Open mike 06/10/2023

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, October 6th, 2023 - 38 comments
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38 comments on “Open mike 06/10/2023 ”

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  1. Dennis Frank 1
    6 October 2023 at 6:18 am

    The panel after the minor party leaders debate was interesting in their analysis, but this reviewer felt the debate itself was unsatisfactory. Unfair, I reckon – nothing obviously wrong with the format. https://www.1news.co.nz/2023/10/06/felix-desmarais-whos-the-loser-in-minor-parties-debate/

    The panel agreed Winston was the loser. Seymour seemed a prat misbehaving, when he wasn't pretending to be a robot. James showed some spine in his style of interaction with the dork. Rawiri came across well.

    • Tony Veitch 1.1
      6 October 2023 at 7:39 am

      Significantly, apart from one mention at the beginning, the panel didn't discuss Seymour at all.

      Act have peaked at 9% IMO, and with the Natz in steady decline, and Winnie showing he's past his use-by date, there's everything to play for.

      As Bomber says, it's not over until the fat blogger sings.

      Also significantly, early voting totals are well below 2020. Which might suggest that people have not yet decided how to vote, whereas in 2020 they'd made up their minds early on.

      Take heart, lefties, it ain't over until it's over!

      • Dennis Frank 1.1.1
        6 October 2023 at 7:57 am

        Yeah, can't disagree Tony. On the face of it Labour being 10% behind National makes it seem a foregone conclusion but I think you're right to be optimistic.

        This electorate is disenchanted with both, so floaters are likely to wash up anywhere and if they watched the minor leaders debate I doubt any undecided would go for the two rightists. That 10% will decide the outcome, I reckon.

      • Patricia Bremner 1.1.2
        6 October 2023 at 12:04 pm

        Tony so correctsmiley. Apparently Chris Hipkins left isolation to some possible good poll news. I would not be surprised after Lux's mean comment the tax debacle plus Winston threatening Jack Tame, and icing on the cake of Act going down …. All good for the Left. Meantime we are working in step, looking like a Government in waiting.

    • AB 1.2
      6 October 2023 at 8:39 am

      The 'expert' panel afterwards were pathetic – not once did they discuss the actual content of what any of the leaders said. It was all ridiculous speculation about the impressions the leaders might have made and the motivations they might have had. They are courtiers, gossiping in the side halls of the palace about the powerful, who's in and who's out, calculating how to keep their careers alive. I had a sudden recall of what Walter Ralegh said about the Elizabethan courtiers: “Say to the court, it glows / and shines like rotten wood”.

      In any case, Shaw was the only one with consistently sane responses across every topic that was discussed, though his reasonableness might seem dull to some. Waititi was pretty good on most topics, but I thought some of the things he said vaguely implied that he wanted parallel Maori political systems which would be hugely problematic constitutionally and in terms of getting public support. Seymour – a deluded, small state, leave it to the market libertarian straight out of the 1980's and personally just a bit weird. Peters is incoherent and irascible – very little of it makes any sense.

      • Dennis Frank 1.2.1
        6 October 2023 at 8:56 am

        I get your angle on the thing. It was indeed displaying an aversion to substance & focus on style. Check out what these two younger gen folk thought: https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/06-10-2023/last-nights-multi-party-debate-was-all-chaos-no-conviction

        Re separatism, I've always seen that as feasible in principle. I recall standing up after Mat Rata did his thing at the Trades hall, telling the crowd about MM's justice policy stand in favour of a separate Maori justice system. I'd been running justice policy for the Greens a couple of years by then (early '93). Didn't tell him that, just told everyone I agreed with him. Was the only person to actually do that in the meeting. Wanted him to know at least one pakeha male was willing to go public in support!

        Re constitutional status, I'm open-minded. I contributed to Sir Geoffrey's revision right from the start when he appealed for help. Was extremely critical: sent in around 50/60 delineations of exactly what he got wrong. Consequently never got included in his list of helpers – despite giving equal reporting to all his points of merit! But typical Labour turkey, always fos…

    • Mike the Lefty 1.3
      6 October 2023 at 10:55 am

      I thought three waters would be a topic for discussion. Only mentioned once in passing by Seymour. Not quite the terrible socialist trick it was formerly made out to be so it seems.

