Open mike 10/05/2022

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, May 10th, 2022 - 66 comments
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66 comments on “Open mike 10/05/2022 ”

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  1. Jenny how to get there 1
    10 May 2022 at 6:40 am

    Stop the War, an international on-line organising event on May, 12 leading up to the June 25 International Day of Action

    6 AM UTC (6 pm NZ time, I think. Hope I have got that right).

    ​​​​​​​Stop the War in Ukraine!
    Russian Troops Out!
    No to NATO expansion

    Organising meeting for the June 25th International Day of Action for Peace in Ukraine

    MAY 12 AT 5 AM – MAY 12 AT 6 AM UTC+12

    https://www.facebook.com/events/1425882707882530/?ti=ls

    • mikesh 1.1
      10 May 2022 at 8:23 am

      All the protests in the world won't stop this war. Russia will fight to end, and the US will fight to the last Ukranian. It would make more sense to protest against the supply of weapons to the Ukrainians, in the hope of bringing about an early Ukrainian surrender.

      • aj 1.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 9:53 am

        It's going to be interesting when Russia achieves its goals and starts negotiating a ceasefire, won't be too far away.. Peace will not be permitted by the USA.

      • Jenny how to get there 1.1.2
        10 May 2022 at 10:08 am

        mikesh

        10 May 2022 at 8:23 am

        …..protest against the supply of weapons to the Ukrainians, in the hope of bringing about an early Ukrainian surrender.

        Hi Mikesh,

        Do you think stopping the flow of Russian and Chinese armaments to the Vietnamese would have stopped the US invader in Vietnam?

        Stopping the flow of weapons to Ukraine won't stop this war, it will only provide a clear field of fire to one side. The Russian aggressor.

        Richard Nixon campaigned for the US Presidency on the same stop the war platform as yours.

        However Nixon's idea for stopping the war, (same as your idea), was through forcing a surrender. On taking office Nixon, to force the surrender he wanted (and end the war), Nixon began the most intensive bombing campaign of the war.

        Ukraine will not surrender, they cannot afford to.
        Already the Putin regime is recruiting the forces responsible for overseeing the genocide in Syria for the occupation of Ukraine. Ukraine knows the experience of the Syrian people, is what awaits them under Russian occupation. You only have to witness what Russia's ally the Assad regime behaves or how Russia itself behaved in Syria and Chechnya, to know what awaits the people of Ukraine under Russian occupation.

        The Tadamon massacre

        https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2022/apr/27/a-hidden-war-footage-sheds-light-on-horrors-of-war-in-syria-video-explainer

        Even the total subjugation of Ukraine by Russia wouldn't stop this war. This war won't stop until Russia has achieved its full war aims. Which are the denazification of Ukraine, (ie Russia's code word for regime change in Ukraine).
        And the seizure of the whole of the Northern Black Sea Coast of Ukraine as a corridor to the invasion and occupation of Moldova. And for Russian Federation naval supremacy and domination of the Black Sea.

        Russian President Vladimir Putin announced in March that he will approve up to 16,000 fighters from the Middle East to deploy in Ukraine’s Donbas region to support Russian-backed rebel groups.

        https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/4/1/in-syria-moscow-leads-effort-to-recruit-fighters-for-ukraine

  2. adam 2
    10 May 2022 at 6:44 am

    From glitter bombs to cockroaches, what a wonderful way to deal with scammers.

  3. weka 3
    10 May 2022 at 7:53 am

    If you’ve noticed an increase of female violent crime, it’s not women doing this but trans identified males (trans women, or men pretending to be women). Some MSM will include in their report that the offender is male, some like this one don’t.

    “Our Fugitive Apprehension Team, other Detectives and assets are actively looking for this homicide suspect who we believe is armed and dangerous,” said Oakland Sheriff Michael Bouchard. “Please contact 911 if you see her or know of her whereabouts.”

