Act likes some rights but not others

Written By: - Date published: 7:50 am, July 22nd, 2021 - 37 comments
Categories: act, human rights, law, law and "order", the praiseworthy and the pitiful, uncategorized - Tags:

I hope the Free Speech coalition is taking note.  Because this week Act has proposed policy involving some pretty outrageous breaches of human rights on groups within our country.

The funny thing is that Act has tried to make out that it wants to protect our rights.  Just read what it said about freedom of speech:

Tougher hate speech laws will take away basic rights to free speech, shut down debate, and make people afraid to express themselves.

In short, it will put cancel culture on steroids.

We are going to see petitions and lynch mobs demanding Police prosecute people with unpopular views. The only people who win are the perpetually offended.

Then on Tuesday Act assembled a lynch mob and demanded that people with unpopular status be attacked by the authorities and that their rights be taken away.

It was nothing new.  It was basically an amalgamation of traditional beneficiary bashing and gang bashing.  But what was interesting is that Act is trying to eat National’s and Simeon Brown’s tough on crime rhetoric.

Act promised to:

  • Increase incarceration rates and bring back the three strikes law,
  • Change the law so that prisoners could not be granted parole unless they completed a rehabilitation course,
  • Require gang members with kids to use electronic cards that prevented spending on alcohol and tobacco,
  • This one is a doozy, exempt police officers from the hate speech laws,
  • Provide for Gang Injunction Orders which would allow the Police to apply to the Courts for an injunction against an individual on the National Gang List to “prohibit bad behaviours including being in a particular location or associating with particular people. It could also be used to require positive actions, like attending rehabilitation.”

All good red meat to the laura norda brigade.  And clear breaches of multiple rights such as the right to be presumed innocent until proven guilty, freedom of movement and association, and the right not to be arbitrarily detained to name a few.

It takes a great deal of agility to be principled on protection of the freedom of expression but then offer a big meh to rights of assembly, free movement and the right to due process.  I am sure a finely calibrated weighing of the political implications were involved.

And it is interesting that Act is trying to eat National’s lunch on Laura Norda.  I wonder how National will respond?

37 comments on “Act likes some rights but not others ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. tc 1
    22 July 2021 at 9:11 am

    National will likely respond with an even bigger dogwhistle, it’s what superior financial backing affords you.

    Collins and Seymour continue to fight over that decreasing piece of the electoral pie whilst the new kids on the block get on with being inclusive and living as they see it.

    Bring back 3 strikes eh…..any jonolists out there care to do some work over that tawdry piece of policy, it's actual effects and why it was repealed. Not holding my breath.

    • Gosman 1.1
      22 July 2021 at 9:36 am

      The last poll had both ACT and National increasing their support so they aren't really cannibalising a decreasing share of the electorate.

      • tc 1.1.1
        22 July 2021 at 10:12 am

        Because polls are sooo reliable…..especially out of cycle.

        • Gosman 1.1.1.1
          22 July 2021 at 11:11 am

          They are indicative of trends and general feeling. What is clear is that there is a significant section of the electorate that is amenable to the ideas expressed by both National and ACT on various topics such as Gangs.

          • left for dead 1.1.1.1.1
            23 July 2021 at 6:57 am

            Gosman,yes we know their is more than two racists, hypocrites in New Zealand,Sadly .

  2. Gosman 2
    22 July 2021 at 9:34 am

    ACT is not a pure libertarian party but even if it was libertarianism does not mean people are free to get welfare without restrictions nor does it mean you are free to form criminal gangs and carry out harmful actions against others without consequences.

    • woodart 2.1
      22 July 2021 at 12:05 pm

      your statement is like driftnet fishing. so full of unwanted rubbish that gets collected in such wide generalisation. liberarianism should mean that a know-nothing on a website spouting opinions on libertarianism is neither right nor wrong. stupid comments like doing harmful actions against others is so unfocused and all encompassing, that pretty much every human action somewhere, cause some sort of harm to another human somewhere else. as for criminal gangs, a bunch of businesses colludeing to drive up prices, avoid taxes, pollute, etc,etc. where does it end? with dog whistling polies, one would hope they get savaged by some of those dogs…

    • Incognito 2.2
      22 July 2021 at 3:01 pm

      Of course we’re 100% free to form criminal crayon classes and join harmful hobby hubs, just not criminal gangs with loud intimidating motorbikes. Similarly, we’re free to smoke ourselves to death with legal tobacco, as long as it doesn’t come from criminal gangs. And we’re entitled to drink ourselves into early graves with pretty legal substances, as long as they’re not sold by criminal gangs. Consequences are only consequential if they’re caused by criminal gangs. Duh!

