Written By: - Date published: 12:22 pm, April 3rd, 2008 - 60 comments
Categories: Media, nz first, racism -
Tags: Media, nz first, racism
Now this is what Campbell needs to do more of. Last night the man ripped poor old Peter Brown to shreds over his racist comments about Asian immigrants, and it was brutal. You almost had to feel sorry for the guy:
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Great video.
I think it is an important point that has been made that as Winston is part of the Government, the views of his party are relevant. Particularly as minister of Foreign Affairs. Can he now adequately discharge his obligations given his party’s stated policies?
Others have made the point and have been denigrated for doing so. However I think as Prime Minister, Helen Clark needs to think long and hard about the effect of having as Foreign Minister a man who leads a party with disgustingly racist views. Some may feel that it is sufficient for party spokespeople to condemn Peter Browns statement on behalf of NZ First. However Helen Clark needs to worry about the reputation NZ has internationally. She should give strong consideration to a Prime Ministerial statement of condemnation if not an outright sacking. It is simply unacceptable for her to be putting Labour’s fortunes ahead of NZ’s reputation.
MC: I think you’re a bit confused as well. It wasn’t Winston who made the comments. I haven’t seen it in any party policy from NZF.
As far as I can tell (by analogy, and stretching it a bit) you’re saying that Key should stand down as leader of the opposition because Burka Bob makes rascist comments. Or he shouldn’t get the security briefings as leader of the opposition…..
Is that what you are saying?
BeShakey said “So Inventory, you think that all coalition agreements, that include making a member of the minor party a government minister, include (implicitly) the requirement that the major party sign off on the minor partys election platform, and kick them out of their ministerial role/s (which would in effect probably mean an end to the coalition)?”
Not at all BeShakey. The point I am making is that Clark appointing Peters, well known as a loose cannon, as Foreign Minister was the price of NZ First enabling her to form a government. However, with that came risk. The role of Foreign Minister is a crucial one – Peters is effectively the “shop window” for the New Zealand government on the international diplomatic circuit. To have as Foreign Minister the leader of a xenophobic party is not a good look, and unless Clark distances herself from Peters in strong terms, she runs the risk of being seen as endorsing the NZ First anti-Asian rhetoric.
Anyone who believes that Brown’s outburst was not sanctioned by Peters is naive in the extreme. Peters has a well-documented track record in Asian-bashing, and whether by accident or design, his rhetoric is normally delivered in the run-up to an election. Labour markets itself as a party which is “ethnic-friendly”; being associated with Winston Peters and his party can only be bad news for Labour.
AncientGeek said “MC: I think you’re a bit confused as well. It wasn’t Winston who made the comments. I haven’t seen it in any party policy from NZF.”
Get real AG! You know that Winston rules NZ First with an iron hand, and that comments like this would never be made without him giving the ok. I have no doubt that these are Winston’s words, just like the “rows of ostentatious houses” comments from 1996.
AG – This has come from the spokesperson for immigration for NZ First and Winston has not distanced himself from the statement. I believe it is fair to infer that this is policy unless otherwise stated. This is also historically accurate with NZF policy.
Bob Clarkson although an idiot for making the stupid comments he made is not responsible for New Zealand’s image overseas – he is not minister of Foreign Affairs. John Key can discipline him however he feels is right – his decision does not affect New Zealand’s international reputation so much as a Foreign Minister leading a party with racist policies.
You say I’m confused. Next time bring the crayons and I’ll think you’ll understand a little better eh mate.
So you have some kite-flying. Peter Brown from the clip I saw, was quite clear that it is his opinion.
Personally I think the statement was ridiculous as well as being stupidly racist. Peter Brown deserves condemnation and he has observably gotten it. Hopefully he will get dropped as NZF’s immigration spokesperson.
But to jump from that to dismissing Winston requires so many steps between that you’d have to be a conspiracy nutter to make them. It jumps across so many lines of responsibility that you could make equivalent examples from any party from some of their resident idiots saying things to the media.
Face it – it is a hell of stretch from Peter Brown expressing his opinion, to dismissing Winston (not that I favour him either).
I2:
Crap. Think back 10 years to the Nat/NZF coalition. Think back four (?) years to Woolerston. If I could be bothered, I could probably pick a dozen examples including Ron Mark.
Internal discipline inside NZF is just marginally better than the Greens.
AG – Has Winston said he doesn’t support the statement? No. Did Peter Brown say he has the support of Winston Peters in the video? Yes. Has Winston Peters said similar things himself in election years? Yes. Did Peter Brown say he was acting in accordance with NZF policy? Yes.
To say Winston Peters is not responsible here is to hide your head in the sand. However things change considerably if he comes out and condemns the statement. Anything less is an endorsement worthy of his sacking.
I don’t doubt that Winston endorses Brown’s comments. NZ First are doing what they’ve always done – appeal to rednecks. The only difference is that this time it was done without Peters’ demagogue skills, a bumbling amateur instead of the old pro.
It is no different from the message that got Peters up to 30% in the polls in the 1990′s, no different from when his star was rising, no different from when he entered a coalition with National, no different from when Brash courted him in 2005, no different from when John Key said last year that Peters could be Foreign Minister in his government, and for exactly the same reason as Labour – because they needed the seats.
New Zealand First’s poison has been there for 15 years now. It’s a bit late to start claiming moral high ground and demanding resignations. Some of us got off our arses and marched and campaigned and protested against Peters and his bigotry years ago. If you joined in then, credit to you. If you didn’t, spare me the lecture now.