    Ms Taverner has been described as being a white female with purple hair, is 5-ft-2 inches tall, and of a thing build weighing about 115lbs.

    https://twitter.com/independent/status/1523696544930750466

    Taverner is trans. This reporting is dangerous, especially for women. Humans intuitively recognise male from female most of the time. If Taverner dresses typically male they will look male. If they dress typically female then people afraid of or confused by gender ideology rules may find it harder to act appropriately because the rules that TW must be seen and treated as literal women at all times interrupts our instinctive responses atriums safety and safeguarding.

    People need to know what actual sex the dangerous offender is in their area.

    I see zero reason for this degree of inaccuracy in reporting a situation like this.

    I think this is not great for trans women either who just want to get on with their lives. The ideological push is going to backlash and that’s unfair on TW and women alike.

    • Molly 3.1
      10 May 2022 at 7:59 am

      "I see zero reason for this degree of inaccuracy in reporting a situation like this."

      I see zero reason for this degree of inaccuracy in reporting.

      As you mentioned, many transwomen don't support this either, and understand the impact it has on women. Unfortunately, anyone speaking against inclusive reporting guidelines are ignored.

      • Visubversa 3.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 8:47 pm

        The cowardly and captured NZ Herald referred to Toko Shane (Ashley) Winter as a woman and showered him with female pronouns all through his trial, conviction and sentencing for the sadistic torture and murder of a young woman. Winter is serving his sentence in Paremoremo where he belongs. His appeal against his conviction and sentencing has just been denied. To add insult to injury, The Herald left the name of his victim off the list of femicides in their recent article.

        • Molly 3.1.1.1
          11 May 2022 at 10:50 am

          I recall that. It's surreal to read that obvious avoidance of referring to biological sex.

          It seems the Guardian has taken the small opportunity to be brave for this report:

          https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2022/may/10/paedophile-jailed-trying-groom-children-social-media?CMP=share_btn_tw

          A paedophile has been jailed for 10 years after using social media to groom children.

          Rachel Fenton, who police said was known as Richard Fenton when arrested and charged, pleaded guilty to 21 child sexual abuse offences and a drug offence and was sent to a male prison.

          The Guardian understands Fenton was living as a man when arrested in November 2020 and was later charged under that name.

          But during the sentencing hearing on Monday, Manchester Minshull Street crown court heard Fenton had changed their name and was in the process of transitioning to become a woman.

          What could have prompted Richard to initiate transition? Could it be the possibility of lighter sentencing and if convicted, being housed in the women's estate?

  4. weka 4
    10 May 2022 at 8:02 am

    Women are not even non-males and birthing bodies now. We’re an it.

    https://twitter.com/bettysea_/status/1522364378997215234

    the woman gestating and delivering a baby to this man is his sister.

    She’s not a mother, she’s a machine.

    • JO 4.1
      10 May 2022 at 10:38 am

      Regard our cute replica placentas! Flaunting our blood tie without needing to admit it? And why do you mutter about Georgia O'Keefe, who's that? Anyway, how very dare you question our ineffable bravery – who do you think you are, our mothers?

    • foreign waka 4.2
      10 May 2022 at 10:42 am

      Next step Burka?

    • Molly 4.3
      10 May 2022 at 10:53 am

      Are we missing an opportunity for a pithy chant here?

      "It's Rights Are Women's Rights!".

      I'll alert the press.wink

      • Molly 4.3.1
        11 May 2022 at 10:55 am

        In fact, the "it" he casually refers to turns out to be his sister.

        Not likely to be a commercial arrangement, but one with its own considerations, not helped by referring to his sister as an 'it'.

        Have to change the chant, though.

        Have only my 70s and 80s music tastes to draw on for creative thought:

        "Sisters Are Doing It For Them Bros" or

        "We Are Family, I've Got All My Itsers With Me".

        Showing my age, and hopefully also, my mild disdain.

  5. Molly 5
    10 May 2022 at 8:19 am

    So… there has been a successful example dealing with the safety of incarcerated transwomen (and other vulnerable males) that has been going since 2014, which doesn't require the women's prison estate to accommodate.

