Open mike 05/08/2022

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, August 5th, 2022 - 37 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:


Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

37 comments on “Open mike 05/08/2022 ”

  • Comments are now closed

  1. PsyclingLeft.Always 1
    5 August 2022 at 8:06 am

    James Shaw only contender as Green co-leader nominations close

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/472237/james-shaw-only-contender-as-green-co-leader-nominations-close

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cnut#The_story_of_Cnut_and_the_waves

    Well….James was standing on a beach. Marama Davidson might smile : ) ?

    • Jimmy 1.1
      5 August 2022 at 9:28 am

      A bit like playing tennis on your own. A bit of a waste of time but at least you always win!

    • Ad 1.2
      5 August 2022 at 10:30 am

      Even Ian Foster knows his own team supports him.

      • arkie 1.2.1
        5 August 2022 at 10:47 am

        He does seem to adhere to your thinking regarding the Green party:

        Ian Foster has urged his side to "man up"

        https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/sport/472266/time-for-the-all-blacks-to-man-up

        • Ad 1.2.1.1
          5 August 2022 at 11:40 am

          Like Ian Foster, Shaw has behaved in a dignified manner despite being ruthlessly undercut by his own members and largely unsupported by his own MPs.

          The Green Party activists have not provided any alternative to James Shaw, so it's time to show that they can unite again and support the leader they have again chosen.

          • Jimmy 1.2.1.1.1
            5 August 2022 at 11:58 am

            Well said. Shaw has got them to where they are today. They would be crazy to dump him. Oh that's right, a lot of them are crazy….but I'm sure they will see sense.

            • Bearded Git 1.2.1.1.1.1
              5 August 2022 at 12:44 pm

              If only Shaw was as clever, logical and fault-free as Luxon.

              (Labour, Green and MP readers will recognise this as sarcasm.)

          • arkie 1.2.1.1.2
            5 August 2022 at 12:08 pm

            Your continued misunderstanding of the internal processes of the Green party is hard not to see as deliberate.

            The fact that there is no other candidate is the sign of 'unity' that is perceived as so important. As has been explained to you, the election process will allow members to ask questions of, and have discussion with the candidate. This is a positive outcome.

            • Ad 1.2.1.1.2.1
              5 August 2022 at 12:47 pm

              Your misunderstanding of the sea of difference between party members and party voters is impressive.

              If as you claim this is actually unity, I would hate to see what disunity looks like.

              If as you say this was all planned, what evidence do you have out of this other than the same guy gets up doing the same job as the same leader with the same policies in the same ministerial role in the same government?

              • arkie …
                5 August 2022 at 1:07 pm

                What I am distinctly aware of is how an appearance of 'disunity' can be fostered and disseminated to the voting public by those uninterested in the more direct form of representative democracy that underlines Green party procedures. There's a diversity of views in the membership and this is the result of that. What the singular candidate co-leader campaign expressly requires is direct discussion between members and the candidate. This will allow those with concerns about Shaw to voice them directly and get answers that will either satisfy them or not, but the facilitation of dialogue between the membership and MPs is a positive outcome. The same guy ends up doing the same job as the same co-leader more attuned and informed of the concerns of membership. That he has the same policies in the same ministerial role in the same government is because of Ardern and Labour.

                If as you say this was all planned

                Where have I said that?

                • Ad …
                  5 August 2022 at 2:21 pm

                  "…the election process will allow members to ask questions of, and have discussion with the candidate. This is a positive outcome."

                  Such confidence in process hasn't been in evidence. The Greens have illustrated that 25% of the Delegates could only get James Shaw to listen by proposing to fire him. And could continue to do so.

                  As in any party there are factions. Shaw's faction were asleep that weekend and didn't see the challenge from the 25% of the loonies until it was too late and it simply exploded their Annual Conference.

                  Shaw's team will not be so asleep now.

                  What has changed as a result is that Shaw's 5-year work to reassure 10-15% of voters that the Greens are stable and don't fall apart has yet again died as it was in October 2017. The 25% imply that they want greater purity and smaller vote share as a result.

                  The way to get into Cabinet is trust, delivery, and patronage. Shaw has delivery and patronage, but the trust will be shaken.

                  It may well be that the 25% of Delegates feel more listened to, after all some trees really do fall in the forest and really are heard. But the cost is with the bulk of the Green voters who are not of that 25% of Delegates.

                  • arkie …
                    5 August 2022 at 2:40 pm

                    As is demonstrated by the relatively stable support of the Greens across elections their voter base aren’t going to change their party vote based on this event.

                    Shaw’s team will not be so asleep now.

                    This is a positive outcome.

                    The rest is typical florid language. It is to be seen whether this whole issue will have the electoral results you imagine but framing being answerable to portions of the party that you call loonies, as ‘shaken trust’ of ‘the bulk of the Greens voters’ is hopeful at best.

                    Those who party vote Green do not have an alternative party; there’s no one else in parliament advocating the things that they do.

    • Barfly 2.1
      5 August 2022 at 12:17 pm

      Hmm has he had another promotion?

      Is he a "5 star Apostle " now?

    • bwaghorn 2.2
      5 August 2022 at 12:43 pm

      Give him enough rope , hell hang himself at some point

    • Peter 2.3
      5 August 2022 at 1:27 pm

      "He has no personal parliamentary ambitions." I've said it before. He wants to be in Parliament but he does not want to be in a parliament where he is not the Top Dog.

      There are disciplines, structures and strictures. He can only handle being The Boss. There is work to be done. He is not interested in actually doing the work necessary. He could not handle that but he can handle spouting and spouting.

