web analytics

Open mike 17/01/2020

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, January 17th, 2020 - 54 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

54 comments on “Open mike 17/01/2020 ”

    • Kevin 1.1

      I think Warren's popularity will plummet after her BS leaked story regarding Bernie Sanders.

      • Puckish Rogue 1.1.1

        Agreed, the consensus among conservative commentators is that basically Warren is telling big, fat porkies and if that's what the conservatives are thinking…

      • McFlock 1.1.2


        speculation about that simply encourages folk like puckish.

        Two grownups can get pissed at each other and get over it – I suspect that it's a simple misunderstanding, where Sanders meant one thing and Warren heard another.

        • Puckish Rogue

          Yeah probably true so of course Warren just had to bring it up on the eve of the debate and then at the end of the debate which the cameras just happened to pick up

          • McFlock

            Both strike me as not being eager to lie simply to tear the other down.

            I suspect she honestly thinks he said that.

            I suspect he said something that sounded like that to her but he meant something else – like maybe he was thinking only HRC and she took it as women in general. So he honestly thinks she is incorrect about what she said he said.

            I suspect that each has an honest belief that the other has lied by calling them a liar.

            I suspect they will both get over it.

            I think the people who win from building up this beef are people who would prefer the democrats to lose, but would also be content with the democrats being skewed back towards fiscal and social conservatism (i.e. no obvious difference from rump republicans).

            I think you are one of those people.

    • Ad 1.2

      This is just getting stupid.

      We are now just 6 months away from the US Democratic Convention.

      At that point in front of the nation they are supposed to crown a contender against Trump. Another contested Convention would be even worse chaos than last time. And same Presidential result.

      Warren and Buttigieg need to figure out that they are simply a massive drag on the chances of Sanders taking out Biden for the shot at Trump.

      There is zero path to victory for Bloomberg or any other Democrat candidate .


      We are getting quickly to the point where Biden is the default contender because the rest of them can't pool their resources against him.

      I fear it's getting too late in the day to generate broad electoral messaging that reflects unity and a presumption of Democratic Presidential rule.

      • adam 1.2.1

        The centrist kill any chance to stop trump, who would have thought it. Like the UK election, the centre left would rather a fascist win, than a progressive.

        This is why the left keeps losing Ad – not messaging, not tactics, but a centrist left who would rather lose than have a solid left wing victory.

        • Ad

          Who are the Democrat candidates you see as the "centrist left" doing this damage?

        • joe90

          The centre left would rather a fascist win, than a progressive.

          Or the berniebros would rather a fascist win, than a woman.

          • adam


            Just another batshit crazy conspiracy theory from joe90.

          • arkie

            Chris Hayes's response to the above tweet was to link to an article he wrote in 2004 about undecided voters and some of the points he raised then are relevant now:

            Undecided voters aren't as rational as you think. Members of the political class may disparage undecided voters, but we at least tend to impute to them a basic rationality. We're giving them too much credit.

            Undecided voters do care about politics; they just don't enjoy politics.

            A disturbing number of undecided voters are crypto-racist isolationists.

            Undecided voters don't think in terms of issues. Perhaps the greatest myth about undecided voters is that they are undecided because of the "issues."

            The majority of undecided voters I spoke to couldn't name a single issue that was important to them.

      • Nic the NZer 1.2.2

        "Warren and Buttigieg need to figure out that they are simply a massive drag on the chances of Sanders taking out Biden for the shot at Trump."

        Hilarious. Some how it didn't cross your mind that Waren and Buttigieg are the foe progressives and compete with Biden for votes.

        • Ad

          I'm not sure if you're mixing up "foe" or "faux", or indeed need a working definition of who is more progressive or left when discussing any of them. Go for it. I'd be happy for you to show some cross-polling on your contention.

          • Nic the NZer

            Such polling exists, not that polling data will make anything clear.

            • Ad


              • Nic the NZer

                If you think I am not highlighting the polling data because it makes your argument you would be wrong. You can google second tier candidates if you want to verify that. As i read it Buttigieg pulling probably goes for Biden and Waren is too close to call.

                But this is based on voters switching preferences in line with the model the poll uses, and there are far to many variables for me to consider that reliable evidence. Also ultimately the answer you get from any polling data will depend on a preconceived model the polling company constructs for how the election works.