    Who'd have thought such a solution was possible?

    (Apart from those that suggested it, that is.)

    At the Los Angeles County Men's Central Jail, a separate wing exists for gay, bisexual, and transgender inmates. Since its creation, the unit has gained a reputation as one of the safer, community-oriented units.

    But getting in isn't easy. A series of questions, past incarcerations, arrest records, and resources are utilized to determine whether an inmate can be classified for this special unit. If one doesn't pass, it's back to the general population.

    The unit, known as the K6G, is home to approximately 360 GBT inmates. It was established in 1985 after the ACLU filed a lawsuit urging for the protection and prevention of assault against LGBT inmates.

    Video included in the link:

    https://www.kcet.org/shows/socal-connected/clip/life-behind-bars-for-gbt-inmates-at-the-k6g

  6. AB 6
    10 May 2022 at 8:57 am

    Moral panic over kids doing ram-raids mounts – meanwhile adults engaged in stealing much more money just as brazenly via wage subsidy fraud goes almost unnoticed.

    These are adults, so we can't blame their parents; they will be upstanding members of the community so we cannot point at material deprivation and childhood abuse. Their criminality seems to be entirely their own.

    But nobody is saying "where are the police?" or demanding that we "get tough on business". Why am I not seeing the shouty headlines about the disgraceful state of business ethics?

    Or maybe I am confused and this is just entirely normal and expected – and the way things have always worked. In which case, these ram-raiding kids are just expressing our real core 'values' and should be praised for such an exquisite understanding of them.

    • foreign waka 6.1
      10 May 2022 at 10:49 am

      2 wrongs do not make one right. How would you feel if you invested 20 years of your life working 7 days 12 hr weeks and some snotty kid destroy's it all for a thrill? That's all good? No, not at all. Solution: Why not get the army involved with stay in camps for 6 to 8 months? Discipline, contributing and getting to be part of a bigger society has to be thought. To just neglect this is like believing that a wild wolf will be one day your cuddly buddy.

      And just for the record, I am certainly – with exclamation mark – for the prosecution of those who stole a good porting of 16 billion dollars from the NZ Public. If only … same softly softly now courage, no ethics, no honesty approach. Go figure.

      • AB 6.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 11:02 am

        Agree with everything you say – and that's not in conflict with my original comment. I was pointing out the inconsistent ideological and media treatment of two different types of criminality – based on the social class and ethnicity of those committing the offences.

        • foreign waka 6.1.1.1
          10 May 2022 at 11:17 am

          Media is just going for sound bites. They are not trustworthy, I equate them to the same profession as car sales people. Anybody thinking they are, is very much mistaken. I don't even watch the news anymore. The language pattern used is sometimes cringeworthy, peppered with political correctness and so highly manipulative. Perhaps we can exclude some sport and the weather forecast, maybe 🙂

      • Molly 6.1.2
        10 May 2022 at 11:36 am

        I have family members in the Defence Force, that have had experience at being the trainers for LSVs (Limited Service Volunteers). The inclusion of young people redirected from the Justice System, or the benefits system impacts on those who are looking for an idea of what army life is like, and doesn't often produced the desired results of change from strict discipline and routines.

        I agree that both issues can and should be addressed.

        I think army discipline can work for some, but for many, it doesn't address the wider issues. They need specific programmes that address any addictions, trauma, environment and understanding of opportunities available and lost due to behaviour.

        • foreign waka 6.1.2.1
          10 May 2022 at 1:42 pm

          Does this mean for the parents or kids – just being sarcastic mind you.

          We need somewhere to start and address this. Doing nothing is not an option.

          • Molly 6.1.2.1.1
            10 May 2022 at 3:37 pm

            Agree.

            But there is a marked difference between just doing something and doing something effective. Unfortunately we often aim for the former without taking time for consideration.

            • Foreign waka 6.1.2.1.1.1
              10 May 2022 at 6:31 pm

              What would you suggest?