      • RedLogix 2.2.1
        24 July 2021 at 8:28 am

        I cannot think of anything a human can do that does not have some potentially bad consequence. If that was the sole consideration none of us would ever get out of bed – and that would have negative consequences too.

        But as a society we also make rules that state some activities are beyond the pale. And the negative consequences arising from criminal actions lie in another category altogether.

        • Incognito 2.2.1.1
          24 July 2021 at 5:55 pm

          Agreed.

          My point is the kneejerk reaction to and rejection of anything gang. For example, a knitting group is perceived as a bunch of lovely peace-loving people together drinking tea and eating biscuits yet a knitting gang doesn’t have the same vibe, I bet; the word is heavily loaded in people’s minds and raises many negative connotations – not without reason, of course. Life is a little more nuanced and complicated than this simplistic B & W stuff. So, if our political debates are to be genuine, constructive & progressive, and reflect the realities of this world (AKA the good, the bad, the ugly) then we should at least be aware of this pitfall and strive to get a few shades of pale into the conversation. However, many seem to vehemently and almost violently object to this too. Go figure.

  3. Pete 3
    22 July 2021 at 10:21 am

    Act knows there's an audience thick enough to not see the contradictions in its policy.

    • Gosman 3.1
      22 July 2021 at 11:12 am

      Yes ACT supporters tend to be so thick that they don't generally require State support for their incomes.

      • vto 3.1.1
        22 July 2021 at 11:27 am

        There is no such link

        If you had been there you would know this

      • woodart 3.1.2
        22 July 2021 at 12:09 pm

        the whole act party were on the bludge for years. couldnt even afford to buy there own cup of tea! even now, they are on life support. seymour will have to actually win his electorate honestley next election. without him, the whole party goes back into the phonebooth.

        • Gosman 3.1.2.1
          22 July 2021 at 12:33 pm

          A party on 11.5% is not on life support. Unless you think The Greens are also on life support? What would that mean the Maori party is – In the morgue?

          • woodart 3.1.2.1.1
            22 July 2021 at 1:07 pm

            relying on seymour who relied on nats being charitable, and are now relying on their new fans NOT returning to the mothershit er ship. thats life support.

      • Pete 3.1.3
        22 July 2021 at 1:53 pm

        We have former act leader Richard Prebble saying one way to not have young people joining gangs is to have strong rugby league clubs. "Young people who play sport, waka ama or kapa haka do not join gangs," he said

        Yeah, we know that. Go to an Act conference and say, "I think we should put as much into sport, waka ama and kapa haka as prisons" and see how you get on. If Jacinda Ardern announced that was to happen, what would the reaction be from David Seymour and Act?

        How do Act supporters feel about kids doing kapa haka in schools?

        There are Act supporters who are so clever they mightn't require State support for their incomes. That clever, sure, but that dumb they primarily think the most effective strategies to have people change their ways and function positively are by punitive approaches.

        So dumb Act rubbish the notion of even engaging with gangs by talking with them. Oh, except of course if your name is Nicole McKee and it isn't really a gang member just their representative and it doesn't really count because it was at Parliament. So dumb that they think the world is that dumb that we'd accept that sort of bullshit.

      • Brigid 3.1.4
        22 July 2021 at 2:09 pm

        Can you list the Act supporting companies that did not apply for and receive the covid wage subsidy? Aka state support.

        And then list those who have paid it back.

        • Gosman 3.1.4.1
          23 July 2021 at 12:18 pm

          Ummm… the State imposed a lockdown which reduced businesses income it therefore makes sense that the State pay compensation if they want companies not to respond by laying off workers.

