Open mike 02/04/2015

111 comments on “Open mike 02/04/2015 ”

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1. mickysavage 1

   2 April 2015 at 6:47 am

   Kia ora

   The authors are thinking of an evening open mike post. Open mike performs very well and is regularly the most commented on post. Often there will be over 100 comments. An evening post will allow discussion of what has happened during the day. In various sites it appears to work well.

   Thoughts?
   • Paul 1.1

     2 April 2015 at 6:50 am

     Good idea.
   • Draco T Bastard 1.2

     2 April 2015 at 8:16 am

     Give it a try.
     • weka 1.2.1

       2 April 2015 at 9:06 am

       +1
   • felix 1.3

     2 April 2015 at 8:43 am

     Like.
   • Lanthanide 1.4

     2 April 2015 at 9:09 am

     Sometimes I have an interesting item that I save until the next day’s Open Mike, because the current day has been too busy and if it’s posted the item won’t get the attention it warrants.

     An evening post would help, although alternatively I’m not sure how successful it will be splitting ‘the days discussion’ in half. If the evening post is made too late, it won’t get much use, if it’s made too early, it’ll split stuff up too much.
   • Draco T Bastard 1.5

     2 April 2015 at 9:14 am

     Thinking about it. If you go ahead with this you may want to have it so that new threads on the Morning Mike can’t be created once the Evening Mike is up. This would allow threads to continue while pushing people onto the Evening Mike for new threads.
     • weka 1.5.1

       2 April 2015 at 9:40 am

       Unless Evening Mike is for things that happened during the day and Open Mike is for anything at all. I like the idea of Evening Mike being a bit more focussed than Open Mike, which is very open.
   • Hayden 1.6

     2 April 2015 at 11:09 am

     Can you call it “Open Mike Night?”
2. Paul 2

   2 April 2015 at 6:52 am

   Issues the Herald regards are more important than child ,poverty. sending soldiers to Iraq, the TPPA and Climate Change.

   A house going for auction.
   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11426678

   Messrs Roughan and Murphy think they are journalists.
   • millsy 2.1

     2 April 2015 at 9:29 am

     Why you would buy a house on leasehold land I have no idea. You have to have rocks in your head to do that. You could only get away with it by renting it out.
     • DH 2.1.1

       2 April 2015 at 10:15 am

       Likely to avoid rent inflation millsy. The ground rent on that property is fixed until 2026.

       One of the best reasons to buy your own home is to kill rent inflation. Renters suffer inflation on their entire income, home owners face inflation only on consumer goods & services.
3. Paul 3

   2 April 2015 at 7:16 am

   More great news from Planet Key.

   ‘A new report warns New Zealand’s poor handling of human rights issues and Parliament’s failure to act is harming the country’s reputation.’

   http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/270199/nz-slipping-in-human-rights-issues-report
   • vto 3.1

     2 April 2015 at 7:30 am

     That’s because we have a child for a Prime Minister
     • Draco T Bastard 3.1.1

       2 April 2015 at 8:28 am

       No, we have a psychopath for a PM. A child would grow up but our PM never will.
4. Ad 4

   2 April 2015 at 7:54 am

   Betcha Key is watching Auckland Council’s handling of the ports extension dispute.

   Government has an explicit productivity increase agenda.
   The larger wharves are required for greater productivity, both to enable larger ships, and from losing Queens Wharf to cruise ships.

   Govt stepped in over Rugby World Cup wharf, and now has a 50% share of it.

   Auckland Council explicitly avoided gaining greater control of its port through the CCO review. This despite 2 years of warning through the labour dispute that management there would do what they want, with flimsy public direction.

   If Council keep fumbling on NZ’s most important port pinch-point, its 1951 redux. Key will lose any patience he has left with Auckland Council, and he will act hard.

   Hulse should watch the “thermonuclear option” on her own ass.
   • John Shears 4.1

     2 April 2015 at 10:31 am

     Agreed Ad . So the Ex Maersk Executive now CEO of POA is flying back from San Francisco and will have a chat with the Chair of the Board woopy poops.
     The Council has finally made a public statement about the arrogant attitude of the appointed boards and executives that have been aiding and abetting the POA .

     The POA is legally a CCO {Council Controlled Organisation) so at last it seems the Council and its elected Mayor and councillors is about to start Controlling for the first time since the new Auckland was formed.
     If they do nothing then POA will become a COCO ( Completely Out Of Control Organisation in my LTHO
     • Bearded Git 4.1.1

       2 April 2015 at 11:32 am

       COCO-LOL!
     • Ad 4.1.2

       2 April 2015 at 12:08 pm

       No, Ports of Auckland is controlled by Auckland Council Investments Limited, which is in turn controlled 100% by Auckland Council. Council had their chance for direct control, and folded like origami. They would have to go through a formal consultation process to do it now, which takes a whole bunch of time and shouting.

