web analytics

Open Mike 18/05/2017

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, May 18th, 2017 - 29 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

29 comments on “Open Mike 18/05/2017 ”

  1. indiana 1

    “Labour’s website had the policy on it the very next day. Now I’m experienced enough to know that political rhetoric is just that. It is meant to appeal to a room full of nodding heads.”

    From http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11857784

    I hope people are not setting Little up.

    • Bearded Git 1.1

      @ Indiana

      It is a former ACT party candidate writing that article-and it is bollocks.

      As Damien O’Connor said on Back Benches last night, if people investing in a second house to rent out (speculating on capital gains in the process) don’t like the new tax law they can invest in something else.

      That is the point of the new law-to end favourable treatment of property speculation, whether for one house or twenty, and to help direct investment into more productive sources.

      The term “mum and dad” investors is a National Party construct-they are all speculators.

      • indiana 1.1.1

        ” if people investing in a second house to rent out (speculating on capital gains in the process) don’t like the new tax law they can invest in something else.”…or not vote Labour.

        I’ll admit that I own more than one house, but I never brought the second house thinking “Wow, I can’t wait to benefit from the capital gains!” – I would think that most New Zealanders would feel the same way. Little dropped the CGT as it was essentially seen as attacking hardworking Kiwi’s, but now he’s being driven to think that there is a “loophole” that speculators (Which Labour has not identified clearly who they are) are exploiting – but the end will come back to attack hard working Kiwi’s.

        • David 1.1.1.1

          Your accountant might have been thinking that you were benefitting from the capital gains… It’s an attitude thing, it’s so ingrained into our psyche to attain as much of this beautiful country as we can to ourselves, I blame Roger Douglas for the shock he inflicted on NZ, we’ve never recovered, and societally we think that acquiring property is the only way to prosperity. With so many ways to invest, that are more productive, I can’t see why people want housing, it’s a social need, not a profitable business. I like to think of myself as an entrepreneur, except for that pesky money thing, I’ve had 6 to 7 business ideas that I think would have succeeded, and half of those could have really taken off. Instead, I’m busting my arse to provide a life for my family, and hopefully own the roof over our heads one day, that’d be nice.

          Cue the usual trolls telling me I should work harder, or be smarter or prettier.

          • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1.1.1

            I like to think of myself as an entrepreneur, except for that pesky money thing, I’ve had 6 to 7 business ideas that I think would have succeeded, and half of those could have really taken off. Instead, I’m busting my arse to provide a life for my family, and hopefully own the roof over our heads one day, that’d be nice.

            Most of the country is in that position. They have ideas, would love to develop them but can’t because they don’t have access to the wherewithal necessary to do so. We lose a lot of possibilities because of this.

            It’s why I like a UBI. It would give people the backing necessary to develop their own ideas and we’d all be better off because of it.

            • mauī 1.1.1.1.1.1

              I enjoyed Gareth Morgan’s latest video on his facebook page. In it he interviews a young woman about a Universal Basic Income (UBI), she likes the idea because she would be paid for doing what she enjoys and wants to do – making music. He mentions that the volunteer workforce such as people doing environment work and elders in community orgs would be recognised by a UBI too, which the current economy doesn’t do (well sort of if you count Super).

        • weka 1.1.1.2

          “I would think that most New Zealanders would feel the same way.”

          You would be wrong then. Most people in NZ are fully aware that property values in most places in NZ have increased exponentially and that if you own an investment property you are going to make a lot more money because of that than just from the rent.

          Making money from increasing market values is by definition not what ‘hard working kiwis’ do. Your making money from doing essentially nothing is in fact hurting hard working kiwis across the board in the form of excessive mortgages, rents, and in some places a severe housing shortage.

          • indiana 1.1.1.2.1

            “Making money from increasing market values is by definition not what ‘hard working kiwis’ do.”

            You are right…it should be “Making money from increasing market values is what smart Kiwi’s do” Current home owners are not hurting others and it is wrong to imply that they are. What hurts non-home owners are councils and political parties that do not free up land for development so that more homes can be built and non-home owners hurt themselves by expecting governments to be the solution to all their woes.

