Open mike 26/09/2011

43 comments on “Open mike 26/09/2011 ”

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1. mickysavage 1

   26 September 2011 at 8:16 am

   Brash’s weekend utterances are interesting and I await with interest John Banks publicly supporting the doobie policy.

   But  Brash’s comments about the rights of home owners and people being attacked were the most interesting.  He said:

   “Your home is your castle – your body is your temple,” Dr Brash said. “The law must be unequivocal in allowing you to defend both with reasonable force.”

   Maybe he has in mind the law saying something like this:

   “Every one is justified in using, in the defence of himself or another, such force as, in the circumstances as he believes them to be, it is reasonable to use.”

   Or this:

   “Every one in peaceable possession of a dwellinghouse, and every one lawfully assisting him or acting by his authority, is justified in using such force as is necessary to prevent the forcible breaking and entering of the dwellinghouse by any person if he believes, on reasonable and probable grounds, that there is no lawful justification for the breaking and entering.”

    But wait …

   That is the current law …

   Brash has obviously learned from Key the importance of spin and dog whistling over substance.
   • Lanthanide 1.1

     26 September 2011 at 8:25 am

     They talked about it on Morning Report this morning.

     What Brash wants is a presumption of innocence or immunity from prosecution in cases where the defence is clearly ‘reasonable’.

     I do have some sympathy with this point of view – I don’t see why the police so go around charging victims with assault and such when they’ve just been through a harrowing experience and were only trying to protect themselves, when the majority of the time (you should expect) the charges will be dropped, thrown out or proven innocent in court. It’s also a waste of money and time.

     The law society guy was essentially saying “it’s not up to police to make the decision, they need to lay the charges and the court will decide what is right and what is wrong”. Taking it to the extreme, why don’t the police just lay charges against everyone for every single little thing and let the courts decide if they broke the law or not? Clearly they don’t do that, so they already have discretion and I don’t see there’s any reason that that discretion can’t be extended in these self defence cases.
     • mickysavage 1.1.1

       26 September 2011 at 8:39 am

       Aye Lanth
        
       Jonathan Krebs was the Law Society spokesperson and said essentially that Brash was advocating that politicians make decisions concerning matters which were the Court’s responsibility.  If they could do this then why have laws they can direct the Police not to follow?
        
       It comes down to Prosecutorial policy.  It currently states:
        
       “Prosecutions ought  to be  initiated or continued only where  the prosecutor  is satisfied that the Test for Prosecution is met.  The Test for Prosecution is met if: 

       6.1.1  The evidence which can be adduced in Court is sufficient to provide a reasonable prospect of conviction – the Evidential Test; and
       6.1.2  Prosecution  is  required  in  the  public  interest  –  the  Public  Interest Test. ”
        
       I am struggling to see the difference between the public interest test and Brash’s proposal.
       • Lanthanide 1.1.1.1

         26 September 2011 at 9:07 am

         I agree.

         And yet we have the police charging people who defend themselves with assault offences. Something should be done about this; whether it be Brash’s suggestion or something else.
   • Vicky32 1.2

     26 September 2011 at 5:21 pm

     and I await with interest John Banks publicly supporting the doobie policy.

     Which he said on RNZ this morning, that he won’t do… 🙂
2. tc 2

   26 September 2011 at 8:22 am

   Waiting for Banks to fall into line like the good obedient right wing poodle he is then how long before the MSM coin the phrase…Doobie Brothers.
3. Adrian 3

   26 September 2011 at 8:51 am

   Things are a lot clearer now. Delusions of granduer, wild flights of fancy, thinks people are spying on him and stealing his shit, and living in a fantasy world.. NOW we know what Don has been smoking!
4. Lanthanide 4

   26 September 2011 at 9:05 am

   Expect this headline to be revised as the day progresses:

   Key clings to China
   8:16am PM says there is optimism China’s economy will remain strong and that will buffer New Zealand from the global financial turmoil.
   • Lanthanide 4.1

     26 September 2011 at 9:40 am

     Here’s what it says now, note the timestamp remains unchanged:

     New Zealand in good shape: PM
     8:16am John Key says there is optimism China’s economy will remain strong and that will buffer New Zealand from the global financial turmoil.
     • Colonial Viper 4.1.1

       26 September 2011 at 12:35 pm

       China’s economy is at serious risk at the moment with real inflation (the one the people experience, not the one in the official statistics) hovering over 10%.

       The only people in the markets who are ‘optimistic about China’s economy’ are people trying to offload Chinese shares on to you.
5. Frank Macskasy 5

   26 September 2011 at 9:48 am

   I’m waiting for Brash to announce a radical new road law: all vehicles, with the exception of emergency vehicles, shall travel at no more than 100 kilometres per hour on open roads!

   Wow!

   Radical!
   • mik e 5.1

     26 September 2011 at 7:24 pm

     Motorways will be exempt Frank according to Stephen Joyce.
6. Tigger 6

   26 September 2011 at 10:22 am

   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10754362

   I’m confused by this story. The first para says “An 11th-hour intervention by the Prime Minister has given the newest member of the Warriors family an unlikely ticket to the NRL Grand Final.” But there’s no evidence of any need for intervention Bullshit PR for National. Fuck you MSM, I am literally sick of your spin.
   • tc 6.1

     26 September 2011 at 10:44 am

     Checkout on RNZ’s media watch on the free mileage that Shonkey got courtesy of his good mate the Mad Butcher…..of course like ‘doing it tough ex AB’ Matthew Ridge he’s a beneficiary of a low wage, low rights workforce for his low end sausage shops…..ka ching.
   • queenstfarmer 6.2

     26 September 2011 at 11:10 am

     No “evidence”? It’s not a court case.

     The article could be clearer but I think it is obvious that the problem is the kid didn’t have a passport, so the kid (and presumably therefore the wife) wouldn’t have been able to attend the big final, so the PM pulled strings to get the kid a passport.
     • Campbell Larsen 6.2.1

       26 September 2011 at 11:46 am

       It’s also not news. It is bullshit PR puffery.
       • Tigger 6.2.1.1

         26 September 2011 at 12:46 pm

         QSF – it appears the family hadn’t even tried to get a passport. So Key didn’t pull any strings (and let’s leave aside whether a PM should be deciding how passports are granted) he just did the Mad Butcher’s bidding.
         • queenstfarmer 6.2.1.1.1

           26 September 2011 at 4:44 pm

           QSF – it appears the family hadn’t even tried to get a passport

           So your grievance is now against the family? But anyway, the article says: “Hart [as in John Hart] was seeking contacts within Internal Affairs to pave the way for a fast tracking of the documentation for Luck jnr”

           So they were in the process of trying to get a passport. The Butcher’s old mate JK put in the good word mate, and all’s well that ends well mate.
7. The Voice of Reason 7

   26 September 2011 at 11:07 am

   Quick question for the mods, is the email still working? I sent through a post on Friday, but have no indication that it was received at “thestandardnz@gmail.com”, which is the address in the contact page. The contribute page didn’t work at all (using Firefox).
    
   Cheers, TVoR.
8. Jum 8

   26 September 2011 at 11:27 am

   “Your home is your castle – your body is your temple,” Dr Brash said.

   So Brash is for women’s choice over their bodies? The abortion question will arise soon under a very conservative government. Will Brash support women having a safe, legal abortion?

   Second point: is the home the castle for all members of the family behind the castle walls or is it the castle of the dominant person and no interference in what that dominant member does to other family members? i.e. back to the 19th/20thC?

   But this niggling little voice tells me that this Brash person really doesn’t see women as equal human beings.

   PS Don Brash heads Act as the default leader for National when Key goes soon after the shit hits the fan with the sell offs and the betrayal of sovereign rights for Kiwis and the privatisation of our loved education and health systems. Not to mention the raising of the pension age that Key said he would quit over, which gives him the knighthood and Brash the reins.

   That was the deal the pair struck for Key to take over. Brash and Banks will be in charge within a year.
9. idlegus 9

   26 September 2011 at 11:33 am

   hows this! john key to host a show on radio live on friday, hes going to have some guests including ritchie mcaw(sp?), holy hell, payback for the mediaworks bail out?
   • Ianupnorth 9.1

     26 September 2011 at 11:44 am

     Is this same JK? http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10754362
     The guy who is now in charge of passports for babies who need to see their daddy at work.
     • Tigger 9.1.1

       26 September 2011 at 12:13 pm

       Actually The Radio Network put Key into sweetheart interviews so it’s unfair to point the finger at Mediaworks. Can you name me one commercial broadcaster who isn’t giving Key a red carpet? They’re all equally bent.
   • Campbell Larsen 9.2

     26 September 2011 at 11:55 am

     I would rather listen to MCow. Come to think of it I would rather MCow was PM, one day he really will be prime mince, so Shonkey and the cow have a lot in common, though there can be little doubt that the cow would be a better catwalk model.
10. Jum 10

    26 September 2011 at 11:44 am

    Speaking of Don Brash and the Family First party – a marriage of convenience in the wind, given the high percentage of ticks for Brash by the religious party.

    http://valueyourvote.org.nz/

    You want scary; this should do it. Young women and men of our future New Zealand. You will get this man in Parliament if National gets through. Family First will make sure that your opinions and your views are as nothing. It will be back to the religious right and all sense and egalitarian thinking will go right out the window.

    Labour got lots of black marks from the religious right; I like Labour even more now!
    • mik e 10.1

      26 September 2011 at 7:31 pm

      Don’t be dopey Jum FF the pot issue has come up now and that support will go nationals way It just seems like Act is whistling up support for National this election the dinosaurs are done, global warming is wiping out Nicholsons support.Don is doing Drugs bring back Rodney.
11. Jum 11

    26 September 2011 at 12:02 pm

    The ‘candidate survey’ is even more interesting.
    Winston Peters, Don Brash and Bob Mccoskrie of Family First may want to go into a civil union. I don’t think 3 people are allowed to get married to one another.

    http://valueyourvote.org.nz/

    Winston Peters tops the charts on both screens. Bob loves him.
    • Lanthanide 11.1

      26 September 2011 at 1:19 pm

      No one person can be legally involved in more than 1 marriage.

      However it’s entirely legal to have de facto relationships with as many people as you want. With the current property laws applying equally to de facto couples as it does to married couples, for most purposes people don’t need polygamous marriages any more.
    • Ianupnorth 11.2

      26 September 2011 at 4:58 pm

      This has to be the funniest, least scientific poll ever!
      Phil has five smiley faces and gets a score of 15%, Metiria Turei has 6 smilies and gets 25% and Pita Sharples has 6 but score 14%.
       
      Oh, and Brash has 6 out of 10 and gets 48%. Family First, party of the stupid.
      • Descendant Of Smith 11.2.1

        26 September 2011 at 6:28 pm

        I’ve looked at it and am really concerned about their skills.

        I can’t see how you could so easily cock this up.

        The smiley faces are where the sad faces should be and the sad faces are where the smiley faces should be.

        They should really get a better website guru who can pay more attention to detail.
12. Penny Bright 12

    26 September 2011 at 12:29 pm

    John Bowscawen has effectively thrown in the towel, but is still standing in Tamaki?

    http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/acts-boscawen-not-seeking-re-election-act-party-list-will-stand-tamaki-doesnt-see-victory-ne#comment-201352

    Must be tricky for John Bowscawan to remain enthusiastic about the ACT Party which is being led by an ex-National Party ‘carpet-bagger’, who took over the ACT Party leadership two hours after joining?

    Former National Party Leader Don Bra$h “I’ve got the ca$h – it’s my way or the highway’?

    Wonder where all the ACT Party ACTivists have gone?

    Can’t see them being particularly inspired to campaign hard for two ex-National Party arguably ‘has-beens’ Don Bra$h or John Banks?

    The ACT Party is now obviously the National Party “B” team.

    There is obviously very little differrence between National and ACT if their policies and personnel are so readibly interchangeable?

    Or do the National “A” and National “B” teams think that the voting public are completely stupid and to be treated with contempt?

    Meant of course in a caring way 🙂

    Penny Bright
    ‘Independent Public Watchdog’ candidate for Epsom.
13. The Voice of Reason 13

    26 September 2011 at 12:40 pm

    Department of D’oh!
     
    You’d think a Mayor would know his own council’s rules, eh?
     
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/manawatu-standard/news/5684579/Candidate-caught-out-by-council-sign-bylaw
    • gingercrush 13.1

      26 September 2011 at 1:27 pm

      Stupid isn’t it.
14. joe90 14

    26 September 2011 at 12:45 pm

    This just reinforces my pessimism.

    NGO report: 93,000 Copts left Egypt since March
15. prism 15

    26 September 2011 at 1:19 pm

    The stuff news headline – Terry Serepisos Loses The Phoenix, Then His Shirt. I am sorry that this guy has gone down the tubes, he has been great supporting the Phoenix for so long. Thank goodness that others have been able to take up the role.
    • Jum 15.1

      26 September 2011 at 1:29 pm

      The least they could do is give him a lifetime of free entry to the games.
16. Brett Dale 16

    26 September 2011 at 3:06 pm

    Terry has done so much for New Zealand Football, hopefully he can bounce back.
17. Olwyn 17

    26 September 2011 at 3:19 pm

    I wish Terry Serepisos well: in his support for the Phoenix he has given something quite wonderful to his city and his country.
    • mik e 17.1

      26 September 2011 at 7:39 pm

      SCF pulled the plug ie the govt, alot more businesses have hit the wall because of SCF. more to come if they had not been allowed to carry on after Key was warned by treasury that they were breaking the rules of the bail out this would have been a $ 400 million problem instead of a $ 3 billion problem the govt only loosing $ 1.4 billion other investors and borrowers are loosing alot more.
18. aerobubble 18

    26 September 2011 at 3:45 pm

    WTF? Who is this geddis fellow? Sorry, but if the highest court in the
    land throws out some evidence because it does not rise to the
    higher standard, excpetional circumstances, then so bugger what!
    Why did they throw it out, surely they had a reason, that the
    exception circumstances were not met by Police. i.e. it wasn’t
    terrorism, rather the participtes… oops… should we even be discussing
    this while the trials are ongoing. And therein lies the rather disreputable
    debate and yet another rush to legislate a poorly legislated area.
    and why is it poorly legislated because of our rat bad parliament that
    has little personal responsibility for doing its job in a timely manner.
    WTF! these surveilance camera were invented in the cold war!
    You have to be boggling stupid not to have legislated this already,
    so why is there such a need to rush now, when there wasn’t a need
    to rush for all those years.
    Sorry, but if a few criminals go free and parliament is forced to
    take its time to do the job properly for once, in shame, then so be it.
19. freedom 19

    26 September 2011 at 5:41 pm

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/news/national/5686757/Urewera-fixit-law-goes-to-the-public

    What in this report even suggests a public consultation? The truncated select commitee hearing ? The fawning attitude of the contemporary MSM borders on pathological idolatry. This report plainly and directly states the National Government knows nothing about, or wants to be aware of, democracy.

    March in Wellington on Saturday
    http://stopthebillnow.blogspot.com/
20. thejackal 20

    26 September 2011 at 6:15 pm

    Well Wikipedia has deleted my article on RWNJ’s. So I though I would simply post it on the Jackal:

    RWNJ is internet slang for ”Right Wing Nut Job”. The abbreviated term first became popularized and prominent on the Internet in 2010, mainly used by commentators on blogsites as a descriptive insult. A RWNJ is considered to be a neocon conservative who proselytizes about his political beliefs, trying to convert others to their flawed way of thinking…
21. logie97 21

    26 September 2011 at 9:30 pm

    Anyone notice the Welsh playing strip tonight.
    Black (with red flashing).
    Interesting that there have not been many column inches decrying this preposterous act.
    (Perhaps having a Kiwi as coach mitigates that.)

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