I hate racism. But I hate posturing, pretend anti-racism almost as much. And given the silence – or even approval – on the Right when OTHER minority groups are targeted, I suspect that a lot of the “outrage” is pretty damn artificial.
If anyone doubts this, spend five minutes checking out the blogs (usual suspects) from when the Somalian hi-jacker hit the news. Not much anti-racism then.
Historian: That was almost a perfect description of how I feel about it as well. Especially the last three paragraphs.
NZF caters to a particular subset of the population that I don’t care for much. It is a set of attitudes about superficial differences that I detest. However the only way to clear it out of society is to do it slowly. The common racism of 30 years ago is not tolerated as easily by the current generations. It will be less tolerated in the future.
Like it or not, Peter Brown probably has support for his attitudes. He is in the right generation to have caught a high level of asian phobia from the war and post-war propaganda, plus the end of empire (he was born in 1939). The attitudes he espoused are common in that generation. However there is often a disjunction between what is said and what is done. You hear a lot of rhetoric about generalizations, and quite different actions.
But it isn’t idle rhetoric and empty gestures that will change it. It is pushing the message over and over across time and across generations. You sure as hell don’t try to suppress people talking about it, because it just goes underground, and resurrects in a more virulent form later. You do suppress the idiots who act on it.
I’ve been fighting racism for my adult life, because I could never understand how anyone could be ignorant enough to believe its underlying premises. I get a bit pissed seeing dick heads trivializing it for trivial political opportunities.
AG – they say that confession is good for the soul, so here goes. For much of my adult life, I would have been one of those that you were fighting. But things change, and a “mid-life crisis” (amazing how two failed marriages can affect you!) led to a paradigm shift in my attitude towards other cultures. That’s probably why I am so offended by Peter Brown’s tirade the other day. His venom was especially offensive when it is considered that he himself is a first-generation immigrant who has enjoyedf the largesse of New Zealand.
But make no mistake. These were not Peter Brown’s words. New Zealand First made immigration a key policy right from its genesis at the 1993 election, and the xenophobia has been present in the party throughout its life. New Zealand First has only ever had one leader – Winston Peters. If you do not agree that Brown was articulating Peters’s views, I would suggest that you are being very charitable to Peters. I am not so charitable, and believe that New Zealand’s international reputation will be harmed by Peters’s continued presence as Foreign Minister. And I stand by my claim that Helen Clark runs the risk of “guilt by association” if she does not sanction Peters. Then again, she knew she was taking a risk when she appointed him………
Another day passes and Clark has still refuses to do anything about this disgusting racist attack.
“Whatever it takes”
Another day passes and the right wing trolls still waste acres of space on this blog repeating points that have already been answered ad nauseam.
They never actually enter into a discussion (the whole point of blogs), just make the same mad statements over and over again.
The phrase “get a life” springs to mind
deemac – check out my last post on this thread, and you will find that I am indeed entering into a discussion with AncientGeek, albeit some time after he had “discussed” my comments in an earlier post.
Bruv – unless you can show me where you have called for Clarkson to be fired for his comments too, I’ll assume that you’re just saying this for show, and that you support Brown’s comments.
Another day passes and the left keep making excuses.
I know Clark is right into gutter politics yet even I did not think that she would go as low as this.
Matthew
Unless you can show me where you called for Roger Douglas to halt the sale of state assets back in the 80′s I will assume that you remain a fan of free market policies.
Two years vs two decades? Tell you what bruv – show me an online blog from the 80′s and I’ll happily do so.
Now, are you being selecitve in your causes, or did you equally call for Peters and Clarkson to be sacked?
I’ll make it easier for you: in your next trol…I mean post, here, call for Clarkson to be fired, as well as Peters. Show some mettle, man, and stand by your convictions.
In Big Bruv’s world, anything that you don’t explicitly condemn you love boundlessly.
Matthew
Your diversion tactic will not work, Clarkson is not a member of the govt and nor is he in coalition with the Labour party.
Winston is a member of the Labour led govt and as such he is under the control of dear leader, unless she sacks him immediately then she approves of the racist policy of NZ first.
“[Clarkson] is a member of the [National Party] and as such he is under the control of [John Key], unless [he] sacks him immediately then [he] approves of the racist policy of [Clarkson]”
so, Key should have sacked Clarkson or resigned himself. Eh, BigB?
I am staggered that you guys are happy to defend the racist policy of NZ first and to defend the inaction of dear leader.
At what point would you say enough?, does Clark have to shoot somebody first or would that be OK as long as it was an Asian person.
IrishBill says: One more attempt to misrepresent our arguments like this and you will be banned.
Big Bruv
I have read attacks on refugees and multi-cultural society by “Big Bruv” over on Kiwiblog. If you are the same “Big Bruv”, then you are a racist.
Therefore you must now sack yourself. Goodbye.
Steve, The point I made still holds that Clarkson is not a minister of the crown and does not represent NZ overseas. I would have preferred he was sacked but it is different when a minister of Foreign Affairs is the leader of a party with racist policies. That is something the PM needs to act on. She is responsible for NZs reputation. No-one has discussed this point as yet so I find it offensive when people start saying I have brought no new debating points to the thread.
Irish
That would be right, you chaps are always keen to ban anybody who does not agree with your policy.
So it is OK for you guys to misrepresent National party policy yet you are not going to let anybody question the policy of the Labour party.