I'd have thought it's just common sense for all teachers and school staff to be vaccinated. It shouldn't be a big deal, given some of the homes some of the kids come from, and the overcrowded classrooms these days.
I believe there are some good arguments against being vaccinated with the mRNA Pfizer jab ,but ONLY if one is young, very healthy, and is un-immunocompromised. And that would apply to very few people out there , some of who may well be young, fit, health "addict" teachers. If they are dead against this vaccination then I don't see why they should have to lose their job. Bear in mind a vaccinated person can pass covid on anyway. Just saying.
Sounds like you've done your own research, Garibaldi, and have identified groups that should avoid vaccination!
Weird how all the credible experts (Bloomfield, Baker etc in NZ) think getting everyone vaccinated down to infants (once approved) is the way to go, to give the best protection to everyone. The vaccines are incredibly safe, especially compared to the disease. Just Saying.
Perhaps the teaching profession could afford to lose a few teachers who don't believe in science or in protecting the wellbeing of kids and their families.
Alot of water is yet to go under the bridge before we find out everything about these covid vaccines. I have some nagging doubts about them but was happy to get the jab to avoid going to an overloaded hospital. Yes, I have done it for social and selfish reasons. I don't think the science and politics behind any of the big Pharma companies are squeaky clean. Time will tell.
I know a number of teachers who will have to make this call. Some (I don't agree with them) will lose their jobs over this. None of them like being lied to.
The first bit would be fair, if we weren't talking about getting a vaccine in the middle of a fucking pandemic. What about the risk your hypothetical employee is putting on everyone else? Their paycheque isn't worth someone else's life.
the second bit – we’re still discussing that elsewhere.
So will vaccinated teachers who are working in cramped and overcrowded classrooms have the right to know the vaccination status of all their students and families – and exclude the unvaccinated?
Desks were arranged like exam time. They had all been cleaned. There was plenty of hand sanitiser in every room. Teachers discussed the usual, coughing onto your elbow, thorough hand washing, social distancing.
At morning tea, the girls all hugged each other, and the boys were on the back field rolling around like labrador puppies.
Isn't anyone here worried about the human rights implications of these mandates? Whatever you believe about the vaccines the walking over of the bill of rights is terrifying. What comes next?
I think the focus is in the wrong place here. When this pandemic ends what rights will we as citizens be left with?
Its not just trampling rights, its pitting family member against family member, fear of losing employment etc, resentment that you dont really have a real choice anymore, resentment when a stranger thinks it ok to quiz you on your medical information, resentment that neighbors are encouraged to dob each other in over percieved violation… some people find these things extremely frightening.
When PM Ardern said the government would not apply penalties, and that those choosing not to be vaccinated were placing themselves at risk, the Delta outbreak was but a gleam under Collins’ eyebrow.
"No, and we haven't for any vaccination in New Zealand applied penalties in that way," Ardern told The AM Show, after being asked if there might be tax penalties or other sanctions for refusing a COVID-19 vaccine.
"But I would say for anyone who doesn't take up an effective and tested and safe vaccine when it's available, that will come at a risk to them."
“Adapt or die.” If the current outbreak gets out of control then our government may change tack on "tax penalties or other sanctions" – it’s simply commonsense to adapt to changing circumstances. But I'd be surprised and disappointed if they reneged on the committment to no forced vaccinations in NZ.
Has any NZer had a Covid-19 vaccine forced on them? NZ border workers had a choice; I would be surprised and disappointed if it’s any different for teachers / healthcare workers – the choice is theirs. Makes you think, eh?
Teachers and especially healthcare workers are in demand globally, so NZ may face some staff shortages as these mandates loom – choices and consequences, as always.
Devon Greyson, assistant professor of public health at the University of British Columbia, said officials are steering into uncharted waters with mass vaccine mandates, and it's not clear how workers will respond.
"A shortage of workers can mean people's health and well being. It's scary," Greyson said.
However, Greyson added, "we're in an ethical situation where it's also scary not to ensure that all health workers are vaccinated. So it's a bit of a Catch-22."
To tackle staff scarcity, at least one province is offering signing bonuses to nurses. Provinces including Quebec and British Columbia have made it mandatory for healthcare workers and nursing staff to be vaccinated to continue working in their respective fields.
"So if OSH prosecute employers who have unvaxxed staff, that's not a sanction?"
No it's not. Because they would only investigate if there was an 'incident' (such as an infection). And they would only prosecute if the employer had not taken all reasonable steps. Let the employers decide, and advertise their decision so the community can make informed choices.
Because they would only investigate if there was an 'incident' (such as an infection).
Well, OSH regards hazards / near misses as reportable instances as well, and does investigate them.
So, basically, if a work-place were required to have an up to date register of vax status, and someone wasn't up to snuff, then that person working onsite would be a safety violation and the employer could be charged – that's not a sanction on the staff member fired because they can't do their job safely.
But a school having a register of vax status and being required to only employ vaxed staff is somehow a sanction on the teacher who gets dismissed for not being vaxed.
"So, basically, if a work-place were required to have an up to date register of vax status, and someone wasn't up to snuff, then that person working onsite would be a safety violation and the employer could be charged – that's not a sanction on the staff member fired because they can't do their job safely."
They wouldn’t necessarily be a safety violation or risk. It would be up to the employer to take all reasonable steps to ensure any risk was managed, minimised, mitigated, just as they have been doing. So by all means, keep a register, but don't sack workers who aren't vaccinated. Particularly in a profession with critical staff shortages.
consider this. If we were all more honest in this debate, more people might get vaccinated.
Your sophistry here makes sense for people that have your beliefs, but those aren't the people who are hesitant about the vaccine.
Being real about the degree of pressure doesn't hurt us, it makes things better. Yes, we are mandating (forcing people to choose between their job and being vaxxed, for the good of others), because this is one of our few ways to avoid a really big disaster for NZ.
Dancing around that by pretending there's no coercion will just set off hesitant people's bullshit detectors at a time when many are already concerned about being lied to and losing control of something that's very important to them.
Mate, we keep hazard registers to identify hazards and demonstrate that we have isolated, minimised, or eliminated them.
The preferred resolution is eliminate. No more hazard.
In the case of staff who present a chronic safety hazard that cannot be isolated or minimised reasonably, that means firing them (after giving them reasonable instruction and support to stop being a hazard, which they reject).
Just like you would a truck driver who turns out to be an alcoholic. They can't safely perform their role.
why would anyone keep a meaningless register? "Oh, this is the guy who spread all that disease. We have their name in a register, it's ok".
"The preferred resolution is eliminate. No more hazard."
But that isn't always possible, which is why we manage those hazards.
"In the case of staff who present a chronic safety hazard that cannot be isolated or minimised reasonably, that means firing them (after giving them reasonable instruction and support to stop being a hazard, which they reject)."
But this can be minimised reasonably. We could introduce regular testing (saliva/rapid antigen). Unvaccinated teachers could wear masks. There are alternatives to losing scarce teaching reseource.
Dancing around that by pretending there's no coercion will just set off hesitant people's bullshit detectors at a time when many are already concerned about being lied to and losing control of something that's very important to them.
Oh, so that's what sets off their bullshit detectors, huh.
Not the idea that Ardern was responding to the claim of literal forced vaccinations – full Billy TK shit – and now that is being conflated with "you can't sit in a room with thirty kids if you're going to give them an infectious disease, find something else to do with your stupidity".
But this can be minimised reasonably. We could introduce regular testing (saliva/rapid antigen). Unvaccinated teachers could wear masks. There are alternatives to losing scarce teaching reseource.
Testing catches it after the fact, and an employer could require full BL4 outfites and still be a fool to trust an antivaxxer to use them diligently. Only sure way is to get rid of them.
Oh, so that's what sets off their bullshit detectors, huh.
Not the idea that Ardern was responding to the claim of literal forced vaccinations – full Billy TK shit – and now that is being conflated with "you can't sit in a room with thirty kids if you're going to give them an infectious disease, find something else to do with your stupidity".
lol, how many vaccine hesitant people do you actually know? They're not some amorphous BTK loving mass. Some of them are easily as intelligent as you. And they don't like being lied to.
Do you believe that Ardern would never sanction forced vaccinations? Pretty sure I've seen you argue for them pre-covid, as in maybe they're not such a bad idea. Pretty sure that Andre is in favour. You think vax hesitant people trust the left or Ardern on this? You think people who don't trust the government and feel politically homeless and disenfranchised are going to do what you want?
It doesn't matter how righteous you are in your own mind (and you may well be completely right). People are human, and there are things that work and things that don't. I'm suggesting trying honesty.
And yes, I saw the video on twitter, and I don't think Ardern was only talking about strap em down and force 'em, she was also at times talking about mandating vaccines via coercion.
in order to find some common ground here, I'll withdraw the idea that Ardern lied. She was pragmatic at the time, and genuine, but it's also true that she would have know that a time might come when coercion was necessary.
So let's call it a white lie, or just good PR and political nous. The problem is that some people feel lied to, and while you might thing their feelings are irrelevant, we know that many humans will respond better when they get to feel good or met half way or that people are considering their wellbeing. None of that us unreacheable to us now.
In Gypsy's clip, the question was about tax penalties, and Ardern was saying we don't need to do that because historically we get up to around 90%. That was pre-delta.
We might one day get to the level with a disease where literally everyone needs the jab to stop millions dying. In that case, fuck personal choices. We are not going to replay the black death just because some jerk wants to dick about and google their own research. In the 14th century Europe literally didn't know what hit it, today we can diagnose it, sequence it, kill it, and stick its photo on our wall.
The problem is that some people feel lied to, and while you might thing their feelings are irrelevant, we know that many humans will respond better when they get to feel good or met half way or that people are considering their wellbeing. None of that us unreacheable to us now.
The response is binary. They either get vaccinated, or they don't.
haven't seen Gypsy's clip, I'll see if can find the twitter one.
The issue I'm arguing isn't about personal choice, it's about not throwing the human rights baby out with the bathwater, or using authoritarian approaches that make the situation worse.
The response is binary. They either get vaccinated, or they don't.
Ok, I'll take that as you being ok with either authoritarianism, or risking authoritarianism. By which I don't mean personal choice (that's something in your head), I mean that if society wants to keep treating people like shit (the feelings bit, not the vax/unvaxxed bit), then it can take it's chances, but we know how this went in the US and it's unlikely they will get out of that mess in the forseeable future.
''In Gypsy's clip, the question was about tax penalties, and Ardern was saying we don't need to do that because historically we get up to around 90%."
You haven't read the article. The PM's comments were in response to conspiracy theorists claims that people will be forced to get the vaccination. The article goes on to say this:
“But I would say for anyone who doesn’t take up an effective and tested and safe vaccine when it’s available, that will come at a risk to them.” – PM Ardern (22 Sept 2021)
I certainly don't believe they should lose their livelihoods.
Nor I, and happily there's no need. During a global pandemic it may become acceptable to review (on an on-going basis) the personal and societal merits of safe, effective vaccines.
If, after review, 'jab avoidance' still feels like the right choice, then there are many countries crying out for NZ teachers and healthcare workers. Tragically, in some of those countries the current average daily Covid death toll remains north of 100, so please at least consider getting the appropriate jabs before relocating.
We don't know how lucky we are to live in this country.
Ok, I'll take that as you being ok with either authoritarianism, or risking authoritarianism. By which I don't mean personal choice (that's something in your head), I mean that if society wants to keep treating people like shit (the feelings bit, not the vax/unvaxxed bit), then it can take it's chances, but we know how this went in the US and it's unlikely they will get out of that mess in the forseeable future.
It was a simple statement of fact. Individuals either get the damned jab, or don't.
We get up to a level where ICUs aren't overloaded and deaths are rare, or we get fucked and thousands die.
If you want to hold their hand and take them down to big pharma to buy the prophylactic of their choice, and try and explain to them why the horse tablets are an imbecilic option, go ahead.
We don't have time, and we don't have the resources.
Like the PM was, I'm still reasonably confident that we won't need authoritarian measures to get to a level of community protection. But making sure that key network nodes who have many "edges" (close contacts, like teachers with students, colleagues and parents) have protection isn't just about population immunity, it's about stopping that particular person almost single-handedly causing a near-uncontrollable outbreak.
Population immunity is a stochastic concept: we don't know which person will protect which other person. But teachers getting vaccinated? We know exactly who that is to protect.
It's an easy choice, imho. I wish all teachers and healthcare workers who chose to make the tough decision to remain vaccine-free well – we can't, alas, wish those who have tragically died from Covid well.
Maybe the excellent Covid health outcomes achieved so far by our government and the team have caused some to lose sight of the millions of lives already lost to the pandemic. It appears to be the view of our government that it can’t effectively enforce the public health measures needed to eliminate or possibly even control this Delta outbreak, so they are enacting other logical and enforcible measures to keep everyone as safe as possible. They can’t please everyone.
If I needed to see a healthcare professional right now and had a choice (all other things being equal) between an unvaccinated and a vaccinated worker, I know which one I'd choose. Keep choice alive!
I made what I consider an informed choice and am fully vaccinated. I respect those who made an informed choice and chose not to. I certainly don't believe they should lose their livelihoods.
When PM Ardern said the government would not apply penalties, and that those choosing not to be vaccinated were placing themselves at risk, the Delta outbreak was but a gleam under Collins’ eyebrow.
Yeah, but I could see back then that if the virus got worse, or we got a more deadly pandemic, that mandating would happen. Ardern could have been honest. It's not like they didn't know about the possibility. She chose the line she chose, because she's a good public communicator and it made sense at the time, but it wasn't her only option.
"Dancing around that by pretending there's no coercion will just set off hesitant people's bullshit detectors at a time when many are already concerned about being lied to and losing control of something that's very important to them."
Exactly. The PM has clearly either lied to or mislead teachers and front line customs workers. Anti-vaxxers are lying to people. But this mandating everything in sight is raising hackles and it is just so totally counter-productive.
Just said to McFlock that I'd stop calling it lying, in the interests of common ground. Ardern was being politically pragmatic. The problem is people feel like she lied. This is why I think honesty rather than ostracisation and sophistry would be a better move right now. We really need to be calling people in.
one of the options with mandating is to mandate and help people find other jobs if they don't want to vax. Isn't that what Labour is all about?
"one of the options with mandating is to mandate and help people find other jobs if they don't want to vax."
Honestly, I'm not comfortable with that either. The ECE sector is desperately short of teachers. And if Covid is in the community, children are just as likely to catch it on play dates etc as from a teacher, particularly if sound precautions are taken.
if a child spends one hour with an infected play mate, and one hour with an infected teacher, their risk is increased than if they spent one hour with only one of them. Even if we don’t think the child is at risk, the health system still is and in turn other people.
As for shortages, I believe that covid is the starting point of rolling crises over the next hundred years. Climate and ecology crisis are lapping around our feet. We have to learn to adapt, and the idea that societal institutions and services will remain unchanged is dangerous. Not that I expect Labour to be planning around this (yet), but I do think people need to be thinking about changes, including ones induced by shortages, and figure out how to make things better within the limitations.
"if a child spends one hour with an infected play mate, and one hour with an infected teacher, their risk is increased than if they spent one hour with only one of them. Even if we don’t think the child is at risk, the health system still is and in turn other people."
I get all of that, but those 'if's' don't take into account other measures.
The ECE centre where I spend most of my time had a positive case recently. A child. I was a close contact, as were at least 30 other children and their parents (we had had a farewell event for one of the staff). Even though that was very early in the Delta outbreak, the centre was already exercising good practices, and despite none of the teachers being vaccinated at that stage no-one else caught covid from that child. The greatest risk to children is likely to come from parents and other contacts.
I don't really get this. Surely the point is to eleminate as many risks, not just the greatest. If risks are 50%, 10%, 5%, 15%, 30%, don't we want to do the smaller risks as well as the biggest?
Just BTW – I have just been sent a clip that is circulating on social media. The clip is of both the PM, Chris Hipkins and Ashley Bloomfield stating categorically that vaccinations will not be made compulsory. The PM is specifically asked about the 'no-jab no-job' policy in Australia, and she specifically replies that her government are not looking at that, that she she believes in vaccination, but "not mandatory". There is also a picture of a Covid-19 promotional ad that reads "you cannot be forced to get vaccinated'. It really isn't a good look.
Yep, it is a bad look, this one will come back to bite them. From memory, the wording was different at different times. But I understood at the time the situation could change. Didn't think it would be this soon mind.
"Surely the point is to eleminate as many risks, not just the greatest."
Of course, but there are balances. For example a business doesn't fire people because there is a chance of an accident. They manage, minimise and mitigate. In the tame way The jab doesn't eliminate all risk of catching covid; it is a mitigation, a way of minimising (not eliminating) risk.
When some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well. Should they be in the job?