      • Rapunzel 3.1.5
        22 July 2021 at 5:45 pm

        Like the Tax Payers Union that's an appearance they like to promote but other than Seymour having been on the tax payers' (State) payroll for a while now drilling down the MPs Epsom hauled up in I've only seen one or two with anything like valid credentials.

        I & most of our cohort vote Labour & have never required "State" support as independent contractors. Now I'm not saying one or more don't have a love of a "ute" but not to the point that some see it as a status symbol of sorts. You have pretty limited perception of who keeps NZ moving.

      • left for dead 3.1.6
        23 July 2021 at 7:01 am

        @ Gosman I do hope you don't have much affect in the running of this country.

  4. AB 4
    22 July 2021 at 11:29 am

    ACT's core purpose is to prevent state power from being used to undermine the economic dominance of their social class – and ideally to capture state power and use it to entrench and extend that dominance.

    The championing of free speech and the tough on crime stance are entirely cynical ploys to gain the electoral success needed to deliver that core purpose. That it leads them into contradictory statements doesn't bother them at all, because they are not driven by principle. However it is the left's failure that has given them any oxygen at all, rather than being dismissed as marginal oddballs.

  5. weka 5
    22 July 2021 at 11:35 am

    so glad I don't have a tv.

  6. Keith Christie 6
    22 July 2021 at 11:36 am

    Unless there is a flood, undeniable sea erosion or uninsurable health problems.

  7. Cooper oil 7
    22 July 2021 at 11:51 am

    David Seymour, a Judas goat leading his sheeple up the ramp to totalitarianism

    • Gosman 7.1
      22 July 2021 at 12:34 pm

      Except most people involved with the ACT party are very happy thank you very much.

      • Robert Guyton 7.1.1
        22 July 2021 at 12:41 pm

        Haaaaappy…baaaaaa…haaaapppy!

      • woodart 7.1.2
        22 July 2021 at 1:09 pm

        prove your claim. where is your source? unsupported opinion.

      • Descendant Of Smith 7.1.3
        22 July 2021 at 2:34 pm

        Then why do they spend all their (public at least) time complaining?

        • Incognito 7.1.3.1
          22 July 2021 at 2:46 pm

          The more people complain about this Government and government in general, the happier ACT is. ACT aims for more people to join the choir of dissonant voices and the louder and more cacophonous it gets, the happier ACT will be.

      • Patricia Bremner 7.1.4
        22 July 2021 at 4:43 pm

        There have been no apologies for past misdemeanors by members from Act.

        What do they “really” do?

      • vto 7.1.5
        22 July 2021 at 6:47 pm

        "Except most people involved with the ACT party are very happy thank you very much."

        That dont mean shit..

        Same applied to the National Socialist Party in 1920's Germany..

  8. georgecom 8
    23 July 2021 at 10:34 pm

    the massive ironies here with ACT's policies

    the self professed champions for keeping government out of private peoples lives, are promoting wowserism and nanny statism. Libertarians or nanny state wowsers?

    the self professed champions of small government and opponents of bureaucracy are proposing a bureaucratic system of 'injunction' which gang members will likely ignore but which will cost the tax payer a pretty penny and suck up valuable police and justice resources better spent fighting crime.

    Libertarians or nanny statist wowser bureaucrats?

  9. peter sim 9
    26 July 2021 at 10:11 pm

    At last gosman is honest. act and the nazis are identical.

    Good Grief ! A breath of honesty from gosman.

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    5 days ago

  • The longest of weeks
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    5 days ago

  • Suggested sessions of EGU24 to submit abstracts to
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    5 days ago

  • Under New Management
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    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
    6 days ago

  • While we wait patiently, our new Minister of Education is up and going with a 100-day action plan
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
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  • DAVID FARRAR: Hysterical bullshit
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    6 days ago

  • Skeptical Science New Research for Week #48 2023
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  • ELE LUDEMANN: It wasn’t just $55 million
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    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    6 days ago

  • Weekly Roundup 1-December-2023
    Wow, it’s December already, and it’s a Friday. So here are few things that caught our attention recently. This Week in Greater Auckland On Monday Matt covered the new government’s coalition agreements and what they mean for transport. On Tuesday Matt looked at AT’s plans for fare increases ...
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    6 days ago

