Who said it better?

Written By: - Date published: 9:40 am, July 20th, 2016 - 74 comments
Categories: us politics - Tags: ,

And the Republication convention descends further in to farce:

74 comments on “Who said it better? ”

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  1. shorts 1
    20 July 2016 at 9:58 am

    sigh who really cares…. the world is vastly more interested in the Tay Tay vs Kayne / Kardashian

    both are vacuums to which one must not be drawn into

  2. Chooky 2
    20 July 2016 at 10:03 am

    imitation is the sincerest form of flattery…who cares?

  3. Anne 3
    20 July 2016 at 10:06 am

    I heard a snippet on RNZ this morning to the effect that according to Trumps’s campaign manager… it’s absurd to say the speech was plagiarised. It was just “common” language being used and Hillary Clinton is to blame. She’s the one who made the claims.

    Funny that. As far as I know Clinton hasn’t opened her mouth on the subject. Too gobsmacked I imagine.

    • Murray Simmonds 3.1
      21 July 2016 at 7:23 am

      “As far as I know Clinton hasn’t opened her mouth on the subject. . . .”

      Anne: You think HRC needs to state publicly whatever she wants to be pushed in the media at any particular time?

      Like she ain’t got no publicity-spending money behind her?

      • Anne 3.1.1
        21 July 2016 at 9:48 am

        Err… Murray Simmonds, mountain out of a molehill? Just a tongue-in-cheek remark alluding to the Trump Campaign manager making the ludicrous claim it was Clinton… what done it.

  4. Draco T Bastard 4
    20 July 2016 at 10:15 am

    The most interesting point here that no one seems to have noticed is that Republican plagiarised a Democrat to try and win votes.

    • Colonial Viper 4.1
      20 July 2016 at 11:00 am

      That and Trump wore a BLUE tie on day 1

      • marty mars 4.1.1
        20 July 2016 at 12:16 pm

        Best comment on that I’ve read

        “It means he is either a Putin follower and commie plant, sleeper cell or he is a Clinton supporter.”

        • Colonial Viper 4.1.1.1
          20 July 2016 at 12:30 pm

          This is the take of my political team and you heard it hear first:

          Donald Trump is trolling the Republican Party. He has been since the beginning.

          And surprisingly, they are going to respond by making him President.

          • marty mars 4.1.1.1.1
            20 July 2016 at 12:47 pm

            Hmmm maybe – seems like a classic sleeper cell scenario to me. The proof will be when he is elected and he does things he said he wouldn’t do and doesn’t do what he said he’d do. Might pay to bookmark this thread ☺

    • leftie 4.2
      20 July 2016 at 5:06 pm

      Similarly, right wing organisations like Key’s mate David Farrar’s “Taxpayer’s Union” for example, (right wingers hate unions with a passion), all use socialist wording to make themselves more acceptable and appealing to the wider public.

  5. ianmac 5
    20 July 2016 at 10:22 am

    Mind you do we think Key writes his own speeches? Or any other MPs. While not plagiarised there is no doubt that the history of the speeches of others are taken into account. The pattern from Churchill or Hitler etc is similar based on 3.
    1.”We wil dah dah dah..
    2. We will also dah dah dah
    3. And then we will conquer (destroy or create etc) the whole country!
    Cheers! Cheers! Hurrah!
    And on top of that very little of speeches is usually remembered. More the delivery, confidence and pacing.

    • weka 5.1
      20 July 2016 at 11:00 am

      yeah, but as you say it’s not plagiarism. Plagiarism is an actual thing, and that’s what’s being criticised.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 5.2
      20 July 2016 at 11:56 am

      Nothing wrong with using a speechwriter. What’s wrong is when they write something you don’t believe and you say it anyway. With conviction.

  6. Sabine 6
    20 July 2016 at 10:43 am

    i did it mine self: http://www.today.com/news/melania-trump-convention-speech-i-wrote-it-little-help-possible-t100942

    i did it with help and the help is to blame: http://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-jr-blames-speechwriters-for-melania-trumps-convention-speech/

    my little pony did it: http://edition.cnn.com/2016/07/19/politics/sean-spicer-melania-trump-my-little-pony/

    and then the whole thing is just farcical. Why not say something like, I was really inspired by this and this is why i have used it.
    Why pretend and lie……heck that is the stupidity that gets me.

    As for the Hillary Camp, they have not said a thing. But twitter is having fun, and frankly when you lost the little pony one should just rethink this whole thing.

    https://twitter.com/tarastrong/status/755507707956826114 btw Tara Strong is the voice of one of the ponies.

