Slater’s bid- fail!

Written By: - Date published: 5:40 pm, September 5th, 2014 - 121 comments
Categories: blogs, brand key, election 2014, internet, news, tv - Tags:

[updated] Slater has failed in his bid to gag the media. There is an interim injunction against Rawshark from publishing any further hacked material.  He had already signed of Twitter before today’s court proceedings, and said all the remaining dumps are with the media.

The High Court decision is that the media can write about material already in the public domain, or already in their possession.

Hager and his book Dirty Politics

3 News reports:

Whale Oil blogger Cameron Slater has had a partial victory in getting an interim injunction stopping further publication of private emails and communications stolen by a hacker.

A hearing in the Auckland High Court was held today before Justice John Fogarty, with Slater taking Mediaworks TV, The New Zealand Herald, Fairfax and “unknown defendants” referring to the person using the Twitter account @whaledump and the subsequent @whaledump2 account over his hacked emails and online communications.

In making his judgement, Justice Fogarty made the interim injunction against only the “unknown defendants”, saying he was reluctant to extend the order to the three media organisations.

Yahoo’s report says:

A High Court judge has served an interim injunction against media publishing Cameron Slater’s hacked emails.

[…]

The injunction rules that stories can be published based on information the media outlets already have, but new stories would be in breach.

From NRT:

According to the Herald‘s Tim Murphy on Twitter:

Court result: Whaledump injuncted on an interim basis while three media cos not. Effect of that: material already in hand by media usable.

TV3 News is right now calling Slater’s bid a fail.

Rawshark had already said his goodbyes before the court proceedings started today.

 

 

 

121 comments on “Slater’s bid- fail! ”

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  1. lprent 1
    5 September 2014 at 5:54 pm

    I’m unclear from this as to whether the media organisations can report on emails previously not reported on by them.

    Yes according to RNZ on the way home, they can on anything they had at the time that the injunction was granted. The injunction is only against whaledump/rawshark.

    BTW: Put this post up to the top…

    • karol 1.1
      5 September 2014 at 5:55 pm

      Yes. But some news outlets are reporting that they can’t publish any new material,,
      ZB:

      The judge has granted a temporary injunction on the media publishing any new information on the contents of the Whale Oil blogger’s private emails.

      • wtl 1.1.1
        5 September 2014 at 6:01 pm

        That ZB report is wrong. The Yahoo report you linked to has been clarified to say:

        But the judge was reluctant to grant an injunction against the media companies, instead opting to halt any new stories being published based on any new leaks of information by the hacker.

        Anything already leaked can be published (if its in the public interest) – so if rawshark/whaledump did indeed send all the remaining information to the media earlier today/yesterday, the injunction will have no effect on any new stories.

    • Tracey 1.2
      5 September 2014 at 6:00 pm

      stuff is reporting

      “Any information the media organisations had already received could be published, the judge said.

      The order did not apply to information already in the public domain or information already received by the media organisations…. “

    • mickysavage 2.1
      5 September 2014 at 8:21 pm

      Yep it seems clear that Whaledump handed everything over before exiting twitter.

      Talk about giving double …

  3. Pete 3
    5 September 2014 at 5:59 pm

    So Whaledump’s signoff was extremely well-timed. I wonder if he gave the same material to all the media organisations, or divvied up different scoops between them.

    • Rich 3.1
      5 September 2014 at 6:06 pm

      Unless the media decide it is not in their interests to publish. And as their interests seem to be closely aligned with the Governments I would be cautious about what this means. Yes Rawshark has provided them with possibly explosive material but it seems that Rawshark has been muzzled himself (as it seems he is a he). So now we have to rely on the mainstream to put what is still not in the light of day out there. I’m not confident.

      • yeshe 3.1.1
        5 September 2014 at 6:12 pm

        Rich .. if you read the TV3 link for statements by Paul Davison QC you might be happier … I am.

