Open mike 18/01/2023

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, January 18th, 2023 - 61 comments
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Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

61 comments on “Open mike 18/01/2023 ”

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  1. Maurice 1
    17 January 2023 at 11:51 pm

    What is climate denial?

    Much of the stuff out there is discussion on how best to deal with climate change – it seems to me.

    We most certainly cannot have a Static Climate for it is certain changes have been continuously occurring over millions of years.

    Surely a policy of least present damage for least future damage has some attraction?

    I am trying not to ask questions that are too difficult to answer and hope that open communication can get to the best answer – for us all.

    [TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]

    • Drowsy M. Kram 1.1
      18 January 2023 at 12:11 am

      We most certainly cannot have a Static Climate for it is certain changes have been continuously occurring over millions of years.

      You've put your finger on it – the current rate of change is 'unnatural'.

      We’ve entered the era of unnatural disasters. Here’s what we must do [6 January 2023]
      What we do today will define our tomorrow. Our window of opportunity to avoid even more dangerous climate change is rapidly closing. It’s time to aim high and go fast.

    • weka 1.2
      18 January 2023 at 10:57 am

      For the purposes of commenting under my posts, here is what I consider climate denial,

      • doesn't believe climate change is real
      • believes CC is real but that the current rapid change in climate is not caused by human activities
      • believes CC is real, partially caused by humans but not that big a deal
      • believes that CC is real but will bring more benefits than downsides
      • believes that CC is real but won't be a problem for a long time.

      I also take a dim view of arguments along the lines of 'there's nothing we can do' or 'it's too late.

    • Incognito 1.3
      18 January 2023 at 12:09 pm

      Would you buy a car or a house from an unknown seller without enquiring first about their reputation and track record? Would you simply rely on online reviews from sources that you don’t know anything about? Or would you do a bit of research aka fact-checking and apply sound judgment to make well-informed decisions?

      The expected standard on The Standard is that commenters contribute to robust informed debate by making sound arguments founded on reality and presenting their reliable trustworthy information sources with links. This helps build a culture and community of trust and respect.

  2. Logie97 2
    18 January 2023 at 7:35 am

    SUVs no longer unaffordable for those desperately troubled Groundswell gentlemen?

    I may have misunderstood a recent advertising campaign but it would appear that the Triton (Mitsubishi) is being offered with the surcharge being paid for them by MMC. Now they might be able to buy another GPS-controlled-air conditioned-cab-tractor for exclusive use on demonstrations.

    • Graeme 2.1
      18 January 2023 at 8:13 am

      Mitisbushi have had to be very proactive to sell the Triton in Aotearoa. Reality is they're not that good compared to a Hilux or Ranger, very much built down to a price.

      In my circle they are referred to as an Itsbitsy Tighton.

      But reality is that demand is shifting very quickly from diesel double cabs to EVs

      Nearly double the Clean Car rebates ($203.3 million) have been paid for EVs and low emission vehicles compared with about $105.1m in fees collected for importing polluting vehicles.

      ….The Motor Industry Association (MIA) reported the surge in electrified vehicle sales for last year and December 2022, saying such registrations increased 77%.

      The rebate scheme is affirming what people want in the market and looks like the market is responding.

      I'm also hearing people say they are putting of buying a new ute until hybrids or BEVs come out later this year or early next. Unfortunately the decision is being driven by running cost and business image, rather than pure environmental thinking, but result is same.

    • Bearded Git 2.2
      18 January 2023 at 11:56 pm

      "black ute's matter" was their rather clever slogan

  3. Incognito 3
    18 January 2023 at 8:11 am

    Getting more free dental care is like pulling teeth. It seems a no-brainer but one with a huge price tag, allegedly. Let’s see if National and/or ACT will sink their teeth into this. My guess is that apart from the usual hollow meaningless National SM flutters they won’t.

    https://www.newsroom.co.nz/free-dental-care-a-political-win-but-a-financial-nightmare

    • Nic the NZer 3.1
      18 January 2023 at 8:28 am

      Thats a frankly absurd way to discuss dental care. The cost is completely irrelevant to the question.

      Probably there are some serious questions, such as would dentists want to work for a nationalised service, how would treatment costs be allocated and would it be worth the restructuring process in results. That would be worth discussing.

      I also expect changing from price rationing to need rationing would immediately demonstrate shortages of dentists.

      • Incognito 3.1.1
        18 January 2023 at 8:47 am

        No need to waste much time & energy on this as it is not top-priority. Government is clearing the desk for the policies that they will want to push through this year and an extension of free dental care ain’t one of those. If any other Party wants to campaign for/on it they’ll need to do the work and the onus is on them to sell it to the people aka voters. It is sensible politics in an election year, IMO.

    • SPC 3.2
      18 January 2023 at 8:56 am

      The article covers the knowns.

      The problem is lack of dentists and providing free service to those privileged enough to afford care now (and being in areas where they are available) is clearly not a priority.

      There are not enough for free care to those under 18's (and problems getting services to isolated areas – mobile vehicles being one lack atm)***.

      These are already in play

      1. free toothbrushes and toothpaste in schools***
      2. fluoride in water (for mine to 0.5)***
      3. heath education/healthy food in schools

      There has been the increase in subsidy for private dentist treatment (via Work and Income) from $300 to $1000 (improves chances to get a job/be work able).

      I would add that examination for tooth removal at hospitals is free for those with CSC, and they also do the removal. Those not eligible such as those in work have been pulling their own teeth out.

      There should be an extension of the free tooth removal to those on low incomes or otherwise a subsidy for such private dentist work.

      The next need is a subsidy for an annual check for those with CSC and low income parents.

      It is a known fact that poor dental care impacts on health – infections can lead to heart problems and thus cost to the health system.

      https://locustfamilydentistry.com/5-reasons-why-oral-hygiene-is-important/

    • Graeme 3.3
      18 January 2023 at 8:57 am

      Free dental 'care' means different things to different people. To someone on a benefit or minimum wage it means getting a tooth ache fixed so they can do more than just exist. To a retiree it's getting properly fitting dentures or implants so they can eat and converse to have a life. To someone entering the workforce at a mid to upper level it's getting your teeth straightened so you look acceptable and can get a good job. to an up and coming manager or sales professional it getting the perfect smile to really look the part. The industry is geared about leading customers to the expensive options.

      The cost of those services goes from a couple of hundred up into high tens of thousands + so setting the stage for some really intense boundary issues.

      I'm not sure how well the free treatment for under 18 works for people who haven't a hope of ever affording more cosmetic dental work. The places are set up to be comfortable to people who can afford extensive treatments and are quite intimidating if you can't. I think we lost a lot when the School Dental Service was shut down, that should have been broadened to be a multi disciplinary school health service in all schools. But I'm biased, Mum worked at the murder house.

      There used to be dental services through some of the DHBs at hospital level, but that was really for people who were in a very bad way and beyond a local anaesthetic.

      Probably the best option would be to make the dentist a primary healthcare provider and fund them like GPs, with similar treatment pathways to public or private services at different levels and funding sources.

      Right now though we're seeing people who are stuffed because they can't get, or afford dental care. Something's not working.

  4. Incognito 4
    18 January 2023 at 8:40 am

    What is Newsroom doing? Is it becoming the media-friendly face for Government announcements? Where is the critical analysis?

    Anywho:

    The policy work has been coming thick and fast, the Emissions Reduction Plan, Reshaping Streets, the clean car discount and the transport choices package to name a few.

    Major projects to get people out of their cars are also expected to make progress in 2023, including Auckland light rail and the long-awaited Let’s Get Wellington Moving plan.

    “We want to get on with early works for Auckland light rail next year, get a decision made on the preferred option for the alternative crossing, …

    https://www.newsroom.co.nz/pro/2023-when-rubber-hits-the-road-for-lgwm

    National MPs seem to be stuck in potholes and ACT is racing to get the speed limits dropped but hardly anything else as far as I can tell.

    • Bearded Git 4.1
      19 January 2023 at 12:04 am

      Someone says something positive about Labour's policies/achievements and they must be biased Incog?

      You have been reading the Herald too much.

  5. Adrian 5
    18 January 2023 at 9:02 am

    On dental care I have been under the impression for at least 50 years that the handbrake, in fact the full emergency stop, has been down to dentists. In the late 40s or early50s I think it was when theGovt of the day dragged doctors kicking and screaming into subsidised care the dentists held out. That’s why dental care is so bloody expensive, the dentists did not want the government determining the fee structure.

  6. Graeme 6
    18 January 2023 at 10:23 am

    https://twitter.com/nz_voter/status/1615420935317905408

    Yep. Had the same conversation with a mechanic last week. Walked him round that circle and maybe moderated his pretty rabid anti Government attitude.

  7. Jimmy 7
    18 January 2023 at 2:23 pm

    Judges need to actually impose a sentence that keeps people like this who constantly re-offend off the street to keep the public safe. Three months community detention……what a joke. He's probably already driving again!

    Lets hope they actually get around to installing the alcohol interlock although that doesn't stop him jumping into another vehicle.

    Drink-driver gives up attempt to flee police, sculls beer, throws away keys before arrest – NZ Herald

    • Incognito 7.1
      18 January 2023 at 2:50 pm

      You would have thrown him jail, no doubt, for how long? And then what?

      Only Judge Jimmy can judge Right.

      • Jimmy 7.1.1
        18 January 2023 at 3:07 pm

        The current deterrents are obviously not working. And from the article:

        "although he was attending counselling, Judge Krebs described his cavalier attitude of having a beer before his sessions as “counterproductive”."

        I would hate to be driving (or riding my bike) on the same road. The judge did say it warranted a prison sentence.

        Perhaps while in jail (I would suggest three to four months in jail) attending compulsory alcohol counselling where hopefully he cannot drink beforehand may make a difference. The interlocking device although not foolproof should be compulsory after jail IMO.

        • Incognito 7.1.1.1
          18 January 2023 at 9:10 pm
          • Counselling: tick
          • Alcohol interlock: tick
          • Three months’ community detention, with a 7pm to 7am curfew, and 18 months’ intensive supervision plus a zero alcohol licence for the next three years after 12 months of having the interlock in his car: tick
          • Being in a positive relationship and a pro-social family environment for the first time: tick
          • Jail time: no tick

          A very considered and bold sentence by Judge Jonathan, IMO. Judge Jimmy still has a lot to learn.

          • Jimmy 7.1.1.1.1
            19 January 2023 at 12:11 pm
            • "Three months’ community detention, with a 7pm to 7am curfew, and 18 months’ intensive supervision plus a zero alcohol licence for the next three years after 12 months of having the interlock in his car: tick"

            This wouldn't get the tick from judge Jimmy as we all know the intensive supervision would not be possible we do not have the resources, and he will coming and going as he pleases with an occasional check to see if he is sticking to the rules (of which he hasn't previously). Even the terrorist bloke who stabbed people in Countdown Lynn Mall had constant supervision.

            Be interesting to see if he gets caught again driving in several months time and we have the same debate.

  8. joe90 8
    18 January 2023 at 5:29 pm

    Being taxed into penury would be too good for this fucker. Let's eat him.

    https://twitter.com/yasmin_poole/status/1615133384036040709

    • SPC 9.1
      18 January 2023 at 8:32 pm

      1990 National cut benefits because of budget concern and yet also ended the estate tax.

      2008 Key increased GST to afford promised income tax cuts.

      2023 ACT want to reduce the incomes of the poor and cut tax for the rich.

  10. Stephen D 10
    18 January 2023 at 9:06 pm

    What’s the dirty politics going on in the National Party in Tukituki?

    ”Allegations of “dirty politics” have emerged from a National Party candidate selection, with one would-be MP claiming “concocted fabrications” and “half-truths” surround his bid for Parliament.”

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/01/election-2023-allegations-of-dirty-politics-in-national-candidate-selection-as-parties-set-to-kick-off-political-year.html

  11. Muttonbird 11
    18 January 2023 at 10:19 pm

    Tenants starting to see some justice after 2000 years. In this case a win for wrongful eviction. That's nice but what is better is the Tenancy Tribunal is finally slamming slumlords with (slightly) better fines and reparations. Said landlord had to pay the tenant $2000 for two years of illegal dealings. But that's just $20/week fine over the length of tenancy. Still a long way to go before amateur landlordism is crushed for good.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/tenant-given-notice-after-sparking-council-investigation-over-missing-rubbish-bin/2R6XYLIOWVCRBAEEYZDKJORTA4/

  12. weka 12
    18 January 2023 at 11:00 pm

    Eugenie Sage is leaving parliament this year, and I just heard on twitter that Jan Logie is too. Those are two experienced MPs the Greens are losing.