Open mike 12/06/2019

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, June 12th, 2019 - 124 comments
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Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

124 comments on “Open mike 12/06/2019 ”

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  1. Tony Veitch [not etc.] 1
    12 June 2019 at 7:18 am

    Apart from how pathetic Soimon was in the house yesterday, another significant own goal occurred. I hope people noticed!

    Judith, fangs metaphorically dripping blood, a supercilious smile on her face, asked her usual biting question of Phil Twiford. It seems some first home buyers under the KiwiBuild scheme were able to raise the whole cost of a new home – a figure of $650,000 was mentioned.

    How could this be possible, Jude demanded? You could see from her attitude she really thought she had Phil by the short and curlies this time. The baying chorus in the background thought so to! The implication being that KiwiBuild is being exploited by the wealthy:

    Hon Judith Collins: Does the criteria for KiwiBuild pre-qualification reflect his statement that "this Government is committed to providing the opportunity for home ownership to families who are currently locked out of purchasing their first home."?

    Hon PHIL TWYFORD: Yes.

    Hon Judith Collins: Is he concerned that official documents show that five of the pre-qualified KiwiBuild buyers had deposits of between $500,000 to $650,000—effectively, meaning they could buy their KiwiBuild house with cash?

    Hon PHIL TWYFORD: No. The data the member is referring to is raw data, unchecked. It's very clear that, for a number of the entries, the data had been entered into the online form on the KiwiBuild website by prospective KiwiBuild buyers incorrectly. In fact, Radio New Zealand, who first reported this story, was told by the KiwiBuild unit that a number of the examples where people had entered what seemed to be a large deposit were cases where, in fact, people had assumed they were supposed to enter the total budget for the house. So, for the purposes that the member is trying to use it, the data is quite unreliable.

    Egg (to mix a metaphor) on Jude’s face! She only managed a couple of lame follow-up questions before she shut up. Perhaps Jude’s source within KiwiBuild had set her up?

    This opposition really is a total shambles!

  2. Cinny 2
    12 June 2019 at 7:58 am

    Oh dear simon has done it again…..shameful interview on RNZ this morning.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=265&v=sbTzDVlzTmU

    I think I know what the issue is….. he doesn't listen.

    • Incognito 2.1
      12 June 2019 at 8:02 am

      A man with boy’s ears 😉

    • Sanctuary 2.2
      12 June 2019 at 8:53 am

      What he does is relentlessly and robotically repeats bumper sticker slogans that they've clearly got a good reaction for from focus groups.

      Unfortunately, he has zero charisma and zero charm and zero gravitas so it just comes across as mindless, insincere and slightly hysterical.

      In particular, a leader have to have charisma, and Simon just doesn't.

      • Drowsy M. Kram 2.2.1
        12 June 2019 at 9:06 am

        What Helen Clark lacked in charisma she more than made up for with competence and political nous. Bridges is lacking (and leaking!) in every department.

      • greywarshark 2.2.2
        12 June 2019 at 11:05 am

        Well that's good in the circumstances isn't it Sanctuary?

        Unfortunately, he has zero charisma and zero charm and zero gravitas so it just comes across as mindless, insincere and slightly hysterical.

        You make it sound like something undesirable. I thought you were for the Left. If so you don't need to criticise the Right for not being up to much in your opinion. Let them wallow and encourage the Left to do the best they can with the constraints they have.

        As Margaret Thorn said in the title of her book – her memoirs, ‘Stick out, keep left’, published posthumously in 1997.

        https://www.artybees.co.nz/thorn-margaret/stick-out-keep-left-autobiography-margaret-thorn

    • Adrian Thornton 2.3
      12 June 2019 at 10:18 am

      I know this will be controversial and will probably reflect poorly on me, but I just can't help but feeling a little sorry for him…there I said it.

      And yes of course I know and understand that his political ideology is wrong in the head, and hurts the most vulnerable in our society, that his ideology destroys workers rights and the planet etc and so on…actually now that I have typed this out..fuck him, hope it hurts, maybe it will teach him a lesson in humility, but I doubt it.

      • Rosemary McDonald 2.3.1
        12 June 2019 at 10:27 am

        I know this will be controversial and will probably reflect poorly on me, but I just can't help but feeling a little sorry for him…there I said it.

        He reminds me of …

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NUjWiRp-vc

        and…

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzA3Q1HS0I0

        Theoretically hilarious, but I could never see the funny side. Kinda pathetic.

      • francesca 2.3.2
        12 June 2019 at 1:13 pm

        Empathy and compassion aren't just for our friends
        good for you Adrian!

      • Cinny 2.3.3
        12 June 2019 at 1:26 pm

        I'm hearing you and at a guess you feel that way because you are a caring person and that's nothing to feel bad about, instead having caring feels is something to be proud of.

        Personally, I don't get angry re simon like I did with john key, instead I end up erupting into gales of laughter and disbelief that his party still backs him.

        This week especially he seems to have completely lost his mojo (if he ever had any) question time yesterday was a shocker… I wonder what today will bring.

  3. Rosemary McDonald 3
    12 June 2019 at 8:26 am

    I hope everyone has taken the time to watch Melanie Reid's report on Oranga Tamariki's attempt to forcibly remove a newborn baby from his mother.

    If these 'social workers' are the pick of the Hawke's Bay crop then no fucking wonder there has been little improvement in 'outcomes' for struggling families being 'supported by Oranga Tamariki.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/113395638/new-zealands-own-stolen-generation-the-babies-taken-by-oranga-tamariki

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/programmes/the-detail/story/2018699080/nz-s-own-stolen-generation

    • OnceWasTim 3.1
      12 June 2019 at 8:42 am

      Has anyone heard a peep out of Anne Tolley about it all?

      • Rosemary McDonald 3.1.1
        12 June 2019 at 9:26 am

        Has anyone heard a peep out of Anne Tolley about it all?

        I wouldn't expect to, would you?

        Where's Sepuloni? Off pretending she gives a damn about disability issues…https://www.beehive.govt.nz/release/minister-disability-issues-visit-united-nations-and-canada

        And Martin….denies and denies….https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/shows/2019/05/oranga-tamariki-isn-t-snatching-babies-children-s-minister-tracey-martin.html

        To be honest, I began watching this program with my cynical hat in place…surely this baby is at extreme risk of harm?

        There was risk…but not from the young mother…she was being punished for the failings of her family….a situation I am all too familiar with when it comes to CYFs. My last encounter of this nature was over ten years ago…and nothing has changed.

        Arrogant, power crazed and incredibly stupid social workers employed by an organsiation that clearly couldn't coordinate a bonk in a brothel much less uplifting a baby from a maternity unit.

        And now it appears Oranga Tamariki are suing Newsroom…

        • RedLogix 3.1.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 9:59 am

          Our closest friend here in Australia is a social worker. We know her very well. She is the exact opposite of 'arrogant, power crazed and stupid'. She tells us often of the awful stress of a job where you never know when something terrible is going to go wrong … and while you had no control over it, you will get the blame.

          Oranga Tamariki is however tasked with just one job, protecting children. It is not there to fix families or solve social ills. It cannot deal with poverty, drugs, mental health, violence or abuse … that is the role of other agencies. Inevitably if a child if removed the mother will be aggrieved; yet no-one asks if the child was not removed and is then harmed what will the mother feel then? There can be no winners in this sad calculus.

          There is every reason to demand excellence and high professional standards from social workers, who clearly have a difficult job to do. If the unit in Hawkes Bay is struggling a review and increased support is needed. If their managers are burned out and cynical, they need to be reassigned to other roles less critical.

          • Rosemary McDonald 3.1.1.1.1
            12 June 2019 at 10:06 am

            Oranga Tamariki is however tasked with just one job, protecting children. It is not there to fix families or solve social ills.

            Err… Whatever the reason, we focus first and foremost on the needs of the child or young person. We work together with families and whānau to resolve any issues, and ensure whānau get the help and support they might need to provide a safe, stable and loving home.

            https://www.orangatamariki.govt.nz/how-we-get-involved/overview/

            Did you actually watch the video RL?

            I did. https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2019/06/12/623624/the-midwife-fighting-for-her-patients-babies

            (I am trying to provide excerpts that will convey just wrong those social workers were to treat this young family like criminals.)

            Te Huia says whānau believed they were the right people to care for their own and were doing all they could to address and comply with OT’s concerns and expectations

            Aside from both grandmothers leaving troubled and violent home lives, the young mother had attended antenatal courses and undertaken a family violence course. A care plan had been created which planned for the young mother and her baby to stay in a whare which supports young Māori mothers for the first six months where she would have around-the-clock care and a multi-disciplinary care team had been initiated around addressing the family’s needs.

            • RedLogix 3.1.1.1.1.1
              12 June 2019 at 10:17 am

              Fair enough I overstated the position, but ultimately case workers will be held responsible for the child's welfare and this will always be their first priority.

