Key out of touch on taxes

Written By: - Date published: 9:30 am, December 14th, 2010 - 37 comments
Categories: class war, gst, john key, tax - Tags: ,

Do you feel better off after the great tax swindle? If you do you’re one of the few lucky ones. Key’s tax cut favoured the rich, and he broke his promise to raise GST for everyone. Net result — bugger all — unless you’re a high income earner. For most people any supposed gains disappeared into inflation, and those with kids are about to get whacked with big increases in childcare costs as well.

So most of us don’t feel any better off, and a couple of recent surveys have picked this up. In November:

A nationwide HorizonPoll survey of 1558 people between November 16 and 19 found 8.2 percent of those surveyed felt better off because of the changes while 53.5 percent thought they were worse off. A substantial group, 35.6 percent, felt their situation was unchanged.

And published yesterday:

The TV3 poll asked voters: Have you noticed your tax cut and what are you doing with it? The result was: 70 percent said they hadn’t noticed any difference, 14 percent said they were spending it, and 12 percent said they were saving it.

The PM is puzzled at our ingratitude:

“I’m a little surprised, actually,” Mr Key said at his post-cabinet press conference today. “The moves we’ve made have had quite an impact on the pay packets of most New Zealanders.”

Can everyone see Key’s problem? He’s operating under a bit of a misconception. The tax swindle hasn’t had “quite an impact on the pay packets of most New Zealanders” at all. It’s had negligible impact. The following graph (stolen from better researchers than I here and here) tells the story:

Folk on the average income or average wage got less than ten dollars a week (twenty a fortnight on the left Y axis). A paltry sum soon eaten up by inflation and increased costs. Its not until $80,000 PA and above that the gains reach even twenty a week. But the real problem for Key is that a vanishingly small proportion of the population have that kind of income (see distribution in the background and right Y axis).

So it’s pretty simple really. Most of us don’t feel better off because most of us aren’t better off. The only surprise is that John Key is so completely out of touch as to fail to understand this.

37 comments on “Key out of touch on taxes ”

  1. Lanthanide 1

    “A nationwide HorizonPoll survey of 1558 people”
    Is this the same self-selecting ‘online panelist’ malarky as the political poll?

    • TightyRighty 1.1

      no, this one is anti-national so it’s 100% correct.

      • bbfloyd 1.1.1

        tr. i took part in that poll. they gave me fullscope to answer as i wanted to. the range of choices went from one end of the spectrum to the other.. the only thing anti national were the people out in reality land who answered how they really felt…..

        try to get over it. i know it’s hard, but in a few years, when you,ve grown up a bit you might just manage it.

    • r0b 1.2

      Probably. But the TV3 poll is harder to dismiss.

      • gobsmacked 1.2.1

        As I pointed out on the other thread, this is the same poll as the party vote poll (TV3, Sunday).

        So if people are claiming the big lead for National as “fact”, they must also accept this as fact. It’s the same people responding. Therefore, National’s tax cuts have failed, according to their own supporters.

        • TightyRighty 1.2.1.1

          Nationals tax cuts failed, but national are still kicking the crap out of labour. if you get ahead of labour by failing, imagine how much further ahead you’ll be by getting it right? what hope does the left have next year?

          • gobsmacked 1.2.1.1.1

            Glad that you agree – the tax cuts failed.

            What does “getting it right” entail?

            • TightyRighty 1.2.1.1.1.1

              weak. your argument sucked and you got pinned for it. do you always ask pathetic questions in response to getting five in the poo?

              • gobsmacked

                @TightyRighty

                Let me help you (although your language suggests it’s a lost cause).

                Many voters choose National over Labour, and John Key over Phil Goff, and also are not satisfied with the tax cuts.

                This is not difficult to comprehend. except possibly for you.

                The public are not switching their vote every five minutes. Many are not engaged with politics at all. But in the election campaign, many will be.

                In 2011, the economy will be a major issue. National have used their trump card. It failed. Perhaps John Key’s personality and photo-ops will prevail. Or perhaps people will be more influenced by their wallet.

                Usually it’s the latter.

                • fizzleplug

                  Isn’t Phil Goff talking about raising taxes again though? With no detail yet either, so we can speculate all we want about what level of income rich pricks earn until he does realise something meaningful.

                  I feel sorry for Goff, he looked so promising under Clark, but elevated to the top he’s lost his way completely.