    • Rodel 6.1
      20 July 2016 at 11:10 am

      Plagiarism? What’s new?

      “Ask not what your country can do for you – ask what you can do for your country.”- John F Kennedy, inaugural address- 1961.

      “Are you a politician asking what your country can do for you or a zealous one asking what you can do for your country?”- Khalil Gibran- 1925.

      But MT’s speech was pretty dumb.

      If had been an assignment in academia it would be failed as plagiarism but the Trumpists (Trumpeters?) will convince their believers that it’s unimportant -a bit like the authenticity of Trump University.

  7. Colonial Viper 7
    20 July 2016 at 10:54 am

    Someone definitely plagarised those sentences.

    Still, it’s less than a minutes talk time out of a total 15 minute speech. Meh.

    • marty mars 7.1
      20 July 2016 at 10:56 am

      I dont think a time travelling trouble maker can be discounted.

    • Sabine 7.2
      20 July 2016 at 10:57 am

      yes, and the Trump Campaign still tries to pretend that it did not happen.

      The point is simply that they could have attributed the parts to the original, be gracious about it and pay a compliment to all the previous First Ladies at the same time.

      But no, lets make a fucking mess out of this. Stupid Stupid Stupid.

      • Colonial Viper 7.2.1
        20 July 2016 at 10:59 am

        Unfortunately, there’s no way that the Trump campaign will admit to having borrowed even one sentence from Obama.

      • Rodel 7.2.2
        20 July 2016 at 11:18 am

        Sabine- .”….pay a compliment to all the previous First Ladies at the same time…” Do you mean Trumps previous wives?
        In which case MT won’t be the first lady. She’ll be ‘the third lady.

    • weka 7.3
      20 July 2016 at 11:03 am

      “Still, it’s less than a minutes talk time out of a total 15 minute speech. Meh.”

      Someone on twitter calculated it as 7% of the speech and pointed out that when they taught at uni plagiarising 7% in an assignment would be a fail and warrant disciplinary action. Plagiarising is a serious thing, for what I would have thought were obvious reasons, but reading the comments here I am wondering now if it needs to be spelt out.

      • Colonial Viper 7.3.1
        20 July 2016 at 11:07 am

        I wonder if I need to remind you that in future years, Trump will be teaching to politics classes in university, not taking them.

        By the way did you notice all the legal migrants, hispanics and Blacks (of course including his wife, who had a solid East European accent) that Trump had speaking on day 1?

        As well as two of the speakers crediting Gaddafi’s militia for saving American lives in Libya.

        But no, what we have to focus on is that his wife’s speech had 7% copied content and that would be a fail in a uni assignment.

        The facile nature of the left’s political analysis on the RNC convention is really funny.

        Trump easy win, still my call.

        • Sabine 7.3.1.1
          20 July 2016 at 11:47 am

          History will judge and as Bush the younger once said to pointedly:
          “History will ultimately judge the decisions that were made for Iraq and I’m just not going to be around to see the final verdict,” the two-term president told CNN in a wide-ranging interview.
          “In other words, I’ll be dead.”

          see this is how its done. 🙂

          http://edition.cnn.com/2013/04/24/politics/bush-interview-king/

        • marty mars 7.3.1.2
          20 July 2016 at 11:49 am

          The funny thing is when he wins you will go, “I told you so” and claim some insight and you’ll say, “the people have spoken” and so forth.

          Wanting him to win is not the same as thinking he will win – just getting that in early ☺

          • Colonial Viper 7.3.1.2.1
            20 July 2016 at 12:00 pm

            To be clear. I want Trump to win ahead of Hillary. IMO he will be the far better POTUS for NZ. Eg. He will shitcan the TPP while Hillary will embrace that corporate document with both arms.

            I have been saying that for some time.

            Also I picked Trump as getting the Republican nomination a very long time ago. Made good dollars out of that call.

            • Tony Veitch (not the partner-bashing 3rd rate broadcaster) 7.3.1.2.1.1
              20 July 2016 at 1:04 pm

              I’m with CV on this one – wanting Trump to win.

              Trump is an unknown and untried quantity who will, I think, be bloody-minded enough to stick to a few (!) of the things he campaigned on – such as rejecting TPPA.

              Clinton, on the other hand, is a known and untrusted quantity. She’s been bought and gift wrapped by Wall Street and the frackers. We know she will be a disaster for the planet. At this stage we don’t know this about Donald.

              In a choice of the lesser of two evils, Donald J. Trump is a better bet. IMO.