      • Dennis Frank 1.3.1
        6 October 2023 at 11:28 am

        Good point! A primary issue of contention mentioned only indirectly. Seems like a lapse in programme design by the producers – shoulda showed up on Tame's list of questions. frown

  2. Mike the Lefty 2
    6 October 2023 at 6:35 am

    I hope that viewers noted that Seymour's first speech was to say that he didn't trust his probable coalition partner.

    Luxon must have had his head in his hands most of the debate.

  3. tsmithfield 3
    6 October 2023 at 7:08 am

    Well, I never saw that coming. Absolutely hammering England last night with a bits and pieces team due to injury. We were missing Williamson, Southee, and Ferguson.

    We bowled well to restrict them for 282. Then chased that down in 36 overs for the loss of only one wicket. Conway made 152 no and Ravindra 123 no. If anything qualifies as a complete spanking it has to be this result

  4. PsyclingLeft.Always 4
    6 October 2023 at 7:51 am

    Covid-19. Some (conspiracists, political candidates, et al) might like to forget this…

    New Zealand's restrictions during the pandemic saved the lives of about 20,000 people, according to new research.

    Lead author and Otago University public health professor Michael Baker said it was a "strange paradox" of preventative medicine that its success could work against it in people's minds.

    More than 3000 New Zealanders have died from Covid-19, and it is on track to kill 1000 people this year, making it the country's most deadly infectious disease at the moment.

    However, compared with other nations, New Zealand has got off extremely lightly.

    Globally, there have been about 29 million deaths in the past three years, Baker said.

    Covid -19 vaccination saved lives

    Immunisation Advisory Centre medical director professor Nikki Turner said high vaccination rates helped keep the death toll low.

    "New Zealand overall has done really well, but I think people now have got quite short memories and are forgetting how effective it was," Turner said.

    "And we still have the impact ongoing effect of Covid and other respiratory viruses."

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/499516/new-zealand-s-covid-19-response-saved-20-000-lives-research

    Winston First and his Covid-19 trials Inquiry….would be an insult and a travesty. But we have already seen his response to Science/Facts.

    Vote Left !

    • PsyclingLeft.Always 4.1
      6 October 2023 at 8:00 am

      And…Measles again.

      Te Whatu Ora has issued an alert for the whole country after a person with measles flew from Wellington to Auckland on Tuesday 3 October, after attending events in the capital.

      Medical Officer of Health for the Northern Region Jay Harrower said the person, who lives in Northland, attended a week-long National Shakespeare Schools Production at Scots College.

      The students they were in contact with then travelled to other parts of the country.

      Measles was very contagious among people who were not immune, he said.

      Vaccine hesitant? Anti vaxx? Maybe they should think..

      Te Aka Whai Ora Māori Health Authority chief medical officer Dr Rawiri McKree Jansen said this was a "serious wake-up call about the high risk of measles, particularly to our pēpi, tamariki and rangatahi".

      He said immunisation was the best protection against measles.

      https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/499499/measles-alert-issued-for-new-zealand-after-case-flew-from-wellington-to-auckland

    • Incognito 4.2
      6 October 2023 at 9:58 am

      On the topic of Covid-19, Katalin Karikó and Drew Weissman have been awarded the 2023 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine for their discoveries concerning nucleoside base modifications that enabled the development of effective mRNA vaccines against COVID-19.

      https://www.nobelprize.org/prizes/medicine/2023/press-release/

      • PsyclingLeft.Always 4.2.1
        6 October 2023 at 10:03 am

        Truly..Life saving. Thanks for that link.

      • Sanctuary 4.2.2
        6 October 2023 at 11:53 am

        It would be nice to go to your grave as a Nobel prize winner knowing millions of people who may have never heard of you are alive and going about their business because of your discoveries.

        • Adrian 4.2.2.1
          6 October 2023 at 12:07 pm

          Katalin Karikos story is exceptional, born very poor she was a brilliant student and has apparently been working since university at 18 on mRNA technology, almost 50 years of dedication. A huge personal thank you to her for my friends and family who are alive today .