              Clearly it shouldn't be their only priority, helping families to the extent possible and keeping children safe with their whanau is obviously the desirable outcome. But it seems that all too often that's a gamble OT staff are not willing to take. Maybe that does come back to a blame oriented internal culture as I suggested above.

              • Rosemary McDonald …
                12 June 2019 at 10:42 am

                But it seems that all too often that's a gamble OT staff are not willing to take.

                A cursory peruse of articles about children dying at the hands of whanau will disprove that statement. In many, many cases CYFs were involved and failed to keep the children safe. In at least one case they very probably caused the abuser to kill the children.

                Yes…some kids need uplifting now…don't piss around…

                Others, like the whanau above, had been making real efforts with coordinated help and those numpties rode rough shod over everyone.

          • greywarshark 3.1.1.1.2
            12 June 2019 at 1:37 pm

            RL There has been a lot of talk about agencies working together.

            But if they are always treating crises and making them also at times, they probably can't set the wheels in motion to co-ordinate with other agencies. They need to be working with a partner in another agency perhaps who they can work well with and immediately work out best way to handle cases for effectiveness.

        • greywarshark 3.1.1.2
          12 June 2019 at 10:16 am

          Rosemary M Here is a John Mortimer story – Rumpole and the Children of the Devil. I haven't watched it myself yet but it is based on a written story with the same name. I thought after your comments about Oranga Tamariki that you would like his window onto what he refers to ironically in the story as 'the caring profession'.

          First he explains the background to the story – but his words are voiced by a woman – probably something to do with legal or technological ties.

          (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jilyC-KUYHE

        • Gabby 3.1.1.3
          12 June 2019 at 11:39 am

          How would you avoid punishing her for the failings of her family?

          • Rosemary McDonald 3.1.1.3.1
            12 June 2019 at 12:09 pm

            Gabby. It just struck me that while CYFs, Oranga Tamariki (or whatever they are called today) demand that parents make significant changes in their lives in order to retain custody of their children, they themselves appear wholly incapable as a government agency of making the kinds of changes required to perform their role without causing further trauma.

            Someone needs to remind them, again, that a mere name change is not good enough.

            A fundamental culture change is needed…which is what they should be supporting that young mother to achieve.

            • greywarshark 3.1.1.3.1.1
              12 June 2019 at 12:28 pm

              Words of wisdom and experience that sounds Rosemary. It is no wonder that you get a bit testy FTTT.

          • Siobhan 3.1.1.3.2
            12 June 2019 at 12:56 pm

            First change I would make to give her and her two children a chance..try and make the average NZ accept that every one needs a roof over their head. Not a car roof, not a temporary shelter roof, not a kiwibuild (trickle down housing policy) but an actual place to call home to raise their children.

            Last night around 400 children in the Hawkes Bay alone, slept in motels as a direct result of homelessness and unaffordable housing.

            To say nothing of the hundreds who will have slept in overcrowded, possibly dysfunctional, possibly violent households..because they simply have no options.

            Homelessness, and equally the constant grinding fear of homelessness, is basicaly the number one punishment our society is willing to inflict upon thousands of families and individuals..despite that fact it pretty much guarantees poor outcomes.

            Wrap around services and 'plans' are all very well for this young woman, her babies and her partner…but even the best parent's in the world, are living on the edge of disaster if they are unable to settle in a home.

    • Adrian Thornton 3.2
      12 June 2019 at 10:27 am

      Years ago we used to foster kids from SIPS, after dealing with their relentless bullshit for a couple of years I had a big angry spin out and after a lots of calls managed to talk to someone well up the food chain. He asked me, "what is the one thing we can do to help make this work better for you and the children you foster", I said I want a flashing signal that flashes every time someone from your organization opens any of our files that says "Don't fuck these people around!", they couldn't have followed my very precise instructions because they kept doing exactly what I asked them not to do.

      Sounds like nothing has changed.

      • Rosemary McDonald 3.2.1
        12 June 2019 at 10:36 am

        After caring for a baby in very similar circumstances to Reid's article and finding ourselves the only people on the stage batting for the young mum (to the point of putting in a complaint to the Children's Commission about CYF's handling of the case) we found ourselves on their shit list.

        Despite either myself or my partner phoning the CYFs office every day for nearly two months to find out when the Care Plan for this infant was going to arrive we were chastised for 'not communicating' after we complained to the Commission.

        We had spoken to a couple who had fostered some thirty years prior to us, and they were saying exactly the same things.

        SSDD.

        • Adrian Thornton 3.2.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 11:47 am

          Oh CYF's that's right must have blocked that out.

          I was told at the outset by friends who knew what they were talking about, that while our intentions were good and right, we were like babes in the woods as far as CYF's were concerned, and it would probably end badly, which it didn't but it was a very unsatisfactory experience to say the least.

          That being said I don't regret for minute the decision to get involved, the kids who came through got to exist in a pretty happy, somewhat functional and loving home for a while, and that was not nothing for some of them.

          • Rosemary McDonald 3.2.1.1.1
            12 June 2019 at 11:58 am

            That being said I don't regret for minute the decision to get involved, the kids who came through got to exist in a pretty happy, somewhat functional and loving home for a while, and that was not nothing for some of them.

            We signed up for emergency and respite care so over 60 children got to have that same experience. There were none who did not need to be in care for at least a short time while the grown ups were assisted by Child, Youth and Family to get their shit sorted.

            Trouble is, while we did our bit and kept the kids safe and happyish…CYFs often did sfa to sort out the family.

            • Adrian Thornton 3.2.1.1.1.1
              12 June 2019 at 12:07 pm

              True that, we had one kid with us for quite a while (over 12 months) and he came out of CYF care while with us, even though this young man had been in their care in one form or another since he was a baby, they had not set up even one thing to help prepare him for his entry in to the wide world, they were in a word…useless.

    • millsy 3.3
      12 June 2019 at 10:30 am

      Its all very well and good to carry on about 'uplifting', but what help are these young parents going to get in future?

      Or are they going to be sent home with a few pamphlets and a list of 0800 numbers and expected to flounder around on their own?

      • Rosemary McDonald 3.3.1
        12 June 2019 at 1:07 pm

        Its all very well and good to carry on about 'uplifting', but what help are these young parents going to get in future?

        Good point. And I don't think there was anyone in NZ (other than Tariana) who was cheering on the Whanau Ora concept louder than myself. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wh%C4%81nau_Ora

        Sadly, and despite Tariana throwing family carers under the bus at the 2013 Budget in return for an extra 1.2 billion bucks towards Maori initiatives including WO…it seems to have come to sfa.

        Hawkes Bay has horrendous stats for social dysfunction and you'd think with an active and engaged local iwi there would have been strides made…

        BUT…in this particular case there were interventions being made and support structures in place which were ignored and dismissed by the OT social workers.

    • marty mars 3.4
      12 June 2019 at 11:07 am

      What are they trying to hide – nice the high charging lawyers are involved – that will help the situation get worse.

      Children's agency Oranga Tamariki went to court yesterday seeking orders for cuts to a Newsroom video story on a controversial 'uplift' of a Māori baby.

      The ministry engaged law firm Kensington Swan and partner Linda Clark to file an urgent memorandum with the Family Court asking for Newsroom to be ordered to change the story by investigations editor Melanie Reid.

      https://www.newsroom.co.nz/2019/06/12/631721/oranga-tamariki-taking-newsroom-to-court

      • Rosemary McDonald 3.4.1
        12 June 2019 at 11:42 am

        marty mars…I have this theory. The un- announced uplifting of Maori babies in certain areas is obviously a problem. The deep involvement and activism from these Maori midwives (who seem to be seriously on to it) and their lawyer has led to them forming a plan to gain as much media publicity as possible…because that's simply how the system works.

        They had Reid primed and ready to go on speed dial should another uplift be imminent.

        Then they just sat back with the cameras rolling (so to speak) and let those Oranga Tamariki social workers damn themselves and the organisation they work for.

        Seems like the OT case against Newsroom smacks of another Lashlie…

        https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=940577

        Whistleblower Celia Lashlie deserved to be sacked by the Special Education Service last year, her former boss, chief executive Peter Cowley, told MPs yesterday.

        An uproar followed Ms Lashlie's dismissal after she spoke out about at-risk children by describing a blond, angelic five-year-old boy from Nelson who was headed for prison. The service said that she had breached client confidentiality. But a month later chairman Graham Lovelock had to resign when an inquiry found she had been unfairly treated.

        • marty mars 3.4.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 12:07 pm

          I just watched the show – so bad. With 3 Māori babies a week being taken then they may have had a few choices but this process for this whānau and young mother seems so shocking.

          This isn't going to be able to happen like this anymore – this is going to change.

