Open mike 05/09/2023

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, September 5th, 2023 - 79 comments
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79 comments on “Open mike 05/09/2023 ”

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  1. PsyclingLeft.Always 1
    5 September 2023 at 7:54 am

    Reay wants deadly quake building complaint dismissed

    A man whose company was responsible for designing the six-storey Christchurch building that collapsed in the February 2011 earthquake, killing 115 people, is trying to halt a disciplinary process, claiming he has suffered prejudice.

    The complaint against Reay was first raised in December 2012, after the release of a Canterbury Earthquakes Royal Commission report, which found Reay breached the 1986 IPENZ Code of Ethics.

    https://www.odt.co.nz/news/national/reay-wants-deadly-quake-building-complaint-dismissed

    But..but..he's 82 ! Yea now he's 82. Been trying to dodge this ..for years. Those poor people… crushed. 115 killed.

    Dr Alan Reay, who owned Alan Reay Consultants, has been criticised for giving his inexperienced structural engineer David Harding “sole responsibility” for designing the Canterbury Television (CTV) building when he knew the engineer lacked the necessary experience.

  2. PsyclingLeft.Always 2
    5 September 2023 at 8:03 am

    NZ Labour. And the kind of moron we are up against.

    Brendon Pascoe

    Furious man in Donald Trump T-shirt shouts at Chris Hipkins during Auckland walkabout

    He then shouted, "Where is he", as Pascoe tried to find Hipkins in the crowd.

    Pascoe then appeared to lunge at a police officer and stared him down before he started walking away.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/09/furious-man-in-donald-trump-t-shirt-shouts-at-chris-hipkins-during-auckland-walkabout.html

    A..trump supporting ! fuckwit.

  3. gsays 3
    5 September 2023 at 8:46 am

    After a couple of sleeps I gotta say the CTU ad having a crack at Luxon feels like a mis-step.

    Far rather the meagre resources were spent high-lighting why members should support Labour.

    A punchy sentence about FTA for example. Or encouraging and supporting folk to vote.

    This negative, personal strategy leaves a bad taste and implies people can't work through the issues themselves.

    So far the only defence Ive read is 'They do it too…'

    • Tiger Mountain 3.2
      5 September 2023 at 2:07 pm

      It is a flawed strategy–don’t use your opponents image for starters–from an organisation that has been very low profile for decades apart from the Helen Kelly period. The NZCTU excels in being subservient to State Sector affiliates & “welcoming” anything and everything that the Labour Caucus deigns to announce.

      The NZ working class have long needed a fighting class left central labour organisation since the demise of the NZ Federation of Labour in 1987. But this is not an easy build given the substantial collapse of private sector union density since the Natzos first union busting ECA in 1991. Sure FIRST Union, Unite, Etū, Maritime and Dairy Workers have done some great work, but a Mick Lynch ain’t going to happen at the CTU while the PSA and friends are in charge.

      NActFirst have ECA mkII well in train–a blatant attack on the NZ working class in favour of capital. Rather than attack Baldrick, the ad could better have led with the Natzos hit list of minimum wage etc. etc. etc. and a call to arms and defence of the gains made since 2017.

      • gsays 3.2.1
        5 September 2023 at 3:40 pm

        I absolutely agree with yr final paragraph. Some enjoy easy potshots at Luxon over his appearance, they come across as shallow and petty. Go him for his conflict of interest in being a landlord and proposing making landlording more profitable.

        Your mention of Helen Kelly and thinking about Ardern, I doubt this CTU ad would have got approval from either of them.

        I'm sure the ad, billboards and other sundries cost a pretty penny and it seems squandered. Kinda fitting.

    • AB 3.3
      5 September 2023 at 2:40 pm

      It's a sliding scale. Something like Citizens for Rowling in 1975 was clearly a misstep – a group of liberal intellectuals who were pretty much right in what they said about Muldoon, but clearly gave the impression of talking down to voters. The condescension of it was grist to the mill of Muldoon and his so-called "Rob's mob", which was an earlier incarnation of "Waitakere Man". And it made no difference to the election result.

      The CTU ad is not so clear cut. It's a trade union organisation with members who have legitimate interests, not a self-appointed group of supposed thought-leaders. The ad plugs into a commonly noted fact that many people are not really comfortable with Luxon in the way they were with Key.**. It is well-timed by following the grubby fiasco of letting foreign buyers back in. It gave Hipkins a chance to point out that the Taxpayers Union is a National Party front. It was a lead-in to discussing the implications for workers of National's policies. It provoked a response from National which will now make them look hypocritical if they respond with similar ads – I suspect these are already sitting in the pipeline – and they may be thinking about whether they need to pull some of them or not.