“Never have I seen
Never have I seen so many teachers leading by example and protecting the children in their classes from long covid and possibly even death whilst a small minority are so selfish about their freedom to infect the kids. They should never have been teachers in the first place.
Never had I seen so many health workers protect patients, themselves and their colleagues from infection while working like heroes on the front lines while illiterate morons protest their freedom and make the life of health workers more dangerous and stressful”.
Research on belief in conspiracy theories might help understand why "some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well."
Recent work from Australia (my bold) –
"Results of the current study indicate that individuals who have odd beliefs/magical thinking, and who are strategic, manipulative, dominant, and callous are more likely to believe in conspiracy theories. Given the possibility for these beliefs to shape real world behaviour, and the possibility for this behaviour to have damaging social and civic consequences, it is imperative research continues to establish predictors of these beliefs so reliable methods to challenge and negate these erroneous beliefs can be established."
When some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well. Should they be in the job?
There's a real problem in this line. You believe it is harmless, other people don't. Your argument is predicated on people accepting your beliefs and abandoning their own. How do you think that's going to work out, especially under financial and career duress?
Instead, we could be saying that the risk from the vaccine is low and the risk is worth taking because covid the illness in individuals and society has much worse outcomes and is much more likely to happen.
I don't "believe it is harmless". I know for a fact, vaccines are almost harmless, supported by a huge amount of evidence.
Opinions/beliefs and facts, are two different things.
That vaccination is almost 100% safe, is a fact. Determined by the results of trials and research involving millions of people.
Nothing is 100% safe, of course.
Covid, of course, is several orders of magnitude more harmful.
“instead, we could be saying that the risk from the vaccine is low and the risk is worth taking because covid the illness in individuals and society has much worse outcomes and is much more likely to happen”
That is a fair point. But lets face it Brazil handled it shittely.
I think the govt did it right now at the time. But have to say personally I thought at the time it would have been easier and cheaper to the whole country if we went for shielding the vulnerable rather than restricting them and everyone else (Which is the vast majority(.
All in all reckon at the beginning they did really well. But geezes there is no reason for the Sth Island to be at level 2 now with a properly controlled and the cook strait.
And the vagueness of stuff is silly.
Give me Arden 2020. Because the 2021 one is a bit scattery
Well, down here another person was in the paper today claiming they didn't break the rules by travelling to SI from Auckland. And a chap got tested after his Northland trip.
There are more than a million people in L3, and another couple mill in L2 in the North Island. Even essential travel is likely to spread some cases down here while daily rates are this high.
I'm involved with a local theatre in Dunedin, and operationally we're fucked badly even under L2. Sustained negative cashflow is a worrying thing, for sure.
But waiting until we have detected cases before limiting the ability of those cases to spread is like waiting until you have covid before getting the jab, or waiting until you're about to be in an accident before putting your seatbelt on. There's a good chance you'll be too late to get the effect.
The sooner we stop this crazy "vaccinate to protect others" nonsense, rather than "vaccinate for your own health" the better imo.
Yes, vaccinating mostly healthy adults in order to protect the part of the population with the best immunity and who will be least affected, is as stupid as it sounds.
"When some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well. Should they be in the job?"
Yes, this is where I think the debate should be. I'd like to hear the views of the people who are avoiding vaccinations on this point. We hear their views on anything but this, and I doubt we'll get anywhere until we do know what they think about the rights of the kid with asthma, or the one with the mum who is sick, or the one whose dad is worn out from his work in the hospital looking after covid patients.
Fran, think back over our history and look at the special powers that governments have had in the past, especially in war time, and never got used then or since. There have always been emergency powers. There have always been courts. There have always been elections. WE have had epidemics, wars, depressions, emergencies in the past.
You ask the question- what rights will we as citizens be left with?
One only should suffice- universal suffrage.
We don't like what has happened, we vote them out. The laws get changed, the regulations revoked,
There is one interesting question for me, though. What changes, what attitudinal shift, what social mores will alter after the pandemic?
How will it affect our group thinking, since we have all faced a common enemy and seen our interdependence on each other, rich or poor, whatever suburb we live in (David Seymour take note).
We may see that inequity threarens us all and come to see that a fairer society is a safer society as well.
Surely yr enthusiasm for just needing a vote is a little naive or misguided.
Lobbyists acting for interests with deep pockets shoots that 'one person one vote' to smithereens.
I didn't vote for compulsory medication last election.
As to the future relationships I would love to buy your narrative but I don't see it. My son's 19 yr old girlfriend works in retail. The middle class are not shy of demanding to know her vaccination status half a dozen times a day.
Hopefully she is wearing a mask and that her employer has plans in place to encourage the uptake of the vaccination. I think, as a bare minimum, public facing people in shops etc should be vaccinated but if not at least wear masks.
I believe that there is a selling point of having a completely vaxxed staff, if allowed under HR legislation. Retail needs us and many will go to those places that are mask wearing and/or vaxxed.
I didn't vote for compulsory medication last election.
Neither did I. I also did not know that we were going to have the different /difficult to deal with Delta variant.
I also don't buy the middle class stuff. We should not allow the uptake of the vaccination and the positivity of wearing a mask to be side tracked by this.
I would go a little further than universal suffrage. Universal suffrage with MMP as a voting system as the minimum, although recognising that our first govt could bring in Human Rights legislation after an election.
gsays, one question. If as you say, "Lobbyists acting for interests with deep pockets shoots that 'one person one vote' to smithereens," why did you vote?
Sounds like an exercise in futility to this 'naive and misguided' person……..
I go a little further. I vote, I criticize, I joined a party 50 years ago to create policy, I even stood for parliament twice. Now that might be seen as 'naive and misguided'. As Voltaire once pronounced, on another activity it must be added, "Once is philosophy, but twice is perversion."
For all those people who complain that the government has got no real power, and for all those people who say that the government has got too much power- well, at least one side has got it wrong.
If there is no real power in government, then why does the Right contest so hard. Surely they'd just leave it all to their "deep pockets"?
Clearly there is power in government, witness mandated vaccines.
There also has to be power in lobbyists and vested interests. Fishing boats and their disgraceful practices. There has been opposition to cameras on boats for years and it hasn't come from the electorate.
Sincerely, well done on standing for parliament, more courage of yr convictions than I. I stood unsuccessfully for BOT of our local school. Too much of a fragile ego to do that again.
Nandor Tanzcos (I think) observed he was more influential out of parliament than in it.
Thanks, gsays. My friends said I was better off out of it. But the experience of standing was mostly satisfying- even the nutters were entertaining. But even then, before the decade of dirty politics, there were serious lies of a personal nature. One of the nicer ones was that I had two drug convictions…… (Two sounds far more convincing than one!)
mac 1 there were terrible lies put out by a group. Some ended up in court. Sadly those who do this at arms length but overlooked revealing photos of them with these people became known. Cheers, we definitely need those who stand for public service regardless of the pitfalls.
I think the focus is in the wrong place here. When this pandemic ends what rights will we as citizens be left with?
FFS. What's with all this crazy hysterical nonsense?
When the pandemic ends all our normal rights will be resumed. If you think otherwise, you're living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. As it stands the lives of people are at serious risk – including your life Fran – and that must take precedence over all else.
If you and others can't see that then I suggest you go see a head-shrink.
NZ was this close to removing privacy rights from a whole class of people before the last election. It boggles my mind that lefties haven't seen the erosion of rights in the last 40 years. They're being chipped away at. The issue here isn't whether the laws now are needed (they are), it's the cultural shifts happening that will mean more laws like this will be passed more easily as we go along. We've seen this since 9/11 in particular.
A specific example here: the covid app data won't be used for non-covid things. This is policy, the protection isn't written into law. You might trust Labour on this, I sure as hell don't trust NACT (being part of the class they were trying to remove rights from). Why won't Labour put the protection in law?
It often does, though. EG Britain during WW2 vs 1955, and the restrictions around the aforementioned Spanish Flu.
The funny thing is the debates about masks and lockdowns are almost identical between the latter and now, and they didn't have vaccines or testing or ventilators.
FB took away privacy rights, so the left can give away even more, this time to the state? Are you really arguing that? Do you know what National were doing before the 2017 election?
C'mon ref, where have you been the last year?. There has been lots of name calling and slurs that have gone uncommented upon. Not against your team perhaps?
I am really surprised how much this has shaken me, so may have to be forgiven the occasional outburst.
Imagine though, instead of being the leader in front of a class of kids they can spend their time at home.
They can then be an oracle to the whole world on online forums. Ironically, that would automatically put them in the position of being an expert at education and schooling.
My 2 cents : I'm getting tired of all the anti vax rubbish and being locked down too. I have been and am under treatment of a world leading and renowned Professer of Medicine. Ive trialed experimental drugs for him and now enjoy the cure; along with millions of others, his work bought about. Hes not tied to big Pharma, in the early days he sent me along to a herbalist to help with the effects of my disease. He recommends the vaccine and I'll take his advice before any body elses reckons. Get vaccinated.
As an aside for anyone putting it off because of fear of needles just think of how many more jabs you'll be getting if you get the virus.
This whole situation is about trust. Well done Bruce, many happy returns of the years.
We have a caring Government and this latest meme of 'loss of rights" is silly.
In this situation planning is ongoing and must to try to overcome huge difficulties. In these circumstances vaccine is required. If the member chooses against it ok. No-one will force them.
I have a background in patient rights and alternative health communities. There are many people who have been harmed by mainstream medicine. The issue here isn't that msm is safe (there are always risks with medications and vaccines), it's how to help people make good risk assessments. Telling people to ignore their own experience and knowledge base and follow yours is just not going to work.
Hi Weka, I apologise if my plea to get vaccinated came across as a bit bossy. I must admit I was annoyed when i posted having just read a plea to do the opposite based on mere reckons. I had hoped by sharing my experience from a reputable source may help others make good risk assessments.
Many many many more people have been helped by mainstream medicine. As Elvis Costello says 'Accidents will Happen.' As long as the aim is true
I would be interested in the results of anyone who has tried muscle testing (reflexology) the vaccine. And I feel healing energy, prana, orgone or similar is of little use when the tiger ( virus ) is chewing of your arm.
So for me the vaccine provides a solution but for it to work everyone must be on board and I feel sharing my experience can help with that.
It does seem that people who have a lot of faith in msm are helped by that belief. I suspect there is some strong placebo in addition to the RCT style processes around drugs and other treatments. This isn't me dissing msm, I think that's all a good thing. I'm glad for you that it's worked really well for you, I know msm kept my father alive for many more years than he would have otherwise.
Thing is though, the people who are harmed, are a crossover with those who are vax hesitant. They know the short comings of msms, and telling them the vaccine is harmless or that we should just trust the scientists and doctors doesn't work for similar reasons as to why muscle testing or chi kung wouldn't work for you. You have to meet people where they are. Many people at the moment seem to believe that forcing their beliefs on others will yield good results, but when has that every worked out well?
I agree that we need as many people on board with the vaccine as possible if we want to prevent disaster in NZ. The argument is about how we do that, get as many people on board as possible. Ostracisation, meanness, ridicule, force, sophistry and fudging the truth are not the best approaches if we want a high vax rate.
btw, afaik muscle testing has no empirical support (but it's maybe still a useful tool in some individual settings). Energy work like chi kung I think would be an excellent adjunct to getting vaccinated, and might help some of the hesitant people get on board. Would love to know if China and other Asian countries are integrating those methods. I know the Chinese have been doing work on TCM and herbal medicine alongside msm in treating covid infections.
Good that they have now located the second woman that travelled up North. And it sounds like she has Covid symptoms. It's interesting that neither have been named like the Wanaka couple, as she may have been located sooner if public knew who it was.
I hope they are charged in some way as they have caused so much damage to Northland.
I’m guessing they will be charged with something, but that name suppression will be granted, possibly permanently, by da judge, in view of the vitriol (and possibly other things) both individuals would likely have hurled at them if their identities were revealed.
And the hype around them was ridiculous and totally out of proportion, given no one seems to give a toss about some of the other antics people are getting up to.
I agree though, that antics like Collins running around Queenstown unmasked, when she was from Auckland, for no good reason, should have caused more attention.
Siouxsie Wiles? How she spells Suzy might be stupid, but her hair isn’t. Done more to boost her public image than anything else, imo. And she didn’t break the rules, her friend did, IIRC?
Raining quite heavily; looks like it’ll be a pluvial day. Stream’s up a foot or two and flooding dirty brown. No eel feeding today.
I very rarely needed to mow my lawns when the pooks visited my back yard several times a day. They liked trimming & eating the grass.
Altho the younger ones, once they learned how to fly up onto the fence & down again onto my lawn, invariably had to be shrieked at quite a few times "No! No pulling out grass! Just trimming". It often took up to a fortnight of daily doing my block at newbies to get them to learn that "shearing" the grass was ok, but pulling out clumps of it was definitely NOT!
Do you have any fruit trees on your lawn? And if you have, do you get any of it? I got very over pukekos when living next to them. We had a flock of around 100 living in the paddocks around our house. We get more fruit from the 5 fruit trees we have now where we live than from the 30 trees we had on the farm.
I’m fortunate that that apart from their visits to my back yard they basically live in the stream & on the stream banks, & spend most of their day foraging up & down the stream. There’s plenty of kai, & lotsa variety, for them there.
All they were getting at my place was “treats” of wheat grains, & Molenberg bread chunks (so I could enjoy watching them eat bread holding it in their “hands” – i.e. with their long, very dextrous talons).
Oh dear. You have been reading one of Geoffrey Palmer's books haven't you? He was, of course, the man who described his homeland as "New Zealand is an irreducably pluvial country.".
Now you are using that word, just to show how literate you are I suspect.
I suspect Gezza has come across that word just as I did. As children we learned the word pluvial very early on as events that my Dad organised, A & P shows and Racing days had to have pluvial insurance. We always lost the low table in our bedroom at the time of the A & P show as judges used it to stand the dogs on for judging.
And of course Geoffrey Palmer's use is a delight.
Those who seem to delight in putting others down or damning with faint praise, as far as language is concerned always remind me of the quote from Issac Asimov
“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”
I wasn't meaning to disparage Gezza. However, reading the last sentence I wrote I can see how it can come across that way. To Gezza – I apologise.
I have a rather similar memory about A & P shows. I had an Uncle who used to come and judge livestock at the local show. He would come and stay with my family and I would lose my bed for a couple of nights. Not quite the same as having your table take pride of place during the judging of course.
That was a long time ago of course. Now the farmers don't go any more and the Show is really just for the townies.
Yes indeed with the visitors. We always had to give our visitors our bed/s or topped and tailed.
A couple of years ago I dropped my cousin aged 72 at the time, at her daughters place to stay overnight. I was amazed when I picked her up the next day, to find that her daughter had put her mother on a mattress on the floor so she did not have to move any of the three children 9,8 5 from their beds. I was gob-smacked.
A & P shows still do have an attraction for rural folk in the smaller places. I agree that those within striking distance of a city or larger town the 'townies' do go.
Didn't the Propeller-Head say something similar as PM when 'comforting' flood victims c1990 … something like: "But what none of you seem to understand is that New Zealand is, by its very nature, a highly pluvial Country" … in the process highlighting just how conspicuously he lacked the common touch ?
[Note: maybe it was as Deputy PM during Cyclone Bola 1988 ?]
Excitedly playing his trumpet as he pranced around the outer ring of the top floor of the Beehive in a very early Ep of Holmes, euphorically anticipating the arrival of his hero, clarinettist Acker Bilk, didn’t help his populist image any either … I remember just shaking my head as I watched … worth 50k votes to Bolger-Richardson.
One of the advantages of my 34 years in the Public Service was that I was able to move around a lot, filling a number of roles, nearly all of which involved a great deal of writing, but in various different styles, from very formal English, to quasi-legal writing, to semi-technical IT user requirements, to policy manuals, to very plain, easily understandable English in forms & leaflets where the onus was on simplicity & accuracy.
Even today I find it relatively easy to adapt my writing & speaking styles to suit a particular audience or individual, if I can be bothered to put a bit of effort in. But I can also be damned lazy about it when I’m not being paid.
Regarding MIQ and the selfish few who wish to jump the queue, I should think everyone would have a story to say why they should get back.
I don't think the lottery model is good however, perhaps it should be more like going for a blood test, get a number and wait till you become head of the queue
I'll probably be rolling my eyes at the vegan propaganda side of this, but otherwise it looks exciting, feature length doco on the NZ dairy industry, with some heavy hitting names backing it. Not sure when it's being released.
It's been released. Didn't notice vegan propaganda. It's about the dairy industry as it says. I saw it as a 5 or so part series. Cant remember who ran it tho. Maybe Prime
My Latin teacher was nicknamed Cabbage. He was an arrogant, sarcastic bastard & we loathed each other. I dropped Latin for 6th Form History as soon as I could.
He also taught us the English word perambulate … to walk or travel through or round a place or area, especially for pleasure and in a leisurely way.