        I reason it’s why Rawshark divided the dumps up between competitors — will keep them all honest and producing what they have against each other. I sure hope so, anyway.

        edit: Interesting to note tho that Stuff and Herald and TV3 all headline with Slater’s success in gagging Whaledump — who self-gagged this morning anyway. Their own success in not being gagged is way down the stories.

        Oh dear, I hope it’s not an indicator of what they intend.

  4. yeshe 4
    5 September 2014 at 6:02 pm

    TV3 ..The injunction does not cover information already in the public domain or the contents of Dirty Politics.

    Read more: http://www.3news.co.nz/politics/slater-gets-temporary-injunction-against-hacker-2014090517#ixzz3CPzbp0id

    not sure if it adds anything …

    Now TVNZ News just saying media are free to publish what they have.

  5. Ad 5
    5 September 2014 at 6:04 pm

    My struggle with this is that the sole electoral effect of the revelations of RawShark and Nicki Hagar is to simply splinter the left vote. Unwittingly they have made a progressive change of government much less likely.

    The whole effort was launched far too late to have effect beyond those with a degree of public sector engagement. Great for mobilising the progressives a little more, (though i doubt very much government will be cleaner as a result) but otherwise it’s been quite corrosive for the left’s efforts.

    • Anne 5.1
      5 September 2014 at 6:23 pm

      The whole effort was launched far too late to have effect beyond those with a degree of public sector engagement.

      My sentiments too Ad. It’s well known by those with knowledge and experience in politics that it takes up to two months at the least before the public assimilates issues of this nature.

      After the election is over and the truth starts to impact on them they will be saying… if I’d known that I would never have voted National. This, despite the fact that the truth is under their noses but many are too stupid to see it.

      • Anne 5.1.1
        5 September 2014 at 6:37 pm

        Oh, and for a bit of light relief:

        TV3 went to Slater’s home for a response to the verdict but were unable to report it because it was quote unprintable and unbroadcastable unquote.

    • Once Was Tim 5.2
      5 September 2014 at 6:26 pm

      mmmmm …. maybe @ Ad. Some of the MSM I think might start to get a bit worried closer to the day as well.
      Of course Whaledump also tweeted “Don’t make me come out of retirement” – which of course he can morally justify using Jonky reasoning (everyone does it, etc)

      • Once Was Tim 5.2.1
        5 September 2014 at 6:31 pm

        Ekshly, I was quite surprised Billington QC agreed to take the thing on … must be in need of a bit of coin.

        • mickysavage 5.2.1.1
          5 September 2014 at 8:24 pm

          It is a convention that barristers have to take instructions unless they are too busy or there is a conflict of interest.

          Interestingly Julian Miles QC appeared for the media (at least APN) and he is also Amicus Curiae on the Slater v Blomfield High Court case.

          • yeshe 5.2.1.1.1
            5 September 2014 at 8:28 pm

            micky .. so is he a partisan advocate in that role, and if so, to whom ? thx

            • karol 5.2.1.1.1.1
              5 September 2014 at 8:36 pm

              Sounds to me like an amicus curiae is non-partisan.

              • yeshe …
                5 September 2014 at 8:40 pm

                I agree karol, but this wording at Law Commission website suggests otherwise is also possible, within the same role:

                Amicus curiae
                An amicus curiae, or friend of the court, is not a party to an action, but a person appointed by the court to assist it, either by providing information and submissions about a particular area of the law or, where one of the parties is unrepresented, by advancing legal arguments on that party’s behalf.472 The former role involves giving assistance to the court in a neutral and comprehensive way, ensuring all aspects of a dispute are teased out and addressed. The latter may involve partisan advocacy, including confrontation with opposing counsel.473

                http://ip29.publications.lawcom.govt.nz/chapter+15+-+representation+and+other+participants/other+participants

                • mickysavage …
                  5 September 2014 at 8:50 pm

                  Miles is top notch. The Blomfield case will reach a possible decision that Slater is a journalist but that there is public interest in requiring him to release the information sought.