              • Molly …
                10 May 2022 at 7:11 pm

                I think you need a specialised unit for youth involving people from all types of disciplines. Therapists, skills training, and people finding opportunities or jobs for when they leave. Unfortunately, unless there is some way to give them a way out of their current life when they exit they programme, they will often go back to their habitual ways when they return. Jim Moriarty was involved in a programme years ago, and I attended one of the graduation events, as a relative was involved with sending students there from a high school. It was a six-week residential, and those completing the programme were energised, engaged individuals. I recall the talk afterwards being about how Jim Moriarty tried really hard to have a forward path for them all, because it became so much harder for his students when they returned home. I can't recall the name of the programme, sorry. (Just had a look, and it seems that he was able to get funding for a permanent programme – which was closed down in 2011 after allegations of sexual abuse, and failures of safeguarding. It's a problem with no simple solutions. https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/110729832/news-drama-school-failed-to-keep-troubled-kids-safe-js-).

                I'm just against utilising existing programmes set up for young people actually interesting in joining the Defence Force as a pseudo punishment for them. The trainer/supervisor said the inclusion of such people created an off putting environment for those that did want to be there. They also had to deal with outsiders being called in by the young offenders, deliveries of drugs, assault and concealed weapons. They preferred working with people who wanted to be in the army, not act as de-facto prison or rehabilitation officers. They are not trained to do this either.

                • Foreign waka …
                  10 May 2022 at 8:41 pm

                  That sounds like a good program, a wrap around set up so to speak. It is almost impossible to redirect young people if they go back where the started from creating the very reason they are there in the first place.

                  Perhaps a kind of boarding school might be the answer. It would also take care of nutritional aspects too? Maybe?

                  • Molly …
                    11 May 2022 at 10:33 am

                    I attended a graduation late 1990's early 2000's when he was still trying to get funding, course by course. IIRC, he deliberately tried to employ graduates whenever he could in order to give them gainful employment away from their home environment.

                    One very powerful part of the presentation, was when participants stood up to read letters of personal histories. For various easily comprehended reasons, the history of one was read by another. I remember vividly the delivery of one history read by a tall, imposing young man. It told of the gambling addiction of the father, who used to hold poker games at his house attended by a regular crew. Starting from the age of five, this young girl was added to the stakes when her father ran out of money. This sexual abuse by strangers continued for years.

                    These programmes need the expertise and employment of very competent safeguarding and health and safety officers. And they need to be given authority to challenge and conduct investigations by the book. I think that's an improvement that could be made to ensure that programmes that are succeeding in one major outcome, are not let down by failure of basic, necessary housekeeping structures.

  7. Blazer 7
    10 May 2022 at 9:03 am

    Short memories and the ubiquitous success of social media look like making Ferdinand Marcos the 2nd new President of the Phillipines.

    Campaigned on tackling poverty and corruption!angryDemocracysad

    From CBS…'

    Manila — Millions of voters headed to the polls in the Philippines Monday, propelling the namesake and son of former dictator Ferdinand Marcos to an early lead in his bid to bring his family back to the top of the country's political hierarchy. Amnesty International estimates that during the elder Marcos' two-decade reign — about half of which the nation spent under Marial Law — some 70,000 people were jailed, 34,000 tortured, and more than 3,000 killed.

    "What the Marcoses have done is basically propagate an alternative history of the Martial Law period as a period of peace, progress, and prosperity," Sheila Coronel, a veteran Philippine journalist and professor at the Columbia School of Journalism, told CBS News. '

    • Scud 7.1
      10 May 2022 at 10:20 am

      It's more to do with population demographics & the way old mate Marcos used SM.

      The Philippines has a very young population 18- 39yrs makes around 40-45% of the total population (from memory) & are very social media savvy compared to the cohort of older voters in the Philippines.

      Marcos delivered his election pitch around SM by recasting the legacy of the Marcos Family in particular his Dad to these younger voters. As the younger voters never lived under the Macros Regime & nor understand what the family did to the country.

