Open Mike 23/11/2017

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 23rd, 2017 - 138 comments
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138 comments on “Open Mike 23/11/2017 ”

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  1. ScottGN 1
    23 November 2017 at 6:09 am

    Roy Morgan
    http://roymorgan.com/findings/7419-roy-morgan-new-zealand-voting-intention-november-2017-201711220740

    “In November support for the newly elected Labour/NZ First/Greens Government was 54.5% (up 6% since early October) ahead of National/Act NZ on 41% (down 5.5%) with minor parties outside Parliament attracting the remaining 4.5% of support.”

    Michelle Levine goes on to say:
    “Ardern’s rise to the top job has seen an unprecedented spike in the Roy Morgan Government Confidence Rating – with 66.5% (up 8% since October) of New Zealanders saying New Zealand is ‘heading in the right direction’ contributing to a Roy Morgan Government Confidence Rating of 146.5 – the highest in nearly 8 years.”

    • Colonial Viper 1.1
      23 November 2017 at 6:47 am

      New Zealanders saying New Zealand is ‘heading in the right direction’ contributing to a Roy Morgan Government Confidence Rating of 146.5 – the highest in nearly 8 years.”

      The new government is enjoying a very good Confidence Rating – very similar to the levels of the last new government.

      • Carolyn_nth 1.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 6:49 am

        So, I guess the “minority government” attack line will be wearing a bit thin already – next spin line , please?

        • Colonial Viper 1.1.1.1
          23 November 2017 at 7:07 am

          Not exactly; National still knows that the LAB/GR election result is only 2.5% higher than the LAB/GR losing election result in 2008.

          National knows that erosion around the edges is all that is needed for 2020.

          • North 1.1.1.1.1
            23 November 2017 at 7:40 am

            Are you finding the Authoritarian Right more and more attractive CV?

            • greywarshark 1.1.1.1.1.1
              23 November 2017 at 9:52 am

              North
              Can you discuss the ideas please and stop showing your unreasoning bias and prejudice in your attitude to CV?

              I’m thinking here about the hostile personal response that CV seems to draw from a group of commenters here. It should be noted how this is an example of human behaviour that arises and leads to awful behaviour if unchecked. Someone is set up to be a pariah and vengeful negative attitudes are expressed and this builds in certain others. They combine and feel justified in joining in some negative action. In this case, in this forum, it takes the form of constant pecking by some commenters at the person themself, and heavy disagreement and contention with everything said in an effort to change the opinion to what is agreeable to the inquisitors, and there is animal-like hostile behaviour.

              It is different from taking exception to someone who is an everyday RW wingnut. This person has a sincere fixed opinion that is not simply Party-oriented, rote learned and part of the accepted wisdom of the comfortable classes. Instead of mining the view and trying to gain perspective, the
              intransigence of the commenter in taking a different line, is to be stifled and demolished.

              • savenz …
                23 November 2017 at 10:32 am

                Hear hear, greywarshark!

              • One Two …
                23 November 2017 at 12:00 pm

                GW, you have a delivery which is thoughtful, explanatory and perceptive

                • greywarshark …
                  23 November 2017 at 12:46 pm

                  tq. Holding onto fair and useful behaviour standards that work for us is important.

                  Because many civilised standards we thought were base to us and set in concrete are slipping away or just getting lip service, we become in danger of them being replaced by rigid authoritarian purist ‘strong-man’ or classist controls. We need balance and to hold that balance or we’ll get society that allows exclusion, hate and force at will.

                  Just to carry through on this thought. Think gun use in USA. and their lack of personal control and apparent inability to have reasonable redress through mediation on annoying situations. It has become acceptable to deal with people using force.

                  And the growth of diminishment and harrassment of people defined as ‘other’ and ‘them’ shows up in this example from Nazi Germany. As time went on and Jewish people were turned into pariahs by the authorities, no Jewish, or part Jewish family was allowed to keep a pet. ‘All pets should live in good Aryan homes.’ Just read it when I was reading some Klemperer, for those who are interested; it was classed as sadism by him. (I add that Victor Klemperer was amazed at the solidarity examples he met every day from ordinary Germans, who wished him well. They might give him some extra meat, or swear at the Fuhrer etc. You don’t hear much about the German people under the Nazi boot. But he notices it is from the proles that he receives these thoughtful honours, from communists and socialists.)