                  If the case was reheard now, after Dirty Politics, then I think the Court would struggle to hold that Slater is a journalist. After all journalists do not normally get paid to attack people on behalf of corporates or attack innocent people with leaks from ministers or put their name on corporate propaganda articles.

                  • David H …
                    5 September 2014 at 9:10 pm

                    Not only that, but I am pretty sure a Journalist writes their own stuff.

                    • Alistair Connor …
                      5 September 2014 at 10:39 pm

                      Indeed. It appears retrospectively that it is impossible for the casual reader to distinguish between actual journalism and paid advocacy (whether written by himself or not) which appears under his name. I think proper media organisations are obliged to signal to their readers what is news and what is advertorials, no?

    • weka 5.3
      5 September 2014 at 6:33 pm

      “Unwittingly they have made a progressive change of government much less likely.”

      Rawshark has been clear that his motivations aren’t political, so it might not be unwitting so much as don’t care.

    • Tracey 5.4
      5 September 2014 at 6:50 pm

      a judge has now said they are in the public interest. slater has now legally admitted they are his.

      that is a dent in the idea its a conspiracy or forgeries…

      this is not the left saying it… a high court judge. might make a difference?

      dunno

    • Pascals bookie 5.5
      5 September 2014 at 6:51 pm

      Yeah well, maybe if you followed the yarn you’d note that whaledump said on several occasions that this wasn’t about electoral politics for him.

    • Tom Jackson 5.6
      5 September 2014 at 11:14 pm

      It would have been worse if the revelations had not come out. The strategy identified in Hager’s book was being run very effectively against Cunliffe and Labour with minor hit pieces seemingly every week. At least people can now see why that was happening.

      • karol 5.6.1
        6 September 2014 at 7:53 am

        Unfortunately, a lot of people are willfully looking the other way.

        • RedBaronCV 5.6.1.1
          6 September 2014 at 10:08 am

          Well the ones going to vote left are still going to. Some from the dumps have changed their mind and will not vote for national. Some voting national will have their doubts which may grow enough over the next few weeks. And some will still be haven’t read it but “I know it isn’t true.”

          Would the best strategy for a Nact with doubts who isn’t going to vote further to the left be to look carefully at their electorate candidate and -if they are not part of the whaleoil crowd – candidate vote Nact only. No party vote or vote further left.
          If candidate part of the whaleoil crowd then vote for the best other candidate.
          Again no party vote.

          Really any honest Nact’s, win or lose the election, want to reinforce the honest crowd within the party.

          As to the left, well every little bit helps if people come across.

  6. Clemgeopin 6
    5 September 2014 at 6:17 pm

    The hacker Whaledump2 tweeted this morning that he was putting an end to his operations and that he had ALREADY passed on the information to the MEDIA. So, I suppose the media can release those public interest revelations now as per the judgement. That is good news. I am sure ALL politicians and voters that care for integrity, transparency and fair play will be happy with this balanced ruling.

    Here is the whistle blower, Whaledump’s one of the final tweets today:

    “To targeted ratfuckers: Good luck lying. Remaining dumps are with journos. You feeling lucky, punk?”

    Some other of tweets are here:
    https://twitter.com/whaledump2

    • karol 6.1
      5 September 2014 at 6:31 pm

      It was the clever thing to do. legal opinions before this afternoon reckoned Slater would be successful in getting Rawshark gagged. But the media had a strong public interest argument.

      By withdrawing, and leaving the final dump with media, he ensured the focus is now on the public interest, and not Rawshark’s illegal hack – and not on trying to catch/silence him.

  7. weka 7
    5 September 2014 at 6:31 pm

    Aside, all the posts that Slater has deleted off WO since August 18

    http://pastebin.com/9cAugyCA

  8. yeshe 8
    5 September 2014 at 7:21 pm

    Rawshark advised we should refer to Jeremy Hammond … I found this.

    http://www.meganews.co.nz/news/16-nov-2013/jeremy-hammond-sentencing-statement-15th-nov-13

  9. Weepus beard 9
    5 September 2014 at 7:42 pm

    I’m happy that this disturbed egomaniac has failed in his bid to silence the media.