From the Latin per … all over, & ambulare … to walk.
That puts to my mind a story a cop told me once, about a witness in a trial. The witness had limited English skill, not so much that a translator was needed but still learning the second language. Anyway, the prosecution asks the witness to describe the incident, and the witness talks about how he was "proceeding down this street" and "proceeded to see" yadda yadda yadda.
The use of the word "proceeding" in a repeated manner raised a few eyebrows, so the defense almost immediately begins cross examination with the word, asking him about whether the witness normally uses it. Even the cop was beginning to second guess whether someone had coached the witness.
"My English language class is on Monday nights, and I use the new words as much as possible. We learnt 'proceeding' this week". lol
Ouch. If this follows Northern Hemisphere patterns, we may well be swept with Antarctic cool while the Antarctic warms. And a whole lot of muppets will say, "How can the planet possible be warming??"
Oh look we have a surplus again! Virtual surplus, based on the gains of government properties, but hey, surely the bank will loan on that equity right? Or maybe we already have buyers?
This reminds me of a day in 1997, when then Finance Minister Theo Waigel of Germany re-evaluated the Gold reserves held by hte German Government to qualify Germany for European economic and monetary union. Suddenly all the criteria was met, and well the rest is history. Lol
Treasury prefers it that way. Please keep focusing on the bottom line. Please also ignore the $10 billion (over 6 months) forecasting error. Additionally please don't understand that if the govt had spent an additional 10 billion in the last 6 months treasury already vetted the impacts of that on other economic variables as being fine. And for heavens sake do not realise that an eventual surplus of $N involves those $N being paid out of NZers savings and debt levels.
This may have been covered here before (there's a lot to read on all the Open Mikes!) but anyway, it's worth a repeat.
A quick and easy game (less than 5 mins) where you get to make all the Covid decisions in government (h/t Newshub). And then you have to deal with the consequences … Link here:
It's unduly pessimistic on the numbers IMO, but never mind. It's a useful reminder that every option, from full opening up to tanks on the streets, would have repercussions. A few commentators should try it and test their empty reckons.
Happy to report that as PM I got the R number right down and saved the country. Unfortunately this cost me my job …
Aside from “not being Judith” what has Labour achieved since coming to power?
Journey back with me to 2017- a bright eyed Jacinda made her first promise as leader of the Labour party to bring light rail from the CBD to the Airport by 2021. Now I just checked my calendar and we have 81 days left until 2021 comes to an end. Last time I checked 0.00 metres of track have been laid. The workers are going to have to pull out a few big shifts to accomplish this promise!
Diving deeper into the 2017 manifesto quickly over my morning cup of tea…
Nurses in all high schools … last time I checked (and I do have an OIA request in to get the official number) this wasn’t started?
Kiwibuild – remember the good old days of Kiwibuild? Promise of 1,000 homes built in the first year increasing to 5,000 built in 2019 and then the lofty goal of 10,000 per year from 2020. Grand total we should be at based on just these numbers- 26K by the end of this year. Last number report = 1,169 as at August 2021. The positive here is that they have ticked off the first years goal… over three years in…
Skypath (no not a new Bond movie…)- another great promise from 2017 where we were going to get a bike and pedestrian crossing for (what now seems like a bargain price) $30M. Fast forward to 2021 and we have no progress but have spent over $50M on another version of the crossing that has been put on the scrap heap! Clap. Clap.
Remember the great headline generating quote that tackling climate change was “my generation's nuclear-free moment." Plaudits flowed around the world. Then reality struck- this year we imported more coal for power generation than any year previous. It is purely a coincidence that Megan woods basically closed down the natural oil and gas industry in NZ overnight back in 2018.
Lucky we have a Government with a strong track record on prudent spending to see us through this massive amount of debt we’ve taken on to get the country through COVID though right? Right? They only spend money on quality projects such as funding a series of collaborative quilts for Jess Jonhson and her Mother… sure it is only $17,850 right? Noting that someone on $80K per year would pay $17K in income tax so basically paid tax the entire year for Jess to make some quilts with her Mum… very nice.
So – the end of my rant… National is a shambles, we get that. But is this really what you want to support? Aside from slogans about kindness and team of five million… what has Jacinda and Labour achieved? What will their legacy be? And when Jacinda moves on… who is actually there to take up the leadership?
The two main parties in NZ politics have shown us they can achieve… nothing. What can the alternative be?
Sounds like you've bought into talking points from the taxpayers' onion.
Labour have fallen short in various areas, but if you want a serious debate you'll need better lines than somehow linking NZ's low debt with Jess Johnson.
Cancelled National Parties tax bracket moves and increased Working for Families and Accommodation Supplements substantially
Added a new tax bracket for the very high income earners
Bright line test extended
Property losses ringfenced
Property interest deduction reduced
Overseas investment in property mostly banned
Increased benefit rates by the most seen in a generation (still work to do of course)
Indexed benefits to average wage increases rather than CPI
Introduced Winter Energy Payment
Free lunches in schools
Increased Student Allowances
Fees free scheme (1st year at tertiary institutes, free apprenticeships)
Restored adult night class funding
Kainga Ora building more than 2,000 houses/year
Improved tenancy legislation by eliminating no-fault terminations by landlords
Credit contract reform
Increased minimum wage to $20
Extended paid parental leave to 26 weeks (from 18)
Increased sick leave to 10 days p.a.
Matariki
Improved Employment Relations Act – union delegates now specifically protected, collective agreements must include pay, 90 day trial removed for medium and large employers, breaks reinstated
Pay equity legislation and settlements e.g. social workers, admin workers, teacher aides, nurses and ECE teachers coming, others in the pipelines
Feebates for electric cars
Reduction in prisoner numbers by over 15%
Restored voting rights for prisoners with less than 3 year sentences (I think that's a net positive, but acknowledge that others will disagree)
That's some off the top of my head, I'm sure there are others. Still, other than what must be close to the lowest Covid death rate in the world and a negative excess mortality rate, what they done for us lately?
Yes, but what’s happening with the crime rate? This info seems hard to come by.
My “impression” from reporting – and from personal experience of some youth offenders were intimidating shopkeepers & stealing from local dairies, and another group who smashed 5 local car windows trying to steal cars, including mine – is that it’s increasing.
Fair, although the comment points out that there are new family violence offences introduced in Dec 2018 (so by Labour) which has seen an increase in the recording of serious assaults (the new offences were strangulation and assault on a person in a family relationship).
True, Craig. Altho interestingly I found my from that link somehow to a more up to date Police "Snapshot" which picked up that I'm in Wellington & which shows crime stats for Welly are mostly showing increases:
For some people an 'all bets are off the table' while we deal with Covid approach to govt is what they are focussing on. Kudos for them will come based on that.
For many the idea of looking at a 2017 manifesto will seem a delightful 'those were the days exercise.' Possibly looking at the 2017 manifesto and what was achieved prior to Feb 2020 would be a fairer way of looking at it.
When reading the list from Craig Hall 14.2 I am heartened that other aspects are/have been dealt with and know that work will be ongoing in many govt depts, not linked to the covid response to investigate, and bring up policy matters to Govt. Ministers will still be focussing on ideas/policies in their portfolios.
Yesterday I received come lovely feedback following my Star Wars themed newsletter. A few people mentioned they’d enjoyed reading the personal part at the beginning.I often begin newsletters with some memories, or general thoughts, before commencing the main topic. This hopefully sets the mood and provides some context in which ...
April 30 was going to be the day we’d be calling Mum from London to wish her a happy birthday. Then it became the day we would be going to St. Paul's at Evensong to remember her. The aim of the cathedral builders was to find a way to make their ...
Rob MacCulloch writes – Can’t remember the last book by a Kiwi author you read? Think the NZ government should spend less on the arts in favor of helping the homeless? If so, as far as Newsroom is concerned, you probably deserve to be called a cultural ignoramus ...
Eric Crampton writes – Grudges are bad. Better to move on. But it can be fun to keep a couple of really trivial ones, so you’re not tempted to have other ones. For example, because of the rootkit fiasco of 2005, no Sony products in our household. ...
A new report warns an estimated third of the adult population have unmet need for health care.Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāHere’s the six key things I learned about Aotaroa’s political economy this week around housing, climate and poverty:Politics - Three opinion polls confirmed support for PM Christopher Luxon ...
Today is May the fourth. Which was just a regular day when my mother took me to see the newly released Star Wars at the Odeon in Rotorua. The queue was right around the corner. Some years later this day became known as Star Wars Day, the date being a ...
Buzz from the Beehive Much more media attention is being paid to something Winston Peters said about former Australian Foreign Minister Bob Carr than to a speech he delivered to the New Zealand China Council. One word is missing from the speech: AUKUS. But AUKUS loomed large in his considerations ...
Is the economy in another long stagnation? If so, why?This is about the time that the Treasury will be locking up its economic forecasts to be published in the 2024 Budget Economic and Fiscal Update (BEFU) on budget day, 30 May. I am not privy to what they will be ...
The annual list of who's been bribing our politicians is out, and journalists will no doubt be poring over it to find the juiciest and dirtiest bribes. The government's fast-track invite list is likely to be a particular focus, and we already know of one company on the list which ...
In the weeks after the October 7 Hamas attacks on Southern Israel I wrote about the possible 2nd, 3rd and even 4th order effects of the conflict. These included new fronts being opened in the West Bank (with Hamas), Golan … Continue reading → ...
Peter Dunne writes – It is one of the oldest truisms that there is never a good time for MPs to get a pay rise. This week’s announcement of pay raises of around 2.8% backdated to last October could hardly have come at a worse time, with the ...
David Farrar writes – Newshub reports: Newshub can reveal a fresh allegation of intimidation against Green MP Julie-Anne Genter. Genter is subject to a disciplinary process for aggressively waving a book in the face of National Minister Matt Doocey in the House – but it’s not the first time ...
The Treasury has published a paper today on the global productivity slowdown and how it is playing out in New Zealand: The productivity slowdown: implications for the Treasury’s forecasts and projections. The Treasury Paper examines recent trends in productivity and the potential drivers of the slowdown. Productivity for the whole economy ...
Winston Peters’ comments about former Australian foreign minister look set to be an ongoing headache for both him and Luxon. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The podcast above of the weekly ‘hoon’ webinar for subscribers features co-hosts and , along with regular guests on Gaza and ...
These puppet strings don't pull themselvesYou're thinking thoughts from someone elseHow much time do you think you have?Are you prepared for what comes next?The debating chamber can be a trying place for an opposition MP. What with the person in charge, the speaker, typically being an MP from the governing ...
The land around Lyme Regis, where Meryl Streep once stood, in a hood, on the Cobb, is falling into the sea.MerylThe land around Lyme Regis, around the Cobb that made it rich, has always been falling slowly but surely into the sea. Read more ...
Buzz from the Beehive Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters was bound to win headlines when he set out his thinking about AUKUS in his speech to the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs. The headlines became bigger when – during an interview on RNZ’s Morning Report today – he criticised ...
The Post reports on how the government is refusing to release its advice on its corrupt Muldoonist fast-track law, instead using the "soon to be publicly available" refusal ground to hide it until after select committee submissions on the bill have closed. Fast-track Minister Chris Bishop's excuse? “It's not ...
As pressure on it grows, the livestock industry’s approach to the transition to Net Zero is increasingly being compared to that of fossil fuel interests. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / Getty ImagesTL;DR: Here’s the top five news items of note in climate news for Aotearoa-NZ this week, and a discussion above ...
The New Zealand Herald reports – Stats NZ has offered a voluntary redundancy scheme to all of its workers as a way to give staff some control over their “future” amidst widespread job losses in the public sector. In an update to staff this morning, seen by the Herald, Statistics New Zealand ...
On Werewolf/Scoop, I usually do two long form political columns a week. From now on, there will be an extra column each week about music and movies. But first, some late-breaking political events:The rise in unemployment numbers for the March quarter was bigger than expected – and especially sharp ...
David Farrar writes – The Herald reports: TVNZ says it is dealing with about 50 formal complaints over its coverage of the latest 1News-Verian political poll, with some viewers – as well as the Prime Minister and a former senior Labour MP – critical of the tone of the 6pm report. ...
Muriel Newman writes – When Meridian Energy was seeking resource consents for a West Coast hydro dam proposal in 2010, local Maori “strenuously” objected, claiming their mana was inextricably linked to ‘their’ river and could be damaged. After receiving a financial payment from the company, however, the Ngai Tahu ...
Alwyn Poole writes – “An SEP,’ he said, ‘is something that we can’t see, or don’t see, or our brain doesn’t let us see, because we think that it’s somebody else’s problem. That’s what SEP means. Somebody Else’s Problem. The brain just edits it out, it’s like a ...
Our trust in our political institutions is fast eroding, according to a Maxim Institute discussion paper, Shaky Foundations: Why our democracy needs trust. The paper – released today – raises concerns about declining trust in New Zealand’s political institutions and democratic processes, and the role that the overuse of Parliamentary urgency ...
This article was prepared for publication yesterday. More ministerial announcements have been posted on the government’s official website since it was written. We will report on these later today …. Buzz from the BeehiveThere we were, thinking the environment is in trouble, when along came Jones. Shane Jones. ...
New Zealand now has the fourth most depressed construction sector in the world behind China, Qatar and Hong Kong. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy at 8:46am on Thursday, May 2:The Lead: ...
Hi,I am just going to state something very obvious: American police are fucking crazy.That was a photo gracing the New York Times this morning, showing New York City police “entering Columbia University last night after receiving a request from the school.”Apparently in America, protesting the deaths of tens of thousands ...
Winston Peters’ much anticipated foreign policy speech last night was a work of two halves. Much of it was a standard “boilerplate” Foreign Ministry overview of the state of the world. There was some hardening up of rhetoric with talk of “benign” becoming “malign” and old truths giving way to ...
Graham Adams assesses the fallout of the Cass Review — The press release last Thursday from the UN Special Rapporteur on violence against women and girls didn’t make the mainstream news in New Zealand but it really should have. The startling title of Reem Alsalem’s statement — “Implementation of ‘Cass ...
This open-for-business, under-new-management cliché-pockmarked government of Christopher Luxon is not the thing of beauty he imagines it to be. It is not the powerful expression of the will of the people that he asserts it to be. It is not a soaring eagle, it is a malodorous vulture. This newest poll should make ...
The latest labour market statistics, showing a rise in unemployment. There are now 134,000 unemployed - 14,000 more than when the National government took office. Which is I guess what happens when the Reserve Bank causes a recession in an effort to Keep Wages Low. The previous government saw a ...
Three opinion polls have been released in the last two days, all showing that the new government is failing to hold their popular support. The usual honeymoon experienced during the first year of a first term government is entirely absent. The political mood is still gloomy and discontented, mainly due ...
National's Finance Minister once met a poor person.A scornful interview with National's finance guru who knows next to nothing about economics or people.There might have been something a bit familiar if that was the headline I’d gone with today. It would of course have been in tribute to the article ...
Rob MacCulloch writes – Throughout the pandemic, the new Vice-Chancellor-of-Otago-University-on-$629,000 per annum-Can-you-believe-it-and-Former-Finance-Minister Grant Robertson repeated the mantra over and over that he saved “lives and livelihoods”.As we update how this claim is faring over the course of time, the facts are increasingly speaking differently. NZ ...
Chris Trotter writes – IT’S A COMMONPLACE of political speeches, especially those delivered in acknowledgement of electoral victory: “We’ll govern for all New Zealanders.” On the face of it, the pledge is a strange one. Why would any political leader govern in ways that advantaged the huge ...
Bryce Edwards writes – The list of former National Party Ministers being given plum and important roles got longer this week with the appointment of former Deputy Prime Minister Paula Bennett as the chair of Pharmac. The Christopher Luxon-led Government has now made key appointments to Bill ...
TL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy at 10:06am on Wednesday, May 1:The Lead: Business confidence fell across the board in April, falling in some areas to levels last seen during the lockdowns because of a collapse in ...
Over the past 36 hours, Christopher Luxon has been dong his best to portray the centre-right’s plummeting poll numbers as a mark of virtue. Allegedly, the negative verdicts are the result of hard economic times, and of a government bravely set out on a perilous rescue mission from which not ...
Auckland Transport have started rolling out new HOP card readers around the network and over the next three months, all of them on buses, at train stations and ferry wharves will be replaced. The change itself is not that remarkable, with the new readers looking similar to what is already ...
Completed reads for April: The Difference Engine, by William Gibson and Bruce Sterling Carnival of Saints, by George Herman The Snow Spider, by Jenny Nimmo Emlyn’s Moon, by Jenny Nimmo The Chestnut Soldier, by Jenny Nimmo Death Comes As the End, by Agatha Christie Lord of the Flies, by ...