              • Phil …
                20 July 2016 at 1:25 pm

                We know she [Clinton] will be a disaster for the planet. At this stage we don’t know this about Donald.

                Yeah, but nah. We already know Trump policies (and I use that word in the loosest of all possible manners) will be a disaster for the planet.

                Trump’s demonisation of anyone who isn’t a white able-bodied man makes him the poster child and for every racist and mysoginistic group on the planet.

                His economic policies, such as substantially cutting income taxes and aggressively entering trade wars with other countries, are likely to plunge the US into a deep recession and exacerbate the existing income inequality problem in the US.

                He’s a climate change denier, so don’t expect to see anything positive on the environmental front.

                He’s going to “declare war” on ISIS, but somehow do so without committing US troops on the ground, so we can expect to see a rapid deterioration of the already poor relationship between the US and the middle east.

                He’s committed to increase US intelligence by expanding the torture and interrogation techniques currently in use, despite clear evidence those things don’t work and are actively harmful to US interests.

                • Colonial Viper …
                  20 July 2016 at 5:50 pm

                  He’s a climate change denier, so don’t expect to see anything positive on the environmental front.

                  Actually, Trump hundreds of millions in properties in New York, Florida, and other coastal locations which will be hard hit by rising sea levels.

                  Being the pragmatic business man, he will pay close attention to climate change IMO. Though not for environmental reasons, but for financial ones.

            • McFlock 7.3.1.2.1.2
              20 July 2016 at 1:23 pm

              and it’ll take a while for all the fallout to reach the southern hemisphere…

        • weka 7.3.1.3
          20 July 2016 at 11:56 am

          “I wonder if I need to remind you that in future years, Trump will be teaching to politics classes in university, not taking them.”

          You could make that point but it might help if you also said why it was relevant to my comment.

          “But no, what we have to focus on is that his wife’s speech had 7% copied content and that would be a fail in a uni assignment.”

          Actually I’m focussed on the number of people in this thread who think that plagiarism is no big deal. It’s entirely possible to make the point that we should be looking at what was happening at the convention and state that plagiarism of this kind is problematic, but instead some are marginalising the importance of the issue and instead creating a false binary. I assume because you support Trump.

          “The facile nature of the left’s political analysis on the RNC convention is really funny.”

          So is the facile nature of making generic statements about the left, whoever they are. I think that’s more about your own personal shift in politics to being centrist than there being anything real in the criticism about the left in this instance.

          • Colonial Viper 7.3.1.3.1
            20 July 2016 at 12:03 pm

            You could make that point but it might help if you also said why it was relevant to my comment.

            It means, in case you haven’t noticed, that Trump is not running for a university assignment.

            • weka 7.3.1.3.1.1
              20 July 2016 at 1:34 pm

              Is the implication that it’s ok for him to plagiarise because he’s not at university?

              My example of the 7% fail and discipline thing was to demonstrate that even perceived small amounts of plagiarism can be problematic.

        • red-blooded 7.3.1.4
          20 July 2016 at 11:59 am

          Your dedication to Mr Blow-My-Own-Trumpet is legendary, and seems to know know bounds, CV. It’s also damn silly.

          As for the “Trump will be teaching politics” line; if an academic (and BTW, Trump sure as heck isn’t one) plagiarises another, he/she is reviled and it has serious consequences for their career. Plagiarism is stealing, and I would have thought Mr Free Market (who you, for reasons of your own, have wedded yourself to) would take this seriously. But then, a man who ran what he called a “university” (with no certified status) in real estate and hired absolutely unqualified people with no experience as academics or real estate agents to deliver the courses, and gave them written instructions on what to do if the police raided the (fraudulent) institutions, probably doesn’t give a flying fuck about academic honesty or intellectual standards.
          http://www.forbes.com/sites/kerryadolan/2011/05/07/trump-universitys-unhappy-students/#10f2173c354f
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_University

          As for the “golly, there were a lot of brown people on stage” line – golly, I wonder if that was the whole point of this selection of speakers? Crafty, eh?

          Plus, you choose to focus on Mrs Trump (III)’s accent; what I noticed was her comparative youth (46 vs 70) and glamour – and I’m pretty sure that’s what the old lech noticed, too. I wonder, did the first two get a bit saggy for Donald?