    • disturbed 9.1
      5 September 2014 at 9:00 pm

      Shit weepus don’t call that creep after my namesake.

      Watch the Hager Otago debate its great.

      Please watch this Otago University debate from 1pm today as Nicky Hager will be there. 1pm – 3pm

  10. Tigger 10
    5 September 2014 at 7:49 pm

    WhaleDump 589,567. WhaleOil 0.

  11. Vaughan 11
    5 September 2014 at 8:07 pm

    Is it just me, or has 3 NEWS website http://www.3news.co.nz/ gone AWOL. . .

    Either they haven’t paid their web hosting bill, or Hacking adventures are in full swing? Or none of the above. . .

  12. karol 12
    5 September 2014 at 8:13 pm

    The judge just slapped an interim injunction on the hacker. Full hearing next Wednesday.

    How likely is it that the judge will re-consider and stop the media from writing about previously undisclosed material in their possession?

    • yeshe 12.1
      5 September 2014 at 8:18 pm

      well, let’s see .. we have sat, sun, mon, tues and wed am to publish what they hold already … it might become academic, as the hacker gag proved to be today ! It won’t matter!

      ( I am an optimist, obviously :smile:)

      • Ad 12.1.1
        5 September 2014 at 8:48 pm

        None of it has mattered electorally so far.

        Watergate this ain’t.

        • yeshe 12.1.1.1
          5 September 2014 at 8:52 pm

          It will. It’s a very slow burn, but burning it is. The polls are rigged don’t you see ?

          • Ad 12.1.1.1.1
            5 September 2014 at 10:52 pm

            Well ok then you’ve convinced me.
            A month of polling is oh just wrong.

            • Clemgeopin 12.1.1.1.1.1
              5 September 2014 at 11:00 pm

              It is quite naive and silly to put much trust in these polls due to various reasons which hopefully you can figure out yourself.
              The poll on 20 Sept will CONVINCE you about that fact.

              • Ad …
                5 September 2014 at 11:09 pm

                Now finally you’re getting somewhere.
                All this Whaleoil/Rawshark/Hagar stuff is spectacularly corrosiveve to the effort to change the government.

                It’s polarised nz and strengthened National’s supporters.

                We are 2 weeks from e day and badly distracted by stuff playing into Keys hands every day.

                Change the story, fast, or lose – again.

                • Colonial Viper …
                  5 September 2014 at 11:33 pm

                  It’s polarised nz and strengthened National’s supporters.

                  This election, NZ is supposed to be polarised. That is a good thing. It should boost turnout. And Selwyn Manning doesn’t relay a story of ‘strengthened National supporters’; quite the inverse, really.

                • lurgee …
                  6 September 2014 at 12:15 am

                  I think you are correct in that it is likely National will still be the governing party after the election. DP and Whaledump happened too soon for the real impact to be felt.

                  I think there will be a lot more dirt emerging. There will probably be a grisly death by a thousand exposures of National, and Key’s reputation will be shredded. National may ruefully reflect that 2014 would have been a good one to lose, as it would have been easier to sort the mess out on the opposition benches.

                  But I think you are wrong in suggesting Labour need to change the narrative. Bluntly, I don’t think it would make any difference. This election was lost quite some time ago, and unless the left as a whole get lucky with turn out and the odd random quirk of MMP, nothing will stop Key. Unfortunately.

  13. BM 13
    5 September 2014 at 8:38 pm

    How can the media prove that anything released from now on was already information they possessed?

    • Hanswurst 13.1
      5 September 2014 at 8:41 pm

      More importantly, how can Slater, Ede et al prove that they haven’t been engaged in what on the face of it, and on the basis of their own writings, appears to be the exploitation of confidential information for political gain, and a conscious effort to cover up elected officials’ engagement in the same. The media should publish and be damned.