          • Rosemary McDonald 3.4.1.1.1
            12 June 2019 at 12:11 pm

            I just watched the show

            You have to watch it to get the full impact. If nothing else methinks an award is in the future for Newsroom. Good work.

            • marty mars 3.4.1.1.1.1
              12 June 2019 at 12:20 pm

              I was aware of this when it happened but watching really drives how bad the whole thing is. I had to watch even though I didn't want to. It was horrible.

  4. WeTheBleeple 4
    12 June 2019 at 9:20 am

    Fake News?

    You aint seen nothing yet.

    https://futurism.com/the-byte/ai-clones-voice-speech-patterns

    • Poission 4.1
      12 June 2019 at 11:39 am

      We refer to the question: What sort of creature man’s next successor in the supremacy of the earth is likely to be. We have often heard this debated; but it appears to us that we are ourselves creating our own successors; we are daily adding to the beauty and delicacy of their physical organisation; we are daily giving them greater power and supplying by all sorts of ingenious contrivances that self-regulating, self-acting power which will be to them what intellect has been to the human race. In the course of ages we shall find ourselves the inferior race.

      Day by day, however, the machines are gaining ground upon us; day by day we are becoming more subservient to them; more men are daily bound down as slaves to tend them, more men are daily devoting the energies of their whole lives to the development of mechanical life. The upshot is simply a question of time, but that the time will come when the machines will hold the real supremacy over the world and its inhabitants is what no person of a truly philosophic mind can for a moment question.

      "Darwin among the machines The Press june 1863.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwin_among_the_Machines

      • greywarshark 4.1.1
        12 June 2019 at 1:48 pm

        What 1863? Sure it's not 1963? Is that our curse that we can look and imagine so far into the future, and not make enough headway so that society takes note and the leaders consider that thinking as prescient and important and act in accordance with it. Oh for dreams like Back to the Future. The saddest two words in the English language – If only! Have we not looked for persons of a truly philosophic mind when we choose our leaders? Have we any now? And what classification of the minds of our civil servants – are they just basically practical and commonsense people wanting to meet targets so they can get their pay and hopefully, promotion?
        Edit.

        …giving them greater power and supplying by all sorts of ingenious contrivances that self-regulating, self-acting power which will be to them what intellect has been to the human race. In the course of ages we shall find ourselves the inferior race.

  5. AB 5
    12 June 2019 at 9:29 am

    Trundling down Onewa Rd this morning – able to use the T3 so not too bad, In the non-T3 lane, the looks on people's faces! Boredom, despair, and outright depression. How did this pointless, life-sapping stupidity come about?

    And the signs from "tiny Dan the economist man" Bidois calling for AT to 'fix' Onewa Rd. No Dan – what we need to fix is the insane need for everyone to be on the road at the same time. It's clear that just about everyone works way too much. We need a much shorter working week and public transport free at the point of use. The realm of freedom begins where the realm of necessity ends.

    • James 5.1
      12 June 2019 at 9:50 am

      “we need a much shorter working eeek” huh?

      how short would you life it?

      What wage will you have to pay people per hour to be able to live off the shortened week?

      how much more are you willing to pay for goods now NZ has this “much shorter week”?

      a lot of roles need to be covered so we will need more people in jobs? Where are we going to get them from?

      • Rapunzel 5.1.1
        12 June 2019 at 10:49 am

        There are a multitude of ways that a "four day week" can be applied other than the one most recently reported on as a success incl details of how accommodation was made for those who it did or did not suit.

        It is all about thinking on your feet, productivity and outcomes and will be a vital part of "the future of work".

        Most families have couples working a four day week planned to accommodate two days off immediately reduces the need for full-time or before and after childcare and children farmed out to that less. It can also be a five day but lesser hour day that also caters to younger children's need for adult care and the better productivity achieved in the Perpetual Guardian trial. Besides my husband's business I worked in the private sector as an employee eventually part-time by my choice but completed as many, and some times more, tasks in my 24 hours than others who just occupied their seats often chatting/fiddling for their eight hour day pay.

        Finally in regard to some physically active occupations as per my husband's business of laying infrastructure once a contract was won and agreed it almost always had a fairly clear timeline. With some urging and encouragement he recognised that one option was four ten hour days that meant that travel and loading and unloading gear plus set-up was immediately effectively not required for the fifth day that was once worked.

        Another aspect that worked had similar set-up savings and that was for example a good run and good planning often meant what may have been estimated as an approx eight week job may often be completed in seven or so weeks. Some businesses will have staff doing meaningless "maintenance" yes that must be done and the time is ideal but punitively requiring staff to turn up for hours for the rest of a week before the next job begins is pointless.

        It also meant good will extended to staff work five days when necessary and have the option to accrue "lieu" days – eventually it became a bit of a tradition to have a few of those built up so around Easter no\ jobs were set down to start, all jobs were set to be completed and around that time the lieu days were added to the Easter break for a bit of a build up into winter.

        Thinking as you seem to do that the benefits are not there and people need to work and functional in a one size fits all, rigid and inflexible work regime is of no use to anything particularly the productivity improvements NZ needs.

        • I feel love 5.1.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 1:44 pm

          The "right" are quite bereft of ideas aren't they? National haven't had one in a long while.

  6. Adrian Thornton 6
    12 June 2019 at 9:54 am

    Unbelievably the relentless Russia conspiracy theorist and general nutter Rachel Maddow will moderate first Democratic debates. They could most probably have had more balance if it was hosted by someone from Fox…the clip from below is from 2018, and she still hasn't stopped going on and on and on and on and on and on…..



  7. adam 7
    12 June 2019 at 10:29 am

    God Bless John Stewart.



  8. Adrian Thornton 8
    12 June 2019 at 10:34 am

    George Orwell's doublespeak in real time, right in front of our eyes….although this sort of thing coming straight from the hated Whitehouse will help Corbyn not hurt him IMO.

    Pompeo pledges not to wait for Britain’s elections to ‘push back’ against Corbyn and anti-Semitism

    "Secretary of State Mike Pompeo weighed in on British politics during a closed-door meeting with Jewish leaders, saying he would not wait for Labour Party leader Jeremy Corbyn to become prime minister of Britain to “push back” against him or any future actions he might take against Britain’s Jews."

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/pompeo-pledges-not-to-wait-for-britains-elections-to-push-back-against-corbyn-and-anti-semitism/2019/06/07/dfeaa180-9c27-4495-9322-3d16b7d1541a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.a08adb8c0f44

  9. millsy 9
    12 June 2019 at 10:38 am

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/113409891/can-new-zealands-superannuation-age-remain-at-65

    Dianne Crossman, starts her drum beat again to raise the age, despite that such a move will plunge thousands of people into hardship. Especially those who have spent most of their lives in insecure jobs with very low incomes, or on benefits due to medical conditions. The thought of having to wait 2 more years to get NZ Super will break a lot of people. Not that she gives a shit.

    Personally I think the age should be dropped back to 60, as I see there are a lot of 60-65 year olds in much hardship, thrown under the bus by their wealthy property owning peers who voted for lower taxes and benefit cuts.

    • greywarshark 9.1
      12 June 2019 at 12:14 pm

      Suggesting raising the age for the pension (superannuation) is a case of bias based on 'my' experience and knowledge trumping any other considerations. I think from my knowledge and experience that a lot of our policy makers, leaders and 'thinkers' come at their task with their minds clear and untramelled by any conflict or confusion of differing opinion and information.

      She rightly points out that there are large numbers of older people who are very fit and who are continuing to work and earn past 65. She also points out that people are living longer, (and that can mean that they are receiving the pension for old age for a third of their adult lives).

      But simply looking at the cost of the pension to those people, and arbitrarily shifting the threshold age up is a 'commonsense' response to the problem. Having to hunt for jobs when your abilities are not in demand is often hard and soul-breaking up to 65, so no extension of age is going to make the task easier and would be a nasty blow to people under stress of poverty. Also with the decreasing lack of full-time jobs that pay for all living costs in New Zealand, people over 65 filling some that would have been available to younger people, merely pushes the welfare cost down to a younger age. For someone who has a senior well-paying job, to work on for years prevents others on the ladder from rising and building their own savings for retirement, and their seniority and experience is not then fully realised and utilised by their employer.

      This appears to be the case with Outgoing Retirement Commissioner Diane Maxwell. (Diana Crossan was Retirement Commissioner for ten years and was replaced by Diane Maxwell.) She is someone who has worked extremely hard in England, owned an advertising business, then in finance consultancy, retail banking and became Regulator of the Financial Markets Authority.

      Diane Maxwell has been outspoken about the need to increase the pension age from 65….

      Maori and Pacific people also currently have lower life expectancies but Maxwell said that was something to fix outside pension settings. "My partner is Samoan. My son is half-Samoan. I wouldn't want to raise him saying you get super earlier because you're Samoan – what does that say to him? It tells him it's a done deal. I don't think that's right."

