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Open mike 14/06/2019

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, June 14th, 2019 - 199 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

199 comments on “Open mike 14/06/2019 ”

  1. reason 1

    Using bent corrupt courts to lock up the most popular politician in the country stinks to high heaven …. and it makes mad dog Bolsonaro and his right wing thugs the most illegitimate Govt in South America …. I wonder if the Bank of England will steal their gold .

    it becomes apparent that his speeches against corruption are nothing but empty words. From the allies arrayed alongside Bolsonaro during his first speech as president-elect to the transition team he assembled and the governmental department heads he’s appointed, Bolsonaro picked at least seven people tangled up in scandals, from lawsuits and official investigations to criminal convictions and even confession of guilt.


  2. Sanctuary 3


    National's solution for shit pay for shit jobs that no one wants – import third world labour. Not put pay up, or anything that might actually raise the wages and living standards of Kiwis, just do what the squatocracy demands.

    National, coming up with friendly solutions for the boss class and it cow cocky mates that f**k the working man over since forever.

    • The Chairman 3.1

      Yesterday, we had Jones talking about bringing in forestry workers from overseas.


      • mauī 3.1.1

        🙄 Yeah New Zealand First has decided to rebrand and call itself Immigration First…

        • The Chairman

          Yes, they are undermining themselves, the Government and the local potential benefits of the scheme itself. While further adding to housing and other local infrastructure demand.

          • OnceWasTim

            I guess they could take the approach of one or two orchard owners (or their contractors and sub-contractors – just enough levels of out-sourcing to allow a distancing of responsibility). As far as housing goes anyway. Shove up a tin shack or two onsite with a few bunks, and just enough gaps to let the rats in, and charge like an angry bull in rent. It'd be a win win sitch. The work would get done, and just as long as those natives had their visas tied to the specific employer that's giving them such a great opportunity, there'd be no question of a challenge.

            Could even jack up the standard warning alert system when the Labour Inspectors were in town – even the ones like a Casson anxious to get some of that "scum" can't seem to beat it

  3. johnm 4

    Julian Assange's extradition order is signed by Sajid Javid

    • johnm 4.1

      New Zealand protest opposes persecution of Julian Assange and Australian journalists


      Stardust • 11 hours ago

      Many thanks to all the participants of the demonstration in New Zealand, opposing the persecution of Assange and Australian journalists; and the WSWS reporters for this valuable report.

      Please note, the US Department of Justice is preparing to file additional charges against the WikiLeaks publisher Julian Assange on top of the 18 charges under the Espionage Act already brought against him potentially carrying 175 years imprisonment. The charges will be revealed during the 3rd extradition hearing this Friday 14th of June.

      Join the protest organised by JADC in support of Julian Assange at this Hearing outside Westminster Magistrates Court, 181 Marylebone Road, London, NW1 5BR from 9am in the morning. The nearest tube station is Edgware Road (on District and Circle Lines) or Marylebone (Bakerloo Line).

      The proceedings will take place via video link at Court 3, which only has 10 seats available at the public gallery.

      Watch the wonderful interview UN Rapporteur for Torture Nils Melzer gave to Chris Hedges about Julian Assange’s situation. https://www.youtube.com/wat

      Peters said democratic rights, such as freedom of information and free speech, were under attack in every country, because they were “not compatible with endless war and endless attacks on living standards.”

      He added that the New Zealand Labour Party-led government of Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern had remained completely silent on the police raids in Australia, for the same reason it had refused to defend Assange: “That is, the alliance with US imperialism, which has been strengthened under Ardern. New Zealand troops are remaining in Iraq and Afghanistan at least another year and $20 billion is being spent on the military so it can integrate more effectively in US-led operations.”

      The New Zealand state-run and corporate media, Peters said, had either remained silent on the persecution of Assange or actively joined in the global campaign to smear his character.

      • Herodotus 4.1.1

        in our local area there are a couple of spur wings nesting in a fenced off area.

        just a note not sure if it is I am More aware of this species but they seem to be quite plentiful.

  4. bwaghorn DJ 5

    Middle of June 5 kms from mount ruapehu the black birds are singing like its spring I'm working in short sleeves its getting weird out here.

  5. The Chairman 6

    Speaking of Jones, Shane Jones won't say how many full-time, long-term jobs have been created under the $3 billion Provincial Growth Fund.

    When recently questioned on this, Jones replied, "I find when these questions come up it reminds me of someone popping pimples."

    Answering an important question in this manner undermines the Government's credibility and ultimately, it's leadership.

    A credibility (which in this regard) is already on thin ice. Back in February, MBIE revealed it had based the job creation figures on the estimates provided by the applicants (not the actual jobs created) with no work undertaken to assess whether the claims were credible.

    • Drowsy M. Kram 6.1

      Chair, you say that the Government's "credibility (in this regard) is already on thin ice."

      Since you are, by your own admission, "more left than most", would you care to comment on the opposition's credibility (in any regard.)

      Just hoping for one objective critique of the National party – then you can get back to holding the Government to account in that unique "more left than most" way of yours.

      The Chairman @8
      Bad week for PM – ‘Budgetgate
      Winston prematurely announcing…
      Jones giving a stupid answer…
      undermining PGF, Government’s credibility, leadership
      Twyford accused covering up secret meetings.

      @MatthewHootonNZ Jun 9
      If you call the police & report your house was burgled, and then find out it wasn’t burgled (the kids took the stuff perfectly legally) then you are meant to call the cops immediately & tell them, not say “I can’t say anything about this because it’s a police matter”. #BudgetGate

      Curious that “#BudgetGate”

      • The Chairman 6.1.1

        If you were as left as me you would be more concerned about the damage being done to the lefts credibility rather than attempting to somewhat justify it (or distract from it) by suggesting National's credibility should also be questioned.

        If Labour are going to allow the number of new jobs to be counted in such a lax manner in such a major scheme, it won't be long before people start asking what else is the Government allowing to be counted in such a negligent manner? Which will ultimately come back to its leadership. And Labour can't afford to have Jacinda politically damaged. So she needs to get on top of this ASAP.

        • Drowsy M. Kram

          "National's credibility should also be questioned" – thanks Chair, much appreciated.

          Agree that it's legitimate to question the integrity of both the Government and the National-led opposition. Who do you think should be questioning National's credibility? Might you, as one who is "more left than most", have a role to play?

          #HoldingNationalToAccount ?

          damage being done to the lefts credibility
          Government allowing to be counted in such a negligent manner”
          Jacinda politically damaged
          Jacinda will be called upon to show some (leadership)

          • The Chairman

            While people, the media and the Government are free to question National's credibility, considering the going-ons, the Government's focus should be on getting their own house in order, which we've yet to see.

            If the overwhelming number of voters thought National was credible they would potentially be the Government now. If Labour want to maintain being in Government, they need to address their lacking credibility now.

            • Drowsy M. Kram

              IMHO Labour are currently more credible than National. If your blinkered critiques of the Government accurately reflect your political 'vision', then it's no wonder that you can't see that this credibility gap is widening.

              Maybe your increasingly desperate one-eyed critiques are damaging your "more left than most" credibility on this site. Tbh I see no evidence that you are a friend of the left, and zero evidence that you disapprove of National party policies and MP behaviour, either in Government or in opposition, again IMHO.

              • The Chairman

                IMHO Labour are currently more credible than National.

                The way I see it, with National the left know we are screwed.

                Whereas, Labour come on friendly, then stab you in the back once obtaining power.

                Many on the left see it like this. And for that reason, many no longer vote.

                Ponder this:

                If the number of people that don't vote start to exceed the number that do, can we still claim we live in a democracy?

                • Incognito

                  That’s a fine example of binary thinking to ponder with a rather arbitrary conditional state. Assuming we (still) live in a democracy, the question is or should be whether it functions as well as it can or should. This is an open question IMO because democracy is not a fixed concept but something that can evolve over time.

      • Psycho Milt 6.1.2

        Curious that “#BudgetGate”

        Not at all. "The Chairman" exists to peddle National Party talking points from a supposedly left-wing perspective, so it's no surprise the account would phrase things the same way Hooton does.

      • Gabby 6.1.3

        I just wonder why Hootie Blowhard is speshly keen that no crime happened…

  6. johnm 7


    Kevin and Guy were joined by meteorologist Nick Humphrey for this pre-recorded show. We discussed the links between climate change, weather, and crop failures. You can support Nick via his Patreon page.

    • Pat 7.1

      a matter of fact discussion with some interesting information about impacts particularly in the US….and as noted at the end, not the narrative we will recieve from any government

  7. The Chairman 8

    A bad week for the PM.

    Along with Budgetgate. She had Winston prematurely announcing the teachers settlement. Jones giving a stupid answer to a serious employment question undermining the Provincial Growth Fund, the Government's credibility and ultimately, its leadership. And Twyford being the latest minister accused of covering up secret meetings.