On February 14, 2023 we announced our Rebuttal Update Project. This included an ask for feedback about the added "At a glance" section in the updated basic rebuttal versions. This weekly blog post series highlights this new section of one of the updated basic rebuttal versions and serves as a ...
Have a story to share about St Paul’s, but today just picturesPopular novels written at this desk by a young man who managed to bootstrap himself out of father’s imprisonment and his own young life in a workhouse Read more ...
The list of former National Party Ministers being given plum and important roles got longer this week with the appointment of former Deputy Prime Minister Paula Bennett as the chair of Pharmac. The Christopher Luxon-led Government has now made key appointments to Bill English, Simon Bridges, Steven Joyce, Roger Sowry, ...
Newsroom has a story today about National's (fortunately failed) effort to disestablish the newly-created Inspector-General of Defence. The creation of this agency was the key recommendation of the Inquiry into Operation Burnham, and a vital means of restoring credibility and social licence to an agency which had been caught lying ...
Holding On To The Present:The moment a political movement arises that attacks the whole idea of social progress, and announces its intention to wind back the hands of History’s clock, then democracy, along with its unwritten rules, is in mortal danger.IT’S A COMMONPLACE of political speeches, especially those delivered in ...
Stuck In The Middle With You:As Christopher Luxon feels the hot breath of Act’s and NZ First’s extremists on the back of his neck and, as he reckons with the damage their policies are already inflicting upon a country he’s described as “fragile”, is there not some merit in reaching out ...
The unpopular coalition government is currently rushing to repeal section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act. The clause is Oranga Tamariki's Treaty clause, and was inserted after its systematic stealing of Māori children became a public scandal and resulted in physical resistance to further abductions. The clause created clear obligations ...
Buzz from the Beehive The government’s official website – which Point of Order monitors daily – not for the first time has nothing much to say today about political happenings that are grabbing media headlines. It makes no mention of the latest 1News-Verian poll, for example. This shows National down ...
It Takes A Train To Cry:Surely, there is nothing lonelier in all this world than the long wail of a distant steam locomotive on a cold Winter’s night.AS A CHILD, I would lie awake in my grandfather’s house and listen to the traffic. The big wooden house was only a ...
Packing A Punch: The election of the present government, including in its ranks politicians dedicated to reasserting the rights of the legislature in shaping and determining the future of Māori and Pakeha in New Zealand, should have alerted the judiciary – including its anomalous appendage, the Waitangi Tribunal – that its ...
Dead Woman Walking: New Zealand’s media industry had been moving steadily towards disaster for all the years Melissa Lee had been National’s media and communications policy spokesperson, and yet, when the crisis finally broke, on her watch, she had nothing intelligent to offer. Christopher Luxon is a patient man - but he’s not ...
Chris Trotter writes – New Zealand politics is remarkably easy-going: dangerously so, one might even say. With the notable exception of John Key’s flat ruling-out of the NZ First Party in 2008, all parties capable of clearing MMP’s five-percent threshold, or winning one or more electorate seats, tend ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Polling shows that Wellington Mayor Tory Whanau has the lowest approval rating of any mayor in the country. Siting at -12 per cent, the proportion of constituents who disapprove of her performance outweighs those who give her the thumbs up. This negative rating is ...
Luxon will no doubt put a brave face on it, but there is no escaping the pressure this latest poll will put on him and the government. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political ...
This is a re-post from The Climate Brink by Andrew Dessler In the wake of any unusual weather event, someone inevitably asks, “Did climate change cause this?” In the most literal sense, that answer is almost always no. Climate change is never the sole cause of hurricanes, heat waves, droughts, or ...
Something odd happened yesterday, and I’d love to know if there’s more to it. If there was something which preempted what happened, or if it was simply a throwaway line in response to a journalist.Yesterday David Seymour was asked at a press conference what the process would be if the ...
Hi,From time to time, I want to bring Webworm into the real world. We did it last year with the Jurassic Park event in New Zealand — which was a lot of fun!And so on Saturday May 11th, in Los Angeles, I am hosting a lil’ Webworm pop-up! I’ve been ...
Education Minister Erica Standford yesterday unveiled a fundamental reform of the way our school pupils are taught. She would not exactly say so, but she is all but dismantling the so-called “inquiry” “feel good” method of teaching, which has ruled in our classrooms since a major review of the New ...
Exactly where are we seriously going with this government and its policies? That is, apart from following what may as well be a Truss-Lite approach on the purported economic “plan“, and Victorian-era regression when it comes to social policy.Oh it’ll work this time of course, we’re basically assured, “the ...
Hey Uncle Dave, When the Poms joined the EEC, I wasn't one of those defeatists who said, Well, that’s it for the dairy job. And I was right, eh? The Chinese can’t get enough of our milk powder and eventually, the Poms came to their senses and backed up the ute ...
Polling shows that Wellington Mayor Tory Whanau has the lowest approval rating of any mayor in the country. Siting at -12 per cent, the proportion of constituents who disapprove of her performance outweighs those who give her the thumbs up. This negative rating is higher than for any other mayor ...
Buzz from the Beehive Pharmac has been given a financial transfusion and a new chair to oversee its spending in the pharmaceutical business. Associate Health Minister David Seymour described the funding for Pharmac as “its largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff”. ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Many criticisms are being made of the Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill, including by this writer. But as with everything in politics, every story has two sides, and both deserve attention. It’s important to understand what the Government is trying to achieve and its ...
TL;DR: Here’s my top 10 ‘pick ‘n’ mix of links to news, analysis and opinion articles as of 10:10am on Monday, April 29:Scoop: The children's ward at Rotorua Hospital will be missing a third of its beds as winter hits because Te Whatu Ora halted an upgrade partway through to ...
span class=”dropcap”>As hideous as David Seymour can be, it is worth keeping in mind occasionally that there are even worse political figures (and regimes) out there. Iran for instance, is about to execute the country’s leading hip hop musician Toomaj Salehi, for writing and performing raps that “corrupt” the nation’s ...
Yesterday marked 10 years since the first electric train carried passengers in Auckland so it’s a good time to look back at it and the impact it has had. A brief history The first proposals for rail electrification in Auckland came in the 1920’s alongside the plans for earlier ...
The Government is again adding to New Zealand’s growing unemployment, this time cutting jobs at the agencies responsible for urban development and growing much needed housing stock. ...
With Minister Karen Chhour indicating in the House today that she either doesn’t know or care about the frontline cuts she’s making to Oranga Tamariki, we risk seeing more and more of our children falling through the cracks. ...
The Labour Party is saddened to learn of the death of Sir Robert Martin, a globally renowned disability advocate who led the way for disability rights both in New Zealand and internationally. ...
Labour is calling for the Government to urgently rethink its coalition commitment to restart live animal exports, Labour animal welfare spokesperson Rachel Boyack said. ...
Today’s Financial Stability Report has once again highlighted that poverty and deep inequality are political choices - and this Government is choosing to make them worse. ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to do more for our households in most need as unemployment rises and the cost of living crisis endures. ...
Unemployment is on the rise and it’s only going to get worse under this Government, Labour finance spokesperson Barbara Edmonds said. Stats NZ figures show the unemployment rate grew to 4.3 percent in the March quarter from 4 percent in the December quarter. “This is the second rise in unemployment ...
The New Zealand Labour Party welcomes the entering into force of the European Union and New Zealand free trade agreement. This agreement opens the door for a huge increase in trade opportunities with a market of 450 million people who are high value discerning consumers of New Zealand goods and ...
The National-led Government continues its fiscal jiggery pokery with its Pharmac announcement today, Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall says. “The government has increased Pharmac funding but conceded it will only make minimal increases in access to medicine”, said Ayesha Verrall “This is far from the bold promises made to fund ...
This afternoon’s interim Waitangi Tribunal report must be taken seriously as it affects our most vulnerable children, Labour children’s spokesperson Willow-Jean Prime. ...
Te Pāti Māori are demanding the New Zealand Government support an international independent investigation into mass graves that have been uncovered at two hospitals on the Gaza strip, following weeks of assault by Israeli troops. Among the 392 bodies that have been recovered, are children and elderly civilians. Many of ...
Our two-tiered system for veterans’ support is out of step with our closest partners, and all parties in Parliament should work together to fix it, Labour veterans’ affairs spokesperson Greg O’Connor said. ...
Stripping two Ministers of their portfolios just six months into the job shows Christopher Luxon’s management style is lacking, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said. ...
Tonight’s court decision to overturn the summons of the Children’s Minister has enabled the Crown to continue making decisions about Māori without evidence, says Te Pāti Māori spokesperson for Children, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “The judicial system has this evening told the nation that this government can do whatever they want when ...
It appears Nicola Willis is about to pull the rug out from under the feet of local communities still dealing with the aftermath of last year’s severe weather, and local councils relying on funding to build back from these disasters. ...
The Government is making short-sighted changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) that will take away environmental protection in favour of short-term profits, Labour’s environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said today. ...
Labour welcomes the release of the report into the North Island weather events and looks forward to working with the Government to ensure that New Zealand is as prepared as it can be for the next natural disaster. ...
The Labour Party has called for the New Zealand Government to recognise Palestine, as a material step towards progressing the two-State solution needed to achieve a lasting peace in the region. ...
Some of our country’s most important work, stopping the sexual exploitation of children and violent extremism could go along with staff on the frontline at ports and airports. ...
The Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill will give projects such as new coal mines a ‘get out of jail free’ card to wreak havoc on the environment, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said today. ...
The government's decision to reintroduce Three Strikes is a destructive and ineffective piece of law-making that will only exacerbate an inherently biased and racist criminal justice system, said Te Pāti Māori Justice Spokesperson, Tākuta Ferris, today. During the time Three Strikes was in place in Aotearoa, Māori and Pasifika received ...
Cuts to frontline hospital staff are not only a broken election promise, it shows the reckless tax cuts have well and truly hit the frontline of the health system, says Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall. ...
The Green Party has joined the call for public submissions on the fast-track legislation to be extended after the Ombudsman forced the Government to release the list of organisations invited to apply just hours before submissions close. ...
New Zealand’s good work at reducing climate emissions for three years in a row will be undone by the National government’s lack of ambition and scrapping programmes that were making a difference, Labour Party climate spokesperson Megan Woods said today. ...
More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
Te Pāti Māori is disgusted at the confirmation that hundreds are set to lose their jobs at Oranga Tamariki, and the disestablishment of the Treaty Response Unit. “This act of absolute carelessness and out of touch decision making is committing tamariki to state abuse.” Said Te Pāti Māori Oranga Tamariki ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
The Government has delivered on its election promise to provide a financially sustainable model for Auckland under its Local Water Done Well plan. The plan, which has been unanimously endorsed by Auckland Council’s Governing Body, will see Aucklanders avoid the previously projected 25.8 per cent water rates increases while retaining ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters discussed the need for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza, and enhanced cooperation in the Pacific with German Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock during her first official visit to New Zealand today. "New Zealand and Germany enjoy shared interests and values, including the rule of law, democracy, respect for the international system ...
The Minister Responsible for RMA Reform, Chris Bishop today released his decision on four recommendations referred to him by the Western Bay of Plenty District Council, opening the door to housing growth in the area. The Council’s Plan Change 92 allows more homes to be built in existing and new ...
Thank you, John McKinnon and the New Zealand China Council for the invitation to speak to you today. Thank you too, all members of the China Council. Your effort has played an essential role in helping to build, shape, and grow a balanced and resilient relationship between our two ...
The Government is modernising insurance law to better protect Kiwis and provide security in the event of a disaster, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly announced today. “These reforms are long overdue. New Zealand’s insurance law is complicated and dated, some of which is more than 100 years old. ...
The coalition Government is refreshing its approach to supporting pay equity claims as time-limited funding for the Pay Equity Taskforce comes to an end, Public Service Minister Nicola Willis says. “Three years ago, the then-government introduced changes to the Equal Pay Act to support pay equity bargaining. The changes were ...
Structured literacy will change the way New Zealand children learn to read - improving achievement and setting students up for success, Education Minister Erica Stanford says. “Being able to read and write is a fundamental life skill that too many young people are missing out on. Recent data shows that ...
Trade Minister Todd McClay says Canada’s refusal to comply in full with a CPTPP trade dispute ruling in our favour over dairy trade is cynical and New Zealand has no intention of backing down. Mr McClay said he has asked for urgent legal advice in respect of our ‘next move’ ...
The rights of our children and young people will be enhanced by changes the coalition Government will make to strengthen oversight of the Oranga Tamariki system, including restoring a single Children’s Commissioner. “The Government is committed to delivering better public services that care for our most at-risk young people and ...
The Government is making it easier for minor changes to be made to a building consent so building a home is easier and more affordable, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “The coalition Government is focused on making it easier and cheaper to build homes so we can ...
New Zealand lost a true legend when internationally renowned disability advocate Sir Robert Martin (KNZM) passed away at his home in Whanganui last night, Disabilities Issues Minister Louise Upston says. “Our Government’s thoughts are with his wife Lynda, family and community, those he has worked with, the disability community in ...
Good evening – Before discussing the challenges and opportunities facing New Zealand’s foreign policy, we’d like to first acknowledge the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs. You have contributed to debates about New Zealand foreign policy over a long period of time, and we thank you for hosting us. ...
From today, passengers travelling internationally from Auckland Airport will be able to keep laptops and liquids in their carry-on bags for security screening thanks to new technology, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Creating a more efficient and seamless travel experience is important for holidaymakers and businesses, enabling faster movement through ...
People with an interest in the health of Northland’s marine ecosystems are invited to a public meeting to discuss how to deal with kina barrens, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones will lead the discussion, which will take place on Friday, 10 May, at Awanui Hotel in ...
Kiwi exporters are $100 million better off today with the NZ EU FTA entering into force says Trade Minister Todd McClay. “This is all part of our plan to grow the economy. New Zealand's prosperity depends on international trade, making up 60 per cent of the country’s total economic activity. ...
There are heartening signs that the extractive sector is once again becoming an attractive prospect for investors and a source of economic prosperity for New Zealand, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The beginnings of a resurgence in extractive industries are apparent in media reports of the sector in the past ...
The return of the historic Ō-Rākau battle site to the descendants of those who fought there moved one step closer today with the first reading of Te Pire mō Ō-Rākau, Te Pae o Maumahara / The Ō-Rākau Remembrance Bill. The Bill will entrust the 9.7-hectare battle site, five kilometres west ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has announced 25 new high-speed EV charging hubs along key routes between major urban centres and outlined the Government’s plan to supercharge New Zealand’s EV infrastructure. The hubs will each have several chargers and be capable of charging at least four – and up to 10 ...
The coalition Government will not proceed with the previous Government’s plans to regulate residential property managers, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “I have written to the Chairperson of the Social Services and Community Committee to inform him that the Government does not intend to support the Residential Property Managers Bill ...
The Government has announced an independent review into the disability support system funded by the Ministry of Disabled People – Whaikaha. Disability Issues Minister Louise Upston says the review will look at what can be done to strengthen the long-term sustainability of Disability Support Services to provide disabled people and ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith has attended the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva and outlined the Government’s plan to restore law and order. “Speaking to the United Nations Human Rights Council provided us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while responding to issues and ...
The Government and Rotorua Lakes Council are committed to working closely together to end the use of contracted emergency housing motels in Rotorua. Associate Minister of Housing (Social Housing) Tama Potaka says the Government remains committed to ending the long-term use of contracted emergency housing motels in Rotorua by the ...
Trade Minister Todd McClay heads overseas today for high-level trade talks in the Gulf region, and a key OECD meeting in Paris. Mr McClay will travel to Riyadh to meet with counterparts from Saudi Arabia and the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC). “New Zealand’s goods and services exports to the Gulf region ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford has outlined six education priorities to deliver a world-leading education system that sets Kiwi kids up for future success. “I’m putting ambition, achievement and outcomes at the heart of our education system. I want every child to be inspired and engaged in their learning so they ...
The new NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) App is a secure ‘one stop shop’ to provide the services drivers need, Transport Minister Simeon Brown and Digitising Government Minister Judith Collins say. “The NZTA App will enable an easier way for Kiwis to pay for Vehicle Registration and Road User Charges (RUC). ...
Whānau with tamariki growing up in emergency housing motels will be prioritised for social housing starting this week, says Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka. “Giving these whānau a better opportunity to build healthy stable lives for themselves and future generations is an essential part of the Government’s goal of reducing ...
Racing Minister Winston Peters has paid tribute to an icon of the industry with the recent passing of Dave O’Sullivan (OBE). “Our sympathies are with the O’Sullivan family with the sad news of Dave O’Sullivan’s recent passing,” Mr Peters says. “His contribution to racing, initially as a jockey and then ...
Assalaamu alaikum, greetings to you all. Eid Mubarak, everyone! I want to extend my warmest wishes to you and everyone celebrating this joyous occasion. It is a pleasure to be here. I have enjoyed Eid celebrations at Parliament before, but this is my first time joining you as the Minister ...