      Despite:

      Researchers Michael Littlewood and Michael Chamberlain have said there is no need for panic.

      In their response to Maxwell's 2016 review, they said: "We know that the population aged 65-plus will about double over coming decades and that the costs of healthcare and New Zealand Super will increase substantially if current settings remain. These two major government programmes will be the most directly affected by the ageing population. However, we also know that New Zealand's economy will grow and, barring catastrophes, we should as a country be able to afford more than we currently pay for the age-related programmes…

      Forty-four per cent of people aged 65 to 69 are still working and that is expected to increase in future. Others continue even longer. Some of them are even serving as the country's deputy prime minister…

      Maxwell said the country had passed a tipping point where most people at 65 were healthy, fit and active and did not see themselves as pensioners…

      "If you think about the original intention of super in 1898 back then we weren't expected to make it much past that. Then it went to 60 then back to 65 but where we've got to now, our life expectancy is much longer. Women should expect to get to mid or late 80s, and men mid 80s, broadly. You used to get super for five years, then 10 and now 20 – soon it'll be 30. I'm not sure how we can fund people getting super for 30 years or more."

      https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/113409891/can-new-zealands-superannuation-age-remain-at-65
      Also see 'Diane Maxwell – PressReader'
      And: Profile: Diane Maxwell 2015 https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11504524

      Then there is the need to examine our financial system. There are ways that government could manage the system of support better. Many of our wealthy percentage now live better than kings and queens of past centuries. But they should not necessarily be cut off from the pension scheme, as they form a small percentage in the nation. There are people who apply their minds to problems within society who can be asked to form working groups and work with academics from the age group who know the problems. They would co-operate and interact through a blog such as this. Suggestions leading to pilot schemes for testing would be more acceptable if they came from the older age group themselves. Everyone doing some volunteer part-time work that utilised their past skills, or new ones that they would like to train for, which would be extra to tasks already employing people as agreed by government, would result in the country running more smoothly and better understanding between age and social classes. And there would be a drop in cost for welfare in other areas. This would not be necessarily pleasing to the wealthy class however, who seem to feel obliged to keep impacting on opportunities for betterment of the strugglers.

      An understanding that an increase in cost of pensions does not necessarily mean ruin for the country is also necessary. This requires an understanding of how money is a created asset of will, and the various factors governing its effectiveness in keeping a nation thriving, and in maintaining its value for trading exchanges. Economists have wandered off onto paths that are not appropriate to follow further into our fast-changing future. But new approaches must be formed by others outside the tight measures of historic systems which are grimly held onto by the relative few who want to hold their ephemeral assets, and see their physical assets maintain value.

    • SPC 9.2
      12 June 2019 at 12:51 pm

      As someone who argued that super should not be paid to those still working way back in 1983 (a corrrespondence with Anne Hercus, who later brought in surtax), I do support paying super rate benefits to those not working after the age of 60 (unable to work or find work) and of course the income supplement for power to those on super and or benefits.

      This is important as the cost of paying super to those working is limiting revenue for public education, health and housing (which could be significanly higher and government still be within 30% GDP).

      The cost of paying super to those still working is over $3B pa and is rising fast – will be $5Bpa by the end of the decade.

  10. johnm 10
    12 June 2019 at 10:47 am

    The grossly under- reported Kim Dotcom case is a litmus test for democracy in New Zealand

    Given the public interest in this and its importance as a litmus test for New Zealand's judicial system there is shamefully little coverage of this in the New Zealand media.

    Kim's fate is as important as Julian Assange's. If the New Zealand government sends Kim to a dungeon in the United States it will mark the end of democracy in this country – as if we haven't already seen which way things are going

    I had to search on Google for this. I check the RNZ site regularly.

    http://robinwestenra.blogspot.com/

    • johnm 10.1
      12 June 2019 at 11:42 am

      The founder of file-sharing service Megaupload, Kim Dotcom, has entered the final appeal battle to try and challenge his extradition to the US, where he faces decades behind bars for copyright infringement charges.

      The appeal hearings kicked off in New Zealand's Supreme Court on Monday. If the appeal fails, it will be up to the country's interior minister to decide whether to actually greenlight the extradition.

      Dotcom has resided in New Zealand since 2010 and the US case against the Megaupload founder has resulted in a lengthy extradition battle. While it was greenlighted in 2015, it has been repeatedly appealed in various courts since then, ultimately getting to the top judiciary.

      The founder of file-sharing service Megaupload, Kim Dotcom, has entered the final appeal battle to try and challenge his extradition to the US, where he faces decades behind bars for copyright infringement charges.

      The appeal hearings kicked off in New Zealand's Supreme Court on Monday. If the appeal fails, it will be up to the country's interior minister to decide whether to actually greenlight the extradition.

      Dotcom himself has repeatedly stated that the whole case is an attempt by the US government to further stomp on “web freedom” and if he's prosecuted, any internet provider can be held liable for the “misuse” of their services by the users.

      His legal team maintains that the file-sharing service platform itself cannot be blamed for any copyright infringement by the end users. Supporters of the internet entrepreneur share a similar opinion, arguing that it will set a very dangerous precedent – for internet-based businesses.

      https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-48582958

    • francesca 10.2
      12 June 2019 at 12:55 pm

      New Zealand's Court of Appeal has just ordered the NZ govt(which will be down to the justice minister,Little) to reconsider the Amy Adams granted extradition of a Korean accused of the murder of a sex worker in China.

      This is because apparently we can't just accept China's assurances that the suspect, if found guilty will not be executed , or tortured

      Can we accept any US assurances that Dotcom will be treated fairly and in line with human rights?

      Dotcom's "crime" is way below the charge of murder

      I'll be watching Little on this one

      • aj 10.2.1
        12 June 2019 at 1:41 pm

        This is likely to end up in Andrew Little's lap, and will be a test of independence for this government

    • Siobhan 10.3
      12 June 2019 at 1:54 pm

      Speaking of dungeons..given todays announcement of the US formally and fully requesting Assanges extradition..lets revisit and give a massive eye roll at the Guardians wording last month re;America beginning formally requesting extradition…

      "Julian Assange has declined a chance to consent to his extradition to the US at a hearing in London as Washington started pressing its case to take him across the Atlantic."

      "Declined a chance"

      Chance of a life time folks..and he's 'declined'.

      Good grief.

      https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-justice-assange/us-formally-asks-uk-to-extradite-wikileaks-assange-idUSKCN1TC24R

    • Brigid 10.4
      12 June 2019 at 2:19 pm

      Slightly off topic; more aligned with Julian Assange's case than Dot Com's, but this demonstrates also, how hopelessly useless NZ media is compared to……well

      Russia

      Russia's three top newspapers – @Vedomosti, @ru_rbc, and @kommersant – are running identical front pages tomorrow in solidarity with @meduzaproject reporter Ivan Golunov, who is facing up to 20 years in prison in apparent retaliation for his work.

      https://twitter.com/maxseddon/status/1137821497387601921

      • francesca 10.4.1
        12 June 2019 at 2:55 pm

        All the charges have been dropped and some police under investigation

        Yep, there is a real diversity of voice in print news over there

        Makes us look pathetic

        • joe90 10.4.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 3:09 pm

          I guess it's diverse if Alexei Gromov says it's diverse.

          It is widely known that major Russian media outlets — especially television — are controlled by the government. But who actually manages the Kremlin’s grip? This is the story of Alexey Gromov, a former diplomat who has gained great influence and power as Vladimir Putin’s media puppetmaster.

          In the spring of 2017, tens of thousands of people took to the streets in about 100 Russian cities to protest political corruption and other problems in national government.

          Western media and Russian Internet news outlets published stories about the marches, many focusing on the police who brutally dispersed the crowds and arrested nearly 2,000 protesters. But Russian viewers of the country’s television channels saw little of this. For most of them, the May 26 protests never happened at all.

          Described as an unassuming man whose passions include collecting antique coins, Gromov is nonetheless a key manager of the Putin government’s control over what gets said — or not — in Russia’s major print and broadcast media. He is also a co-creator of RT, the international propaganda network formerly known as Russia Today.

          https://www.proekt.media/portrait/alexey-gromov-eng

          https://www.occrp.org/en/investigations/the-man-behind-the-kremlins-control-of-the-russian-media

          • francesca 10.4.1.1.1
            13 June 2019 at 1:59 pm

            Its always been well known that the print media in Russia is way more diverse, unlike our own, and the TV is more aligned to govt viewpoints.Nothing new here

            • joe90 10.4.1.1.1.1
              13 June 2019 at 2:17 pm

              Likely more partisan than diverse.

              It seems unlikely those who ordered Mr Golunov’s prosecution could have guessed his arrest would prove so controversial and end with disgrace and suspensions. The reporter is not well known beyond liberal circles. And the Russian journalistic community is hardly known for acts of solidarity. But the journalist’s plight provoked an unprecedented multi-level response that surprised almost everyone watching.