    • Robert Guyton 8.1

      "A bad week for the PM"

      Please try to contain your joy, Chair.

      It's unbecoming.

      And misplaced.

      And makes you sound like Eeyore.

      Aside from that, all good!

    • Stuart Munro. 8.2

      That'll be the polls. Winston'll have done the math that he needs to make noise if he means to be re-elected. The Jones spendup doesn't seem to have pulled the punters in yet. With the Gnats promising carte blanche to exploit cheap foreign labour you'd think Winston wouldn't be short of things to have a crack at, but of course he chiefly picks up disgruntled voters, so the PMs habit of leaving people gruntled feels like an existential threat.

      • The Chairman 8.2.1

        That'll be the polls. Winston'll have done the math that he needs to make noise if he means to be re-elected.

        Indeed. But undermining the Government he is apart of, isn't the right way to go about it.

        With the Gnats promising carte blanche to exploit cheap foreign labour you'd think Winston wouldn't be short of things to have a crack at…

        Winston can't really have a crack at that when Jones is suggesting similar and with Labour also considering similar.

        • Stuart Munro.

          "undermining the Government he is apart of, isn't the right way to go about it"

          I suspect the internal logic goes something like – "sitting here waiting for it to happen ain't going to happen either".

          Winston may have to rein Jones in a little – endorsing a serial exploiting employer for the NZTA and conspiring to import even more cheap labour won't play well with contemporary 1st supporters.

          • The Chairman

            Importing offshore labour etc won't sit well with many NZF voters indeed, Stuart.

            And the way he has been failing to answer questions, Jacinda is going to have to have a word with him too.

            At this stage, it seems the Provincial Growth Fund is heading the same way as Kiwibuild.

            And the sad thing is, these two main policies had (and still have if they can get them right) real potential to vastly improve our nation.

            • Drowsy M. Kram

              Chair, does the National party have "real potential to vastly improve our nation"?

              Interested in the opinion of someone who is "more left than most" – am I asking the 'right' person?

            • Stuart Munro.

              The real thing here is whether government sustains the effort until it succeeds. Kiwibuild can be made to work, though it seems that some of those tasked to implement it were not committed. Same goes for the PGF. But that doesn't mean that either will produce the desired results in a timely manner for the next election.

              On the other hand, the Gnats are busy cultivating their own personal version of internal withering and thus producing disaffected voters of the kind that traditionally support Winston.

              • The Chairman

                The Government needs to do more than just sustain current efforts on these to main policies, they also need to improve their implementation for them to have a better chance of succeeding.

                Moreover, if they want regional communities to genuinely prosper, they need to ensure decent jobs paying a living wage are being created. Ensuring the benefits are widely shared, thus resulting in a larger economic stimulus regionally.

                To date, there has been a lot of handouts to the private sector in both schemes and little to show for it. Time for the Government to get a little more hands on.

                As for desired results in a timely manner, the clock is ticking.

                • Stuart Munro.

                  I think that's probably true – but it flies in the face of neo-liberal public service norms, in which operational matters were surrendered to managers who were supposedly more professional. Changing back is fraught because it requires both much more work, but also the risk of politically dangerous failure. This is why the Key government chiefly did nothing – it avoids conspicuous failures in the short term.

                  • The Chairman

                    It flies in the face of neo-liberal public service norms

                    Indeed. Nevertheless, we have witnessed the results of the alternative resulting in Labour's housing reset.

                    Yes, it will require far more work from the Government's perspective, but it will give them the potential to have far more control in producing the desired results. Generally, there will always be risks in most things Government do, the competence is shown in mitigating them.

        • Incognito

          But undermining the Government he is apart of, isn't the right way to go about it. [my italics]

          Nice typo there.

    • Bearded Git 8.3

      Seven and a half long years to go Mr. Chairman

      • The Chairman 8.3.1

        Seven and a half long years to go Mr. Chairman

        Before they deliver anything of significance? smiley

        • Robert Guyton

          Before we're free of your relentlessly-soggy commentary.

          • Drowsy M. Kram

            Alas, The Chairman's comments were relentlessly soggy (nice) when the Labour & Green parties were in opposition – expecting The Chair to change 'their' tune if National regains the Treasury benches is admirable but hopelessly optimistic.

            Each comment by The Chair is in dire need of musical cheer, IMHO.

            The Chairman's Waltz

    • ankerawshark 8.4

      I don't think anyone is clocking what you are calling a bad week for the PM, Chairman.

      Just out of interest, are your paid or a volunteer?

      • The Chairman 8.4.1

        “I don't think anyone is clocking what you are calling a bad week for the PM, Chairman.”

        Really, well here is your chance to show me why you don't think the matters highlighted are resulting in a bad week for the PM.

        And no, I'm not paid to post here. Unlike many Kiwis, I partake in democracy, which is more than just voting every three years. Moreover, I'm a strong believer in the public driving change, which is reliant on people speaking up.

        • ankerawshark

          If Labour are going to allow the number of new jobs to be counted in such a lax manner in such a major scheme, it won't be long before people start asking what else is the Government allowing to be counted in such a negligent manner? Which will ultimately come back to its leadership. And Labour can't afford to have Jacinda politically damaged. So she needs to get on top of this ASAP.

          I don't recall seeing one article calling on Jacinda to show strong leaderenhip over the provincial fund. Saw a clip on the tele with Shane J being slightly defensive about his approach telling him the PM has told him to pull his head in (in a much kinder way than that). Stories of the week are 1. the polls, which look good for Jacinda 2. Simon still making stuff around the budget leak and there was clip in the news showing Ardern making mince meat out of him, 3, teachers resolved with higher pay (public support this). 4. stuff about housing, increase in state houses built, still negative stuff about Kiwibuild but 60% of kiwis support the scheme, Defence spending……..people have different points of views on this.

          Your article about no numbers on Provisional Growth fund all hypothetical, trying to manufacture ????? not sure what………I believe you are here to troll. I could be wrong

          • The Chairman

            Do you really need to see an article calling for Jacinda to show strong leadership over the provincial fund to realise she needs too? Are you happy for Jones to continue carrying on showing up the leader and undermining the Governments credibility? From what has been reported, it's clear she needs to show some leadership on this before it further undermines their credibility.

            While the polls look good for Jacinda, it's not good for us on the left wanting more. The better Labour poll, the less likely they are to listen. They already believe they have the balance about right, while many on the left disagree.

            News that has recently come out in regard to the Budget leak hasn't been good for Labour. Jacinda has now been implicated as knowing.

            And despite Winston's assertion, the dispute between teachers and the Government isn't settled yet.

            The report on the increase in state housing seems a desperate attempt to look as if something is being done when in reality the number of new state homes is nowhere near enough to address the current and growing demand.

            Nevertheless, the matters I highlighted above have all been reported, moreover, you have failed to show me why you don't think the matters highlighted above are resulting in a bad week for the PM.

            • McFlock

              "Us on the left".


            • The Al1en

              While the polls look good for Jacinda, it's not good for us on the left wanting more. The better Labour poll, the less likely they are to listen

              What a wank job that is. The other week you were banging on about how labour should be doing better and getting higher poll results. Now they have, you're changing the tune to 'if they poll high they won't listen'.

              Full of shit, mate. 🙄

              • The Chairman

                One poll has Labour going down while one has them going up.

                And as for my comments re Labour otentially doing better in the polls, you have used them out of context to try and claim a point – weak. I post plenty on here, therefore try pulling me up on something I actually said and keep it in context.

                • The Al1en

                  You said what I've posted above, about how labour should be getting higher poll numbers, and in no way is it out of context. I even made a joke about it in the topic before the two polls were released.

                  What you are doing, I guess, is trying to cause a smokescreen to hide the fact you've been caught out. Not convincing enough, by far.

                  • The Chairman

                    You said what I've posted above

                    Where? Provide a link so we can see the context.

                    Labour have gone up in one poll while disappointing many on the left. Explaining their slip in the other.

                    Where I've talked of labour going up in the polls the context was in regard with them doing more to win more support.

                    For example, if Labour delivered for more people in the Budget, it is logical to assume they would be polling higher now.

                    • The Al1en

                      Both those polls, even the one where they went down, showed the government advancing from national.

                      Both those polls, even the one where they went down, showed labour improved from election night '17.

                      The poll that put labour able to govern alone, over 50% they said, how much higher do you think they should be mid term?

                      Seems like they're doing fine in winning support, apart from as you state, "while disappointing many on the left. Explaining their slip in the other". I'd put money on any genuine lefty not being disappointed at the highly likely fact the prospect of labour not being a one term government is looking really good. The only people not happy with labour are the nats, the nat media, rim clingers and you.

        • McFlock

          Really, well here is your chance to show me why you don't think the matters highlighted are resulting in a bad week for the PM.