       Those glorious yachties and their millionaire WAGs rattling their jewellery about a completely legitimate consent within a well-degraded marine environment, itself within a well-delineated POAL seabed line, need to figure out that the call to wait for isn’t from Maersk to POAL.

       The calls to wait for are from Tesco’s to Fonterra, which goes: “…why the fuck are we having to wait for your little supply ships to get onto Maersk from Sydney? We are cutting you, because we are shifting quite happily to the Urugayan supply out of Buenos Aires thanks.”

       And the second call is from the Chinese Premier to John Key: “…Thanks for playing. You’re benched.”

       I am sure this has been explained to the Council.
       • John Shears 4.1.2.1

         2 April 2015 at 4:42 pm

         MMMMM!!!!! So the POA Board does nothing ? except collect their fees.
         I don’t think so.
         The Governance of POA & other CCO’s was the plan but into place by John Key’s nominee Rodney Hide.
         The Council is 3 times removed from the action via ACIL/POA Board/POA Executive All appointed none elected. Go Figure.
         • Ad 4.1.2.1.1

           2 April 2015 at 6:19 pm

           Agreed this structure is the responsibility of Prime Minister John Key. But that was 7 years ago now.

           Auckland Council must be held to account for its own piss-poor governance.

           No matter which way you cut it, this will be a major local election issue next year, and I see a major clean out coming because of it.
5. The Chairman 5

   2 April 2015 at 8:02 am

   The Public Service Association (PSA) says Minister Tolley’s announcement of a Paula Rebstock-led review into Child, Youth and Family (CYF) is the last thing needed by an organisation that has demonstrated it can assess and plan for its own needs.

   http://www.psa.org.nz/media/releases/yet-another-external-review-the-last-thing-cyf-needs/

   Thoughts?
6. Draco T Bastard 6

   2 April 2015 at 8:24 am

   Iceland looks at ending boom and bust with radical money plan

   He argued the central bank was unable to contain the credit boom, allowing inflation to rise and sparking exaggerated risk-taking and speculation, the threat of bank collapse and costly state interventions.
   In Iceland, as in other modern market economies, the central bank controls the creation of banknotes and coins but not the creation of all money, which occurs as soon as a commercial bank offers a line of credit.
   The central bank can only try to influence the money supply with its monetary policy tools.
   Under the so-called Sovereign Money proposal, the country’s central bank would become the only creator of money.

   Would be good if they do this. We’ll see a nations’ economy stabilise and then bloom. Trade will become a nice to have rather than a necessity.

   And I do wish that these journalists would stop calling sensible actions radical. The radical option is the one we have now that ensures booms, busts and poverty.
   • Draco T Bastard 6.1

     2 April 2015 at 8:34 am

     Another view

     The report describes how commercial banks in Iceland created far more money than was needed for economic growth. The Central Bank failed to bring the money supply under control using conventional means.

     The report considers various reform proposals and concludes that the Sovereign Money proposal could provide a sound basis for effective reform in Iceland.
7. Capn Insano 7

   2 April 2015 at 8:25 am

   Winston’s go at name suppression removal blocked at the gate?
   https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/26887730/govt-spikes-removal-of-paedophile-name-suppression-bill/

   Now that’s just going to fuel speculation that National are protecting their own and fuck anyone else.
   • weka 7.1

     2 April 2015 at 9:05 am

     Anyone know if there’s anything online yet about the bill’s details. A search of it’s name “Criminal Procedure (Removing Paedophile Name Suppression) Amendment Bill” doesn’t bring up much. Nothing on the NZF website either except for the press release.

     I’m still not that happy about Peters using this issue for political reasons. I can’t comment on what he intends until more detail is available, but will just say that the word paedophile doesn’t appear to be in any of our legislation and the use of the word is a political tactic not a legal necessity (am guessing NZ law uses ‘sex offender’ or similar). Nothing like ‘paedophile’ to trigger a whole bunch of reactions, not all of them helpful.
     • Hayden 7.1.1

       2 April 2015 at 9:31 am

       Paedophilia isn’t actually illegal.
       • weka 7.1.1.1

         2 April 2015 at 9:45 am

         Yep, and Peters could quite easily have used the term we have in NZ law instead.
         • Skinny 7.1.1.1.1

           2 April 2015 at 11:08 am

           We all know what Peters is angling at, who and why. It is National who is protecting the truth, however in the end justice will prevail, and the ramifications are going to hurt a recently scratched Teflon John. The shit will stick.