  • Shane MacGowan Is Gone.
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    6 days ago

  • The Hoon around the week to Dec 1
    Nicola Willis, Chris Bishop and other National, ACT and NZ First MPs applaud the signing of the coalition agreements, which included the reversal of anti-smoking measures while accelerating tax cuts for landlords. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The five things that mattered in Aotearoa’s political economy that we wrote ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    6 days ago

  • 2023 More Reading: November (+ Writing Update)
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    A Phuulish FellowBy strda221
    6 days ago

  • Forward to 2017
    The coalition party agreements are mainly about returning to 2017 when National lost power. They show commonalities but also some serious divergencies.The two coalition agreements – one National and ACT, the other National and New Zealand First – are more than policy documents. They also describe the processes of the ...
    PunditBy Brian Easton
    7 days ago

  • Questions a nine year old might ask the new Prime Minister
    First QuestionYou’re going to crack down on people ram-raiding dairies, because you say hard-working dairy owners shouldn’t have to worry about getting ram-raided.But once the chemist shops have pseudoephedrine in them again, they're going to get ram-raided all the time. Do chemists not work as hard as dairy owners?Second QuestionYou ...
    More than a fieldingBy David Slack
    7 days ago

  • Questions a nine year old might ask the new Prime Minister
    First QuestionYou’re going to crack down on people ram-raiding dairies, because you say hard-working dairy owners shouldn’t have to worry about getting ram-raided.But once the chemist shops have pseudoephedrine in them again, they're going to get ram-raided all the time. Do chemists not work as hard as dairy owners?Second QuestionYou ...
    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
    7 days ago

  • Finally
    Henry Kissinger is finally dead. Good fucking riddance. While Americans loved him, he was a war criminal, responsible for most of the atrocities of the final quarter of the twentieth century. Cambodia. Bangladesh. Chile. East Timor. All Kissinger. Because of these crimes, Americans revere him as a "statesman" (which says ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    7 days ago

  • Government in a hurry – Luxon lists 49 priorities in 100-day plan while Peters pledges to strength...
    Buzz from the Beehive Yes, ministers in the new government are delivering speeches and releasing press statements. But the message on the government’s official website was the same as it has been for the past several days, when Point of Order went looking for news from the Beehive that had ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    7 days ago

  • DAVID FARRAR: Luxon is absolutely right
    David Farrar writes  –  1 News reports: Christopher Luxon says he was told by some Kiwis on the campaign trail they “didn’t know” the difference between Waka Kotahi, Te Pūkenga and Te Whatu Ora. Speaking to Breakfast, the incoming prime minister said having English first on government agencies will “make sure” ...
    Point of OrderBy poonzteam5443
    7 days ago

  • Top 10 at 10 am for Thursday, Nov 30
    There are fears that mooted changes to building consent liability could end up driving the building industry into an uninsured hole. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: Here’s my pick of the top 10 news and analysis links elsewhere as of 10 am on Thursday, November 30, including:The new Government’s ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    7 days ago

  • Gordon Campbell on how climate change threatens cricket‘s future
    Well that didn’t last long, did it? Mere days after taking on what he called the “awesome responsibility” of being Prime Minister, M Christopher Luxon has started blaming everyone else, and complaining that he has inherited “economic vandalism on an unprecedented scale” – which is how most of us are ...
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    7 days ago

  • We need to talk about Tory.
    The first I knew of the news about Tory Whanau was when a tweet came up in my feed.The sort of tweet that makes you question humanity, or at least why you bother with Twitter. Which is increasingly a cesspit of vile inhabitants who lurk spreading negativity, hate, and every ...
    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    7 days ago

  • Dangling Transport Solutions
    Cable Cars, Gondolas, Ropeways and Aerial Trams are all names for essentially the same technology and the world’s biggest maker of them are here to sell them as an public transport solution. Stuff reports: Austrian cable car company Doppelmayr has launched its case for adding aerial cable cars to New ...
    Greater AucklandBy Matt L
    7 days ago