Associate Health Minister David Seymour has announced Pharmac’s largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff. “Access to medicines is a crucial part of many Kiwis’ lives. We’ve committed to a budget allocation of $1.774 billion over four years so Kiwis are ...
Hon Paula Bennett has been appointed as member and chair of the Pharmac board, Associate Health Minister David Seymour announced today. "Pharmac is a critical part of New Zealand's health system and plays a significant role in ensuring that Kiwis have the best possible access to medicines,” says Mr Seymour. ...
Hundreds of New Zealand families affected by Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder (FASD) will benefit from a new Government focus on prevention and treatment, says Health Minister Dr Shane Reti. “We know FASD is a leading cause of preventable intellectual and neurodevelopmental disability in New Zealand,” Dr Reti says. “Every day, ...
Regional Development Minister Shane Jones today attended the official opening of Kaikohe’s new $14.7 million sports complex. “The completion of the Kaikohe Multi Sports Complex is a fantastic achievement for the Far North,” Mr Jones says. “This facility not only fulfils a long-held dream for local athletes, but also creates ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters’ engagements in Türkiye this week underlined the importance of diplomacy to meet growing global challenges. “Returning to the Gallipoli Peninsula to represent New Zealand at Anzac commemorations was a sombre reminder of the critical importance of diplomacy for de-escalating conflicts and easing tensions,” Mr Peters ...
Ambassador Millar, Burgemeester, Vandepitte, Excellencies, military representatives, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen – good morning and welcome to this sacred Anzac Day dawn service. It is an honour to be here on behalf of the Government and people of New Zealand at Buttes New British Cemetery, Polygon Wood – a deeply ...
Distinguished guests - It is an honour to return once again to this site which, as the resting place for so many of our war-dead, has become a sacred place for generations of New Zealanders. Our presence here and at the other special spaces of Gallipoli is made ...
Mai ia tawhiti pamamao, te moana nui a Kiwa, kua tae whakaiti mai matou, ki to koutou papa whenua. No koutou te tapuwae, no matou te tapuwae, kua honoa pumautia. Ko nga toa kua hinga nei, o te Waipounamu, o te Ika a Maui, he okioki tahi me o ...
Paul Goldsmith will take on responsibility for the Media and Communications portfolio, while Louise Upston will pick up the Disability Issues portfolio, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon announced today. “Our Government is relentlessly focused on getting New Zealand back on track. As issues change in prominence, I plan to adjust Ministerial ...
Recreational catch limits will be reduced in areas of Fiordland and the Chatham Islands to help keep those fisheries healthy and sustainable, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The lower recreational daily catch limits for a range of finfish and shellfish species caught in the Fiordland Marine Area and ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed an important milestone in New Zealand’s hydrogen future, with the opening of the country’s first network of hydrogen refuelling stations in Wiri. “I want to congratulate the team at Hiringa Energy and its partners K one W one (K1W1), Mitsui & Co New Zealand ...
The coalition Government is delivering on its commitment to improve resource management laws and give greater certainty to consent applicants, with a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) expected to be introduced to Parliament next month. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop has today outlined the first RMA Amendment ...
The Government Communications Security Bureau denies hosting a foreign spying capability flagged by the watchdog, differentiating it from the system recently criticised. ...
RNZ News A group of academic staff at New Zealand’s largest university have expressed concern at the administration’s move to block a protest encampment that was planned to take place on campus calling for support for the rights of Palestinians. This week, the University of Auckland warned that while it ...
Genterwocky After a hard days marching, Sir Doocey calls in at the Village Tavern For a pint of ale and a pork pie. The grim villagers stare at him. “Do not be travelling on the forest road,” warns a crusty old beak. “And why is that, antique peasant?” Grins Sir ...
Political conferences after a party returns to power are usually a chance for some healthy, even unhealthy backslapping. Yet National Party president Sylvia Wood’s address to its mainland representatives on Saturday hardly contained the unalloyed delight that one might have expected following National’s escape from the wilderness of opposition. Yes, ...
Comment: Almost half the world is voting in national elections this year and artificial intelligence is the elephant in the room. There are genuine fears AI-generated or AI-edited deepfakes will potentially manipulate election outcomes not just in the US and UK, but critically in countries such as India. For that ...
Ahead of the reality franchise’s return to New Zealand, allow us to introduce the eight brides and grooms. Chuck on a veil and tie back your man bun, because it’s time to say “I do” to a new season of Married at First Sight NZ. The reality TV “social experiment” ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Andrew Norton, Professor in the Practice of Higher Education Policy, Australian National University Every year on June 1, student debt in Australia is indexed to inflation. In 2023, high inflation pushed the indexation rate to 7.1%, the highest since 1990. This ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Changes in the May 14 budget will cut the student debt of more than three million people, wiping more than $3 billion from what people owe. The government will cap the HELP indexation rate ...
Asia Pacific Report The prosecutor’s office at the International Criminal Court (ICC) has appealed for an end to what it calls intimidation of its staff, saying such threats could constitute an offence against the “administration of justice” by the world’s permanent war crimes court. The Hague-based office of ICC Prosecutor ...
By Patrick Decloitre, RNZ Pacific correspondent French Pacific desk A women’s union in New Caledonia has staged a sit-in protest this week to support senior Kanak indigenous journalist Thérèse Waia, who works for public broadcaster Nouvelle-Calédonie la Première, after a smear attack by critics. The peaceful demonstration was held on ...
New Zealand Food Safety is monitoring overseas recalls of Indian packaged spice products manufactured by MDH and Everest due to concerns over a cancer-causing pesticide. ...
By Stephen Wright and Stefan Armbruster of BenarNews Fiji’s ranking in a global press freedom index has jumped into the top tier of countries with free or mostly free media after its government last year repealed a draconian law that threatened journalists with prison for doing their jobs. Fiji’s improvement ...
We might be in Invercargill but all anyone can talk about is Gore. Specifically, Salford Street. That’s where three-year-old Lachlan Jones lived, south of the centre of town, between the A&P Showgrounds and the Mataura River. Roughly 1.2 km away from the single level home he lived in with his ...
MONDAY I lined up the latest round of civil servants from city hall against the wall, and signalled for the firing squad to drop their rifles. I stepped up onto a wooden crate to look at the office workers in the eye. But that didn’t feel right, so I found ...
Keen hiker and second-year MSc student Liam Hewson wears two hats when he’s in the great outdoors. “The scientist in me appreciates nature and goes, ‘Oh, there’s that thing and there’s another thing,’ but then the tramper and the outdoorsy person in me thinks, ‘Cool bush.’” Born and bred in ...
After a long and illustrious career as a goal kicker, Dan Carter’s favourite way to unwind is… kicking goals. Why can’t he get enough of it? And what it’s like to watch him do it for an hour straight? A semicircle of people wielding cameras and phones has formed in ...
Dame Susan Devoy takes us through her life in television, including late night ER debriefs, her proudest CTI moment and the show she watches in secret. Quite aside from her four world champion squash titles, Dame Susan Devoy will likely go down in history as one of the best Celebrity ...
Hera Lindsay Bird reveals the best places in Ōtepoti to score more for your apocalypse-prep book hoard.Sometimes I get the feeling I’ve been killed in a car crash, and this second half of my life is just the brain unspooling itself, like one of those episodes of a hospital ...
ThreeNow’s new murder mystery series takes us on a dark, damp journey into the Australian wilderness.This is an excerpt from our weekly pop culture newsletter Rec Room. Sign up here. High Country is ThreeNow’s new Australian eight-part crime drama, set in a remote part of the Victorian highlands. It tells ...
Introducing a new way to read The Spinoff every weekend. After nearly 10 years of being an online magazine, we’re finally embracing the weekend liftout. Despite our best efforts to convince you otherwise, writers and editors at The Spinoff don’t work weekend. It is through the sheer power of technology ...
Tip one: let yourself be nurtured by this big old man. Tip two: don’t ask him to adopt you. So, you’ve arrived at your first session with a new therapist. He tells you to make yourself comfortable and you opt for the tweed armchair, hoping it makes you look like ...
I didn’t know books could open you back up; that there were books that stayed with you, where reading was like a chemical event. I knew nothing.The Sunday Essay is made possible thanks to the support of Creative New Zealand.Not too long ago, I was listening to the American ...
Former Olympic swimmer James Magnussen has already started training for the Enhanced games, though says he won’t start taking performance enhancing substances until about nine months out from the competition. The Australian world champion was the first athlete to be announced by Enhanced, but he says the organisation has had ...
Everyone thinks he’s dead. Every day they expect his body to be washed up along the coast. Most likely up Karitane way, the way the tide’s running. But nobody’ll be too surprised if his body’s never found. Even in death he wouldn’t have wished for such attention. He would have ...
Council members voted 21 to 4 in favour of Ahluwalia returning to the Laucala campus following a much-awaited meeting in Vanuatu this week. It comes as USP and its two unions — the Association of the University of the South Pacific Staff (AUSPS) and the Administration and Support Staff Union ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nicola Henry, Professor & Australian Research Council Future Fellow, Social and Global Studies Centre, RMIT University Shutterstock Following an emergency meeting of the National Cabinet this week, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has announced a raft of measures to tackle the problem ...
Analysis - A poll showing the opposition is more popular than the government raises questions, politicians go through their 'trial by pay rise' and a Green MP loses her cool in the debating chamber. ...
The entire stretch of Tokomaru Bay on the East Coast will be subject to a joint customary marine title for two hapū, and extending up to four miles out to sea. A High Court judge has found the two groups, who during the case settled a dispute over boundaries for ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By James Hall, Lecturer, Media & Cultural Studies, Edith Cowan University A longstanding feud between TikTok and Universal Music Group seems to have finally reached an end, with both parties signing a deal that will see Universal-backed music returned to the social media ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Siobhan O’Dean, Postdoctoral Research Associate, The Matilda Centre for Research in Mental Health and Substance Use, University of Sydney After several highly publicised alleged murders of women in Australia, the Albanese government this week pledged more than A$925 million over five years ...
Political parties have now fully disclosed the donations they received last year - with National getting more than double the cash of any other party. ...
A Pacific regionalism expert has called out New Zealand's Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters for withholding information from the public on AUKUS military pact. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard de Grijs, Professor of Astrophysics, Macquarie University Bruno Scramgnon/Pexels All systems are “go” for tonight’s launch of China’s next step in a carefully planned lunar exploration program. Placed on top of a powerful Long March 5 rocket, the Chang’e 6 ...
National returned a massive donation the day after a Newsroom story linked the donors to a property being investigated for operating unlawfully as a migrant workers’ hostel. The party’s 2023 donation filings, released on Friday, show it returned a $200,000 donation from Buen Holdings on August 23. That was the ...
Pacific Media Watch New Zealand has slumped to an unprecedented 19th place in the annual Reporters Without Borders World Press Freedom Index survey released today on World Press Freedom Day — May 3. This was a drop of six places from 13th last year when it slipped out of its ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Joshua Black, Political Historian and Administrator Officer, Australian Historical Association, Australian National University Australia has had its fair share of public record-keeping controversies in recent years. Some have been mere farce, as in the case of two formerly government-owned filing cabinets (containing ...
Heavenly Culture, World Peace, Restoration of Light (HWPL), a United Nations-affiliated organization dedicated to fostering peace through civilian-led initiatives, has issued a statement in response to the escalating conflict between Israel and Iran. ...
A poem by Tessa Keenan, from AUP New Poets 10. Mātou These days we are a photograph; one of a farm strewn with cows that used to be bright harakeke or swamp. The kids point at it and say the sun sits behind a smudge (left by someone at Christmas); ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Small Things Like These by Claire Keegan (Faber & Faber, $25)The masterful Irish writer ...
Marriage and civil union statistics record the number of marriages and civil unions registered in New Zealand each year, and divorce statistics record the number of divorces granted in New Zealand each year. Key facts Marriages and civil unions In ...
Marriage and civil union statistics record the number of marriages and civil unions registered in New Zealand each year, and divorce statistics record the number of divorces granted in New Zealand each year. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Lennon Y.C. Chang, Associate Professor of Cyber Risk and Policy, Deakin University Taiwan stands out as a beacon of democracy, innovation and resilience in an increasingly autocratic region. But this is under growing threat. In recent years, China has used a variety ...
In this excerpt from her new memoir, Dame Susan Devoy remembers her turn as star contestant on the 2022 season of Celebrity Treasure Island. The most anxious time of every day was pre-elimination, when you knew this could be your final day on the show. I felt such contradictory emotions, ...
A week that began in triumph ended in an all-too-familiar disaster for the Green Party. Duncan Greive asks if there’s something in the mission that breaks its best and brightest. A long, strange week for the Green party began with a fantastic poll result. On one level this is hardly ...
By Lydia Lewis, RNZ Pacific journalist Vanuatu’s former prime minister and opposition MP Ishmael Kalsakau has stepped down — just two days after he confirmed he was the rightful opposition leader. Kalsakau, MP for Port Vila, confirmed to ABC’s Pacific Beat, and the Vanuatu Daily Post on Thursday that he ...
What’s to blame for the coalition’s choppy start? Six months in, and the mojo meter is in the doldrums. A new poll would put National out of power and sees its leader, Chris Luxon, sliding in popularity. How much is it about policy, how much coalition management and a perception ...
The striking report goes far beyond the proposed repeal of the Oranga Tamariki Act’s Treaty of Waitangi provision, and its impact should be felt far beyond the unique circumstances of the claim it addresses. Earlier this week, the Waitangi Tribunal released an interim report on the government’s proposed repeal of ...
The world has been experiencing a productivity slowdown, from which New Zealand has not been exempt. COVID-19 temporarily boosted labour productivity, but more recently, productivity has retreated. The overall trend since 2007 has been one of slow productivity ...
What’s more wasteful than spending $315k on syrup and machine maintenance? Trying to drum up a controversy about it.Cast your mind back to the pre-pandemic idylls of 2019. A “rat” was a disgusting rodent and not a self-administered plague test; the sixth Labour government was in power; and the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kate Fitz-Gibbon, Professor of Social Sciences, Faculty of Arts, Monash University, Monash University Ken stocker/Shutterstock In the wake of numerous killings of women allegedly by men’s violence in 2024, thousands of Australians have joined rallies across the country to demand action ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Henry Cutler, Professor and Director, Macquarie University Centre for the Health Economy, Macquarie University Oleg Ivanov IL/Shutterstock Waiting times for public hospital elective surgery have been in the news ahead of this year’s federal budget. That’s the type of non-emergency surgery ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Konstantine Panegyres, McKenzie Postdoctoral Fellow, Historical and Philosophical Studies, The University of Melbourne Amna Artist/Shutterstock One of the earliest descriptions of someone with cancer comes from the fourth century BC. Satyrus, tyrant of the city of Heracleia on the Black Sea, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By John Rose, Professor of Sustainable Future Transport, University of Sydney LanaElcova/Shutterstock Electric vehicles are often seen as the panacea to cutting emissions – and air pollution – from transport. Is this view correct? Yes – but only once uptake accelerates. Despite the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Giselle Natassia Woodley, Researcher and Phd Candidate, Edith Cowan University There is widespread agreement Australia needs to do better when it comes to gender-based violence. Anger and frustration at the numbers of women being killed saw national rallies over the weekend and ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By James Graham, Lecturer in Economics, University of Sydney Mark and Anna Photography/Shutterstock As home ownership moves further out of reach for many Australians, “rentvesting” is being touted as a lifesaver. Rentvesting is the practice of renting one property to live ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sukhmani Khorana, Associate Professor, Faculty of Arts, Design and Architecture, UNSW Sydney Netflix The new season of Heartbreak High is garnering mixed reviews. Critics are writing about the racy story lines, comparing it to other coming-of-age series about teenage relationships and ...
Bob Carr intends to launch legal action against Winston Peters and Julie Anne Genter is facing a second allegation of bullying. Both sucked the air out of an announcement on education, writes Anna Rawhiti-Connell in this excerpt from The Bulletin, The Spinoff’s morning news round-up. To receive The Bulletin in ...
I'd have thought it's just common sense for all teachers and school staff to be vaccinated. It shouldn't be a big deal, given some of the homes some of the kids come from, and the overcrowded classrooms these days.
I believe there are some good arguments against being vaccinated with the mRNA Pfizer jab ,but ONLY if one is young, very healthy, and is un-immunocompromised. And that would apply to very few people out there , some of who may well be young, fit, health "addict" teachers. If they are dead against this vaccination then I don't see why they should have to lose their job. Bear in mind a vaccinated person can pass covid on anyway. Just saying.
Sounds like you've done your own research, Garibaldi, and have identified groups that should avoid vaccination!
Weird how all the credible experts (Bloomfield, Baker etc in NZ) think getting everyone vaccinated down to infants (once approved) is the way to go, to give the best protection to everyone. The vaccines are incredibly safe, especially compared to the disease. Just Saying.