        • Incognito 4.2.2.2
          6 October 2023 at 12:09 pm

          We all try to do our little bit, whatever it is, to make a difference for others, don’t we?

  5. Dennis Frank 5
    6 October 2023 at 8:08 am

    If anyone missed last night's debate there's a useful summary here: https://www.newsroom.co.nz/minor-parties-face-off-for-tvnz-debate

    Good to see James declared the winner by a bunch of non-Greens on that panel!

  6. Dennis Frank 6
    6 October 2023 at 8:33 am

    Luxon's performance review now online: https://www.newsroom.co.nz/performance-review-for-cm-luxon

    KPI Seven: Strategic Communications

    Achieved. Won over Mike Hosking. Survived Jenna and Jessica. Deflected attention away from Uffindell, Kuriger, the Collins years, wife's Tesla discount, owning seven homes and abortion belief. Stalemated the dissection of tax policies until well into the advance voting period. Lifted preferred PM ranking late in the piece to a salvageable level, helped by Chris Hipkins' failure to fire. Listened to Mary Lambie.

    KPI Nine: Take out NZ First

    Failed. Acted late in the piece to rule NZ First and Winston Peters out or in as a potential coalition partner – only to have made the 'in' message too positive and then had to walk back the level of warmth and interest in NZ First. Allowed that party to progress past the 5 percent threshold about three weeks from election day and could not eliminate them from contention, despite Peters' own best efforts. Needs further training from John Key Consultants.

    Section 4: Employee leadership development needs?

    Study the Dealing with Winston Manual, read How to End a Press Conference and Influence People, enrol David in puppy training.

    Tim Murphy is co-editor of Newsroom. I liked his comprehensive description of the diverse role-plays Lux exhibited while out campaigning. yes

    • ianmac 6.1
      6 October 2023 at 1:39 pm

      Read that and as expected Tim Murphy's National bias showed through. I knew before I read it given Murphy's Newsroom record. Such a review should have looked at the credibility issue which Luxon is so weak on.

  7. Bearded Git 7
    6 October 2023 at 8:37 am

    If you listened to the the political commentators on RNZ's Morning Report just now you would have thought the election had already taken place and National had won.

    No mention of National telling lies about its tax policy (its central policy) and getting badly caught out this week. Hardly a mention of the Greens fine polling or of TPM.

    I would love the result to turn out Lab 29 Gr 15 TPM 4 just to see their smug faces drop. This is entirely possible.

    • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1
      6 October 2023 at 8:57 am

      Hi BG..I link this one? There was some comment about "coalition of chaos" sir Key's (imo plaintive…) call for true blue nat voting…Seymour/Peters belligerence/grudge fest and… other.

      https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018909959/political-panel

      sir Key…

      "I try and hold that firepower a little bit… to be blunt, I genuinely think Christopher Luxon will be a fantastic prime minister."

      As for the relationship between David Seymour and Winston Peters, he said they got on better than he expected.

      https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/election-2023/499518/election-2023-updates-all-the-latest-developments-on-6-october

      lol..so what the fuck does he know ?! Just a creep.

      Anyway BG..I too look for the Left win.

      Edit….ACT…oh yea, there fall has has been very satisfying. Not anywhere near where they were a month ago…Good : )

      Oh and Chris Hipkins..out of Covid isolation. Cmon Chris !

      • Bearded Git 7.1.1
        6 October 2023 at 9:16 am

        Thanks for putting the link up psyc. I thought when they mentioned "Coalition of Chaos" it was in refence to Lab/Gr/TPM, but whatever. The irony is the real chaos has turned out to be on the Right.

        On another issue, I'm not sure that Chris Bishop going on about "you will get a Wealth Tax if Labour gets in" earlier this week is a good tactic given that a study reported last week (I think) said that many people supported this and/or a CGT.

        • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1.1.1
          6 October 2023 at 10:09 am

          "Coalition of Chaos"

          Yes some real chicken coming to roost, there for sure !

          Multi-party debate exposes lack of trust between David Seymour and Winston Peters

          A debate tonight offered further evidence of the gap between the ACT and NZ First leaders who may soon be in coalition negotiations with the National Party to form a new government.