      As a result, he's been able to manipulate this cohort of younger voters to vote for him. As he only needs around 30-35% of the Young vote & the same with the older voters to win.

  8. SPC 8
    10 May 2022 at 10:37 am

    Chinese police are using modern psy ops tech on dissidents – but of course none of this is done in the West to discredit anyone …



  9. arkie 9
    10 May 2022 at 10:39 am

    Please sign Consumer NZs petition for Govt intervention in the supermarket duopoly:

    Every day, the major supermarkets are taking more than $1 million in excess profits from our collective back pockets.

    Excess profits mean you pay more than you should at the checkout.

    New Zealanders deserve better but the Commerce Commission’s recommendations don’t go far enough.

    We need more competition to drive down prices and give consumers better choices.

    https://campaigns.consumer.org.nz/supermarkets#sign-the-petition

    • foreign waka 9.1
      10 May 2022 at 10:59 am

      Arkie, this is very noble as a concept. But you do realise that NZ supermarkets are all Franchised? This means that the parent company demands every higher "fees" to satisfy their shareholders and this keeps the profit line always at the same % year in year out for the person running the business. There is, in other words a ceiling to how much these proprietor can earn. Of cause no one will talk about that.

      If anyone needs to be held to task than it is the body corporate and also the distribution chain for local produce and meat. I mean we are paying overseas pricing but we don't get overseas wages. Do we?

      My feeling is that this is the reason the government and commerce commission has not acted. The ones to offend are too large to handle.

      • arkie 9.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 11:26 am

        NZ supermarkets are all Franchised?

        Incorrect. Countdowns’ are wholly owned by Woolworths NZ.

        While the other brands have majority franchised stores there also remain some non-franchised supermarkets under those brands.

        The duopoly uses its buyer power to drive prices down at the farmgate and thereby ensure excessive profits, that as the Commerce Commission noted exceed $1 million a day.

        Action is required and if signing a petition can help provide the impetus then it’s an easy win.

        • Blazer 9.1.1.1
          10 May 2022 at 11:35 am

          Only $1million a day for supermarkets?Sounds way too little.

          Look at the banks profits,getting exported….unbelievable.angry

          • dv 9.1.1.1.1
            11 May 2022 at 10:41 am

            I saw on the news? that it was excess profit of 1m per day.

            ($1m per day is abt 20c per person per day)

            • Blazer 9.1.1.1.1.1
              11 May 2022 at 12:41 pm

              Thats what is reported….'New Zealand supermarkets are comprised of three main chains, Countdown (~150 stores), New World Market (~140 stores), and Pak'nSave (~60 stores), along with several small chains. The five largest supermarkets in New Zealand are run by two companies, Foodstuffs, and Woolworths NZ.

              I find it hard to believe…that's an ave of around $1million profit per store=$19,000 odd per week.(350 stores)

  10. joe90 10
    10 May 2022 at 11:54 am

    Respect to who. The Red Army soldiers who invaded Poland during Stalin's and his Austrian mate's effort to divvy up the country? Or the Red Army soldiers who liberated Poland so it could spend 42 years as Soviet satellite state?

    https://twitter.com/AP/status/1523650262350667777

  11. Woolly Mammoth 11
    10 May 2022 at 12:18 pm

    Eternally grateful you were never my History lecturer, joe90.

    A low blow at the people who broke the back of Nazism. Truly unworthy comments.

      • Scud 11.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 12:52 pm

        Or during & after the Warsaw Uprising was quite telling at how the Soviets conducted themselves. Then Post war with the returning Polish expats who serve with the British/ Commonwealth Forces who were treated like a 5th Columnists by the Soviets and the Polish Communist Party.

    • joe90 11.2
      10 May 2022 at 12:46 pm

      On 17 September 1939, the Red Army broke the 1932 Soviet–Polish Non-Aggression Pact and invaded Poland. The Red Army returned on January 17 1945 to occupy Poland.

      This is how Central Eastern Europe remembers 1945.