          Nobody cares except you and other irredeemable tories. The semantice of "hacking" vs "unauthorised access"? lol

          Shane Jones? No harm to the govt, and he's Winston's problem anyway. Lol

          Twyford is the only area of mild concern, and even that's offset by the stirling work on state house numbers. KB hasn't gone off well, for whatever reason, but that and anything else has negative has been largely ignored by the tories in favour of their parliamentary obsession with the semantic nature of soimon's legal transgression.

          • The Chairman

            While Shane Jones is largely Winstons problem he is also the public's (due to his position in Government and what he oversees) and Jacinda's (due to also being part of a Government she leads).

            He is best at home with his mates over at National.

            Twyford is the only area of mild concern, and even that's offset by the stirling work on state house numbers.

            Now that was a good laugh. Have you seen the number on the state housing waiting list and compared it to the number of houses being provided? It's far from acceptable. Wellbeing? Yeah right.

            • McFlock

              Have you seen the state housing stock vs the trend over time of the nats?

              Funny thing about waiting lists: if it starts looking realistic, people apply rather than not even bothering to fill out the form.

              As for shane jones, nah, he's not the PM's problem. Because everyone knows he works for NZ1.

              • The Chairman

                Have you seen the state housing stock vs the trend over time of the nats?

                Really? The old they did it too excuse.

                I'm not defending National's poor performance on this nor am I (unlike you) using them to diminish Labour's shortcomings.

                Funny thing about waiting lists: if it starts looking realistic, people apply rather than not even bothering to fill out the form.

                And that's a bullshit line out of Labour's spin book. Chances of securing a home isn't looking more realistic when the waiting list is growing so fast. Moreover, and here is the kicker, Labour aren't even providing enough houses to cover the number that were on the waiting list before they even came into power.

                • Drowsy M. Kram

                  The Chairman – "more left than most"? HELP – I'm just not seeing it.

                  "Labour's shortcomings"
                  "a bullshit line out of Labour's spin book"
                  "here is the kicker, Labour aren't even providing enough houses"

                  More “relentlessly-soggy commentary” showing The Chairman's true colours – that “more left than most” false flag is wearing pretty thin.

                  Please, just be honestI certainly wouldn’t think any less of you.

                  • The Chairman

                    Any genuine lefty would be disappointed with Labour's shortcomings and over their spin. Moreover, Labour are failing to meet their own modest housing targets.

                    Yet here you are apparently defending their shortcomings suggesting I'm not left. If you were genuinely left you would be joining me in putting the pressure on Labour to up their game.

                    • Drowsy M. Kram

                      Any genuine ‘righty’ would be delighted to point out “Labour’s shortcomings“, “their spin“, “failing to meet their own targets“, again, and again, and again, and again, and again, and again. And many genuine ‘righties’ do just that on this blog, but none are as “relentlessly soggy” as you. You’re not even fooling yourself!

                      Are you suggesting that because I'm asserting that whoever is behind The Chairman identity is not left, that I cannot be genuinely left?

                      That's some mighty fine reasoning.

                      For the record, I would be more than happy to join you in putting pressure on National to up their game (and, let's face it, they've nowhere to go but up), but you are contractually unable to give me that opportunity.

                  • The Chairman

                    Are you suggesting that because I'm asserting that whoever is behind The Chairman identity is not left, that I cannot be genuinely left?

                    Far from it. I'm suggesting that if you were genuinely left you would be agreeing with a good number of the issues I've raised. Especially areas where Labour themselves have expressed shortcomings.

                    I'd be happy for National to take up my recommendations, there was a time when they were Keynesian too.

                    • Drowsy M. Kram

                      The Chairman has but one mode of comment: 'criticise the Government' (but only if that government is left-leaning.)

                      This breaks down to:
                      'criticise Labour', 'criticise PM Ardern', 'criticise Twyford', etc.;
                      'criticise the Greens', 'criticise Shaw', 'criticise Davidson' (and Turei before her – that's 'right', The Chairman was also highly critical of the left in opposition), etc.;
                      'criticise NZ1st', 'criticise deputy PM Peters', 'criticise Jones', etc.

                      Seems that the only NZ politicians that have escaped The Chairman's critical gaze are National and ACT party politicians – The Chairman can't even bear to criticise Bridges, or Seymour ffs.

                      The Chairman is currently contractually unable to criticise the National-led opposition. Any genuine friend of the left should be able to do that, at least occasionally, on this blog, yet The Chairman can't, and never has.

                      The Chairman‘s 'cover' is well and truly blown, but keep digging and we'll keep pointing it out – you lefty you!

                  • The Chairman

                    The Chairman was also highly critical of the left in opposition

                    Glad you noticed. And as you would have seen, I was onto Labour's shortfalls back then too. If it wasn't for the turn of events, Jacinda taking leadership, Labour would have been hammered. And despite the recent poll, Labour shouldn't be quick to forget that.

                    I just told you before that I don't believe National will vastly improve our nation, so clearly your claims are crap.

                    • Drowsy M. Kram

                      "clearly your claims are crap" – have I touched a nerve, Chair?

                      I'll make two more 'claims' – you'll be criticising the PM, and Winston, and the Labour party/MPs, and the Green party/MPs, and NZ1st/MPs (unless they throw their lot in with National – you wish) on this site for every and a day. That's your demonstrable modus operandi – can you prove otherwise?

                      And your critiques of National party policies/MP behaviour will continue to be 'strangely' lacking – strange at least for one "more left than most".

                      Oh, what a tangled web we weave
                      When first we practise to deceive!

                • McFlock

                  No, I wasn't pulling a "they did it too" line. I was pointing out that the waiting list increased despite an increase in state houses. Labour increased state houses when national didn't, and in fact national sold state houses despite the fact that waiting lists were increasing.

                  So at least Labour are trying to address the problem.

                  • The Chairman

                    I was pointing out that the waiting list increased despite an increase in state houses.

                    Clearly, the increase was insufficient. And your point seems moot.

                    Labour increased state houses when national didn't, and in fact national sold state houses despite the fact that waiting lists were increasing

                    Now you seem to be contradicting yourself. Are you on the piss?

                    Yes, Labour have generally done a little of everything, giving them something to spout off for the media soundbites. But just about everything they've done has fallen far too short.

                    And no. I'm not an extremist expecting them to deliver us everything at once, tomorrow, but me and others do expect them to get their priorities right and deliver more.

                    Failing to is only going to cost us more in the long run as things further deteriorate due to Labour not even doing enough to stem the decline, admitting they expect things to worsen. And on the ground, the result is society will continue to suffer, illness, poverty, death, hunger, crime.

                    • McFlock

                      "National literally did the opposite" is not "national did it, too".

                      As for your constant criticism, I find it disingenuous. There are several commenters who would like, nay demand, the government do more. And yes, they criticise Labour. But they make what they want, their exact policy requirements, very clear. Whereas you criticise, but keep your actual demands very vague.

                      And even the most zealous lefties have managed to give credit where credit is due, but you'd crawl over hot glass before doing that without some snide, backhanded criticism.

                  • The Chairman

                    As for your constant criticism, I find it disingenuous

                    Then address it without trying to personally tar me.

                    I often stated what I'd like to see from Government. And just the other day I told you a way Labour could possibility get more support from NZF. So don't resort to talking crap. And I've also given credit to Labour, Greens, and NZF on occasion.

                    I'm telling it as it is and you know it, hence your need to resort to talking crap.

                    • McFlock

                      Oh bullshit. When challenged on yet another vague criticism of Labour, you pulled out of your arse the idea of dramatically increasing the tourist tax as a policy that would be attractive to all three coalition parties (when you have no idea whether that was the case) and then using however much cash that would generate (of which you have no idea) to fund more expenditure.

                      I have many disagreements with folk like Adam or Bill or Francesca, but at least they are up front and specific about their demands on government and they give the impression that they've considered those ideas for longer than the twenty minutes since the latest reply to their comments.

                  • The Chairman

                    I didn't just whip it out. I've posted this suggestion before and provided potential figures.

                    Moreover, as an entry levy has recently been announced, it indicates the three support the notion. Therefore, suggesting the potential for increasing it is in the realm of reality. And that is only one of many suggestions I've made over the years posting here.

                    Taxing the offshore property investors that Labour's ban failed to capture is another.

                    • McFlock

                      I didn't just whip it out. I've posted this suggestion before and provided potential figures.

                      Really? How did you arrive at those figures? What calculations and assumptions did you incorporate in deriving those figures?

                      Moreover, as an entry levy has recently been announced, it indicates the three support the notion. Therefore, suggesting the potential for increasing it is in the realm of reality. And that is only one of many suggestions I've made over the years posting here.

                      Oh bollocks. It indicates that at least one party supports the notion enough to put it forward, and the other two will tolerate it up to a certain point.

                      Only a goddamned fool of a burger joint owner would assume that just because I bought a $5 burger, I might find a $20 or even a $100 burger to be a serious proposition.