      • Ad 13.1.1
        5 September 2014 at 8:56 pm

        So worst comes to the worst Key gets a new media guy and a new Minister of Justice as part of his refresh,, and Whaleoil continues its rise as more powerful than the Herald or any other newspaper. Nothing positive here.

        • Hanswurst 13.1.1.1
          5 September 2014 at 9:03 pm

          You are right that that could be one outcome. Where you are completely wrong is that that would be a “worst comes to worst” situation for Key. In the event of clear and widely-perceived indications of deep and deliberate political machinations by Ede, that would be the absolute best case scenario. “Worst comes to worst” would be Key being implicated, forced to resign and facing criminal charges. In between that and simply hiring a new media guy, there are many shades of shit for Mr. Key.

          • Ad 13.1.1.1.1
            5 September 2014 at 10:56 pm

            Sure ain’t Key eating shit for the last month is it?
            Wishful thinking is the difference between politics and Pentecostalism.
            Liberals ain’t going to win again until they figue how to stop losing in multiple sports.

            • Rich 13.1.1.1.1.1
              5 September 2014 at 11:05 pm

              Liberals? Pentecostalism?

              Where are we again?

            • Hanswurst 13.1.1.1.1.2
              5 September 2014 at 11:08 pm

              They’re not “Liberals”. We shouldn’t import that confused American nomenclature.

              Key has absolutely been eating shit. Look at how the political discourse has changed, and what questions he has had to answer. Also, if you are going to accept the polls showing that National has kept support, you also have to accept those that show them losing support, and also those that show fewer people believing him. Regardless of any other considerations, Key has lost a lot on the back of this saga, and none of his opponents has lost a blessed thing.

              Setting aside the contested question of whether National has lost electoral support, your argument only works if you assume that Labour would have gained significant amounts of support if the dirty politics barrel hadn’t been opened, and that the ramifications of the dirty politics revelations will not go beyond this election. I think those assumptions are tenuous to the point of being simply wrong.

              • Ad …
                5 September 2014 at 11:21 pm

                I’m not interested in your counterfactuals at t minus 15 days.

                Pay attention. This focus on Whaleoil/Slater/Hagar isn’t working.

                Any poll so far shows the left splintering and the right staying strong.

                Change the story.

                • Colonial Viper …
                  5 September 2014 at 11:27 pm

                  Pay attention. This focus on Whaleoil/Slater/Hagar isn’t working.

                  Any poll so far shows the left splintering and the right staying strong.

                  Labour have only put moderate and passing attention on Whaleoil/Slater/Hager.

                  Change the story.

                  With two weeks to go, it’s too late for that. And anyhows – what would you change the story to?

                • McFlock …
                  5 September 2014 at 11:40 pm

                  I agree that it would not be optimal if the entire campaign kept focussing 100% on chipping at key, but none of the parties (WO connections notwithstanding) can dictate the coverage of whaledump.

                  But I also think that it was a valuable service that nixed collins as a political front, highlighted division and uncoordination within the nats, and has set up the last two weeks of the campaign for the left to fight a weaker opponent.

                  The leaders’ debates have been going pretty well for the left, they’ve released much more policy and much better policy than the nats, and the left just look keener than the tories. The nats have run out of steam.

                  Still up in the air, but about this time in 2011 things were looking a lot more grim for the left – and the nats only scraped in.

                • Hanswurst …
                  5 September 2014 at 11:55 pm

                  I’m not terribly interested in counterfactuals, either. The fact is, though, that your assumptions require those counterfactuals in order to be of any value. Your suggestion that “the Left” change its tune are fatuous, since it hasn’t been “the Left” that has chosen to focus on Dirty Politics as an issue in the election campaign.

                  Labour and the Greens have focussed on their policies. How exactly are you suggesting that they change that over the next to weeks?

                • lprent …
                  6 September 2014 at 2:07 am

                  This focus on Whaleoil/Slater/Hagar isn’t working.