           Not sure why your taking some sort of what? Moral high ground position.

           Still carrying a grudge over the Davis endorsement ahead of the sell out one trick pony by the looks.
           • tracey 7.1.1.1.1.1

             2 April 2015 at 11:38 am

             “not sure why your (sic) taking…”

             You don’t need to be unsure, Weka was quite clear about the why

             “I’m still not that happy about Peters using this issue for political reasons. I can’t comment on what he intends until more detail is available, but will just say that the word paedophile doesn’t appear to be in any of our legislation and the use of the word is a political tactic not a legal necessity (am guessing NZ law uses ‘sex offender’ or similar). Nothing like ‘paedophile’ to trigger a whole bunch of reactions, not all of them helpful.”

             Hopefully my bold helps with clarity for you.
             • weka …

               2 April 2015 at 11:57 am

               Thanks tracey. I thought it was reasonably clear too, but Skinny could always have just asked. Instead he wants to poke the trole stick.
             • Skinny …

               2 April 2015 at 1:42 pm

               “Not all of them helpful.”
               The last city I lived in a friend who was a police prosecutor advised us to mind my partners daughter, there were known paedophile’s living in our posh area. And they were living just outside the boundary of primary schools. So a register with these creeps names and current address would be handy to know, just so they know the public know not to consider getting up to no good.
               • tracey …

                 2 April 2015 at 1:46 pm

                 How are you going to save the children from all the “paedophiles”, sexual abusers and rapists, never convicted and free to carry on? There are way more of them than the ones found guilty.

                 “just so they know the public know not to consider getting up to no good.”

                 You’d think if naming them was a proven way to prevent sexual assaults on chidlren and to deter others from it, … it’s llike you think this is a new idea??

                 I am often bemused at how those who have never been victims are often far more hard headed on this issue than those who have.
           • weka 7.1.1.1.1.2

             2 April 2015 at 11:55 am

             Thanks for confirming what I said Skinny. Peters is using the sexual abuse of children to gain political power. I think this is a mistake, because as a culture we are really bad at dealing with child sexual abuse. Culturally we think that it’s all those bad men over there (let’s put them on a register), instead of understanding that the vast majority of sexual abuse of children happens at home or in situations that are very close to home (i.e. by people who are supposedly highly trusted). I’m not convinced that focusing on paedophillia (shock horror!) and controlling sex offenders with a blunt instrument like a register is the best thing to do.

             Like I said, I haven’t seen Peters’ bill yet. Do any of us really know what he is proposing? Is he talking about a register for convicted sex offenders? Of children only? Why is the timing even an issue if it’s convicted offenders and not all people being investigated/charged? These kinds of messy boundaries and unclarities and people with agendas mirror both what happens with sexual abuse of children and how society at large responds (or doesn’t respond) to that. Playing political power games with this stuff is not a good way to solve sexual crime issues, and doing it in the context of macho politics certainly isn’t.
             • tracey …

               2 April 2015 at 12:01 pm

               does it have an exception if the victim wants to be protected from identification…

               what we don’t need is a whole bunch of people viewing this from the outside as a law and order black and white issue.

               I also am not a fan of anyone, from any political party, using sexual violence as a populist law and order grand standing.
               • weka …

                 2 April 2015 at 12:07 pm

                 Yep, and we have so little information in the pubic domain about the bill yet here we are trying to debate it. Is that normal for a party to try and introduce a bill and not have anything available to look at?

                 Thanks for that last sentence, that sums it up better than I’ve been explaining it.
                 • tracey …

                   2 April 2015 at 12:13 pm

                   I am trying to work out if the introduction of a Bill doesn’t require anything to have been drafted yet?

                   In your search did it take you to WO? I believe he is describing an awful situation for a family.

                   http://www.donotlink.com/ee09
                   • weka …

                     2 April 2015 at 12:24 pm

                     Hmmm, a few problems with that. One is, the name suppression is also there to protect the children. If they are old enough to be adults they can have their own name suppression lifted. If they’re not old enough, who is making the call on the name suppression being lifted? And what happens when you have siblings involved and one wants name suppression lifted and the other doesn’t? What are the victims’ rights here?

                     I also think that despite what he says, Slater would be in the camp of focussing on the need for vengence rather than the overall need to reduce risk for children. I’m not convinced that a register protects children so much as makes the rest of society feel better about a situation they’re not really willing to change. (but of course I don’t know because Peters hasn’t said what he intends).

                     There’s also the issue of what happens to offenders whose convictions are made public. Do we want people to rehabilitate/change or not?

