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Open mike 09/06/2021

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, June 9th, 2021 - 129 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

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129 comments on “Open mike 09/06/2021 ”

  1. Ad 1

    And finally, a way to get those 'vaccine hesitant' types racing in to get jabbed: free dope.

    Washington State's Liquor and Cannabis Board (LCB) on Monday announced licensed marijuana dealers are now allowed to give one free pre-rolled joint to customers 21 years or older who receive their first or second dose of COVID19 vaccine at an on-site vaccination clinic.

    Great new initiative for my hydrochoroquine believer relatives in the Far North.

  2. Thousands of nurses to walk off the job today in strike action nationwide

    1 NEWS

    About 30,000 nurses at all public hospitals and DHB facilities will be walking off the job from 11am to 7pm today, warning that it could be the first of many strikes if an agreement with their employers isn’t reached…..

    ……“Burnout, exhaustion, considering working overseas. All of those things are very real and I see myself and my colleagues going through [that] on a daily basis.”
    Deena Cardon, a surgical nurse at North Shore Hospital

    “At the moment, their [NZNO’s] ask is 17 per cent [annualised increases]; we're just not in the position to be able to fund that at this point in time,”
    Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern


    The Prime MInister claims that the government is able to fund the nurses claims.

    $785 million for a cycleway says otherwise

    As part of their protest Nurses will march up Queen Street.

    Nurses know a lot about blocked arteries, if they are serious they should continue their march down Fanshaw Street and block the motorway entrance, until Michael Wood or Grant Robertson agree to negotiate.

    • Oops typo.

      Should read:

      The Prime MInister claims that the government is not able to fund the nurses claims.

      $785 million for a cycleway says otherwise

    • Incognito 2.2

      I see, you’re still tilting at the cycling & walking bridge, which doesn’t surprise me.

      And you’re still barking up the wrong tree, it seems.

      Both sides have agreed to meet after the strike, to continue the negotiations.

      https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/444225/nurse-fears-for-exhausted-profession-as-colleagues-gear-up-for-strike [from yesterday, i.e. before the strike]

      Pray tell, what do Michael Wood or Grant Robertson have to do with the negotiations?

      • Sacha 2.2.1

        One trick pony.

      • Sabine 2.2.2

        Let us refresh the memory of those that have forgotten what the two dudes named above do in government


        Transport – Minister

        Workplace Relations and Safety

        Deputy Leader of the House


        Minister of Finance

        Minister for Infrastructure

        Minister for Racing

        Minister of Sport and Recreation
        edit: but then we can see why cycling bridges are the winner when one is also transport minister and the other is minister of racing and sport and recreation. Priorities this government has them, and they are outdoing John Key on his cycleway of historic importance.

        As for the nurse vs the bridge, lol. Yeah, that is making the rounds in all places that are not labour loyalists by hook n crook.

        But then some rather have solidarity with cycling bridges for the 10% then the wellbeing for nurses and other medical frontline staff. So very 'labour' of them. So very 'kind' so very 'gentle'.

        • Sacha

          Who persuaded you it's one or the other?

          • Sabine

            dear leader yesterday saying

            "There is NO money"

            nurses striking today

            nurses being offered ' 4000 NZD backpay!!!! – as part of their wage agreement

            nurses being offered 1.38% (under inflation)

            Nurses Striking today.

            and just for clarity : “At the moment, their [NZNO’s] ask is 17 per cent [annualised increases]; we're just not in the position to be able to fund that at this point in time,”
            Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern

            As i suggested yesterday, all he white nurses (only the white ones please it would be to dangerous for people of color) should loan some 2 – 4 grand bikes and run over a police barricade, illegally enter a motorway, cause traffic issues and then …..then the PM would say, lols, sure here have your 870 million.

          • Sabine

            nah, that image is wrong,

            the foreigner don't get cookies from the get go – its called Kiwi experience and thus they can work real cheap,

            the worker only gets cookie when he does as he is told,

            and the suits- Jacinda, Grant, Andrew etc and the white well to do people from Herne Bay and Ponsnobby – who can break laws without consequeses- are in the meantime eating all the cookies,

            And then they turn around and tell the nurses there ain't any money left in the kitty, and that if they expect a decent pay for a decent day of work, and if the Nurses expect toilet breaks and lunch breaks and enough collegues to cover these breaks they need to move to OZ, the US, or England or elsewhere, cause here in NZ they are not valued neither by the government nor the public.