      • foreign waka 11.2.1
        10 May 2022 at 2:00 pm

        I just like to make the point that all wars are proxy fights for those in power and with money. None of the wars are for "democracy" or "decency" or "morality" or "for a better future" etc…. We are not learning seemingly, still haven't figured it out.

    • Jenny how to get there 11.3
      10 May 2022 at 1:44 pm

      The Russian Federation is not the Soviet Union.

      The only back the Russia Federation has been breaking, is the back of the Syrian opposition, on behalf of Assad fascism, and the Russian Federation’s own geo-political imperial interests.

  12. Jenny how to get there 12
    10 May 2022 at 12:18 pm

    Save The Date: Auckland Anti-War March. June 5th, 2022. 12pm.

    In any weather, join this march from Aotea Sq to Auckland Domain.

    March for peace and self-determination for the Ukrainian people, against war and authoritarian regimes!

    Organised by the Auckland Ukrainian community.

    The march is to start with any weather at Aotea Sq. 12:00 noon, and go to the War Memorial Museum at Auckland Domain, with 40 – 45 minutes final meeting by the Museum

  13. Woolly Mammoth 13
    10 May 2022 at 12:44 pm

    Pataua4life, even if that supremely unreliable source is 100% correct, it does not diminish the gargantuan sacrifice of Soviet peoples in WW2 (including Ukrainians).

    Seems the master race who are the 'collective West' have found new Untermenschen.

    • Pataua4life 13.1
      10 May 2022 at 2:52 pm

      WM – I don't disagree that the Eastern Europe bore the brunt of the Nazi aggression and the Russian in particular did the most to push back the invaders which makes it all the more ironic that now the Russian are behaving like the Nazi invaders.

      Even more ironic when Hitler invaded Russia to defeat the Bolshevik's. Now Putin uses the exact same excuse Hitler did using the exact same language.

      Putin is a Nazi in a suit not a uniform. that is the only difference. I guess given Putin background we should call him Himmler.

      • Blazer 13.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 8:30 pm

        ' Now Putin uses the exact same excuse Hitler did using the exact same language.'

        What am I missing here…your statement does NOT make ..sense.

  14. RP Mcmurphy 14
    10 May 2022 at 12:59 pm

    it is time for the would be policy wonks and other intaleksalls to get their collective arses into gear and start reading their weekly giveaways and provincial tabloids which contain daily opinion pieces and editorials by right wing operatives like clare trevatt, mathew hooten and cake hoaxby. their utterances are a virtual torrent and need countering cogently and forcefully. get to work and flog them for free.

  15. mikesh 15
    10 May 2022 at 1:36 pm

    In Syria the Assad regime is under attack from various outside forces, Hezbolla, ISIS probably, and of course Uncle Sam has his grubby mitts in there as well. Russia has been fighting wars in Chechnyna at various times for centuries. The problem with Chechnya is that it represents a main gateway to Russia, and one which the Ottomans would have had to pass through if they were to invade Russia. In Putin's time Chechnya was infiltrated by ISIS terrorists, – Chechnyans are Muslims – a circumstance which Putin understandably felt he had to react to.

    I don't think the Russians would want to take over Moldova, though the latter should probably maintain a neutral stance.

    As for Nixon. He manged to get himself forced out of office, I seem to recall.

    • Jenny how to get there 15.1
      10 May 2022 at 2:08 pm

      The Spanish Civil War was to Nazi Germany, what the Syrian revolution is to Russia.

      The German Nazi invasion was to Poland , what the Russian Federation invasion is to Ukraine.

      The first was ignored by the world, the Second became the ground zero for world war.

      You said so yourself Mikesh. Russia will not stop this war.

      Russia will not stop this war unless they are stopped by one of two things, either by a broad front international anti-war peace movement, spanning both sides, or by something much worse.

      mikesh

      10 May 2022 at 8:23 am

      All the protests in the world won't stop this war. Russia will fight to end

      All the protests in the world will stop this war. They must, before this war becomes a global conflagration.