                     Plus, I think Slater is also using this situation for political gain (the Cunliffe reference).
                   • tracey …

                     2 April 2015 at 12:28 pm

                     Sorry Weka, I was being deliberately vague to avoid any suggestion of breaching a suppression order. I was referring to the scenario WO refers to right at the beginning. I didn’t read the rest.

                     I have looked at NZF website and it appears it has been their policy regarding the removal of suppression for “paedophiles” before the by-election.

                     I have emailed them to ask for more detail.
                   • tracey …

                     2 April 2015 at 12:29 pm

                     Weka

                     I agree that people like slater and peters make this seem black and white and an easy fix when it isnt. Above all it must be victim-focused and like you, feel too many use it as a football for their self interest.
             • Skinny …

               2 April 2015 at 9:32 pm

               “and doing it in the context of macho politics certainly isn’t.”

               Actually dear bird, behind every macho man (I assume from this reference of yours) there is a female MP doing great work. Don’t sell yaself short sister.
               • McFlock …

                 2 April 2015 at 9:46 pm

                 Just a reminder that tomorrow’s a stat hol.
                 So Skinny can take time off from being a jerk with a massive chip on their shoulder.
                 • marty mars …

                   2 April 2015 at 9:58 pm

                   I thought all the leaders were heading to his place for a spa and a chat about the way forward 🙂
                   • McFlock …

                     2 April 2015 at 10:17 pm

                     Upon reflection, I seem to recall Skinny mentioning being a union rep or similar. So the tendency to constantly pick at a point of tension rather than backing off probably makes them quite good in that role.

                     It takes a village, I guess.
                   • marty mars …

                     2 April 2015 at 10:22 pm

                     jeeze you need cv back for the late nighters 🙂
                   • McFlock …

                     2 April 2015 at 10:27 pm

                     part of me says yes, part of me is thankful to not have been arguing about fucking medicine vs hocus pocus for the eleventy-third time 🙂
                   • marty mars …

                     2 April 2015 at 10:38 pm

                     lol sounds like you need some reiki
                 • Skinny …

                   3 April 2015 at 5:16 pm

                   Hey Mc dick got a problem with unionists?

                   Hope you enjoyed your day off today coobah, I have just finished work.
                   • McFlock …

                     4 April 2015 at 7:38 pm

                     Frankly, I regard being a unionist as your most obvious saving grace.
8. Philip Ferguson 8

   2 April 2015 at 8:30 am

   Thousands of farm workers in the Mexican state of Baja California walked out of the fields on Tuesday, March 17, at the peak of the winter harvest season.

   This strike pits against each other two diametrically-opposed social forces. On the one side, there are some of the biggest and richest companies in the world. The large farms in Baja, about 200 miles south of San Diego, specialize entirely in produce for the U.S. market – for big companies that we all know: Walmart, Safeway, Kroger, Albertsons, and others. Mexico’s produce exports to the U.S. are a business worth more than 7.5 billion US dollars a year.

   On the other side are fruit pickers, the vast majority of whom are indigenous people from the southern states of Mexico. Many of them are illiterate and don’t even speak much Spanish. Trying to escape extreme poverty, they have migrated hundreds of miles north, only to be caught up in extremely bad working and living conditions.

   The companies pay the fruit pickers as low as . . .

   full at: https://rdln.wordpress.com/2015/04/01/mexican-farm-workers-strike/
9. Philip Ferguson 9

   2 April 2015 at 8:40 am

   “The Cotton On attempt to take away the breaks became a big issue on social media and also in the mainstream news. Cotton On’s website was deluged with criticisms, following news coverage of the issue, and the company was pilloried by the TV3 news-comedy show 7 Days. In the space of about a week there were at least 50 stories in the media on the issue.

   “Faced with industrial action and public support for the workers, plus solidarity from Cotton On distribution workers in Brisbane, Australia – the company is currently attempting to prevent unionisation in its Victoria distribution centre – the bosses have retreated. The first-ever collective agreement between the company and FIRST Union was ratified by the Cotton On workers belonging to the union yesterday (April 1).

   “The company gave up its attempt to. . .

   full at: https://rdln.wordpress.com/2015/04/02/workers-at-cotton-on-win-pay-and-teabreak-victory/

   Phil
10. The Chairman 10

    2 April 2015 at 9:03 am

    Why aren’t women tweeting their political views as often as men are?

    http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs/trending
    • tracey 10.1

      2 April 2015 at 11:41 am

      Have jobs (paid/unpaid) that allow less access to mobiles during work hours?
      • weka 10.1.1

        2 April 2015 at 11:59 am

        and the amount of harassment that politicised women get online, some of it extreme.
        • Hateatea 10.1.1.1

          2 April 2015 at 12:03 pm

          And whether or not being a twit or a tweeter appeals!
11. weka 11

    2 April 2015 at 9:14 am

    A website that shows just four countries are doing what is needed with their ghg emissions to keep us at 2C.