                • TightyRighty

                  so the question about the trump card, being asked at the same time, suggestes peoples loathing of labour is greater than their desire for money in the pocket

                  • Lanthanide

                    So the political party question was asked in the same poll as the tax cut question?

                    You realise that this poll had National down in the 30’s, the lowest out of any recently released polls. So I wouldn’t exactly be crowing about that if I were you…

        • luva 1.2.1.2

          Gob I don’t think it is anything to be spouting on about. If the tax changes have failed yet Natioanl are still popular, according to the same poll, where does the left go now?

          • fizzleplug 1.2.1.2.1

            Judging from what has been happening within Labour lately – further left?

          • gobsmacked 1.2.1.2.2

            @Luva

            Key is popular. Labour can’t out-Key him, not with Goff or any other leader.

            But they can campaign on substance. On policies. Probably, Key will still win, but on past record, he will win only by promising not to do what the Right wants (see mining, asset sales, nuclear-free etc).

            The more he concedes ground to keep his numbers up, the better. And the angrier the right will get.

            • luva 1.2.1.2.2.1

              completley agree on Labour focussing on Policy rather than Key. Forget about Key altogether. Treat next year like he doesnt exist.

              See my comments in Open mike on this subject

  2. burt 2

    You are better off with Labour where nobody gets a tax cut and fiscal drag is used to make the govt rich while the people get poor. Well that seems to be the alternate universe view of myopic dim-bulbs who don’t understand that as long as we have inflation we need to adjust tax thresholds regularly.

    EDIT: Oops forgot about the tax cut for the racing industry, remember the secret donations that Winston as part of the Labour-led govt didn’t declare – that is how it should be done and probably how Labour want to do it again with the help of their honesty role model Winston.

  3. fizzleplug 3

    I’m sure you’ll say I’m an isolated case and not at all indicative of reality, but I feel (and am) better off after the tax cuts.

    My income is in the $60-65k band
    Not eligible for WFF (or any other “tax credit”)
    I rent, not own, my apartment
    Grocery bill has not significantly increased due to the GST increase.

    I put myself around $20-25 a week better off. Which doesn’t sound like much, but it adds up nicely.

    In fact, this is the first time in around 10 years that a tax cut package has actually provided me anything – the last big tax re-distribution was WFF, which discriminated against middle-income earners without children (of which I am one).

    Edit: tidied up my last sentence

    • TightyRighty 3.1

      ah no it didn’t discriminate against you. It made the country better off by providing needy children with ipods and parents with flash kitchens to cook them lovely meals in. just because you shivered in your flat to pay for the middle class largesse doesn’t make you discriminated against. It makes you a contributing member of society.

      • gobsmacked 3.1.1

        Key has kept WFF. Added to it, in fact.

        You can’t claim the popularity, AND reject the reasons for it.

        • fizzleplug 3.1.1.1

          Yes, well I’d love to see WFF and interest-free student loans thrown out with the Families Commission (and a few other things).

          Dreams are free, like they say.

    • infused 3.2

      Same here. If you are on 65k, you got about $45 or something. So I signed up for Kiwi Saver. Still get left over with $10-15. Happy.

      I think I’m a rich prick. Even on 65k supporting someone who is studying is very hard.

      • Colonial Viper 3.2.1

        You are a rich prick, albeit a poor one. How can that be you ask? The thing is that on $65K p.a. you are almost in the top decile of income earners.

        ~90% of NZ’ers earn less than you.

        That’s how poor the people of this frakin country has become as a few at the top end lord it up.

        • Lanthanide 3.2.1.1

          Isn’t the average household income apparently $78k? I’ve never understood how that works. But anyway, given that, if he’s the sole breadwinner, then technically he’s below average.

          • Colonial Viper 3.2.1.1.1

            Don’t go with ‘average’ anything, go with median.

            Household income takes into account that some households have two (or more) income earners living there.

  4. AB 4

    At least the HorizonPoll researchers give their methodology, sample size, say what factors they have weighted on in order to provide a representative population sample at:
    http://www.horizonpoll.co.nz/page/72/more-than-half-say-they-are-worse-off-after-major-tax-reform

    Seems HorizonPoll is very accurate.

    They say they recruit their online panel by invitation, to match the national population, while others can also opt in if they wish.

    So, like the highly successful UGov in the UK, they can do very accurate research.
    When will TV3 publish the full results of its surveys, and reveal what crtieria they weight on.
    Horizon says it is weighting on six factors, including party vote.

    Time the pollsters fessed up and then we can judge for ourselves who’s being most open and giving the most compelte picture.