      The only thing about it that crossed a line was how it made use of Luxon's unprepossessing physical appearance. In that feature alone I think it started to look like some of the unsavoury stuff that comes from the right. It's a common tactic though, for example the NZ Herald subtly uses pictures of Hipkins suffused in an orange wash, while Luxon is mostly crystal-sharp and making decisive hand-gestures like a man in the act of 'getting things done' (not spouting inane, scripted lines). So overall I'm not certain it was a misstep.

      ** Key's supposed likeability always baffled me. I am probably odd or unusual, but after seeing Key on the telly I always felt like I should be hosed down with antiseptic for my health's sake.

      • PsyclingLeft.Always 3.3.1
        5 September 2023 at 3:04 pm

        Key's supposed likeability always baffled me.

        And many others..incl me ! sir Key always struck me as not as affable/likeable as he purported. A fake even….with quite a strange sleazy component. That poor Waitress for one….

        • Tiger Mountain 3.3.1.1
          5 September 2023 at 3:32 pm

          Yes, sir Key seemed “off” for sure, even Winston asked if “the carpet matched the curtains” and introduced the nation to a new kink…trichophilia–hair fetishism.

          “Shonkey” (rhymes with “Jean Qui“ a friend said), certainly had twin turbo boost support from Finance Capital one way or another in his political affairs. The off shore Trust debacle for instance…there is quite a trail there that so many NZers seemed totally oblivious to.

      • Anne 3.3.2
        5 September 2023 at 3:40 pm

        Critics need to appreciate:

        The CTU is not talking to the general voting public. They are talking to their own people. I refer to the factory workers, the road workers, forest workers, cleaners, carpenters, transport workers, port workers etc. etc.

        What better way to get the message across than wrapping it in the newspaper with the largest readership as well as hoardings in cities across NZ – assuming they are in places other than Wellington.

        • Tiger Mountain 3.3.2.1
          5 September 2023 at 3:54 pm

          Good point Anne.

        • PsyclingLeft.Always 3.3.2.2
          5 September 2023 at 3:58 pm

          The CTU is not talking to the general voting public. They are talking to their own people. I refer to the factory workers, the road workers, forest workers, cleaners, carpenters, transport workers, port workers etc. etc.

          IE Me….and many thousands of others..who NAct will standover….and steal from.

          • gsays 3.3.2.2.1
            5 September 2023 at 4:08 pm

            I'm one of them too. E Tu. That's why I have a bee in my bonnet on this, I reckon my fees have been squandered.

      • gsays 3.3.3
        5 September 2023 at 3:47 pm

        I take yr point about Luxon/Key. Whenever I see Key I reckon you would have to count yr fingers if you shook his hand. Too smarmy for my liking.

        As to hypocrisy, that would be anyone who bemoaned dirty politics/Bretheren/Whaleoil but think this CTU effort is ok.

        • PsyclingLeft.Always 3.3.3.1
          5 September 2023 at 3:51 pm

          As to hypocrisy, that would be anyone who bemoaned dirty politics/Bretheren/Whaleoil but think this CTU effort is ok.

          You really see equivalence? Bizarre.

          • gsays 3.3.3.1.1
            5 September 2023 at 4:00 pm

            You either play with a straight bat or not.

            • PsyclingLeft.Always 3.3.3.1.1.1
              5 September 2023 at 4:01 pm

              lol..whatever . I call bizarre equivalence.

            • bwaghorn 3.3.3.1.1.2
              5 September 2023 at 5:13 pm

              So labour bas someone in the office next to the pm feed hit prices to the ctu?

              That's what national was doing with whaleoil

            • Bearded Git 3.3.3.1.1.3
              5 September 2023 at 11:34 pm

              Maybe you should be telling Luxon, Bishop and the other Nats that.

              Luxon has been slogging to cow corner ever since he became leader.

  4. PsyclingLeft.Always 4
    5 September 2023 at 8:55 am

    Well this is interesting…

    The head of the University of Waikato was intimately involved in National's policy of establishing a medical school at the university, and told one of its senior MPs it could be a "present" to a future National government.

