Written By:
- Date published:
6:00 am, July 31st, 2023 - 43 comments
Categories: open mike -
Tags:
Open mike is your post.
For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.
The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).
Step up to the mike …
Nice obituary.
[TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]
Congratulations, you are now on my moderation radar.
Read.
Anyone know when the next polls are out?
Roy Morgan usually at the start of the month, so maybe late this week? I haven’t seen a TV3 one for a while. With everything that is going on politically, will be interesting to see if any clear trends are emerging.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2023_New_Zealand_general_election
It began in 2018
A National policy in 2020.
National and NZF are now proposing an alternative to the Brynderwyn hills route north, as it is flood prone.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/two-possible-bypass-routes-investigated-for-sh1-at-brynderwyn-hills-closed-for-weeks-after-summer-floods/Q2VAJUBJDRGN3C2VJGA3UULVOE/
I get it, costs and funding systems and all that. And Northerners won’t mind a toll tunnel at Brynderwyn they’ll be so happy to have it.Like the Puhoi tunnel.
But in Auckland, the Waterview tunnel? There’s no way Aucklanders would wear a toll.
And just like that you get to see why some Northlanders think they’re still being treated like dumb shits. The best part of 100 years of being playthings in games of politics. Simeon Brown or whoever the latest little message boy is can join the legion of Nation Party scumbags whose only real interest in Northland is getting a tick on a voting form.
I've been up north (Auckland to Mangonui) thrice in the last month. There is absolutely no need for any additional massive road building now the holiday highway has been opened. Incremental improvements are needed in Dome valley, and the Brynderwyns are a mess so it may be worth considering bypassing them to the east should climate events make that road no longer feasible.
If this proposal was for a high speed passenger (and freight) electrified rail corridor linking Whangarei-Auckland-Hamilton-Tauranga combined with a push to create a high productivity corridor alongside the rail then I'd be all in favour of it.
This !
NZ First wants to build a railway to Marsden Point from the Northern Main Trunk Line.
And also a dry-dock in Northport and move Ports of Auckland, while also moving the RNZ Navy to Northport from Devonport.
High speed rail to Northland makes very little sense as it is only a short distance and once there one would need to rent a car to get to the myriad townships and beaches that rail or daily public transport will never ever get to. The other consideration is that within the next decade almost all transport will be electric and any presumed fossil fuel saving benefits will no longer apply. France has a very good TGV and other rail systems but you see very few buses.
I've always thought drive on , drive off rail flat cars would be an idea that could save congestion, lives and emissions on highways and provide a relaxing, comfortable journey without the need for hire cars.
There are those types of wagons for cars on the Ghan and Indian Pacific trains, great for long distance travel without the hassle of driving. No reason why they shouldn't work over this side of the ditch.
You should go to cities then, the whole of the Cote d'azur Alpes Maritimes is connected with buses where you have no trains – mountainous areas for example. Cheap, effective, several times a day and evenings buses that go long distance.
Lived in France for over a decade, never owned a car, always lived rural.
And fwiw, look up the feat of building a tram in Nice, something that was done in short time, and the ticket was initially at a 1 euro and is now something 1.5 euros. By a conservative deputee no less. Not a single greeny came help.
NZ does not have public transport because neither the left nor the right actually wants to invest in that. The one wants to build roads, the other want to complain about building road. And here we are, no tram anywhere in Auckland – just been there today, nary a bus to see, the trains seem all being worked on, and well it was quite depressing actually.
And hiring cars costs money, it is actually cheaper to have a non warrented non rego'ed car that one brings out when they need to go to town and cop the fine, specially when poor. If you even have a rental company anywhere near you to get too to pick up your car. Mind, a poor person could always walk there after all they have time to waste, right?
But yeah, just another region of NZ that don't need roads, nor trains, just rent a car, the same car that the left believes the poor won't be driving soon and that will be banned cause fossil fuels.
As for electric cars not being 'fossil fuel' dependent, what do you think electricity is? Where does that magic juice comes from? How do you recycle the batteries? What about the fossilfuel spend to create the car and the batteries and the shipping to our far flung corners? Oh yeah, thats cool and good pollution cause some rich guy can afford a car that makes him feel so green.
Fuck that is just so tedious.
Totally agree. The Nice tram went in so fast!
And after living in Vienna (Euro365/year for bus/train/tram within the city limits) & and travelling around Europe car-free for eight years and bugger-all money, and trying to do the same in Wellington (now we're home) – NZ is ruined, it's a transport nightmare. Absolutely pathetic, it's like people cannot see an alternative. We've seen NZers on Danube cruises and city-to-city trains who rave about the experience and then 'oh no, we can't do that in NZ, it's not our way.'
City-to-city by train $60 there and hundreds of dollars here, Wellington to Auckland by rail is twice the price of flying.
But of course, I'm elitest.
(otoh public transport is only for poor people) I give up.
"…within the next decade almost all transport will be electric…"
yeah….nah.
This time it's a 4 lane motorway (second tunnel under Mount Victoria – yeah toll free) to the airport and eastern suburbs (instead of a light rail system within Wellington and via a tunnel to the east, something users would pay for).
National's obsession with roads frankly goes beyond just a blinkered and antedeluvian world view and veers hard towards outright cronyism and culture war nihilism.
Absolutely summed. Its a core belief obsession.
They are still largely unchallenged in MSM over allowing heavier trucks on the roads – causing cracking and then the later potholes with the rain (and they did this while reducing funding for road maintenance).
And the poseurs then this year announce a pothole fund policy to deal with the mess they caused, as if they have the answers.
How many of those new bridges national promised to build in northland…
.. actually got built..?
This motorway chimera might snag the biggest pile of electioneering bullshit award…
..(from/for the party (formerly) known as the tax cuts party..)
CNN reports on bilingual road signage, featuring this country along with Wales & Hawaii: https://edition.cnn.com/2023/07/29/asia/new-zealand-bilingual-road-signs-debate-intl-hnk-dst/index.html
So the historical trend into monoculture was a result of imperialism.
Whereas the trend towards inclusion is good politics, there's a problem with impact on driver cognition that has design implications:
You may need to pull over & stop to read the sign for this place…
Alternatives to the msm are helpful. This one seems to have emerged from an aussie university: https://360info.org/about-us/
It provides this review of China's BRI: The future of the Belt and Road Initiative is uncertain, but regional cooperation could secure its future.
China would need to proffer a Taiwan within China deal, reassure ASEAN as to the SCS atolls being claimed as islands, and assist with a Korean Peninsular peace (guarantee South Korean security and thus allowing US forces to leave) to gain Japanese and Korean confidence.
Then there is this. Italy wondering about how to withdraw.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66354362
That 360 is a useful link/resource..
Labour is proposing a change to its rent to buy scheme.
About time.
Rising wages since 2020.
This is hardly surprising given the increasing cost of new builds since 2020.
Now, if only they would do an adjustment to Kiwibuild and allow those owning flats and apartments to buy (those seeking better quality or a small family home) or those empty nesters downsizing (to encourage this path to quality new builds). This would help provide impetus to the wider construction market.
The new hiway
Simple calc cost is 17 b not 6b
Distance 380
Based on the Tranmission gulley
27k, 1.2 b cost
How or when will this car dependency end? Seemingly never. Well, not while morons are still planning to build 4 lane "highways".
We must get Rail back on track !
I don't know about trying to restore regional rail. it's been run down for almost fifty years now. My view is we should start with a clean sheet of paper, build a standard gauge high speed electric rail network in the above mentioned Whangarei to Tauranga route, and then expand that South over 20-40 years. Then, a spur to Rotorua. Then to Taupo and from Wellington to Palmerston North. Then complete the link between Palmerston and Taupo. Then maybe an East Coast link, Palmerston North-Napier-Gisborne-Whakatane-Rotorua.
In the South Island, the maintrunk from a new ferry port at Clifford Bay to Christchurch. Forget about the rest of the old narrow gauge network.
No argument with Rail North. But meanwhile, heavy truck/trailers are rooting South Island roads.
Clifford Bay to ChCh could be a start…but we who are actually in the South need much more Rail service and use to put a stop to that.
Heres an Opinion piece from Duncan Connors.
While stating the case strongly for Dunedin..and our South Island IMO he has many valid points.
Duncan Connors, no mere enthusiast…he is also Senior Lecturer at University of Otago Business School
The small populations and lack of economic dynamism makes modern rail hard to justify south of Hamilton except on the hope of induced demand and I can't imagine you'd ever come up with a good case to spend the money required ofor upgrade rail in Otago/Southland.
Far better accept the dynamic “virtuous circle” of growth in NZ will occur north of Taupo, and aim to create a zone with good, high-skilled jobs, a large, skilled population, and good communications that will attract more private investment and new, high-skilled jobs. Leave Otago and Southland to the penguins, fur seals and Royal Albatrosses.
Did you even read Duncans article? Ok. Leave it at that…
National's default policy position: build more roads.
That's all you get from National.
Shameless populist vote buying, so their mates can drive their Ford Rangers at 130 km/hr between Whangarei and Auckland along ludicrously expensive King's highways.
Who will pay for that?
The poor, the homeless, the hungry and the sick.
National's pandering to the Kiwi car culture for votes at the expense of the general welfare of the country is the product of calculated minds who don't give a f.. about anything but the buzz of power.
They should be ashamed of themselves, but being National they will think they are the best thing since sliced bread.
Yet another week starts with National releasing policy and Labour again talking about themselves – today their party list.
[TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]
About a month ago Jack was on here claiming that National had released their tax policy. When I pointed out that was incorrect, and (politely) asked for a link to this policy, Jack resorted to abuse.
That doesn't bother me, but deliberate misinformation does. Where is National's tax policy, Jack?
Public health controversy continues to swirl around my local dioxin site: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/494823/ministry-of-health-cuts-access-to-flawed-data-in-paritutu-serum-dioxin-study
You'll see a nice aerial view of the Ivon Watkins-Dow plant in 2001. Demolition was completed earlier this year and all those buildings within that large green-belt quadrangle are now gone. Just below the bottom of the picture is the Tasman coastline. I live in that fringe suburb above the top right corner, less than 300m from the boundary, but I'm not paranoid about any contamination.
After months wondering why developers haven't moved in to start subdivision of what could become a highly-prized market opportunity, I've gleaned that the NPDC isn't satisfied with the owner's decontamination process, so the thing has stalled.
Meanwhile this report suggests things are even murkier for locals closely affected.
Can't do basic science if you fudge the data. Gross negligence? Anyone ought to be able to grasp that the period of exposure is proportional to the effects, right? Should public health officials be deemed to thick to grasp that principle? No. How come they don't just get it right? Pandemic, obviously. The universal feeble excuse.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300939162/live-the-day-in-politics-monday-july-31
Labour List is currently being released but a standalone link not available yet. To quote the top 60 from that link:
Here's a link
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/watch-live-labour-to-reveal-party-list-ahead-of-general-election/S4L45UXQFNDDFOI3JBFEEPTVP4/
What have the twenty extra MPs been doing for 3 years? Has there been any benefit to having this huge caucus?
I would expect that they were representing constituents, voting in Parliament, sitting on Parliamentary committees, dealing with constituent problems and local issues.
If they were National MPs they'd be finding potholes, mingling with anti-mandate protesters, putting up protest hoardings, putting out press releases and newsletters full of words like "shambles", "crisis" and "woke".
People often complain there are too many MPs, but under our system there is no other talent pool for Cabinet. We can't create peers (UK) or appoint Senators (Australia) or other officials (USA). New Zealand is unusual in that regard.
The first MMP government (National – NZ First) was an object lesson in what can go wrong if jobs outnumber available talent.
That’s it?
Trainer wheels cabinet ministers who we haven’t seen, have no profile and who are going to lose their seats anyway?
Could at least have been some guest posts for the Standard expressing their political philosophy or political goals if those are allowed in the Labour Party these days…
@Mac yep all NaCT backbench stuff. What’s the Labour alternative? It seems like a lot of wasted opportunity at the moment.
According to RNZ's Midday Sports News [@ 0:59 min], "New Zealand crushed Singapore"!
Crushed! Humiliated! Destroyed! – it's all good (entertainment), if a little juvenile.
The Labour alternative is to understand that potholes not on SH1 are the responsibility of the local authority, not the government; that anti-mandate protesters who deny the power of the police, the courts and reason are dangerously deluded; that protest hoardings that call for the banning of something that does not exist are in similar intellectual territory; that words used wrongly and overused lose their meaning; and finally that 'woke' is a term of praise.