            Fact of life: House values will always increase, only the rate of the increase will vary over time. Little learned this with his Brooklyn house increasing in value the most during a Labour led government Bu, he never said “You know what, I should be paying CGT for this” or “Oh my, I must really be hurting those hard working Kiwi’s”.

            • weka 1.1.1.2.1.1

              “Current home owners are not hurting others and it is wrong to imply that they are.”

              I didn’t say they are. I said people speculating in the property market are. They aren’t home owners. I’m also saying that people wanting to make money out of multiple properties for essentially doing nothing and then resisting paying tax are hurting others.

              There are places in NZ with lots of land and development and there are still people in those places who can’t find stable housing because of the whole housing crisis. So freeing up more land and slackening regulations is not a solution and in many cases will just make that worse as it inflates property prices even more. We need a nationwide solution that takes into account the many reasons why housing is in crisis, not quick fix silver bullets that ignore the base problems.

              “House values will always increase, only the rate of the increase will vary over time.”

              Yes, and it’s the rate of increase that is the problem. Hence the need for taxation and regulation.

            • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1.2.1.2

              You are right…it should be “Making money from increasing market values is what smart Kiwi’s do”

              No, that’s what bludgers do and it’s their sole purpose for being – getting lots from everyone else for doing nothing.

              Current home owners are not hurting others and it is wrong to imply that they are.

              It’s not the current home owners but the speculators – the people who expect to make money on the house. Of course, that does include many current home owners who are using their house as an ATM.

              And, yes, that does hurt society.

              What hurts non-home owners are councils and political parties that do not free up land for development so that more homes can be built

              No amount of land will do that if the houses aren’t being built and that is due to the developers not building them. there’s plenty of land available.

              House values will always increase

              But they shouldn’t. A house from one year to the next hasn’t increased in value at all so why should its price increase?

              • Graeme

                Need to make a distinction between “home owners” as in owner occupiers, and house owners, as in those who’s home is somewhere else. They own someone else’s home.

        • Bearded Git 1.1.1.3

          @Indiana
          …but I never brought the second house thinking “Wow, I can’t wait to benefit from the capital gains!”

          That’s right you bought the house thinking “I know this is going to lose 50% of its value over the next 5 years but that is ok because I love it”

          Yeah right.

  2. ianmac 2

    Fran O’Sullivan writes this:
    “The upshot is the PR massaging should not obscure the fact that Auckland still faces a humongous supply problem on the housing front. Housing deserves to be the number one election issue and solutions found for what is a big national issue.The upshot is the PR massaging should not obscure the fact that Auckland still faces a humongous supply problem on the housing front. Housing deserves to be the number one election issue and solutions found for what is a big national issue.”
    Mike the Flailing Minute says, “Housing is not an Election issue and Labour is wrong to try and make it so.”
    Can’ both be right. So umm.. who should I believe?
    Fan: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11857926

    • tc 2.1

      Nacts cheerleaders not being aligned makes for interesting times.

      • aerobubble 2.1.1

        Housing problem will explode after the election, Naffy nats need to make the election about something else, so they can act all surprised or make it a new ggovts problem fromopposotion. Delay,obfuscate and distract.

        • ianmac 2.1.1.1

          Yes aero. Wondered about that. Who will get the blame if next year under a Labour lead Government, house prices plummet. Will Labour get away with “9 long years of National Mismanagement?”

  3. Andre 3

    Tick tock tick tock.

    Robert Mueller is appointed Special Prosecutor.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/doj-special-counsel-russia-trump_us_591cbfa2e4b03b485cae5465?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

    So will it be a wide-ranging investigation like Ken Starr’s inquisition, or will it have narrow terms?

  4. Marco 4

    Just had a thought. If water (ie rain) is a public resource that no one should profit from, what about all those fruit growers, market gardeners etc – especially the ones that export. That’s “our” stuff they’re stealing isn’t it?