    Seems the editors at The National Business Review and Sunday Star Times have decided HorizonPoll is very acurate and continue to publish its work in detail.

    • Lanthanide 4.1

      I believe the Horizon poll was one of the most inaccurate ones at the last election?

      Their recent political one put NZFirst at 6%, and had National far lower than all other recent polls. Sure, their methodology is different (and publicised), but that in itself doesn’t mean it’s any good. Likewise I also wouldn’t tout media picking a story up as meaning that story has merit – more likely in this day and age, it means the story is controversial.

  5. Deadly_NZ 5

    See on the news that the teflon john says because we are all saving the books are screwed….

    Yeah right my bank account reads ohhh shit where’s my glasses all the red is dazzling -00000

    how much further out of touch is he going to become or has he had rose colored contact lenses made?

    • Tanz 5.1

      Key will never understand the lot of the underpaid, the worker, the little guy/gal. How could he, rolling in cash as he does? He may have come from relative poverty, but he sure as heck is never going back to it. Plenty of Kiwis out there will never get free of the mire. Does Key care a toss? Doubt it. Tax cuts for the rich for crying out loud. The rich. This is why I will never understand the Nats, never.

  6. Swampy 6

    I haven’t been swindled. Maybe you have

Links to post

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • NZ – European Union ties more critical than ever
    Your Excellency Ambassador Meredith,   Members of the Diplomatic Corps and Ambassadors from European Union Member States,   Ministerial colleagues, Members of Parliament, and other distinguished guests, Thank you everyone for joining us.   Ladies and gentlemen -    In diplomacy, we often speak of ‘close’ and ‘long-standing’ relations.   ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 hours ago
  • Therapeutic Products Act to be repealed
    The Therapeutic Products Act (TPA) will be repealed this year so that a better regime can be put in place to provide New Zealanders safe and timely access to medicines, medical devices and health products, Associate Health Minister Casey Costello announced today. “The medicines and products we are talking about ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    9 hours ago
  • Decisions on Wellington City Council’s District Plan
    The Minister Responsible for RMA Reform, Chris Bishop, today released his decision on twenty recommendations referred to him by the Wellington City Council relating to its Intensification Planning Instrument, after the Council rejected those recommendations of the Independent Hearings Panel and made alternative recommendations. “Wellington notified its District Plan on ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    11 hours ago
  • Rape Awareness Week: Government committed to action on sexual violence
    Rape Awareness Week (6-10 May) is an important opportunity to acknowledge the continued effort required by government and communities to ensure that all New Zealanders can live free from violence, say Ministers Karen Chhour and Louise Upston.  “With 1 in 3 women and 1 in 8 men experiencing sexual violence ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    11 hours ago
  • Smarter lunch programme feeds more, costs less
    Associate Education Minister David Seymour has today announced that the Government will be delivering a more efficient Healthy School Lunches Programme, saving taxpayers approximately $107 million a year compared to how Labour funded it, by embracing innovation and commercial expertise. “We are delivering on our commitment to treat taxpayers’ money ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    12 hours ago
  • Report provides insights into marine recovery
    New research on the impacts of extreme weather on coastal marine habitats in Tairāwhiti and Hawke’s Bay will help fishery managers plan for and respond to any future events, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. A report released today on research by Niwa on behalf of Fisheries New Zealand ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    14 hours ago
  • NZ to send political delegation to the Pacific
    Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Winston Peters will lead a broad political delegation on a five-stop Pacific tour next week to strengthen New Zealand’s engagement with the region.   The delegation will visit Solomon Islands, Papua New Guinea, Vanuatu, New Caledonia, and Tuvalu.    “New Zealand has deep and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    14 hours ago
  • Low gas production threatens energy security
    There has been a material decline in gas production according to figures released today by the Gas Industry Co.  Figures released by the Gas Industry Company show that there was a 12.5 per cent reduction in gas production during 2023, and a 27.8 per cent reduction in gas production in the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    19 hours ago
  • Defence industry talent, commitment recognised
    Defence Minister Judith Collins tonight announced the recipients of the Minister of Defence Awards of Excellence for Industry, saying they all contribute to New Zealanders’ security and wellbeing. “Congratulations to this year’s recipients, whose innovative products and services play a critical role in the delivery of New Zealand’s defence capabilities, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Speech to the Minister of Defence Awards of Excellence for Industry
    Welcome to you all - it is a pleasure to be here this evening.I would like to start by thanking Greg Lowe, Chair of the New Zealand Defence Industry Advisory Council, for co-hosting this reception with me. This evening is about recognising businesses from across New Zealand and overseas who in ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Speech to the Sixth Annual New Zealand Government Data Summit
    It is a pleasure to be speaking to you as the Minister for Digitising Government.  I would like to thank Akolade for the invitation to address this Summit, and to acknowledge the great effort you are making to grow New Zealand’s digital future. Today, we stand at the cusp of ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Ceasefire agreement needed now: Peters