        • Incognito

          One step forward @ 8:22 am, two steps backward @ 8:41 am. It’s windy outside.

      • “Pray tell, what do Michael Wood or Grant Robertson have to do with the negotiations?”

        I thought it would be a bit presumptious to ask the Prime Minister to take part in the negotiations. Though if you think that is better. Sure, why not.

        After all it is the Prime Minister who has said that the government hasn't got the money. Maybe the Prime Minister coulc convince the nurses of that.

        Why I chose Grant Robertson; Grant Robertson is the Deputy PM and also the Minister of Finance, an obvious choice. He holds the purse strings.

        Why I chose Michael Wood, for several reasons; Michael Wood is an Auckland based MP, it wouldn;t be too far out of his comfort zone.

        I have met with Michael several times and am convinced of his basic decency and humanitarianism.

        Because of this, I toyed with the idea of just asking Michael to come and negotiate with the nurses on behalf of the government.

        The other and more obvious reason is Michael could agree to forgo the $785 million he got for the cycleway and ask the Minister of Finance to give it to the nurses instead.

        I would expect the negotiations to last 30 minutes. Auckland motorists could then get back on their way.

        • Sacha

          You seem to spend a lot of effort not understanding how government works, nor even how it could in an ideal world. Stuck in the middle somehow.

          • “You seem to spend a lot of effort not understanding how government works, nor even how it could in an ideal world.” Sacha

            Hi Sacha,
            We live in a far from ideal world. Sometimes you just have to cut through the Gordian Knot.

            Government steps into Ihumātao land dispute, halts building activity

            JUL 26, 2019 • SOURCE: 1 NEWS

            …Police this week have made a number of arrests and have maintained a heavy presence after an eviction notice had been served against occupiers.

            But tonight the Prime Minister stepped into the debate, following a meeting today between Government representatives, mana whenua, Fletchers, Auckland mayor Phil Goff and other members of Auckland council…..



            Ihumātao: Deal struck between government and Fletcher Building to buy disputed land

            Jane Patterson 16/12/2020

            A deal has been struck between the government and Fletcher Building to buy the disputed Ihumātao land for just under $30 million, the first step in breaking the long-running deadlock…..


            The lesson is obvious.

            It is a lesson not missed by the Right.

            Judith Collins hits out at Jacinda Ardern's 'foolish' involvement in Ihumātao

            Zane Small 20/07/2020

            National leader Judith Collins has hit out at Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern's involvement in the Ihumātao land dispute, describing it as "foolish" and "a total nonsense"…..

            ……Collins, who became the National Party's new leader last week following the resignation of Todd Muller, said Ardern should never have got involved, and that if she becomes Prime Minister, Fletcher Building will be allowed to continue with its plans.

            "It's their land, they can do what they like within the rules," she told Magic Talk. "The Government, under me will never put a cent into Ihumātao. This is private land. This is a total nonsense and the Prime Minister was foolish to go and get herself involved in it in the first place."

            Collins' predecessor Muller has also said Ardern should not have got involved.

            "Our position with Ihumātao has been consistent all the way through: this was an issue, from our perspective, between the iwi owners and Fletchers," he said in June.

          • greywarshark

            You seem to spend a lot of effort not understanding how government works, nor even how it could in an ideal world. Stuck in the middle somehow.

            Or perhaps, bogged down. That quicksand is diabolically slow sometimes.

        • The other reason I chose Michael Wood, he is probably in town already and could get there without much delay.

          • If Grant can't make it at short notice. Michael could take a smart phone and Bring in Grant Robertson by skype, or facebook messenger, or zoom or whatever platform suits best.

            The PM could even cut in for 5 minutes if she wanted to. To berate the nurses for being wrong headed, ‘There is no money, you should call off your strike’.

            • Sabine

              And all of that hinges on two things,

              Good faith, and actually wanting to resolve the dispute. I can't see non of that happening at the moment;.

              I mean offering an advance to owed backpay as part of a wage negotiation is not good faith, nor does it show a will to resolve a pay dispute, but it is very much an insult to injury.

              • gsays

                "I mean offering an advance to owed backpay as part of a wage negotiation is not good faith, nor does it show a will to resolve a pay dispute, but it is very much an insult to injury."

                Too true. A bit like criticism of Vance's article, the $4000 is there for lazy minds to cling to.

        • Incognito

          The chosen ones will be delighted and over Mars the Moon with their elevation, which comes as a revelation. Will you make them knights or just anoint them?