              • gsays …
                23 November 2017 at 2:32 pm

                Cheers grey, well said.
                It reminds me of two wise women- Helenen Kelly and my nana.
                “Be kind to each other” and “if you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all”

            • North 1.1.1.1.1.2
              23 November 2017 at 4:31 pm

              Seen the comments…….fair enough.

              • McFlock …
                23 November 2017 at 4:41 pm

                on the flipside, I just didn’t want to get into another fucking argument about him yet again. My opinion’s pretty close to yours.

  3. Ed 3
    23 November 2017 at 6:28 am

    George Monbiot
    ‘Our relentless consumption is trashing the planet.’

    ‘When you hear that something makes economic sense, this means it makes the opposite of common sense. Those sensible men and women who run the world’s treasuries and central banks, who see an indefinite rise in consumption as normal and necessary, are beserkers: smashing through the wonders of the living world, destroying the prosperity of future generations to sustain a set of figures that bear ever less relation to general welfare.

    Green consumerism, material decoupling, sustainable growth: all are illusions, designed to justify an economic model that is driving us to catastrophe. The current system, based on private luxury and public squalor, will immiserate us all: under this model, luxury and deprivation are one beast with two heads.

    We need a different system, rooted not in economic abstractions but in physical realities, that establish the parameters by which we judge its health. We need to build a world in which growth is unnecessary, a world of private sufficiency and public luxury. And we must do it before catastrophe forces our hand.’

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/nov/22/black-friday-consumption-killing-planet-growth

    • Ed 3.1
      23 November 2017 at 6:30 am

      And Rachel Stewart on the same subject.

      ‘Why Christmas is killing us all.’

      ‘Because here we are in 2016. The planet is burning in front of our eyes but we’re still going to buy those gifts, damn it! Because the world’s a grim and depressing place, so shut up and let me do this for strangers, as well as friends and family. I want to make them smile. Don’t judge me!

      But I am going to judge you, and judge you hard. Strap yourself in.

      If you’re not consciously thinking about this stuff, then you’re part of the problem.

      Study after study shows that consumption now dwarfs population as the main environmental threat on earth.

      Indeed, most of the extra consumption has so far been – but is rapidly changing – in wealthy countries that have long since stopped adding substantial numbers to their population. Like us.

      Moreover, is it making anybody happy? Will those carefully wrapped presents in all their plastic glory keep anyone deeply delighted for more than an hour or two? Let’s be honest with ourselves.

      Sure, I get that you want to please your kids but, really? Is this the way to go? Is there not an argument for opting out of this madness and telling them why?

      I’m sure that most Secret Santa fans (and many bog-standard Xmas worshippers) are sane, rational human beings. They’re among the first to jump on social media and lament the loss of hundreds of species a day, or the vast inequality and poverty we see in our own country and around the world.

      Except ironically, there appears to be this huge disconnect about what causes these events. Capitalism will literally be the death of us, our children, and humanity. But still we turn away, avert our eyes and do little to change the perfect storm bearing down on us.

      It’s getting beyond urgent but, hey, let’s all have a cutesy cultural norm of a festive season. The economy depends on it, and the unequal wealth generated from it needs to be distributed to the usual suspects. Growth, growth, growth!

      While you’re sitting around the tucker table and raising a glass to family, all misty-eyed about how much you care about future generations, raise the subject of just how serious climate change is becoming. How the Arctic ice is melting as quickly as the ice cream left out of the freezer by Uncle Bob. See how that conversation goes down.

      They’ll call you “Grinch” and tell you to just enjoy the day. There’s nothing you can do about it anyway. Which is exactly how we got into this hellbeast of a planetary mess.’

      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11770187

      • Draco T Bastard 3.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 11:43 am

        All the evidence tells us that we should stop doing what we are but our politicians and rich people tell us that it can be no other way, There Is No Alternative (TINA).

        This is, of course, bollocks. A few people just don’t want all the wealth and power that they’ve absconded with taken from them as it needs to be.