              Within hours of his detention making the news, hundreds of journalists were picketing the headquarters of Moscow police. Even stars of state propaganda offered messages of support. On Monday, Russia’s leading broadsheets led with the same front page in support of Mr Golunov. Again, this was a historical first and the entire print-run was snapped up before lunchtime.

              “I hope with this story something has changed in this profession,” said Ms Timchenko. “I hope that the next time we are offended, attacked or worse, we will respond as one.”

              https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ivan-golunov-released-house-arrest-police-drugs-charge-journalist-a8953801.html

        • Brigid 10.4.1.2
          12 June 2019 at 6:34 pm

          "Makes us look pathetic"

          Indeed it does, though it isn't 'us', its mainstream New Zealand media, print, digital, radio and TV.

          It must be said though there are some fantastic NZ journalists: Max Rushbroke, David Slack, Chris Trotter, Mihingarangi Forbes, Kirsty Johnstone, Bryan Bruce.

    • Wayne 10.5
      12 June 2019 at 5:24 pm

      If the Supreme Court finds the KDC should be extradited, I am pretty sure that is what will happen.

      All KDC's points are being fully argued in the Supreme Court, probably more fully than any other litigant in New Zealand history.

      He either wins or loses in the Supreme Court. More than any other case, a political decision should not come into it.

      If he loses, then he should be extradited. If he wins, then he stays.

      • Psycho Milt 10.5.1
        12 June 2019 at 6:41 pm

        More than any other case, a political decision should not come into it.

        Bit late for that. The circumstances of the dodgy assault on his home scream "political decision," so one more here or there doesn't make much difference.

  11. ianmac 11
    12 June 2019 at 11:43 am

    We will never give up thinks Simon.

    Today in the House:

    2. Hon SIMON BRIDGES to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her Government’s statements and actions in relation to the alleged unauthorised access of Budget 2019 material?

    4.Hon AMY ADAMS to the Minister of Finance: Does he accept that clause 3.27 of the Cabinet Manual states he is individually accountable for Treasury’s actions in relation to the early release of Budget 2019 information, and at what specific time did Treasury first receive advice from the GCSB relating to the use of the term “hack”?

    • veutoviper 11.1
      12 June 2019 at 12:28 pm

      Bridges really is a glutton for punishment. IMO he is just making himself look like a fool acting like a broken record. LOL

      The question by Amy Adams is of more interest IMO, because she appears to be trying to get around Trevor Mallard's Speaker ruling/warning yesterday in relation to her line of questioning of Robertson under Question 4. Mallard referred her to a ruling some years ago (2012) by Speaker Smith that it is not in the public interest to comment while an independent inquiry is underway.

      As I mentioned in a reply I made earlier this morning @ 4.2.2,1. to one by mickysavage under Daily Review 11 June, the transcript of yesterday's Questions 1 and 2 by Bridges are worth reading carefully for the timeline and their exact wording – along with that of Question 4 where Adams (as a trained lawyer) tried to 'lead' Robertson in his answers to her questions but failed thanks to Mallard's preparation/anticipation of the tactic she used and Robertson's careful replies.

      Here is the link to the transcript again for all yesterday's questions.

      https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/hansard-debates/rhr/combined/HansDeb_20190611_20190611_04

      • ianmac 11.1.1
        12 June 2019 at 12:56 pm

        The Timeline published on Scoop:

        David Parker answered questions on behalf of minister responsible for the GCSB Andrew Little, giving a clear timeline of the events surrounding Hack-gate.

        • 8:02pm – Treasury issued its press release advising there had been a deliberate and systemic hack and it had referred this to police

        • 8:43pm – Mr Little's office first spoke to the GCSB

        • 9:43pm – Mr Little spoke to the GCSB

        • 9:52 pm – Mr Little contacted the prime minister's office

        • 10:25pm – Mr Little contacted Finance Minister Grant Robertson via text message

        (Wonder why the last Government was not put under the same intense scrutiny?)

        • veutoviper 11.1.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 1:26 pm

          Thanks, That seems to be a shortened version of the long timeline published in Derek Cheng's non-paywalled article in The Herald this morning.

          Link –
          https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12239460

          [Note – I don’t like giving clickbaits to the Herald, but with this new comments system I seem unable to copy and paste into comments which is a real bore. The tool bar says that my browser doesn't enable pasting using the two paste icons in the tool bar and to use Control + Shift + V which does not work and just gives a row of vvvvvvvvvvvs ]

          Agree re the last govt not having been subjected to the same level of scrutiny, but I really think that the “Bridges’ approach” is going to backfire on National in the longer term – and already is seen by many as a Wellington Beltway bore.

          • veutoviper 11.1.1.1.1
            12 June 2019 at 1:43 pm

            Test of using the Blockquote facility to paste. ummmm ………

            Timeline Tuesday, May 28

            • 10:01am: In a press release, National publishes what it claims to be details of the 2019 Budget •

            11:30am: Finance Minister Grant Robertson confirms some of the details in National's release are from Budget 2019 •

            Afternoon: National releases more Budget details •

            2pm: National says its method of accessing the Budget information on the Treasury website is closed down.

            bull; Before 6pm: The Treasury asks the cybersecurity unit of the Government Communications Security Bureau about how confidential information on its website was accessed. The GCSB says the Treasury's computer network was not compromised, and the matter should be referred to the police, given that it's not what the GCSB normally responds to •

            6pm: Treasury Secretary Gabriel Makhlouf refers the matter to the police •

            7pm to 7:15pm: Makhlouf meets Robertson in his Beehive office and tells him that he has called in the police. Robertson says that Makhlouf described it as 2000 attempts to "hack" the system. Meeting is later attended by Jacinda Ardern's chief press secretary Andrew Campbell and deputy chief of staff Raj Nahna. •

            7:20pm: Robertson calls Ardern to inform her of latest developments • 8:02pm: The Treasury issues a press release saying it has "sufficient evidence" that it had been "deliberately and systematically hacked". It cites the GCSB advice in saying it has been referred to the police. •

            8:19pm: Robertson issues a press release, asking National not to release any further information because "the material is a result of a systematic hack". •

            8:43pm: The GCSB contacts the office of GCSB Minister Andrew Little to say it doesn't believe any systematic hacking took place. Little is in a meeting. The GCSB contacts the Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet to pass on its concerns, and Ardern is told soon afterwards. •

            9:43pm: Little speaks with the GCSB and then tries to call Robertson. The call is not answered. •

            9.52pm: Little contacts Nahna in Ardern's office to pass on the GCSB's concerns. •

            10.25pm: Little texts Robertson about the GCSB's concerns. ;.

          • Incognito 11.1.1.1.2
            12 June 2019 at 1:48 pm

            The Paste as plain text (Ctrl + Shift + V) icon doesn’t work for me either and I use Ctrl + V, i.e. without Shift.

            This is when using Microsoft Edge.

        • Gabby 11.1.1.2
          12 June 2019 at 6:29 pm

          Well David Carsehole was very 'good' at putting an end to inconvenient questions.

    • SPC 11.2
      12 June 2019 at 1:15 pm

      4.Hon AMY ADAMS to the Minister of Finance: Does he accept that clause 3.27 of the Cabinet Manual states he is individually accountable for Treasury’s actions in relation to the early release of Budget 2019 information, and at what specific time did Treasury first receive advice from the GCSB relating to the use of the term “hack”?

      Treasury did not release the information early, it was obtained by the National Party using unauthorised access to confidential government information.

      The time given is …. and they were also advised to take the matter of the National Party's unauthorised access to Treasury’s confidential information to the police.

    • RedLogix 11.3
      12 June 2019 at 1:58 pm

      It's my view that Bridges belatedly realised he committed a crime and is frantically diverting all over the shop in an attempt to set the agenda. A conviction would not just sink his political career, but call into question any future legal one as well.

      And I know I'd never employ a lawyer who'd been so reckless as to leak the Budget and then crow about it after.

      No wonder he cannot let it go; it's keeping him awake at night.

  12. OnceWasTim 12
    12 June 2019 at 12:01 pm

    I think I may have accidentally stumbled on what was meant by a government that is 'transformational'. But it still doesn't explain the lack of "reinvention of government' or the lack of adequate "interaction with its citizens' (or various other things like being open and kind, or even some of the dithering).

    I had been interrupted while doing a g-g-g-google on Oranga Tamariki (anxious to see why not much has changed, or is transformational), and government, then later (using the same unfulfilled g-g-g-google window) typing 'transformational'. Low and behold:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformational_Government

    It possibly does explain things like demographic EXCEL spreadsheets and generic public servant managers entirely out of their depth though, and even deference to those 'officials' considered to be the experts. Maybe I should see 'Gabs' in a different light, and even why some of those 'progressive generic manager' types thought the use of T&C would be OK at the parliamentary corral. (Codes of Conduct, Purchase Agreements and Performance Appraisals ALL aside)

    Maybe some of the failings are just down to 'The Computer Says NO'

    In a former life as a Systems Programmer many years past, I've never forgotten what a couple of my managers said to me: One being one of those 10 pound Poms and expert in various network protocols, the other responsible for being the author of an entire operating system that supported our banking system for years.