    Documents seen by RNZ show vice chancellor Professor Neil Quigley went to considerable lengths to help National develop the policy. Quigley was in constant contact with the party's health spokesperson, Dr Shane Reti, in the lead-up to its announcement in July this year.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/497281/university-of-waikato-boss-referred-to-new-medical-school-as-a-present-for-future-national-government

    IMO doesnt pass any independence test….

  5. lprent 5
    5 September 2023 at 12:07 pm

    There is a power outage where my server is. I just shifted to a different UPS.

    Depends on Vector about how long the outage takes to deal with. In the meantime, I have involuntary lunch time. What can I have without power…

    • Belladonna 5.1
      5 September 2023 at 1:37 pm

      Time to raid the fruit bowl?

      • lprent 5.1.1
        5 September 2023 at 1:58 pm

        I would, but there was only a shrivelled apple and a mandarin with a green-blue blemish.

        I didn’t have time to shop on the weekend because of work, and my partner was finishing a course before heading offshore with her dad.

  6. Ad 6
    5 September 2023 at 12:19 pm

    Anyone generating sympathy for 60,000 indolent millennial louches at the Burning Man mess?

  7. MickeyBoyle 7
    5 September 2023 at 12:34 pm

    [lprent: deleted as simple minded spam with no apparent content.
    Gloating by simpletons whilst wanking should wait until after an election. Something that has to be won first.
    This is your only warning. ]

    • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1
      5 September 2023 at 1:38 pm

      Havent you got a bridge to be under?

    • MickeyBoyle 7.2
      5 September 2023 at 1:41 pm

      Go on Lynn. Ban me then you [deleted]

      [lprent: First rational and responsible thing you have said. Bye. ]

      • MickeyBoyle 7.2.1
        5 September 2023 at 1:45 pm

        Truth hurts eh Lynn. See ya lol.

        • lprent 7.2.1.1
          5 September 2023 at 1:55 pm

          You have about as much of relationship with “truth” as Trump does.

          What are you worried about? I simply did what you asked for. Banned you on your request after I’d dealt with you spurting spam on my site.

          Being a ignorant sexual fetishist isn’t a problem. Stupid spam in the site is. And the truth is that you asked to be banned.

          You really are a bit of a knuckle dragger.

    • Chris 7.3
      5 September 2023 at 1:46 pm

      I can never understand why Labour cannot encapsulate in a really simple way the fundamentally flawed ideas around neo-liberalism and how such a system sucks wealth into one small corner of the world's population, so that average voters can understand. Instead, it lets the nactoids off the hook by letting them get away with "national's the party with the economic smarts" etc. Surely it's these really basic ideas that need to be at the heart of Labour's campaign.

      • gsays 7.3.1
        5 September 2023 at 4:03 pm

        One of the reasons they don't diss neo-liberalism is that they are the main practitioners of it.

        • Grey Area 7.3.1.1
          5 September 2023 at 7:30 pm

          Snap.

        • Bearded Git 7.3.1.2
          5 September 2023 at 11:44 pm

          Dumb comments like this plays to the "they are both the same" meme.

          The policies of the Left are very different to those of the Right being put forward at this election.

          Please acknowledge this gsays.

          • gsays 7.3.1.2.1
            6 September 2023 at 6:04 am

            I wouldn't say very different. I see the two main parties as the the two closest aligned parties in Parliament.

          • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.3.1.2.2
            6 September 2023 at 7:41 am

            And not only dumb….there is this.

            Don’t share defeatist bollocks. It tells swing, undecided and habitual non-voters to not bother voting left.

            https://thestandard.org.nz/the-report-of-our-death-has-been-grossly-exaggerated/

          • gsays 7.3.1.2.3
            6 September 2023 at 5:45 pm

            Now that it's not first thing in the morning, I have re-read yr comment.

            There is nothing dumb in observing that this incarnation of Labour is dyed in the wool neo-liberal. To imply otherwise is very shallow thinking.

            Little's new Te Whatu Ora is an example. Going for 'efficiencies' in the back office functions, payroll and IT systems. All well and good but still out-sourcing catering, laundry, security, grounds, parking…

            Woods and Little and their Approved Employer Scheme. Because, for some reason, we can't train welders and drivers anymore. So subcontract it. Neo-liberal as. Nurses, doctors, dentists the list goes on.

            Maybe the onus is on you to demonstrate how they are not neo-liberal.

  8. Ad 8
    5 September 2023 at 2:39 pm

    Beginning to think we need a post forecasting NZ after a term of ACT with 20% of Cabinet.