    New Zealand is urging both Israel and Hamas to agree to an immediate ceasefire to avoid the further humanitarian catastrophe that military action in Rafah would unleash, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says.   “The immense suffering in Gaza cannot be allowed to worsen further. Both sides have a responsibility to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Daily school attendance data now available
    A new online data dashboard released today as part of the Government’s school attendance action plan makes more timely daily attendance data available to the public and parents, says Associate Education Minister David Seymour.  The interactive dashboard will be updated once a week to show a national average of how ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Ambassador to United States appointed
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced Rosemary Banks will be New Zealand’s next Ambassador to the United States of America.    “Our relationship with the United States is crucial for New Zealand in strategic, security and economic terms,” Mr Peters says.    “New Zealand and the United States have a ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New permit proposed for recreational gold mining
    The Government is considering creating a new tier of minerals permitting that will make it easier for hobby miners to prospect for gold. “New Zealand was built on gold, it’s in our DNA. Our gold deposits, particularly in regions such as Otago and the West Coast have always attracted fortune-hunters. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • NZ and the UAE launch FTA negotiations
    Minister for Trade Todd McClay today announced that New Zealand and the United Arab Emirates (UAE) will commence negotiations on a free trade agreement (FTA). Minister McClay met with his counterpart UAE Trade Minister Dr Thani bin Ahmed Al Zeyoudi in Dubai, where they announced the launch of negotiations on a ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • New Zealand Sign Language Week an opportunity for anyone to sign
    New Zealand Sign Language Week is an excellent opportunity for all Kiwis to give the language a go, Disabilities Issues Minister Louise Upston says. This week (May 6 to 12) is New Zealand Sign Language (NZSL) Week. The theme is “an Aotearoa where anyone can sign anywhere” and aims to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Next stop NASA for New Zealand students
    Six tertiary students have been selected to work on NASA projects in the US through a New Zealand Space Scholarship, Space Minister Judith Collins announced today. “This is a fantastic opportunity for these talented students. They will undertake internships at NASA’s Ames Research Center or its Jet Propulsion Laboratory (JPL), where ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • $1.9 billion investment to keep NZ safe from crime
    New Zealanders will be safer because of a $1.9 billion investment in more frontline Corrections officers, more support for offenders to turn away from crime, and more prison capacity, Corrections Minister Mark Mitchell says. “Our Government said we would crack down on crime. We promised to restore law and order, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • OECD reinforces need to control spending
    The OECD’s latest report on New Zealand reinforces the importance of bringing Government spending under control, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. The OECD conducts country surveys every two years to review its members’ economic policies. The 2024 New Zealand survey was presented in Wellington today by OECD Chief Economist Clare Lombardelli.   ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Agreement delivers Local Water Done Well for Auckland
    The Government has delivered on its election promise to provide a financially sustainable model for Auckland under its Local Water Done Well plan. The plan, which has been unanimously endorsed by Auckland Council’s Governing Body, will see Aucklanders avoid the previously projected 25.8 per cent water rates increases while retaining ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Gaza and the Pacific on the agenda with Germany
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters discussed the need for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza, and enhanced cooperation in the Pacific with German Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock during her first official visit to New Zealand today.    "New Zealand and Germany enjoy shared interests and values, including the rule of law, democracy, respect for the international system ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Decision allows for housing growth in Western Bay of Plenty
    The Minister Responsible for RMA Reform, Chris Bishop today released his decision on four recommendations referred to him by the Western Bay of Plenty District Council, opening the door to housing growth in the area. The Council’s Plan Change 92 allows more homes to be built in existing and new ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Speech to New Zealand China Council
    Thank you, John McKinnon and the New Zealand China Council for the invitation to speak to you today.    Thank you too, all members of the China Council. Your effort has played an essential role in helping to build, shape, and grow a balanced and resilient relationship between our two ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Modern insurance law will protect Kiwi households
    The Government is modernising insurance law to better protect Kiwis and provide security in the event of a disaster, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly announced today. “These reforms are long overdue. New Zealand’s insurance law is complicated and dated, some of which is more than 100 years old. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Government recommits to equal pay