Perhaps the teaching profession could afford to lose a few teachers who don't believe in science or in protecting the wellbeing of kids and their families.
95% of teachers are in their unions Their Unions say vaccinate.
Alot of water is yet to go under the bridge before we find out everything about these covid vaccines. I have some nagging doubts about them but was happy to get the jab to avoid going to an overloaded hospital. Yes, I have done it for social and selfish reasons. I don't think the science and politics behind any of the big Pharma companies are squeaky clean. Time will tell.
Just leaving a false equivalence out there, more like.
Nobody has to lose their job. They just have to test the courage of their convictions.
It seems that in the US the number of people who genuinely would rather not have that job than get vaccinated is astonishingly low compared to the touted outrage.
"Nobody has to lose their job.
If they chose not to be vaccinated, they will lost their job. Which precisely contradicts what the PM said,
"No, and we haven't for any vaccination in New Zealand applied penalties in that way," Ardern told The AM Show, after being asked if there might be tax penalties or other sanctions for refusing a COVID-19 vaccine."
I know a number of teachers who will have to make this call. Some (I don't agree with them) will lose their jobs over this. None of them like being lied to.
If. they. chose.
Which is a choice under duress. And against a specific assurance given by the PM.
The first bit would be fair, if we weren't talking about getting a vaccine in the middle of a fucking pandemic. What about the risk your hypothetical employee is putting on everyone else? Their paycheque isn't worth someone else's life.
the second bit – we’re still discussing that elsewhere.
The risk of infection can be managed by the employer. ECE's have been doing that on and off for months. Which is what we're discussing elsewhere.
So will vaccinated teachers who are working in cramped and overcrowded classrooms have the right to know the vaccination status of all their students and families – and exclude the unvaccinated?
We went back to school in Level 2 last year.
Desks were arranged like exam time. They had all been cleaned. There was plenty of hand sanitiser in every room. Teachers discussed the usual, coughing onto your elbow, thorough hand washing, social distancing.
At morning tea, the girls all hugged each other, and the boys were on the back field rolling around like labrador puppies.
There is only so much we can do.
Same experience. Well said. Kids are hopeless at Physical Distancing, probably because somebody was stupid enough to name it 'Social Distancing'. ..
Isn't anyone here worried about the human rights implications of these mandates? Whatever you believe about the vaccines the walking over of the bill of rights is terrifying. What comes next?
I think the focus is in the wrong place here. When this pandemic ends what rights will we as citizens be left with?
My partner is beside herself, tbh its getting a bit scary…
Its not just trampling rights, its pitting family member against family member, fear of losing employment etc, resentment that you dont really have a real choice anymore, resentment when a stranger thinks it ok to quiz you on your medical information, resentment that neighbors are encouraged to dob each other in over percieved violation… some people find these things extremely frightening.
"On Tuesday Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern went a step further, saying not only will there be no forced vaccinations, but those who choose to opt-out won't face any penalties at all."
I suspect her past assurances won't be any consolation now.
My 'tradie' son was quick to acknowledge the Prime Minister lied to us.
He said it rather too cheerfully for my liking.
Tradies eh? Kings of the "self made man" syndrome. Married to their manly Ford Rangers etc.
You are spot on about the Ranger.
I would like to think it is a phase he is going through. Surrounded by older, News talk Hoskjng disciples.
I would suggest that losing your job is a sanction. Wouldn't you?
“Teachers and healthcare workers who refuse a Covid-19 vaccine will soon be out of a job.” https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300427745/covid19-nz-sweeping-vaccine-mandate-for-teachers-and-most-healthcare-workers
When PM Ardern said the government would not apply penalties, and that those choosing not to be vaccinated were placing themselves at risk, the Delta outbreak was but a gleam under Collins’ eyebrow.
“Adapt or die.” If the current outbreak gets out of control then our government may change tack on "tax penalties or other sanctions" – it’s simply commonsense to adapt to changing circumstances. But I'd be surprised and disappointed if they reneged on the committment to no forced vaccinations in NZ.
"But I'd be surprised and disappointed if they reneged on the committment to no forced vaccinations in NZ."
They already have. "Teachers and healthcare workers who refuse a Covid-19 vaccine will soon be out of a job."
People having to face consequences for their actions, actions that are wholly their own choice, is not force.
When your livelihood is threatened, it is force.
Has any NZer had a Covid-19 vaccine forced on them? NZ border workers had a choice; I would be surprised and disappointed if it’s any different for teachers / healthcare workers – the choice is theirs. Makes you think, eh?
Teachers and especially healthcare workers are in demand globally, so NZ may face some staff shortages as these mandates loom – choices and consequences, as always.
"Has any NZer had a Covid-19 vaccine forced on them?"
If it's a choice between giving up their livelihood, then yes it's force.
And that's not all.
"No, and we haven't for any vaccination in New Zealand applied penalties in that way," Ardern told The AM Show, after being asked if there might be tax penalties or other sanctions for refusing a COVID-19 vaccine. "
Surely you're not arguing that losing your job is not a sanction?
” NZ border workers had a choice;”
And if they made the ‘wrong’ choice, they lost their job. Despite the PM’s assurances.
Well, no. It's you making yourself unable to do your job safely. Your employer has responsibilities in that regard.
So let employers manage that risk. Just like we have until now. Just like we do with virtually all other health and safety issues.
So if OSH prosecute employers who have unvaxxed staff, that's not a sanction?
cool
"So if OSH prosecute employers who have unvaxxed staff, that's not a sanction?"
No it's not. Because they would only investigate if there was an 'incident' (such as an infection). And they would only prosecute if the employer had not taken all reasonable steps. Let the employers decide, and advertise their decision so the community can make informed choices.
Well, OSH regards hazards / near misses as reportable instances as well, and does investigate them.
So, basically, if a work-place were required to have an up to date register of vax status, and someone wasn't up to snuff, then that person working onsite would be a safety violation and the employer could be charged – that's not a sanction on the staff member fired because they can't do their job safely.
But a school having a register of vax status and being required to only employ vaxed staff is somehow a sanction on the teacher who gets dismissed for not being vaxed.
"So, basically, if a work-place were required to have an up to date register of vax status, and someone wasn't up to snuff, then that person working onsite would be a safety violation and the employer could be charged – that's not a sanction on the staff member fired because they can't do their job safely."
They wouldn’t necessarily be a safety violation or risk. It would be up to the employer to take all reasonable steps to ensure any risk was managed, minimised, mitigated, just as they have been doing. So by all means, keep a register, but don't sack workers who aren't vaccinated. Particularly in a profession with critical staff shortages.
consider this. If we were all more honest in this debate, more people might get vaccinated.
Your sophistry here makes sense for people that have your beliefs, but those aren't the people who are hesitant about the vaccine.
Being real about the degree of pressure doesn't hurt us, it makes things better. Yes, we are mandating (forcing people to choose between their job and being vaxxed, for the good of others), because this is one of our few ways to avoid a really big disaster for NZ.
Dancing around that by pretending there's no coercion will just set off hesitant people's bullshit detectors at a time when many are already concerned about being lied to and losing control of something that's very important to them.
Mate, we keep hazard registers to identify hazards and demonstrate that we have isolated, minimised, or eliminated them.
The preferred resolution is eliminate. No more hazard.
In the case of staff who present a chronic safety hazard that cannot be isolated or minimised reasonably, that means firing them (after giving them reasonable instruction and support to stop being a hazard, which they reject).
Just like you would a truck driver who turns out to be an alcoholic. They can't safely perform their role.
why would anyone keep a meaningless register? "Oh, this is the guy who spread all that disease. We have their name in a register, it's ok".
"The preferred resolution is eliminate. No more hazard."
But that isn't always possible, which is why we manage those hazards.
"In the case of staff who present a chronic safety hazard that cannot be isolated or minimised reasonably, that means firing them (after giving them reasonable instruction and support to stop being a hazard, which they reject)."
But this can be minimised reasonably. We could introduce regular testing (saliva/rapid antigen). Unvaccinated teachers could wear masks. There are alternatives to losing scarce teaching reseource.
Oh, so that's what sets off their bullshit detectors, huh.
Not the idea that Ardern was responding to the claim of literal forced vaccinations – full Billy TK shit – and now that is being conflated with "you can't sit in a room with thirty kids if you're going to give them an infectious disease, find something else to do with your stupidity".
Are you suggesting that all unvaccinated people should be fired from teaching, health, border control etc jobs?
What about the people with medical exemptions?
Testing catches it after the fact, and an employer could require full BL4 outfites and still be a fool to trust an antivaxxer to use them diligently. Only sure way is to get rid of them.
100 people, isn't it? If everyone else gets vaccinated, we might be able to keep them on.
lol, how many vaccine hesitant people do you actually know? They're not some amorphous BTK loving mass. Some of them are easily as intelligent as you. And they don't like being lied to.
Do you believe that Ardern would never sanction forced vaccinations? Pretty sure I've seen you argue for them pre-covid, as in maybe they're not such a bad idea. Pretty sure that Andre is in favour. You think vax hesitant people trust the left or Ardern on this? You think people who don't trust the government and feel politically homeless and disenfranchised are going to do what you want?
It doesn't matter how righteous you are in your own mind (and you may well be completely right). People are human, and there are things that work and things that don't. I'm suggesting trying honesty.
And yes, I saw the video on twitter, and I don't think Ardern was only talking about strap em down and force 'em, she was also at times talking about mandating vaccines via coercion.
in order to find some common ground here, I'll withdraw the idea that Ardern lied. She was pragmatic at the time, and genuine, but it's also true that she would have know that a time might come when coercion was necessary.
So let's call it a white lie, or just good PR and political nous. The problem is that some people feel lied to, and while you might thing their feelings are irrelevant, we know that many humans will respond better when they get to feel good or met half way or that people are considering their wellbeing. None of that us unreacheable to us now.
In Gypsy's clip, the question was about tax penalties, and Ardern was saying we don't need to do that because historically we get up to around 90%. That was pre-delta.
We might one day get to the level with a disease where literally everyone needs the jab to stop millions dying. In that case, fuck personal choices. We are not going to replay the black death just because some jerk wants to dick about and google their own research. In the 14th century Europe literally didn't know what hit it, today we can diagnose it, sequence it, kill it, and stick its photo on our wall.
The response is binary. They either get vaccinated, or they don't.
haven't seen Gypsy's clip, I'll see if can find the twitter one.
The issue I'm arguing isn't about personal choice, it's about not throwing the human rights baby out with the bathwater, or using authoritarian approaches that make the situation worse.
Ok, I'll take that as you being ok with either authoritarianism, or risking authoritarianism. By which I don't mean personal choice (that's something in your head), I mean that if society wants to keep treating people like shit (the feelings bit, not the vax/unvaxxed bit), then it can take it's chances, but we know how this went in the US and it's unlikely they will get out of that mess in the forseeable future.
''In Gypsy's clip, the question was about tax penalties, and Ardern was saying we don't need to do that because historically we get up to around 90%."
You haven't read the article. The PM's comments were in response to conspiracy theorists claims that people will be forced to get the vaccination. The article goes on to say this:
On Tuesday Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern went a step further, saying not only will there be no forced vaccinations, but those who choose to opt-out won't face any penalties at all.
"No, and we haven't for any vaccination in New Zealand applied penalties in that way," Ardern told The AM Show, after being asked if there might be tax penalties or other sanctions for refusing a COVID-19 vaccine.
She specifically ruled out mandated vaccination, and also ruled out any penalty for those who refused.
No, PM Ardern ruled out forced vaccinations.
Nor I, and happily there's no need. During a global pandemic it may become acceptable to review (on an on-going basis) the personal and societal merits of safe, effective vaccines.
If, after review, 'jab avoidance' still feels like the right choice, then there are many countries crying out for NZ teachers and healthcare workers. Tragically, in some of those countries the current average daily Covid death toll remains north of 100, so please at least consider getting the appropriate jabs before relocating.
We don't know how lucky we are to live in this country.
Unite against COVID-19
https://covid19.govt.nz
You didn't watch the interview embedded in that article.
Also:
Fairly accurate headline for a change. Not a bad prediction given the ground a year ago.
It was a simple statement of fact. Individuals either get the damned jab, or don't.
We get up to a level where ICUs aren't overloaded and deaths are rare, or we get fucked and thousands die.
If you want to hold their hand and take them down to big pharma to buy the prophylactic of their choice, and try and explain to them why the horse tablets are an imbecilic option, go ahead.
We don't have time, and we don't have the resources.
Like the PM was, I'm still reasonably confident that we won't need authoritarian measures to get to a level of community protection. But making sure that key network nodes who have many "edges" (close contacts, like teachers with students, colleagues and parents) have protection isn't just about population immunity, it's about stopping that particular person almost single-handedly causing a near-uncontrollable outbreak.
Population immunity is a stochastic concept: we don't know which person will protect which other person. But teachers getting vaccinated? We know exactly who that is to protect.
It's an easy choice, imho. I wish all teachers and healthcare workers who chose to make the tough decision to remain vaccine-free well – we can't, alas, wish those who have tragically died from Covid well.
Maybe the excellent Covid health outcomes achieved so far by our government and the team have caused some to lose sight of the millions of lives already lost to the pandemic. It appears to be the view of our government that it can’t effectively enforce the public health measures needed to eliminate or possibly even control this Delta outbreak, so they are enacting other logical and enforcible measures to keep everyone as safe as possible. They can’t please everyone.
If I needed to see a healthcare professional right now and had a choice (all other things being equal) between an unvaccinated and a vaccinated worker, I know which one I'd choose. Keep choice alive!
Unite against COVID-19
https://covid19.govt.nz
I made what I consider an informed choice and am fully vaccinated. I respect those who made an informed choice and chose not to. I certainly don't believe they should lose their livelihoods.
Yeah, but I could see back then that if the virus got worse, or we got a more deadly pandemic, that mandating would happen. Ardern could have been honest. It's not like they didn't know about the possibility. She chose the line she chose, because she's a good public communicator and it made sense at the time, but it wasn't her only option.
"Dancing around that by pretending there's no coercion will just set off hesitant people's bullshit detectors at a time when many are already concerned about being lied to and losing control of something that's very important to them."
Exactly. The PM has clearly either lied to or mislead teachers and front line customs workers. Anti-vaxxers are lying to people. But this mandating everything in sight is raising hackles and it is just so totally counter-productive.
Just said to McFlock that I'd stop calling it lying, in the interests of common ground. Ardern was being politically pragmatic. The problem is people feel like she lied. This is why I think honesty rather than ostracisation and sophistry would be a better move right now. We really need to be calling people in.
one of the options with mandating is to mandate and help people find other jobs if they don't want to vax. Isn't that what Labour is all about?
"one of the options with mandating is to mandate and help people find other jobs if they don't want to vax."
Honestly, I'm not comfortable with that either. The ECE sector is desperately short of teachers. And if Covid is in the community, children are just as likely to catch it on play dates etc as from a teacher, particularly if sound precautions are taken.
if a child spends one hour with an infected play mate, and one hour with an infected teacher, their risk is increased than if they spent one hour with only one of them. Even if we don’t think the child is at risk, the health system still is and in turn other people.
As for shortages, I believe that covid is the starting point of rolling crises over the next hundred years. Climate and ecology crisis are lapping around our feet. We have to learn to adapt, and the idea that societal institutions and services will remain unchanged is dangerous. Not that I expect Labour to be planning around this (yet), but I do think people need to be thinking about changes, including ones induced by shortages, and figure out how to make things better within the limitations.
Apparently there's a lot of hospo work going at the moment.
My son's a chef. He's back at work and has been told he can work all the hours he wants, there is such a shortage of chefs.
"if a child spends one hour with an infected play mate, and one hour with an infected teacher, their risk is increased than if they spent one hour with only one of them. Even if we don’t think the child is at risk, the health system still is and in turn other people."
I get all of that, but those 'if's' don't take into account other measures.
The ECE centre where I spend most of my time had a positive case recently. A child. I was a close contact, as were at least 30 other children and their parents (we had had a farewell event for one of the staff). Even though that was very early in the Delta outbreak, the centre was already exercising good practices, and despite none of the teachers being vaccinated at that stage no-one else caught covid from that child. The greatest risk to children is likely to come from parents and other contacts.
I don't really get this. Surely the point is to eleminate as many risks, not just the greatest. If risks are 50%, 10%, 5%, 15%, 30%, don't we want to do the smaller risks as well as the biggest?
Just BTW – I have just been sent a clip that is circulating on social media. The clip is of both the PM, Chris Hipkins and Ashley Bloomfield stating categorically that vaccinations will not be made compulsory. The PM is specifically asked about the 'no-jab no-job' policy in Australia, and she specifically replies that her government are not looking at that, that she she believes in vaccination, but "not mandatory". There is also a picture of a Covid-19 promotional ad that reads "you cannot be forced to get vaccinated'. It really isn't a good look.