                  Neither Labour nor the Greens are focused on those. The media, the blogs, and to a large extent the public are.

                  None of the political parties are really getting in a word edgewise. But they’re still going through the election campaign.

                  Sure they will scoop the occasional prize out of it. But that is about it. It is a bit of a nuisance in some respects for all the parties.

                  I suspect that we’re going to have a quieter next couple of weeks and the campaign will pop up through it. It also takes about a month for something like DP to filter out through the polls. I’m expecting the only poll that will reflect it will be the one on election day.

                  I also have no idea what the effect will be because of the unknown about the effect on turnout.

                  However as you’re probably aware I have been fighting this stench of lousy political practices for about 7 years. It is damn good that despicable behaviour that got me interested enough to exert effort in this site has been exposed because it wasn’t going to get cleaned up otherwise. I count that as a win.

                  • One Anonymous Bloke …
                    6 September 2014 at 6:19 am

                    There’s no win until it stops.

                    We’ve always known what they were doing, proof isn’t going to stop them now any more than suspicion did then; unless criminal charges are laid, and stick, nothing will change.

                    This is a set-back for the criminal classes. How damaging a set-back remains to be seen.

                  • Tracey …
                    6 September 2014 at 4:28 pm

                    Exactly, how do you stop doing what you havent been doing. Key controls the framing because the media allow him to.

              • Colonial Viper …
                5 September 2014 at 11:24 pm

                Arguments about John Key’s shit eating grin aside, neither Labour nor Greens have obtained any clear benefit whatsoever from the last 4 weeks, either in increased credibility, confidence of ordinary NZers or stated voting intentions.

                There has been some damage done to National but it is basically limited to: won’t be able to govern alone. Yes, Key is fucked in any event and English will get another go at the top job pretty soon, whether that is as National Leader or as PM.

    • karol 13.2
      5 September 2014 at 8:43 pm

      Maybe they’ve sorted that out with their lawyers?

    • yeshe 13.3
      5 September 2014 at 8:51 pm

      BM .. you should be creating questions for students of English as a second language, for use in their written exams. You would do very well. Your cunning convolution of logic infused with incorrect verb tense(s) would test the finest, Well done.

    • Clemgeopin 13.4
      5 September 2014 at 11:04 pm

      One will need to excercise plenty of ‘trust’ in the same way that the Nat supporters do for Key, I suppose.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 13.5
      6 September 2014 at 6:14 am

      They don’t have to. Anyone who says otherwise needs:

      a. Proof and,
      b. To not be tainted in any way by the ratfuckers Key, Ede, Slater, Collins, etc.

    • Tracey 13.6
      6 September 2014 at 4:25 pm

      By proving to a court the date they received the information was prior to the date of the decision yesterday. Are you really not able to work that out for yourself?

  14. infused 14
    5 September 2014 at 8:49 pm

    Sweet. Keep Dirty politics going. Seems to be working so far.

    • Hanswurst 14.1
      5 September 2014 at 9:35 pm

      It will end Key. With him will go the palatability of the rightwards-oriented National Party for a good while to come. The question is only whether it will be sooner or later.

  15. disturbed 15
    5 September 2014 at 9:18 pm

    Phoney polls don’t worry you’ll see

    • lurgee 15.1
      6 September 2014 at 12:20 am

      It’s quite sad if you actually believe the polls are rigged. They might not be accurate, but that isn’t the same as being ‘phoney.’

      Why, out of interest, were the pollsters so much more honest in the Clark years than than now?

      Are the pollsters the same people who brought down the Twin Towers? That would explain why they were soooo good at keeping secrets secret …

  16. logie97 16
    5 September 2014 at 9:35 pm

    Does anyone remember the sincere but failed Citizens for Rowling campaign.

    With the apparent revelations in Dirty Politics, and the very strongly expressed concerns of some respected learned people, there must surely be a case for a delegation to approach the Governor General to investigate the current government’s leadership.

  17. Toby 17
    5 September 2014 at 10:08 pm

    Show the fabric of New Zealand society some respect media. Be open now if you’ve been given information. Explain any issues you are working through and give us a time frame for any public-interest release or acknowledge your self censorship. It is in the public interest that you do it this weekend while the legal environment definitely allows you to. Take the special role you have in an election and prosecute corruption. If political bias or commercial expediency dictates ANY of your actions around this you are as guilty as any implications within what you withhold. …it will come out one day.

    John Key should resign now,
    He is his office, he said so. I mean “HE” as in “John Key” said….yeah, his office said?
    Either way should lead to Hawaii.

    • Rich 17.1
      5 September 2014 at 10:27 pm

      Only if he’s made to swim there.

    • Ad 17.2
      5 September 2014 at 10:59 pm

      Key is sleepwalking to victory, barring lunacy from a geriatric drunk.

      The Left needs fresh game inside 10 days.

      • Hanswurst 17.2.1
        5 September 2014 at 11:26 pm

        It would be suicidal for the Left to change its game, which (lest we forget) has been about capital gains tax and reducing property speculation, building homes, raising wages, cleaning up waterways and strengthening public broadcasting. The Left can only hope that those issues are given considered and positive coverage that is not dominated by shallow snark from John Key.

        As regards the dirty politics issue, it isn’t about this election. The fact that it blew up in the run-up to this election has simply been a catalyst for its getting considerably more media coverage than would otherwise have been the case, at a time when Key has no choice but to front up to media, rather than avoiding interviews as has otherwise been his modus operandi. The ramifications of Dirty Politics will extend well beyond this election, and reduce the ability of aggressive right-wing spin to drag the political discourse to the right as it has done over the last few years. That is more important than an election victory.

        You’re thinking about it as a weapon in a short-term political game, rather than as a political issue in itself. Your attitude makes you part of the problem.

        • Ad 17.2.1.1
          5 September 2014 at 11:39 pm

          Your opening paragraph is the problem. It would have been great if the election had stuck to policy content. It didn’t, and its killing us.

          I am very pessimistic the Hagar/Rawshark/ whatever will make any positive difference to political operations. More likely it will just give the left an historical “told you I was right” historical footnote, while National enables it to suck all the media oxygen out of the room. And more likely it will confirm the bar of political morality is officially, not just unofficially, lowered.

          Neither amounts to victory of any kind. Hoping it will lead us to victory is what too many have been doing for a month. It hasnt worked because we confused virtue with winning.

          At t-15 days, the left needs to change the media story.

          • Ad 17.2.1.1.1
            5 September 2014 at 11:47 pm

            Sorry. “Confirm”. “Unofficially”

            Time for bed.

          • weka 17.2.1.1.2
            5 September 2014 at 11:58 pm

            Ad, are you saying you believe that Hager releasing his book was wrong, and that RS releasing the hacked information was wrong?

          • Hanswurst 17.2.1.1.3
            6 September 2014 at 12:00 am

            Again, you are running with the assumption that there was a legitimate campaign by Labour that could have won it the election. If you have a particular suggestion, that would be great. However, as it stands, your suggestion appears to be, “The focus on policy hasn’t won the election, therefore the Left should stop focussing on policy and instead do… I dunno… other stuff… and raising the issue of dirty politics is bad… and stuff”.

            As to whether the dirty politics scandals will become a footnote to left-wing feelings of moral superiority, you may well be right. If that is all it amounts to, however, it will be because people did exactly what you are doing: seeing its value principally as a weapon in an amoral political game about winning.

  18. timbo 18
    5 September 2014 at 10:51 pm

    @yeshe – you said above that Paul Davison QC’s comments on 3news site reassured you that MSM would publish whatever they now have. I can’t find those comments on the 3news site. Have they been taken down? Can you say more about what Davison hinted at?

    • yeshe 18.1
      6 September 2014 at 12:19 am

      Timbo, I am so sorry .. my big mistake … I meant Julian Miles QC.

      I did not mean to do that; so much going on in those moments trying to find out what was happening. I apologise, I should have corrected his name before now.

      “Julian Miles QC, lawyer representing the three media organisations, says the organisations are not interested in publishing the private details regarding Slater’s family, which he had been worried about.
      Media organisations were instead focused on the political implications of the emails.
      While the media did not know what was yet to be revealed, it would be a “significant and unprecedented gag” on the media to not be allowed to publish the material, particularly in an election period, he said.
      “To be told there are more of these [emails] out there and to be told this information should be withheld would be an extraordinary interference to the right of the public to be given this information and the media to disseminate it.”
      Slater could have filed for an injunction the day after Dirty Politics came out last month or when the subsequent emails were leaked, Mr Miles said. The information has been in the public arena for some time now.
      “The genie has escaped from this particular bottle,” he said.
      There had been an “extraordinary” effect following the release of the information including the launch of two inquiries and the resignation of Ms Collins.
      He says there is a “reasonable assumption” any further information would be as significant as what has already been published.
      “It would be a travesty that the responsible media are unable to talk about these future disclosures, whereas the wilder areas on the internet and the bloggers will undoubtedly be posting on them and commenting on them,” Mr Miles said.
      “You would have a world where the public is way worse off than they would have been otherwise. Informed comment is gone because it’s been gagged and uninformed comment becomes the means in which the public is informed.”

      Read more: http://www.3news.co.nz/politics/slater-gets-temporary-injunction-against-hacker-2014090517#ixzz3CPwPhvYI

  19. harry holland 19
    6 September 2014 at 12:20 am

    So who paid for Slater’s legal action? Someone who is still nervous about what’s to come…

  20. coolas 20
    6 September 2014 at 12:37 am

    “To targeted ratfuckers: Good luck lying. Remaining dumps are with journos. You feeling lucky, punk?” #whaledump

    I love this guy. He says it’s not about (election) politics for him but what he’s kicked off is as political as we can get – Corporates, Ministers of the Crown, and Crown Agencies, all providing especial privileges and information, and paying heaps, to a blogger whose Daddy was President of the National Party.

    Can’t imagine what Rawshark went through when he read Slater’s files – the scheming, smear tactics, and sheer nastiness.

    Seems he hacked Slater’s puter in outrage after Judd Hall was mocked and called ‘feral’ in a Whaleoil blog. Judd’s mother Jo was also smeared, and ‘Dirty Politics’ asserts Key joined in too. Jo Hall lost a son in the Pike River mine and Judd was her fourth, and last, son to die in an accident. (Whaleoil posts no longer accessible)

    My fervent hope is that Whaledump(ed) a file, so next week a Herald headline says, “Key and Slater mock the dead and grieving.” And there’s a transcript of some sort.

    In the meantime, thank you Rawshark, whoever you are. Dumping before the Judgement was very classy. Hey, praps you are the Judge?

    • Colonial Viper 20.1
      6 September 2014 at 1:02 am

      Or the nerdy kid from Slater’s high school who hates him. Stranger things have happened.

      • Murray Olsen 20.1.1
        6 September 2014 at 4:24 am

        Slug Boy went to Auckland Grammar. There would have been plenty of nerdy kids. He was in about the 3rd or 4th classes down, 5C or 5D, for example. I can imagine that he would have bullied quite a few nerd boys. He was short, dumb, possibly fat, ugly, and probably with a huge sense of entitlement due to his family connections. He would have made enemies.

        • Tracey 20.1.1.1
          6 September 2014 at 4:33 pm

          Slaters son, cameron, has no integrity or ethics. Doug grahams son, carrick has no integrity or ethics…

          Anyone think of other family connections?

          • Anne 20.1.1.1.1
            6 September 2014 at 5:25 pm

            Bhartnagar is the son of a very rich prick who was part of the tycoon clique who bankrolled ACT into existence and then went on to donate many thousands over the years to keep the Nats sitting pretty. He was rewarded with a knighthood.

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