  4. eco maori 4
    23 November 2017 at 7:28 am

    Country of origin labling should be part of the consumers guarantees act so we can chose wisely the quality of what we eat that’s the angle I would take on that subject of food labeling .
    If I see or find a good Idea I don’t care were It comes from I will use it as the good idea will make me more successful and could save time and money so don’t listen to the bullies people talk about China controlling there people.
    OUR world can see that our coalition government is honest and humane government
    and Jacinda popularity is rising and so is OUR’s with her ka pai Forbes well they are all about the wealthy !!!!!!! so there statements are bullshit. Remember this Iwi it is not a fact until it is proven to be a fact 300 od years ago we would believe that OUR earth is flat now we no it is not flat but some idiot is spending heaps of money to try and prove that it is flat well that’s what the bullies are trying to do to they are making statements to try and damage Eco Maori Me YEA Right this shows the quality of our civil servants left to us from 9 years of national Its not about Justice Its about the system is always being right. Winston that’s exactly what I was thinking that one would have to be a soothsayer to answer Jack’s question . Ka pai

    • savenz 4.1
      23 November 2017 at 10:37 am

      +1 ecoMaori, “Country of origin labling should be part of the consumers guarantees act so we can chose”

    • Draco T Bastard 4.2
      23 November 2017 at 11:56 am

      If I see or find a good Idea I don’t care were It comes from I will use it as the good idea will make me more successful and could save time and money so don’t listen to the bullies people talk about China controlling there people.

      China is building influence around the world in subtle and not so subtle ways.

      We should be concerned about this. China should not have influence upon our politicians or any other country’s politicians.

      Remember this Iwi it is not a fact until it is proven to be a fact 300 od years ago we would believe that OUR earth is flat…

      The Ancient Greeks worked out that the Earth wasn’t flat over 2500 years ago:

      The idea of a spherical Earth appeared in Greek philosophy with Pythagoras (6th century BC), although most pre-Socratics (6th – 5th century BC) retained the flat Earth model. Aristotle provided evidence for the spherical shape of the Earth on empirical grounds by around 330 BC. Knowledge of the spherical Earth gradually began to spread beyond the Hellenistic world from then on.

      But, yes, belief still existed beyond that. The same can be said of capitalism. It’s been proven to be a failure, time and time again, and yet still people believe it to be the only workable socio-economic system.

      But, after all that, I still have NFI WTF you were going on about. There’s no context and no logical progression to your rant.

  5. eco maori 5
    23 November 2017 at 8:14 am

    Well I’m thinking of running in my local elections next time they come up I will stir them up and make them serve the people and mother earth.
    On shortages of labour these people are crying that they need 5000 workers . In reality it is much cheaper for business to hire foreign labour It is cheaper to recruit them and pay them . So the big picture is Business will have to part with more cash to recruit Kiwi’s as OUR unemployment rate aint O% so Kiwi workers are there waiting for work and business will have to treat OUR kiwi workers like diamonds and polish and look after them which is what happens under a left lead Government. I can remember when
    the Helen Clark Government won our election the price of fuel went up this is big business response to a Government that puts Iwi before there profits WHAT big business has not grasped is that the more evenly that OUR resources are spread the more we have to spend an the more profits they make everyone’s happy so if I was a big business CEO I would be backing OUR new coalition government . Many thanks to OUR lady’s sports teams for there win’s I can see that you don’t like publicity but this is the way OUR world works and this is what is needed to get more ladies into power to run OUR world in a humane way Kia Kaha ladies I like horses they are wonderful intelligent beings as all animals are .Ka pai

  6. garibaldi 6
    23 November 2017 at 8:19 am

    Eco, we in the Greens have been wanting “country of origin” labelling for years. If my memory serves me well it was turned down by Helen’s lot. The food industry has powerful lobbyists and doesn’t want us to know the truth about our foods in so many ways.

  7. eco maori 7
    23 November 2017 at 8:23 am

    Gull got 10 cent discount today till 12 am tomorrow once again I filled up yesterday at Gull Ka pai

  8. Morrissey 8
    23 November 2017 at 9:02 am

    GROPERS
    No. 8: Rolf Harris

    The woman said she was “shocked and confused” by Harris’s actions.

    “I certainly didn’t flirt with him. He could have been my grandfather,” she said. She did not complain to the police at the time because even her father was dismissive when he heard what happened, the court was told.

    After telling her father Harris was a “dirty old man” and had “a bit of a go”, she said he replied: “you shouldn’t have worn that tight pink jumper”.

    https://www.themorningbulletin.com.au/news/harris-nicknamed-groper-rolf-says-his-accuser-cour/3179291/

    https://donaldelley.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/rhs_rolfharris0.jpg

    “GROPERS” is presented by GroperWatch, a division of Daisycutter Sports Inc.
    More gropers…
    
No.1 George Herbert Walker Bush; No. 2 Bill O’Reilly; No. 3 Al Franken; No. 4 Robin Brooke; No. 5 Lester Beck; No. 6 Arnold Schwarzenegger; No. 7 Joe Biden

  9. Morrissey 9
    23 November 2017 at 9:19 am

    Deadbeat Dads
    No. 5: This Old Etonian pig f***er treated his eight year old daughter with almost the same cavalier disregard as he treated the poor.