    "People should drive technology" and conversely "technology should not drive people".

    By which they meant that people were the starting point, rather than here's a piece of technology, so now let's see what it can do for us.

    Which is why we spent a lot of time determining what it was that 'people' – i.e. human beings' requirements were as the staring point, and if need be, developing and even manufacturing hardware to effect things like remote switching mechanisms, and 99.9% availability, etc. etc. etc.

    I'm thinking that the day machinery is able to feel emotion, to empathise rather than sympathise and structure some templated version of a response, and the day it isn't versed in spin and obfuscation – unable to get its registers and storage knickers in a twist, is the day I'll renew my interest in things IT (as opposed to ICT). Probably also the day those generic managers will be out of business although really, they should be already ("ultimately, going forward")

  13. Herodotus 13
    12 June 2019 at 12:03 pm

    is getting the right answer even if you weren’t planning it a good thing ?

    many here have commented on the wrong direction the govt is heading re Kiwibuild (welfare for the middle class) instead of placing all the efforts into HNZ and those in need. Somehow we have in the short term got it right imo

    https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/113402379/while-kiwibuild-falters-state-house-build-rockets-ahead-with-ninefold-increase-over-three-years

    • SPC 13.1
      12 June 2019 at 1:04 pm

      If the government concentrated on one over the other, the house build programme would not carry widespread support – a recent poll showed people still support KiwiBuild.

      KiwiBuild is a way to boost supply to constrain upward rents that is affordable – given the 30% government to GDP (and 20% debt target between now and 2022 this is important) limitation

      PS It's inevitable sales will extend to those going from one bedroom flats and apartments to family homes.

    • Gabby 13.2
      12 June 2019 at 6:35 pm

      It would be nice to see a bit more made of this.

  14. greywarshark 14
    12 June 2019 at 12:42 pm

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/first-up/audio/2018699171/milford-track-huts-booked-out-in-minutes-for-summer

    The site went live at 9:30am on Tuesday and within minutes bookings for the 70 beds in huts along the track were full for December and January….

    There has also been a rise in the number of New Zealand residents booking to walk the tracks.

    DoC says the number of Kiwis booking has risen since last year and credits it to a "different pricing trial in place on four of the Great Walks". The Milford, Kepler, Routeburn and Abel Tasman Coast Tracks all have a special price for International visitors which is up to double the fees New Zealand residents will pay….

    Further bookings for the Great Walk tracks are being released this week and are expected to be popular, Mr Taylor says, 'If it's anything like previous seasons you'll need to be in quick." Bookings for the tracks will come out on the following days:

    Routeburn Track & Paparoa Track
    Wednesday 12th June 2019, 9.30am

    Abel Tasman Coast Track, Tongariro Northern Circuit & Kepler Track
    Thursday 13th June 2019, 9.30am

    Rakiura Track, Whanganui Journey & Lake Waikaremoana Track
    Friday 14th June, 9.30am

    (So get in Kiwis that can afford the cost to get in and enjoy. A great chance to enjoy your own scenic splendour while you can. Also it would be good if Kiwis had first dibs in the main holidays and in school holidays.) International visitors can have their opportunities outside our holidays- seems fair – we don't have that many.

    I think we need more saints days and memorial days for past great luminaries!)

    • Rosemary McDonald 14.1
      12 June 2019 at 1:12 pm

      …it would be good if Kiwis had first dibs in the main holidays and in school holidays.

      That is an excellent idea. You should email DOC and suggest it. It could become an actual thing….Kiwi families doing the Great Walks.

  15. joe90 15
    12 June 2019 at 1:19 pm

    Poots and his kleptocrat mates losing their grip?

    https://twitter.com/AlexNicest/status/1138458186602680320

  16. Cinny 16
    12 June 2019 at 1:30 pm

    Had a long meeting this morning with a couple of locals who carry some weight, left feeling rather uplifted as we are going to work together to help our community, especially the kids at the high school with mental health and bullying. Yay!!!!

    • greywarshark 16.1
      12 June 2019 at 3:01 pm

      Double yay Cinny. What methods do you propose to use. Is there a helpful therapeutic tool that is available?

      • Cinny 16.1.1
        12 June 2019 at 5:54 pm

        In the past there have been various parent evenings or off campus talks, but those who attend aren't the people that necessarily need the help the most.

        We want to get some prominent speakers to come and address the whole school, captive audience and all that. So are now taking steps to make it happen.

        Found out the principal thinks that there is a mandate with the ministry of ed preventing such speakers coming to talk. So I rang the ministry of ed who said there is no such mandate. Made me wonder if there was such a mandate with the prior government. Turns out it's up to the BOT if they want it to happen, rather than the principal, and I know the BOT will be on our side with this 🙂

        Will let you know how we get on. I've been racking my brains for a different anti bullying system as the one at school doesn't work. What I have figured out is, many of the bullies have their own issues. Am trying to find the common ground and it seems to be the mental health of all.

        If I discover some awesome tools etc will def share. Kids around here are killing themselves, it's our towns dirty secret and needs to be addressed big time.

        Feeling really positive about it all, it's great that a couple of well known high up community members are on board, that's a huge deal. Progress yay and motivation from the well being budget, excellent 🙂

    • Rapunzel 16.2
      12 June 2019 at 4:28 pm

      That is the sort of action NZers should hope to see and be part of if they can, everything that can be improved or resolved is one problem less and is a "saving" – it is up to NZers to add momentum behind govt to improve NZers lives it is not just a money issue though that is necessary a changed mindset is crucial.

  17. greywarshark 17
    12 June 2019 at 1:32 pm

    Annual net migration has remained at high levels since the December 2014 year, Stats NZ said today.

    “Since late 2014, annual net migration has ranged between 48,000 and 64,000,” population indicators manager Tehseen Islam said.

    “The only previous time net migration was at these levels was for a short period in the early 2000s.”

    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO1906/S00128/net-migration-remains-high.htm

    (I presume they mean that this means high immigration levels rather than high emigration levels – migration just means movement.)

  18. greywarshark 18
    12 June 2019 at 2:59 pm

    A good education will help you into a job and start to your adult life. An excellent education will place you above those with a good education.

    Education
    Parents Gone Wild: High Drama Inside D.C.’s Most Elite Private School
    At Sidwell Friends, the high school of Chelsea Clinton and the Obama children, college counselors find themselves besieged by Ivy-obsessed families. 5/6/2019

    School officials have repeatedly warned parents, who represent the pinnacle of elite Washington, about their offensive conduct. In January, the head of the school, Bryan Garman, sent a remarkable letter to parents of seniors in which he demanded that they stop “the verbal assault of employees.” He also reiterated a policy banning them from recording conversations with counselors and making calls to counselors from blocked phone numbers. Garman also suggested that some parents were responsible for the “circulation of rumors about students….”

    Anger, vitriol, and deceptiveness have come to define highly selective college admissions. In the now notorious Varsity Blues scandal, the desire from wealthy parents to get their children into such elite institutions as Yale and the University of Southern California led them to lie on applications and obtain fake SAT scores. At Sidwell Friends, one of America’s most famous Quaker schools, the desire manifested itself in bad behaviors—including parents spreading rumors about other students, ostensibly so that their children could get a leg up, the letter said.
    https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2019/06/sidwell-friends-college-admissions-varsity-blues/591124/
    (Sidwell Friends, run by the Quakers – Heaven Knows, Anything Goes!)

    I think this shows Affluenza.

    In 2007, British psychologist Oliver James asserted that there was a correlation between the increasing occurrence of affluenza and the resulting increase in material inequality: the more unequal a society, the greater the unhappiness of its citizens.[5] Referring to Vance Packard's thesis The Hidden Persuaders on the manipulative methods used by the advertising industry, James related the stimulation of artificial needs to the rise in affluenza. To highlight the spread of affluenza in societies with varied levels of inequality, James interviewed people in several cities including Sydney, Singapore, Auckland, Moscow, Shanghai, Copenhagen and New York.