                      Your "many suggestions" are overwhelmed and diluted by the multitude of pointless beat-ups and criticisms you present on a daily basis. I just decided to double check and reread all your comments on this page. Maybe you should do the same and see how many specific suggestions you actually put forward, and how much despondency you try to sow.

                    • RedLogix

                      Only a goddamned fool of a burger joint owner would assume that just because I bought a $5 burger, I might find a $20 or even a $100 burger to be a serious proposition.

                      Well yes, but if on the same night out I'd spent $2000 at the bar and it turns out the 'burgers' actual cost is $100 to provide … then maybe it's a different story. No comparisons are perfect, but NZ's Conservation Estate can't really be valued in the same category as a burger.

                      It's an issue being grappled with, and it has a few complex aspects. Here is an article on the impact of differential charging on the Great Walks:


                      For what it’s worth I’d prefer a generic airport fee on all overseas visitors; the vast majority of them are coming here to enjoy some aspect of our outdoors, even if only sitting in a car or bus.

                  • The Chairman

                    Calculations were based upon the Governments with the entry levy pricing deriving from public consultation I've had with tourists and local operators in the sector.

                    As tourist numbers are expected to exceed our population in the near future, operators in the sector that I've spoken to aren't that nervous about a fee of that rate ($200 per adult, $100 per child) negatively impacting upon their income stream. In fact, many understand the need and the benefits (better infrastructure etc) to do this.

                    Many tourists (around 80%) understood this too. Plenty (just over 20%) of them were happy to pay more to enter our little slice of paradise. Understanding it costs money to maintain and manage. With around 40% comfortable with the suggested pricing.

                    But of course, there was a small number (close to 5%) that totally opposed it, with the rest preferring it to be less.

                    It indicates that at least one party supports the notion enough to put it forward, and the other two will tolerate it up to a certain point.

                    The Government's $35 levy comes into effect in October. And the levy rate won't increase for the first 5 years. So not only does it indicate it is supported, in 5 years it is bound to increase.

                    Where is your evidence it was only supported by one party and merely tolerated by the other two?

                    • McFlock

                      lol so let me get this straight, you think a policy necessarily means all three support it, rather than it being a concession for one or two parties making the coalition deal?

                      As for your "consultation" for the triple figure levy, I don't believe you.

        • ankerawshark


          Sorry Chairman. I think this is game, set and match to me.

          As I strongly believe you are a troll, this is the last reply I will give you

          • The Chairman

            When Labour has Mitchell backing them saying his party would have done the same if it was in power. The left should very well know things are going wrong.

            Can you remember Labour's position on the military spend when Little (the elected left representative) was party leader. And how that has now changed with Jacinda now in charge?

            Just to refresh your memory. Little said the $20 billion to be spent on the defence upgrade could be better spent on housing and education.

            • Robert Guyton

              You've managed to out-eeyore, Eeyore!


              • The Chairman

                Where do you sit on the military spend Robert? Do you believe in and support spending so much?

                Or are you with Little and like to see more money going elsewhere?

                Personally, I oppose this massive amount being spent on the military when so much more nationally requires to be done.

            • ankerawshark

              The Chairman is a (concern) troll and should be ignored. He has taken up way too much time on this site today. He claims to be left wing, but is always criticizing the coalition with the usual meme's such as Jacinda = needs to show stronger leadership, implication is she's a weak leader.

              I am going to encourage people to ignore him

              • The Chairman

                I'm not a concern troll. I'm a lefty expressing my valid conerns which you have failed to refute when challenged.

                You provided a link to an article promoting Labour's military spend suggesting Labour have done no wrong this week. Showing National's backing

                The left don't support massive military spends, especially when when locals are homeless and kids are going hungry. So where do you get off calling me a concern troll?

                • Pat

                  "I'm a lefty"

                  whats wrong with this statement?

                  • Drowsy M. Kram

                    Thank-you Pat, well spotted – by their pejoratives shall you know them.

                    The Chairman, "more left[y] than most", hoisted on their own petard.

    • Along with Budgetgate. She had Winston prematurely announcing the teachers settlement. Jones giving a stupid answer to a serious employment question undermining the Provincial Growth Fund, the Government's credibility and ultimately, its leadership. And Twyford being the latest minister accused of covering up secret meetings.

      A set of talking points taken straight from Kiwiblog by the concern-troll account supposedly belonging to a left-winger. I'm not sure you're aware of this, but every week is a bad week for the PM on Kiwiblog. The number of non-Kiwiblog readers who are even aware of the above "issues" would be tiny, let alone the number who find they reflect badly on the PM.

      • The Chairman 8.5.1

        A set of talking points taken straight from Kiwiblog.

        Really? Seems you visit there more than me. These are matters recently reported by the media and have concerns for the left.

        Jacinda can't afford to have Winston going rogue. It undermines her leadership. And Labour can't afford that to happen to their star player. How you think this valid concern (hence line of talk) aligns with National is bizarre.

        The similar applies to Twyford being the latest minister accused of covering up secret meetings. Jones running wild and Jacinda being implicated in Budgetgate. And as for Budgetgate, Labour could have put it to bed before it got to this if they owned it from the onset.

        • solkta

          Give it a rest tableman, nobody is buying your dog poo here.

        • Psycho Milt

          I visit there quite often, yes. That's how I could identify every one of the items in your comment as talking points featured on Kiwiblog. It's also the only place I've seen mention of a supposed Twyford "secret meeting." These are "issues," for want of a less-ridiculous term, that only interest Tories and their concern-troll sock-puppet accounts.

          • The Al1en

            Reminds me of the poster on here during the build up to the '14 election who continually bagged the greens for intruding on labours territory, parroting the nat line, saying they should stick to environmental issues and leave the social stuff out of it.

            Can't remember the name, but I'm sure someone will. Eerily similar.

          • The Chairman

            Well, if you also paid attention to the news, you would have seen the Twyford story (as with the others) was reported with comparisons of the infamous Clare Curran clip shown.


            • Anne

              And if you paid attention to the news you would have known that the omission of the meeting in the publicly available schedule of ministerial meetings had been an inadvertent mistake on the part of the staffer responsible for putting it together. Given the huge number of ministerial meetings on a weekly basis, it is not surprising it happens now and then.

              And if you paid attention you would also have known that this government introduced the publicly available schedule of ministerial meetings in the interest of transparency. Under the last government there was no such schedule available so they could – and did – hold secret meetings without anyone knowing.

              • The Chairman

                Hi Anne

                Is that galloping I hear?smiley

                And if you paid attention you would also have known that this government introduced the publicly available schedule of ministerial meetings in the interest of transparency.

                Yes, they did. However, that didn't stop it from being done, seems you have forgotten (or is that willingly overlooked?) the Clare Curran incident.

                As for this one, there is the emails Twyford's office refused to release and the suspect timing (apparently when he was caught) of the correction being made. So even if it is legit, it is all looking rather dodgy. And you know what they say about perception.

                • Drowsy M. Kram

                  Chair, just a friendly observation – if it's easy for me to see that you’re putting the boot into Labour with your comments, then it'll be easy for others to see that too.

                  "the Clare Curran incident"
                  "emails Twyford's office refused to release"
                  "the suspect timing"
                  "it is all looking rather dodgy"

                  "You know what they say about perception." laugh

  8. greywarshark 9

    This news item has gathered some examples of the same breed of dog attacking people. Should there be some more controls on breeding so that bad traits aren't intensified?

    He was 51. His dog was a Staffordshire bull terrier….

    A 72-year-old woman was also killed last month when she was attacked by her pet Staffordshire cross breed at her home in Sydney's south-west.
    Her husband was bitten while trying to save her, but survived

    (Rosemary O'Reilly, 72, suffered significant bite wounds and lacerations to her arms, legs and body when she was attacked by the large Staffordshire terrier-Rhodesian ridgeback cross at her home.) https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/112820522/australian-woman-dies-after-being-attacked-by-her-pet-dog?rm=a

    Three people were critically injured in a "horrific" dog attack involving a Staffordshire cross in Sydney's west this year.
    One of those attacked died five weeks later.

    On Staffordshire bull terriers. The item below notes they can be good family dogs. But dogs need to be classified as whether they need special puppy training to learn good traits, or not. If it is essential that they be trained properly then that should be started before they are sold, and the new owner have to sign a contract to continue. If they later cause trouble, then there would be a fine and the dog would be put down. I think there needs to be control over owners, who may be lax, too busy, or irresponsible, and they should know there will be consequences to them for failure. No excuses and legal battles.

    On the "dog news" website gooddogstory.com, an article about the case said Staffordshire bull terriers, which are a permitted breed in New Zealand, were bred in the 19th century as agile fighting dogs.
    "Just because they were bred to fight other dogs does not mean they are bad with people; in fact, as nearly any educated enthusiast would agree – these dogs have severely misunderstood reputations, and are in fact some of the absolute best family dogs an owner can find. Anywhere," the site said. https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/79308625/euthanasia-reprieve-for-staffordshire-bull-terrier-found-eating-part-of-its-owner?rm=a

    A NZ dog attack story – dog breaks away from walker and attacks a cat on own property. Walker laughs and walks on. Some advice:

    "If a dog does have to be dragged off another animal it should be grabbed by the back legs and pulled away while lifting its legs up," van der Merwe said.

    "It is also helpful to remember any details about the owner's appearance, and record any other information, such as addresses or vehicle registration numbers. This will assist Animal Management with the investigation in the event that the dog or owner has left the area before the officer's arrival."


    • Anne 9.1

      Please can I put people straight about the Staffordshire terrior. They are a fabulous breed – loyal, warm-hearted, gentle, full of personality and wonderful family dogs. And they are one of the easiest breeds to train in obedience.

      Yes, the complete opposite to what is claimed by many in their ignorance and I particularly blame the media. The key word is "cross-breed". It is not the pure bred staffies who are prone to being dangerous, but the irresponsible, undesirable dog owners who breed them for their sharp teeth with the real fighting breeds.

      The media should have long ago been called out on their propensity for naming these dangerous dogs "Staffordshire crosses". It sends entirely the wrong message. Call them by the breeds that are the real culprits like "American Pit Bull crosses" or "Mastiff Bull crosses" but stop attributing the blame to the little pedigree Staffie.

      I have known of little Staffies who have been attacked in the street or on beaches by individuals because of this wrong publicity and it left both the dogs and their owners distraught and terrified by the intensity of the hostility.

      • In Vino 9.1.1

        Agreed, Anne

        Older Bull Terriers were OK until American Pit Bull Terriers etc were imported (we were warned at the time but did nothing) and now we have huge cross-breed problems, despite trying far too late to limit the Pit Bulls.

  9. Kay 10

    This was emailed to the NZTA (responsible for drivers licencing) and CCd to Phil Twyford (Transport) and Julie Anne Genter (Associate Minister) about 2 weeks ago. According to the instant auto-replies, all 3 offices have recieved it. As anticipated, I've heard nothing. I've posted it here because I'm not the only one whose very real and legitimate concerns over this drug brand switch are being completely ignored, brushed off, blatently lied about and in the case of Ministers of the Crown (especially the Minister of Health,)not even being acknowledged in the first place. The latter is also refusing to speak to a senior reporter on the subject.

    For a Government spouting the compassion and well being line they are completely abdicating their responsibility for the well being of the general public. This is bigger than Pharmac wanting to save a bit of money. Knowing there are more than likely people closely connected to Paliament/Government who read this blog maybe they will see it. It's also really important that the public at large know what is going on, because, PUBLIC SAFETY.

    This letter is written in pain English to make it simple enough for even a Minister to understand, one would think. Again, PUBLIC SAFETY. This brand switch has already started. If you are concerned about this then make a noise to the suitable Ministers, or in public if you're in a position to do so.

    "I am sure you are aware of Pharmacs’ recent decision to enforce a brand switch of the epilepsy drug lamotrigine. And of course you’re very aware of the very real consequences of someone driving when they are at risk of a seizure behind the wheel which is why there’s very reasonable rules/laws in place for the safety of both the individuals and the general public.

    So I’m writing to you with extreme concern over your response to the driving status of persons who will be undertaking this lamotrigine brand switch over the next few months. According to Pharmacs notification on their website

    “New Zealand Transport Agency (NZTA) noted a brand change does not constitute a treatment change for purposes of driving and considered that any risks from changing would be extremely low.”

    Now, given that NO ONE can guarantee that break through seizures will not occur as a result of this brand change- and trust me, they do- how did you reach the conclusion that any risks would be ‘extremely low’ and why is this not be treated in the same way as a drug change, ie a 6 month stand down? Is one person crashing and killing someone acceptable to you?More to the point, why haven’t you insisted to Pharmac that anyone currently fully controlled and driving continue having their current brand funded and stay on it?

    Maybe your medical advisors weren’t aware of it at the time but this submission from Medsafe has recently come to light https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/6025152-MedSafe-OIA.html

    Since we are now in the position of the Medicines Safety Agency strongly disagreeing with the Medicines Funding Agency over the safety of this decision, until something is clarified either way you cannot continue to say there is no risk to individuals- or to the general public- if they carry on driving while changing brands of this medication. This is a PUBLIC SAFETY ISSUE.

    While I’m personally not affected in this area (permanently banned from driving due to the nature of my epilepsy), as a member of the public it terrifies me to think there will be people out there driving around not knowing their longstanding fully controlled epilepsy is at risk. Personally, I don’t want to be on the receiving end when they have a seizure behind the wheel and crash into the footpath. Are you really prepared to continue this stance?

    Finally, should heaven forbid the worst happen and even one person dies or is seriously injured as a result of your refusal to face reality on this issue, will the NZTA be accepting any responsibility for their role given they are now fully aware? I sincerely hope you have sought legal advice on where you stand with this.

    Please get this out there. If the worse case scenario did happen- and hope like hell it doesn't- there will be avoidable blood on the hands of a lot of Government agencies, but none of them will accept any responsibility.

    • A 10.1

      I really hope they sort this out. The issue had some good media coverage too.

      • Kay 10.1.1

        It has, Guyon Espinor has been amazing. There's an even bigger story that's unfolding out of this with major ramifications. It's way more than just defunding a drug brand used for a couple of conditions that most of the public don't care about anyway.

    • greywarshark 10.2

      Managing seizures so that you can have a normal life and not have them occurring when you are in a position where you can harm yourself and others – that's a serious thing.

      My old car is good but has a 'condition' where in humid conditions water gets into the distributor or something and it will conk out just when I enter an intersection. CRC will fix it, stronger pressure on the accelerator will prevent it, but if it happens the steering goes, the motor dies, and i have to send distress signals to avoid harm. It's alarming but I can prevent it, and handle it if it happens.

      So I sympathise. It is particularly important for your ability to have a life to have the right medication. Government should give Pharmac the right and also the responsibility to choose not just the best efficient drug for each disability, but also look at which is most effective. It is no good just being given a good quality drug, if it does not provide the essential help to prevent the momentary seizure that can lead to harm, injury or death.

      (This would apply for someone who is not at an old age; there will be a need to limit more expensive drugs to people over say 75, as we are being too demanding in our numbers, living to longer age, and that is a fact.)

    • Rosemary McDonald 10.3

      This letter is written in pain English to make it simple enough for even a Minister to understand, one would think.

      Brilliant! (A young friend, reading one of the 2765 or so such letters/emails I've written to Ministers, CEOs, Managers, Lawyers and the like over the years on matters Disability, proffered the opinion that it was no wonder I was getting nowhere because I was assuming too high a level of comprehension from the addressee.

      "One issue per letter, in plain language, and no polysyllables."

      Kay, Peter and I are wishing you the very best outcome on this…we pay extra for one of Peter's meds that was disfunded by Pharmac a few years ago…but we're better placed to pay the extra with Peter now off the Supported (Hah!) Living Payment and grazing in the lusher pasture of National Super.

      Knowing there are more than likely people closely connected to Parliament/Government who read this blog maybe they will see it.

      I have no doubt there are…but do they actually care?

      It seems there are far too many Coalition flag-wavers frequenting these pages…those that leap into print at the mere hint of complaint from those who are not feeling the Lovingkindness.

      • Kay 10.3.1

        Rosemary, I'm not even fighting for my own situation anymore. Well it's on hold, it has to be. I had no idea just how ill fighting the government could make you, physically and mentally. I have even more admiration for you now- how the hell have you kept this up for so long and not lost the plot completely??? I'm under GPs orders to back off for now the situation got so dangerous.

        As that email is referring to, it's the very real dangers facing people who are currently fully controlled and driving, something that's never going to affect me. I guess that's called giving a damn about people other than myself? A foreign concept to Public servants and politicians too…

        • Sacha

          "I had no idea just how ill fighting the government could make you, physically and mentally."

          Shocking thing to learn the hard way, eh.

        • Rosemary McDonald

          …how the hell have you kept this up for so long and not lost the plot completely???

          I have had the odd moment or nine.wink So has Peter. We tell each other to buck the fuck up, but sometimes when we both are laid low…it is hard not to be teary. But shit man…(for those close to the Government that lurk around these pages frown) we ain't dead yet. We have nothing to lose…well, MOH funding for Peter's care since they still refuse to pay…so we have no fear of speaking out. You just might be shocked how vulnerable MOH DSS clients feel. If they complain publicly, funding could be cutangry. I'm more than happy to be a goad…

          Take care.

  10. greywarshark 11

    This morning's news.

    Nitrate levels in water raising beware flags in Denmark. Scorned by NZ Federated Farmers – nitrate is in lots of things.


    Environment Canterbury response : https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018699585/environment-canterbury-stands-by-nitrate-limits-in-water

    Oranga Tamariki following the letter of the law? They want to keep whanau together and their relationships and culture alive as encouraged for decades, presumably. But also well known is that when children are bonded with loving people, it breaks a child's trust and feeling of security and instinctive acceptance of continual caring relationships when cut-and-dried law results in separation and replacement with other carers.
    This is not just a case of pakeha preference, it is following a practice that Maori have wanted.

    But if the child comes first, then their development of trust and security, should be paramount. Letting Samoan foster parents continue caring for a pakeha child, if they are well-integrated in society and adequate and reliable parents, should be enabled not cut away. The trauma of complete or long-term separation can remain for a lifetime. https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/first-up/audio/2018699557/oranga-tamariki-rejects-couple-s-request-to-foster-child-for-not-being-european



  11. Adrian 12

    If you bred any of those nasty little fucking handbag rats much adored by young women and the retired to be as big as a staffy or ridgeback you would have a lethal, filthy tempered killing machine without paralell in the animal world.

    • Robert Guyton 12.1

      Worse than Michelle Boag?

      • Peter Christchurh nz 12.1.1

        Not possible. Striking resemblance though. She certainly has a face like a dogs ****, but without the charm.

      • greywarshark 12.1.2

        Worse than the nasty little rats that often come on to this blog and want to take a rabid bite out of our arms or anywhere, they don't care? They have never been properly trained in how to consider other people in society fairly and considerately, and shouldn't be left alone in a room with a computer, Facebook or twitter.

      • ianmac 12.1.3

        Be kind to dogs and Michelle is more snake-like.

        • Peter Christchurh nz

          Reptile like, yes, that is a good description. Slithering along. Reminds me of Kaa from Jungle Book film now you mention it.

          • greywarshark

            What was the name of the immense snake in Harry Potter books? N-something. Very reliable in service of Voldemoor, but didn't Harry find that he had some of her genes, and could understand snake language – a bit horrifying for him?

            I tend to see analogies; we all have some of the unpleasant side of snake-like people which we have to keep under control. I often hiss when I find something annoying. Sometimes I worry about myself!

            • Peter Christchurh nz

              Ha Greywarshark, being too hard on yourself😉.

              Personally, I just launch into a 4 letter word rant for a few.minutes. usually does the trick.

              • greywarshark

                Yes PeterCh That's what I am trying to lessen. I have to be in a room with other computer users soon and want to show that my parents brought me up well.

                • Peter Christchurh nz

                  Good luck greywarshark and I hope you let us know how you go. And I mean that 100% sincerely, as I hope all on this site do!

              • Anne

                Yes, and it helps even more if you make up a few more 4 letter words along the way and string them altogether. Quite therapeutic.

            • Robert Guyton

              Read "Rikki-Tikki-Tavi" by Rudyard Kipling, greywarshark, if you want to get inside a snake's skin; it's a remarkable short story, featuring a mongoose and two cobra snakes; it'll have you curled up on your chair, looking to the corners of the room 🙂

            • Stuart Munro.


      • Incognito 12.1.4


      • Cinny 12.1.5

        LMFAO!!!!!!! Mr Guyton 🙂

    • Gabby 12.2

      That's a big if Ady.

    • greywarshark 12.3

      If you have met a 'nasty little fucking handbag rat' Adrian and it was in a situation that leaves you in a foul temper, I feel for you. But the bigger dogs have a bigger bite, and nipped heels, and if accompanied by careless, inconsiderate women are not in the same league as being mauled by mini-tigers.

  12. greywarshark 13

    A piece backgrounding Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. A USA phenomenon.


  13. Peter Christchurh nz 14

    Chch gunman in court this morning. Pleaded 'not guilty'. What on earth is he thinking? If someone films their crime and broadcasts it live, bit of a problem mounting a defence i would have thought.

    His lawyer certainly drew the short straw with this.

    • greywarshark 14.1

      Of course he is going to plead Not Guilty – he wants his day/s in Court and to be as big a toe-rag as possible, playing our system of civilian justice for all its worth. If we got as tough as he we would kill him without much ado but we are afraid that we will look into the abyss, and see ourselves if we do that.

      • ankerawshark 14.1.1

        Yes not guilty to get his day in court………..that is all he has. The rest of his life is finished. Years and years, day in day out in virtual solitary……………

        I hope the judge shuts it down as much as possible within the law.

        • Peter Christchurh nz

          That's sounds absolutely horrendous, regardless of what he has done.

          As Hanibal Lector said in Silence of the Lambs: ' a civilised society would either put me to work or put me to death'. So true.

          • ankerawshark

            Yes, I think it does sound horrendous Peter, regardless of what he has done. But then I think of those who have lost love ones and also the survivors and their injuries, one woman who will never walk again, one who is in constant pain due to the damage the bullet did and the little girl with unknown consequences of the effect of the bullet in her brain. My compassion goes to them. they didn't choose it…….He did.

            • Peter Christchurh nz

              True, but why would anyone actually 'choose' that? My sympathies too go to the victims and their loved ones. But somewhere somehow the shooter is ill or something similar. Hate is easy. Understanding is not.

              On this site, I have been called a right wing troll (absolutely not true), yet on this, I am a 'bleeding heart liberal'.

              Hanibal Lector was so true. Execute or put to work. But torture (which is his de facto future) is not worthy of the 21st century.

              • McFlock

                Thing is, he's not ill. He's ideological. There is a difference.

                And execution is still worse than imprisonment.

                As for his status, if found guilty he needs to be in prison to protect us, and he needs to be in solitary to protect himself. He'd still get to talk to his guards.

              • ankerawshark

                Entitled to your point of view about the gunman Peter.

                Given he is not pleading Not Guilty by Reason of Insanity (which would mean he was psychotic at the time and out of touch with reality) we can assume he was sane. We all have to take responsibility for our actions. If we don't that means we blame someone else. There is no one else to blame here.

                The shooter was exposed to extremist views. He continued to engage with them. He developed a hatred for people of the Muslim faith. He took many months/years to plan and execute these horrendous attacks that cost 51 their lives left many injured and disabled and disturbed the peace of mind of many, many others. In pleading not guilty, he shows no remorse or sympathy for his victims. I and many others suspect he has done that to expose his hate filled views and gain notoriety.

                His will now be the most hideous existence and likely he will have long periods where he wishes he was dead and regrets what he did, not for his victims, but for himself. I know myself to be a compassionate person and have no problem saving that compassion for those who are deserving of it.

          • greywarshark

            It's so costly to keep them locked up. If they can't be contained where they can grow their own food and not run away or have a go at staff, they would be better off dead. We will have better people to look after, including ourselves.

    • ianmac 14.2

      Not guilty will be to gain a platform to mount a defence in order to promote his philosophy. Be interesting to see how a Judge handles the extent of that.

      • Peter Christchurh nz 14.2.1

        If he started spouting forth his sick ideology, surely the judge would cut him off, and if he persists have him removed from court?

        I mean, whatever he says in that vein, it in no way whatsoever can be a defence or related to his defence.

        • greywarshark

          A barrister acting for someone like the shooter who seems to have no attributes or soul, in giving his defence acts against his own nature but follows the law which says that we should hear what can be said in the accused's defence. I think defending bastards that he thought were guilty led to Greg King's death.

          Greg King suffered ‘massive breakdown’ – coroner

    • Peter Christchurh nz 14.3

      Unbelievably, some idiot was outside court this morning abusing Muslims attending the session for Mosque shooter. Heil Hitler salutes and Nazi music (the Nazis actually actively helped Muslim freedom movements, so he is ignorant as well as bigoted and just plain stupid). And of course nasty anti Muslim speech. He has now appeared in court.

      I despair. A crazy like ******* is one thing, but the supporters, in the cool light of day, scare me more.

  14. greywarshark 15

    Health and wellbeing. Surgical mesh has been a disaster for some people mainly women I think.


    Teeth brushing programs for primary schools would be excellent preventative care, and have a flow-on effect for other health problems and general wellbeing of children. A caring community being both kindly and practical!


    We need to be caring about our young people who may be prevented from gaining employment because of unreasonable and unnecessary drug tests that bear no relation to their readiness and ability to do the work they apply for. Two opinions about drug testing methods:



    • Rosemary McDonald 15.1

      This week the Director-General of Health Ashley Bloomfield told parliament's health select committee that a register to track patients who have been harmed by mesh implants would be too expensive and take too much time.

      FFS! He expects the DHBs to collect the data in their region..too much for the MOH to assign one of their overpaid bureaucrats to simply be the person that receives that data from the DHBs on a regular basis and puts them a file for future reference.

      They are deliberately sidestepping here…you can't measure what you don't count.

      Typical MOH. SSDD.

      • Molly 15.1.1

        Really disappointing. Have a friend who was severely damaged by mesh implants, and has been active with select committee hearings.

        Part of the difficulty of her return to health was the relationships between surgeons and specialists in this small country of ours. Our ACC was the reason given why some NZ patients were unable to join in on class action lawsuits in the states. However, many in NZ have been unable to get compensation or support from ACC as they won't recognise the injuries caused by the mesh implants.