          National leader Christopher Luxon should be "extremely worried".

          "I think he should be thinking 'yikes, I've got a problem here' if he hasn't already started to think that. I think their antipathy was there for everybody to see."

          RNZ journalist Guyon Espiner said Seymour saying he didn't trust Peters wasn't a great place to be going into a "three-way handshake".

          And James Shaw…showing what we ..always knew.

          As for a winner, the commentators gave it to Shaw.

          https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/on-the-inside/499506/multi-party-debate-exposes-lack-of-trust-between-david-seymour-and-winston-peters

          Cmon the Left !

    • rod 7.2
      6 October 2023 at 4:08 pm

      RNZ national is the voice of the National Party .

      1News is the voice of the National Party

      1ZB is the voice of the National Party

      That's how it folks, and there are plenty more like it in the media sad

  8. Drowsy M. Kram 8
    6 October 2023 at 8:45 am

    Release: National Tax Scam revealed: 99 percent of kiwi households won’t get $250 per fortnight [5 October 2023]

    Earlier this week a sign on my fence was defaced – it now reads “In it for you me”.

    Every lie told incurs a debt to the truth, and sooner or later that debt is paid. But National's big donors won’t be paying, and you can take that to the (ANZ) bank.

    So, some variations on a theme from the little blue book of National party ‘values’.

    Get New Zealand Unearned Income Back on Track

    Get New Zealand Mega Landlords Back on Track

    Get New Zealand Foreign Buyers Back on Track

    Potential Opportunities for Property Investors [6 October 2023]
    A change in government could see more opportunities open up for property investors in New Zealand, with adjustments to the Brightline Test, removal of the foreign buyer ban, and a reinstatement of interest deductibility just some of the policies being considered. Find out how these possible changes could reshape the property market landscape and what the overall impact would be for property investors.

    Sir seems to be salivating a little more than usual this morning… smiley

    Like a gardener preparing for spring, we're nurturing what's thriving and planting new seeds for growth after another month of heady demand in the residential property sector.
    https://rwtakanini.co.nz/news/kiwis-are-getting-their-ducks-in-a-row

    And – it's gone.

    • Bearded Git 8.1
      6 October 2023 at 8:50 am

      Great post Drowsy.

    • Ad 8.2
      6 October 2023 at 12:08 pm

      Labour losing the campaign because of National tax policy has got to go down as one of the most predictable tragedies of our entire political economy.

      • Incognito 8.2.1
        6 October 2023 at 12:43 pm

        Tax cuts of some kind by the NACTs were as predictable as night follows day. Never mind the seeds of discontent that started to sprout and firmly take root in 2020 leading to a more than usual widespread feeling for change. Certainly, Winston Peters tapped that vein well.

  9. PsyclingLeft.Always 9
    6 October 2023 at 12:35 pm

    How low can Luxo limboooo…..Im sure the Limbo in the link is slightly different but IMO Christopher Luxon is getting limbo-lower: )

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/on-the-inside/499553/power-play-is-new-zealand-heading-for-a-post-election-limboland

  10. Stephen D 10
    6 October 2023 at 4:08 pm

    Pablo interesting as ever on the nasty in politics

    https://www.kiwipolitico.com/2023/10/bully-pulpits-and-the-politics-of-nastiness/

    “It is well known that National has been for some time looking to US rightwing spin doctors for campaign guidance and narratives (crime! waste! taxes!), but now Winston First and ACT’s David Seymour have decided to go full US conspiracy theory (Winston: globalists! mandates!) and pseudo-libertarian racist (David: free speech! bureaucrats! Treaty separatists!). The tone of politics in NZ has gotten cruder (see: Chris Bishop, Judith Collins) and more personal (e.g. treatment of Kiri Allen). The corporate media has clearly decided to go full Murdoch in approach (with a few exceptions duly noted) by stirring partisan and racial division and polemics, focusing on personal foibles and conflicts rather than platforms/proposals and going for “gotcha” moments rather than offering dispassion analyses of the policy platforms of the respective parties.”

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