  8. marty mars 8
    20 July 2016 at 10:54 am

    Bloody rickrolled too – how long must this suffering continue – its just not fair.

    https://youtu.be/9KtzdP7mR-4

  9. joe90 9
    20 July 2016 at 11:08 am

    The RNC communications director Sean Spicer has solved it – Michelle Obama lifted her speech from … My Little Pony….

    https://youtu.be/fSUaIKKKTmA?t=1m30s

  10. joe90 10
    20 July 2016 at 11:14 am

    heh

    Official RNC YouTube channel has video of Trump introducing Melania before her speech and of him escorting her off stage after: nothing else— Robert Mackey (@RobertMackey) July 19, 2016

  11. joe90 11
    20 July 2016 at 12:06 pm

    Wonder if Eric, son of The Donald, will follow family tradition when he speaks at the RNC.

    http://dailycaller.com/2016/03/16/trump-appears-to-have-heavily-plagiarized-op-ed-from-carson/

  12. Adrian 12
    20 July 2016 at 1:04 pm

    Now I love a good conspiracy theory as much as anybody mostly because they are almost universally a really good laugh, but it has surprised me that the fact two of Trumps wives were born, educated and acquired fame and had high profile careers with governmental help and direction ( well everybody did, even if you were a humble street sweeper ) under communist rule.
    I see a honey trap, damn clever that, now only a quick glance away from every American secret.
    If Bernie is a communist because he wants better health care then why the deafening silence about the world’s most visible sleeper cell?

  13. paul andersen 13
    20 July 2016 at 1:05 pm

    trump steals music to spruik his wife, she steals speech to spruik donald,

  14. Ad 14
    20 July 2016 at 1:07 pm

    Or we could play the Amy Schumer game.
    Much more entertaining.

  15. joe90 15
    20 July 2016 at 1:10 pm

    “SACK THE SPEECH WRITER!”

    Melania re-wrote it, Mr Trump.

    “…fuck.”

    A new report out Tuesday suggests the blame for Melania Trump’s plagiarized convention speech could fall more squarely on the former model and complicates the narrative that a speechwriter or other staffers were to blame for the high-profile embarrassment.

    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/melania-trump-plagiarism-speech-matthew-scully

  16. adam 16
    20 July 2016 at 1:15 pm

    This is the show, which is trump.

    Expect more of the same, and even more outrageous things to happen.

    Because trump is going for ratings to get votes.

    Meanwhile, the media blackout continues on the candidate on 8%, and the candidate on 13%.

  17. Blackcap 17
    20 July 2016 at 1:19 pm

    I have a different theory. Looks whats happening… all the talk is now about Trump Trump Trump. I think this is another genius move (the “plagiarism” was intended) as the media focus is now solely on Melania and Donald. This is “advertising” gold. Who would have read Melania’s speech or listened to it if it was not for this. Clever move by Trump I think.

  18. Whatisis 18
    20 July 2016 at 1:23 pm

    Personally I’d rather a new idiot as potus than the old evil. Plagiarism is small compared to what’s to come from either of these bad choices. The only difference is that I won’t be fed the evil of Hillary for what it is.

    • McFlock 18.1
      20 July 2016 at 1:55 pm

      If drumpf were merely an idiot, I might agree.

      But according to the guy who actually did write The Art of the Deal, he’s much worse than that: it’s not and act. He really is vain, stupid, insecure, impulsive, and self-absorbed.

      That type can be played like a fiddle by the geopolitical sharks, and when he finally realises he’s a failure he’ll lash out. He wins in november, we’re all fucked.

      • Colonial Viper 18.1.1
        20 July 2016 at 5:47 pm

        Nah, as POTUS, Trump is far ahead of Clinton from the NZ point of view.

        • McFlock 18.1.1.1
          20 July 2016 at 11:25 pm

          lol

          I believe you’ve mentioned that article of faith previously.

          Our economy is based on trade. For that we need a modicum of geopolitical and global economic stability and internal stability in the US.

          Even Jeb Bush (let alone Clinton) would have been better than a compulsive-lying, chronically self-aggrandizing, chaotically impulsive idiot and possible sociopathwho hasthe attention span of a flea on caffeine.

          Clinton at least act rationally, even if you don’t like her motives. Trump might end up in a nuclear confrontation with China simply because North Korea said he had a small dick.

  20. ianmac 20
    20 July 2016 at 2:08 pm

    Money buys Senators and steers the course of a once great country:

    “But Donald J. Trump is not an accident. The GOP has in the last 40 years relentlessly devolved away from addressing the needs of ordinary people, catering instead to extreme ideologies and the wealthiest donors.