    Another 15 countries are doing something but it’s inadequte and requires someone else to do more to make up for it.

    Another 10 of the countries are completely insufficient.

    Guess which category NZ falls into.

    http://climateactiontracker.org/countries.html
    • emergency mike 11.1

      2 April 2015 at 7:06 pm

      We’ll start fast following any day now.
12. Chooky 12

    2 April 2015 at 9:14 am

    11 days remaining till the return of the Rawshark 4:

    Murray Rawshark
    phillip ure
    Colonial Rawshark
    Macro

    …..we hope…as these are some of the most intelligent and ethical and mature commenters…who are a magnet, like karol, for dialogue and other commenters
    • Pasupial 12.1

      2 April 2015 at 9:30 am

      Chooky

      You beat me to it I see, though it is only 10 days now (assuming 12/3 as the return date – technically it may be around 10pm on the 11th). I’d probably still include; greywarshark, as the only comment he’s made since Saturday was on Monday to clarify his position. The problem with people withdrawing their commentary is that it becomes difficult to ask them whether they accept being included in such a list (which mm & r-yh certainly didn’t).

      Good luck with responding calmly to the; alternating horn-honks, and obscene gestures, from those commenters driving by the picket line. I’ll be back tomorrow to hold the placard if you don’t get here first.
      • tracey 12.1.1

        2 April 2015 at 11:42 am

        greywarshark posted a video today or yesterday.
        • Pasupial 12.1.1.1

          2 April 2015 at 6:12 pm

          Tracey

          Thanks; yes I hadn’t noticed that before (and the video it linked to was intriguing). But it was a twoline throw-away in the same hour as he wrote this much longer statement (on Tuesday not Monday):

          http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-31032015/#comment-994097

          However, if you hadn’t mentioned that, I wouldn’t have scrolled back and found this comment from Murray Rawshark via Lprent:

          The solidarity that many have shown warmed the cockles of me heart on a personal level. On a political level, I think it’s a mistake, even though I probably would have done the same sort of thing. This discussion is too easily framed as gender specific, and it has been. I don’t think it is, but I only know about my own thoughts and motivations. So thanks guys, but my opinion is that it’s better to keep commenting. I was going to take a break anyway, and I think TS needs your voices.

          http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-31032015/#comment-994013

          Which does raise some questions about the value of continuing this vigil. Perhaps we should remove MR’s name from the roll and refer to the; Rawshark 3? How much of this issue is about the original banning event, and how much is about issues that we’ve been examining since then?

          I will have to sleep on it.
          • marty mars 12.1.1.1.1

            2 April 2015 at 6:54 pm

            excellent – nice comment from Murray and lprent

            probably too early to talk about the positives that have come from this whole episode…
          • weka 12.1.1.1.2

            2 April 2015 at 7:27 pm

            Thanks Pasupial, I hadn’t seen Murray’s comment but am really glad I have now read it.
      • Chooky 12.1.2

        2 April 2015 at 3:16 pm

        @Parsupal.. YES 10 DAYS to GO! …..thanks for the correction….I just copied and pasted your yesterday entry ….deleted Greywarshark from the list ….and forgot to change the number of days…ha ha….( I was interrupted …that is my excuse …because I can count backwards)

        lol…to the horn- honks and obscene gestures….and……yes well if you sleep in I will try to do the countdown
        • Pasupial 12.1.2.1

          2 April 2015 at 5:37 pm

          Chooky

          Well, no one’s infallible (eg I said the 12/3 when I meant the 12/4). When you have a child under three months old; there is no such thing as a sleep-in, or a holiday – at least I’m not walking into walls with the sleep deprivation anymore.

          I will be up and at home near a computer tomorrow morning; so if you have a chance to take a break over the long weekend, I can maintain the vigil here.
          • Chooky 12.1.2.1.1

            2 April 2015 at 10:51 pm

            good…i am working over Easter…so am around as back up

            As regards your comment “How much of this issue is about the original banning event, and how much is about issues that we’ve been examining since then?”….i think it is about all of these ….people don’t just walk off without good reason..they are pissed off….and it isn’t just one or two people…imo although MR doesnt want to be responsible for pulling down the house…the problem remains
          • Chooky 12.1.2.1.2

            2 April 2015 at 11:11 pm

            PS:…the song sentiment that springs to mind regarding the ban and walk out is..it may be a count down to nowhere /nothing
    • tracey 12.2