    The coalition Government is refreshing its approach to supporting pay equity claims as time-limited funding for the Pay Equity Taskforce comes to an end, Public Service Minister Nicola Willis says.  “Three years ago, the then-government introduced changes to the Equal Pay Act to support pay equity bargaining. The changes were ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Transforming how our children learn to read
    Structured literacy will change the way New Zealand children learn to read - improving achievement and setting students up for success, Education Minister Erica Stanford says.  “Being able to read and write is a fundamental life skill that too many young people are missing out on. Recent data shows that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • NZ not backing down in Canada dairy dispute
    Trade Minister Todd McClay says Canada’s refusal to comply in full with a CPTPP trade dispute ruling in our favour over dairy trade is cynical and New Zealand has no intention of backing down. Mr McClay said he has asked for urgent legal advice in respect of our ‘next move’ ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Stronger oversight for our most vulnerable children
    The rights of our children and young people will be enhanced by changes the coalition Government will make to strengthen oversight of the Oranga Tamariki system, including restoring a single Children’s Commissioner. “The Government is committed to delivering better public services that care for our most at-risk young people and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Streamlining Building Consent Changes
    The Government is making it easier for minor changes to be made to a building consent so building a home is easier and more affordable, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says.      “The coalition Government is focused on making it easier and cheaper to build homes so we can ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Minister acknowledges passing of Sir Robert Martin (KNZM)
    New Zealand lost a true legend when internationally renowned disability advocate Sir Robert Martin (KNZM) passed away at his home in Whanganui last night, Disabilities Issues Minister Louise Upston says. “Our Government’s thoughts are with his wife Lynda, family and community, those he has worked with, the disability community in ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Speech to New Zealand Institute of International Affairs, Parliament – Annual Lecture: Challenges ...
    Good evening –   Before discussing the challenges and opportunities facing New Zealand’s foreign policy, we’d like to first acknowledge the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs. You have contributed to debates about New Zealand foreign policy over a long period of time, and we thank you for hosting us.  ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Accelerating airport security lines
    From today, passengers travelling internationally from Auckland Airport will be able to keep laptops and liquids in their carry-on bags for security screening thanks to new technology, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Creating a more efficient and seamless travel experience is important for holidaymakers and businesses, enabling faster movement through ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Community hui to talk about kina barrens
    People with an interest in the health of Northland’s marine ecosystems are invited to a public meeting to discuss how to deal with kina barrens, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones will lead the discussion, which will take place on Friday, 10 May, at Awanui Hotel in ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Kiwi exporters win as NZ-EU FTA enters into force
    Kiwi exporters are $100 million better off today with the NZ EU FTA entering into force says Trade Minister Todd McClay. “This is all part of our plan to grow the economy. New Zealand's prosperity depends on international trade, making up 60 per cent of the country’s total economic activity. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Mining resurgence a welcome sign
    There are heartening signs that the extractive sector is once again becoming an attractive prospect for investors and a source of economic prosperity for New Zealand, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The beginnings of a resurgence in extractive industries are apparent in media reports of the sector in the past ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Ō-Rākau Remembrance Bill passes first reading
    The return of the historic Ō-Rākau battle site to the descendants of those who fought there moved one step closer today with the first reading of Te Pire mō Ō-Rākau, Te Pae o Maumahara / The Ō-Rākau Remembrance Bill. The Bill will entrust the 9.7-hectare battle site, five kilometres west ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Government to boost public EV charging network
    Energy Minister Simeon Brown has announced 25 new high-speed EV charging hubs along key routes between major urban centres and outlined the Government’s plan to supercharge New Zealand’s EV infrastructure.  The hubs will each have several chargers and be capable of charging at least four – and up to 10 ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Residential Property Managers Bill to not progress
    The coalition Government will not proceed with the previous Government’s plans to regulate residential property managers, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “I have written to the Chairperson of the Social Services and Community Committee to inform him that the Government does not intend to support the Residential Property Managers Bill ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Independent review into disability support services
    The Government has announced an independent review into the disability support system funded by the Ministry of Disabled People – Whaikaha. Disability Issues Minister Louise Upston says the review will look at what can be done to strengthen the long-term sustainability of Disability Support Services to provide disabled people and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago

Page generated in The Standard by Wordpress at 2024-05-08T11:53:49+00:00