    Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor has welcomed the release of a bold new vision for the country’s vital food and fibre sector. “I’m delighted that New Zealand’s major farmer and grower organisations are today supporting the Primary Sector Council’s vision – Fit for a Better World,” he said. “The international consumers ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    9 hours ago
  • NZ congratulates PNG and Autonomous Bougainville Government on referendum
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has congratulated the Government of Papua New Guinea and the Autonomous Bougainville Government for completing a well-conducted referendum on the future political status of Bougainville. “New Zealand supported the referendum process by providing technical advice through the New Zealand Electoral Commission and leading a Regional Police ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    10 hours ago
  • Next steps for Upper North Island logistics
    In light of Cabinet’s position that freight operations on prime land in downtown Auckland are no longer viable, the Government will now embark on a short work programme to enable decision-making in the first half of next year, Associate Transport Minister Shane Jones says. Minister Jones is today releasing the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    11 hours ago
  • Surgical mesh restorative justice report received
    Associate Health Minister Julie Anne Genter has received the report back from a surgical mesh restorative justice process undertaken by Victoria University. The process heard stories, either in person or online submission, from more than 600 people affected by surgical mesh. “The report made for heart-breaking and confronting reading,” says ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    11 hours ago
  • The Water Services Regulator Bill – Taumata Arowai a milestone for drinking water safety
    The Water Services Regulator Bill – Taumata Arowai , introduced to Parliament today, is a milestone for drinking water safety in New Zealand and will help improve environmental outcomes for urban waterways, rivers and lakes.  “This is a breakthrough for New Zealanders in terms of providing safe drinking water throughout ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    12 hours ago
  • Speech to new direction for criminal justice reform announcement
    Kia ora koutouE ngā mana, e ngā reo, e ngā matā wakaTēnā koutou katoaHaere ngā, moe maiKoutou ma ngā Rangatira Ko Anaru ahauKo au te Minita mo ngā TureHe Honore tino nui kei roto I ahau No reira tena koutou katoa Today, we are releasing two reports that are the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    13 hours ago
  • New direction for criminal justice reform
    The Government is looking to turn around the long-term challenges of criminal justice by taking a new approach to break the cycle of offending to ensure there are fewer victims of crime. Justice Minister Andrew Little released two reports today, Turuki! Turuki! from Te Uepū Hāpai I te Ora, and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    13 hours ago
  • New law sets up $300m Venture Capital Fund
    New Zealand firms expanding beyond the start-up phase are set for more support after today’s passage of the Venture Capital Fund Bill, Associate Finance Minister David Parker said. The Bill, which establishes a $300 million Venture Capital Fund, puts in place a key initiative of the Wellbeing Budget’s economic package. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • New Zealand’s National Statement to COP25
    E ngā mana, e ngā reo, e ngā iwi, e ngā rau rangatira mā. Tēnā koutou, tēnā koutou, tēnā koutou katoa. Señora Presidenta, Excellencies, Delegates. International action A common thread that runs through the Paris Agreement is the commitment we have made to each other to do what we can to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • $12 billion in extra infrastructure investment
    The Government is lifting capital investment to the highest level in more than 20 years as it takes the next step to future-proof New Zealand. Finance Minister Grant Robertson has announced $12 billion of new investment, with $8 billion for specific capital projects and $4 billion to be added to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Strong economy, careful spending gives $12bn of surpluses
    The Government is forecast to run $12 billion worth of surpluses across the four years to 2023/24 as the economy continues to grow. The surpluses will help fund day-to-day capital requirements each year. These include fixing leaky hospitals, building new classrooms to cover population growth and take pressure off class ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Priorities for 2020 Wellbeing Budget outlined
    Budget 2020 will continue the Coalition Government’s focus on tackling the long-term challenges facing New Zealand while also investing to future-proof the economy. When the Government took office in 2017 it was left with crumbling infrastructure, severe underinvestment in public services, degraded rivers and lakes, a housing crisis and rising ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
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