      He is so Trumpian. He is afraid of standing for Parliament and not winning a seat. i.e. being a loser. That's why he sent 'the missus' out in the last election.

    • mauī 2.4
      5 August 2022 at 7:11 pm

      The people most concerned about restrictions on our freedom and rights, are the facists? Ok..

      • observer 2.4.1
        5 August 2022 at 9:43 pm

        They restrict our freedom and rights all the time. They will do it again tomorrow.

        They have the freedom to ask for our votes, and the people exercise their own freedom not to give them any. That is why fascists hate democracy.

        • mauī 2.4.1.1
          6 August 2022 at 6:13 pm

          I'm sure those in disagreement said similar things about the springbok tour protestors too…

  3. Sanctuary 3
    5 August 2022 at 10:04 am

    20% of the USAF B-2 bomber force is currently now based in Brisbane.

    This puts them well beyond the reach of any Chinese tactical medium range ballistic missiles – If China wanted to hit Amberley RAAF base they'd need to use an ICBM (and we are currently out range of anything China has except an SLBM). The United States is clearly developing fall back options should Guam prove to be untenable in a war with China.

  4. tsmithfield 4
    5 August 2022 at 11:35 am

    I have just received the Research and Development survey from Stats NZ in the mail. It is a 16 page survey (8 folded A3 pages), along with a covering letter and a return envelope. I assume it has been posted to thousands of businesses throughout NZ.

    This posted survey seems like a huge unnecessary cost both to the environment and the tax payer in terms of trees required to produce it, and C02 costs for posting the survey and having it returned. Plus needless costs to the taxpayer that could have otherwise been used for helping the needy.

    All these costs could have been avoided by putting the survey online, which should have happened years ago IMO.

    So, what should I do to protest this? I have emailed them and told them my thoughts. But perhaps I could refuse to send it back on the grounds that I am trying to save the planet, and don't want to be complicit in the C02 emissions. Another option would be to comply by scanning the document and emailing it back to them rather than posting it.

    Surely this is just bad from a government department that should be leading by example.

    • Ad 4.1
      5 August 2022 at 11:42 am

      We did that last time for the Census and it was a disaster so big it nearly invalidated the entire census. The degree of digital poverty in this country remains stubbornly high.

      • tsmithfield 4.1.1
        5 August 2022 at 11:47 am

        That might be true for private citizens. But for NZ companies?

        The companies being targeted with this survey are almost certain to be able to complete the survey online.

        So, I don't really think the experience with the previous census is an acceptable excuse with respect to this particular survey.

        Also, Stats NZ already offers some of its Surveys online, and has an option to request a paper version e.g:

        https://www.stats.govt.nz/help-with-surveys/list-of-stats-nz-surveys/about-the-agricultural-production-survey/

        So, no excuse why they couldn’t do the same with this one.

        • Ad 4.1.1.1
          5 August 2022 at 11:56 am

          Agree if it's a company focus.

          • tsmithfield 4.1.1.1.1
            5 August 2022 at 12:11 pm

            Another peeve of mine is all the junk mail going into letterboxes.

            That type of marketing should be banned on environmental grounds as well. And I don't think there would be much complaint from the general population.

      • Sanctuary 4.1.2
        5 August 2022 at 12:34 pm

        So much government is now online I think the time has come for legislation to require ISPs & mobile data to zero rate the top level domain of .govt.nz. Also, a free ISP that just provides access to those government services should be set up by the government.

        That way no matter how poor you are you can access government services at a local and national level.

  5. Ad 5
    5 August 2022 at 12:01 pm

    Two squash players are representing different countries but are partners in life and also cousins.

    Aussie wife to meet Scottish husband in squash mixed doubles (1news.co.nz)

    Instead of two national anthems they'll just need one rendition of duelling banjoes.

  6. joe90 6
    5 August 2022 at 1:35 pm

    ..it's reasonable to expect that Mr Jones could be in deep, deep trouble…

    https://twitter.com/dansolomon/status/1555308565715451904

    • Ad 6.1
      5 August 2022 at 2:24 pm

      Of the very, very slim pickings that the left have extracted from the US hard right in the last 6 years (outside the Jan 6 Committee prosecutions), this would surely rank as a small but juicy fruit.

  7. Populuxe1 7
    5 August 2022 at 3:55 pm

    Nancy Pelosi's visit to Taiwan is really the most perplexing move on her part. One can only put it down to ego given that the Defense Department asked her not to go, Biden was deliberately ambiguous about the whole thing in the media, and it clearly achieved nothing for Taiwan except to have missiles fired over it by China, and probably set back US-China relations even further than they were already. Unlike Ukraine where there is a very clear set of situational priorities in play vis a vis NATO, the Taiwan trip had no real justification to it whatsoever beyond China's status quo sabre rattling.

    • Peter 7.1
      5 August 2022 at 4:21 pm

      China should have a list of who the US (and us I suppose) will be allowed to deal with, have relationships with and can visit or accept visitors from.

      Is that how it works? Oh, and get a list from Russia too I presume.

      • Populuxe1 7.1.1
        5 August 2022 at 4:58 pm

        Oh please don't pretend Pelosi is an ordinary American or that her physical presence was required to assert the US position. She didn't just decide to go for her health and I'm pretty sure the Taiwanese authorities didn't invite her. Unless there's overt aggression, as there is with Russia, there is no point in deliberately provoking more tension than there already is. I'm sure Japan would rather not have missiles splashing down in their EEZ. It's not diplomacy in concert with other relevant nations, it's crude showboating and apparently without Pentagon backing.

The server will be getting hardware changes this evening starting at 10pm NZDT.
The site will be off line for some hours.