  9. Belladonna 9
    5 September 2023 at 3:03 pm

    Latest election polling from Roy Morgan – has ACT on 18% to National's 31% – with the combined right total having enough seats to govern (i.e. not needing NZF or another 3rd party).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_New_Zealand_general_election

    In this scenario – ACT with over half of the National total (23 seats to National's 39) would theoretically be in a very strong position in a coalition – in terms of getting their policy enacted. Especially as they've increased 4% (compared to the previous poll by this pollster) – so going up, while National has dropped slightly.

    I don't recall a minor party with such a strong position vis-a-vis the major one in a previous NZ election.

    Should the polls reverse (as is always a possibility) – the strong performance of the GP is putting them in the same position in relation to Labour.

    As others have been saying – the policy platform of the 'minor' parties is more relevant than ever in this election.

    • gsays 9.1
      5 September 2023 at 4:05 pm

      I think it was Hooten that observed a few weeks ago about how the two main parties share of the vote was at an all time low. If they both keep trending down as they appear to be the minor parties may not ne so minor in October.

      • Anne 9.1.1
        5 September 2023 at 5:15 pm

        Its traditional for minor parties to do well in polls prior to election day but once people get to vote many slink back to one of the two main parties. The exception to the rule are the Greens who tend to be the other way round. They do less well in pre-election polls but come up trumps on election day.

      • Belladonna 9.1.2
        5 September 2023 at 6:24 pm

        Another interesting point is what it (this high vote for the minor parties) does to the electorate list for the major ones.

        Given that (apart from Swarbrick for the GP, Seymour for ACT and the TPM winning 2-3 electorate seats) – the vast majority of the electorates will go to Labour or National. So if there are high numbers of party votes for ACT/GP and possibly NZF – it's pretty unlikely that many list MPs from Labour and National will be getting into parliament. If ACT get 23 seats – 22 of them will be list; if the GP get 16 seats, 15 of them will be list. If NZF get over the line, that's another 7, all list. That's leaving only 15 or so list places to be split between National and Labour.

        Likely to make a big difference to the government – whichever side wins. At the current polling (and bearing in mind that electorates may switch from Labour to National, 'freeing up' list places) – it doesn't look likely that Rurawhe, Little or Parker will in the next Parliament.

        Harder to tell for National – since the majority of their top list places are standing in winnable electorates as well.

        • SPC 9.1.2.1
          5 September 2023 at 7:25 pm

          At the 24 poll level – 30 seats (maybe up a few more with the wasted vote re-allocated).

          In the past Labour got around 25 seats with that party list vote. Higher or lower based on the Maori electorate numbers.

          • Belladonna 9.1.2.1.1
            5 September 2023 at 7:39 pm

            In the past, Labour didn't have the high numbers of list seats being taken up by ACT and the GP.
            Of the 30 seats they'll get (at 24%) – the vast majority look as though they're going to be electorate seats (safe Labour seats). That leaves very few to come in off the list.

            • SPC 9.1.2.1.1.1
              5 September 2023 at 8:01 pm

              It makes no difference to Labour's cjrcumstance, if National or ACT/Green gets the party list seats, when Labour is at 24% in the polls.

              It will still be c25 electorates and 30 seats either way.

              Though good Greens are at a higher level.

              It could mean National will win a lot of electorate seats back (2020) and more (2017-2014-2011-2008). But at a low 31% of the poll.

              Labour 25 MP 2-3 ACT 1. National 43-44 electorates – no list seats whatsoever. Maybe some overhang.

              • Belladonna …
                5 September 2023 at 8:36 pm

                I know it makes no difference in the total number of seats. But it has the potential to make a huge difference in the representation. If the majority of the Labour party in parliament are the electorate MPs in safe seats, rather than a mixture with the list. Just go and have a look at the list-only MPs at the top of Labour's party list. That's a lot of experience that's at serious risk of not being back in parliament.

                • SPC …
                  5 September 2023 at 8:41 pm

                  The same as other elections between 2005 and 2020 and those at risk, Parker and Little do not care – they are there for a third term, not to do another 3 years in opposition and retire in 2026.

    • Patricia Bremner 9.2
      5 September 2023 at 9:33 pm

      The New Zealand Party, The Alliance, New Zealand First, so not so unusual Belladonna. It happens at cross roads when big events have clouded choices.

      • Belladonna 9.2.1
        5 September 2023 at 9:39 pm

        So which year would this be then? I've checked back to 2011 – and not seen any evidence.
        Are you talking about last century? It can hardly be a tradition if it hasn't happened in the last 20 years……

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