    In 2008 James wrote that higher rates of mental disorders were the consequence of excessive wealth-seeking in consumerist nations.[6] In a graph created from multiple data sources, James plotted "Prevalence of any emotional distress" and "Income inequality", attempting to show that English-speaking nations have nearly twice as much emotional distress as mainland Europe and Japan: 21.6 percent vs 11.5 percent

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affluenza

  19. bewildered 19
    12 June 2019 at 4:12 pm

    Chlöe Swarbrick got owned by the Hosk this morning There is a time when a bit of life experience under your belt makes a difference, than simply quoting selective research papers on legalising pot I was in Portugal last year ( Lisbon) and smelt it everywhere day and night To say legalising pot won’t increase its propensity in society is silly at best

    • joe90 19.1
      12 June 2019 at 4:20 pm

      *naive*

    • McFlock 19.2
      12 June 2019 at 4:22 pm

      Relying on your age rather than your arguments, as the husk did, do not "own" an argument.

      As for Portugal, you must still be feeling the effects, going by your punctuation.

      • bewildered 19.2.1
        12 June 2019 at 4:34 pm

        Should that be does not vs “do not” Flocky

        • McFlock 19.2.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 4:41 pm

          muphry strikes again, lol

          Still, just because he's 54 doesn't mean hosking knows a darn thing.

          • Muttonbird 19.2.1.1.1
            12 June 2019 at 6:44 pm

            He also implied people with no children are naive. Not a position I'd expect Hoskings to take.

            And the truth is Hoskings lost it and started ranting which is a sure sign he himself felt he lost the argument.

            • bewildered 19.2.1.1.1.1
              12 June 2019 at 9:36 pm

              I felt he conveyed the thoughts of many being lectured by naive 24 yr old who really knows or has experience squat

              • Muttonbird …
                12 June 2019 at 10:20 pm

                Only the hypersensitive and insecure right wing snowflakes would feel they were being lectured to.

    • Incognito 19.3
      12 June 2019 at 4:22 pm

      No idea what you’re talking about but I agree that individual and/or anecdotal ‘evidence’ always trumps research papers, each and every time. For example, I once knew a person who had been heavy smoker all his life and he lived until he was 85. So, to say that smoking causes lung cancer and kills is just rubbish. BTW, he died a horrible death from colon cancer because he used to smoke fish.

      • Gabby 19.3.1
        12 June 2019 at 6:41 pm

        I knew a bloke who drove his Maserati blind drunk all the time and he never crashed.

    • Psycho Milt 19.4
      12 June 2019 at 4:51 pm

      There is a time when a bit of life experience under your belt makes a difference, than simply quoting selective research papers…

      Thank you for declaring this preference for anecdata that supports your personal prejudice over actual research. It explains a lot about your comments.

      • Bewildered 19.4.1
        12 June 2019 at 9:43 pm

        Note the proviso “selective” PM End of day people will decide and I suspect the majority will go with common sense, real life experience and values over social science quackery A discipline dominated by leftwing bias and constructs

    • Cinny 19.5
      12 June 2019 at 6:00 pm

      Are you sure… twitter seems to think otherwise….

      https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&vertical=news&q=hosking&src=tren

      • Bewildered 19.5.1
        12 June 2019 at 9:52 pm

        Twitter is an echo chamber of left Cinny, it not the real world Look I get it was a bit of ad hominium from Hoskins, but for this subject I do feel age and experience, having kids etc does have bearing on your credibility with this topic God listening to Chlöe was like listening to a 12 year old lecture you on climate change

    • Gabby 19.6
      12 June 2019 at 6:39 pm

      What do you think propensity means beewee?

      • bewildered 19.6.1
        12 June 2019 at 9:58 pm

        Dunno gabs, maybe some one who likes to put child like cute little ee on the end on every one handle continuously and thinks it’s hilarious 😊

  20. greywarshark 20
    12 June 2019 at 4:28 pm

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/391859/barren-underworld-coral-bleaching-and-the-perilous-forecast-for-pacific-reefs

    What's most worrying, said Andrew Thurber, an associate professor of ocean ecology at the University of Oregon, is that nobody saw this year's event coming.

    …"We didn't expect it, we didn't predict it," Dr Thurber said. "The models didn't predict this to be a bleaching year. Mo'orea wasn't supposed to bleach and yet all of a sudden something's shifted and it's an incredibly widespread event."

    Coral bleaching happens when the sea temperature rises to a point that puts coral under intense stress, causing them to separate from the plant-like organisms that give their colours, as well as their oxygen, waste filtration and up to 90 percent of their energy….

    "The only time that it last hit those temperatures was 2016, when it hit for a few days," Dr Thurber said. "It's hit it numerous, numerous times this year."

    While Dr Thurber added that it was too early to conclude whether this was a trend being seen at Mo'orea, studies from other parts of the world paint a dire picture for much of the planet – and especially the Pacific's – coral reefs , particularly as the oceans continue to warm rapidly, in some cases up to 40 percent more than previously forecast….

    Last year's report by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change said that if global warming was limited to 1.5 degrees celsius – the target set and signed up to by most governments under the Paris Agreement – coral reefs would still decline by between 70 and 90 percent.

    And a study published in April by Australian scientists, which focussed on the Great Barrier Reef, found that global warming had hampered its ability to recover from large-scale bleaching in both 2016 and 2017. The researchers said the time between bleachings would shrink as global warming intensified.

    "Dead corals don't make babies," said the study's lead author, Professor Terry Hughes from Australia's James Cook University, in a news release."We have noticed more events like that, high temperatures," Mr Siu said. "We've also seen more wave events coming from hurricanes."…

    Coral reefs effectively act as the lungs of the ocean, producing more than half of the oxygen that humans breathe and, in turn, regulating both air and water temperatures.

    Their rigid shape also acts as a barrier, their friction slowing the force of waves and acting as a barrier against waves and erosion, both of which are increasing with climate change.

    Reefs are also home to about a quarter of all marine life, ranging from microscopic plankton, through to colourful reef fish, sharks and giant whales. This life is critical for communities like Mo'orea and Tahiti, which depend on them for food, protection, recreation and livelihoods.

    Not waiting

    When an 18-year-old Titouan Bernicot first saw the coral bleaching of 2016, he was surfing with his school friends. Shocked by what he saw, he wasn't going to wait for either the territorial or the French government to act.

    "We started to realise the coral reefs give us everything in our lives," he said. The waves they surfed on. The fish they ate when they returned to Mo'orea's white shores. The jobs their parents relied on – tourism, the pearl industry, fishing. "Everything is all connected," he said.
    Motivated to act, Mr Bernicot and friends formed the Mo'orea Coral Gardeners, a group that set about trying to restore the island's reef. It started with them trying to replant coral cuttings in other parts of the reef.Three years later, Mr Bernicot's movement is bigger than he ever imagined….

    Mr Bernicot said this year's bleaching has been disheartening. "This year, everyone is concerned," he said. But if anything, he added, it's given him further drive. His planting effort has intensified, and he's more motivated than ever.

    "It's simple. If we do nothing, nothing is going to happen, and the reef will die." "If we do nothing my children will ask me, 'why didn't you do something?'"

  21. greywarshark 21
    12 June 2019 at 5:41 pm

    Just what we didn't need. A great big retail chain spilling across land in Auckland that we could have grown food on and had social housing on.

    But no this monster is going to take business off established retailers large and small and undercut everybody and the profits will go offshore. There are people going to be employed. But there will be businesses closing down – stalemate. And Phil Goff is there smiling. It is supposed to be good. All this buying of land for business to tap into our veins and bleed us to death. But the land speculators will be smiling. They are on a gold mine.

    And there will be more biggies. We have IKEA. FGS we are only a country of 4 million people and we have plenty of competition already. We have low wages so that NZrs can't afford what these stores are offering. But with luck they will be able to keep pumping food into themselves so they can have the strength to go out and buy, buy. Wanting the big stores is like star-struck rural innocents who get a supermarket and a mall and think they have made it. It has a superficial charm but the Walmart success for the owners has been a bad dream of small shop owners in the heart of town; it cuts them out.

    All about it. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12238980
    Costco's coming: World's second-largest retailer unveils NZ store

    We are presented with the big figures – gasp everyone.
    Costco US $138 billion
    750 Warehouse stores
    Employs 245,000+ people
    94m members worldwide (Best buys to members about $60 annual fee)

    When we want to edge up our minimum wage – guess who will be against that. And threatening us with some legal action for loss of profits. Why a raise will be likened to some socialist plot to nationalise the country. Whoa!

    • Gabby 21.1
      12 June 2019 at 6:43 pm

      I wonder if they'll somehow manage to make no profit here as well.

      • greywarshark 21.1.1
        12 June 2019 at 8:04 pm

        That is an interesting thought for these interesting times. It could be that the foreign owners will decide to go green by adopting a no footprint-that-might-contain-money principle when they tidy up their finances for each quarter's market report. The site will be left clean and free from dirty lucre.

    • Exkiwiforces 21.2
      12 June 2019 at 8:27 pm

      When I was posted to Melbourne many moons ago, my partner now wife and I went to Costco located in the Docklands area for a bit of a look. Unless you were prepared to buy in bulk and I mean bulk aka you have one of those big yankie F250 utes or bigger. It was rather pointless signing up for the annual fee as we would've probably bought a enough bog roll and tissues to last a year and as I had a five bedroom Defence House storage wasn't a issue for us two.