      • McFlock 1.2.3

        Bloomberg is betting that his path to victory has 8 or 9 zeros in it, lol

        there are still a dozen contenders. We haven't had a single primary yet. That's when shit will get frenzied and bitter and the minnows will drop off.

        Butthe one who wins will be pretty tough – although I doubt Biden will beat dolt45 if he gets the nom, unless he gets some spark from somewhere.

        • The Al1en

          Yeah, Biden wouldn't be in my top three picks, and I also don't fancy his chances should he likely win the dem nomination.

          But that aside, I'd want him over Trump any day of the week, weeks in a month, and months in a year etc.

          • McFlock

            oh fuck yes. Even chequebook bloomberg would be better than the current fool.

            • The Al1en

              Absolutely, which makes those 'my choice didn't get picked so I want the other side to win' types, appear somewhat ignorant and quite immature, socially and politically.

              • Nic the NZer

                Those people you are calling ignorant seemed highly aware that they got screwed over in the primary race. I don't think calling them ignorant to boot is convincing anyone that their are best represented by the Democrats.

                • McFlock

                  If they're so precious that they'll vote dolt45 because of comments on a NZ (or any) political blog, I doubt they'd ever have voted over their own ego no matter what people called them.

                  It screams more "I'm looking for an excuse to vote orange" than "oh dear, the one true saviour in the democratic party has been been so poorly treated by our alleged comrades that voting for the nazi-adjacent (Miller, Bannon, and others) is the only sensible course of action we can take to make life better for all americans".

                  • Nic the NZer

                    Its pretty well established that a sure fire way to win over the aggrieved is to dismiss their concerns as unimportant and accuse them of secretly harbouring malitious intent.

                    You can collect your certificate in dispute resolution at the door.

                    • The Al1en

                      Winning over the aggrieved has nothing to do with 180 political flip flops just because your preferred candidate couldn't get through the selection process.

                      How any Sanders supporter, for example, could turn around and vote Trump sort of belies any claim to be a follower of democratic socialism in the first place. That's just f*cked up thinking, like how a soft left labour party isn't radical enough, so you vote conservative or national instead. 🙄

                    • Nic the NZer []

                      I hope you refuse to accept conservatives money in the same way you don't regard their votes as worth having.

                    • Craig H []

                      I would guess that they prefer Trump's economic line of protectionism to the alternative.

                    • The Al1en

                      I'd be very happy to see national or conservative voters switch over to labour, though they have absolutely nothing to do with the topic, or points I have contributed (supposed lefties switching to the other side because their choice of candidate doesn't get selected).

                    • McFlock

                      Sometimes the only resolution to a dispute is to accept that one party is intractable and go your separate ways.

                  • Andre

                    Itchy middle finger.

              • Fuck yes. When I was living in the Middle East, I saw someone write that a post on social media should win "The master sword of greatness." I think you just won today's master sword of greatness.

  1. Andre 2

    Rick Wilson as readable as ever …


    Rick Wilson is a long-time Repug strategist that is also a hard-core never-Drumpfer. It's worth keeping that in the back of your mind while reading.

  2. Peter 3

    When the system runs its course and after the primaries a candidate of the quality of Trump is spewed (or shat) out, you know it's just a show like an LSD induced trip. That the ideal candidate could actually be a surreal, bizarre Mad Max character says it all.

    Then the realisation, a bit strange and a bit of a pity, that the circus has some fairly serious ramifications for the world. It is a most fantastic parody.

  3. A 4

    Just watched an interview with Robert Kyosaki talking about the book, "Who Stole My Pension?". He said it was happening all around the world. Thinking this may not apply to NZ I googled and found this 2017 news release. I don't quite see it as stealing, more refusing to double up on payment. Happy to be wrong about that.

  4. mosa 5

    This will have an impact on the race for some and ( maybe ) leave the way clear for others.

    " Four Democrats running to challenge United States President Donald Trump in November's general election have a new headache to deal with – a mandatory obligation that will keep them off the campaign trail for at least two weeks, if not longer "


  5. AB 6

    There has to be a future PhD thesis titled something like: "Lightbulbs and the conservative mind: exploring fictional constructs of green authoritarianism". We had our own version of it in 2008, and here is Donald Trump with his take on the subject.