      2 April 2015 at 11:42 am

      the irony of you mentioning karol is not lost on me, Given her reasons for leaving.
      • weka 12.2.1

        2 April 2015 at 11:58 am

        +1
      • Karen 12.2.2

        2 April 2015 at 12:02 pm

        +1
        I really miss Karol.
        • r0b 12.2.2.1

          2 April 2015 at 12:06 pm

          Me too. And tracey is right.
13. Chooky 13

    2 April 2015 at 9:26 am

    ‘Palestine gets ICC membership, opening door to Israel war crimes prosecution’

    http://rt.com/news/245793-palestine-icc-israel-crimes/

    “Palestine is soon to have its day in court, after securing long-awaited membership at The Hague. Plagued by constant setbacks to a peace deal with Israel, the ICC newcomer wants to see Tel Aviv on the stand for alleged war crimes in Gaza…

    ICC membership has been years in the making. It comes after Palestine gained UN observers status, followed by an increasing number of European countries recognizing them as an independent state or considering it. Israel’s operation tipped the balance in the Palestinians’ favor….

    Joining the ICC opens up possibilities: the Palestinian leadership can not only take the Israelis to task for their summer campaign, they can also challenge the Jewish state’s continuing settlement building beyond the Green Line as a war crime. Israel’s settlement building has been condemned by the international community, including the UN”….
14. Sable 14

    2 April 2015 at 9:28 am

    Worth signing:

    https://secure.avaaz.org/en/monsanto_dont_silence_science_c/?bKvKGgb&v=56276
15. And thenthere'sme 15

    2 April 2015 at 9:34 am

    To the tune of “Daisy, Daisy…”

    Sabin, Sabin, where the fuck are you?
    It’s so crazy, give me your answer do…
    It won’t be a stylish trial,
    If you [r0b: too far]
    But you’ll look sweet, upon the seat
    Of a cell block just for you!
    • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 15.1

      2 April 2015 at 2:46 pm

      If Sabin gets put in a “cell block” as you implied there, will the Nats scream and scramble to throw away the Key?
16. weka 16

    2 April 2015 at 9:35 am

    There are few delights to compare with the sight of power-hungry people panicking.The bland sense of entitlement fraying at the edges……

    John Cleese

    https://twitter.com/JohnCleese/status/582870473190481920

    h/t blue leopard.
17. ianmac 17

    2 April 2015 at 10:08 am

    Dita De Boni. Crikey. This is a new and frightening angle! National claims to stand for free enterprise and freedom of action. This would destroy that claim.

    At the moment, the only thing standing between New Zealand and its total loss of sovereignty is Winston Peters.

    Dislike him or write him off as you will, he is the only person now positioned close enough to the wet noodles of power to strenuously oppose the Investor-State Dispute Settlement provisions (ISDS) in the absolutely ruinous TPP free trade agreement our Government is desperately trying to ram through with 11 other nations.

    For this reason alone, Peters deserves the support of anyone who doesn’t want our laws to be dictated, chilled or altered by foreign corporations. Which should, in fact, be most of us….
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11426641
    • The Murphey 17.1

      2 April 2015 at 12:15 pm

      http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/includes/lateline_20150309.htm

      Video archives from Tuesday evenings show on the TPP
      • ianmac 17.1.1

        2 April 2015 at 12:38 pm

        A headline from lateline “Trade Minister Andrew Robb (Aus) says DFAT has held more than a thousand briefings with stakeholders about the TPP. He says the public will have months to look at the detail of the deal, before it’s ratified by parliament. Political Correspondent Tom Iggulden reports on what the TPP could mean for Australia.
    • The Chairman 17.2

      2 April 2015 at 6:50 pm

      @ ianmac

      It will be interesting to see which parties support or oppose it when it comes to voting on the Bill.

      I wonder which way Labour will go?

      Apparently, the Maori Party will support it through its first reading.
18. Molly 18

    2 April 2015 at 11:30 am

    Another fire for deep sea oil in the Gulf of Mexico.

    The UK government included a £660m handout to Permex in their recent trade deal with Mexico.

    The death of four workers was sufficiently distressing enough to warrant a tweet from Permex. Their deaths increase the tally of workers killed in fires at Permex facilities in the last three years to a total of 64.

    Charlie Kronick, oil analyst for Greenpeace UK, said: “This tragic accident … once again demonstrates the true cost of our addiction to oil, whether in the Gulf of Mexico, Nigeria or the Arctic. The sooner we end our dependence on dirty and dangerous fuels like oil and shift to clean energy, the better.”
    
    • miravox 18.1

      2 April 2015 at 11:32 pm

      I’m appalled by bad practices on rigs and in industrial plants that lead to injury, death and environmental damage. However, I was disappointed in the Charlie Kronick statement, I think he’s being a bit opportunist here.