This one?
https://twitter.com/_MaccaNZ/status/1447397828909617162
Yep, it is a bad look, this one will come back to bite them. From memory, the wording was different at different times. But I understood at the time the situation could change. Didn't think it would be this soon mind.
"Yep, it is a bad look, this one will come back to bite them. "
That's the one.
And while they’re implementing a mandate they said they wouldn’t, there’s this:
Epidemiologist Michael Baker says there’s so many holes in the system “you could drive a truck through it”.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/10/covid-19-government-rules-don-t-require-negative-test-result-to-cross-borders.html
"Surely the point is to eleminate as many risks, not just the greatest."
Of course, but there are balances. For example a business doesn't fire people because there is a chance of an accident. They manage, minimise and mitigate. In the tame way The jab doesn't eliminate all risk of catching covid; it is a mitigation, a way of minimising (not eliminating) risk.
Sounds just like the 2nd world war. I wonder if they moaned as much then.
Apparently, quite a few did, lol.
Like an ironmonger at the start of the war who responded to a cop instructing him to put out his lights:
Interesting thesis, that – but a big read, because thesis lol
Gerald Otto puts it better then I can.
When some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well. Should they be in the job?
https://www.facebook.com/gerard.otto
“Never have I seen
Never have I seen so many teachers leading by example and protecting the children in their classes from long covid and possibly even death whilst a small minority are so selfish about their freedom to infect the kids. They should never have been teachers in the first place.
Never had I seen so many health workers protect patients, themselves and their colleagues from infection while working like heroes on the front lines while illiterate morons protest their freedom and make the life of health workers more dangerous and stressful”.
If an RSV shot is approved should that be mandatory as well? (killed a bunch of kids this year overan starship)Flu? Measles, Chickpox? MMR?
We are going to have to decide these things, and be ready to roll on mandated booster shots as well.
Research on belief in conspiracy theories might help understand why "some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well."
Recent work from Australia (my bold) –
"Results of the current study indicate that individuals who have odd beliefs/magical thinking, and who are strategic, manipulative, dominant, and callous are more likely to believe in conspiracy theories. Given the possibility for these beliefs to shape real world behaviour, and the possibility for this behaviour to have damaging social and civic consequences, it is imperative research continues to establish predictors of these beliefs so reliable methods to challenge and negate these erroneous beliefs can be established."
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6890261/
There's a real problem in this line. You believe it is harmless, other people don't. Your argument is predicated on people accepting your beliefs and abandoning their own. How do you think that's going to work out, especially under financial and career duress?
Instead, we could be saying that the risk from the vaccine is low and the risk is worth taking because covid the illness in individuals and society has much worse outcomes and is much more likely to happen.
As a past teacher, after getting the facts, most want their pupils safe from the virus.
The union membership it is voluntary and last I looked 95%.
The members want vaccination.
Those who don't it is their personal choice and parents may not want that risk.
not sure what that has to do with what I said, tbh.
I don't "believe it is harmless". I know for a fact, vaccines are almost harmless, supported by a huge amount of evidence.
Opinions/beliefs and facts, are two different things.
That vaccination is almost 100% safe, is a fact. Determined by the results of trials and research involving millions of people.
Nothing is 100% safe, of course.
Covid, of course, is several orders of magnitude more harmful.
“instead, we could be saying that the risk from the vaccine is low and the risk is worth taking because covid the illness in individuals and society has much worse outcomes and is much more likely to happen”
What do you think I’ve been saying?
"Nothing is 100% safe, of course."
That's right. But you have been saying "harmless".
"What do you think I’ve been saying?"
I think you've been saying that the vaccine is harmless, and no-one ever experiences adverse effects.
In New Zealand after 5 million jabs
Adverse reactions more severe than sniffles for a few days. Less than ten.
That is about as "harmless" as anything gets.
So. Saying the Phizer vaccine is "harmless" is entirely justified.
"Covid, of course, is several orders of magnitude more harmful."
To the vulnerable
Apparently Brazil has passed the 600k "vulnerable" mark, and that's just their dead.
Per capita, that would be about 14,000 NZ dead.
But they're vulnerable, so that would be fine. 🙄
That is a fair point. But lets face it Brazil handled it shittely.
I think the govt did it right now at the time. But have to say personally I thought at the time it would have been easier and cheaper to the whole country if we went for shielding the vulnerable rather than restricting them and everyone else (Which is the vast majority(.
All in all reckon at the beginning they did really well. But geezes there is no reason for the Sth Island to be at level 2 now with a properly controlled and the cook strait.
And the vagueness of stuff is silly.
Give me Arden 2020. Because the 2021 one is a bit scattery
Well, down here another person was in the paper today claiming they didn't break the rules by travelling to SI from Auckland. And a chap got tested after his Northland trip.
There are more than a million people in L3, and another couple mill in L2 in the North Island. Even essential travel is likely to spread some cases down here while daily rates are this high.
I'm involved with a local theatre in Dunedin, and operationally we're fucked badly even under L2. Sustained negative cashflow is a worrying thing, for sure.
But waiting until we have detected cases before limiting the ability of those cases to spread is like waiting until you have covid before getting the jab, or waiting until you're about to be in an accident before putting your seatbelt on. There's a good chance you'll be too late to get the effect.
The sooner we stop this crazy "vaccinate to protect others" nonsense, rather than "vaccinate for your own health" the better imo.
Yes, vaccinating mostly healthy adults in order to protect the part of the population with the best immunity and who will be least affected, is as stupid as it sounds.
"When some Teachers and health workers think their “right” to avoid a harmless jab, overrides the rights of their students, patients or fellow staff to remain well. Should they be in the job?"
Yes, this is where I think the debate should be. I'd like to hear the views of the people who are avoiding vaccinations on this point. We hear their views on anything but this, and I doubt we'll get anywhere until we do know what they think about the rights of the kid with asthma, or the one with the mum who is sick, or the one whose dad is worn out from his work in the hospital looking after covid patients.
Fran, think back over our history and look at the special powers that governments have had in the past, especially in war time, and never got used then or since. There have always been emergency powers. There have always been courts. There have always been elections. WE have had epidemics, wars, depressions, emergencies in the past.
You ask the question- what rights will we as citizens be left with?
One only should suffice- universal suffrage.
We don't like what has happened, we vote them out. The laws get changed, the regulations revoked,
There is one interesting question for me, though. What changes, what attitudinal shift, what social mores will alter after the pandemic?
How will it affect our group thinking, since we have all faced a common enemy and seen our interdependence on each other, rich or poor, whatever suburb we live in (David Seymour take note).
We may see that inequity threarens us all and come to see that a fairer society is a safer society as well.
Surely yr enthusiasm for just needing a vote is a little naive or misguided.
Lobbyists acting for interests with deep pockets shoots that 'one person one vote' to smithereens.
I didn't vote for compulsory medication last election.
As to the future relationships I would love to buy your narrative but I don't see it. My son's 19 yr old girlfriend works in retail. The middle class are not shy of demanding to know her vaccination status half a dozen times a day.
Hopefully she is wearing a mask and that her employer has plans in place to encourage the uptake of the vaccination. I think, as a bare minimum, public facing people in shops etc should be vaccinated but if not at least wear masks.
I believe that there is a selling point of having a completely vaxxed staff, if allowed under HR legislation. Retail needs us and many will go to those places that are mask wearing and/or vaxxed.
Neither did I. I also did not know that we were going to have the different /difficult to deal with Delta variant.
I also don't buy the middle class stuff. We should not allow the uptake of the vaccination and the positivity of wearing a mask to be side tracked by this.
I would go a little further than universal suffrage. Universal suffrage with MMP as a voting system as the minimum, although recognising that our first govt could bring in Human Rights legislation after an election.
Who voted for Covid?
Covid was unavoidable and maybe inevitable.
Mandatory medication has been chosen as if there is no other option.
gsays, one question. If as you say, "Lobbyists acting for interests with deep pockets shoots that 'one person one vote' to smithereens," why did you vote?
Sounds like an exercise in futility to this 'naive and misguided' person……..
Surely, at the least, voting gives licence to criticize.
That doesn't mean I can't acknowledge the rorts and short-comings eg 3 main parties allegedly in breach of election funding.
I go a little further. I vote, I criticize, I joined a party 50 years ago to create policy, I even stood for parliament twice. Now that might be seen as 'naive and misguided'. As Voltaire once pronounced, on another activity it must be added, "Once is philosophy, but twice is perversion."
For all those people who complain that the government has got no real power, and for all those people who say that the government has got too much power- well, at least one side has got it wrong.
If there is no real power in government, then why does the Right contest so hard. Surely they'd just leave it all to their "deep pockets"?
Clearly there is power in government, witness mandated vaccines.
There also has to be power in lobbyists and vested interests. Fishing boats and their disgraceful practices. There has been opposition to cameras on boats for years and it hasn't come from the electorate.
Sincerely, well done on standing for parliament, more courage of yr convictions than I. I stood unsuccessfully for BOT of our local school. Too much of a fragile ego to do that again.
Nandor Tanzcos (I think) observed he was more influential out of parliament than in it.
Thanks, gsays. My friends said I was better off out of it. But the experience of standing was mostly satisfying- even the nutters were entertaining. But even then, before the decade of dirty politics, there were serious lies of a personal nature. One of the nicer ones was that I had two drug convictions…… (Two sounds far more convincing than one!)
mac 1 there were terrible lies put out by a group. Some ended up in court. Sadly those who do this at arms length but overlooked revealing photos of them with these people became known. Cheers, we definitely need those who stand for public service regardless of the pitfalls.
mac 1, 1.3.4
Orwell, enough said.
37 years ago, FW, and waiting……..
For prophecies of doom I much prefer Yeats and The Second Coming. Shorter, more poetic and written during the time of the Spanish Flu Epidemic.
FFS. What's with all this crazy hysterical nonsense?
When the pandemic ends all our normal rights will be resumed. If you think otherwise, you're living in Cloud Cuckoo Land. As it stands the lives of people are at serious risk – including your life Fran – and that must take precedence over all else.
If you and others can't see that then I suggest you go see a head-shrink.
LOL, yes Europe has seen how easy that is.
No they haven't because the pandemic is far from over. 🙄
what makes you think the pandemic will end?
NZ was this close to removing privacy rights from a whole class of people before the last election. It boggles my mind that lefties haven't seen the erosion of rights in the last 40 years. They're being chipped away at. The issue here isn't whether the laws now are needed (they are), it's the cultural shifts happening that will mean more laws like this will be passed more easily as we go along. We've seen this since 9/11 in particular.
A specific example here: the covid app data won't be used for non-covid things. This is policy, the protection isn't written into law. You might trust Labour on this, I sure as hell don't trust NACT (being part of the class they were trying to remove rights from). Why won't Labour put the protection in law?
The pandemic will be over – one day. It might not be in my life-time but it will happen. See Spanish Flu 1918.
oh that's alright then 😉
You said,
Are you ok removing rights for now and reinstating for people who are around after you die? It doesn't really work like that.
It often does, though. EG Britain during WW2 vs 1955, and the restrictions around the aforementioned Spanish Flu.
The funny thing is the debates about masks and lockdowns are almost identical between the latter and now, and they didn't have vaccines or testing or ventilators.
Look Facebook took more rights away than most. Phones… all the gadgets.
Face it, if we put our tea our holiday and more online…..????
FB took away privacy rights, so the left can give away even more, this time to the state? Are you really arguing that? Do you know what National were doing before the 2017 election?
Chilling was my response.
I have a little more empathy for the fringe element who predicted this compulsion ages ago.
One upside is it reveals the closeted authoritarians and confirms the ones who were 'out'.
Name calling is not a desirable trait.
C'mon ref, where have you been the last year?. There has been lots of name calling and slurs that have gone uncommented upon. Not against your team perhaps?
I am really surprised how much this has shaken me, so may have to be forgiven the occasional outburst.
I'd say if a teacher is anti vax they arnt intelligent enough to teach
In a nutshell as usual bw.
Imagine though, instead of being the leader in front of a class of kids they can spend their time at home.
They can then be an oracle to the whole world on online forums. Ironically, that would automatically put them in the position of being an expert at education and schooling.
My 2 cents : I'm getting tired of all the anti vax rubbish and being locked down too. I have been and am under treatment of a world leading and renowned Professer of Medicine. Ive trialed experimental drugs for him and now enjoy the cure; along with millions of others, his work bought about. Hes not tied to big Pharma, in the early days he sent me along to a herbalist to help with the effects of my disease. He recommends the vaccine and I'll take his advice before any body elses reckons. Get vaccinated.
As an aside for anyone putting it off because of fear of needles just think of how many more jabs you'll be getting if you get the virus.
Is that Ed Gane?
you betcha. Be over 20 years of life hes given me next month.
This whole situation is about trust. Well done Bruce, many happy returns of the years.
We have a caring Government and this latest meme of 'loss of rights" is silly.
In this situation planning is ongoing and must to try to overcome huge difficulties. In these circumstances vaccine is required. If the member chooses against it ok. No-one will force them.
I have a background in patient rights and alternative health communities. There are many people who have been harmed by mainstream medicine. The issue here isn't that msm is safe (there are always risks with medications and vaccines), it's how to help people make good risk assessments. Telling people to ignore their own experience and knowledge base and follow yours is just not going to work.
Hi Weka, I apologise if my plea to get vaccinated came across as a bit bossy. I must admit I was annoyed when i posted having just read a plea to do the opposite based on mere reckons. I had hoped by sharing my experience from a reputable source may help others make good risk assessments.
Many many many more people have been helped by mainstream medicine. As Elvis Costello says 'Accidents will Happen.' As long as the aim is true
I would be interested in the results of anyone who has tried muscle testing (reflexology) the vaccine. And I feel healing energy, prana, orgone or similar is of little use when the tiger ( virus ) is chewing of your arm.
So for me the vaccine provides a solution but for it to work everyone must be on board and I feel sharing my experience can help with that.
It does seem that people who have a lot of faith in msm are helped by that belief. I suspect there is some strong placebo in addition to the RCT style processes around drugs and other treatments. This isn't me dissing msm, I think that's all a good thing. I'm glad for you that it's worked really well for you, I know msm kept my father alive for many more years than he would have otherwise.
Thing is though, the people who are harmed, are a crossover with those who are vax hesitant. They know the short comings of msms, and telling them the vaccine is harmless or that we should just trust the scientists and doctors doesn't work for similar reasons as to why muscle testing or chi kung wouldn't work for you. You have to meet people where they are. Many people at the moment seem to believe that forcing their beliefs on others will yield good results, but when has that every worked out well?
I agree that we need as many people on board with the vaccine as possible if we want to prevent disaster in NZ. The argument is about how we do that, get as many people on board as possible. Ostracisation, meanness, ridicule, force, sophistry and fudging the truth are not the best approaches if we want a high vax rate.
btw, afaik muscle testing has no empirical support (but it's maybe still a useful tool in some individual settings). Energy work like chi kung I think would be an excellent adjunct to getting vaccinated, and might help some of the hesitant people get on board. Would love to know if China and other Asian countries are integrating those methods. I know the Chinese have been doing work on TCM and herbal medicine alongside msm in treating covid infections.
I read about this a while ago but have not seen follow up.
https://www.herbalgram.org/resources/herbalgram/issues/129/table-of-contents/hg129-wnews-thai-andro-cov19/
Good that they have now located the second woman that travelled up North. And it sounds like she has Covid symptoms. It's interesting that neither have been named like the Wanaka couple, as she may have been located sooner if public knew who it was.
I hope they are charged in some way as they have caused so much damage to Northland.
Covid 19 Delta outbreak: Race between 'vaccine and virus' as Auckland stays in level 3 – NZ Herald
I’m guessing they will be charged with something, but that name suppression will be granted, possibly permanently, by da judge, in view of the vitriol (and possibly other things) both individuals would likely have hurled at them if their identities were revealed.
What is now important is the locations of interest, testing, contact tracing and following the level 3 restrictions.
I suppose the usual political stirring will take place.
I would like to know how the opposition would handle such a situation when a person chooses to remain silent?
Thumbscrews?
I was going to say waterboarding.
The opposition would have no problem with the woman not talking.
It's one they support, National as shown through the Todd Barclay saga, Act through their belief in invividual choice.
@ Treetop (2.2) … Stretching on a rack! Crucifixion perhaps!
" It's interesting that neither have been named like the Wanaka couple"
TBF the Wanaka couple weren't named (well apart from on Facebook gossip). They came out and named themselves
They didn't name themselves.
They were caught.
Originally got name suppression, which they had to withdraw under pressure from others that were being mis identified as them.
They didn't have to withdraw.
And the hype around them was ridiculous and totally out of proportion, given no one seems to give a toss about some of the other antics people are getting up to.
Priviledged people who should have known better.
Deserved all they got.
I agree though, that antics like Collins running around Queenstown unmasked, when she was from Auckland, for no good reason, should have caused more attention.
Exactly. Totally agree
Who’s “Jacinda’s mate with the stupid hair”?
Siouxsie Wiles? How she spells Suzy might be stupid, but her hair isn’t. Done more to boost her public image than anything else, imo. And she didn’t break the rules, her friend did, IIRC?
As Siouxsie Wiles grew up in the UK, I bet her parents were fans of the UK rockband Siouxsie and the Banshees – Siouxsie Sioux was the lead singer.
Yes. Highly likely, I agree.
Are you saying one law for all?
Chris T – There's no 's' in Te Reo.
Apologies.
I am actually a bit embarrassed I didn't realise that.
Raining quite heavily; looks like it’ll be a pluvial day. Stream’s up a foot or two and flooding dirty brown. No eel feeding today.
I very rarely needed to mow my lawns when the pooks visited my back yard several times a day. They liked trimming & eating the grass.
Altho the younger ones, once they learned how to fly up onto the fence & down again onto my lawn, invariably had to be shrieked at quite a few times "No! No pulling out grass! Just trimming". It often took up to a fortnight of daily doing my block at newbies to get them to learn that "shearing" the grass was ok, but pulling out clumps of it was definitely NOT!
Do you have any fruit trees on your lawn? And if you have, do you get any of it? I got very over pukekos when living next to them. We had a flock of around 100 living in the paddocks around our house. We get more fruit from the 5 fruit trees we have now where we live than from the 30 trees we had on the farm.
Only a lemon tree, Macro. They don’t like lemons.
I’m fortunate that that apart from their visits to my back yard they basically live in the stream & on the stream banks, & spend most of their day foraging up & down the stream. There’s plenty of kai, & lotsa variety, for them there.
All they were getting at my place was “treats” of wheat grains, & Molenberg bread chunks (so I could enjoy watching them eat bread holding it in their “hands” – i.e. with their long, very dextrous talons).
"looks like it’ll be a pluvial day."
Oh dear. You have been reading one of Geoffrey Palmer's books haven't you? He was, of course, the man who described his homeland as "New Zealand is an irreducably pluvial country.".
Now you are using that word, just to show how literate you are I suspect.
I suspect Gezza has come across that word just as I did. As children we learned the word pluvial very early on as events that my Dad organised, A & P shows and Racing days had to have pluvial insurance. We always lost the low table in our bedroom at the time of the A & P show as judges used it to stand the dogs on for judging.
And of course Geoffrey Palmer's use is a delight.
Those who seem to delight in putting others down or damning with faint praise, as far as language is concerned always remind me of the quote from Issac Asimov
“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”
I wasn't meaning to disparage Gezza. However, reading the last sentence I wrote I can see how it can come across that way. To Gezza – I apologise.
I have a rather similar memory about A & P shows. I had an Uncle who used to come and judge livestock at the local show. He would come and stay with my family and I would lose my bed for a couple of nights. Not quite the same as having your table take pride of place during the judging of course.
That was a long time ago of course. Now the farmers don't go any more and the Show is really just for the townies.
No worries. Can't remember now if it was my Latin or French teacher who taught us the word.
How soporific alwyn. Hint.. it's from Peter Rabbit.
Are you really up to reading Peter Rabbit?
You seemed more like someone who had reached your intellectual limit with the Teletubbies.
Alwyn, I gather you never read to your children/grandchildren ?
I think alwyn is so suitably rebuked that any reply would be lachrymose.
Yes indeed with the visitors. We always had to give our visitors our bed/s or topped and tailed.
A couple of years ago I dropped my cousin aged 72 at the time, at her daughters place to stay overnight. I was amazed when I picked her up the next day, to find that her daughter had put her mother on a mattress on the floor so she did not have to move any of the three children 9,8 5 from their beds. I was gob-smacked.
A & P shows still do have an attraction for rural folk in the smaller places. I agree that those within striking distance of a city or larger town the 'townies' do go.
.
Didn't the Propeller-Head say something similar as PM when 'comforting' flood victims c1990 … something like: "But what none of you seem to understand is that New Zealand is, by its very nature, a highly pluvial Country" … in the process highlighting just how conspicuously he lacked the common touch ?
[Note: maybe it was as Deputy PM during Cyclone Bola 1988 ?]
Excitedly playing his trumpet as he pranced around the outer ring of the top floor of the Beehive in a very early Ep of Holmes, euphorically anticipating the arrival of his hero, clarinettist Acker Bilk, didn’t help his populist image any either … I remember just shaking my head as I watched … worth 50k votes to Bolger-Richardson.
Who’s the “propeller head”? Sir Geoffrey Palmer?
One of the advantages of my 34 years in the Public Service was that I was able to move around a lot, filling a number of roles, nearly all of which involved a great deal of writing, but in various different styles, from very formal English, to quasi-legal writing, to semi-technical IT user requirements, to policy manuals, to very plain, easily understandable English in forms & leaflets where the onus was on simplicity & accuracy.
Even today I find it relatively easy to adapt my writing & speaking styles to suit a particular audience or individual, if I can be bothered to put a bit of effort in. But I can also be damned lazy about it when I’m not being paid.
Regarding MIQ and the selfish few who wish to jump the queue, I should think everyone would have a story to say why they should get back.
I don't think the lottery model is good however, perhaps it should be more like going for a blood test, get a number and wait till you become head of the queue
Pretty good interview by Kim Hill with the Big yin from this morning.
Parkinson's sucks man
RNZ Audio Player
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/saturday/audio/2018815700/sir-billy-connolly-a-windswept-and-interesting-life
[full link added - weka]
Thanks Chris T, I'm a big fan. He is one of my hero's.
We loved that and thanks Chris T/ Weka.
Enjoyed listening to that. Billy doesn't let his Parkinsons get him down. A man who's loved his life & wouldn't really change any of it.
I'll probably be rolling my eyes at the vegan propaganda side of this, but otherwise it looks exciting, feature length doco on the NZ dairy industry, with some heavy hitting names backing it. Not sure when it's being released.
https://twitter.com/MilkedFilm/status/1445887197060616193
It's been released. Didn't notice vegan propaganda. It's about the dairy industry as it says. I saw it as a 5 or so part series. Cant remember who ran it tho. Maybe Prime
Prime have it for rent/buy although I couldn't see immediately if that was allowed from NZ. It's not on Prime streaming (from NZ).
Premiering in NZ in November,
https://twitter.com/MilkedFilm/status/1447350084828491782
Thank you for sharing. Looks like an important film.
Will check on Prime or wait till November.
cough cough, Putlockernewsite, cough cough.
nope
No worries. Can't remember now if it was my Latin or French teacher who taught us the word.
Latin I expect.
History and Etymology for pluvial
Adjective
Latin pluvialis, from pluvia rain, from feminine of pluvius rainy, from pluere to rain
Interesting stuff etymology.
il fait pleut – it's raining (French)
plein na – it's raining (Khmer – from memory).
I think you’re right.
My Latin teacher was nicknamed Cabbage. He was an arrogant, sarcastic bastard & we loathed each other. I dropped Latin for 6th Form History as soon as I could.
He also taught us the English word perambulate … to walk or travel through or round a place or area, especially for pleasure and in a leisurely way.
From the Latin per … all over, & ambulare … to walk.
That puts to my mind a story a cop told me once, about a witness in a trial. The witness had limited English skill, not so much that a translator was needed but still learning the second language. Anyway, the prosecution asks the witness to describe the incident, and the witness talks about how he was "proceeding down this street" and "proceeded to see" yadda yadda yadda.
The use of the word "proceeding" in a repeated manner raised a few eyebrows, so the defense almost immediately begins cross examination with the word, asking him about whether the witness normally uses it. Even the cop was beginning to second guess whether someone had coached the witness.
"My English language class is on Monday nights, and I use the new words as much as possible. We learnt 'proceeding' this week". lol
From which we get 'pram' I guess. Wot one pushes a baby in.
Heh.
One doesn't push the baby. The pram gets pushed. The baby's in the pram.
I'll shuddup now
Yup. 👍🏼 Correct.
Pram is just a colloquial contraction of perambulator.
Peregrination is pretty appealing, eh, Peregrin Took!
“A journey, especially a long or meandering one.”
IIRC, fourth form geography.
I would love to hear Bill's take on the mandated vaccines.
He often articulated unease I had about issues, only more articulate and with good imagination.
I know he popped up recently and I trust he is keeping good health.
I wait with baited breath a comment from whoever the opposition finance spokespeople are.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/453386/govt-books-2020-2021-financial-statements-show-deficit-of-4-point-6-billion
Both Goldsmith (8 billion) and Joyce (14 billion) didn't think treasuries (10 billion over 6 months) forecasting error was that worthy of comment.
Sudden stratospheric warming underway in Antarctica,Southern annular mode switched negative,and vortex breaks down.
Bring your Kale into the barns.
http://ds.data.jma.go.jp/tcc/tcc/products/clisys/STRAT/gif/pole10_sh.gif
https://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/daily_ao_index/aao/aao_index.html
Ouch. If this follows Northern Hemisphere patterns, we may well be swept with Antarctic cool while the Antarctic warms. And a whole lot of muppets will say, "How can the planet possible be warming??"
Earthquake Top of the South 2:55. About 10 seconds.
"Weak" 5.1 mag, 80 km north of French Pass, according to Geonet.
Felt a sizeable single jolt, rattled the house, here in North Welly.
Oh look we have a surplus again! Virtual surplus, based on the gains of government properties, but hey, surely the bank will loan on that equity right? Or maybe we already have buyers?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/surplus-inches-closer-as-government-books-billions-of-dollars-on-rising-property-values/YD4F7N3P3D7P6TKQGAZGFVEKEI/
This reminds me of a day in 1997, when then Finance Minister Theo Waigel of Germany re-evaluated the Gold reserves held by hte German Government to qualify Germany for European economic and monetary union. Suddenly all the criteria was met, and well the rest is history. Lol
https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB864581478643282000
Surplus! Surplus!
yei yei hey hey
Surplus!
Treasury prefers it that way. Please keep focusing on the bottom line. Please also ignore the $10 billion (over 6 months) forecasting error. Additionally please don't understand that if the govt had spent an additional 10 billion in the last 6 months treasury already vetted the impacts of that on other economic variables as being fine. And for heavens sake do not realise that an eventual surplus of $N involves those $N being paid out of NZers savings and debt levels.
Never mind. The Rich will always engineer it so that we others experience an income deficit surge…
This may have been covered here before (there's a lot to read on all the Open Mikes!) but anyway, it's worth a repeat.
A quick and easy game (less than 5 mins) where you get to make all the Covid decisions in government (h/t Newshub). And then you have to deal with the consequences … Link here:
https://www.kiaoramrwills.com/COVID-19.html
It's unduly pessimistic on the numbers IMO, but never mind. It's a useful reminder that every option, from full opening up to tanks on the streets, would have repercussions. A few commentators should try it and test their empty reckons.
Happy to report that as PM I got the R number right down and saved the country. Unfortunately this cost me my job …
See if you can do better.
Good fun – this PM went down fighting. Maybe managing NZ's response to the pandemic isn't as easy as the armchair critics reckon.
Aside from “not being Judith” what has Labour achieved since coming to power?
Journey back with me to 2017- a bright eyed Jacinda made her first promise as leader of the Labour party to bring light rail from the CBD to the Airport by 2021. Now I just checked my calendar and we have 81 days left until 2021 comes to an end. Last time I checked 0.00 metres of track have been laid. The workers are going to have to pull out a few big shifts to accomplish this promise!
Diving deeper into the 2017 manifesto quickly over my morning cup of tea…
Nurses in all high schools … last time I checked (and I do have an OIA request in to get the official number) this wasn’t started?
Kiwibuild – remember the good old days of Kiwibuild? Promise of 1,000 homes built in the first year increasing to 5,000 built in 2019 and then the lofty goal of 10,000 per year from 2020. Grand total we should be at based on just these numbers- 26K by the end of this year. Last number report = 1,169 as at August 2021. The positive here is that they have ticked off the first years goal… over three years in…
Skypath (no not a new Bond movie…)- another great promise from 2017 where we were going to get a bike and pedestrian crossing for (what now seems like a bargain price) $30M. Fast forward to 2021 and we have no progress but have spent over $50M on another version of the crossing that has been put on the scrap heap! Clap. Clap.
Remember the great headline generating quote that tackling climate change was “my generation's nuclear-free moment." Plaudits flowed around the world. Then reality struck- this year we imported more coal for power generation than any year previous. It is purely a coincidence that Megan woods basically closed down the natural oil and gas industry in NZ overnight back in 2018.
Lucky we have a Government with a strong track record on prudent spending to see us through this massive amount of debt we’ve taken on to get the country through COVID though right? Right? They only spend money on quality projects such as funding a series of collaborative quilts for Jess Jonhson and her Mother… sure it is only $17,850 right? Noting that someone on $80K per year would pay $17K in income tax so basically paid tax the entire year for Jess to make some quilts with her Mum… very nice.
So – the end of my rant… National is a shambles, we get that. But is this really what you want to support? Aside from slogans about kindness and team of five million… what has Jacinda and Labour achieved? What will their legacy be? And when Jacinda moves on… who is actually there to take up the leadership?
The two main parties in NZ politics have shown us they can achieve… nothing. What can the alternative be?
Sounds like you've bought into talking points from the taxpayers' onion.
Labour have fallen short in various areas, but if you want a serious debate you'll need better lines than somehow linking NZ's low debt with Jess Johnson.
Cancelled National Parties tax bracket moves and increased Working for Families and Accommodation Supplements substantially
Added a new tax bracket for the very high income earners
Bright line test extended
Property losses ringfenced
Property interest deduction reduced
Overseas investment in property mostly banned
Increased benefit rates by the most seen in a generation (still work to do of course)
Indexed benefits to average wage increases rather than CPI
Introduced Winter Energy Payment
Free lunches in schools
Increased Student Allowances
Fees free scheme (1st year at tertiary institutes, free apprenticeships)
Restored adult night class funding
Kainga Ora building more than 2,000 houses/year
Improved tenancy legislation by eliminating no-fault terminations by landlords
Credit contract reform
Increased minimum wage to $20
Extended paid parental leave to 26 weeks (from 18)
Increased sick leave to 10 days p.a.
Matariki
Improved Employment Relations Act – union delegates now specifically protected, collective agreements must include pay, 90 day trial removed for medium and large employers, breaks reinstated
Pay equity legislation and settlements e.g. social workers, admin workers, teacher aides, nurses and ECE teachers coming, others in the pipelines
Feebates for electric cars
Reduction in prisoner numbers by over 15%
Restored voting rights for prisoners with less than 3 year sentences (I think that's a net positive, but acknowledge that others will disagree)
That's some off the top of my head, I'm sure there are others. Still, other than what must be close to the lowest Covid death rate in the world and a negative excess mortality rate, what they done for us lately?
🙂
That’s quite an impressive list. Gonna copy & keep that.
………………………………………….
“Reduction in prisoner numbers by over 15%”
………………………………………….
Yes, but what’s happening with the crime rate? This info seems hard to come by.
My “impression” from reporting – and from personal experience of some youth offenders were intimidating shopkeepers & stealing from local dairies, and another group who smashed 5 local car windows trying to steal cars, including mine – is that it’s increasing.
Correction: I found this, although it's for December 2020:
https://www.police.govt.nz/sites/default/files/publications/crime-at-a-glance-dec2020.pdf.
Some crime's gone down; violent crime's increasing.
Fair, although the comment points out that there are new family violence offences introduced in Dec 2018 (so by Labour) which has seen an increase in the recording of serious assaults (the new offences were strangulation and assault on a person in a family relationship).
True, Craig. Altho interestingly I found my from that link somehow to a more up to date Police "Snapshot" which picked up that I'm in Wellington & which shows crime stats for Welly are mostly showing increases:
Sorry, pic’s too big to all fit, though half the page is only a hi-level map of Wellington.
The date range for that Wellington Crime “Snapshot” is Sep 2020 to Aug 2021.
For some people an 'all bets are off the table' while we deal with Covid approach to govt is what they are focussing on. Kudos for them will come based on that.
For many the idea of looking at a 2017 manifesto will seem a delightful 'those were the days exercise.' Possibly looking at the 2017 manifesto and what was achieved prior to Feb 2020 would be a fairer way of looking at it.
When reading the list from Craig Hall 14.2 I am heartened that other aspects are/have been dealt with and know that work will be ongoing in many govt depts, not linked to the covid response to investigate, and bring up policy matters to Govt. Ministers will still be focussing on ideas/policies in their portfolios.
Lukas, go to this web site for a list of Labour's achievements up to May this year. Far too long to list.
https://www.labour.org.nz/our-record