    Its disclosure in the Sun newspaper has the potential to embarrass Cameron, coming on the day the government launched a fresh drive to tackle “problem families” who lead chaotic lives and cost taxpayers millions of pounds in policing and welfare costs.

    Cameron and his wife Samantha only discovered their eldest child was missing when they returned to their official country residence, Chequers in Buckinghamshire, 40 miles northwest of London.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-cameron-daughter/cameron-left-eight-year-old-daughter-in-pub-idUSBRE85A0AE20120611</blockquote)

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/david-cameron-accused-of-sex-act-with-a-dead-pig

    Deadbeat Dad No. 1: Sir John Key
    Deadbeat Dad No. 2: Bill English
    Deadbeat Dad No. 3: Sir Douglas Graham
    Deadbeat Dad No. 4: John Banks

  10. adam 10
    23 November 2017 at 9:44 am

    Google loves you. Well your compliance and money – that it really loves.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWDmelZxgoI&ab_channel=TopTenz

  11. eco maori 11
    23 November 2017 at 9:58 am

    The Rock keeps a smile on my face when i drive to work Kia Kaha IwI

  12. halfcrown 12
    23 November 2017 at 10:44 am

    Sorry cannot separate each video, but the first one Capitalism, if it wasn’t so true it would be funny.

    https://www.facebook.com/pg/gritpost/videos/?ref=page_internal

  13. Ad 13
    23 November 2017 at 11:29 am

    Sir Michael Cullen will lead the Tax Working Group.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11947072

    Working For Families is not included in the review and gets its own review.

    Other members of the group will be announced before Christmas and will include a diverse range of tax and finance experts, Robertson said. Final recommendations are expected by February 2019, but significant changes would not come into force until the 2021 tax year – as promised on the election campaign.

    Certain areas will be outside the group’s scope, including increasing income tax rates, the rate of GST, inheritance tax and changes that would apply to the family home or the land beneath it.

    Any change won’t come into effect until 2021.

    • alwyn 13.1
      23 November 2017 at 1:45 pm

      This is going to cost $4 million!
      Reading the Herald article I reckon they could do it for the price of a single copy of the paper. All you would have to do is cut out Robertson’s instructions and hand them back to him. He has told them every thing the are to put in, or leave out, right there.
      Meanwhile another $4,000,000.00 goes down the drain.

      • Stunned Mullet 13.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 2:21 pm

        C’mon now Michael needs a fine taxpayer trough to gorge at now that his gig at NZ Post has finished.

        National and Labour looking after their own since forever – a pox on them all.

      • gsays 13.1.2
        23 November 2017 at 2:36 pm

        You are right, $4M could get us 1/6th of a flag referendum.

      • tracey 13.1.3
        23 November 2017 at 4:12 pm

        What did the job summit cost? And the “nothing to see here but we will look anyway” trust investigation ( not as a result of panama papers)?

    • DoublePlusGood 13.2
      23 November 2017 at 5:10 pm

      What the hell is the point if increasing income tax rates, GST rates, inheritance tax and land tax are out of scope? Those are exactly the things that need to change!

      • McFlock 13.2.1
        23 November 2017 at 5:18 pm

        Look like they’re targeting company tax and capital gains taxes – which are also things that need to change.

        But yeah, GST and personal income taxes especially need to be nuked and made more progressive, respectively.

    • Puckish Rogue 14.1
      23 November 2017 at 12:06 pm

      I’m a little…uneasy about all this. Do people get second chances or not, is he “allowed” to go back to his former occupation as others have and if not why not?

      Is tv presenting a job or is it something exalted so is a privilege, if he was a storeperson or a builder or something else would people still care

      Are some crimes irredeemable?

      • tracey 14.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 12:13 pm

        Have you not known he has been on Radiosport for years?

        As for second chances, most beneficiaries get no chances in NZ and they didn’t break anyone’s back.

      • Psycho Milt 14.1.2
        23 November 2017 at 12:59 pm

        Are some crimes irredeemable?

        Sure. I can’t imagine Himmler saying “Actually I feel pretty bad about the Holocaust now” and everyone saying “Oh, he’s sorry now, give him another chance.”