      Other energy sources can also lead to injury, death and environmental degradation if the systems, people and resources to make them safe are not sufficient or effective.

      Pemex seems to be one of these companies with a poor safety record (not that investors care) and that’s the issue here, I think.
19. Barfly 19

    2 April 2015 at 11:39 am

    Re the TPPA

    Is it possible to withdraw from this agreement in the future or will we be stuck with it forever?
    • Draco T Bastard 19.1

      2 April 2015 at 11:48 am

      IMO, it’s always possible to withdraw from such agreements. Others may disagree with this.
    • weka 19.2

      2 April 2015 at 12:04 pm

      Like Draco I think it’s always possible. But you have to look at the consequences. The general idea is that once in you can’t get out unless you radically change the direction of our governance. Is that likely for us? Would we stand up against the huge pressures to toe the line? If pulling out means we would be fined, would we refuse to pay the fine? What would happen then? etc

      This is one of the hugely evil things about the TPPA (and other agreements). The current govt can bind NZ into agreements permanently and no other subsequent govt can easily override them. This completely and utterly renders our democratic process (such that it is) irrelevant. If National get a TPPA that is based on their policies, no other government (eg L/GP/NZF) can change that (except with the caveat above). We lose our rights to determine the political nature of our governance.
      • tracey 19.2.1

        2 April 2015 at 12:08 pm

        I wonder if it is also because we will enact a bunch of laws to support the implementation which would all have to be undone. This is part of the ruse… make it so hard to undo something it sticks.
        • Karen 19.2.1.1

          2 April 2015 at 12:33 pm

          I think that the various laws that would need to be changed in order to meet all the rumoured provisos in the TPPA are what will help stop it going through. I am not a lawyer, but my understanding is that while cabinet can approve the signing of the TPPA without taking it to parliament, there will be law changes required and these would have to go through parliament before it is ratified.

          Any lawyers that could help here?
          • tracey 19.2.1.1.1

            2 April 2015 at 12:41 pm

            Professor Jane Kelsey explains it pretty well here Karen.

            http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO1403/S00429/one-more-time-pm-parliament-does-not-get-to-ratify-tppa.htm
            • Karen 19.2.1.1.1.1

              2 April 2015 at 12:55 pm

              Thanks, Tracey, but I don’t understand what Jane means when she says:

              “At most, Parliament could refuse to pass legislation that is required to bring a particular law into compliance with the TPPA. But the government will have plenty of non-legislative ways to achieve compliance”

              What are the non-legislative ways to achieve compliance?
              • tracey …

                2 April 2015 at 1:06 pm

                By using regulations which do not require a vote from Parliament.

                Once Cabinet has agreed and signed the Treaty there is a good faith binding under International Law.

                http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO1312/S00148/explanation-of-nzs-treaty-making-process.htm

                “The Cabinet manual spells out the powers and process for entering into international treaties. Paragraph 7.112 states that “In New Zealand, the power to take treaty action rests with the Executive.” In practice that means the Cabinet.

                Cabinet decides whether to enter into negotiations, the negotiating mandate and any revisions to it, and what trade-offs are made to conclude a deal.

                Cabinet then approves the signing of the agreed text by the Minister. This is a definitive step that binds the government to act in good faith towards its negotiating partners. The Cabinet manual makes it clear that by signing an agreement the executive indicates an intention for New Zealand to be bound to that text. This constitutes a good faith obligation under international law.

                Parliament does not get to see the completed text until that stage. According to the Cabinet Manual, a signed TPPA would then be presented to Parliament, accompanied by a National Interest Analysis. These analyses have been widely criticised during the standing orders reviews and submissions on the International Treaties Bill for their lack of independence and balance, because they are prepared by the same Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade that negotiated the agreement. “
                • tracey …

                  2 April 2015 at 1:08 pm

                  Here’s the extract from the Cabinet Manual which covers Regulations

                  http://cabinetmanual.cabinetoffice.govt.nz/7.77
                  • Karen …

                    2 April 2015 at 1:13 pm

                    Thanks very much for that, Tracey.
                    • tracey …

                      2 April 2015 at 1:18 pm

                      No problem. To clarify most Acts have Regulations, so it would be using existing Acts to add or amend their Regulations to give effect to any TPP stuff. That is what I think Kelsey is referring to.
20. tracey 20

    2 April 2015 at 12:35 pm

    Darby and Joan to be saved from the chopping block. Key has said they won’t be sacrificed… probably cos he will tell Northlanders you can have the bridge or the trees. Your choice.
    http://nzfirst.org.nz/news/darby-and-joan-chopping-block-what-cost
21. Saarbo 21