    Rather than addressing pressing problems like income inequality and climate change, the modern GOP focuses instead on cutting taxes for the super-wealthy, expanding earth-killing carbon extraction, and endless war.

    But it wasn’t always this way. Sixty years ago, the Republican Party was advocating for civil rights and gender equality, a stronger welfare state, and environmental protection. This is the story of the Republican Party that once was….”
    https://theintercept.com/2016/07/18/the-long-sad-corrupted-devolution-of-the-gop-from-eisenhower-to-donald-trump/
    (Thanks Millhouse.)

  21. joe90 21
    20 July 2016 at 2:09 pm

    Who knew..
    /

    Good to see David Duke has gotten to the bottom of who was behind the Melania plagiarism mess. It was the Jews. https://t.co/QIXTtnh4Pf— Jason Zengerle (@zengerle) July 20, 2016

  22. Richard McGrath 22
    20 July 2016 at 2:24 pm

    This presidential race is becoming absolutely hilarious to watch.

  23. joe90 23
    20 July 2016 at 3:52 pm

    It’s a family trait.
    /

    https://twitter.com/TheDailyShow/status/755601024908300288

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnxvHKwUEAAhqWY.jpg

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CnxuvByUkAAtORw.jpg

    edit: done dirt cheap

    Correction: The AmCon writer also wrote Trump Jr.'s speech. So recycling rather than plagiarism https://t.co/E55gEYGGLj— Jeet Heer (@HeerJeet) July 20, 2016

  24. Morrissey 24
    20 July 2016 at 4:27 pm

    A message to the delegates at the Republican Convention in Cleveland…

    THANK YOU!

    Yours sincerely,

    The Democratic Party

    P.S. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F6qe-VaChM

  25. Jenny 25
    21 July 2016 at 8:02 am

    With a little help from my friends.

    Hours before giving the speech on Monday (Tuesday NZT), Melania Trump told NBC’s Today that she wrote it with as little help as possible.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/82320866/donald-trump-staff-writer-takes-responsibility-for-melania-speech-controversy

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Oct1Qv8x0

  26. Rae 26
    21 July 2016 at 2:14 pm

    Bit of an unfair question this, (unfair on the fair Mrs T, anywho). If anyone were to ask me who could make me turn gay, my answer would be Michelle Obama, so I’m a bit biased. 😀

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  • Supporting better financial outcomes for Kiwis
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    7 days ago

  • Trade relationship with China remains strong
    “China remains a strong commercial opportunity for Kiwi exporters as Chinese businesses and consumers continue to value our high-quality safe produce,” Trade and Agriculture Minister Todd McClay says.   Mr McClay has returned to New Zealand following visits to Beijing, Harbin and Shanghai where he met ministers, governors and mayors and engaged in trade and agricultural events with the New ...
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    7 days ago

  • PM’s South East Asia mission does the business
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    1 week ago

  • $41m to support clean energy in South East Asia
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  • Minister releases Fast-track stakeholder list
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    1 week ago

  • Judicial appointments announced
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  • Education Minister heads to major teaching summit in Singapore
    Education Minister Erica Stanford will lead the New Zealand delegation at the 2024 International Summit on the Teaching Profession (ISTP) held in Singapore. The delegation includes representatives from the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) Te Wehengarua and the New Zealand Educational Institute (NZEI) Te Riu Roa.  The summit is co-hosted ...
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  • Value of stopbank project proven during cyclone
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  • Anzac commemorations, Türkiye relationship focus of visit
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  • Comprehensive Partnership the goal for NZ and the Philippines
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  • Government commits $20m to Westport flood protection
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    1 week ago

  • Taupō takes pole position
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  • Cost of living support for low-income homeowners
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    1 week ago

  • Government focused on getting people into work
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    1 week ago

  • Clean energy key driver to reducing emissions
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    1 week ago

  • Earthquake-prone buildings review brought forward
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    1 week ago

  • Thailand and NZ to agree to Strategic Partnership
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and his Thai counterpart, Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, have today agreed that New Zealand and the Kingdom of Thailand will upgrade the bilateral relationship to a Strategic Partnership by 2026. “New Zealand and Thailand have a lot to offer each other. We have a strong mutual desire to build ...
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    1 week ago

  • Government consults on extending coastal permits for ports
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    1 week ago

  • Inflation coming down, but more work to do
    Today’s announcement that inflation is down to 4 per cent is encouraging news for Kiwis, but there is more work to be done - underlining the importance of the Government’s plan to get the economy back on track, acting Finance Minister Chris Bishop says. “Inflation is now at 4 per ...
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    1 week ago

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