        Veitch would be redeemable, but there are a few things involved in redemption. First up is remorse – Veitch has never shown any. If anything, he considers himself a constant victim of liberal virtue-signallers.

        Next up is self-reflection and awareness of why people are angry about what you did. Veitch’s level of self-awareness is well illustrated by his tweet describing his new show as “hard-hitting.”

        Last up is humility. He has none.

      • Cinny 14.1.3
        23 November 2017 at 2:22 pm

        PR, the thing with domestic violence is they usually have been given many second chances. There’s usually been many more incidents before one gets the police involved.

        • Puckish Rogue 14.1.3.1
          23 November 2017 at 3:13 pm

          I don’t watch or listen to the guy but would the reaction be the same if he was a tradesman, would people still be saying he shouldn’t be a builder?

          Some of it is sounding uncomfortably like its because hes on the “wrong” team he shouldn’t have a job in broadcasting

          • Pete 14.1.3.1.1
            23 November 2017 at 3:34 pm

            If Veitch were working for some outfit in their media stable would Stuff have been so condemnatory? (Don’t for heaven’s sake suggest they wouldn’t take him on because they have ethics or morals.)

            I don’t like him at all in his work. I do not like his style of person. He eminently suits the way the media operates in 2017.

            For some to say he shouldn’t be given a platform though, he’s had a prominent radio platform for some years since his case. There is no reason if those protesting are to be consistent that the campaign against him cannot be taken to NZME.

            Having said that, there are some who seemingly still wouldn’t be be satisfied even if he committed Hara-Kiri on the steps of Parliament.

            At least Veitch can smile about the Veitch type hyperbole and ‘journalism’ from Kylie Klein Nixon on Stuff: “Do you know what it takes to break a human back? Apparently it’s roughly 4000 newtons, or enough force to bend a car door in half.”

            She mightn’t have had much to do with others who’ve had bones broken in their backs but she sure listened to the advice about spicing up an article.

            • Psycho Milt 14.1.3.1.1.1
              23 November 2017 at 3:43 pm

              Well, yes, she could just have written “You have to kick someone pretty fucking hard to fracture their spine” instead, but I don’t think Veitchy comes out of that smelling any sweeter.

            • mauī 14.1.3.1.1.2
              23 November 2017 at 4:05 pm

              Plenty of people would be quite satisfied if he took up a building job and never made the public spotlight again.

            • tracey 14.1.3.1.1.3
              23 November 2017 at 4:48 pm

              I stopped listening to radiosport when they re employed him with unseemly haste and advised SKY this morning I woukd cancel that subscription. Both stances are about the brushing aside of domestic violence cos sport is king and so forth

            • Draco T Bastard 14.1.3.1.1.4
              23 November 2017 at 5:43 pm

              For some to say he shouldn’t be given a platform though, he’s had a prominent radio platform for some years since his case.

              And he shouldn’t have. Not until he’s adequately apologised and shown that he understands that what he did was wrong.

              I expect Hell to freeze over first.

          • McFlock 14.1.3.1.2
            23 November 2017 at 3:49 pm

            Media roles are public roles. These days, whether you’re a politician, sports player, or talking head, people look up to you. You set an example. It’s part of the job.

            Part of Veitch’s problem is that he not only did a seriously bad thing, but he still really has no idea why it was bad and is completely tone deaf when it comes to his actions. See milt’s comment for what “redemption” can mean.

            edit: the thing about media personalities is that they leverage their work off their image. So if they do something that screws with their image and then complain that they can’t get work, it’s like me downloading viruses onto my work computer and complaining that the thing is running slow.

            • tracey 14.1.3.1.2.1
              23 November 2017 at 4:50 pm

              +1m

              You do not get to choose to be a role model. Children choose who they look up to based on many reasons from pleasing tgeir parents to marketing. So those who say “he shouldnt be a role model” educate yourselves. The reason media get inflated salaries is precisely because we have distorted views of them. It irks me when people say this shit.

          • tracey 14.1.3.1.3
            23 November 2017 at 4:13 pm

            He. Has. A. Job.

          • Draco T Bastard 14.1.3.1.4
            23 November 2017 at 5:48 pm

            If he was a builder would he have had access to the NZHerald pages to claim that he was actually the victim while not apologising for the harm that he had caused?

          • Cinny 14.1.3.1.5
            23 November 2017 at 6:12 pm

            Going to be straight up honest with you PR

            For me i think the issue is that he is in the public eye, a public figure, and a sporting figure. I feel that’s different from being say a tradesperson, who would not be in the public eye, won’t be on any billboards etc.

            Yeah I think that’s my hang up about it all. Sounds a bit two faced, one law for public figures and another for everyone else, but it’s how I feel. Maybe because I see someone who is a public figure as a possible role model for others, a public representation of a companies brand etc. And maybe my feelings have a bit to do with the whole macho sports thing, which seems to be cropping up again and again of late.

            Maybe I would feel different about it if he had say made an effort to acknowledge his wrong doings by speaking to kids about domestic violence, like doing a boys school road show etc. Doing something rather than donating $ etc.

            I heard on the wireless that he didn’t even apologise to the lady whose back he broke.

            Honestly have no clue where his political preferences sit.

            Hope that makes sense 🙂

    • mauī 14.2
      23 November 2017 at 1:44 pm

      Looks like they saw him as potentially impacting their share price,

  15. Puckish Rogue 15
    23 November 2017 at 11:59 am

    Heavens above its tiring work keeping up with the governments flip-flops/backtracks/misspokes 🙂

    http://norightturn.blogspot.co.nz/2017/11/climate-change-fudging-on-trees.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11946729

    But, helpfully, kiwiblog has a couple of new counters on its site, the kiwibuild deficit and the tree deficit, good of him to help out I guess

    https://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/

    • tracey 15.1
      23 November 2017 at 12:14 pm

      We can all compare it to BlIps. You rated BlIps stuff ay?

      • Puckish Rogue 15.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 12:20 pm

        Nationals not in power so now its the present governments turn to have to live up to its pre-election promises

        Don’t worry I promise not to enjoy pointing out every single time the government fails to live up to its pledges 🙂

        • alwyn 15.1.1.1
          23 November 2017 at 1:41 pm

          I suppose you must have a job to do that takes up some of your time.
          I think it would probably be a full time occupation trying to keep up a record of all the times they flip/flop on a pledge.

          • Puckish Rogue 15.1.1.1.1
            23 November 2017 at 3:06 pm

            Fortunately my job does come with a computer but unfortunately they kind of expect me to produce work every now and then so i won’t be able to list all of the governments failings

            Kind of annoying really 🙂

          • McFlock 15.1.1.1.2
            23 November 2017 at 3:06 pm

            nah, like you he just parrots lines from the dirty politics team and is pretty much done in five minutes.

            • Puckish Rogue 15.1.1.1.2.1
              23 November 2017 at 3:14 pm

              Mostly because I work so I can’t really spend as much time as I’d like on here because as enjoyable as this is sometimes its not as enjoyable as getting paid

        • tracey 15.1.1.2
          23 November 2017 at 4:52 pm

          As long as you have an awareness of your hypocrisy 🙂

        • Kevin 15.1.1.3
          23 November 2017 at 8:21 pm

          All good PR, although I will never tire of saying it’s all Nationals fault, for the next 9 years.

    • McFlock 15.2
      23 November 2017 at 3:05 pm

      Yawn. I take it the trees link is what I saw in the paper today where apparently two times 500million trees does not equal 1 billion trees planted?

      Math says different.

      • Puckish Rogue 15.2.1
        23 November 2017 at 3:10 pm

        “Partnership with the private sector is one thing, but misleading the public about the ambition of the policy is another. Because the 50 million trees a year private industry currently plants is almost entirely replanting, replacing trees which they’ve already cut down. In other words, that’s just planting to stand still. Worse, the required replanting rate is going to soar over the next decade, as the forests that were planted in the 1990’s are harvested. If private industry wants to avoid deforesting land (and paying the carbon costs for doing so), it will probably end up planting that billion trees itself.”

        Computer says no

  16. greywarshark 16
    23 November 2017 at 1:09 pm

    Smart thinking by live NZs with Heart, Kindness and Practicality. Three attributes that will take us in the right direction to some happiness and security of conditions.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/98817463/wellington-op-shop-helping-divert-landfill-waste-with-firstofitskind-sewing-initiative

    Excellent grassroots, bottom up initiative and with ten thousand of these, or more, say one in every town and every city suburb, we will have the basis of a living country we can all be proud of. What about a series of articles put out on government media, and under the heading of Growth in Micro-business, and added to each time an authenticated, well-run, near target, or not for profit business is ready to be exhibited to encourage the others? We need a pragmatic but not capitalistic manager with flexibility to lead this. And don’t have it anywhere near Stuart Nash Minister of Small Business.