  16. Peter 16
    10 May 2022 at 3:11 pm

    On seeing Mark Mitchell a couple of times recently, I was disappointed he didn't get to be Leader of the Opposition. Previously he'd come across as a bit like a rock on the foreshore but without the personality of it. The latest sightings have confirmed that.

    He might be a most charming, quick-witted and effervescent character. If so I congratulate him on his skills of disguise.

  17. Jenny how to get there 17
    10 May 2022 at 3:33 pm

    Four more settlements to east of Kharkiv have been wrested from Russian control and liberated today.

    That should piss off the Ukraine can't win and should surrender now crowd.

    https://liveuamap.com/

    • Ad 17.1
      10 May 2022 at 5:59 pm

      Little point gaining the whole of the Kharkiv oblast when you are about to lose the whole of the Donbass. Ukraine better watch its' over-extended front line.

  18. Ad 18
    10 May 2022 at 3:51 pm

    It's pretty weird when the AA, Chamber of Commerce, Greater Auckland, the Helen Clark Foundation and plenty of others all supporting a tax every time you take the car into town (at peak times).

    Move Forward With Congestion Charging But Put Fairness In The Driver’s Seat, Says Helen Clark Foundation & WSP NZ | Scoop News

    This is a move to make better use of the motorway at peak, push people onto public transport, and raise a bit of revenue as well.

    Presumably the Minister of Transport who lives in central Auckland will pick this up into the required legislation.

    • Sabine 18.1
      10 May 2022 at 5:40 pm

      And that will come in right after the half price public transport goes back to fullprice?

      Poor worker of akl who pays for his full commuter costs, sucks to be you in public transport and private transport as you will be fleeced.

      Who will not pay for this?

      The dudes/and non males of the AA, Chamber of Commerce, Helen Clarke Foundation, Greater Auckland, Ministers and such will all just use their tax payer funded vehicles, with the tax payer funded gasoline/electricity and the tax payer funded congestion charge. Or the big businesses that cause a lot of that pollution who will simply write of this 'congestion charge' on their tax bill as an expense, no worry sir, no not at all the Tax Payer provided and payeth.

      Non of them will pay just even one cent of this charge and thus they have no issue with it.

      But sure it sounds like something is being done. lol Done again to the working poor.

      • Ad 18.1.1
        10 May 2022 at 5:58 pm

        9 days to find out what will happen to the Public Transport 50% discount. My suspicion is that it will be permanent. It is hugely popular in Auckland.

        Also surprising that the $8000 subsidy for electric cars is one fo the most popular policies this government has generated. Electric car sales are now over 20% of all vehicle sales, and sales of utes has plummeted now that the ute tax is in.

        The report from the Helen Clark Foundation shows that those coming into the CBD every day are mostly from wealthy suburbs. Less well off are in the southern and western areas, going from job to job and far less within the CBD.

        I also suspect you will something in the Budget on the company vehicle and whether it's still attracting any tax benefit at all.

        • Sabine 18.1.1.1
          10 May 2022 at 7:06 pm

          You know what, if i were a rich person who could spend 30.000 + on a car outright, i too would have the 8000 courtesy of the tax payer, i means like, take a family of five (a rich family of course) and that subsidy will get you a brand new car for free!!! What is not to like, maybe we should ask Mike Hoskin and his wife and the kids. I wonder if they all drive a brand new electric car 🙂

          Or like the dude that got his car and then sold it on Trade Me for a tidy profit of 8000. Mind, that is just kiwi ingenuity and a right entrepreneural spirit.

          So yeah, if you are rich, and NZ has rich people, that is a little give a way that is nice to have.

          As for the utes, that is just people now not buying a car, maybe they are too poor for the non existing electrice utes? So they might be saving up for that vehicle when it comes available, i am sure at that stage no 'incentives' will be made available.

          The Helen Clark foundation, can you link to that? I used to live in the 'richer' subburbs, simply because the extra in rent was cheaper then the time wasted in the car and the cost of the maintenance. And i have always considered my time to have a cost/price.