    2 April 2015 at 12:58 pm

    An interesting article from Trotter on Stuart Nash http://bowalleyroad.blogspot.co.nz/2015/04/the-nashing-of-labours-teeth-why-being.html

    Worth a read, perhaps the first time a Labour MP has stepped out of line under Little’s leadership. In my view, Nash is a problem for Labour. His personal values and Labour’s simply don’t match.
    • tracey 21.1

      2 April 2015 at 1:09 pm

      I think someone posted it yesterday, cos I recall a few comments about it being Nash who seems to step out of line with his “policy” announcements.
22. Sable 22

    2 April 2015 at 1:10 pm

    More on the TPPA:

    http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2015/03/tpp-bad-even-us-congress-shocked/
    • tracey 22.1

      2 April 2015 at 1:32 pm

      Thanks. Funny how their verson of our MP’s can read over it, but ours can’t…
23. BassGuy 23

    2 April 2015 at 1:26 pm

    Retailers are calling for a revamp of Easter trading laws.

    They don’t want people to have to work, of course, only work if you want to, but I think enough of us have seen how that really works out for a good number of workers.
    • Rosie 23.1

      2 April 2015 at 4:54 pm

      Ha! What did I say yesterday? Sooooo predictable. Oderings garden centres go on about Easter trading hours, Every. Single. Year. They’ve got a freaking obsession with it. Unclench that tight arse of yours Boss and give your workers time to be with their friends and family on a couple of those three and half days of the year when they can actually do that.

      http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-01042015/#comment-994200
      • millsy 23.1.1

        2 April 2015 at 5:06 pm

        I hopr Oderings allow their workers to say ‘no’ to working on Good Friday without any retribution.
      • weka 23.1.2

        2 April 2015 at 6:04 pm

        Nice one Rosie!

        I can see the rationale for tourist towns, but garden centres?!
        • Rosie 23.1.2.1

          3 April 2015 at 9:20 am

          Their argument has always been (and I see the logic in it, I just oppose them opening) is that customers are getting a whole four days off to work in their gardens, and those customers need to get into their stores to get their supplies.

          Autumn, not that it’s feeling particularly autumnal, is a perfect time for planting perennials, shrubs and tree’s. Gardeners are also busy pruning and clearing old summer growth and doing general maintenance work. Garden centres are selling equipment and tools as well as plants and tree’s.
          This is a time of year when garden centres can make a steady profit before the less profitable winter season sets in.
          • weka 23.1.2.1.1

            3 April 2015 at 10:28 am

            “is that customers are getting a whole four days off to work in their gardens, and those customers need to get into their stores to get their supplies.”

            Aah, the altruism 😉

            The last rationale makes a bit more sense, but even then I think if you can’t run a business all year without those two days at Easter there is something wrong.
      • BassGuy 23.1.3

        2 April 2015 at 6:47 pm

        Well, can’t argue with that! You win an easter egg.
24. saveNZ 24

    2 April 2015 at 4:12 pm

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11426641
25. Clemgeopin 25

    2 April 2015 at 4:14 pm

    A message for Peter Dunne, Marama Fox and Te Ururoa Flavell and from UK.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/67588442/uk-deputy-pm-nick-clegg-set-to-lose-seat-in-election–poll
26. felix 26

    2 April 2015 at 4:36 pm

    Questions for Oral Answer

    Thursday, 2 April 2015

    Questions to Ministers

    1. PHIL TWYFORD to the Minister for State Owned Enterprises: What reports, if any, has he received about KiwiRail’s plans to get rid of electric locomotives on the North Island Main Trunk Line and replace them with diesel locomotives?

    2. JULIE ANNE GENTER to the Minister for State Owned Enterprises: Is he considering replacing the electric locomotives with diesel locomotives on the Main Trunk Line, and would this mean removing electrification on that line?

    Labour and Greens, this is getting to be beyond a joke. Are you not talking to each other before question time at all?
27. North 27

    2 April 2015 at 5:28 pm

    This in the Northern Advocate – http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11426838

    Then, in the comments section below the article this in relation to the offender, from from Desi Boyz of Remuera – “Maori, I’m betting.”

    ???
    • the pigman 27.1

      2 April 2015 at 7:14 pm

      Reported that. Considering that all those major media outlets tend to hold back comments before publishing them, it is pretty extraordinary it was published.

      Letters to the Editor ain’t what they used to be.
      • weka 27.1.1

        3 April 2015 at 10:32 am

        It’s still there 🙁 Love the comments in response to it though. Northern Advocate not afraid of a bit of sarcasm.

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