          You toying with ideas is like Donald Trump playing with the two red buttons on his desk, one was for the Diet Coke Button the other one was for frying the world.

          • Sabine

            Acutally we could choose the worlds governments, inclusive ours and ship them all to Mars to colonize the rock.

            No one would be missed here on earth, and chances are life would go on as if these useless eaters had never existed.

      • gsays 2.2.4

        Robertson popped his beak in a couple of days ago.

        As Finance Minister, he controls the purse strings and gas been able to find monies for various reasons/projects

        Like all things the amount is largely irrelevant, it is a will that is lacking.

    • Ad 2.3

      Nurses are sure going to have to campaign smarter than a boring old strike (which the system is coping with easily) if they are going to be out-competed by a few old lycra-waddling duffers.

      You can pop over to the Nurses Union and tell them how their industrial relations efforts are so weak and then show them HowToGetThere.

      • Sabine 2.3.1

        nope they don't actually, they could just choose to move overseas to a government that pays them better.

        • Ad

          It's a free country. Go for it. We'll just keep importing replacements.

          • Sabine

            ah, but then you are ok with foreign workers, and then it should be ok for the horticulturist, the Orchadists, the farmers, the booze shops, the universities and all the others that don't want to pay a decent wage in NZ, lead by the government. i

            As always with government in NZ, Labour as well as National it is a case of do as we say not as we do. Non of them want 'living wages' or 'decent wages'.

            hahahahaha, i am so gonna enjoy the next National / Act government and their 'surplus' tax cuts, for the rich, of whom Robertson, Ardern, and the rest of the dull knights and dames are members of. hahahahahahahah

  3. Stephen D 3


    The inference we're getting here is that Judith lied to Nick Smith about the breaking scandal to get him to resign. Knowing full well there was no breaking story. So she could get Harete Hipango into the House.

    Or am I reading this all wrong?

  4. Phillip ure 4

    Kinda stoopid of those cops telling the world how they got their busts..

    instead of hauling their informant out into the sunlight and pointing at them ..

    you'd think it would have made more sense to just keep that gold mine of information ticking over ..

    and occaisonally/selectively harvesting..?

    • Phillip ure 4.1

      and of course it will not make the slightest difference in the supply of meth etc..

      to claim otherwise is a folly..

      and of course it is a given…that the war on drugs is an ineffectual keystone cops farce…

      and that all drugs should be decriminalised..and treatment etc. moved under the aegis of the health department..

      that is the only solution that will work..

    • Sacha 4.3

      The legal basis they used worldwide expired.

    • Noel 4.4

      Well no…as soon as the first cases appeared in court the light bulb would have gone on and phones would be heading for the skip smartly.

      "ANoM could only be found on phones bought through the black market, which had been stripped of the capability to make calls or send emails, according to the AFP. The phones could only send messages to another device that had the app and criminals needed to know another criminal to get a device.

      "The devices organically circulated and grew in popularity among criminals, who were confident of the legitimacy of the app because high-profile organized crime figures vouched for its integrity," the AFP statement said."

      • Phillip ure 4.4.1

        well no…if you read the story you will see they have been doing that…using info gained to bust imports…back to 2019..

        so I still don't understand why they blew the gaff..

        and didn't just continue to milk it..

        • Sabine

          maybe it was already blewn and thus they explained what they did.

          • Phillip ure

            or they wanted the kudos/positive p.r..

            I still can't see any 'policing' reason to pull the plug…

            • Sabine

              If this was a one of, and it was known (or suspicion arose among those targeted) …..then yes pull the plug and only to see if the news would make some more crawl out from under the rocks in order to hide under another.

        • Noel

          Let me put it another way. All the arrests around the world were coordinated,

    • joe90 4.5

      The gig was up.

      But the cover appeared to be blown in March 2021 when a blogger detailed ANOM security flaws and claimed it was a scam linked to Australia, the United States and other members of the Five Eyes intelligence sharing network. The post was later deleted.


      • Poission 4.5.1

        Certainly showed the problem of networked crime,and its expansive reach.

        As a psyop,the enhancement of paranoia,within acute paranoid gangsters will bring fear,and error.

        • joe90

          Make what you will of the author but he certainly tells a ripping yarn.

      • Noel 4.5.2

        Two for one.

        "The erosion of trust in these networks was a primary goal, along with gathering invaluable investigative information."