          And i do hope that that report from the Helen Clarke Foundation is from times before the pandemic when people actually still had to travel to the CBD and surrounding areas.

          Not sure how much value a report about travels into town from the outer suburbs make sense when mostly everyone is working from home, has spend several month in lockdown over a 2 year period and had strict 5 km radius rule , and people generally move less then they used too thanks to Covid. That report would be not very realistic unless of course that is the intended outcome to pretend that this will be something 'rich' people will pay cause rich people travel more to the CBD. LOL. If working remote is going to be an ongoing thing in the future – and the occasional lockdown, then the CBD are going to be dead and deserted, and then you will need to find a different way to milk the worker in order to get that 'congestion charge' of the workers.

          But this charge will only be paid for by the working public who will have to travel by car to the CBD as they are the only ones that pay the full cost of everything without any chances of write offs. Those that have public transport available will use that if they can afford it. And that is the big question, and fwiw, they could have announced the half price forever with the announcement of the congestion charge. But they did not. I wonder why?

          And let me just remind you that National/Act will follow this labour government, do you really believe that any removal of business write offs etc in regards to transport/cost of transport will stand? I might have a bridge in Northland on sale for you, its double laned and has a kauri on either side too.

        • Molly 18.1.1.2
          10 May 2022 at 8:05 pm

          Congestion charges work in cities like London, where the public transport systems are well established, accessible, affordable and efficient. So the congestion charges mostly fall on those who choose to drive in London, and have the money to afford the car and the parking.

          This is not the case in Auckland. The public transport system is neither accessible, affordable or efficient for those in the outer regions. For students travelling into Auckland to study it is abysmal. They have a choice of three-four hours commute into town, at quite a high cost OR trying to find accommodation in town while studying. Adding to the student loan.

          The electric car subsidy might have been 'popular' but was a discount for those who could already afford an electric car but couldn't be bothered getting one. A more equitable policy would have been to offer free registration for those with electric vehicles (particularly rewarding the early adopters), which would have been a small recognition, but a just one.

          The fuel tax for Aucklanders also affected the wage earners who had to travel distances more. They were more likely to be those who lived where they could afford, and commuted by car because that was the cheapest and most timely (or only option). Those who voted it in most likely travelled short distances, in cars or by transport paid by their employers. Our representatives only representative a particular demographic.

          • Ad 18.1.1.2.1
            10 May 2022 at 9:10 pm

            Yup agree getting beyond Stage 4 is no place to live in Auckland without a car. Except North Shore. They have the best PT of anyone in t he country.

            You won't have to sorry about congestion charges being a reality until at least 2025 which is when CRL completes. Or if National get in it will be never.

            Everyone is subsidised up the wazoo in Auckland on transport – every time you buy a ticket, use a road, ride a bike or buy an electric car. Very little point arguing about what is more or less 'equitable' after 70 years of road investment dominance.

            • Molly 18.1.1.2.1.1
              11 May 2022 at 10:38 am

              "Everyone is subsidised up the wazoo in Auckland on transport – every time you buy a ticket, use a road, ride a bike or buy an electric car. Very little point arguing about what is more or less 'equitable' after 70 years of road investment dominance."

              Transport – for those who are struggling – is only part of the hits that they have currently. It is compounded by housing costs, rising utilities and food costs, rising petrol costs, etc.

              To say that everyone is "subsidised" by the priorities of governments to spend money in certain ways is missing the point. Taxes are collected to deliver services. You can refer to them as government delivered services, or subsidised services, but they are the same.

              What is apparent is that successive governments, and councils have had little care to make a priority of looking after the most financially vulnerable in any of these necessary areas. Even when they do look at issues like housing costs, and transport, they still ignore the impact on those with lower incomes – and fewer choices.

  19. Foreign waka 19
    10 May 2022 at 6:50 pm

    https://youtu.be/DpE5cBgl11U

    Something to think about?

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