  • November AMA
    Hi,It’s been awhile since I’ve done an Ask-Me-Anything on here, so today’s the day. Ask anything you like in the comments section, and I’ll be checking in today and tomorrow to answer.Leave a commentNext week I’ll be giving away a bunch of these Mister Organ blu-rays for readers in New ...
    David FarrierBy David Farrier
    1 week ago

  • National’s early moves adding to cost of living pressure
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    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    1 week ago

  • Backwards to the future
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has confirmed that it will be back to the future on planning legislation. This will be just one of a number of moves which will see the new government go backwards as it repeals and cost-cuts its way into power. They will completely repeal one ...
    PolitikBy Richard Harman
    1 week ago

  • New initiatives in science and technology could point the way ahead for Luxon government
    As the new government settles into the Beehive, expectations are high that it can sort out some  of  the  economic issues  confronting  New Zealand. It may take time for some new  ministers to get to grips with the range of their portfolio work and responsibilities before they can launch the  changes that  ...
    Point of OrderBy tutere44
    1 week ago

  • Treaty pledge to secure funding is contentious – but is Peters being pursued by a lynch mob after ...
    TV3 political editor Jenna Lynch was among the corps of political reporters who bridled, when Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters told them what he thinks of them (which is not much). She was unabashed about letting her audience know she had bridled. More usefully, she drew attention to something which ...
    Point of OrderBy Bob Edlin
    1 week ago

  • How long does this last?
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    More Than A FeildingBy David Slack
    1 week ago

  • Minister sets expectations of Commissioner
    Today I met with Police Commissioner Andrew Coster to set out my expectations, which he has agreed to, says Police Minister Mark Mitchell. Under section 16(1) of the Policing Act 2008, the Minister can expect the Police Commissioner to deliver on the Government’s direction and priorities, as now outlined in ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    13 hours ago

  • New Zealand needs a strong and stable ETS
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    15 hours ago

  • PISA results show urgent need to teach the basics
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago

  • Collins leaves for Pacific defence meeting
    Defence Minister Judith Collins today departed for New Caledonia to attend the 8th annual South Pacific Defence Ministers’ meeting (SPDMM). “This meeting is an excellent opportunity to meet face-to-face with my Pacific counterparts to discuss regional security matters and to demonstrate our ongoing commitment to the Pacific,” Judith Collins says. ...
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    3 days ago

  • Working for Families gets cost of living boost
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    3 days ago

  • Lake Onslow pumped hydro scheme scrapped
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    4 days ago

  • NZ welcomes further pause in fighting in Gaza
    New Zealand welcomes the further one-day extension of the pause in fighting, which will allow the delivery of more urgently-needed humanitarian aid into Gaza and the release of more hostages, Foreign Minister Winston Peters said. “The human cost of the conflict is horrific, and New Zealand wants to see the violence ...
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    6 days ago

  • Condolences on passing of Henry Kissinger
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    6 days ago

  • Backing our kids to learn the basics
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago

  • US Business Summit Speech – Regional stability through trade
    I would like to begin by echoing the Prime Minister’s thanks to the organisers of this Summit, Fran O’Sullivan and the Auckland Business Chamber.  I want to also acknowledge the many leading exporters, sector representatives, diplomats, and other leaders we have joining us in the room. In particular, I would like ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago

  • Keynote Address to the United States Business Summit, Auckland
    Good morning. Thank you, Rosemary, for your warm introduction, and to Fran and Simon for this opportunity to make some brief comments about New Zealand’s relationship with the United States.  This is also a chance to acknowledge my colleague, Minister for Trade Todd McClay, Ambassador Tom Udall, Secretary of Foreign ...
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    7 days ago

  • India New Zealand Business Council Speech, India as a Strategic Priority
    Good morning, tēnā koutou and namaskar. Many thanks, Michael, for your warm welcome. I would like to acknowledge the work of the India New Zealand Business Council in facilitating today’s event and for the Council’s broader work in supporting a coordinated approach for lifting New Zealand-India relations. I want to also ...
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    1 week ago

  • Coalition Government unveils 100-day plan
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    1 week ago

  • New Zealand welcomes European Parliament vote on the NZ-EU Free Trade Agreement
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago

  • Further humanitarian support for Gaza, the West Bank and Israel
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    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago

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