  17. Penny Bright 17
    23 November 2017 at 2:20 pm

    NZ WHISTLE-BLOWER UPDATE!
    (Thursday 23 November 2017)

    DIRECT ACTION WORKS!

    ‘Pocket’ occupation on Old Mill Rd traffic island, Westmere, Auckland stops the Auckland Transport juggernaut in its tracks…

    ‪https://i.stuff.co.nz/auckland/99019915/Auckland-Transport-faces-rising-backlash-as-shop-owners-across-super-city-say-it-is-destroying-their-businesses‬

    ‪”Auckland Transport faces rising backlash as shop owners across super city say it is destroying their businesses | Stuff.co.nz”‬

    Who will benefit if small local businesses wither and die?

    The multi-national malls?

    Overseas investor$ and property developer$?

    Follow the dollar ….

    #ThinkForYourself
    ‪#StopKillingLocalBusinesses‬
    ‪#NoParkingNoStoppingNoShopping‬
    ‪#CyclewaysSavingThePlanetByDestroyingLocalCommunities‬
    #WellDoneLisaPrager
    #BringingLocalBackIntoAucklandLocalGovernment

  18. ianmac 18
    23 November 2017 at 2:32 pm

    “Two police officers have been found not guilty of kidnapping a 17-year-old boy to end a young love affair.”
    A wise and fair decision.

  19. eco maori 19
    23 November 2017 at 2:43 pm

    Well I decided to change the water pump in my truck well had to the fan belts were squeaking that means the bearing are gone there was movement in the pump. I rang around and found the cheapest pump in Rotorua but when I went pick it up the price had gone up buy $60 so I brought it I tried to get the original price but the boy just would not budge he gave me a cheap price to get me into the shop and change the price this shop is across the road from Repco I’m not going there again Ka pai. Now you iwi with vehicles that’s has a 21st well you must change the oil every six months because the oil is like the blood of the motor even if the oil is full if you do not charge the oil the oil gets thick as sludge and makes your car use more fuel and over heat and the gaskets will dry out and leak oil should only cost $50 for a petrol car for oil and filter and use you tube to show you how to change the oil on the make of your car type in make and year and how to change oil and you are away it’s good you got YouTube I had to learn by trial and error blew up 2 cars before I figure that out you will save $50 on your fuel bill in one month. lol Ka pai

    • eco maori 19.1
      23 November 2017 at 3:02 pm

      PS Google how to change air filter to but you just have to give this a bang and vacuum the dust out of it if you can not afford a new air filter and that will save you fuel and money Ka Pai

      • eco maori 19.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 5:25 pm

        If you wash your car with washing soap powder you will get it clean and it will shine to Ka pai

    • Cinny 19.2
      23 November 2017 at 6:14 pm

      You are such a good buzz Eco 🙂

  20. Rosemary McDonald 20
    23 November 2017 at 2:57 pm

    Supreme Court rules….http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/344548/pike-river-prosecution-withdrawal-unlawful-supreme-court

    “…the payment was in exchange for the withdrawal of the prosecution and was unlawful.”

    We all knew that…but makes my day to hear the Supreme Court agrees.

    Well done.

    • Ad 20.1
      23 November 2017 at 3:07 pm

      +100
      Bring it.

      • ianmac 20.1.1
        23 November 2017 at 3:35 pm

        Yes. It seems as though big business can avoid prosecution by being Big. Erebus Inquiry anyone? Winebox enquiry?

      • James 20.2.1
        23 November 2017 at 3:28 pm

        The one thing I really disagree with in this is that if it was unlawful he should still face the charges.

        • Graeme 20.2.1.1
          23 November 2017 at 3:52 pm

          Like to be a fly on the wall at the upper level’s of both WorkSafe, and Whittal’s insurance company right now.

          And why should parties who engage in illegal and /or corrupt practices to avoid prosecution not be held accountable for both the corrupt / illegal practice and the original unlawful activity?

        • tracey 20.2.1.2
          23 November 2017 at 4:57 pm

          On what basis?

          • McFlock 20.2.1.2.1
            23 November 2017 at 5:04 pm

            On the basis that the suppression of the charges was illegally purchased, therefore shouldn’t count.

            Although that opens up a further can of worms about “charges dropped – 5 years later SURPRISE! They’re back on!”