    • weka 4.1

      Two issues there. One is how the use of the commons affects everyone else, and whether some uses are theft. The other is how exporting affects ecologies and their cycles.

      The latter is more obvious with something like dairying where we are pulling the remaining fertility out of the ground and sending it overseas. It’s the worst kind of farming we can do, and there are plenty of other good ways to farm that don’t harm the land. But that doesn’t solve the exporting problem. Exporting commodities or even higher value products is inherently unsustainable both in terms of the land and watershed, and in AGW terms.

      In that sense, I agree it’s a theft, but I’m pretty sure that’s not what you were referring to. If you mean that because some farmers use rain to grow cabbage and then export them, that people should be allowed to mine water and export that, then that’s like saying hey those people over there are picking up money they find on the ground and spending it so it’s ok for us to rob a dairy. (inadequate analogy, but best I can do at lunchtime).

    • “Just had a thought”

      Sure you did, Marco. Just “thought” that selling a lettuce is “stealing”.
      Nah. Your “thought” is a desperate attempt to conflate actual resource theft (think, “Swamp Kauri”) with something we know to be bona fide. Rain falls, plants grow; putting water through an irrigation system and a cow is a different thing altogether.

    • Draco T Bastard 4.3

      what about all those fruit growers, market gardeners etc

      What about them? They should pay for the resources that they use at the market rate. Isn’t that how the market is supposed to work?

      Councils should do a lot of scientific research to determine how much can be removed from the ecosystem that supports us and then restrict the use of that water to that limit. That should help set the price that the council should charge.

  5. UncookedSelachimorpha 5

    The rush to flog the country to foreigners builds the Brighter Future at Silver Fern Farms this week – 370 jobs in the firing line.

    One week after the layoffs, no doubt WINZ will be subjecting the ex-workers to “working for you” seminars, “obligation failures” and telling them they are a bunch of drug using layabouts who just won’t get off their arses and find a job etc etc.

    Loving that Brighter Future!!

    • saveNZ 5.1

      +1 – Rod Oram has some interesting insight when the Silver Ferns merger went ahead. Basically for 50% share Shanghai Maling somehow got more than 50% control of how it was going to be run. It was unusual.

      Oh well. Silver Fern Farms, Cadbury, etc etc all about gutting the business and getting the profits offshore. Our Natz government and the business press, cheerleads this on.

      I guess it’s great not to care about any thing but themselves and only worry about clingling to power.

    • US/RS Jericho Station, Southland; sold to the man from Mainland China!

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • Twenty highlights of 2020
    As we welcome in the new year, our focus is on continuing to keep New Zealanders safe and moving forward with our economic recovery. There’s a lot to get on with, but before we say a final goodbye to 2020, here’s a quick look back at some of the milestones ...
    3 weeks ago

  • Bay Cadets learn skills to protect environment
    Bay Conservation Cadets launched with first intake Supported with $3.5 million grant Part of $1.245b Jobs for Nature programme to accelerate recover from Covid Cadets will learn skills to protect and enhance environment Environment Minister David Parker today welcomed the first intake of cadets at the launch of the Bay ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    8 hours ago
  • Cook Islanders to resume travel to New Zealand
    The Prime Minister of New Zealand Jacinda Ardern and the Prime Minister of the Cook Islands Mark Brown have announced passengers from the Cook Islands can resume quarantine-free travel into New Zealand from 21 January, enabling access to essential services such as health. “Following confirmation of the Cook Islands’ COVID ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Supporting communities and landowners to grow employment opportunities
    Jobs for Nature funding is being made available to conservation groups and landowners to employ staff and contractors in a move aimed at boosting local biodiversity-focused projects, Conservation Minister Kiritapu Allan has announced. It is estimated some 400-plus jobs will be created with employment opportunities in ecology, restoration, trapping, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Border exception for some returning international tertiary students
    The Government has approved an exception class for 1000 international tertiary students, degree level and above, who began their study in New Zealand but were caught offshore when border restrictions began. The exception will allow students to return to New Zealand in stages from April 2021. “Our top priority continues ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Tiwai deal gives time for managed transition
    Today’s deal between Meridian and Rio Tinto for the Tiwai smelter to remain open another four years provides time for a managed transition for Southland. “The deal provides welcome certainty to the Southland community by protecting jobs and incomes as the region plans for the future. The Government is committed ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • New member for APEC Business Advisory Council
    Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has appointed Anna Curzon to the APEC Business Advisory Council (ABAC). The leader of each APEC economy appoints three private sector representatives to ABAC. ABAC provides advice to leaders annually on business priorities. “ABAC helps ensure that APEC’s work programme is informed by business community perspectives ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Govt’s careful economic management recognised
    The Government’s prudent fiscal management and strong policy programme in the face of the COVID-19 global pandemic have been acknowledged by the credit rating agency Fitch. Fitch has today affirmed New Zealand’s local currency rating at AA+ with a stable outlook and foreign currency rating at AA with a positive ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Additional actions to keep COVID-19 out of NZ
    The Government is putting in place a suite of additional actions to protect New Zealand from COVID-19, including new emerging variants, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins said today. “Given the high rates of infection in many countries and evidence of the global spread of more transmissible variants, it’s clear that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • 19 projects will clean up and protect waterways
    $36 million of Government funding alongside councils and others for 19 projects Investment will clean up and protect waterways and create local jobs Boots on the ground expected in Q2 of 2021 Funding part of the Jobs for Nature policy package A package of 19 projects will help clean up ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Zealand Government acknowledges 175th anniversary of Battle of Ruapekapeka
    The commemoration of the 175th anniversary of the Battle of Ruapekapeka represents an opportunity for all New Zealanders to reflect on the role these conflicts have had in creating our modern nation, says Associate Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Kiri Allan. “The Battle at Te Ruapekapeka Pā, which took ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Better care for babies with tongue-tie
    Babies born with tongue-tie will be assessed and treated consistently under new guidelines released by the Ministry of Health, Associate Minister of Health Dr Ayesha Verrall announced today. Around 5% to 10% of babies are born with a tongue-tie, or ankyloglossia, in New Zealand each year. At least half can ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Prisoner disorder event at Waikeria Prison over
    The prisoner disorder event at Waikeria Prison is over, with all remaining prisoners now safely and securely detained, Corrections Minister Kelvin Davis says. The majority of those involved in the event are members of the Mongols and Comancheros. Five of the men are deportees from Australia, with three subject to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Pre-departure COVID-19 test for travellers from the UK and the US from 15 January
    Travellers from the United Kingdom or the United States bound for New Zealand will be required to get a negative test result for COVID-19 before departing, and work is underway to extend the requirement to other long haul flights to New Zealand, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins confirmed today. “The new PCR test requirement, foreshadowed last ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • PM congratulates New Year Honour recipients
    Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has added her warm congratulations to the New Zealanders recognised for their contributions to their communities and the country in the New Year 2021 Honours List. “The past year has been one that few of us could have imagined. In spite of all the things that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago
  • David Parker congratulates New Year 2021 Honours recipients
    Attorney-General and Minister for the Environment David Parker has congratulated two retired judges who have had their contributions to the country and their communities recognised in the New Year 2021 Honours list. The Hon Tony Randerson QC has been appointed a Companion of the New Zealand Order of Merit for ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago
  • New Year’s Honours highlights outstanding Pacific leadership through challenging year
    Minister for Pacific Peoples Aupito William Sio says the New Year’s Honours List 2021 highlights again the outstanding contribution made by Pacific people across Aotearoa. “We are acknowledging the work of 13 Pacific leaders in the New Year’s Honours, representing a number of sectors including health, education, community, sports, the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago
  • Supporting seniors to embrace technology
    The Government’s investment in digital literacy training for seniors has led to more than 250 people participating so far, helping them stay connected. “COVID-19 has meant older New Zealanders are showing more interest in learning how to use technology like Zoom and Skype so they can to keep in touch ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago