Depends what you mean. There was a general stoppage of comments last night by accident. In the post edit screen there is a button to moderate comments for that post.
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In the discussion settings screen there is a setting to require that only logged in users are able to comment. This is used by some sites who want to restrict comment writing access. Kiwiblog is probably the most noticeable.
We use different techniques which tend to allow a wider and less selective participation.
However, the setting screen used when banning commenters, and releasing them from bans. Which is a bit of a nuisance as the toggle gets hit by accident and turned on. Especially by overly sensitive touchpad clickareas. It has happened a few times over the last decade.
When I get my machines set up again (just moving apartments), I’ll get the style sheet to hide the button.
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If you mean that certain posts get full moderation (ie they must be released by a moderator). That happens occasionally, and usually on guest posts from politicians or posts about client change or ones that outrage misogynist idiots. That is to reduce the workload on moderators cleaning up after children who can’t behave with any degree of decorum
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Could you please try to be more precise when asking questions. My toleration for wide open diffuse questions is pretty limited.
Sorry, some of the new topics today require a commenter to be logged in with WordPress to be able to comment. I think that’s the first of the two options you provided.
Nice to know that after all this time Bill English at last thinks its time to concentrate on jobs and incomes . . .
About the only thing in those he would be concerned with would be the wages and how to lower them to ‘make us more competitive’. One way to do that is to import people to fill job slots.
The student spoke on the condition of anonymity because most in the programme had signed non-disclosure agreements before starting on the programme.
She believed the complaints and leaks to the media were driven by one or two interns who had a beef with the programme. She claimed one was dropped from a leadership position on the programme after allegedly taking bottles of wine from Labour MP Jenny Salesa’s house after Salesa hosted a meal for them.
…
She said it was disappointing to read comments in the media about “sweatshop” conditions and “slave labour”.
“Three meals a day, every single day, were provided. The care they have provided is comprehensive. The one thing that has cause a bit of chatter is the cubicle situation, which I understand is not ideal. But the sweatshop conditions, where we were rallied into a line and forced to work, that’s not true at all.”
She defended Awataha marae, saying most were moved into proper living quarters on the marae which are “more than ideal”.
“The food is great and they are very accommodating.”
She said many others shared her view but could not speak because of the non-disclosure agreements.
McCarten’s (and the Marae) supporters come out in support of McCarten and Te Awataha Marae:
So the students were offered something that turned out to be not true, but the students are very aware of who is at fault and it is not the Labour party leadership, but those running the campaign, most of who do not have paid authority in the Labour party.
The NZ Herald also has a good article this morning from an interview with a different intern. The Marae have also defended themselves and their facilities on the radio news
It appears the biggest issue is that the people running the scheme tried to go too big and were a bit ‘creative’ with the promotion of the scheme to try and entice Sanders & Corbyn supporters down to NZ to bring their enthusiasm and desire for social change to NZ.
I am beginning to think this is definitely more a manufactured crisis than a real one.
“So the students were offered something that turned out to be not true, but the students are very aware of who is at fault and it is not the Labour party leadership, but those running the campaign, most of who do not have paid authority in the Labour party.”
I don’t care if the law has been breached or not, the supposed worker’s party should not be asking people to come and work here for fuck all wages that’s what we expect from right wing scum.
Oh James, how lovely to see you back, I was very concerned we hadn’t seen you commenting during the whole Barclay alleged breaking the law affair, but glad to see you back now commenting on a volunteer intern scheme (possibly blown up by a disgruntled wine thief).
Biased as heck???? Pot… kettle….
Its because Im out of the country and only online a little. Glad to hear you missed me.
Re Barclay – the guys and idiot and gets everything he deserves. English was an idiot on the way he handled it. Other than that I havnt read too much on it – Enjoying the sun too much.
Because there appears to be one story saying it is all labours fault and multiple stories saying it was a cock up by the Change campaign after the people involved left labour to run the campaign that labour is now fixing because of the perceived connections.
Also now there are more stories which are disputing the “all volunteers/students feel ripped off” story line, and it looks like it was between 5-10 people who had a bit of a beef with the organisation
“I was out to the Marae 2 weeks ago having a look around at what they were doing. I had a meal with them, talked with some of the volunteers. They were fantastic young people who were loving the adventure of it all.”
“Firstly, let’s be clear of the timeline here. Bryce Edwards had mentioned this program 20 days ago on June 1st… …”another type of resource is being utilised by the Labour Party this election – comrades from the US and UK. The party is currently importing dozens of young leftwing activists who are staying at an Auckland Marae”,”
“…and Bryce’s mention was after a news story on the 20th of April – a full month ago, where Hone was attacking Labour for doing this. ”
“The spluttering shock and hyperventilation of the corporate media at a story that is over a month old right when English was getting screwed seems remarkably good timing for National.”
“The perception of political hypocrisy is a mainstream media generated one, …”
With this first electioneering shot from our pro-nat media …. the only thing missing is Dong Liu
I wonder how many foreign students are helping with the National Party campaign? I doubt they have many volunteers so another question is, are they being paid by the taxpayer via Parliamentary Services?
Probably more foreign donations or ‘sweet’ deals u want to look for. Lucky with Skycity & 0 tax havens laundering conditions r favourable for the Natz.
So looks like it was a wish list made by the change programme when asked by unions to provide a plan to get them to provide funding. A wishlist which never made it into a real plan nor proposal, nor appears to have been approved by anyone, and no statement from anyone on if it is actually real… so basically garbage
At the risk of kicking a hornets nest:
In the context of change the government, the common refrain is a vote for anyone other than Labour/green is a wasted vote/or a vote for national….
I am of the opinion that if I vote for a minor party that is to the left of labour, and national govern again after the election, then labour weren’t ready to be an alternative government.
Labour may need another period of time in opposition to get it to move ‘left’. Especially if it looses votes to the ‘left/non neo-liberal’ parties.
The old left right paradigm may not be relevant any more.
I forget who put the theory up about there being a triangular aspect to politics (left, right, not neo-liberal) but having an option of a non neo liberal party really appeals.
There is greens & mana on the left.
Labour is a liberal centre party that’s gonna go in the direction voters indicate in elections. If it’s greens & mana it will push labour left. If it’s national it will push them right, if it’s nzfirst it will push them conservative centre. So if u r a leftie & for some inexplicable Reason U don’t vote, u r the ones pushing the parties right. Don’t whine about the middle class, rich & corporations and how to blame they r next election if u don’t vote, blame yourself!
Also my guess is it’s last chances for the public to choose a different future, because at the rate of state house sell offs , rising rents & lowering wages & asset sales from the national party and their grab of power across the state sectors, the poor are being socially cleansed.
The cost of houses of over 1 million in Auckland and the price of rents rising & prices spreading rapidly ( just saw a do up 90m2 villa in arrow town for 1.1million).
Even if u don’t live in Auckland the social cleansing & immigration practices going on will generate votes for the national party, giving them a long term advantage in ongoing elections. Auckland is 1/3 of the vote apparently.
so vote Green. The problem is lefties voting Mana or TOP and those votes being wasted if Mana don’t gain TTT and TOP don’t get to 5%. That’s a gift to National.
Sorry, I am away from my fone for the rest of the day.
That is my point, my vote isn’t wasted, rather it is invested.
If Labour lose this election but shift profoundly left/non neo-liberal for the next cycle.
Probably the other vibe I want to articulate is: is a Labour government that much of a change?
Gsays the message u send to labour is the opposite. If people r voting for the right political parties only – it’s sending all the left parties to the right because that is what the voters r telling them to do.
In my view that has been nationals biggest dirty politic propagating the message that labour is national. So don’t bother voting.
That’s the national tactic to vulnerable people. Don’t bother voting.
Voters need to send a message back to national – I reject your policy by voting against them.
yes. Also the people that criticise the Greens for not being more radical or left than they are but who haven’t been voting for them, well that’s why the Greens have become more mainstream. If there was a viable party further on the left I would agree with voting for them, but there really isn’t. Voting Mana or TOP as a protest vote will have very little effect on Labour or the Greens (if it was going to move them left it would have already).
“If Labour lose this election but shift profoundly left/non neo-liberal for the next cycle.”
Yes, that’s the bet. But it’s a risk IMO. A few % to Mana or TOP isn’t going to change Labour’s mind if they lose but it might cause them to lose. Little will probably be replaced as leader. What more left wing MP is there to take his place?
And why not just vote Green who are to the left of Labour already? To me your argument is very FPP. It’s not about Labour losing the election, it’s about the parliamentary left as a whole. I hope Harawira wins TTT and that Mana get another crack at parliament, but they don’t need left wing party votes to do that. They blew it at the last election, so it’s on them to rebuild over time if they want more MPs.
TOP aren’t left wing and are basically capitalism with more social justice than we have now so long as it’s framed in economics (that’s neoliberal imo).
“Probably the other vibe I want to articulate is: is a Labour government that much of a change?”
That one irks. For one, it won’t be a Labour govt. It will be a L/G govt or a L/G/NZF govt or a L/NZF one. That alone is a bloody good reason to vote Labour or Green. Best thing for the left right now is a L/G govt that doesn’t need Peters. In order for that to happen we need more people voting Labour or Green not less.
The other aspect is that if you compare policy Labour are very different to National in ways that impact directly on people and the country as a whole. Add in Green policy and on almost every area you can name a L/G govt would be substantially different to National. It beggars belief that we are still arguing about this on the left, are people not reading actual policy? If you want to understand the difference, have a look at water, welfare, and housing. It’s glaring.
hi weka,
i can see we aren’t gonna see eye to eye on this.
mana blowing it last election is a point of view, the internet thing didn’t help.
i do feel labour did not help at all either, which is form for them and the way they can treat parties to the left of them.
“Probably the other vibe I want to articulate is: is a Labour government that much of a change?”
i certainly accept labour and national have differing polices, but as you and bill and others have pointed out, we need RADICAL changes to the way we live.
electric cars and vegetarian tuesdays isn’t gonna save our bacon.
labour will still be beholden to the status quo and lobbyists.
fair enough labour/green govt will help some of those that need it most.
labour, green, and 2,3,4 mana mps will be even better for the disadvantaged.
cheers for your input. hopefully the feathers arent too ruffled.
Also ‘investing’ your vote is something a neoliberal day trader would think of.
Have u by chance, had something pop into your social media accounts? Because I heard that’s how trump won.
data mining social media & sending individualised fear messages to voters. Ie Hillary Clinton thinks black men r predators to Black voters to make them not vote.
hi save, cheers for yr responses.
kinda hard to have a nuanced conversation, via text only, hours between responses.
believe it or not the standard is my social media.
no facebook, if you are on facebook you are not the customer you are the product.
no instantgram or twitter.
ts, rnz and stuff for the odd sports story/result is the limit cyber wise.
much rather engage with people in the flesh.
i am aware of trumps team use of targetted facebook posts, brilliant and dastardly use of a tool.
i think at the heart of this is i resent the implication that i must vote with the crowd.
mana last time round resonated with me.
Labour might think “oh gee, we’d better try nationalising everything as a policy because nobody is voting for us now”, but you know there will be loads of advice to “just go a little bit lmore like national to capture the middle ground”.
As investments go, that one’s pretty high risk. You might waste money on sports betting, but it’s not really an “investment”.
And I genuinely think that at least a labgrn government will improve the lives of thousands of people, even if it won’t bring about the revolution. I for one support the idea of less homeless people, but in a “give them homes and support” way, not a “move them out of my sight” way.
I forget who put the theory up about there being a triangular aspect to politics (left, right, not neo-liberal) but having an option of a non neo liberal party really appeals.
I think those three would be: Left, Right, Not Capitalist
Going Left or Right while maintaining capitalism maintains all the problems of the status quo. Although, going Left is more likely to lead to the removal of capitalism.
Just wondering what others think of the idea of foreign (mostly US) people campaigning for Labour? Would kiwis respond positively to someone flown in from another country telling them how to vote? I don’t think it’s a very good idea.
Over the years, I’ve seen a lot of activists heading to Aussie, UK, and US as volunteers in their elections. Plus quite a few who have acted as observers in elections all around the world. I have also seen small numbers of overseas volunteers coming here.
It is a way to transfer information about different electoral systems and the way that campaigns and elections are run – for better or for worse.
For instance, explaining the nuances of MMP campaigns to overseas volunteers has been a private amusement for quite a while. Always nice when you can see the light of understanding in their eyes.
Update: I see that Anne said much the same thing further down.
What you refer to as globalism, is basically globalisation by and for the wealthy and corporates. They have their wealthy international think tanks, Bildeberg groups and other networks.
The best way to combat this internationalisation of the power of the elites, is to work collaboratively with other less powerful individuals and groups across countries. Pulling up the draw bridge, and isolating the less well off in individual countries, will be no defense against the international reach of the powerful and wealthy elites.
This scheme has been operating for some 20 plus years and political parties of all persuasions do it. Kiwis have gone to America, to Aussie, to England. Americans have gone to England, to Aussie and now to NZ. Aussies have gone to… and on it goes.
It’s an excellent way for young people of like mind to meet their counterparts in other countries and gain experience along the way.
What a closed mind you and other detractors must have.
TC
It’s hard to try and move forward when having to drag a concrete Noah’s Ark from your left leg full of survival animals who can’t think anything different than what they’ve always had without squawking in fright.
I don’t have a problem with it being a resource, I just think that Labour needs to get our young people politically motivated as a priority.
While overseas volunteer supporters of like minded parties may look forward to coming over and having the experience. It is not necessarily true that the policies of similar positioned parties are the same. They have a lot of trust that the campaign they are working on follows their values until they get here. They are also unaware of any of the political happenings in the last three years for NZ, where US and UK politics can be easily followed on this side of the world.
A non-partisan encouragement of young people, presenting the overriding issues and looking for comprehensive solutions would be a great vehicle to get this started. If Labour and the Greens were involved, they would have to place trust in NZers that once they are informed, they would no longer accept trite assurances from Ministers and media that everything is hunky-dory. But the pay-off would most likely benefit those parties involved, and the left side of NZ politics as a whole. When people work together successfully, they are more inclined to view the wider community as their responsibility and with care.
I don’t have a problem with it being a resource, I just think that Labour needs to get our young people politically motivated as a priority.
Which is exactly what has been happening under the radar for some time Molly. I have noticed the increasing number of young people who have joined the Labour Party in recent years. It has almost seemed like a revival of the Norman Kirk years when many young people – including me – were motivated to join Labour.
A few weeks ago I attended a public meeting in Glenfield, Auckland which had been called to discuss the local housing crisis. There were several guest speakers including Phil Twyford. I was surprised to see there were an equal number of young people present as there were older people.
Oh and for the detractors, many of those young people present were not members of the Labour Party, but who chose to attend because they were interested to hear what Phil Twford had to tell them.
“Which is exactly what has been happening under the radar for some time Molly. I have noticed the increasing number of young people who have joined the Labour Party in recent years. It has almost seemed like a revival of the Norman Kirk years when many young people – including me – were motivated to join Labour.”
Thanks Anne. Always interested to hear from someone who knows the history and current position of Labour, as opposed to those who view it from an outside perspective.
A couple of questions, for clarity rather than inquisition:
1. Why is it under the radar? Is that a resources issue, a failure to see future value, or an intended choice?
2. There is a difference between motivating the young to get involved in politics – and getting the young involved in party politics.
I’m thinking that the resurgence in youth politics in Scotland and the UK, has been instigated by the Scottish referendum (and all the non-partisan grassroots community meetings held in support and against) and the Brexit referendum.
I would love to see a true initiative to get the youth electorate voting – regardless of party.
This would require the parties on the left to work together and would require them to have a lot of trust in the electorate, but would pay dividends on election day to the benefit of the left opposition.
Not only does it show how like minded parties can work together for the benefit of the public, it shows how valuable political engagement and knowledge can be. Once awakened, that skill and judgement will be deployed over the course of their voting lives. Political commentators and politicians will be working with a voting public that has the skills to more keenly judge media reports and obfuscations.
I was hoping the internship was something along these lines, but it doesn’t appear to have been in it’s current form.
Because it is fundamentally about people going somewhere to learn how others political systems operate by getting involved in them. It isn’t about making continuous press releases or a big deal about it.
The media will have known about these kinds of programmes for a long time. They really aren’t news – well at least not until National’s spinners like Hooten and Farrar need a diversionary story and someone is found to provide kernel of it.
The question was more about how to make it known to the youth in NZ, so they can intern, rather than the media for commentary. (In particular, youth not currently aligned with the Labour party).
As for the internship initiative, given the quality and depth of the reporting, it seems the typical “sound and fury, signifying nothing” distraction.
Hi Molly. I wasn’t being critical of your comment @ 9.2.2
Just wanted to let you know Labour are doing what they can to get the youth to take part in politics. And of course the Greens are doing like-wise. I also believe the young are coming to recognise their futures don’t look too bright under the current regime. They have every reason to worry about their ability to ever have a home of their own, and of course Climate Change [rightly] hangs heavy on their minds. It wouldn’t surprise me if they are starting to look seriously at wanting a change of regime in NZ.
“What a closed mind you and other detractors must have.”
Wow- what a nasty response to a question imagining how kiwis might respond to doorknocking by American interns.
If that’s an example of how a Labour Party Aucklander replies to a genuine question, glad I’m a Southern Greenie.
[lprent: What a delicate wee lazy flower you must be. Read the policy – especially that about robust debate.
Learn not to make simpleminded presumptions about others nor to try to use a typical troll ‘victim’ act. Because I really don’t like lazy fuckwits like you who try to impose your obnoxious rules on this site. That is my and the moderator’s job. We don’t pass it out to opinionated idiots like you. If I see you try it again, I will amend your behaviour with a sudden permanent ban for violating the rules of this site.
Sorry, warning taken on board. I really wasn’t meaning to impose any rules and, yeah, being a bit sensitive about the closed mind bit. Haven’t been commenting for a while, need to toughen up.
I’ve been involved with overseas volunteers on local revegetation projects, they’ve been great. All I had heard about re the ones this week was about them campaigning/door knocking for Labour and I wondered how that would work out. Now I know more about this type of thing thanks to the other comments.
I’ve noticed a lot of interest in our political culture from some of the Americans I interact with at the gallery. They are intrigued that we have a much more constructive political conversation than they are used to. Several have asked about internships. From where I’m seeing it, it’s not surprising that this got overwhelmed with interest. Tis’ a bugga being popular…
This item on NBC sort of touches on it and explains a lot of how we are place du jour in America right now
It wasn’t the best idea. Yet, it seems Labour gave this little consideration.
In fact, they didn’t even clear the legality of it, which should have been one of the first things to do. Moreover, they are carrying on with it while it is still unclear.
This won’t inspire voter confidence in their ability to run the country.
I’m not a fan – in principle parties should cultivate a local activist or volunteer base.
It may not be illegal but it’s going to cost a couple of points. Looks to me like some middle echelons wanted an entry to the lucrative US political job market.
Garner and that other odious prick held a poll on the AM show this morning asking if the Labour migrant scandal was of more concern than the Barclay affair That odious bit of shit was using terminology like slave ships slave labour etc and Garner in his usual style was reading out the most blatant rightwing crap people supposedly was writing in. with the usual discussions that Labour was not beyond redemption if they change their leader etc etc ad nauseam
That odious prick was most upset when at the last time I saw it more people were concerned about the Barclay affair than Labours. Also it was delightful to see Ardern put hysterical Benefit well and truly in her place.
Has anyone seen the whole morning programme and what was the result of the biased poll they had. because I think people are beginning to wake up the shit by the Garners, Gowers Hoskins and Johnny come lately odious Mark whatever his surname is.
did you see how Ardern had garner eating out of her hand and saying that labour had acting in the right way as opposed to the nats spending a year lying and such.
here that you nat scum the truth will set you free
I haven’t not bothered reading about this labour intern issue, sounds more to me like a msm distraction to drum up, now that national are on the rocks with Barclay etc
No-one brings bashing upon themselves. Bashing is different from holding to account.
“If it wasn’t for Labour messing up, there be no bashing from the left.”
Obviously. But we’re all humans here and all of us make mistakes. I’m far more interested in how we handle those mistakes than in everyone having to be perfect and never make any. As far as I can tell Little fronted up well on this and Labour are doing the work to sort out the actual problem not just the perceived political one.
It’s time to change the government. Your own incessantly negative approach appears to work against that.
“I’m far more interested in how we handle those mistakes”
Indeed, it’s the putting right that counts. Many mess up, not many put it right.
However, in this instance the putting right looks as if it may unravel. I’m concerned Labour are starting to dig a larger hole.
As highlighted, sorting out the legality should be a priority. The media will have a field day with Labour continuing on if it turns out to be illegal. Therefore, this could potentially get far worse.
There is even paperwork bringing their excuse (it was over subscribed) into question.
Labour have been round long enough to know how the game is played, yet they aren’t playing too well, hence we’ve got to keep their feet to the fire.
That’s a pretty ugly metaphor, but useful to know that you think people asked to be damaged and that damaging people is warranted. Including natural allies.
It has been raised by government ministers. Of course Labour is now going to do due diligence..
But it’d be interesting if National are willing to extend this kind of scrutiny to all volunteers who are housed on a Marae. I’m sure that the Maori Party will want a say in that. Or Lions and Rotary who also have widespread international volunteer program. Or churches. Or…. whatever – you may understand the point.
Not to mention kiwis going offshore to do things like VSA, or the volunteers that DOC uses.
“Of course Labour is now going to do due diligence..”
Having a political party associated to an illegal act (not that it has yet been established) isn’t a good look, therefore this should have been cleared up from the get go.
No that is wrong and you are quoting The Hub of all places as a reliable source, you must be joking
Garner kept trying to put words into Kirton’s mouth and kept repeating “does that mean you don’t’ know if you have broken the law yet is that what you are saying”, to which Kirton replied “Oh look I don’t actually but that doesn’t mean anything really and I am focussing on the welfare of these volunteers.” which was more or less repeated a little later by Arderne “I wouldn’t know enough about the explicit rules around someone who’s here on a short-term voluntary basis. I wouldn’t have thought so… we’ve got to be absolutely sure,”
So it is NOT coming from Labour.
If someone said my car had flat tyres I would check to see if they needed inflating but that doesn’t mean I would be admitting that I have been driving around with flat tyres. As I can see the same dirty politics coming into play with this election with all the shit being bounded around about slave ships and sweat shops by labour I am pleased they are checking the law.
Did you know that proven liar Prime Minister John key left and Bill English took over and has been caught lying too only he is a bit more yaap so he’s no good at it. That makes the last two gnat leaders caught lying. Breathe it in bm these are the last of the good days for you old bean.
I haven’t really followed it that closely, beltway stuff.
The issue with the Labour “interns” though…
Oh, how we laughed. The PM lying about what he knew of a crime and his involvement in helping covering it up? Beltway stuff, nothing of interest there. A couple of disgruntled Labour interns, though? Disgusting! Heads must roll!
When asked if Labour has broken any immigration laws, Kirton replied he’s still getting to the bottom of it. Therefore, clearly they’re unsure.
Moreover, the fact he didn’t know, hence wasn’t able to refute it, leaves the thought (it may be illegal) hanging in peoples minds.
This is something they should have cleared up right from the get go.
But here’s another problem, Kirton believes whether it’s legal doesn’t mean anything. However it does. This will look far worse if it turns out to be illegal, yet Kirton can’t see it.
It will be back in the headlines if it is.
And while that would explain why they are carrying on, it’s disappointing they can’t see the potential storm they’re sailing into if it turns out to be illegal.
Meanwhile, the head of the Auckland marae at the centre of the complaints about living conditions said it had been unfairly smeared for political purposes.
Awataha Marae chief executive Anthony Wilson said most interns he had spoken to had loved their stay.
He said politicians had seized on the publicity and the marae was being booted back and forth like a political football, which has upset some kaumatua.
Someone I know intimated something along these lines two weeks ago.
[posted in another thread, but seems pertinent and was offtopic in the other thread so deleted it]
For an engineer in the political machine, McCarten seems to be a bit shit with paperwork. Although it could also be supervision – a few people involved and the person doing the recruiting didn’t tell the colleagues or McCarten how many people were coming.
Actually, I wonder if they just didn’t expect the usual rush of applications at the last minute? Every year I am part of the organising committee for an event, and every year we start shitting ourselves that we’ve overcatered and nobody will show up, and it’s always in the last week/ten days that a solid 80% of attendees register. Fucks my blood pressure up and no mistake. But failing to have the guts to tell people “no, time’s up, we’ll put you on a list of alternates if you want” could have gotten them into this position.
Yes. There does seem to have been a bit of the… left hand not knowing what the right hand was doing. It also sounds like more people took up the offer than they had prepared for, but heaven forbid… nobody committed any crimes, and it’s something everybody has experienced when organising an event or a family reunion. There’s always a hitch of some sort which rears its ugly head at the last minute.
It most certainly didn’t warrant the attention or the vitriol that was heaped on Labour by the MSM over the past 24 hours. They behaved like a pack of howling, rabid dogs. I hope they have sought medical assistance for their hysterical nonsense.
On the plus side, the Labour thing looks like a bit of a flash in the pan, whereas the deBarclay is a long and steady burner. He’s hanging around like a persistent pimple, and we’ll see if a search warrant comes by this time.
1. The Iraqi government and US military have a plan to rebuild built infrastructure, the Mosque, schools and hospitals and housing, to start to make Mosul a liveable place again.
2. Iran just waits for the post-victory near-anomie, uses proxies to gain a stronger hold with the Iraqi government, carves the area up informally with the Kurds, and Mosul becomes a shell of a place.
Given that the U.s.a has just sold $120 Billion of weapons to the Saudis …. and that they seem to be a military industrial society that needs to export these weapons of democracy to stay afloat.
And the fact they help fund Isis … and act as its air-force at crucial moments in Syria.
Then I would suggest it would be the u,s,a ( and Nato ), who continue the destructive conflicts in the middle east ….. that they started with illegal wars/invasions, launched under false pretenses.
What do you think Iran would be like today, if the u.s.a and Brits had not attacked and overthrown their democracy way back in 1953 Ad? ….
Mossadegh was a good man…. and the west has treated the Iranian people with malevolence ever since they overthrew their democratically elected leader.
Go ahead and defend Iran. Because you clearly can’t see I’m not defending either Iran or the USA.
Always amusing to see another moist leftie look for the last European regime it can find to assign the ills of the world upon. It was them colonialists who instigated the comprehensively fundamentalist, misogynist, fanatical , murderous and corrupt 1979 Revolution? And the lack of any reform since?
Have a nice armchair-general time running your alternative history.
Meantime, first coalition to come up with a post-war plan wins.
Well we can know for certain that the `1979 revolution would not have happened if Iran was allowed to continue as a peaceful secular democracy.
We know that the Shah imposed upon the Iranians was a murderous thieving thug.
Ayatollah Khomeini was the fanatical blow back that removed the unpopular Shah.
The average Iranian is obviously far worse off thanks to the real … not alternative ….. history behind the present.
No 1953 coup ,,, no 1979 Ayatollah
And basically evidence since Yugoslavia onward s points to the fact.
That from the west.
The plan Is war ….
For profit …. to the few.
The fate of Mosul ….. going on its history since the u.s.a turned Iraq into one huge war crime ….. is that it will see more shells and bombing and death squads than building.
“The Kurdistan region of Iraq enjoys more stability, economic development, and political pluralism than the rest of the country. And public opinion under the Kurdistan Regional Government demands rule-of-law-based governance. But power is concentrated in the hands of the ruling parties and families, who perpetuate a nondemocratic, sultanistic system. These dynamics could foster instability in Kurdistan and its neighborhood, but could also provide a rare window of opportunity for democratization.”
P.s I thought Saddam, another c.i.a installed thug, should have been hung when he used Sarin nerve gas on the Iranians with coordination and coordinates from the usa …
Muammar Gaddafi on the other hand with his bloodless coup …… demonstrated socialism working ….. by the largest improvements of living standards for the people of Libya …., in the shortest period of time …. in any country anywhere in the world ….. in the 20th century.
Nato will be able to take credit for the quickest reversal …..
Muammar Gaddafi on the other hand with his bloodless coup
then it was all down hill – mass arrests and detention, torture, disappearances, televised executions, the assassination of expat opponents abroad, nuclear ambitions, war with his neighbours, the financing of ETA in Spain, the IRA and the Italian Red Brigades, as well as groups in Japan, Turkey, Thailand and the Philippines……
You sound like your reeling of the actions of the cia/u.s.a in south america or Iraq or Vietnam Joe90 ….. or to quote Nelson Mandela …….“If you look at those matters, you will come to the conclusion that the attitude of the United States of America is a threat to world peace. If there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the USA. They don’t care for human beings.”
I on the other hand was talking about a man using the resources of his country ( instead of BP getting it ), ……. and lowering infant mortality from over 100 deaths per thousand live births down to approx 14
Who granted equal Human rights to women in 1972 ….. something the fundamentalist terrorists Hated …… like the British sponsored “Manchester Boys” …. and other religious extremists used by the west.
He vastly improved housing from most living in slums ….. and declared housing a human right.
He vastly improved access to and quality of medical care … free
He was ridding the country of illiteracy and had full enrollments of children into schools
University education was free …… and of course women could attend.
He took Libya from one of the most impoverished countrys in the world …….. and before being Mob murdered had Libya with the highest standard of living in Africa and a life expectancy comparable to Europe.
No other country in the world improved the standard of living for its citizens by such an amount in such a short time ……. through Socialism.
Nato will bear responsibility for the quickest decline
He supported the Palestinians which infuriated the Israelis
I tend to think that the hard facts and statistics regarding health, education…..water and housing projects. The improvements in living standards are there for anyone to find on the internet.
Speaks more to me of the man than tony Blair , or Cameron type hyperbole…… the types who give safe harbors to ‘Manchester Boys’.
You can see Cameron in action in the video I linked to above.
EF Schumacher on small economics. Too bad 40 years on we turned our backs on this stuff and doubled down on waste, consumption and greed. It looks like we’re going to learn the hard way.
Was thinking that John key has haijacked the ‘third way’ for the national party that politicians like tony blair did for Labour Party in th UK. It goes too far and the leaders turn into arguably criminal liars and their obsession with networking & likeability drag their counties into war, debt & division.
For the national party voters, that hanker after the ‘old values’ of the national party before they became asset selling, migration touting, arrogant careerists that don’t give a crap about their constituents and spend their days drinking & lunching & day trading & doing real estate deals like hotels & conference centres, nz first is a good alternative. It’s the national party of old! Hope winston does a killing in all the Natz stronghold provinces!
if labour & greens pick up the missing million as well, then the the public can kick the ‘third way’ Natz to the curb – hopefully in a landslide to send that message home!
Hope that makes National nervous. I wonder how many of those National voters saying they won’t vote National are talking about the party vote or the seat vote.
From my personal acquaintances who vote nat, and a very small sample, split between not voting, see who the new candidate is, Mark Patterson (NZF candidate) / National pv, NZF / NZF.
Prior to toddles’ departure (Monday, Tue morning) you could take out the new candidate option. Patterson was getting a lot of interest and maybe that triggered the end game.
My comment about the missing million. It could affect National just like it got Labour in 2008. And for exactly the same reason, arrogance and moved too far into opposition territory to try and hold onto the centre voters.
The Government has been dealt a huge blow as the High Court ruled its benefit cap is unlawful and illegally discriminates against single parents with young children.
#notsurprised
If we could take our government to court over their benefit policies we’d probably get the same ruling.
Also, to those who think an Upper House works, this must have got past the UKs House of Lords.
………………… June 5-7 ………… June 21-22 Corbyn ………… 32 …………………… 35 …… + 3 May …………….. 43 …………………… 34 ……. – 9
The first time YouGov have a Labour leader ahead a Tory leader on the best PM question since the summer of 2007.(although 35% still a long way from wildly popular)
The only way to fight “terror” in the region is to reclaim a shared vision that transcends tribalism and sectarianism.
The discourse on terrorism has itself been narrowed down so much that there is little or no space in mainstream media for any other ideas on how to combat it
“What 95 percent of all suicide attacks have in common, since 1980, is not religion, but a specific strategic motivation to respond to a military intervention, often specifically a military occupation, of territory that the terrorists view as their homeland or prize greatly. From Lebanon and the West Bank in the 80s and 90s, to Iraq and Afghanistan, and up through the Paris suicide attacks we’ve just experienced in the last days, military intervention – and specifically when the military intervention is occupying territory – that’s what prompts suicide terrorism more than anything else.”
Such findings – based on examining 4,600 suicide attacks – had no influence on US foreign policy.
Many who applied terror against their own people, or funded terrorism elsewhere, are not hesitating to accuse others of terrorism
We are being lied to to justify invasion into other countries.
Anyone got anything similar for our local scene? I know the strike rate with ACT is high enough that trouble with the law feels like a near prerequisite to serving in Parliament, but I’ve got no feel for how the balance looks for other parties.
Bryce Edwards stirring it around again. He is from Christchurch and seems all shook up with the earthquakes and that, and hasn’t settled and found stability in his political discourse so up bubbles a lot of liquefaction. Which faction it is differs from week to week.
Regardless what “we” might think or like or dislike about this Student Internship Calamity Recruitment Campaign Drive ….the Hack LSM & Hoots are going to keep on kicking this story all the way to the election.
Its a fuck up in anyone’s book & the fault lies with all involved who’ve forgotten the golden rule, dont piss your workers off! And also remember; the first rule is the same as the 2nd & the 3rd, you dont talk about …
So, a collective “Fuck this Fuck’n mess!” Time to shore up the dyke because the latest RM Polls out & that is just going to compound this almighty fuck up.
Heard Nick Smith on the wireless saying the new nelson branch of the young Nat’s is thriving, dang are there only six members = 5 white males, 1 white female?
This short blog post and the linked PDF document is the result of a collaborative effort by Anne-Marie Blackburn, Dana Nuccitelli, Bärbel Winkler, Ken Rice and John Cook. When the climate change (mis)information briefs pushed by David Legates and others started to make the rounds in January 2021 we wondered whether ...
A part of this morning's transport announcement which hasn't got a lot of attention yet: biofuels are back: “Our Government has agreed in principle to mandate a lower emitting biofuel blend across the transport sector. Over time this will prevent hundreds of thousands of tonnes of emissions from cars, ...
After almost twenty years of ignoring the Māori vote, National may run in the Māori seats again: A former National MP is excited the party could stand a candidate in the Māori electorate seats for the first time since 2002. One News reported last night that National's leader Judith ...
If one stubbornly clings to the Elimination strategy (I don’t support it, but that will have to wait for another occasion) then try to get it right. You need secure borders. We have attempted this with a very large measure of success. It has not been perfect as the Covid-19 Response ...
Diaspora: perception departs from reality In this collection of articles are two papers currently captivating the attention of people following the science and emergence of climate change, especially the rapid variety we've accidentally unleashed and which is now unfolding around us. The synthesis and review article Earth's Ice Imbalance by Slater ...
The ultra-rich have done very, very well out of the pandemic. Globally, the wealth of the ten richest people rose by US$540 billion last year, enough money to pay for the pandemic in its entirity. And in New Zealand, local billionaire Graeme Hart saw his wealth increase by almost NZ$3.5 ...
Postmodernism has long been looked upon as an indecipherable ideology and a source of amusement. In 1996 Alan Sokal, a physics professor at New York University, had a hoax article published in ‘Social Text’ an academic journal of postmodern cultural studies. In ‘Transgressing the Boundaries: Towards a Transformative Hermeneutics of ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections Anew study in Nature Sustainability incorporates the damages that climate change does to healthy ecosystems into standard climate-economics models. The key finding in the study by Bernardo Bastien-Olvera and Frances Moore from the University of California at Davis: The models have been underestimating the ...
In a recent interview with RNZ (14th of January), NZ Council of Civil Liberties Chair Thomas Beagle, in response to Simon Bridges condemnation of the post-Trump Twitter purge of local far Right and other accounts, said the following: “Cos the thing about freedom of expression is that it’s not just ...
Let’s be clear: if Trump is not politically killed off once and for all, he will become a MAGA Dracula, rising from the dead to haunt US politics for years to come and giving inspiration to his wretched family of grifters and thousands of deplorables well into the next decade. ...
Since its demise as an imperial power, and especially its deindustrialisation under Thatcher, the UK's primary economic engine has been its role as a money laundry, using its network of overseas territories as tax havens to enable rich people around the world to steal from the societies they live in. ...
Last month OMV quit the Great South Basin and surrendered its offshore exploration permits outside of Taranaki. This month, Australian-owned Beach Energy has done the same: Beach Energy Resources New Zealand has decided to abandon all of its oil and gas exploration permits off the South Island coast, including ...
The new Northland case has been linked to the South African strain of Covid-19, one of a number of new, more contagious Covid variants. Here’s how they emerge and why. Let’s start with the basics. The genetic material of the SARS-CoV-2 virus responsible for Covid-19 is a strand of RNA ...
MARVIN HUBBARD, US citizen by birth, New Zealand citizen by choice, Quaker and left-wing activist, has been broadcasting his show, "Community or Chaos", on Otago Access Radio for the best part of 30 years. On 24 November last year, I spoke with him about the outcome of the 2020 General ...
This is a guest blog post by Daniel Tamberg, Potsdam, co-founder and director of SCIARA GmbH. The non-profit organisation SCIARA is developing and operating a flexible software platform for scientific simulation games that allows thousands of players to explore, design and understand possible climate futures together. Decision-makers in politics, business, ...
Yesterday's Gone: Cold shivers are running up and down the spines of conservatives everywhere. Donald Trump may have gone, but all the signs point to there being something much more momentous in the wind-shift than a simple return to the status quo ante. A change is gonna come. ONE COULD ...
Is it possible to live and let live in the post-Trump era? The online campaign to vilify Christopher Liddell, ex-White House Deputy Chief of Staff and Assistant to Trump, makes for an interesting case study. Liddell is a New Zealander whose illustrious career in corporate America once earned him plaudits ...
A chronological listing of news articles linked to on the Skeptical Science Facebook Page during the past week: Sun, Jan 17, 2021 through Sat, Jan 23, 2021Editor's Choice12 new books explore fresh approaches to act on climate changeAuthors explore scientific, economic, and political avenues for climate action ...
This discussion is from a Twitter thread by Martin Kulldorff on 20 December 2020. He is a Professor at Harvard Medical School specialising in disease surveillance methods, infectious disease outbreaks and vaccine safety. His Twitter handle is @MartinKulldorff #1 Public health is about all health outcomes, not just a single ...
The Treasury forecasts suggest the economy is doing better than expected after the Covid Shock. John Kenneth Galbraith was wont to say that economic forecasting was designed to make astrology look good. Unfair, but it raises the question of the purpose of economic forecasts. Certainly the public may treat them ...
Q: Will the COVID-19 vaccines prevent the transmission of the coronavirus and bring about community immunity (aka herd immunity)? A: Jury not in yet but vaccines do not have to be perfect to thwart the spread of infection. While vaccines induce protection against illness, they do not always stop actual ...
Joe Biden seems to be everything that Donald Trump was not – decent, straightforward, considerate of others, mindful of his responsibilities – but none of that means that he has an easy path ahead of him. The pandemic still rages, American standing in the world is grievously low, and the ...
Keana VirmaniFrom healthcare robots to data privacy, to sea level rise and Antarctica under the ice: in the four years since its establishment, the Aotearoa New Zealand Science Journalism Fund has supported over 30 projects.Rebecca Priestley, receiving the PM Science Communication Prize (Photo by Mark Tantrum) Associate Professor ...
Nothing more from me today - I'm off to Wellington, to participate in the city's annual roleplaying convention (which has also eaten my time for the whole week, limiting blogging despite there being interesting things happening). Normal bloggage will resume Tuesday. ...
The Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weaponscame into force today, making the development, possession, use or threat of use of nuclear weapons illegal in international law. Every nuclear-armed state is now a criminal regime. The corporations and scientists who design, build and maintain their illegal weapons are now ...
"Come The Revolution!" The key objective of Bernard Hickey’s revolutionary solution to the housing crisis is a 50 percent reduction in the price of the average family home. This will be achieved by the introduction of Capital Gains, Land, and Wealth taxes, and by the opening up of currently RMA-protected ...
by Daphna Whitmore Twitter and Facebook shutting down Trump’s accounts after his supporters stormed Capitol Hill is old news now but the debates continue over whether the actions against Trump are a good thing or not. Those in favour of banning Trump say Twitter and Facebook are private companies and ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections Democrats now control the White House, Senate, and House of Representatives for the first time in a decade, albeit with razor thin Congressional majorities. The last time, in the 111th Congress (2009-2011), House Democrats passed a carbon cap and trade bill, but it died ...
Session thirty-three was highly abbreviated, via having to move house in a short space of time. Oh well. The party decided to ignore the tree-monster and continue the attack on the Giant Troll. Tarsin – flying on a giant summoned bat – dumped some high-grade oil over the ...
Last night I stayed up till 3am just to see then-President Donald Trump leave the White House, get on a plane, and fly off to Florida, hopefully never to return. And when I woke up this morning, America was different. Not perfect, because it never was. Probably not even good, ...
Watching today’s inauguration of Joe Biden as the United States’ 46th president, there’s not a lot in common with the inauguration of Donald Trump just four destructive years ago. Where Trump warned of carnage, Biden dared to hope for unity and decency. But the one place they converge is that ...
Dan FalkBritons who switched on their TVs to “Good Morning Britain” on the morning of Sept. 15, 2020, were greeted by news not from our own troubled world, but from neighboring Venus. Piers Morgan, one of the hosts, was talking about a major science story that had surfaced the ...
Sara LutermanGrowing up autistic in a non-autistic world can be very isolating. We are often strange and out of sync with peers, despite our best efforts. Autistic adults have, until very recently, been largely absent from media and the public sphere. Finding role models is difficult. Finding useful advice ...
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Getting to Browser Tab Zero so I can reboot the computer is awfully hard when the one open tab is a Table of Contents for the Journal of Environmental Economics and Management, and every issue has more stuff I want to read. A few highlights: Gugler et al demonstrating ...
Michael Cowling, CQUniversity AustraliaWe’ve probably all been there. We buy some new smart gadget and when we plug it in for the first time it requires an update to work. So we end up spending hours downloading and updating before we can even play with our new toy. But ...
Timothy Ford, University of Massachusetts Lowell and Charles M. Schweik, University of Massachusetts AmherstTo mitigate health inequities and promote social justice, coronavirus vaccines need to get to underserved populations and hard-to-reach communities. There are few places in the U.S. that are unreachable by road, but other factors – many ...
Israel chose to pay a bit over the odds for the Pfizer vaccine to get earlier access. Here’s The Times of Israel from 16 November. American government will be charged $39 for each two-shot dose, and the European bloc even less, but Jerusalem said to agree to pay $56. Israel ...
Orla is a gender critical Marxist in Ireland. She gave a presentation on 15 January 2021 on the connection between postmodern/transgender identity politics and the current attacks on democratic and free speech rights. Orla has been active previously in the Irish Socialist Workers Party and the People Before Profit electoral ...
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Nathaniel ScharpingIn March, as the Covid-19 pandemic began to shut down major cities in the U.S., researchers were thinking about blood. In particular, they were worried about the U.S. blood supply — the millions of donations every year that help keep hospital patients alive when they need a transfusion. ...
Sarah L Caddy, University of CambridgeVaccines are a marvel of medicine. Few interventions can claim to have saved as many lives. But it may surprise you to know that not all vaccines provide the same level of protection. Some vaccines stop you getting symptomatic disease, but others stop you ...
Back in 2016, the Portuguese government announced plans to stop burning coal by 2030. But progress has come much quicker, and they're now scheduled to close their last coal plant by the end of this year: The Sines coal plant in Portugal went offline at midnight yesterday evening (14 ...
The Sincerest Form Of Flattery: As anybody with the intestinal fortitude to brave the commentary threads of local news-sites, large and small, will attest, the number of Trump-supporting New Zealanders is really quite astounding. IT’S SO DIFFICULT to resist the temptation to be smug. From the distant perspective of New Zealand, ...
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As families around the world mourn more than two million people dead from Covid-19, the Plan B academics and their PR industry collaborator continue to argue that the New Zealand government should stop focusing on our managed isolation and quarantine system and instead protect the elderly so that they can ...
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Health authorities in Norway are reporting some concerns about deaths in frail elderly after receiving their COVID-19 vaccine. Is this causally related to the vaccine? Probably not but here are the things to consider. According to the news there have been 23 deaths in Norway shortly after vaccine administration and ...
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Grigori GuitchountsIn November, Springer Nature, one of the world’s largest publishers of scientific journals, made an attention-grabbing announcement: More than 30 of its most prestigious journals, including the flagship Nature, will now allow authors to pay a fee of US$11,390 to make their papers freely available for anyone to read ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Gary Yohe, Henry Jacoby, Richard Richels, and Benjamin Santer Imagine a major climate change law passing the U.S. Congress unanimously? Don’t bother. It turns out that you don’t need to imagine it. Get this: The Global Change Research Act of 1990 was passed ...
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TheOneRing.Net has got its paws on the official synopsis of the upcoming Amazon Tolkien TV series. It’s a development that brings to mind the line about Sauron deliberately releasing Gollum from the dungeons of Barad-dûr. Amazon knew exactly what they were doing here, in terms of drumming up publicity: ...
Since Dwight Eisenhower’s inauguration in 1953, US presidents have joined an informal club intended to provide support - and occasionally rivalry - between those few who have been ‘leaders of the free world’. Donald Trump, elected on a promise to ‘drain the swamp’ and a constant mocker of his predecessors, ...
For over a decade commentators have noted the rise of a new brand of explicitly ideological politics throughout the world. By this they usually refer to the re-emergence of national populism and avowedly illiberal approaches to governance throughout the “advanced” democratic community, but they also extend the thought to the ...
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The Green Party is already delivering on its commitment for cleaner, climate-friendly transport through our Cooperation Agreement with the Government. ...
A growing public housing waiting list and continued increase of house prices must be urgently addressed by Government, Green Party Co-leader Marama Davidson said today. ...
Prudence Steven QC, barrister of Christchurch has been appointed as an Environment Judge and District Court Judge to serve in Christchurch, Attorney-General David Parker announced today. Ms Steven has been a barrister sole since 2008, practising in resource management and local government / public law. She was appointed a Queen’s ...
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Minister for Climate Change, James Shaw spoke yesterday with President Biden’s Special Presidential Envoy for Climate John Kerry. “I was delighted to have the opportunity to speak with Mr. Kerry this morning about the urgency with which our governments must confront the climate emergency. I am grateful to him and ...
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A skilled and experienced group of people have been named as the newly established Oranga Tamariki Ministerial Advisory Board by Children’s Minister Kelvin Davis today. The Board will provide independent advice and assurance to the Minister for Children across three key areas of Oranga Tamariki: relationships with families, whānau, and ...
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[Opening comments, welcome and thank you to Auckland University etc] It is a great pleasure to be here this afternoon to celebrate such an historic occasion - the entry into force of the Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons. This is a moment many feared would never come, but ...
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The Government has released its Public Housing Plan 2021-2024 which outlines the intention of where 8,000 additional public and transitional housing places announced in Budget 2020, will go. “The Government is committed to continuing its public house build programme at pace and scale. The extra 8,000 homes – 6000 public ...
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has congratulated President Joe Biden on his inauguration as the 46th President of the United States of America. “I look forward to building a close relationship with President Biden and working with him on issues that matter to both our countries,” Jacinda Ardern said. “New Zealand ...
A major investment to tackle wilding pines in Mt Richmond will create jobs and help protect the area’s unique ecosystems, Biosecurity Minister Damien O’Connor says. The Mt Richmond Forest Park has unique ecosystems developed on mineral-rich geology, including taonga plant species found nowhere else in the country. “These special plant ...
To further protect New Zealand from COVID-19, the Government is extending pre-departure testing to all passengers to New Zealand except from Australia, Antarctica and most Pacific Islands, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins said today. “The change will come into force for all flights arriving in New Zealand after 11:59pm (NZT) on Monday ...
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Jobs for Nature funding is being made available to conservation groups and landowners to employ staff and contractors in a move aimed at boosting local biodiversity-focused projects, Conservation Minister Kiritapu Allan has announced. It is estimated some 400-plus jobs will be created with employment opportunities in ecology, restoration, trapping, ...
The Government has approved an exception class for 1000 international tertiary students, degree level and above, who began their study in New Zealand but were caught offshore when border restrictions began. The exception will allow students to return to New Zealand in stages from April 2021. “Our top priority continues ...
Today’s deal between Meridian and Rio Tinto for the Tiwai smelter to remain open another four years provides time for a managed transition for Southland. “The deal provides welcome certainty to the Southland community by protecting jobs and incomes as the region plans for the future. The Government is committed ...
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has appointed Anna Curzon to the APEC Business Advisory Council (ABAC). The leader of each APEC economy appoints three private sector representatives to ABAC. ABAC provides advice to leaders annually on business priorities. “ABAC helps ensure that APEC’s work programme is informed by business community perspectives ...
The Government’s prudent fiscal management and strong policy programme in the face of the COVID-19 global pandemic have been acknowledged by the credit rating agency Fitch. Fitch has today affirmed New Zealand’s local currency rating at AA+ with a stable outlook and foreign currency rating at AA with a positive ...
The Government is putting in place a suite of additional actions to protect New Zealand from COVID-19, including new emerging variants, COVID-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins said today. “Given the high rates of infection in many countries and evidence of the global spread of more transmissible variants, it’s clear that ...
$36 million of Government funding alongside councils and others for 19 projects Investment will clean up and protect waterways and create local jobs Boots on the ground expected in Q2 of 2021 Funding part of the Jobs for Nature policy package A package of 19 projects will help clean up ...
By Adi Briantika in Jakarta A group of Papuan students in front of the House of Representatives (DPR) building in Jakarta, who were planning to hold a protest action opposing the extension of Papuan Special Autonomy (Otsus), have been arrested and taken to the Metro Jaya regional police headquarters. “Around ...
By RNZ News The two new cases of covid-19 confirmed yesterday in New Zealand are the South African variant and initial results show they are connected to the Northland case at the Pullman Hotel. This morning the Director-General of Health, Dr Ashley Bloomfield, confirmed to Covid-19 Response Minister Chris Hipkins ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Overhype can be a dead giveaway of under-confidence. When Anthony Albanese on Thursday compared his situation to that of Joe Biden, it sounded rather desperate. Some journalists, he said, had predicted a certain Trump win. ...
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Test comment to check that they are now possible.
A flag got flipped
Yay being able to comment
Just checking – is there a reason for some of the topics requiring logging in to reply?
Depends what you mean. There was a general stoppage of comments last night by accident. In the post edit screen there is a button to moderate comments for that post.
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In the discussion settings screen there is a setting to require that only logged in users are able to comment. This is used by some sites who want to restrict comment writing access. Kiwiblog is probably the most noticeable.
We use different techniques which tend to allow a wider and less selective participation.
However, the setting screen used when banning commenters, and releasing them from bans. Which is a bit of a nuisance as the toggle gets hit by accident and turned on. Especially by overly sensitive touchpad clickareas. It has happened a few times over the last decade.
When I get my machines set up again (just moving apartments), I’ll get the style sheet to hide the button.
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If you mean that certain posts get full moderation (ie they must be released by a moderator). That happens occasionally, and usually on guest posts from politicians or posts about client change or ones that outrage misogynist idiots. That is to reduce the workload on moderators cleaning up after children who can’t behave with any degree of decorum
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Could you please try to be more precise when asking questions. My toleration for wide open diffuse questions is pretty limited.
Sorry, some of the new topics today require a commenter to be logged in with WordPress to be able to comment. I think that’s the first of the two options you provided.
Bill English says we need to concentrate on important issues likes jobs and incomes and prospects (Morning Report this morning: http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/201848564/barclay-saga-threatens-to-overshadow-national-party-conference ) – but then we hear that at the National Party conference there will be no policy announcements. Surely he isn’t trying to distract us from something else!
Nice to know that after all this time Bill English at last thinks its time to concentrate on jobs and incomes . . .
About the only thing in those he would be concerned with would be the wages and how to lower them to ‘make us more competitive’. One way to do that is to import people to fill job slots.
Enough semi-hysteria and hyperbole over the so-called Labour Party ‘student intern scandal’?
Let’s have some proper investigation based upon FACTS, EVIDENCE and the underpinning LAW?
1) What exactly were these student ‘interns’ offered?
2) What exactly did these student ‘interns’ receive?
3) What exactly is the law covering immigration and ’employment’ in these circumstances?
4) Where exactly has the law been breached (if it has?)
Penny Bright
2017 Independent candidate for Tamaki.
Exposing the $1.6 billion Tamaki ‘Regeneration’ – GENTRIFICATION $CAM.
In the NZ Herald an opinion piece: “US intern defends Labour’s ‘fellowship’ campaign programme from ‘sweatshop’ claims”
McCarten’s (and the Marae) supporters come out in support of McCarten and Te Awataha Marae:
Bradbury on The Daily Blog: “Why the Labour Party Student Intern ‘scandal’ is a smear”
Moana Maniapoto on Twitter:
From the links and news posts abound yesterday, this appears to be the best
http://www.95bfm.com/news/exclusive-transcript-with-labour-student-intern
So the students were offered something that turned out to be not true, but the students are very aware of who is at fault and it is not the Labour party leadership, but those running the campaign, most of who do not have paid authority in the Labour party.
The NZ Herald also has a good article this morning from an interview with a different intern. The Marae have also defended themselves and their facilities on the radio news
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11880781
It appears the biggest issue is that the people running the scheme tried to go too big and were a bit ‘creative’ with the promotion of the scheme to try and entice Sanders & Corbyn supporters down to NZ to bring their enthusiasm and desire for social change to NZ.
I am beginning to think this is definitely more a manufactured crisis than a real one.
“So the students were offered something that turned out to be not true, but the students are very aware of who is at fault and it is not the Labour party leadership, but those running the campaign, most of who do not have paid authority in the Labour party.”
Then the next question is, if the people running the campaign had no authority in Labour, why were they advertising the fact that people would be coming to New Zealand to help Labour?
https://umichpicsannouncements.wordpress.com/2017/02/24/labour-party-campaign-fellowship-in-new-zealand/
https://casit.illinoisstate.edu/sites/pol/2017/04/12/2017-labour-campaign-fellowship/
https://www.tilburguniversity.edu/students/news/show/news-labour-campaign-fellowship/
http://stage.wp.hum.uu.nl/170424-2-new-zealand-labour-party-2017-campaign-fellowship/
https://bskstage.weblog.leidenuniv.nl/2017/05/12/internship-2017-labour-campaign-fellowship-new-zealand/
https://www.tilburguniversity.edu/students/news/show/news-labour-campaign-fellowship/
I don’t care if the law has been breached or not, the supposed worker’s party should not be asking people to come and work here for fuck all wages that’s what we expect from right wing scum.
Read this story in the Herald, Penny Bright, and get a corrected version on the overseas student “interns” story.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11880781
So Jenny – whats makes this version a ‘corrected version’ as opposed to the others stories?
Because this one makes labour look less bad and you are biased as heck?
Oh James, how lovely to see you back, I was very concerned we hadn’t seen you commenting during the whole Barclay alleged breaking the law affair, but glad to see you back now commenting on a volunteer intern scheme (possibly blown up by a disgruntled wine thief).
Biased as heck???? Pot… kettle….
Its because Im out of the country and only online a little. Glad to hear you missed me.
Re Barclay – the guys and idiot and gets everything he deserves. English was an idiot on the way he handled it. Other than that I havnt read too much on it – Enjoying the sun too much.
Because there appears to be one story saying it is all labours fault and multiple stories saying it was a cock up by the Change campaign after the people involved left labour to run the campaign that labour is now fixing because of the perceived connections.
Also now there are more stories which are disputing the “all volunteers/students feel ripped off” story line, and it looks like it was between 5-10 people who had a bit of a beef with the organisation
“and it looks like it was between 5-10 people who had a bit of a beef with the organisation”
According to one person.
One person, and the Marae…
and 85 people have the beef according to one person…
Funny you take the view of the first story (broken by a partisan source) and ignore further developments as biased.
But you know, continue with your confirmation bias, I am ensuring I keep updated with new information
update, at least 2 people, if not 3 people plus the marae saying not squalid conditions, but actually quite nice
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/93997696/internal-docs-on-labour-intern-scheme-wishful-thinking
Most stories from volunteers saying not labour’s fault, just the change campaigns disorganisation
It’s election time …. and our media becomes dirty mis-informers….. just like last election….. and the one before that….
Although not popular here, Martyn Bradbury credibly dismantles this dirty media manufactured bullshit.
. https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2017/06/23/why-the-labour-party-student-intern-scandal-is-a-smear/
“I was out to the Marae 2 weeks ago having a look around at what they were doing. I had a meal with them, talked with some of the volunteers. They were fantastic young people who were loving the adventure of it all.”
“Firstly, let’s be clear of the timeline here. Bryce Edwards had mentioned this program 20 days ago on June 1st… …”another type of resource is being utilised by the Labour Party this election – comrades from the US and UK. The party is currently importing dozens of young leftwing activists who are staying at an Auckland Marae”,”
“…and Bryce’s mention was after a news story on the 20th of April – a full month ago, where Hone was attacking Labour for doing this. ”
“The spluttering shock and hyperventilation of the corporate media at a story that is over a month old right when English was getting screwed seems remarkably good timing for National.”
“The perception of political hypocrisy is a mainstream media generated one, …”
With this first electioneering shot from our pro-nat media …. the only thing missing is Dong Liu
I wonder how many foreign students are helping with the National Party campaign? I doubt they have many volunteers so another question is, are they being paid by the taxpayer via Parliamentary Services?
First you have to establish if there are any.
No one would willingly donate their time to the NACt, so yeah none and so no problems there….
Probably more foreign donations or ‘sweet’ deals u want to look for. Lucky with Skycity & 0 tax havens laundering conditions r favourable for the Natz.
Interesting read
Other than it was uploaded by NewShrub… any clue if that is a real document and who wrote it?
Most likely by a gutter hog or a reverse young Nat an Old Nat.
So looks like it was a wish list made by the change programme when asked by unions to provide a plan to get them to provide funding. A wishlist which never made it into a real plan nor proposal, nor appears to have been approved by anyone, and no statement from anyone on if it is actually real… so basically garbage
According to the General Secretary of the Labour Party, Andrew Kirton it was Matt McCarten and his Auckland Labour party side kicks that wrote it.
Was that leaked?
At the risk of kicking a hornets nest:
In the context of change the government, the common refrain is a vote for anyone other than Labour/green is a wasted vote/or a vote for national….
I am of the opinion that if I vote for a minor party that is to the left of labour, and national govern again after the election, then labour weren’t ready to be an alternative government.
Labour may need another period of time in opposition to get it to move ‘left’. Especially if it looses votes to the ‘left/non neo-liberal’ parties.
The old left right paradigm may not be relevant any more.
I forget who put the theory up about there being a triangular aspect to politics (left, right, not neo-liberal) but having an option of a non neo liberal party really appeals.
There is greens & mana on the left.
Labour is a liberal centre party that’s gonna go in the direction voters indicate in elections. If it’s greens & mana it will push labour left. If it’s national it will push them right, if it’s nzfirst it will push them conservative centre. So if u r a leftie & for some inexplicable Reason U don’t vote, u r the ones pushing the parties right. Don’t whine about the middle class, rich & corporations and how to blame they r next election if u don’t vote, blame yourself!
Also my guess is it’s last chances for the public to choose a different future, because at the rate of state house sell offs , rising rents & lowering wages & asset sales from the national party and their grab of power across the state sectors, the poor are being socially cleansed.
The cost of houses of over 1 million in Auckland and the price of rents rising & prices spreading rapidly ( just saw a do up 90m2 villa in arrow town for 1.1million).
Even if u don’t live in Auckland the social cleansing & immigration practices going on will generate votes for the national party, giving them a long term advantage in ongoing elections. Auckland is 1/3 of the vote apparently.
If u care, vote now.
so vote Green. The problem is lefties voting Mana or TOP and those votes being wasted if Mana don’t gain TTT and TOP don’t get to 5%. That’s a gift to National.
Yep agree with weka, best bet greens or labour dep on where u sit. Safest way to change the government.
Sorry, I am away from my fone for the rest of the day.
That is my point, my vote isn’t wasted, rather it is invested.
If Labour lose this election but shift profoundly left/non neo-liberal for the next cycle.
Probably the other vibe I want to articulate is: is a Labour government that much of a change?
Gsays the message u send to labour is the opposite. If people r voting for the right political parties only – it’s sending all the left parties to the right because that is what the voters r telling them to do.
In my view that has been nationals biggest dirty politic propagating the message that labour is national. So don’t bother voting.
That’s the national tactic to vulnerable people. Don’t bother voting.
Voters need to send a message back to national – I reject your policy by voting against them.
yes. Also the people that criticise the Greens for not being more radical or left than they are but who haven’t been voting for them, well that’s why the Greens have become more mainstream. If there was a viable party further on the left I would agree with voting for them, but there really isn’t. Voting Mana or TOP as a protest vote will have very little effect on Labour or the Greens (if it was going to move them left it would have already).
“If Labour lose this election but shift profoundly left/non neo-liberal for the next cycle.”
Yes, that’s the bet. But it’s a risk IMO. A few % to Mana or TOP isn’t going to change Labour’s mind if they lose but it might cause them to lose. Little will probably be replaced as leader. What more left wing MP is there to take his place?
And why not just vote Green who are to the left of Labour already? To me your argument is very FPP. It’s not about Labour losing the election, it’s about the parliamentary left as a whole. I hope Harawira wins TTT and that Mana get another crack at parliament, but they don’t need left wing party votes to do that. They blew it at the last election, so it’s on them to rebuild over time if they want more MPs.
TOP aren’t left wing and are basically capitalism with more social justice than we have now so long as it’s framed in economics (that’s neoliberal imo).
“Probably the other vibe I want to articulate is: is a Labour government that much of a change?”
That one irks. For one, it won’t be a Labour govt. It will be a L/G govt or a L/G/NZF govt or a L/NZF one. That alone is a bloody good reason to vote Labour or Green. Best thing for the left right now is a L/G govt that doesn’t need Peters. In order for that to happen we need more people voting Labour or Green not less.
The other aspect is that if you compare policy Labour are very different to National in ways that impact directly on people and the country as a whole. Add in Green policy and on almost every area you can name a L/G govt would be substantially different to National. It beggars belief that we are still arguing about this on the left, are people not reading actual policy? If you want to understand the difference, have a look at water, welfare, and housing. It’s glaring.
+111
hi weka,
i can see we aren’t gonna see eye to eye on this.
mana blowing it last election is a point of view, the internet thing didn’t help.
i do feel labour did not help at all either, which is form for them and the way they can treat parties to the left of them.
“Probably the other vibe I want to articulate is: is a Labour government that much of a change?”
i certainly accept labour and national have differing polices, but as you and bill and others have pointed out, we need RADICAL changes to the way we live.
electric cars and vegetarian tuesdays isn’t gonna save our bacon.
labour will still be beholden to the status quo and lobbyists.
fair enough labour/green govt will help some of those that need it most.
labour, green, and 2,3,4 mana mps will be even better for the disadvantaged.
cheers for your input. hopefully the feathers arent too ruffled.
Also ‘investing’ your vote is something a neoliberal day trader would think of.
Have u by chance, had something pop into your social media accounts? Because I heard that’s how trump won.
data mining social media & sending individualised fear messages to voters. Ie Hillary Clinton thinks black men r predators to Black voters to make them not vote.
hi save, cheers for yr responses.
kinda hard to have a nuanced conversation, via text only, hours between responses.
believe it or not the standard is my social media.
no facebook, if you are on facebook you are not the customer you are the product.
no instantgram or twitter.
ts, rnz and stuff for the odd sports story/result is the limit cyber wise.
much rather engage with people in the flesh.
i am aware of trumps team use of targetted facebook posts, brilliant and dastardly use of a tool.
i think at the heart of this is i resent the implication that i must vote with the crowd.
mana last time round resonated with me.
Labour might think “oh gee, we’d better try nationalising everything as a policy because nobody is voting for us now”, but you know there will be loads of advice to “just go a little bit lmore like national to capture the middle ground”.
As investments go, that one’s pretty high risk. You might waste money on sports betting, but it’s not really an “investment”.
And I genuinely think that at least a labgrn government will improve the lives of thousands of people, even if it won’t bring about the revolution. I for one support the idea of less homeless people, but in a “give them homes and support” way, not a “move them out of my sight” way.
I think those three would be: Left, Right, Not Capitalist
Going Left or Right while maintaining capitalism maintains all the problems of the status quo. Although, going Left is more likely to lead to the removal of capitalism.
Just wondering what others think of the idea of foreign (mostly US) people campaigning for Labour? Would kiwis respond positively to someone flown in from another country telling them how to vote? I don’t think it’s a very good idea.
Not a good idea. People want a break from globalism esp those not doing so well.
Over the years, I’ve seen a lot of activists heading to Aussie, UK, and US as volunteers in their elections. Plus quite a few who have acted as observers in elections all around the world. I have also seen small numbers of overseas volunteers coming here.
It is a way to transfer information about different electoral systems and the way that campaigns and elections are run – for better or for worse.
For instance, explaining the nuances of MMP campaigns to overseas volunteers has been a private amusement for quite a while. Always nice when you can see the light of understanding in their eyes.
Update: I see that Anne said much the same thing further down.
What you refer to as globalism, is basically globalisation by and for the wealthy and corporates. They have their wealthy international think tanks, Bildeberg groups and other networks.
The best way to combat this internationalisation of the power of the elites, is to work collaboratively with other less powerful individuals and groups across countries. Pulling up the draw bridge, and isolating the less well off in individual countries, will be no defense against the international reach of the powerful and wealthy elites.
This scheme has been operating for some 20 plus years and political parties of all persuasions do it. Kiwis have gone to America, to Aussie, to England. Americans have gone to England, to Aussie and now to NZ. Aussies have gone to… and on it goes.
It’s an excellent way for young people of like mind to meet their counterparts in other countries and gain experience along the way.
What a closed mind you and other detractors must have.
One could argue Labour were being closed minded for failing to consider the negative reaction some would have to their use of foreign volunteers.
TC
It’s hard to try and move forward when having to drag a concrete Noah’s Ark from your left leg full of survival animals who can’t think anything different than what they’ve always had without squawking in fright.
I don’t have a problem with it being a resource, I just think that Labour needs to get our young people politically motivated as a priority.
While overseas volunteer supporters of like minded parties may look forward to coming over and having the experience. It is not necessarily true that the policies of similar positioned parties are the same. They have a lot of trust that the campaign they are working on follows their values until they get here. They are also unaware of any of the political happenings in the last three years for NZ, where US and UK politics can be easily followed on this side of the world.
A non-partisan encouragement of young people, presenting the overriding issues and looking for comprehensive solutions would be a great vehicle to get this started. If Labour and the Greens were involved, they would have to place trust in NZers that once they are informed, they would no longer accept trite assurances from Ministers and media that everything is hunky-dory. But the pay-off would most likely benefit those parties involved, and the left side of NZ politics as a whole. When people work together successfully, they are more inclined to view the wider community as their responsibility and with care.
I don’t have a problem with it being a resource, I just think that Labour needs to get our young people politically motivated as a priority.
Which is exactly what has been happening under the radar for some time Molly. I have noticed the increasing number of young people who have joined the Labour Party in recent years. It has almost seemed like a revival of the Norman Kirk years when many young people – including me – were motivated to join Labour.
A few weeks ago I attended a public meeting in Glenfield, Auckland which had been called to discuss the local housing crisis. There were several guest speakers including Phil Twyford. I was surprised to see there were an equal number of young people present as there were older people.
Oh and for the detractors, many of those young people present were not members of the Labour Party, but who chose to attend because they were interested to hear what Phil Twford had to tell them.
“Which is exactly what has been happening under the radar for some time Molly. I have noticed the increasing number of young people who have joined the Labour Party in recent years. It has almost seemed like a revival of the Norman Kirk years when many young people – including me – were motivated to join Labour.”
Thanks Anne. Always interested to hear from someone who knows the history and current position of Labour, as opposed to those who view it from an outside perspective.
A couple of questions, for clarity rather than inquisition:
1. Why is it under the radar? Is that a resources issue, a failure to see future value, or an intended choice?
2. There is a difference between motivating the young to get involved in politics – and getting the young involved in party politics.
I’m thinking that the resurgence in youth politics in Scotland and the UK, has been instigated by the Scottish referendum (and all the non-partisan grassroots community meetings held in support and against) and the Brexit referendum.
I would love to see a true initiative to get the youth electorate voting – regardless of party.
This would require the parties on the left to work together and would require them to have a lot of trust in the electorate, but would pay dividends on election day to the benefit of the left opposition.
Not only does it show how like minded parties can work together for the benefit of the public, it shows how valuable political engagement and knowledge can be. Once awakened, that skill and judgement will be deployed over the course of their voting lives. Political commentators and politicians will be working with a voting public that has the skills to more keenly judge media reports and obfuscations.
I was hoping the internship was something along these lines, but it doesn’t appear to have been in it’s current form.
Because it is fundamentally about people going somewhere to learn how others political systems operate by getting involved in them. It isn’t about making continuous press releases or a big deal about it.
The media will have known about these kinds of programmes for a long time. They really aren’t news – well at least not until National’s spinners like Hooten and Farrar need a diversionary story and someone is found to provide kernel of it.
The question was more about how to make it known to the youth in NZ, so they can intern, rather than the media for commentary. (In particular, youth not currently aligned with the Labour party).
As for the internship initiative, given the quality and depth of the reporting, it seems the typical “sound and fury, signifying nothing” distraction.
Hi Molly. I wasn’t being critical of your comment @ 9.2.2
Just wanted to let you know Labour are doing what they can to get the youth to take part in politics. And of course the Greens are doing like-wise. I also believe the young are coming to recognise their futures don’t look too bright under the current regime. They have every reason to worry about their ability to ever have a home of their own, and of course Climate Change [rightly] hangs heavy on their minds. It wouldn’t surprise me if they are starting to look seriously at wanting a change of regime in NZ.
“What a closed mind you and other detractors must have.”
Wow- what a nasty response to a question imagining how kiwis might respond to doorknocking by American interns.
If that’s an example of how a Labour Party Aucklander replies to a genuine question, glad I’m a Southern Greenie.
[lprent: What a delicate wee lazy flower you must be. Read the policy – especially that about robust debate.
Learn not to make simpleminded presumptions about others nor to try to use a typical troll ‘victim’ act. Because I really don’t like lazy fuckwits like you who try to impose your obnoxious rules on this site. That is my and the moderator’s job. We don’t pass it out to opinionated idiots like you. If I see you try it again, I will amend your behaviour with a sudden permanent ban for violating the rules of this site.
This is your warning. ]
Highlighting that it’s been going on for 20+ years and has never had an issue is nasty?
Or was it that you got your closed mind pointed out that hurt?
There are benefits to such exchanges as has been pointed out.
Sorry, warning taken on board. I really wasn’t meaning to impose any rules and, yeah, being a bit sensitive about the closed mind bit. Haven’t been commenting for a while, need to toughen up.
I’ve been involved with overseas volunteers on local revegetation projects, they’ve been great. All I had heard about re the ones this week was about them campaigning/door knocking for Labour and I wondered how that would work out. Now I know more about this type of thing thanks to the other comments.
I’ve noticed a lot of interest in our political culture from some of the Americans I interact with at the gallery. They are intrigued that we have a much more constructive political conversation than they are used to. Several have asked about internships. From where I’m seeing it, it’s not surprising that this got overwhelmed with interest. Tis’ a bugga being popular…
This item on NBC sort of touches on it and explains a lot of how we are place du jour in America right now
http://www.nbcnews.com/megyn-kelly/video/the-americans-are-coming-the-obsession-with-new-zealand-970813507783
It wasn’t the best idea. Yet, it seems Labour gave this little consideration.
In fact, they didn’t even clear the legality of it, which should have been one of the first things to do. Moreover, they are carrying on with it while it is still unclear.
This won’t inspire voter confidence in their ability to run the country.
They may do. Depends upon the Kiwi and their understanding of the way similar parties cooperate across the globe.
I’m not a fan – in principle parties should cultivate a local activist or volunteer base.
It may not be illegal but it’s going to cost a couple of points. Looks to me like some middle echelons wanted an entry to the lucrative US political job market.
Corokia
That’s a very good point.
POLL: Does the Labour Party look like a government-in-waiting?
http://www.radiolive.co.nz/home/newshub/2017/06/poll–does-the-labour-party-look-like-a-government-in-waiting-.html
Currently 66% say yes. Heh.
Garner and that other odious prick held a poll on the AM show this morning asking if the Labour migrant scandal was of more concern than the Barclay affair That odious bit of shit was using terminology like slave ships slave labour etc and Garner in his usual style was reading out the most blatant rightwing crap people supposedly was writing in. with the usual discussions that Labour was not beyond redemption if they change their leader etc etc ad nauseam
That odious prick was most upset when at the last time I saw it more people were concerned about the Barclay affair than Labours. Also it was delightful to see Ardern put hysterical Benefit well and truly in her place.
Has anyone seen the whole morning programme and what was the result of the biased poll they had. because I think people are beginning to wake up the shit by the Garners, Gowers Hoskins and Johnny come lately odious Mark whatever his surname is.
It is Mark Richarsoaaaaaaaaaggggggghhhhhhhhhh
When I looked earlier it was something like 51% said Barclay/English was worse. Which is pretty good given the bias it was presented with.
did you see how Ardern had garner eating out of her hand and saying that labour had acting in the right way as opposed to the nats spending a year lying and such.
here that you nat scum the truth will set you free
If it wasn’t for this botched intern scheme the support for Labour could have possibly been higher.
If it wasn’t for lefties running round bashing Labour it could possibly have been higher.
+100%
I haven’t not bothered reading about this labour intern issue, sounds more to me like a msm distraction to drum up, now that national are on the rocks with Barclay etc
Why bother biting?
There’s a need to push back a bit because the dirty politics on this is strong enough to undermine the left.
If it wasn’t for Labour messing up, there be no bashing from the left. They bring it upon themselves.
Moreover, if we don’t hold them to account, we can’t expect them to improve.
One hopes more isn’t revealed or develops.
No-one brings bashing upon themselves. Bashing is different from holding to account.
“If it wasn’t for Labour messing up, there be no bashing from the left.”
Obviously. But we’re all humans here and all of us make mistakes. I’m far more interested in how we handle those mistakes than in everyone having to be perfect and never make any. As far as I can tell Little fronted up well on this and Labour are doing the work to sort out the actual problem not just the perceived political one.
It’s time to change the government. Your own incessantly negative approach appears to work against that.
“No-one brings bashing upon themselves”.
Perhaps not willingly, but evidently, they do.
“I’m far more interested in how we handle those mistakes”
Indeed, it’s the putting right that counts. Many mess up, not many put it right.
However, in this instance the putting right looks as if it may unravel. I’m concerned Labour are starting to dig a larger hole.
As highlighted, sorting out the legality should be a priority. The media will have a field day with Labour continuing on if it turns out to be illegal. Therefore, this could potentially get far worse.
There is even paperwork bringing their excuse (it was over subscribed) into question.
Labour have been round long enough to know how the game is played, yet they aren’t playing too well, hence we’ve got to keep their feet to the fire.
Thanks weka @10.2.1 So true.
It doesn’t looked botched.
The media coverage was light on background, balance, presented as a “gotcha” and picked up a few willing commentators ready to be outraged.
Count yourself among them.
“It doesn’t looked botched.”
Rubbish. They don’t even know if it’s legal, yet they are carrying on regardless.
Lowering the bar and making excuses won’t encourage them to up their game.
If we want Labour to move left and improve, we are going to have to hold their feet to the fire.
That’s a pretty ugly metaphor, but useful to know that you think people asked to be damaged and that damaging people is warranted. Including natural allies.
I didn’t say people ask to be damage. However, of course people will get flak when they mess up.
Would you rather we lower the bar and allow them to get away with it?
“Would you rather we lower the bar and allow them to get away with it?”
You’re really not listening to what I am saying. Critique good, bash bad.
Can you provide an example of where you believe I’ve bashed them.
“They don’t even know if it’s legal,”
That my friend is being promoted by the media because what their delightful obnoxious character Toddy did was CRIMINAL
Say it enough times and it will become Labour does it too
And as Foxy pointed out on twitter, “When you are running the same line as Matthew Hooton you need to check yourself.”
No. That is coming from Labour. See link below.
http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/labour-investigating-whether-scheme-broke-visa-laws.html
It has been raised by government ministers. Of course Labour is now going to do due diligence..
But it’d be interesting if National are willing to extend this kind of scrutiny to all volunteers who are housed on a Marae. I’m sure that the Maori Party will want a say in that. Or Lions and Rotary who also have widespread international volunteer program. Or churches. Or…. whatever – you may understand the point.
Not to mention kiwis going offshore to do things like VSA, or the volunteers that DOC uses.
“Of course Labour is now going to do due diligence..”
Having a political party associated to an illegal act (not that it has yet been established) isn’t a good look, therefore this should have been cleared up from the get go.
To The Chairman @ 12.52 pm
No that is wrong and you are quoting The Hub of all places as a reliable source, you must be joking
Garner kept trying to put words into Kirton’s mouth and kept repeating “does that mean you don’t’ know if you have broken the law yet is that what you are saying”, to which Kirton replied “Oh look I don’t actually but that doesn’t mean anything really and I am focussing on the welfare of these volunteers.” which was more or less repeated a little later by Arderne “I wouldn’t know enough about the explicit rules around someone who’s here on a short-term voluntary basis. I wouldn’t have thought so… we’ve got to be absolutely sure,”
So it is NOT coming from Labour.
If someone said my car had flat tyres I would check to see if they needed inflating but that doesn’t mean I would be admitting that I have been driving around with flat tyres. As I can see the same dirty politics coming into play with this election with all the shit being bounded around about slave ships and sweat shops by labour I am pleased they are checking the law.
Lets be honest it’s amateur hour on steroids.
A government in waiting I don’t think so,
Honest, yes, let’s be. The Barclay debacle was the height of professionalism. A Government in freefall, BM.
I haven’t really followed it that closely, beltway stuff.
The issue with the Labour “interns” though, disgraceful, hypocritical, maybe even illegal, heads definitely need to roll.
Did you know that proven liar Prime Minister John key left and Bill English took over and has been caught lying too only he is a bit more yaap so he’s no good at it. That makes the last two gnat leaders caught lying. Breathe it in bm these are the last of the good days for you old bean.
Mate, I really don’t care who wins the next election.
If labour manages to scrape together a coalition and gains power nothing is really going to change, it’s going to be business as usual.
The only change will be English retiring and Collins taking the reins.
I haven’t really followed it that closely, beltway stuff.
The issue with the Labour “interns” though…
Oh, how we laughed. The PM lying about what he knew of a crime and his involvement in helping covering it up? Beltway stuff, nothing of interest there. A couple of disgruntled Labour interns, though? Disgusting! Heads must roll!
Lol yeah you don’t care all right – after key scurried away many die-hard gnat lovers have felt the same. I feel ya…
@ Halfcrown
When asked if Labour has broken any immigration laws, Kirton replied he’s still getting to the bottom of it. Therefore, clearly they’re unsure.
Moreover, the fact he didn’t know, hence wasn’t able to refute it, leaves the thought (it may be illegal) hanging in peoples minds.
This is something they should have cleared up right from the get go.
But here’s another problem, Kirton believes whether it’s legal doesn’t mean anything. However it does. This will look far worse if it turns out to be illegal, yet Kirton can’t see it.
It will be back in the headlines if it is.
And while that would explain why they are carrying on, it’s disappointing they can’t see the potential storm they’re sailing into if it turns out to be illegal.
“Count yourself among them.”
+1
Indeed, and on past performances I reckon our friend has an intent to foment discord.
Here is another poll for you weka…Roy Morgan
https://www.roymorgan.com/findings/7259-roy-morgan-new-zealand-voting-intention-june-2017-201706230945
It has Labour @ 25.5% down by 3% from last month. But some good news for the greens they are steady on 14% 🙂
The latest RNZ story to come out on the MSM labelled “Intern Scandal”.
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/333625/labour-party-programme-got-out-of-control
Someone I know intimated something along these lines two weeks ago.
[posted in another thread, but seems pertinent and was offtopic in the other thread so deleted it]
For an engineer in the political machine, McCarten seems to be a bit shit with paperwork. Although it could also be supervision – a few people involved and the person doing the recruiting didn’t tell the colleagues or McCarten how many people were coming.
Actually, I wonder if they just didn’t expect the usual rush of applications at the last minute? Every year I am part of the organising committee for an event, and every year we start shitting ourselves that we’ve overcatered and nobody will show up, and it’s always in the last week/ten days that a solid 80% of attendees register. Fucks my blood pressure up and no mistake. But failing to have the guts to tell people “no, time’s up, we’ll put you on a list of alternates if you want” could have gotten them into this position.
Yes. There does seem to have been a bit of the… left hand not knowing what the right hand was doing. It also sounds like more people took up the offer than they had prepared for, but heaven forbid… nobody committed any crimes, and it’s something everybody has experienced when organising an event or a family reunion. There’s always a hitch of some sort which rears its ugly head at the last minute.
It most certainly didn’t warrant the attention or the vitriol that was heaped on Labour by the MSM over the past 24 hours. They behaved like a pack of howling, rabid dogs. I hope they have sought medical assistance for their hysterical nonsense.
True, that.
On the plus side, the Labour thing looks like a bit of a flash in the pan, whereas the deBarclay is a long and steady burner. He’s hanging around like a persistent pimple, and we’ll see if a search warrant comes by this time.
The latest on getting rid of ISIS out of Mosul:
https://southfront.org/map-update-iraqi-security-forces-storming-last-isis-bastion-in-mosul/
And which one is more likely:
1. The Iraqi government and US military have a plan to rebuild built infrastructure, the Mosque, schools and hospitals and housing, to start to make Mosul a liveable place again.
2. Iran just waits for the post-victory near-anomie, uses proxies to gain a stronger hold with the Iraqi government, carves the area up informally with the Kurds, and Mosul becomes a shell of a place.
I sure know what I’d like to see.
Given that the U.s.a has just sold $120 Billion of weapons to the Saudis …. and that they seem to be a military industrial society that needs to export these weapons of democracy to stay afloat.
And the fact they help fund Isis … and act as its air-force at crucial moments in Syria.
Then I would suggest it would be the u,s,a ( and Nato ), who continue the destructive conflicts in the middle east ….. that they started with illegal wars/invasions, launched under false pretenses.
What do you think Iran would be like today, if the u.s.a and Brits had not attacked and overthrown their democracy way back in 1953 Ad? ….
Mossadegh was a good man…. and the west has treated the Iranian people with malevolence ever since they overthrew their democratically elected leader.
Whats your excuse ?.
Go ahead and defend Iran. Because you clearly can’t see I’m not defending either Iran or the USA.
Always amusing to see another moist leftie look for the last European regime it can find to assign the ills of the world upon. It was them colonialists who instigated the comprehensively fundamentalist, misogynist, fanatical , murderous and corrupt 1979 Revolution? And the lack of any reform since?
Have a nice armchair-general time running your alternative history.
Meantime, first coalition to come up with a post-war plan wins.
Weak As Ad.
Why did the 1979 revolution happen …… 1953 coup.
What do you think Iran would be like today, if the u.s.a and Brits had not attacked and overthrown their democracy way back in 1953 Ad? ….
Mossadegh was a good man…. and the west has treated the Iranian people with malevolence ever since they overthrew their democratically elected leader.
What you complain about is known as “blow-back”
What do you think Iran would be like today, if the u.s.a and Brits had not attacked and overthrown their democracy way back in 1953 Ad? ….
You tell me what it would be like. It’s your story.
See if that’s fruitful to the impending fall of Mosul and any plan thereafter.
Well we can know for certain that the `1979 revolution would not have happened if Iran was allowed to continue as a peaceful secular democracy.
We know that the Shah imposed upon the Iranians was a murderous thieving thug.
Ayatollah Khomeini was the fanatical blow back that removed the unpopular Shah.
The average Iranian is obviously far worse off thanks to the real … not alternative ….. history behind the present.
No 1953 coup ,,, no 1979 Ayatollah
And basically evidence since Yugoslavia onward s points to the fact.
That from the west.
The plan Is war ….
For profit …. to the few.
The fate of Mosul ….. going on its history since the u.s.a turned Iraq into one huge war crime ….. is that it will see more shells and bombing and death squads than building.
Look to Fallujah
There is no fate.
An equally valid alternative, if the Iraqi government lets them, and if Iran is supportive, is to look to Kurdish Erbil:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraqi_Kurdistan
“The Kurdistan region of Iraq enjoys more stability, economic development, and political pluralism than the rest of the country. And public opinion under the Kurdistan Regional Government demands rule-of-law-based governance. But power is concentrated in the hands of the ruling parties and families, who perpetuate a nondemocratic, sultanistic system. These dynamics could foster instability in Kurdistan and its neighborhood, but could also provide a rare window of opportunity for democratization.”
Stranger things have happened.
Well with the Billions of weapons being pumped into the middle east I think the destruction rate ( 3.5 million refugees Iraq ) will continue.
Who are we bombing ?” 3mins 43
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBwQPEsh9IE
P.s I thought Saddam, another c.i.a installed thug, should have been hung when he used Sarin nerve gas on the Iranians with coordination and coordinates from the usa …
Muammar Gaddafi on the other hand with his bloodless coup …… demonstrated socialism working ….. by the largest improvements of living standards for the people of Libya …., in the shortest period of time …. in any country anywhere in the world ….. in the 20th century.
Nato will be able to take credit for the quickest reversal …..
then it was all down hill – mass arrests and detention, torture, disappearances, televised executions, the assassination of expat opponents abroad, nuclear ambitions, war with his neighbours, the financing of ETA in Spain, the IRA and the Italian Red Brigades, as well as groups in Japan, Turkey, Thailand and the Philippines……
You sound like your reeling of the actions of the cia/u.s.a in south america or Iraq or Vietnam Joe90 ….. or to quote Nelson Mandela …….“If you look at those matters, you will come to the conclusion that the attitude of the United States of America is a threat to world peace. If there is a country that has committed unspeakable atrocities in the world, it is the USA. They don’t care for human beings.”
I on the other hand was talking about a man using the resources of his country ( instead of BP getting it ), ……. and lowering infant mortality from over 100 deaths per thousand live births down to approx 14
Who granted equal Human rights to women in 1972 ….. something the fundamentalist terrorists Hated …… like the British sponsored “Manchester Boys” …. and other religious extremists used by the west.
He vastly improved housing from most living in slums ….. and declared housing a human right.
He vastly improved access to and quality of medical care … free
He was ridding the country of illiteracy and had full enrollments of children into schools
University education was free …… and of course women could attend.
He took Libya from one of the most impoverished countrys in the world …….. and before being Mob murdered had Libya with the highest standard of living in Africa and a life expectancy comparable to Europe.
No other country in the world improved the standard of living for its citizens by such an amount in such a short time ……. through Socialism.
Nato will bear responsibility for the quickest decline
The most famous terrorist he supported was one Nelson Mandela ….. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article37301.htm
He supported the Palestinians which infuriated the Israelis
I tend to think that the hard facts and statistics regarding health, education…..water and housing projects. The improvements in living standards are there for anyone to find on the internet.
Speaks more to me of the man than tony Blair , or Cameron type hyperbole…… the types who give safe harbors to ‘Manchester Boys’.
You can see Cameron in action in the video I linked to above.
Such huge bullshitters
EF Schumacher on small economics. Too bad 40 years on we turned our backs on this stuff and doubled down on waste, consumption and greed. It looks like we’re going to learn the hard way.
Was thinking that John key has haijacked the ‘third way’ for the national party that politicians like tony blair did for Labour Party in th UK. It goes too far and the leaders turn into arguably criminal liars and their obsession with networking & likeability drag their counties into war, debt & division.
For the national party voters, that hanker after the ‘old values’ of the national party before they became asset selling, migration touting, arrogant careerists that don’t give a crap about their constituents and spend their days drinking & lunching & day trading & doing real estate deals like hotels & conference centres, nz first is a good alternative. It’s the national party of old! Hope winston does a killing in all the Natz stronghold provinces!
if labour & greens pick up the missing million as well, then the the public can kick the ‘third way’ Natz to the curb – hopefully in a landslide to send that message home!
This is probably a fairly good cross section of Clutha Southland, they’re not happy
http://www.scene.co.nz/the-south-today/?video=5478401942001
Quite possible that the “missing million” won’t so much be the left’s to pick up, but National’s to loose this election.
Hope that makes National nervous. I wonder how many of those National voters saying they won’t vote National are talking about the party vote or the seat vote.
From my personal acquaintances who vote nat, and a very small sample, split between not voting, see who the new candidate is, Mark Patterson (NZF candidate) / National pv, NZF / NZF.
Prior to toddles’ departure (Monday, Tue morning) you could take out the new candidate option. Patterson was getting a lot of interest and maybe that triggered the end game.
So English’s involvement and behaviour isn’t changing the party vote?
Don’t think Bill’s coming out of this exactly smelling of roses. More and more people are getting sick of the lies, and the liars winning.
True, but I suspect that many of those Nat voters will hold their noses and party vote Nat anyway. Swing ones are another matter I guess.
My comment about the missing million. It could affect National just like it got Labour in 2008. And for exactly the same reason, arrogance and moved too far into opposition territory to try and hold onto the centre voters.
The “faithful” say bugger ya, and stay at home
that’s a good point.
I think NZF is getting some traction in the provinces, won’t get any help from NZ’s Tory media though.
Tory Government’s benefit cap is unlawful and causes ‘real misery for no good purpose’, High Court rules
#notsurprised
If we could take our government to court over their benefit policies we’d probably get the same ruling.
Also, to those who think an Upper House works, this must have got past the UKs House of Lords.
Latest YouGov poll
Corbyn now rated as best PM for first time
………………… June 5-7 ………… June 21-22
Corbyn ………… 32 …………………… 35 …… + 3
May …………….. 43 …………………… 34 ……. – 9
The first time YouGov have a Labour leader ahead a Tory leader on the best PM question since the summer of 2007.(although 35% still a long way from wildly popular)
More telling contrast = In first YouGov poll after calling the General Election (18-19 April) … May was leading Corbyn by 54%-15% on best PM
… So May down 20 points … Corbyn up 20
You gotta smile at the world we live in.
Herald online suggesting Prince Harry is in trouble: ” Stripping off in Vegas is one thing, but speaking the unvarnished truth is quite another.”
And on this side of the world Bill English is in trouble for telling unvarnished lies.
I’m hoping the next Queen will change the UK national anthem from God Save the Queen to My Milkshake Brings All The Boys To The Yard.
The Arab vision for fighting terrorism
We are being lied to to justify invasion into other countries.
Heh.
http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/06/our-score-so-far-republicans-89-democrats-1/
Anyone got anything similar for our local scene? I know the strike rate with ACT is high enough that trouble with the law feels like a near prerequisite to serving in Parliament, but I’ve got no feel for how the balance looks for other parties.
Standard “gotcha” column inches entitled “Labour Gives Up Search For Missing Million”
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11881038
Sigh.
Bryce Edwards stirring it around again. He is from Christchurch and seems all shook up with the earthquakes and that, and hasn’t settled and found stability in his political discourse so up bubbles a lot of liquefaction. Which faction it is differs from week to week.
Regardless what “we” might think or like or dislike about this Student Internship Calamity Recruitment Campaign Drive ….the Hack LSM & Hoots are going to keep on kicking this story all the way to the election.
Its a fuck up in anyone’s book & the fault lies with all involved who’ve forgotten the golden rule, dont piss your workers off! And also remember; the first rule is the same as the 2nd & the 3rd, you dont talk about …
So, a collective “Fuck this Fuck’n mess!” Time to shore up the dyke because the latest RM Polls out & that is just going to compound this almighty fuck up.
http://www.roymorgan.com/findings/7259-roy-morgan-new-zealand-voting-intention-june-2017-201706230945
We need to “grow some” donate enrol and vote. Leave the hair shirt at home.
Heard Nick Smith on the wireless saying the new nelson branch of the young Nat’s is thriving, dang are there only six members = 5 white males, 1 white female?
Heh. In case you are around, there’s a post going up tomorrow about the Greens running a de-seat Smith campaign in Nelson.
To busy with rugby and yatching sorry, like to see something on labors 25p. Though
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