  6. Dennis Frank 7

    When is a dam not a dam? When there's no river. “Announcing the deal, officials and organisers have avoided using the word “dam”.” https://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=12300981

    "Technically, the project won't dam a river, but instead put a dam wall at the end of a valley to store water from nearby sources. The site would hold up to 18 million cubic metres of water and be able to irrigate about 10,000 hectares."

    A big win for NZF and regional development. "But the Green Party says it's still undecided about whether to back the plan." Probably checking out those "nearby sources". Hope they are in contact with the affected regional community.

    ""Once finished, this project will provide a resilient freshwater supply for the area, leading to many benefits, such as providing support to sustainable agriculture and horticulture industries," Tabuteau said. The plan has the backing of iwi, the three local councils and Greater Wellington Regional Council. Federated Farmers hailed the funding decision as "outstanding news"."

    • AB 7.1

      Interesting to know if ongoing extraction would be needed from "nearby sources" to keep the dam full – or whether natural rainfall within the drainage catchment of the dam is sufficient, i.e. is it a one-off appropriation of a public resource to benefit the owners of agricultural businesses, or an ongoing one?

      • Dennis Frank 7.1.1

        I agree. The report doesn't mention any opposition to the scheme so I suspect it may be mutual benefit. We know what happened in nearby Hawkes Bay not long ago!

        But yes, the question of replenishment is crucial to prove resilience. Sounds like Tabuteau believes in answers given on that question but the report doesn't elucidate.

      • Alice Tectonite 7.1.2

        Involves damming Black Creek, a tributary of the Waingawa River. (The not damming a river relies on the notion of a stream not being a river). Catchment area of Black Creek is too small to support the size of proposed irrigation source area, will definitely take from nearby sources.

        Mysteriously their website isn't working properly, but can be accessed through the wayback machine. Strangely they never mention which rivers they propose taking from, but the Waingawa is a pretty obvious contender.

  7. Dennis Frank 8

    The battle of the geriatrics is hotting up. Once again, voters are feeling the bern! https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-democrats-poll/sanders-climbs-now-tied-with-biden-among-registered-voters-reuters-poll-idUSKBN1ZG00D

    "U.S. Senator Bernie Sanders has been steadily climbing in popularity this year and is now tied with former Vice President Joe Biden for the 2020 Democratic presidential nomination among registered voters, according to a Reuters/Ipsos national poll.”

    “The poll shows that standing does not appear to have been hurt by his recent confrontation with Warren over Sanders’ views of women and politics.”

    “Warren, who is aligned with Sanders on a variety of issues, has accused him of telling her in 2018 that a woman could not be elected president. Sanders disputes that claim, and the two sniped at each other after this week’s presidential debate about how they were framing the conversation in public.”