            It would be poetic that anyone complicit in such a deal should face sentencing according to the likely sentences of the original charges, had they obtained a conviction.

            edit: although being on the same side as James does give me pause for thought, lol

        • tracey 20.2.1.3
          23 November 2017 at 5:26 pm

          “It is accepted by them that orders to set aside the
          decision to offer no evidence and to require the prosecution to proceed is no longer an
          available option with the passage of time”

          • McFlock 20.2.1.3.1
            23 November 2017 at 5:29 pm

            Translation: an insurance company can buy you out of a worksafe charge, appeal it through the entire court system, and by the time the transaction is overruled you get away with it.

            • Draco T Bastard 20.2.1.3.1.1
              23 November 2017 at 5:38 pm

              Considering that does seem to be what happened then charges of corruption need to be laid.

              Unfortunately, we probably don’t have such charges. The lack of such charges seems to be based on the but we’re the least corrupt country in the world argument.

            • tracey 20.2.1.3.1.2
              23 November 2017 at 5:41 pm

              Agree

              Justice still for sale…

              The company let Whittal take the fall in return for the insurance payout and then he woukd never have to defend himself which woukd probably impact a Board member or more?

        • Draco T Bastard 20.2.1.4
          23 November 2017 at 5:35 pm

          I think he should. The charges were dropped on the understanding that >$3 million dollars was going to be paid to the families. Immediately after the charges were dropped the company would up and no payment was made.

          And that >$3 million plus interest should now come directly out of his pocket.

          • tracey 20.2.1.4.1
            23 November 2017 at 5:42 pm

            I thought the payment from whitall was covered by insurance, the company skipped payment of the fine by folding up

            • Draco T Bastard 20.2.1.4.1.1
              23 November 2017 at 5:57 pm

              Yeah, it was. I quickly read in an article this morning that they’d received no payment but that must have been the company that hadn’t paid because it got folded up before hand.

          • alwyn 20.2.1.4.2
            23 November 2017 at 5:54 pm

            Are you actually claiming that no payment was ever made?
            If that is what you mean do you have any evidence for that claim?
            It wasn’t the mine owners who were supposed to be paying, and who were the company that was wound up.
            It was their Insurance company.

          • Rosemary McDonald 20.2.1.4.3
            23 November 2017 at 5:56 pm

            ” Immediately after the charges were dropped the company would up and no payment was made.”

            Not quite, DTB.

            http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/pike-river-mine-disaster/9553523/Payout-to-Pike-River-families-under-way

            The decision makes an interesting read. Examining the machinations required to make the illegal appear legal is truly fascinating.

            I’m not overly impressed that… “Further legal advice was then taken from in-house counsel, as well from Mr Stanaway and Crown Law, although privilege in the advice was not waived and details are not before the Court.”

            You’d think that under the circumstances, some pressure would be brought to bear to waive such privilege…..

    • Tracey 20.3
      23 November 2017 at 4:09 pm

      Another report says in exchange for suppressing a prosecution!

  21. Ad 21
    23 November 2017 at 5:04 pm

    Deutsche Weller documentary on how Kiribati is quickly dying as a nation through sea level rise::

    http://www.dw.com/en/top-stories/documentary-report/s-32861

    It’s pretty dark.

    • bwaghorn 21.1
      23 November 2017 at 6:04 pm

      they are the refugees we should be preparing for , but most likely we’ll wait till at least one island gets wiped clean in a storm first

    • ianmac 21.2
      23 November 2017 at 7:01 pm

      Silly question but is the sea level rising or the land sinking? The Marlborough Sounds as sunken valleys are very slowly sinking further.

      • mac1 21.2.1
        23 November 2017 at 7:09 pm

        The Marlborough Wairau plain sank a metre in the 1848 earthquake allowing vessels to ply the Opawa river to the site where Blenheim now stands. So both land movement and sea level change is possible, up or down. I understand that northern Europe is rising in reaction to the Ice Age being no more in a phenomenon called glacial rebound. ( Not that I’m trying to deny climate change).

  22. ianmac 22
    23 November 2017 at 7:27 pm

    Kiribati is a coral based island group I think and susceptible to undersea erosion. But still it doesn’t really matter to the people, as wet feet are very real and the future is grim. Considering the relatively tiny population it should be possible to rehouse in places like NZ.

    • Pat 22.1
      23 November 2017 at 8:35 pm

      ya think?…Christchurch cant manage to rehouse a few 10s of people in Southshore post quake…how will we deal with the likes of South Dunedin (i.e)?….the public and political will is not there….”Im alright Jack” exemplified

      p.s on rereading i realise i have misinterpreted your post but will keep the post as the question is still valid

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