    • Treetop 4.6

      I'm surprised the internet policing app was used for as long as it got used and no one discovered they were being monitored. Possibly the cops cover would have been blowen as the app would be used as evidence.

  5. Phillip ure 5

    for anyone at all interested in hip-hop..the guardian website has a very tidy piece on the history/arc of hip-hop lyrics..

    with the appropriate vid-links…

  6. Sabine 6

    Good on them. Hope they strike until the DHB (and Government) pull their heads in.


    seriously for this alone they should stay on strike for the rest of the week.

    The DHBs revised their offer with changes to sick leave entitlement and there was a $4,000 lump sum in advance on the anticipated Pay Equity settlement.

    that 4 grand has nothing to do with the current wage dispute. Here really the government and DHB are saying that we owe you back pay, but we could advance that for you now, so please dear Nurses *(male/female/others as some seem to think that nursing is a 'female' profession ) stay on strike until the Managarial Goons learn some shame, humility and grow a brain.

    For what its worth all of us have needed nurses and medical staff in our lifes, non of us has needed any of the overpaid goons that pretend that 1.38% (below inflation) is a 'pay increase'.




  7. Phillip ure 7

    (should have been headline ..)

    'bennett blacklisted by tories..!'..)

    [time to flex my (blue-pencil) muscles 😀

    Please add a link to your comments so that others may get a clue what you’re on about, thanks – Incognito]

    • Sabine 7.1

      Why? She still in politics? or is there just something in the waters of some left leaning people that they rather discuss the National wanabes of yesteryears rather tehn just the regular businesses of strikes, homelessness, violence and crime?

      She was always only an attack dog, she knew her role and she fulfilled it to the finest. And now she sells real estate for big bucks, laughing all the way to the bank.


      • Incognito 7.1.1

        You seem to have missed the post by Mike Smith: https://thestandard.org.nz/nz-nuclear-free-day/.

        • Sabine

          i did not answer to someone writing a post, i answered to someone who should have posted a link. So nah, i missed nothing. And i don't waste my time with has beens such as the like of Paula Benefit.

          • Phillip ure

            heh..!….luv yr long reason why you wouldn't link to the link you demanded from me…

            tho' there is anti-tory schadenfreude to burn there..

            I'm sure you would find something to please you there ..

            (hint:. just Google bennett..and it will all be @ yr fingertips..wallow away..!..)

            • Sabine

              i just think it is polite to link. Nothing more nothing less. And no i see no reason to google anything National, I have no care for them.

            • KJT

              Links are even more important than ever.

              So called Journalists should provide them for one.

              Helps stop the all to common practice of interviewing their own empty heads.
              As shown by Vance’s recent, unsupported by evidence fluff piece.

    • Incognito 7.2

      See my Moderation note @ 8:35 am.

    • Phillip ure 7.3

      (a short history/arc of the link..)

      in the early days of the internet..when everybody had shit/expensive internet-coverage..providing links was crucial…

      it was one of the reasons I started/did my proto-aggregation website whoar.co.nz..to provide that service…and I always included the link to every story I posted..

      that was then…this is now…when everyone has fast/efficient internet..and in the above case of my made-up tabloid headline..typing bennett into google will bring up all coverage of 'what I am talking about'..namely bennetts' vomiting all over her tory party..and how they dun her wrong…

      and I would contend that just providing one link (as you continue to demand) is/can be a negative..is an involuntary controlling of the message..by only giving the reader one perspective..whereby they have to Google to find out more ..(!)

      It is for these reasons I feel the arc of importance of 'the link'..has reached it's natural conclusion..

      and is increasingly irrelevant/a block on the full picture..

      largely..the link is yesterday's imperative..

      and should be left just to wither..

      and certainly not be demanded of anyone posting anything..

      [I did not demand, I asked, nicely and politely. You must have attended the same school as Jenny for not understanding the difference between these two verbs.

      Indeed, this is here and now, you’re commenting on TS, not on your proto-site. You take heed of Moderation notes, here and now.

      It is good manners to post a link. Don’t expect others to do the digging and Googling; they’re not mind readers.

      When I Google “bennett”, I get all sorts of results, including Naftali Bennett, the next PM of Israel.

      Please don’t act like an obstinate pillock and include links in your comments, especially when asked by a Moderator, thanks. This is your final warning – Incognito]

      • Sacha 7.3.1

        in the above case of my made-up tabloid headline..typing bennett into google will bring up all coverage of 'what I am talking about'

        You must have an awful lot of time on your hands if that seems like a viable tactic. If you google the word 'tactic' you will find what I'm talking about..

      • Incognito 7.3.2

        See my Moderation note @ 9:54 am.

      • Phillip ure 7.3.3

        So you totally dismiss the case I made re arc of link…?

        and choose to again threaten to ban ..?

        After the several days of my being back here you following me around sneering insults/trolling at virtually everything I say..?

        go read them..!

        your abuses of power/harassment of me is over the top..

        other people..including yrslf..regularly say things without linking..I read whole threads like that..while I was'nt commenting here..and not a word from you..or any other moderator..

        I repeat…why do you single me out for such special treatment..

        • Phillip ure

          So you don't like my arguments…esp re animal flesh..eh..?..

          So you cancel me…?

          'final warning'..?

          not very over the top…eh..?

          • Phillip ure

            injustice does my fucken head in..

            • Phillip ure

              how about telling me what I got wrong in my depiction of the arc/increasing irrelevance/need of the link…

              I thought I made quite a relevant case..

              would be interested to hear your dismissal…

              all I have heard so far is 'polite'..and 'because I said so'

    • McFlock 7.4


      my screen/font settings gave a convenient word wrap:

      Please add a link to your comments so that others may get a clue what you’re on

  8. KSaysHi 8

    Reform for retirees has been a long time coming. It would be a popular move if the government follows the advice and takes the rights of older folk as seriously as younger tenants.


    • KSaysHi 8.1

      From the link above

      Her [Retirement Com.] report said submissions revealed 99 per cent support for a complete review of the legislative framework and that included support from organisations like the Law Society, and professionals in the sector like trustees and statutory supervisors, as well as hundreds of residents’ submissions.

      Wrightson told said the only group that thought a full review was a bad idea was the operators.

      Village residents did not have many of the consumer protections provided to tenants here. A review should eliminate unfair terms in contracts and better protect the rights of consumers.

      • Sabine 8.1.1

        also from the link as to why nothing will change until this government is shamed into action – from Poto Williams herself

        "Asked what plans, if any, she has to move on the commission and Consumer reports to strengthen the Retirement Villages Act, Williams said: "At this stage there are no immediate plans to review the Act, although I acknowledge that the Act is due for review and will work towards this when we can."

        Lol. This fucking government.

  9. Sabine 9

    Seriously the government should be ashamed of itself. All of the goons.


    Under-resourced, understaffed'

    Over their four years at the Auckland hospital, the Kiwi nurse dealt with an "under-resourced, understaffed department", and sometimes experienced unsafe situations.

    "Over my time working at the hospital I can’t count the number of verbal and physical assaults that have happened to health care workers," they say.

    "I’ve seen co-workers punched in the face, oxygen cylinders thrown through medication rooms, people pulling out knives, family members getting up in our faces."

    The nurse told Newshub of a particular incident when two nurses were attacked with a baseball bat when leaving the hospital after a night shift.

    "One ended up with a head injury and the other a broken clavicle. It can sometimes be scary to think about," they say.

    The Auckland hospital where the Kiwi nurse worked confirmed the incident to Newshub, stating that emergency departments are "emotionally charged, stressful environments".

    "Nurses can sometimes be subjected to verbal abuse, they can experience people encroaching on their personal space, and occasionally experience low-levels of physical abuse," the hospital said in a statement.

    as the nurse who know lives and work in OZ says: "We want to be recognised for all we do, and unfortunately a pen on international nurses’ day doesn’t cut it."

    • gsays 9.1

      Back in the day, last century, long service was acknowledged at 25 years and the good old gold watch was the gift.

      Nowadays it occurs at 10 years.

      Also since the rise of DHB CEOs, carparks were privatized. A fairly significant change in working conditions for many hospital staff.

      Not a skerrick of renumeration and often decreased safety as the person in the booth wasn't paid to provide security or folk would park off hospital grounds.

  10. greywarshark 10

    Two crucial initiatives to clamp down on unsafe building designs are yet to see the light of day, five years after the Kaikōura earthquake.

    At the same time, the number of complex complaints about commercial building structural design is rising, according to the Structural Engineering Society.
    It says the problem with substandard designs is "unacceptable".

    "We've been campaigning for change to prevent quality issues," Structural Engineering Society president, Michelle Grant said.
    "We've … strongly voiced our recommendations for greater scrutiny and tighter assessment of structural engineers."

    Such is the increase in complex investigations landing at Engineering New Zealand (ENZ) that it has had to hire more engineers and lawyers to tackle the backlog. The body receives between 45-50 complaints each year.

    Give over the bridge discussion. Get behind this one now, about buildings which affects us all every day of the week.

  11. greywarshark 11

    Here is something to bite into.

    In Australia the rule about agreement to sex or whether it was rape would be laughable if it was in a satirical performance. If it said that previous agreed sex within the period the participants were together should be considered in exoneration, (which I believe was the case for Julian Assange) that would fit the Oz idea of rationality, but not just the sheer force of the man's lust or want.)

    However, the court also cited the “high hurdle” it faced on the issue of consent. Under the archaic legal definition of “consent” in place in Australia at the time the incidents had occurred, any belief by the perpetrator that the complainant was consenting – not matter how irrational that belief was – had to be counted as grounds for acquittal. The court cited McLachlan’s “egocentric” personality as an exonerating factor, in that he simply may not have been able to comprehend that his advances would not be reciprocated

    Gordon Campbell in Scoop – https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL2106/S00022/on-the-mclachlan-interview-and-the-g-7-global-corporate-tax.htm

  12. UncookedSelachimorpha 12

    Not a surprise, but leaked info from the US IRS confirms billionaires pay very low tax rates compared to ordinary people


    Meanwhile in NZ, we seem terrified of taxing wealth but are happy to go hammer and tongs with nurses to suppress their pay. To me, these two things are linked.

    • Sabine 12.1

      Why would the wealthy people in government raise taxes on the wealthy or the wealthy companies? heck, we give millions of dollars to come here and make some dumb arse movies.

      • greywarshark 12.1.1

        Please try and limit the number of short sharp irrationalities that you put up Sabine.

        Dumb arse movies are common, and watched by many similar people. If made here they provide jobs and a change of business, a bit of diversity from dairy and housing and building war tech for the USA. It will be a good change from selling our stock of houses from under the feet of the NZs who we hope will make some wages from the movie-making.

        • Sabine

          so the Amazon dude did not get some hundered million and a bit for a movie? 🙂 lol.

          In the agreement with the New Zealand Government, obtained by Stuff under the Official Information Act, the company committed to partnering with local firms to invest in research and development in sectors as diverse as drones, costume design and healthcare.

          The deal could also see the company establishing offshoots of its other businesses here.

          It is unconfirmed whether Amazon will open a local distribution centre for its famous online shop, which would likely upend the local retail sector. The company isn't obliged to start new businesses in New Zealand, but as a minimum it is required to partner with local research houses

          but but but

  13. Chris 13

    Says here MSD has "blacklisted" the person from receiving help with emergency accommodation.


    MSD cannot do this. Help with emergency accommodation is governed by legislation which means if a person is entitled to the help they must receive it. Nobody can stop anyone applying for help under the Act, but when it comes to emergency accommodation MSD do it all the time.

    When challenged MSD will of course agree they cannot blacklist anyone, but the fact is that very few people do challenge their decisions so what has become a widespread problem is left to continue because it suits MSD for it to continue even though they know it's wrong.

  14. Adrian 14

    The money you are trying to raise to pay for the nurses would have to come from …the nurses. They are well paid ,but not as well paid as the Aussies. I’m not being a smart are’s, my wife is a nurse and she is currently on the street protesting, and I agree with her but there aren’t enough rich to tax to get enough money to pay the nurses without taxing the nurses. The point being missed by most is not the 17% increase to the nurses, almost certainly affordable, but the ongoing parity that would then be required for all other govt employees, a huge sum no doubt, well beyond my capacity to calculate and the governments to afford in the short term.. That huge sum can only come from bankrupting the so-called rich which would include ..the nurses.

    • mac1 14.1

      Adrian, I am minded of the parable that Christ taught about the farmer who got a problem with weeds in his crops. Of course, his listeners were the poor farmers high up the hills whose land was too poor to grow the particular weeds and who never knew the threat to their huge crops complained of by the wealthy farmers on the valley floor.

      A bit like a poorly paid worker being told that they would have to pay more tax if they got paid a decent wage commensurate with their hours, skills and social worth.

      If only……….

    • Sabine 14.2

      What is the average pay for a nurse? The start at about 55 before tax and after a few years should be at about mid 70? that is not rich, not before tax not after tax. And certainly not when one factors in GST. And certainly not when we consider that these women and men are the ones that will intubate us should we need it, and in case of Covid might be the last people to actually care about the patient more then them just being a dying bag of bones and flesh.

      They could however establish a Capital Gains Tax to finance these fancy people called Nurses. Maybe a Land tax? Maybe a luxury tax on certain cars for the very rich? Maybe an 'empty room' tax for those that own houses but keep them empty? I am sure if these people were to put that thinking hat on they would come up with something.

      Anyway, i hope she and her collegues will achieve and receive not only bread but also Roses, and maybe some respect. So she has my support.

    • UncookedSelachimorpha 14.3

      " The money you are trying to raise to pay for the nurses would have to come from …the nurses. "

      Yeah right.

      There are about 60,000 nurses working in NZ. Average pay is very roughly $70k. a 10% pay rise (compared to the 1.38% on offer) would cost roughly $420m p.a.

      The wealth of NZ's richest person, Graeme Hart, increased (!) by $3.4b since the covid pandemic started. So a 10% pay rise for every nurse in NZ is only 12% of this wealth increase (ignoring his existing enormous wealth). So this single person could easily pay for a 10% increase for every nurse in NZ, for the next 8 years, without losing a cent of his underlying wealth, just his recent increase.

  15. joe90 15

    There’s no bottom to the depths these fuckers will sink to.

    Three groups opposed to Covid restrictions, masks, and vaccines are hosting conspiracy theorist Naomi Wolf for a fundraiser entitled "Liberate Our Five Freedoms."

    The event is going to be held on Juneteenth, the holiday celebrating the end of chattel slavery in the US. Event organizer Kathryn Levin told me that in her view, it's appropriate.

    "The 19th is a day of emancipation, and it's a day when we claim our freedom," said Levin. "It's when we see that we are not slaves to mandate. It's when we take our power back."

    I asked Levin how she analogized American chattel slavery—where slaves were whipped, beaten, raped, and murdered by their white masters for centuries—to the temporary restrictions over the last 15 months due to the pandemic.

    "We have been enslaved by our government," she replied.


    • greywarshark 15.1

      They think 'It's all about me, precious me, my inviolable rights. Others serve my purpose, and might get some advantage eventually.'

    • millsy 15.2

      Ironically, these people are perfectly fine with a police state as long as it is them not being policed. They all would have thought George Floyd deserved to die.

      Like these 3 people who I used to work with, all through COVID was a plot to impose a police state, but supported Trump.

  16. greywarshark 16


    2035 – 14 years away. So what are we doing in the meantime?

    The Climate Change Commission has released its final report laying out the roadmap for the country to slash emissions and become carbon neutral by 2050…

    • By end of 2022 set targets to get more people walking, cycling and using public transport
    • Renewable energy target of 50 by the end of 2035

    (Plus a lot more. Doesn't say anything about hybrid vehicles in the meantime, which would be helpful while we up the electricity supply.)

    Climate Change Minister James Shaw said this government had done more to fight the climate crisis in the last three-and-a-half years than the combined efforts of governments over the last three-and-a-half decades.

    "However, we are yet to see a sustained decline in the pollution we put into the atmosphere," Shaw said.

  17. greywarshark 17


    Well. It's time for The Hollies. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmzi0Rc3P8Q

    'What more could I ask, There's nothing left to desire!'

    • Pat 17.1

      Auckland the most liveable city in the world?

    • Sabine 17.2

      You know what, that was said consistently under John Key too, and i bet you a dollar that no one asked those that can't afford rent, are on a benefit in a town that costs per week (without utilities, food, and all other jazz of nice things)


      Market rent in Avondale (Auckland) 01 Nov 2020 – 30 Apr 2021

      • BONDS 2160
      • LOWER ($)490
      • MEDIAN ($)580
      • UPPER ($)650

      If however you are one of the really lucky ones that live in a nice part of town, with a nice wage, and an affordable mortgage, or inherited housing then truly Auckland is a very livable city.

      But then…….who was asked and who did the asking?

    • McFlock 18.1

      That's a damned useful bit of research.

    • Andre 18.2

      That's an extremely limited alibi and exoneration.

      Those articles only provide evidence for an argument against the idea that a jump to humans from bats or pangolins occurred at that specific market. It in no way excludes the possibility that patient zero got it from bats or pangolins (or any other species for that matter) somewhere else, then spread it to other humans at the market. Nor does it even exclude the possibility that the jump to humans happened from some other species at the market.

      Never mind the myriad other possibilities for zoonotic transfer some other place and time, and that Wuhan maybe just happened to be where the first superspreading event occurred.

      Bats and pangolins just happened to have drawn suspicion because they are known to host viruses similar to SARS-CoV-2, to the extent that they commonly have antibodies already circulating that neutralise SARS-CoV-2.. That doesn't mean there aren't other species also hosting similar coronaviruses that we aren't aware of. The original SARS intermediary was likely palm civets, for example, or camels for MERS.

  18. weka 19

    One of the stranger things about moderating TS is seeing how many people make comments and then don't check to see who has replied to them next time the come back. Mods see this when someone's comments are held in the back end until someone responds to a moderation request.

    I'd like to know how many people either don't use the Replies list function, or can't see it on their device. What are you all doing?

    Tricledrown, if you are reading this, you need to go back to my last reply to you. All your other comments are landing in Trash until this gets sorted out.

  19. greywarshark 20


    Gelberger's body was found the next day, missing his lower left leg, and entire right leg.

    Ports of Auckland was fined more than $420,000 in the Auckland District Court following Gelberger's death.

    It admitted it had put people's lives at risk because its pilot boats consistently breached speed limits because, it said, they believed they were exempt.

    The limits dictate vessels should not exceed five knots when closer than 200m to shore, and must keep to a 12-knot limit between the Harbour Bridge and North Head.

    There is an exemption for Ports of Auckland vessels to breach limits if they are unable to carry out duties, but this applies only in limited circumstances.

    In court, the company was found to have breached the rules on about 99 percent of its trips.

    This seems the way things are in NZ. Power tends to corrupt etc. Why does someone have to be killed before the value of the precautionary policy is recognised? It was too fast, and not allowed at that time anyway.

  20. ghostwhowalksnz 21

    As reported the proposed pay rates by DHBs for the nursing sector

    Healthcare Assistants $40,382 a year, through to $48,003. This will range of $45,310 to $53,359. That is a total pay increase of between 4.6 per cent for those on step two of the pay scale, and 11.7 per cent for those at the top.

    Enrolled nurses are currently paid between $48,632 and $57,047. The new agreement would take that to $53,998 to $59,447, or a total increase of 11 per cent for the step one nurses through to 4.2 per cent for step four

    Senior midwives would see their pay increase from $79,760 for grade two through to $130,653 for grade eight, to $83,157 to $133,486.

    Registered Nurses total pay increase between 3.1 per cent and 4.4 per cent, to reach a band of $56,434 to $79,786.

    Most NZNO members are in the RN category and on the top scale ( after 7 years) of $80 k per year

    My neighbour was on top scale and I would see her each morning waiting for Uber instead of the bus just around the corner

  21. Sabine 22

    Can someone explain to me why 30 people would be in handcuffs for 'questioning' after a hit and run in Auckland?


    Up to 30 people are in handcuffs and being questioned by police after a hit-and-run crash which left one person dead in Auckland this morning.

    A witness at the scene in Māngere said 20-30 people had been restrained across two scenes, while they were questioned amid a heavy police presence of about 15-20 officers.

    "The vehicle involved fled the area immediately afterwards. Emergency services attended the scene but sadly the man died shortly after."

    Early reports suggested a firearm may have been involved in the incident and as a precaution, armed staff responded to the area.

    Police had not located a firearm.

    Or is that selective over policing in certain areas of town? Have a good look at this picture and ask yourself if that is a normal action to a 'hit and run'. Also who suggested firearms had been involved and when that weapon failed to materialized why was the present police force not told to put their weapons away?

    • ghostwhowalksnz 22.1

      It wasnt a hit and run ! First reports arent always accurate

      Why does this concern you now , Im sure you can wait till tomorrow when more will be released. A person is dead after an some sort of violence in a house , a car was attacked in the street and some masked people drove off … and thats what neighbors have said at around 5 PM reports

      Is that your alter ego , a TV reporter for those real life crime shows ?

      • Sabine 22.1.1

        I just asked because i read the article and i could not quite get it sorted. It seems there were at least two if not three incidents. And having the cops stand there with what look like assault weapons in suburbia should concern all of us, unless of course we think that cops with assault weapons in the street is Kiwi as.

        Never mind, you were not answering. 🙂

        • Sacha

          If you want to take on a gang-related fatal street fight with a cheery smile and a whistle, be our guest.

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