        As you often point out, SSDD.

  15. greywarshark 16

    Cleangreen – it's a good start! After puffing and blowing for years to get the wheels rolling, you will have your own Thomas the Tank Engine.


  16. Gabby 17

    Does Muck Pomposo know who really attacked those tankers? I'm strugglin to see why Iran would annoy the Japanese if they're talking trade.

    • Cinny 17.1

      Maybe Muck set it up all along, it's almost like they are leveraging it as an excuse for a war, not like they've ever done that before. Lolz

    • Stuart Munro. 17.2

      It may be that the mode of attack points to a state actor – one of the ships claimed to have been torpedoed. A torpedo is a bit more complex than the usual scratchbuilt bombs employed by the likes of ISIS for example. Limpet mines appear to have used, and these are primarily available to states – though of course one could readily supply them to the perpetrators.

      • Brigid 17.2.1

        "…. scratchbuilt bombs employed by the likes of ISIS… "

        There doesn't seem to be any scratch-built bombs in this list.

        "Based on various reports, CNBC came up with the following laundry list of supplies the U.S. has so kindly provided to ISIS so far.

        • 2,300 Humvee armored vehicles at $70,000 each: $16 million
        • 40 M1A1 Abram tanks at $4.3 million each: $172 million
        • 52 M198 Howitzer mobile gun systems at $527,337 each: $2.7 million
        • 74,000 Army machine guns at $4,000 each: $29 million"


        • Stuart Munro.

          I think your source contains wildebeests of dubious provenance Brigid. 2,300 Humvees would be noticed, as would an Abrams tank battalion. Sure they had plenty of Toyota trucks – they're a preferred civilian and civil service vehicle in the region.

          IEDs seem to be a preference with ISIS, which might be because they don’t have an Abrams tank battalion.

          Explosive violence in Iraq in 2018
          There were 2,510 deaths and injuries from explosive violence
          60% (1,508) were civilians
          This is a 77% decrease in civilian casualties from explosive violence. In 2017, AOAV recorded 6,571 civilian casualties from explosive weapons in Iraq,
          Of civilian deaths and injuries, 89% were caused by IEDs
          When explosive violence was used in a populated area in Iraq last year 86% of those dead and injured were civilians

  17. greywarshark 18

    It's time we mounted a humanitarian project and took all those people off Manus Island, not only for their health and humanity, but for ours and that or the Pacific Island country that is under such strain and warping of their life and culture and ability to plan for their future under CC and CUH (Chinese/Usa hegemony).

    5/6/19 https://www.rnz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/391291/manus-island-police-chief-calls-for-govt-action-over-suicidal-refugees

    For years, the Manus Provincial Police Commander David Yapu has dealt with the impact of hundreds of young, male refugees foisted on his community by Australia.

    Conflict and crime are just some of the problems My Yapu has faced, but its only now with refugee suicide attempts reaching epidemic proportions that the police commander has turned to policy makers in Port Moresby.

    "There must be some intervention from the government because the trend of attempted suicide is growing," Mr Yapu said.

    "Anything drastic can happen, meaning that they can lose their life. This is something that I don't want to see."

    Refugees have reported about 40 suicide attempts or incidents of self harm since the Australian election on 18 May, a statistic borne out by Mr Yapu's plea in which he described two attempted hangings and a failed self immolation last week, while admitting the situation was beyond his control.

    This will go in our history where we sat back and did nothing but ineffectually wag our hands and tongues. It is hard to bear to think of these poor people inside and outside of the prison complex. And we are being screwed by the Australians as well. Have we any strength of will; do we have any integrity or are we true mercenaries, willing to sell ourselves and our integrity if any, if we are offered the right price?

    Can we start a fund-raiser to send a fleet of little boats there, like Dunkirk. This might prompt some nastiness! But would highlight the disaster for the world's attention. Embarrassment at being shown up might do it.

    And where would they come to in NZ. Pepin Island say? What about buying that NZ Government and settling them there and giving them the care and mental health services they need and deserve. That would be a good answer, as similar events will continue to happen. And we need to remember that NZ troops have participated in attacks and destruction of home areas that have caused many of these people to flee. We help destabilise the world, and injure and kill and deprive the populations in those places.

    Where are our standards, our morals, our higher civilisation, or are we at heart ready to sink below the bottom line as long as we are comfortable? We won't be for long anyway, so let us try to do some good and not misuse our intelligence and cleverness to take us below the beasts as we decline.

    • Buster12 18.1

      No one really gives a crap about those idiots on the island sept the usual left wing nutters

      • ankerawshark 18.1.1

        Buster 12, = ignorant, overgeneralisation and labelling. Plus bad spelling. Not worth replying to.

      • greywarshark 18.1.2

        Sorry buster we move in circles much larger than 12 and totally disagree with you. Is that the answer you were hoping for?

    • Bewildered 18.2

      Not sure they would be a vote winner, we can’t even house refugees we have, all stuck in Mangere refugee Center with no where to go

      • Stuart Munro. 18.2.1

        I'm sure the cow cockies down south would lap them up.

        • greywarshark

          That is a great idea Stuart. That would smooth the way in to our paradise, and keep the cockies quiet for a short time. They would all live in a giant housebus and have a medical team alongside. They might be able to cope for 4 hours a day. They would be pretty debilitated mentally if not physically but some therapeutic work not over demanding would be good.l

          • Stuart Munro.

            I was being facetious Grey, the southern communities would look after them though – the lactocapitalist mafia not so much.

    • reason 18.3

      Hi greywarshark…. I agree fully …. refugees have contributed and benefited to New Zealand throughout our past …..

      Recently The Canadians found that refugees payed more tax and contributed to society more than their Millionaire Investor citizens…. The Aussies also found the same sad sack returns from their rich investment citizen schemes

      Not to long ago, The Aussie five eyes spies bluffed, bullshitted and punked our prime minister …. when she previously offered NZ to take 100 ( or more? ) refugees off the Ausie Island prison camps.

      Shortly after the offer our media carried stories of the aussie navy turning back refugee boats bound for Nz … it was reported as the Aussies stopped these boats from " crossing the ditch " …… To me "The ditch" infers the Tasman sea ….. but according to the Aussie Navy, these boats were turned back into Indonesian waters … So thousands of miles and a sea or two away.

      In what seemed a beat up to me ,,,, Aussie 'officials' and herald type media …. were trying to blame jacinda Arden for an upsurge in mythical NZ bound boat people.

      In January of this year we were 'warned' that a fishing boat, full of refugees, had left India , NZ bound which is over 11,000 Kms…… never to be heard of again.


      John Key fearmongered about refugee boats for most of his DP time as PM …. his proof was … steel boats … and vague reports of the threat ' getting closer'.

      It's all bullshit ……….. as the old rooted and often dangerous refugee boats … will always try to make it onto Aussie soil.

      The aussie strategy is intercept and prevent this ……. as it allows them to deny a lot of rights refugees who actually make it onto Aussie soil would be entitled to.

      Its a cynical stripping of human rights ,, this aussie intercept at sea ,,,, is a nasty creative run around policy…. to avoid acting humane

      Creative avoidance of having to act humane.

      • Anne 18.3.1

        Thanks for the reminder reason.

        It is to be noted that the Aussie intelligence agencies have been living in the pockets of the CIA for many decades. So, it is not surprising they have acted from time to time in the same devious and dishonest way.

  18. greywarshark 19

    Interesting report on the Globug electricity pre-payment system (through Mercury I think.) It sounds like a feel-good advertisement but they have anecdotes to say that it works for people who make payments regularly rather than monthly and if they try to do so will get all the discounts that regular monthly account holders would get. They may get behind and get cut off, but if they contact their provider they can get electricity reinstated quickly with no hefty charge for the reinstatement. It sounds Hope it is as good as it sounds.


  19. RedLogix 20

    An interesting view on Bob Hawke and some of his more radical ideas around reform:


  20. Pat 21

    "We should seize a simple public education opportunity,

    by renaming

    GDP (Gross Domestic Product)


    GDB¹ (Gross Domestic Burn);"


  21. marty mars 22

    Some people eh – so sad and reduced to nothing inside themselves that they hate on others because of skin pigmentation or religious beliefs – yep the real deal – and the others who refuse to notice this shit even when they live down there – ffs

    Shooting survivor Mustafa Boztas was speaking to media on Lichfield Street outside the court shortly before 11am, when the Pākehā man approached them and appeared to make race-related threats.

    The man had earlier been sitting on a bicycle on the street, playing music with Nazi lyrics though a set of handheld speakers.


    He should be assessed for exposing himself.

  22. Herodotus 23

    From my reading the increases by increasing the number of pay steps have been loaded to take effect from July 2020. Excluding the $1,500 one off bonus paid only to the union members, those non union will also have to wait another 3 months for their increase to apply – delaying the financial impact to the govts books.

    Increasing beginning teachers pay hopefully will make the profession a little more appealing. Still like so many workers of today the difficulty in funding the "Affordable" $650k 2+ bedroom house
    So the following govt. will have to deal with the implications as this agreement takes effect a few months before the next election.

    Nice to see that "we have no more money" was not true 🤭 Well done the unions as I read this

  23. bewildered 24

    Interesting quote from Duncan Garner, a center left journo

    I’ve watched politics closely for 25 years and this government is the least effective of them all, by some margin.

    • It's almost as though a three-party coalition government might struggle to define and implement a cohesive policy programme, or something. If people are concerned about it, they should vote Labour or Green next time so those two can govern without NZ First. You'd see a coherent policy programme then, alright.

      Also: Duncan Garner, a center left journo

      Oh, my aching sides! Keep 'em coming!

    • Robert Guyton 24.2

      Another vacuous garnerism, don't sweat it, bewildered.

    • Stuart Munro. 24.3

      It was one of those Freudian slips.

      I've watched Duncan Garner closely for 25 years and this is his least effective of them all, by some margin.

      Gardening leave beckons.

    • greywarshark 24.4

      You should have tried to participate and lobby for things to make us more effective instead of watching it like some skewed voyeur.

    • Gabby 24.5

      Druncan may be missing the liquid lunches.

  24. My thoughts on the Government's proposed changes to the Hobbit Law:


    It's either something very good via the back door, or something very bad via the back door.

  25. Jenny - How to Get there? 26

    During the Key government the huge wind farm project planned for near Huntly named Hauauru Ma Raki, was cancelled when the price of coal dropped. Eric Sykes the head of the Wind Energy Association of New Zealand said at the tim, "the right policy settings" could see the cancelled Hauauru Ma Raki wind farm be restarted.

    So why aren’t these policy settings being put in place?


  26. Jenny - How to Get there? 27

    The Prince of Whales meets the Minnow of Presidents.


  27. Eco maori 28

    Kia ora Newshub Nation.

    Tanya it is not good the out comes of the tamariki who end up in state care most of those tamariki are Maori & Pacific tamariki they end up in jail or on the streets .

    I think that the state abuse should be dragged out into court and sorted OUT so that the state abuse of tamariki will stop .

    Eco Maori knows what the state not listening to one concerns as I have tried to use the Official Information act 3 x nothing.

    Its sad Tanya that you lost your sister to suerside ultermitly because of state abuse being covered up. .

    I agree people should not be put through recalling the trummer 2 or 3 X to get justice that would trummertize you and darn right rude that the person who was listening to you story of abuse while in state care falling asleep is down right rude and disrespectful the state servants are all about protecting them selves and there m8 and the state who care of the carnage that there actions do to the poor common tangata.

    I don,t think a state opolergy is going to make any difference to the people whos lives have been harmed I say drag the people at fault for the abuse over the hot coals of a court and COMPONSATION for the people who have been abused that will improve the people whos lives that have been dammaged more than sorry Tova but thanks for this story.

    david free speech is diffrent to Hate Speech and white supremacy if we let fools make hate speech and white supremacy common practices we will end up in anarchy A big MESS.

    Niki shonky ran NZ like a busness take over he slashed and burned the state agencys budeget and sack heads of agencys use the state police to suppress people that were a threat to him and his goals all targeting a surplase in the state budget denied the housing crisses he was making . One can not run a goverment to cater for one small part of our socity the state need to be run for the better of all people not just the 00.1 %

    Ka kite ano

  28. Eco maori 29

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

  29. Eco maori 30

    Kia kaha Extinction Rebellion all the people around the world for championing human caused climate change our grandchildren futures are so special to Eco Maori ka pai.

    Extinction Rebellion protesters stop rush-hour traffic in London

    Lewisham campaigners block three roads into city centre to highlight ‘air pollution crisis

    Environmental protesters stopped traffic on three main roads into central Londonfrom the south-east in protest over the “air pollution crisis” in the area.

    The protesters, organised by a local chapter of the Extinction Rebellion group, blocked traffic on the A20 near Lewisham station, A205 South Circular in Catford and the A2 in Deptford during the morning rush-hour.

    XR said the action was intended as the first in a series of disruptions in the area as part of a campaign called Let Lewisham Breathe. Protesters handed out leaflets and cake to apologise for the disruption caused on a main route into the centre of London.

    Extinction Rebellion protesters in Lewisham.

    Extinction Rebellion protesters in Lewisham. Photograph: Lorna Greenwood/Extinction Rebellion

    Lorna Greenwood, who took part in the protest despite being nine months pregnant, said she and about 50 fellow activists – all from the local area – began their action at 7.30am ka kite ano link below.


  30. Eco maori 31

    Some Eco Maori music for the minute.

  31. Eco maori 32

    Eco Maori thanks the Pope for his declaration that Human Caused Climate Change is a World Emergency ka pai.

    Pope Francis has declared a global “climate emergency”, warning of the dangers of global heating and that a failure to act urgently to reduce greenhouse gases would be “a brutal act of injustice toward the poor and future generations”.

    He also endorsed the 1.5C limit on temperature rises that some countries are now aiming for, referring to warnings from the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change of “catastrophic” effects if we crossed such a threshold. He said a “radical energy transition” would be needed to stay within that limit, and urged young people and businesses to take a leading role.


    “Future generations stand to inherit a greatly spoiled world. Our children and grandchildren should not have to pay the cost of our generation’s irresponsibility,” he said, in his strongest and most direct intervention yet on the climate crisis. “Indeed, as is becoming increasingly clear, young people are calling for a change.”

    The Pope’s impassioned plea came as he met the leaders of some of the world’s biggest multinational oil companies in the Vatican on Friday to impress upon them the urgency and scale of the challenge, and their central role in tackling the emissions crisis. It followed a similar meeting last year, but this time the Pope’s stance was tougher as he warned that time was running out and urged them to hear “the increasingly desperate cries of the earth and its poor

    Ka kite ano link below.


  32. Eco maori 33

    Kia ora Newshub.

    Ollie I don't think david cares really he just wants the publicity who cares about the people whom are hurting because of hate speech and people who think that they are superior.

    Condolences for the whanau of the plane that crashed and the pilot died in NZ

    I think everyone should put those life bars on Quads I have had a close call 6 years ago .

    I don't think the Nelson council should leavening that leakey suerage pipe spewing crap into Tangaroa for another minute if farmers do something like that they would get a huge fine .

    It is shocking the way Australia treats those refugees asylum seekers on manus island the people are self harming and can't see a better future than death WTF Scottmo gets of your ASS and fix this atrocity.

    It is very cool all the buildings and aroha that Sir Edmond Hillary graced Nepal with awesome to give it was the old Maori way to give a the receiver userly tried to out gift the other if they had the resources.

    Ka kite ano

  33. Eco maori 34

    Kia ora te ao Maori news

    I say that oranga tamariki is going to change its prosess in the way that they assess and up lift Pepe and tamariki I hope that they have Maori whanau involvement and maybe get a credible kaumatua to sign the papers before pepe are up lifted should be same Iwi but not a immediate whanau member ie they should not no each other for a fair CALL.

    Aotearoa produces enough food to feed 40 million people worldwide that is one of the reason why I back our farmers for one food is going to become more expensive and harder for the common and the poor people to get with Global warming. We have to do our part to feed the whole Papatuanuku. The other is corporate farming taking over our farms and turning Aotearoa into one big factory farm f that.

    Awesome to that Wahine printing te reo on cloving kia kaha I missed her company name Eco Maori mite have to get a few shirts branded with my name.

    Ka kite ano

  34. george.com 35


    "Non-union teachers are angry that they will have to wait three months to get the pay rises that the Government has offered to union members…Justin Lindsay, a Hastings Boys' High School music teacher who is philosophically opposed to unions, said the three-month delay in the pay rise for non-union members is unprecedented and unfair.

    "We are the teachers who would like to see performance pay and individual contracts," he said.That's a philosophical issue, but I feel like we are being punished for taking that point of view."

    Charter school founder Alwyn Poole said even the three-month advance on the pay rise and the $1500 lump sum were less than the fees paid by union members. Union members have paid, on average, well in excess of $500 a year for the last three years and the next three years, i.e. $3000," he said. The percentage increase for three months will only be marginal. Plus the union members have struck for at least three days, [losing] approximately $900. So us non-members are still winning by about $2000 and don't have all of the ridiculous hassle of union membership."

    I guess Justin Lindsay will be refusing the pay increases and contacting the Ministry of Education to negotiate an Individual Employment Agreement with performance based pay. If teachers want the pay increases at the same time as every one else, well, they could join the union.

    And as for Alwyn Poole, well, if it wasn't for the education unions it's very likely the pay rates for teachers would be quite a bit lower than they are at present and teachers would still be dealing with rubbish like National Standards and Charter Schools.

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