      We got a better choice and better savings between Coles, Woollies, Aldi, IGA all within a 1-2km radius.

      In other words Costco wasn't much chop for us two.

      • greywarshark 21.2.1
        12 June 2019 at 8:57 pm

        So just as we are trying to introduce the idea of buying less, and reusing and recycling, this crowd will be trying to sell in bulk offering cheap prices based on a single item but you have to buy 10 towels etc.

        It catches the psychology of someone poor buying on price, but they can't control themselves from paying $15 when the only wanted one towel if it was $1.50. The shopper feels they got a deal at a bargain price, but don't recognise they're being sucked in and now have 9 towels on their hands that they have to store somewhere or give away or try and sell on themselves.

        • RedLogix 21.2.1.1
          12 June 2019 at 9:11 pm

          Agree with you on this. EKF mentioned Aldis a German chain that we use all the time. Key point of difference, smaller stores typically only about 1000m2 and lots of them. About one store per 20,000 people. All the key grocery and fresh food items are there, but a limited selection. Instead of dozen brands of say yoghurt there will be only two. Also they have a good line of in house organics.

          The other fascinating thing they do, which is a bit of a hook I will admit, is that the centre aisle of the store is used for a constantly rotating selection of all sorts of things you don't expect, everything literally from power tools, clothing, appliances, workout gear, camping kit and the like. Often good quality and great prices. What they do is buy a line in bulk, then use the empty backloading from the grocery lines to rotate to the next store. It's often only there for a week or two at most so you have to make up your mind or you miss out.

          The upshot is very good value for money. Two of us typically shop about once every ten days, and will fill a standard trolley for about A$130 – 150 depending on how many splurge items we got. On the whole I think we spend about 65% less on our groceries than in NZ.

          • greywarshark 21.2.1.1.1
            12 June 2019 at 9:18 pm

            They have the buying power and it's damn hard to compete with them. There will have to be a bond formed between NZ buyers and certified NZ owned stores so that we support each other. We have been conditioned to think globalised and our own enterprises have been sidelined and gone bust. If we want a country where people can earn a living at a job that pays for a person's livelihood which we are told is so important, then people are going to have to put their money where there mouth is. When you think that technology is doing so many out of a job, how do the planners expect to people to manage. There is still an attitude of derision for 'lazy' people by others who hardly know how to do anything for themselves, and never waste time thinking!

            • RedLogix 21.2.1.1.1.1
              12 June 2019 at 9:37 pm

              If we want a country where people can earn a living at a job that pays for a person's livelihood which we are told is so important, then people are going to have to put their money where there mouth is.

              Not going to happen. People will buy best value for money … as they judge value.

              Some purchases I make a point of buying local, because like you I do place a value on it, especially where there is added relationship value from sales and support expertise.

              Then there is this interesting model with a Japanese chain Muji that has a subtly different business model, also reducing selection but offering product longevity and value.

              “This will do.”

              It’s an unusual emotion for a retail chain to evoke from its shoppers, but it’s exactly how Japanese powerhouse Muji wants consumers to feel when perusing its vast array of goods.

              And it’s working.

              The chain opened its first store in Melbourne in 2013 selling a selection of unbranded minimalist clothes, stationery and furniture.

              Its strategy lends itself to its sustainable ethos — Muji focuses on recycling and wants to reduce waste in production and packaging.

              The clothes are gender neutral and have no logos as part of its no-brand policy.

              There is an inherent tension between the efficiency and innovation of globalisation and the desire to retain local identity and diversity. It's plays out at every scale, from villages, towns, cities and nations and largely it's a healthy thing.

            • bewildered 21.2.1.1.1.2
              12 June 2019 at 10:05 pm

              not going to happen shark people will vote with their wallets as the way it should be. If the values you highlight are real Costco are rooted, however I suspect you are in a small minority ;

  22. Exkiwiforces 22
    12 June 2019 at 7:36 pm

    A very interesting article from the people who compile the World Peace Index, saying the CC is going to be a major threat to world peace in the coming years/ decades with the Asia Pacific region the biggest concern and according to the ABC up to a million Aussies will be affected “No shit Sherlock” was my response while the article.

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-12/climate-change-hazards-global-peace-index-report/11198144

  23. Jenny - How to Get there? 23
    12 June 2019 at 10:01 pm

    Well that went well

    Not

    Link about Afghans

    [lprent: Worst link I have seen for a while. I reduced it to a readable form. ]

  24. Eco maori 24
    13 June 2019 at 8:33 am

    Kia ora The Am Show.

    Sugary drinks need the ass taxed out of them all forms of sugar in our food needs to be lowered ma te wa Papatuanuku was not made in a day Jacinda will sort our sugar problem in good time.

    Lloyd it hotting up in British politics everyone knows my opinion on brexit and boris it raining here to m8 we need it we are on rain water tank supply.

    Our Marae has just been refurbish and new carvings it makes me so proud te whanau have cared and love our Marae it gives Eco Maori a sore face.

    Its cool to see you supporting Wahine in hard times the Wahine in the jails need all the help they can get Annah Strettons journey behind bars is the organization Anna has a new book The Raw TRUTH please buy her book and you will be helping these vaunrable Wahine.

    Petra I back you in your opinion we need more Maori in management in Oranga tamariki even tho there was a court order for the up lifting of the pepe the glasses that the people who applied and signed the order would not understand the circumstances of the mother and the whanau reo people from a different worlds should not be making choices for the lower class common people you need people who love and understand te tangata to make a fair CALL. I can see we're Ryan is coming from some pepe need to be uplifted for their health and safety. My be a Kau matua needs to sign the papers a well to make the order fairer and un biased.

    Ka kite ano

  26. Eco maori 26
    13 June 2019 at 2:00 pm

    Eco Maori hopes that they find a cure for the illness of Aotearoa beautiful flightless Parrots the kakapo. I hope doc gets all the resources that they need to fix this problem.

    World’s fattest parrot, the endangered kākāpō, could be wiped out by fungal infection

    Seven of the birds native to New Zealand have died, with just 142 adults remaining

    The world’s fattest parrot is facing an existential threat in the form of a dangerous fungal infection which has already endangered a fifth of its species.

    Seven of New Zealand’s native kākāpō have died in recent months after falling victim to the respiratory disease aspergillosis. The latest was on Tuesday, where a 100-day-old chick died at the Auckland Zoo

    The nocturnal and flightless parrot ingratiated itself with world after it mated with a zoologist’s head during a BBC documentary. The incident led it to being described as the “party parrot” and finding a life-long fan in Stephen Fry.

    Kākāpō, whose males can grow to 4.8 pounds (2.2kg), were once found in large numbers all over New Zealand. However, habitat destruction and pest invasion forced the bird to edge of extinction.

    Critically endangered kākāpō – the world's fattest parrot – has record breeding season

    The discovery of a previously unknown population of kākāpō in the 1970s led to a resurgence of their numbers. The parrot was then the focus of a conservation effort that saw the bird’s population rise from a low of 51 ageing birds to three times that number.

    This year, a team of more than 100 scientists, rangers and volunteers worked to make it the biggest breeding season on record.

    Despite that effort, Auckland Zoo’s head of veterinary services Dr James Chatterton said the future of the birds hangs in the balance ka kite ano link below.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jun/13/worlds-fattest-parrot-endangered-kakapo-fungal-infection-new-zealand

  27. Eco maori 27
    13 June 2019 at 4:27 pm

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

    https://youtu.be/PWoDSGfSu6o

  28. Eco maori 28
    13 June 2019 at 6:29 pm

    Kia ora Newshub.

    That's the way Paddy it's reporters like you who keep everyone honest

    That's cool more funding for cancer research that uses our bodies own defense systems to I'd and eliminate the cancer ka pai.

    There was a lot of mist around the motu Mike this morning.

    The defense forces needs reliable equipment so the 2 billion spend on the defense forces is long overdue shonky gave tax cuts muppet.

    It would be scary whirlpool dryers catching fire I glad we didn't buy that make.

    Malisa genetic gain in bovine animals is very important I quite liked the field days to heal of new equipment

    Ka kite ano

  29. Eco maori 29
    13 June 2019 at 6:51 pm

    Kia ora te ao Maori news.

    I Winston it is cool that the teachers strike has been called off and they have settled.

    The statue smith is just spraying wai into the tawhirimate if he was still in power there would have been no extra money for tangata whenua O Aotearoa they were dishing it out in tax cuts.

    Its good that there is a new kuakaupapa being built .

    I agree with Jacinda we need to comite to mitigating climate change or our Pacific cousins will lose out

    Awesome Mrs Mason for her transaction of a diary of Anne Frank's

    Ka kite ano.