The Lusk paper

130 comments on “The Lusk paper ”

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1. Furrball 1

   1 June 2013 at 10:09 am

   In the right hands, this should be damaging. So much for centre-right or moderate.
   • Alanz 1.1

     1 June 2013 at 4:10 pm

     “So much for centre-right or moderate” – ha ha ha hardly.

     And they are not quite a “broad church” either but in their head honcho’s loopy words on 16 May 2013, let’s give credit where credit is due:

     “They have come together in this happy little place where fruit meets loop.”

     Lusk is a real peach, Slater going bananas and Collins a lemon.
2. mickysavage 2

   1 June 2013 at 10:10 am

   Ha ha fancy calling the current administration dominant faction “the wet wing”.

   Makes you really, really worried what would happen if the Lusk Slater Collins cabal gained control. They would really wreck the joint.
   • Mary 2.1

     1 June 2013 at 1:58 pm

     It’s incredible Slater is even in this mob given how thick he is. The only contribution he makes is access to the blogoshere. It’d be interesting to know what the likes of Lusk and Collins really think of his pseudo-intellect. He gives the game away whenever it’s him talking, like on tele or the radio, or the odd post on his blog that’s full of the kind of grammatical errors that have become his trademark. It’s so easy to pick what’s his and what comes from others like Lusk no doubt or Nact staffers. That piece he wrote defending accusations he was paid to blog was a mix of denying he was paid and defending being paid. The guy couldn’t argue his way out of a paper bag. He’s certainly not the intellectual heavy-weight he makes himself out to be. In fact, given he’s so dumb, I’d bet my house that apart from the strategic value Collins, Lusk et al might see in his blog, I’m sure they wouldn’t let him near anything else. When everything’s stripped back, Slater’s really nothing more than an empty fog-horn for the greedy proponents of a hateful and uncaring society.
     • David H 2.1.1

       1 June 2013 at 2:10 pm

       Yeah but every gang, seems to have the thicko playing with himself and drooling in the corner. They also make the perfect fall guy, because they are too dumb to recognise when they are being used.
       • Murray Olsen 2.1.1.1

         1 June 2013 at 11:06 pm

         That’s the most reasonable explanation I’ve seen for WhaleSpew’s existence. He really is pretty thick, but with delusions of intelligence, and an enormous ego, balanced by a cringing need to be accepted by those he considers his betters. He also has no moral limits. The perfect sort of idiot to die in the trenches.
     • kiwicommie 2.1.2

       1 June 2013 at 10:32 pm

       Slater can’t even troll properly, wonder why people even read his blog?
     • weka 2.1.3

       1 June 2013 at 11:14 pm

       “It’s incredible Slater is even in this mob given how thick he is. The only contribution he makes is access to the blogoshere. It’d be interesting to know what the likes of Lusk and Collins really think of his pseudo-intellect.”

       Slater is a tool. What’s not to like?
   • Colonial Viper 2.2

     1 June 2013 at 2:13 pm

     Wet traditional tories vs dry conbustible neolib tories.

     It’s an epithet similar to what Republicans call their own “RINOs”.
   • nationalman 2.3

     1 June 2013 at 3:11 pm

     what load of shit!
3. KyleDChurch 3

   1 June 2013 at 10:15 am

   “…proposing to sell our politics to business and American interests.” I feel like this has been happening regardless- Warner Bros, Sky City, FBI in Kim Dotcom case… Although probably not the the extent proposed.
   • Draco T Bastard 3.1

     1 June 2013 at 12:52 pm

     Yep. It’s been happening but seemingly not being seen. It certainly hasn’t been turning up in the MSM as such but it is, IMO, what has driven National to sell our assets, to sell our laws.
4. ianmac 4

   1 June 2013 at 10:22 am

   Reaction to first Lusk paper:
   1. It is a satirical piece – surely?
   2. It will adopt the worst aspect of American politics where the lobbies/wealthy control the agenda.
   3. It would be a means to cut out Welfare by putting a time limit on Welfare payments, and reducing Free Health Care, all in the name of Small Government.
   4. If successful it would destroy the National Party as a body which does have many moderates currently in it.
   5. It would be the end of our current National Electorate MP who sits quietly in a well paid safe seat. Ha!
   • mickysavage 4.1

     1 June 2013 at 10:37 am

     Yep the other thought that I had was how psychotic these people are. They want more and more wealth and do not care if kids miss out on breakfast or if the environment gets trashed in the process.

     They really are a bunch of robber barons. At least the truth is now being outed.
     • saarbo 4.1.1

       1 June 2013 at 11:23 am

       +1.
     • fender 4.1.2

       1 June 2013 at 11:53 am

       +1

       Hope the GCSB and SIS are keeping an eye on these terrorists. If they need an extra foot soldier I will gladly volunteer to rid the country of these extremists.
     • TheContrarian 4.1.3

       1 June 2013 at 12:30 pm

       It isn’t that Mickey, these people truly believe the trickle down theory and honestly think that the more wealthy people there are and the more wealth they have the better society will be as a whole.

       How can there be poverty when there are so many rich people?
       • Tim 4.1.3.1

         1 June 2013 at 12:51 pm

         “these people truly believe the trickle down theory”.
         You’re correct – they do IN SPITE of all the evidence that it hasn’t/doesn’t/won’t.
         They’ve moved though from a belief that trickle down would work, to a position that they just don’t care that it hasn’t.
         Long term, just from a mathematical perspective of 1% .v. 99%, or whatever the fractions you wish to use, long term they’re signing their own death warrants.
         • TheContrarian 4.1.3.1.1

           1 June 2013 at 1:16 pm

           You’re right – it doesn’t work at all.
       • felix 4.1.3.2

         1 June 2013 at 1:23 pm

         “these people truly believe the trickle down theory and honestly think that the more wealthy people there are and the more wealth they have the better society will be as a whole.”

         Nah, not even. The last thing they want is more wealthy people.
         • muzza 4.1.3.2.1

           1 June 2013 at 1:57 pm

           Felix is correct.

           This is about control, control by a very exclusive club, which does not have a requirement for increased numbers, in fact if you follow these things around, you see the in-fighting happening in various parts of the world.

           Needless to say, even the elite fight it out amongst themselves, because thats what psychopaths do, the rest of us live with the outputs of the power grab, as the pawns are shoved around the chess board, for the entertainment of the money masters.
           • TheContrarian 4.1.3.2.1.1

             1 June 2013 at 3:00 pm

             Well, I disagree.

             I believe these people really do think that their ideologies are what is best for everyone. Because, hey, it is good for me and look at how rich I am.
             All others need to do is pull themselves up by their bootstraps and we’ll instigate an economic system which maximizes “personal responsibility” and end their reliance on “handouts” which provides no incentive to better ones self. If you’re poor all you need to do is work a bit harder.

             And so forth, bullshit, bullshit.
5. Descendant Of Sssmith 5

   1 June 2013 at 10:29 am

   I assume that we know these are genuine.

   “Lose alliance” instead of “loose alliance” seems a pretty poor mistake to make in a document – or right wingers really are dumb.

   And then Lusk can’t comment cause he’s lost his voice. The slow emergence of Lusk in the media in the last couple of months.

   Call me sceptical but a fake leaked document and lots of media reaction to it can do plenty of harm and this government and it’s ilk have a history of fake crises e.g. ACC.

   Due diligence – I just don’t trust these bastards.
   • r0b 5.1

     1 June 2013 at 10:36 am

     I assume that we know these are genuine.

     Well the electronic document can’t exactly have fingerprints on it, so anything could be argued. But what is posted here matched what was discussed on The Nation, and matches quote for quote what The Herald has cited. I think the documents (this one and the one coming tomorrow) are genuine (as The Nation / The Herald clearly did), and I don’t hear any denials yet.

     My guess is the leaker has more in reserve (maybe still keeping the best back?), that would make any denial a complete fiasco.
   • Draco T Bastard 5.2

     1 June 2013 at 1:51 pm

     “Lose alliance” instead of “loose alliance” seems a pretty poor mistake to make in a document – or right wingers really are dumb.

     That’s a mistake I’ve been seeing more and more of over the last few years. It’s one I’ve made myself. It’s just one of those nasty English spellings that can trip anybody up if they’re in a hurry, don’t do a proper grammar check (which, IME, means getting someone else to read it) or leaves it to the spell the checker.
     • Colonial Viper 5.2.1

       1 June 2013 at 1:53 pm

       proof reading a lost skill???
   • Psycho Milt 5.3

     1 June 2013 at 8:30 pm

     “Lose alliance” instead of “loose alliance” seems a pretty poor mistake to make in a document – or right wingers really are dumb.

     The ability to spell words correctly is becoming a lost art. Loose/lose is one of the losses. Same with their/there, your/you’re etc. It’s a sign of people whose reading consists mostly of the rantings of other illiterates on the internet, rather than actual literature.

     PS: Lusk isn’t alone with such problems. His colleague David Farrar should really stop using the word ‘whom’ because he almost always uses it wrong. If you don’t know when to use ‘whom’, just use ‘who’, for fuck’s sake.
6. Furrball 6

   1 June 2013 at 10:46 am

   Who is Anthony Robins? Listed as the document creator in the PDF’s properties.
   • r0b 6.1

     1 June 2013 at 10:47 am

     That’s me – r0b – author at The Standard. I converted the document from Word to PDF and uploaded it.

     I’ve just deleted that version and replaced by one with no author – since having me as “author” was an unnecessary confusion.

     Update – just checked the original Word document properties…
     Author : Simon Lusk
     Company: Venulum Ltd
     • Furrball 6.1.1

       1 June 2013 at 10:56 am

       OK. Ta. Nice to see it was done on a Mac. 😉

       Whatever its provenance, tie it to them and make them deny it. Despite the misogynistic overtones, I’m a big believer in Josh Marshall’s BitchSlap Theory Of Politics.
       • r0b 6.1.1.1

         1 June 2013 at 11:05 am

         Nice to see it was done on a Mac.

         Friends don’t let friends do Windows!

         Whatever its provenance, tie it to them and make them deny it

         Ho! Not me. I’m a random academic from Dunedin, far from the Wellington power games. All the big players are having this one out, I just potter in the background and watch.
         • Furrball 6.1.1.1.1

           1 June 2013 at 11:15 am

           Sure thing. I’m just thinking aloud, that’s all. They know it’s damaging, because there wouldn’t have been this preemptive scramble to leak and distance themselves from it, because it feeds so perfectly into an existing narrative, as well as highlighting disunity.

           A little chum in the water. Nice.
           • r0b 6.1.1.1.1.1

             1 June 2013 at 11:23 am

             No worries. I’m just a bit bemused with myself to have ended up in the blogging game sometimes.
         • Tim 6.1.1.1.2

           1 June 2013 at 1:16 pm

           “I just potter in the background and watch.”
           It’s a lugsurious perspective in which to luxuriate aye!
           Even though I’m almost amongst it, the piffling juxtapositioning of the egotistical ‘wannabe beltway’ descriptors the various players have assigned themselves – aided and abetted by a compliant media (as opposed to a 4th Estate), it’s both depressing and amusing to watch.

           Depressing in that it’s SUCH a waste of time
           Amusing in that most of these cnuts actually believe in their (own) superficial spin.

           As things stand, when it all turns to shit – I’ll probably be somewhere in Northern India (though I’d rather not). Far preferable though to the NAct’s Mighty Mighty plan.
           Do you want Ice with that?
     • Vagabundo 6.1.2

       1 June 2013 at 12:48 pm

       Clicking on the link at the top of the story now just redirects me to http://thestandard.org.nz/.
       • Vagabundo 6.1.2.1

         1 June 2013 at 12:53 pm

         Oh wait, now it’s working. Weird.
     • billbrowne 6.1.3

       2 June 2013 at 1:23 pm

       Hope you’ve had a look at the original Word doc with Track Changes on.
       • r0b 6.1.3.1

         2 June 2013 at 1:29 pm

         Good thought. Nothing there…
   • weka 6.2

     1 June 2013 at 12:09 pm

     “Listed as the document creator in the PDF’s properties.”

     Where do you see that? (I’m on a mac)
     • r0b 6.2.1

       1 June 2013 at 12:14 pm

       You need to have a PDF viewer (e.g. Acrobat) that allows you to look at the document’s “properties” – usually a menu choice under Edit somewhere…
     • Furrball 6.2.2

       1 June 2013 at 12:17 pm

       Open the PDF in Acrobat Pro or perhaps Adobe Reader. Menu: File>Properties.

       Had to double-check. You know, the pixels. 😉
       • weka 6.2.2.1

         1 June 2013 at 3:02 pm

         ok, I’m using the mac Preview PDF reader, don’t think it does that.

         The reason I am asking is that where it said that the author was Anthony Robbins, does that mean, r0b, that you put your name there, or did the document take it from your computer? Just curious about the security aspect of posting PDFs online.
         • r0b 6.2.2.1.1

           2 June 2013 at 12:07 am

           Hi Weka – author info is inserted automatically in various kinds of documents, including all MS Office documents (as far as I know) and PDFs (in many circumstances). But you can always find it and delete it if you want to.
7. Pete 7

   1 June 2013 at 10:54 am

   So basically now that Act is a discredited and unpopular party, those that still subscribe to that school of thought want to do the same thing to National.
   • BM 7.1

     1 June 2013 at 11:31 am

     Bit like the Alliance and Labour.
     • Colonial Viper 7.1.1

       1 June 2013 at 11:46 am

       Actually not at all, but keep making your shit up.
       • BM 7.1.1.1

         1 June 2013 at 12:05 pm

         Really?, it’s not what I’ve seen.
         If anything, judging by the way Labour has been massively pulled to the left, I’d say they’ve been quite successful.
         • fender 7.1.1.1.1

           1 June 2013 at 12:19 pm

           Did Key tell you to say that?

           ‘massively pulled to the left’ – citation needed, and no NZ Power won’t suffice.
           • Colonial Viper 7.1.1.1.1.1

             1 June 2013 at 12:22 pm

             The righties are really quite nervous that the Greens might get 15% or so of the vote in 2014.They can see their mining and banking interests having to take a back seat if that happens.

             Also might need to remind BM that the National Party is also “hard left” and “liberal bleeding heart” when compared to the sickness that is US politics.
             • TheContrarian …

               1 June 2013 at 12:28 pm

               Totally, National has nothing on the US
             • fender …

               1 June 2013 at 12:30 pm

               I’m pleased they are nervous, I’ll be giving my party vote to the Greens rather than my usual double tick for Labour and I encourage others to do the same.
         • Richard 7.1.1.1.2

           1 June 2013 at 12:27 pm

           What evidence do you have that “Labour has been massively pulled to the left”?

           From what I’ve seen of the Labour party in opposition, it would sit very comfortably within the wet end of National.
         • Tim 7.1.1.1.3

           1 June 2013 at 1:20 pm

           Keep it up – P L E A S E! @ BM
         • Paul 7.1.1.1.4

           1 June 2013 at 2:20 pm

           Sloganeering…without any evidence to support.
           Your classic wingnut ignorant comment.
         • Matthew Whitehead 7.1.1.1.5

           1 June 2013 at 5:53 pm

           Labour hasn’t been a coherently left party for some time, pull the other one. It’s a centrist party with some union ties.
           • Colonial Viper 7.1.1.1.5.1

             2 June 2013 at 12:33 am

             and not that many of them
8. bad12 8

   1 June 2013 at 11:03 am

   Are not they a joy to behold, claims that the likes of Blubber-Boy via the Sewer are the voice of the National Party having the main stream media trailing along faithfully gathering their political slant via that website,

   And then claiming that they, i assume Slater, Lusk, Hooten, should be paid for their efforts, the laugh a minute flotsam of the bottom tier of of sludge feeders in the National pond have obviously thrown a hissy fit having been told to F off with their claims to monetary reward,

   Small wonder that the Shill Hooten has been for some weeks hinting darkly about National not winning the 2014 election,

   Amidst the stench emanating from Nationals ranks i had to have a small guffaw at the twin columns of the Herald online’s Armstrong and Roughman this morning openly attacking the Labour/Green Government in waiting with Armstrong playing the fiddle so hard it smokes,

   Having made a blunt admission that the Read poll in particular has been skewing the results by inserting particular questions designed to gain specific negative results for Labour/Green the fool Armstong then goes on to ascribe such questions the title of ‘mistakes’…
9. Sanctuary 9

   1 June 2013 at 11:05 am

   Is the Simon Lusk who defenced disgraced Former Bridgecorp board member Peter Steigrad recently in the Auckland High Court the same guy?

   Here is a photo of the lawyer Lusk:

   http://www.ypol.com.au/our_team_lusk.html
   • veutoviper 9.1

     1 June 2013 at 11:44 am

     I don’t think so. See my 11.1.
10. geoff 10

    1 June 2013 at 11:23 am

    One of the few times I’d agree with JK, Simon Lusk does = -1
11. tamati 11

    1 June 2013 at 11:28 am

    Nothing on Venulum Ltd via. the companies office. Probably listed in the Cayman islands or something.
    • veutoviper 11.1

      1 June 2013 at 11:43 am

      Probably British Virgin Islands. It has been widely reported for quite some time that Lusk is involved in a couple of overseas companies – eg the morning’s Herald article on National turns on hard right adviser”.

      “Mr Lusk is based in Hawkes Bay and spends his days hunting and fishing. He is involved in a fine wine trading company based in the British Virgin Island, where he is also connected to a lobster farming project. “
      • felix 11.1.1

        1 June 2013 at 12:28 pm

        A wine company that wants to become a… http://www.venulum.com/index.php?option=com_user&view=login&return=aHR0cDovL3d3dy52ZW51bHVtLmNvbS8=
        • veutoviper 11.1.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 12:48 pm

          Thanks for that link felix.

          The fact that you cannot view the details on the site without a login and password is in line with what I recall from other things about Lusk and the way he works when I did a bit of research on him about a year ago for some now forgotten reason.
          • felix 11.1.1.1.1

            1 June 2013 at 1:07 pm

            I think that site is the next phase of project venulum. If you go to http://venulumltd.com you get the wine site.
            • Murray Olsen 11.1.1.1.1.1

              2 June 2013 at 2:15 pm

              “We have established channels throughout the world, and are often the first number on a merchants list when they have a large parcel of fine wine they want sold discretely.”

              Why would merchants want large parcels of fine wine sold discretely? Hmmmm.
        • rosy 11.1.1.2

          1 June 2013 at 6:51 pm

          Upstanding company…
          http://www.justanswer.com/consumer-protection-law/776nf-invested-venulum-without-realizing.html

          Edit: And the company filing in the U.S
          Love this internet thingy.
          • NickS 11.1.1.2.1

            1 June 2013 at 7:41 pm

            This just gets more and more interesting.
12. QoT 12

    1 June 2013 at 11:39 am

    My favourite bit:

    2. Media
    a. Dominate the media by controlling the message through credible right
    wing blogs.

    That’s literally the entire “Media” section. So their media strategy is “David Farrar”.

    (The alternatives being: Simon Lusk thinks W****O** is “credible”; or stay tuned for a sudden influx of Farrar-mimicking blogs in the lead-up to the election.)
    • felix 12.1

      1 June 2013 at 12:48 pm

      Do you think it unlikely that Lusk would consider WO to be credible? After all, Collins said:

      Whaleoil is better informed and better read than any other news outlet or social media.

      These people are freaks. They manage to pass as human most of the time but they really work at it. It’s not useful to judge them by our standards as words like “credible” have a totally different meaning to them.
      • prism 12.1.1

        1 June 2013 at 1:00 pm

        felix
        Ideologists on both side are perhaps aliens passing as humans. Anyway they might as well be if the right wing side triumphs over the left wing principles. There have been throwbacks before in history that looked like our concept of what humans are. But though the word humane might contain the letters for human the DNA is something else.
      • QoT 12.1.2

        1 June 2013 at 8:06 pm

        I think it’s possible Lusk is just so used to spinning things that he says “controlling the message through credible right wing blogs” when he means “get Slater to throw shit at everything until a journo with a short deadline needs a story”.

        You can call Slater many things – “successful” would tragically be one of them – but there’s a big step up to the properly “credible” places like Kiwiblog (though DPF’s credibility is surely only ensured by the fact that Proper Journos just scrape the stories and don’t stick around for the comments.)
    • Tim 12.2

      1 June 2013 at 1:40 pm

      🙂
      David Fucking Farrar! It reminds me of a recent doco re the (fall of the) British Empire (with that sage that fronts BBC Newsnight …. Jeremy someone or other. Ah yea…. Paxman) who essentially offered the argument that empire (lower case ‘e’) only ever survived because of a successful BLUFF. The natives woke up (eventually). Often the outcome wasn’t that pretty.
      You know – it ISN’t mandatory that history has to repeat itself, it’s just that there are a few pillocks (Lusks, Slators, etc., etc., and their ilk) that have allowed their egos (a la Piggies in Lords of Flees) that aren’t actually the Brains of Britain.
      Let them Rise and Fall where they may. Whatever the outcome, let’s not pretend we have any degree of sympathy.
      I’d actually LOVE to meet Simon Lusk!, more so Cameron Slator! No doubt there’d be a duel of some description.
      They’re actually quite fcukin pathetic, and I can’t understand WHY they’ve gained the profiles they have.
      • Paul 12.2.1

        1 June 2013 at 2:21 pm

        They have got their profiles because they are bought puppets.
        They do their masters’ wishes.
        For a pittance.
13. Furrball 13

    1 June 2013 at 11:50 am

    From a cursory reading it’s now fairly clear what this Lusk statement now means:

    “He spends “two to three hours” a day reading political literature from the US “looking for knowledge that can be applied here”.”

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/8717357/Seriously-happy-to-upset-the-status-quo

    The only solid and proven way to beat this from the left is membership drives, engagement, dialogue, involvement and grassroots fundraising… all facilitated through human contact and digital strategies. For the NZ Labour party’s long-term survival, in this day and age, caucus grip on leadership selection will eventually have to give way to that of membership.
    • Paul 13.1

      1 June 2013 at 11:55 am

      Looks and sounds like a piece of work.
      What is his motivation for turning us into an extreme right paradise?
      Anyone got any background on his childhood/ upbringing/ education to see where such extreme viewpoints were cultivated….
    • Colonial Viper 13.2

      1 June 2013 at 11:58 am

      Note that Labour currently has a fascination for the Democratic Party way of doing things. And that’s a huge leap towards the right wing in of itself.
      • Furrball 13.2.1

        1 June 2013 at 12:09 pm

        You deal with the electorate you have, not the one you wish you want to have. Strategies for voter and membership involvement and turning out the vote are the only way of beating this form of big money deck-stacking.
        • Colonial Viper 13.2.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 12:26 pm

          nb Beltway Labour want followers, not members. You’ll see a consistent push from them to centralise more party power in Wellington and Wellington selected committees, and away from the Regions and branches.

          This was one reason they were so pissed off with the membership voting for a much larger say over the Labour Leader.
          • Furrball 13.2.1.1.1

            1 June 2013 at 12:41 pm

            Well, that’s going to be a problem for them in the future. It’s an old-fashioned way of doing politics on the left because members, especially the coming generation. will see themselves as consumer/participants who if they’re motivated, will engage themselves with the brand and organisation of the NZ Labour Party.

            Throwing up a RedAlert blog just isn’t going to cut it… take a look what Arnie Graf is doing with the Labour Party in the UK. The days of flyer-stuffing through doors is running its course. It’s all about direct voter contact.

            The danger of discarding the Lusk documents wholesale is rejecting some of its core findings, because like it or not, some of this will already be in play. I’m writing from London, so I don’t really have a horse in this race. Just my two cents.
    • Mary 13.3

      1 June 2013 at 3:05 pm

      Maybe…who knows? One thing’s for sure, though. Labour is stuffed for as long as it sits around doing and saying nothing like it does with Shearer as leader. Norman’s speech shows the Greens understand that things are changing and know where Key and his moneymen’s weak points are therefore know what the message needs to be. Norman’s speech made that very clear. It’s just a shame that Labour are either too lazy or too stupid to know that they too need to deal to the nasty and undemocratic greediness that’s become Key et al’s MO. It’s either this or Labour under Shearer share Key’s views. Regardless of the answer Labour under Shearer are so ineffectual they’ve become a very tangible asset to this nasty underhand pack of thugs we’ve decided to make our government. Norman’s speech was fantastic. It also showed how much of a liability Shearer really is.
      • Treetop 13.3.1

        1 June 2013 at 3:52 pm

        The Labour caucas cannot undermine their leader Vs underestimating how their leader is perceived by the voter.
14. Yes 14

    1 June 2013 at 11:55 am

    And labour and greens don’t have the same strategies to drive them to the top. FFS what is greenpeace all about?

    What are unions all about?

    This is a nothing boring story. Labour has had splits all the time
    Greens
    Alliance
    Mana
    Maori
    Progressive

    National
    Act
    NZ first

    So what
    • Colonial Viper 14.1

      1 June 2013 at 12:00 pm

      Funny how you are so desperately keen to avoid talking about the Lusk National Party, and the way they are bowing to the USA way of the radical Republican Tea Party and the billionaire Koch Brothers.
      • Yes 14.1.1

        1 June 2013 at 12:05 pm

        I agree lusk is very right and national need to manage. Not avoiding just giving historical comparisons
        • Yes 14.1.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 12:06 pm

          Greenpeace funds the green parties around the world so no difference
          • paul andersen 14.1.1.1.1

            1 June 2013 at 12:14 pm

            you forgot to add the standard line ‘” nothing to see here, lets move on” ,,yeah right!!
            • felix 14.1.1.1.1.1

              1 June 2013 at 12:39 pm

              Look again, he got it in above: “This is a nothing boring story.”

              (I don’t know why he spelled “tory” with a silent “s” though)
          • Colonial Viper 14.1.1.1.2

            1 June 2013 at 12:29 pm

            Greenpeace funds the green parties around the world so no difference

            No difference? I’m afraid that’s so much BS.

            Greenpeace only has a fraction of the funds and resources of the Koch Brothers or the Conservative Right of the USA.

            And, NZ’s Green Party is governed by strict political funding rules. Simon Lusk is not.
            • Yes 14.1.1.1.2.1

              1 June 2013 at 12:42 pm

              And one of the biggest funders of Greenpeace is…..The Body Shop….last look worth billions!
              • felix …

                1 June 2013 at 12:55 pm

                Oh ffs what a crock. The organic sector secretly runs the world by selling shampoo.

                You should join the lose alliance.
              • Colonial Viper …

                1 June 2013 at 1:04 pm

                The Body Shop is owned by the multinational corporate L’Oreal you fucking moron, a corporate which kills minxs and whales for ingredients for their perfumes and cosmetics.
                • felix …

                  1 June 2013 at 1:26 pm

                  But the shopfronts are painted green. Anything painted green is part of a secret funding mechanism for The Secret International Alliance Of Green Parties.
                  • Colonial Viper …

                    1 June 2013 at 1:36 pm

                    Ahhhh, I’ve been naive, thank you for enlightening me to the truth of the matter.
                    • Yes …

                      1 June 2013 at 7:46 pm

                      I seriously think you should do your history of the The Body Shop. Wikipedia and their own history on their website explains all the connection to greenpeace and the greens.

                      You are totally ignorant on this and talking rubbish
                    • Colonial Viper …

                      1 June 2013 at 7:49 pm

                      That shit is ancient history now mate, the Body Shop is today just an assimilated part of yet another big multinational corporate who took it over. Try and keep up with market events please.
                    • QoT …

                      1 June 2013 at 8:08 pm

                      Jesus, Yes, have you not been reading your memos? Lush is the new secret fifth column bathroom products storefront of the organo-anarchist conspiracy.
      • kiwicommie 14.1.2

        2 June 2013 at 12:41 am

        Makes me wonder whether or not Labour and the Greens should start to develop financial ties with progressive groups in the US (as National has being exposed as a Republican party fifth column), though the Democrats are more right wing than National in many respects, so that has its own problems.
    • Matthew Whitehead 14.2

      1 June 2013 at 6:35 pm

      The difference is that this isn’t a split yet and that the two factions compose roughly half of the party each, and one of them is making a play for dominance.

      It’s more akin to Roger Douglas’ faction of the Labour Party than the splitting off of new parties from Labour and National.
15. Jeff 15

    1 June 2013 at 12:10 pm

    And Jackie Blue has been appointed Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner by Judith Collins. My guess is that this sticks to “the plan”.
16. Yes 16

    1 June 2013 at 12:21 pm

    And Clark didn’t appoint anyone? Omg
    • Colonial Viper 16.1

      1 June 2013 at 12:31 pm

      Collins is playing a cronyism game that NZers really dislike. If National’s track record holds up, Blue will not be sufficiently qualified or experienced for the role.

      Let’s see if they even did any serious interviewing of candidates or whether this is pure cronyism.
      • felix 16.1.1

        1 June 2013 at 1:03 pm

        Have you been following this in question time this week?

        Collins’ spin is that when the ministry advertised the job it was only pretend and it didn’t count because she’s the boss and it only counts if she personally places the ad or some such bullshit, so any appointment process followed by the ministry isn’t relevant to and can’t be compared to how she actually did the appointment.

        (which consisted of saying “Hey Jax fill your boots.”)
        • Colonial Viper 16.1.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 1:32 pm

          Ahhh I hadn’t kept up with that thanks for the update
17. Frankie and Benjy Mouse 17

    1 June 2013 at 1:32 pm

    A quick Google got me to this….
    The SEC has recently filed yet another enforcement action concerning promissory notes

    “The Commission’s suit, filed in Dallas federal court, alleges that, beginning in 2002, Venulum made unsolicited calls to American investors, primarily dentists, to solicit investments in interests in trading in fine wines to be managed by Venulum. Venulum’s solicitation highlighted its purported expertise in selecting, sourcing, storing and marketing fine wines for the benefit of investors. Then, starting in 2010, Venulum solicited 94 of its wine investors to purchase high-interest promissory notes. Neither of the offerings was registered with the Commission.”
18. Whafe 18

    1 June 2013 at 2:59 pm

    This little tea party discussing the “Lusk Papers” has about as much traction as an F1 car on a 4WD track…..

    David Hay Seed Fisher must be annoyed he hasn’t any traction for the long gardening weekend…..

    Whale Oil doesn’t pose any issues to you lefties though does it ?????????
    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 18.1

      1 June 2013 at 4:02 pm

      What about the Herald? What about The Nation? Have their stories got traction? Do they pose any issues for wingnuts?

      I think the National Party needs to purge itself of its extremist elements, and stop selling its policy and MPs, so obviously any hit on Lusk is a good thing.

      As for Mr. Slater, the issue is that he lies for money. What of it?
19. scotty 19

    1 June 2013 at 3:18 pm

    I smell a strawman being dragged into the light, to fight a phoney war against ‘centrist’ Key.
    Key claims’ victory’ over righties in his party, and is delighted to announce National will ‘remain’ firmly in the centre , representing a broad range of NZers.
    Yay John Key .
    • Treetop 19.1

      1 June 2013 at 4:02 pm

      Where do you think Key places the mum and dad investors?
    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 19.2

      1 June 2013 at 4:10 pm

      Have you seen any evidence that any of the players possess the intelligence to enact such a scheme? Perhaps there are some intelligent competent Righties somewhere, keeping very very quiet.
      • handle 19.2.1

        1 June 2013 at 8:24 pm

        Joyce does. Key does what he is told.
    • Paul 19.3

      1 June 2013 at 4:15 pm

      With the Herald running 3 stories on the issue today, there is much to be suspicious about.
      They are a repeaters for the corporates, so what you read there is what the .0001% want you to read.
      It does fit the new sloganeering about Key being moderate and the Greens being an offshoot of the North Korean communist party.
      And paid poodles like Roughan and Armstrong kept up the propaganda with stories trying to scare/encourage the weak Labour caucus into dropping its links with Labour.
      We must never forget that the media is owned and controlled by foreign corporate interests who do not care about NZ’s democracy.
      • kiwicommie 19.3.1

        1 June 2013 at 11:32 pm

        Media and the long white cloud

        God, Socrates, Aristotle, Nietzsche and Marx are all sitting on a cloud. They look down below at the rambling crowd of media figures, who are all shouting ‘communist’, ‘socialist’, ‘dole bludger’, ‘get a job’, and ‘Stalin’ at a scarecrow with a ‘left’ sign hanging from it.

        God asks ‘what are they so worked up about?’, Socrates replies ‘I was really too honest a man to be a politician and live’, Aristotle replies ‘all paid jobs absorb and degrade the mind’, Nietzsche replies ‘to forget one’s purpose is the commonest form of stupidity’, Marx replies ‘reason has always existed, but not always in a reasonable form’.

        God ponders all the answers set before him, and understands there is little hope for the rambling crowd below, he asks Socrates his opinion, who tells God ‘death may be the greatest of all human blessings’.

        Aristotle, horrified by the notion they could end up with that crowd of mindless rabble for eternity asks, ‘do we have to open the gates for them?’

        God raises his palm to his head, and replies ‘I am afraid so’.
        • SukieDamson 19.3.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 11:44 pm

          And Cameron Slater looks in the mirror and asks Who is the fairest of them all?
    • felix 19.4

      1 June 2013 at 5:51 pm

      I think you’re onto it scotty.

      No doubt Lusk and his cult really do want to take over the party (typical crony-capitalists, too lazy to start their own party), but in this instance they’re also being used as a stalking horse by the current administration.
    • North 19.5

      1 June 2013 at 10:06 pm

      I can see that, as I’ve said somewhere else on TS. today. Key the reasonable man who would protect us from that madness. And in the process stick it up Collins.

      It’s all about winning in 2014 and then carte blanche.
20. Michael 20

    1 June 2013 at 4:10 pm

    NACT have been running this strategy for a while now. Remember the 2002 campaign to persuade the “business community” to close their check books to National while Bill English was leader? It worked then. The strategy is also cut and pasted from that employed in the US (not surprising, as Lusk and the other right-wingers are not original thinkers). OTOH, I think the strategy will work, not least because it panics Labour into moving right, too (just look at its track record, both current and recent). NACT have already politicised the bureaucracy (not too many lefties in Treasury, if there ever were. Power within MSD and ACC located in “boards” of right-wing “business leaders” and “doctors”, etc,ad nauseam). I hope the Greens steer well clear of Labour in 2014; if the latter wants to move into the Beehive, it should have to go cap in hand to Greens every step of the way. That’s the only I can see our political system protecting the interests of the majority from the rapacious right.
    • Paul 20.1

      1 June 2013 at 4:18 pm

      Or the Labour rank and file recapturing the party from careerists inside the caucus.
      • Anne 20.1.1

        1 June 2013 at 4:53 pm

        Or the Labour rank and file recapturing the party from careerists inside the caucus.

        That is ultimately a distinct possibility.

        For example: take the poor strategy thinking by the ABC club at the last Annual Conference:

        There were three amendments to the remits calling for greater member participation in the election of a leader. First, was the caucus sanctioned amendment which essentially placed the bar too high for any possible membership input in leadership contests. Second, was a compromise remit setting the bar at 50% +1. That would have meant membership participation was possible but still quite difficult to achieve. Third, was the 40% threshold which gives members an even chance of having a strong influence in the selection of future leaders.

        If the ABC club members had been smart they would have gone for the second option, and that would have given them a partial win. But no… so confident were they of their ability to outsmart delegates, they went for the first option. The delegates fought back by resoundingly voting down the second option and going for the third option. The delegates won.

        In a nutshell that is what happened.

        I’m not convinced the ABCers have learned their lesson yet, and I suspect they still continue to under-estimate the intelligence of the rank and file.
        • Rhinocrates 20.1.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 9:19 pm

          Good analysis.

          I’m not convinced the ABCers have learned their lesson yet, and I suspect they still continue to under-estimate the intelligence of the rank and file.

          I think that they’ve become so blinded by a sense of their own entitlement that the party itself is seen as an irritant. That little yuppie shit Hipkins’ remark that his real enemies are within the party is pretty symptomatic of their solipsism.
        • weka 20.1.1.2

          1 June 2013 at 10:58 pm

          “Or the Labour rank and file recapturing the party from careerists inside the caucus.”

          That is ultimately a distinct possibility.

          I wish they would hurry up and get on with it.
    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 20.2

      1 June 2013 at 4:19 pm

      This policy may have rebounded on National’s Tea Party: in pulling Labour to the centre/right, they have opened up a large gap on the left for the Greens and Mana.

      Their attacks on New Zealand are met with electoral humiliation, but they have deep pockets, so despite their cancerous effect on the country, National abides them, but would be better to cut them adrift entirely.

      Things are piling on for the government. While the Left has its foot on their throat, let’s keep it there.
      • Paul 20.2.1

        1 June 2013 at 4:23 pm

        Do you think Shearer has his foot on Key’s throat?
        Norman…..yes.
        Turei….yes.
        Harawira….yes.
        But Shearer?
        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 20.2.1.1

          1 June 2013 at 4:29 pm

          Shearer is Labour’s problem. Three out of four ain’t bad 🙂
          • Colonial Viper 20.2.1.1.1

            1 June 2013 at 6:00 pm

            Oh you cynic 😀
          • Rhinocrates 20.2.1.1.2

            1 June 2013 at 9:11 pm

            Don’t know about foot on throat, but considering that Shearer doesn’t know his arse from his elbow, no doubt soon, to show that he’s relevant, he’ll fuck everything up by putting his pancreas on one of Moonbeam’s kidneys and expect to be applauded for it.

            And then Robertson will issue yet another press release to reassure “the markets” that they shouldn’t worry, Labour won’t actually do anything to upset the status quo and it’ll all be business as usual.
            • veutoviper 20.2.1.1.2.1

              1 June 2013 at 9:17 pm

              LOL – how true!
21. North 21

    1 June 2013 at 9:45 pm

    Rhinocrates excellent !
22. donkeysuck 22

    2 June 2013 at 12:54 am

    Is this part of Lusks wine business

    http://www.justanswer.com/consumer-protection-law/776nf-invested-venulum-without-realizing.html
23. Watchdog 23

    2 June 2013 at 12:33 pm

    Donkeysuck

    Yes

    http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/985261?backurl=%2Fcompanies%2Fapp%2Fui%2Fpages%2Findividual%2Fsearch%3Fq%3DCADMAN+Giles%26start%3D%26entitySearch%3D%26addressKeyword%3D%26postalCode%3D%26country%3D%26addressType%3D%26advancedPanel%3D%26roleType%3DDIR%26sf%3D%26sd%3D

    and this

    http://investorswatchdog.com/blog/investorswatchblog/?p=7320#more-7320

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