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • Celebrating the Entry Into Force of the Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons
    [Opening comments, welcome and thank you to Auckland University etc] It is a great pleasure to be here this afternoon to celebrate such an historic occasion - the entry into force of the Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons. This is a moment many feared would never come, but ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Supporting disabled people to stay connected
    The Government is providing $3 million in one-off seed funding to help disabled people around New Zealand stay connected and access support in their communities, Minister for Disability Issues, Carmel Sepuloni announced today. The funding will allow disability service providers to develop digital and community-based solutions over the next two ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Voluntary saliva testing offered to quarantine workers from Monday
    Border workers in quarantine facilities will be offered voluntary daily COVID-19 saliva tests in addition to their regular weekly testing, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins said today. This additional option will be rolled out at the Jet Park Quarantine facility in Auckland starting on Monday 25 January, and then to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Next steps in firearms buy-back
    The next steps in the Government’s ambitious firearms reform programme to include a three-month buy-back have been announced by Police Minister Poto Williams today.  “The last buy-back and amnesty was unprecedented for New Zealand and was successful in collecting 60,297 firearms, modifying a further 5,630 firearms, and collecting 299,837 prohibited ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Jobs for Nature projects target iconic ecosystems
    Upscaling work already underway to restore two iconic ecosystems will deliver jobs and a lasting legacy, Conservation Minister Kiri Allan says.  “The Jobs for Nature programme provides $1.25 billion over four years to offer employment opportunities for people whose livelihoods have been impacted by the COVID-19 recession. “Two new projects ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • New Public Housing Plan announced
    The Government has released its Public Housing Plan 2021-2024 which outlines the intention of where 8,000 additional public and transitional housing places announced in Budget 2020, will go. “The Government is committed to continuing its public house build programme at pace and scale. The extra 8,000 homes – 6000 public ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Prime Minister congratulates President Joe Biden on his inauguration
    Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has congratulated President Joe Biden on his inauguration as the 46th President of the United States of America. “I look forward to building a close relationship with President Biden and working with him on issues that matter to both our countries,” Jacinda Ardern said. “New Zealand ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Jobs for Nature funding will create training and employment opportunities
    A major investment to tackle wilding pines in Mt Richmond will create jobs and help protect the area’s unique ecosystems, Biosecurity Minister Damien O’Connor says. The Mt Richmond Forest Park has unique ecosystems developed on mineral-rich geology, including taonga plant species found nowhere else in the country. “These special plant ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Pre-departure testing extended to all passengers to New Zealand
    To further protect New Zealand from COVID-19, the Government is extending pre-departure testing to all passengers to New Zealand except from Australia, Antarctica and most Pacific Islands, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins said today. “The change will come into force for all flights arriving in New Zealand after 11:59pm (NZT) on Monday ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Bay Cadets learn skills to protect environment
    Bay Conservation Cadets launched with first intake Supported with $3.5 million grant Part of $1.245b Jobs for Nature programme to accelerate recover from Covid Cadets will learn skills to protect and enhance environment Environment Minister David Parker today welcomed the first intake of cadets at the launch of the Bay ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Cook Islanders to resume travel to New Zealand
    The Prime Minister of New Zealand Jacinda Ardern and the Prime Minister of the Cook Islands Mark Brown have announced passengers from the Cook Islands can resume quarantine-free travel into New Zealand from 21 January, enabling access to essential services such as health. “Following confirmation of the Cook Islands’ COVID ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Supporting communities and landowners to grow employment opportunities
    Jobs for Nature funding is being made available to conservation groups and landowners to employ staff and contractors in a move aimed at boosting local biodiversity-focused projects, Conservation Minister Kiritapu Allan has announced. It is estimated some 400-plus jobs will be created with employment opportunities in ecology, restoration, trapping, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Border exception for some returning international tertiary students
    The Government has approved an exception class for 1000 international tertiary students, degree level and above, who began their study in New Zealand but were caught offshore when border restrictions began. The exception will allow students to return to New Zealand in stages from April 2021. “Our top priority continues ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Tiwai deal gives time for managed transition
    Today’s deal between Meridian and Rio Tinto for the Tiwai smelter to remain open another four years provides time for a managed transition for Southland. “The deal provides welcome certainty to the Southland community by protecting jobs and incomes as the region plans for the future. The Government is committed ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • New member for APEC Business Advisory Council
    Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has appointed Anna Curzon to the APEC Business Advisory Council (ABAC). The leader of each APEC economy appoints three private sector representatives to ABAC. ABAC provides advice to leaders annually on business priorities. “ABAC helps ensure that APEC’s work programme is informed by business community perspectives ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Govt’s careful economic management recognised
    The Government’s prudent fiscal management and strong policy programme in the face of the COVID-19 global pandemic have been acknowledged by the credit rating agency Fitch. Fitch has today affirmed New Zealand’s local currency rating at AA+ with a stable outlook and foreign currency rating at AA with a positive ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Additional actions to keep COVID-19 out of NZ
    The Government is putting in place a suite of additional actions to protect New Zealand from COVID-19, including new emerging variants, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins said today. “Given the high rates of infection in many countries and evidence of the global spread of more transmissible variants, it’s clear that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • 19 projects will clean up and protect waterways
    $36 million of Government funding alongside councils and others for 19 projects Investment will clean up and protect waterways and create local jobs Boots on the ground expected in Q2 of 2021 Funding part of the Jobs for Nature policy package A package of 19 projects will help clean up ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • New Zealand Government acknowledges 175th anniversary of Battle of Ruapekapeka
    The commemoration of the 175th anniversary of the Battle of Ruapekapeka represents an opportunity for all New Zealanders to reflect on the role these conflicts have had in creating our modern nation, says Associate Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Kiri Allan. “The Battle at Te Ruapekapeka Pā, which took ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago