web analytics

Polity: The big lie

Written By: - Date published: 8:05 am, September 5th, 2014 - 44 comments
Categories: labour - Tags: , ,

Reposted from Polity.

With the polls bouncing around all over the map, methinks some folk have been a little quick to bury the left’s corpse. And the interesting thing is the way they have done it, with a disappointed shake of the head and a “if only Labour had concentrated on policy, rather than using all their energy on Dirty Politics.” That is the Big Lie.

The truth is opposition parties have rolled out massively more policy than the government for this election. And the policy that opposition parties have released has been better developed and costed as well. How do you think National is able to release massive (doctored) lists of what opposition party policies might cost? Hard to do that if the opposition has no policy, right?

On the flip side, we have a government that still can’t tell New Zealanders whether the tax system will change, and if it can by how much. That is their flagship policy for an election in 15 days, and still nobody knows what the policy is. How’s that for not concentrating on policy?

Here’s a parlour game. Name the top five new policies of the two major parties. Start with Labour. Go!

  • 100,000 new homes – KiwiBuild
  • Lower class sizes
  • $60 a week for parents of new babies – Best Start
  • Hundreds of dollars a year off your power bill – NZ Power
  • Cheaper doctor’s visits for kids and the elderly
  • Ban on foreign speculators in the housing market
  • Minimum wage up $2
  • Laptops for kids… Oh, sorry, you only wanted five.

And now National. Go!

  • Potentially tax cuts. Or not. Size uncertain
  • Cheaper doctor’s visits for kids
  • Subsidies for first home buyers to keep bidding up home prices
  • Um, axing the nail tax
  • Give me a second. Hang on, I’ll get one… Dammit.

The Big Lie here is that the left doesn’t have any ideas. The left is brimming with ideas, all paid for and popular.

44 comments on “Polity: The big lie ”

  1. infused 1

    Dumb, or just stupid. I don’t know, probably both.

    https://www.national.org.nz/plan/plan

    • AmaKiwi 1.1

      The polls are the Big Lie.

      Pollsters do NOT poll cell phones. I have confirmed this personally with one of Auckland’s leading polling firms.

      1. It is too expensive to poll cell phones.
      2. Their clients (news media) don’t care because the purpose of the polls is to generate news stories, not to be accurate.
      3. Most of their clients don’t want a poll that says the Left will win. Please the client.

      People who have landlines own their own home. Are they more likely to vote National or Left?
      Are people who only have a cell phone more likely to vote for Internet Mana or NZ First? Labour/Green or Nats?

      The polls are the big right wing lie. Polls are intentionally inaccurate because that discourages Left voters.

    • Draco T Bastard 1.2

      Off the top of your head.

      The fact is that the majority of people would be able to identify 5+ of Labour’s/left policies while very few would be able to name five of National’s because National hasn’t been talking policies.

  2. Tracey 2

    The things is that cross analysis of polls and polling companies is achievable. If they want to be lazy they can just go to Swordfish website.

    Now an interesting story would be to publish their findings… showing that the polls are largely, consistently wrong about the figures in the final outcome.

    Too much work?

    • AmaKiwi 2.1

      Too much expense for no gain.

      My source, who owns are large polling firm, says it is hugely expensive to try to poll cell phone users.

      How happy would the client (Granny Herald, etc.) be if a poll including cell phone users showed Internet Mana is well above the 5% threshold. They’d shoot the messenger.

  3. disturbed 3

    “if only Labour had concentrated on policy, rather than using all their energy on Dirty Politics.” That is the Big Lie.

    There was never a time when NatZ would discuss or consider working with the opposition and this can easily be demonstrated by watching the constant shouting down of opposition during any debate during parliament.

    NatZ have shown a new raw caustic new policy of working exclusively alone now.

    They cannot expect any opposition to even attempt to work now with NatZ who are shown to be diametrically opposed to anything the opposition say.

    Let alone consider it as a working possibility, because National set the tone for no co-operation.

    TV3 this morning Jamie Lee Ross was shouting down Jacinda Adern during what?

    Yes a debate about policy and Jacinda was unable to get her point across.

    Where did we see this emerge?
    Yes it was during one of the first debates on policy with Steven Joyce (NatZ campaign manager) and David Parker, remember that awful bully shouting match?

    So why are NatZs falsely saying left have sadly used their energy on dirty politics?

    Who has set the tone for discussion on policy?

  4. Lanthanide 4

    Cheaper doctor’s visits and axing the nail tax are from National’s last budget, not election policy.

    The election policy that I know they’ve announced is:
    * Building some roads in favoured electorates
    * Rolling out UFB to 5% more of the population
    * Paying a select group of teachers and principles extra money to preside over ‘area schools’, even though teachers and principles don’t want it

    That’s pretty much it, actually.

    Also there’s the “red-tape” drive Paula Bennett is doing, getting submissions from the public about which laws are stifling people. It’s a nice little PR campaign but ultimately I don’t expect much to come from it.

    • Tracey 4.1

      I think they are relying on the May budget as their “policy” but don’t have to include it in their spending promises.

  5. go west 5

    Labour only have themselves to blame. They’ve been letting Hager do the talking and are now paying the price. Turns out the electorate isn’t as ignorant as they were hoping.

    • lprent 5.1

      Hah… A political idiot neophyte.

      Dirty Politics has disrupted planned Labours campaign just as much as it did for National. Probably more. They had a pile of policy carefully scripted and planned for release and now no-one is really spending much time looking at it in the wake of the book.

      The Labour campaign team have been scrabbling for the last 3 weeks, I get some of that from the back channels. A pretty good test for how versatile they are. However it is apparent that they have been more flexible than National with their pathetic denial routines.

      It seems to me that National were rather stupid to head into simple denial, committing their party machine (their doorknockers!) and prime candidate to it, and then bullheadedly sticking to it. It is quite clear that voters don’t believe them.

      • Wayne 5.1.1

        And this site confirms the Left’s obsession with DP. Five of the first eight items relate to DP.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 5.1.1.1

          Go and stand in the garden while I get the hose, Dr. Mapp: you’re covered in it.

        • karol 5.1.1.2

          It was big news yesterday.

          Dirty Politics reveals goings on that are very significant in NZ’s political history. Your comment is just another right wing attempt to downplay it.

        • tricledrown 5.1.1.3

          Wayne rights obsession to deny and blame the left.
          You must be disgusted by the high jacking of your party by extremist mentally unstable professional and corrupt officials !
          Not the National party you grew up with!
          Key would be even more popular if he hadn’t engaged in this lowlife behaviour!

      • Quinnjin 5.1.2

        +1 lprent, “Go West” seems to think if he keeps saying it makes it true, just like The nats and their party shills in much of the MSM. Just another ignorant, wilfully deluded propaganda victim too stupid to see through the BS, or just too corrupt to admit it.

    • AmaKiwi 5.2

      Dirty Politics is all the buzz amongst younger voters.

      It confirms what they have long thought: the Nats are crooked.

      These younger voters are NOT being polled because they only have cell phones. I think Internet Mana has energized (and enrolled) them to vote this time.

      • weka 5.2.1

        And do the polls count the people who say fuck off I don’t want to answer your questions? Or people who aren’t very available by phone.

        The risk here is that too many people will see the polls and not bother voting because they think it’s all over. Or like last time the MSM will tell people that National are going to win.

        • Draco T Bastard 5.2.1.1

          And do the polls count the people who say fuck off I don’t want to answer your questions?

          Theoretically the demographic weighting that the polling companies do should still capture those people.

          Or like last time the MSM will tell people that National are going to win.

          The MSM have a bad habit of doing that. I don’t think it’s going to work this time though as, IMO, there’s a lot of anger at National out there.

          • weka 5.2.1.1.1

            “Theoretically the demographic weighting that the polling companies do should still capture those people.”

            How so?

              • weka

                Are you saying they can weight for the section of the population that says piss off? eg x% of pissed offs vote fo A etc. Wouldn’t people be saying piss off for different reasons though?

                • Draco T Bastard

                  Are you saying they can weight for the section of the population that says piss off?

                  To within a reasonable degree of accuracy, yes, because not everyone that fits within the defined categories tells the pollsters to piss off.

                  Wouldn’t people be saying piss off for different reasons though?

                  Yes but they’re not asking for why people tell the pollsters to piss off.

    • Tracey 5.3

      Thanks for proving the point of the post

  6. Blue 6

    Exactly. National have hardly any policy, and no big flagship policies. Their entire campaign is based on ‘don’t rock the boat’. There’s no vision presented at all.

    But here’s the problem: if they win the election, then they have three more years in power. And the pathetic scraps of policy they have offered so far will not keep them busy for long. So what are they going to do for the next three years? Sit around and twiddle their thumbs during what would certainly be their last term in Government?

    The fact that they have presented such a lackluster campaign does not bode well for New Zealand. Are we really that stupid that we will vote for a party that won’t tell us what they will do? Apparently we are, and that’s more than a little bit depressing.

    I think we’re going to wake up to some Abbott-style ‘surprises’ shortly after September 20 if the Nats win. And once they know we can’t get rid of them for the next three years they are going to go hell for leather on the hard right stuff they have been saving up for six years.

    • Draco T Bastard 6.1

      I think we’re going to wake up to some Abbott-style ‘surprises’ shortly after September 20 if the Nats win. And once they know we can’t get rid of them for the next three years they are going to go hell for leather on the hard right stuff they have been saving up for six years.

      And really fuck over the country.

    • Brendon Harre 6.2

      I suspect you are right. The usual groups will get a good kicking…..

  7. ianmac 7

    @Blue,” And once they know we can’t get rid of them for the next three years they are going to go hell for leather on the hard right stuff they have been saving up for six years.”
    Yes. The far Right supporters have complained that the Key Government has been too soft so far. They did not want to scare the bulk of the Voters. But should they win then all hell will be unleashed.

  8. Peter 8

    Unfair as it may sound the NATS control the sound bites ……. and that is what matters

    • AmaKiwi 8.1

      I disagree. The Nats are in disarray. They have campaign money to burn but can’t reply to the torrent of dirty tricks news stories.

      What good are 10,000 posters of John Key saying, “I am not a liar.”

  9. dv 9

    And here is another way of looking at the NATS housing deal

    On a 500k mortgage

    For an input of 20k, the BANKS collect $32,500 in interest in the first year
    AND
    $1.5 million

    over 20 years!!!!!!

    • Brendon Harre 9.1

      The power elites keep winning from a government not willing to reform away unearned income.

    • Wayne 9.2

      Except you can buy new houses in Auckland for $450,000. It is not necessary to spend $550,000. And as more Special Housing Areas get developed you will see more houses around the $450,000 mark.

      • tricledrown 9.2.1

        Geeze Wayne so what about Don Brash’s productivity commission was disbande because of inconvenient truths !
        Like the cost of housing particularly in Auckland was damaging NewZealand’s long-term productivity!
        The cost of servicing a mortgage of$300,000 @ $500 per week them maintenance rates and insurance makes house ownership out of reach for most NewZealanders!
        Wayne your full of crap a fair-weather friend of a corrupt govt sneaking back on site when National are up on the polls!

        • Colonial Viper 9.2.1.1

          Wayne is talking about housing affordability for those on the average household income of about $85,000 p.a.

          Of course for anyone living on the median wage of $44,000 p.a. a $500/week mortgage (even a $400/week mortgage) is pretty impossible.

  10. If anything this campaign tells us again that campaigns are not really able to change the outcome of elections. Hager’s book has certainly changed our political discourse, but the fundamental picture of a wildly popular party versus an opposition in seemingly inexonerable decline hasn’t changed in months.

    In this sense Labour launching policy early was good as it at least let them dominate policy discussions. Though obviously the problems for Labour extend far deeper than this campaign and it is foolish to expect a good campaign or policy discussion to change their systemic lack of appeal.

    I think this campaign will result in a new record defeat for Labour, so far all of the polling seems to reinforce this and they are trending down.

    A number of current Labour MPs will not be reelected. Say goodbye to Raymond Huo, Kelvin Davis, Maryan Street, Moana Mackey and Carol Beaumont. Andrew Little is on the cusp of not returning and will really be a 50/50 call if polls continue to drop. Certainly we can be certain that no new MPs will be elected from Labour’s list.

    The only fresh faces entering parliament this election are from the Maori Electorates – and sadly for Labour MPs from these electorate have traditionally been very marginalised within the power structure of the party and are unlikely to be allowed to contribute much.

    The Labour Party is moribund, and seemingly only focused on protecting an ever decreasing number of incumbent MPs.

    • Draco T Bastard 10.1

      Wow, what long spiel of delusion.

      It’s National that are in decline and are moribund. Labour’s not as lively as it used to be but that doesn’t matter as there’s a lot more talent on the Left.

      • Wayne 10.1.1

        Draco,

        Have a look at the CV’s of National’s likely new intake. Some impressively well qualified people in there.

        Don’t see too many new Labour MP’s, even up to the 30% mark.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 10.1.1.1

          Will they go along with the filth oozing from the Prime Minister’s office, or do they have spines, Dr. Mapp?

        • Draco T Bastard 10.1.1.2

          I’ve never really given a fuck about qualifications. I do care about ethics and rational planning based upon the facts. Neither of which are available from National.

          Also, I said the Left and not Labour.

  11. Plan B 11

    The Regan era Republican idea was that people do not actually listen to what is being said, they just look at the pictures- so more pictures of John Key on the news is good for National rather than what is actually being said.
    The selfie idea is part of that, say nothing, just do the same thing again and again – selfies and say nothing

  12. Sans Cle 12

    Jane Patterson had good insight into what is happening on the campaign trail.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/20148496/insights-from-the-campaign-trail

    • Brendon Harre 12.1

      I just listened to the radionz report and found it a considered and intelligent debate. This is the hard thing to convey but Whaleoil or Kiwiblog bloggers would never refer someone to ‘neutral’ ‘considered’ source of information.

      I hope TheStandard does not drop down to there level. Long term people will demand a higher standard of debate about what is important to them and the society they live in.

Links to post

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • NZ announces a third P-3 deployment in support of UN sanctions
    The Government has deployed a Royal New Zealand Air Force P-3K2 Orion (P-3) maritime patrol aircraft to support the implementation of United Nations Security Council (UNSC) resolutions imposing sanctions against North Korea, announced Minister of Foreign Affairs Winston Peters and Minister of Defence Ron Mark. “New Zealand has long supported ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Pacific trade and development agreement a reality
    Pacific regional trade and development agreement PACER Plus will enter into force in 60 days now that the required eight countries have ratified it. Trade and Export Growth Minister David Parker welcomed the announcement that the Cook Islands is the eighth nation to ratify this landmark agreement. “The agreement represents ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Securing a pipeline of teachers
    The Government is changing its approach to teacher recruitment as COVID-19 travel restrictions continue, by boosting a range of initiatives to get more Kiwis into teaching. “When we came into Government, we were faced with a teacher supply crisis,” Education Minister Chris Hipkins said. “Over the past three years, we ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Border exceptions for a small number of international students with visas
    The Government has established a new category that will allow 250 international PhD and postgraduate students to enter New Zealand and continue their studies, in the latest set of border exceptions. “The health, safety and wellbeing of people in New Zealand remains the Government’s top priority. Tight border restrictions remain ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • First COVID-19 vaccine purchase agreement signed
    The Government has signed an agreement to purchase 1.5 million COVID-19 vaccines – enough for 750,000 people – from Pfizer and BioNTech, subject to the vaccine successfully completing all clinical trials and passing regulatory approvals in New Zealand, say Research, Science and Innovation Minister Megan Woods and Health Minister Chris Hipkins. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • International statement – End-to-end encryption and public safety
    We, the undersigned, support strong encryption, which plays a crucial role in protecting personal data, privacy, intellectual property, trade secrets and cyber security.  It also serves a vital purpose in repressive states to protect journalists, human rights defenders and other vulnerable people, as stated in the 2017 resolution of the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Ministry of Defence Biodefence Assessment released
    The Ministry of Defence has today released a Defence Assessment examining Defence’s role across the spectrum of biological hazards and threats facing New Zealand. Biodefence: Preparing for a New Era of Biological Hazards and Threats looks at how the NZDF supports other agencies’ biodefence activities, and considers the context of ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • New Approaches to Economic Challenges: Confronting Planetary Emergencies: OECD 9 October 2020
    New Approaches to Economic Challenges: Confronting Planetary Emergencies: OECD 9 October 2020 Hon David Parker’s response following Thomas Piketty and Esther Duflo. Good morning, good afternoon, and good evening, wherever in the world you might be. I first acknowledge the excellent thought provoking speeches of Thomas Piketty and Esther ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Kaipara Moana restoration takes next step
    A Memorandum of Understanding has been signed today at Waihāua Marae between the Crown, local iwi and councils to protect, restore and enhance the mauri of Kaipara Moana in Northland. Environment Minister David Parker signed the document on behalf of the Crown along with representatives from Ngā Maunga Whakahī, Ngāti ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • New Zealand and Uruguay unite on reducing livestock production emissions
    Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor and Uruguayan Minister of Livestock, Agriculture and Fisheries Carlos María Uriarte have welcomed the launch of a three-year project that will underpin sustainable livestock production in Uruguay, Argentina, and Costa Rica.  The project called ‘Innovation for pasture management’ is led by Uruguay’s National Institute of Agricultural ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • 3100 jobs created through marae upgrades
    Hundreds of marae throughout the country will be upgraded through investments from the Provincial Growth Fund’s refocused post COVID-19 funding to create jobs and put money into the pockets of local tradespeople and businesses, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones and Māori Development Minister Nanaia Mahuta have announced. “A total ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Health volunteers recognised in annual awards
    Health Minister Chris Hipkins has announced 9 teams and 14 individuals are the recipients of this year’s Minister of Health Volunteer Awards.  “The health volunteer awards celebrate and recognise the thousands of dedicated health sector volunteers who give many hours of their time to help other New Zealanders,” Mr Hipkins ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Community COVID-19 Fund supports Pacific recovery
    The Minister for Pacific Peoples, Aupito William Sio says a total of 264 groups and individuals have successfully applied for the Pacific Aotearoa Community COVID-19 Recovery Fund, that will support Pacific communities drive their own COVID-19 recovery strategies, initiatives, and actions. “I am keen to see this Fund support Pacific ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Community benefits from Māori apprenticeships
    Up to 50 Māori apprentices in Wellington will receive paid training to build houses for their local communities, thanks to a $2.75 million investment from the Māori Trades and Training Fund, announced Employment Minister Willie Jackson today. “This funding will enable Ngāti Toa Rangatira Incorporated to provide its Ngā Kaimahi ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Training fund supports Māori jobseekers
    Rapidly growing sectors will benefit from a $990,000 Māori Trades and Training Fund investment which will see Wellington jobseekers supported into work, announced Employment Minister Willie Jackson today. “This funding will enable Sapphire Consultants Ltd. to help up to 45 Māori jobseekers into paid training initiatives over two years through ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Ruakura Inland Port development vital infrastructure for Waikato
    The Government is investing $40 million to develop an inland port at Ruakura which will become a freight super-hub and a future business, research and residential development for the Waikato, Urban Development and Transport Minister Phil Twyford, and Māori Development Minister Nanaia Mahuta announced today. The funding has been has ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Appointments made to Defence Expert Review Group
    Defence Minister Ron Mark announced today the establishment of an Expert Review Group to review a number of aspects of the New Zealand Defence Force’s (NZDF) structure, information management and record-keeping processes.  The Expert Review Group’s work arises out of the first recommendation from the Report of the Government’s Inquiry ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • No active community cases of COVID-19
    There are no active community cases of COVID-19 remaining in the country after the last people from the recent outbreak have recovered from the virus, Health Minister Chris Hipkins said today. “This is a big milestone. New Zealanders have once again through their collective actions squashed the virus. The systems ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Clean energy upgrade for more public buildings
    More public buildings will be supported by the Government to upgrade to run on clean energy, the Minister for Climate Change James Shaw announced today. Minister Shaw announced that Lincoln and Auckland universities will receive support through the Clean-Powered Public Service Fund to replace fossil fuel boilers. Southern, Taranaki, and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 weeks ago
  • Schools back donations scheme for the second year
    More schools have opted in to the donations scheme for 2021, compared to 2020 when the scheme was introduced. “The families of more than 447,000 students will be better off next year, with 94% of eligible schools and kura opting into the scheme,” Education Minister Chris Hipkins said. “This is ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago
  • Ruapehu cycle trails gets PGF boost
    The spectacular Mountains to Sea cycle trail in Ruapehu District will receive $4.6 million in funding from the Provincial Growth Fund for two additional trails, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. “This is an exciting development for the local community, and one that will provide significant economic opportunities ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 weeks ago